I have a Raypak 406 and found this very helpful. I checked and cleaned the burner tray and then also took off the top and washed down the heat exchanger to ensure proper air flow. The two of these items together will hopefully stop my ROL switch from tripping
Most rollout switches are actually a fusible link set to a certain temperature so they don't "trip" in the sense that you can reset them like a circuit breaker, you need to replace the entire component with a new one. Of course correcting the condition that cause it to fail is important before putting in a new switch.
Very good video with the trainee, It would also be advised to make sure the burner tray is in the tracks in the back of the heater base as it keeps the burner flames properly in line with the water heat exchanger, clean the pilot burner and orifice and also verify the manifold gas pressure is set correctly with a manometer.
All excellent suggestions and in fact we do check them all now with a manometer with and without the heater running to see how much drop there is. It's amazing how many places have inadequate gas pressure. The heater in this video (since replaced) was really rusted, just getting the tray back in was a feat... but yes, always making sure the back is lined up is important. Thanks for commenting.
Very informative! Wish I had watched this before I took mine apart! Mine was creating LOUD bangs. (Think of lobbing a 40lb bag of salt into an empty steel trash dumpster, also at night there were orange flames blasting through the top.) I cleaned everything out: burner tubes, nozzles, heat exchanger. Replaced degraded components: pilot tube, pilot igniter, pilot bracket, added sheet metal to degraded areas of burner tray. When first putting it back together, it would light the pilot and then only the first half dozen burner holes. It showed a main burner ignition failure. After some research I decided the ground might not be good enough. I sanded male spade wire fittings, sprayed the female spade fittings with electronics cleaner. I put it back together and the burner fired up great. Then it would shutoff after a couple of minutes (well before target temp was reached). A couple of minutes later it would try to restart and BANG! I didn’t notice you installing a flame rod. Should this heater have one or something similar? I can’t find it on the parts list in the manual or with web searches. The only other idea I have is that the pilot “shield” bracket gets so hot that after the gas restarts, the hot metal puts it too close to flash point of the NG? Any thoughts on what to check would be most appreciated.
Loud banging is caused by the water getting too hot inside the heat exchanger, this can be from a variety of reasons. Also a howling can also be a sign of it getting too hot, the fins actually vibrate and make that sound. I would check the tubes inside the heat exchanger and also the unitherm governor, in addition I've seen heaters where the flame was set to high, it should be about 4" and all blue without orange. There is an adjustment on the gas valve for this, it reacts SLOWLY so if you change it wait before turning it galore.
Great video. I have a Raypak 406 and sometimes the water via the pool returns It's nice and hot, and then at times lukewarm. Hoping it's not the heat exchanger and cleaning it will do the trick.
@@elvisd6691 It's there to prevent excessive flow through the heater, it's automatic not something you can open or close. Unless it's not functioning correctly I'd leave it alone.
This is one of the best explained Video I have seen on RUclips; Thank you :) I am going to do this tomorrow. Question, my heater starts up and in few seconds Turns off and Display FAN error, Do I need to change the sensor? ( part # 009577F); I have Raypak 266A. Thanks again
Make sure the fan spins freely, there's a black sort of knob on he combustion fan you can turn with your hand. Sometimes they get moisture in there and lock up and turning that by hand can help. Beyond that your issue is a bit beyond the scope of this video which is for the naturally aspirated heater models.
@@RajKancharla-n1j Unfortunately trying to diagnose is a bit beyond the scope of this video which is for the atmospheric version not the one with a fan... sometimes it can be air switch tubing (if the fan is running) or the air switch has failed. I would contact your local pool professional or do some googling and try to find some videos that apply to your heater. My video was just general heater service on a working heater that had a burned out rollout sensor due to some spider webs inside the burners.
Could be a number of things but first make sure the gas or propane supply is turned and coming into the heater. Second possibility is a stuck gas valve or possibly the jet nearest the ignition is clogged which can cause a serious explosion if gas fills the cabinet then ignites. If you're smelling gas and hearing the spark I'd call a service tech, that can e a dangerous situation.
Sorry, not yet but maybe next time we do one I will. Oftentimes though if the heat exchanger goes bad it leaks down onto the burner tray causing damage and since the part is more than half the cost of a new heater many times we give the customer the option to replace the entire unit which can be a better investment. Definitely inspect your burners if it's been leaking for any amount of time or if it's a salt water pool.
Got it, thanks! Mine started leaking last year and while the unit is about 12 years old I really didn't want to invest in a new heater at the huge cost. We're empty nesters and rarely use the pool and I'd take it out but it'll cost me more in landscaping (built into side of hill and wrap-around deck) than doing basic repairs. Maybe a solar cover is in order....
PR5 is probably PRS meaning the pressure switch is open. That's usually caused by not enough flow/pressure being delivered to the sensor or a failed pressure switch. ROL stands for rollout condition so that sensor will need to be replaced too but you need to first find out what caused the rollout switch to fail. It's not a switch you can reset, it's actually a fusible link that opens with a certain amount of heat so you'll need to buy a new one. Make sure you get one with the same temp rating as the one you remove, they do vary between heater models and location.
Is there anyway that you can take the tank or radiator out from the heater and clean it and put it back? Mine is too old and when the water circulates it pushes some black and rusted pieces into the pool and jacuzzi water. Thank you
The part you're talking about is known as the heat exchanger and it can definitely be taken out, cleaned, reamed, etc. Sometimes we see calcium buildup and have to clean out the tubes, there's a tool for that you can hook to a drill. As for the outside of the tubes with the fins take that out and watch with water, do not brush it dry because it can ignite!
This looks pretty involved. How often should this be performed? I doubt it’s ever been done to my heater that was installed in 2009. Would this normally be included in the monthly costs for pool maintenance or be an additional charge?
The manufacturers generally recommend servicing heaters on a yearly basis. With that said a lot depends on the environment... we have customers with heaters that haven't been serviced in 5 years and they are OK yet other customers need this done yearly. We always check when lighting the heater the first time in the spring to make sure there aren't any clogged jets, not doing so can destroy the heater and even cause a fire if the rollout is bad. This service isn't generally covered under pool maintenance but every company does things differently, it's possible that heater service is part of what you pay for your opening. We sell this service as a separate add-on because many customers don't have heaters and as you can see it's time consuming and involved. If your heater is run year round then the likelihood of spiders clogging up your jets is greatly reduced.
Can you show more details on how the pilot assembly attaches to the burner manifold? My brackets were completely rusted and unrecognizable. I purchased a new pilot assembly (002003F) but non of the instruction manuals or diagrams show the pilot brackets and how they attach. I have Raypak P-R406A-EN-C
It's the middle of winter here so we're not servicing any pool currently but when we start opening them back up in May I'll likely make some more videos. We're based in NJ so pools are a seasonal operation. As for the burner trays and even the cabinet rust is often a real problem and even without leaks it seems condensation can cause it to occur. Sorry I can't tell you offhand how it mounts, I know it's attached to the side but giving details without one in hand I cannot. One thing I will suggest to prevent rust in the future is make sure there's ventilation around the heater and if you can have some airspace underneath that helps too. The worst situation is a heater on wet soil or gravel that doesn't dry out. We sometimes have to tell our customer the heater isn't repairable when they get too rusted out and suggest a new unit. Usually that's around the 10 year mark.
Do you think it is possible to remove the whole burner tray and burn wood at the bottom to heat the water instead of using propane and the burner tray?
I don't think that'd work out well at all for a few reasons, first there's not a lot of room down there for a fire, second the insulation on the inside would probably catch fire if it got too hot. In addition the soot from the smoke would choke out the heat exchange in short order, even a yellow flame with gas can soot it up so imagine a real wood fire! Lastly you'd have no safety or control, I would highly advise against lighting a wood fire inside your natural gad or propane heater. Another pool company and myself actually once built a firepit with copper coils around it and a metal conductor plate to heat the pool from a wood fire but after learning how it could potentially explode and burn guests we abandoned the idea.
Well, if you get the error yes the switch needs replacement but it's important to solve the condition that burned the switch out so you don't ruin the new part.
Hello, thanks for doing this great video! Question, how do you determine if the gas valve is not working? My pilot light does stay on, but burners will not fire up. The millivolts reading is around 350, which seems low? So I ordered a new pilot assembly. But any quick way of testing the gas valve? My unit is Raypak 130a natural gas, it is probably 10 years old. I am waiting for the pilot assembly to be delivered and I have the burner and valve removed from the heater. Before I remove the burner assembly, I checked all the safety switches , even jumped them to see if the burners fire up, but did not work. The safety switches are fine.
So 350mv is low unless that's measured when the gas valve is trying to open... 750 mv is closer to what you should be seeing. The most common culprit is the pilot isn't strong enough to contact the pilot generator correctly so the PG isn't getting hot enough to put out the necessary voltage. Jumping the gas valve by connecting the th to th terminals directly should allow it to open up (but NEVER leave that jumper on). Another possibility is the pilot generator itself is bad, less common than a weak pilot but they do wear out. It sounds like you're on the right track, essentially all the switches are safeties and a complete circuit delivers about 750mw to the gas valve allowing it to open. Sometimes tapping it lightly with the heater turned on can unstick the valve, fixed a couple heaters that way. If you ever replace that heater go with an electronic ignition model, Raypack is a solid choice but they wore on 24V not millivolts so it's more robust, a lot less non firing heater problems.
My RP pool heater has a ROL fault that won’t reset. I also found that the outer casing cas extremely hot. Would doing this maintenance fix the ROL issue?
Cleaning out the burner tray and vacuuming out the top of the heater should fix the overheating but you'll need to buy a new rollout sensor (fusible link), there is no "reset", once it's burned like a fuse it needs to be replaced.
Not ideal but there's nothing flammable underneath the heater. This heater was over 10 years old and we replaced it for the customer this season because it was just falling apart and could no longer be serviced.
It's not a re-settable switch like a circuit breaker, once it's tripped the part needs to be replaced even after cleaning. If it continues to trip after cleaning that means there either too much heat inside there or the temp rating of the switch is incorrect (sometimes). I don't want to tell you to do something unsafe but we often put a small jumper lead across the rollout sensor to test it. Another possibility is the wiring that goes to the switch is bad or the connectors that clip onto it loose.
If you live in a state where there's a down season and the pool is closed the heater should at minimum be checked. What often happens is spiders build webs inside the jets and burners and if they're not cleared they can cause expensive repairs and possible a fire. If the heater is used year round I'd say not necessary unless there's a problem but it can never hurt to get in there and clean things out.
When I turn on the heater I make sure my gas is on. I hear a click and then I get a PLT error message. I have tried it many times with the same message. I never smell any gas. Could it be the gas valve needs replacing? I have a Raypac R405BL
it could be a lot of things, sometimes believe it or not tapping the gas valve can get it unstuck. If it's a PLT message though that's different than the main gas valve opening. The most common thing we see with pilots if if a pool heater isn't used for awhile spiders can get in and built nests blocking the orifices where the gas needs to flow freely.
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I have a Raypak 406 and found this very helpful. I checked and cleaned the burner tray and then also took off the top and washed down the heat exchanger to ensure proper air flow. The two of these items together will hopefully stop my ROL switch from tripping
Most rollout switches are actually a fusible link set to a certain temperature so they don't "trip" in the sense that you can reset them like a circuit breaker, you need to replace the entire component with a new one. Of course correcting the condition that cause it to fail is important before putting in a new switch.
This video is gold. Thank you for posting it.
Very good video with the trainee, It would also be advised to make sure the burner tray is in the tracks in the back of the heater base as it keeps the burner flames properly in line with the water heat exchanger, clean the pilot burner and orifice and also verify the manifold gas pressure is set correctly with a manometer.
All excellent suggestions and in fact we do check them all now with a manometer with and without the heater running to see how much drop there is. It's amazing how many places have inadequate gas pressure. The heater in this video (since replaced) was really rusted, just getting the tray back in was a feat... but yes, always making sure the back is lined up is important. Thanks for commenting.
@@BobsPoolService Yeah input and manifold pressure should be checked on the gas control especially if manifold output pressure can not be achieved.
Very informative! Wish I had watched this before I took mine apart! Mine was creating LOUD bangs. (Think of lobbing a 40lb bag of salt into an empty steel trash dumpster, also at night there were orange flames blasting through the top.) I cleaned everything out: burner tubes, nozzles, heat exchanger. Replaced degraded components: pilot tube, pilot igniter, pilot bracket, added sheet metal to degraded areas of burner tray. When first putting it back together, it would light the pilot and then only the first half dozen burner holes. It showed a main burner ignition failure. After some research I decided the ground might not be good enough. I sanded male spade wire fittings, sprayed the female spade fittings with electronics cleaner. I put it back together and the burner fired up great. Then it would shutoff after a couple of minutes (well before target temp was reached). A couple of minutes later it would try to restart and BANG! I didn’t notice you installing a flame rod. Should this heater have one or something similar? I can’t find it on the parts list in the manual or with web searches. The only other idea I have is that the pilot “shield” bracket gets so hot that after the gas restarts, the hot metal puts it too close to flash point of the NG? Any thoughts on what to check would be most appreciated.
Loud banging is caused by the water getting too hot inside the heat exchanger, this can be from a variety of reasons. Also a howling can also be a sign of it getting too hot, the fins actually vibrate and make that sound. I would check the tubes inside the heat exchanger and also the unitherm governor, in addition I've seen heaters where the flame was set to high, it should be about 4" and all blue without orange. There is an adjustment on the gas valve for this, it reacts SLOWLY so if you change it wait before turning it galore.
Great video. I have a Raypak 406 and sometimes the water via the pool returns It's nice and hot, and then at times lukewarm. Hoping it's not the heat exchanger and cleaning it will do the trick.
I've felt that on the returns, there's actually a piece that sometimes opens to allow some water to bypass the heater that can cause that variability.
@@BobsPoolService that's pretty interesting. Is that something I should leave alone or make sure that the bypass stays closed at all times.
@@elvisd6691 It's there to prevent excessive flow through the heater, it's automatic not something you can open or close. Unless it's not functioning correctly I'd leave it alone.
@@BobsPoolService yeah agreed and thank you for the feedback.
This is one of the best explained Video I have seen on RUclips; Thank you :) I am going to do this tomorrow. Question, my heater starts up and in few seconds Turns off and Display FAN error, Do I need to change the sensor? ( part # 009577F); I have Raypak 266A. Thanks again
Make sure the fan spins freely, there's a black sort of knob on he combustion fan you can turn with your hand. Sometimes they get moisture in there and lock up and turning that by hand can help. Beyond that your issue is a bit beyond the scope of this video which is for the naturally aspirated heater models.
@@BobsPoolService I don’t see the black knob for the fan anywhere, any ideas?
@@RajKancharla-n1j Unfortunately trying to diagnose is a bit beyond the scope of this video which is for the atmospheric version not the one with a fan... sometimes it can be air switch tubing (if the fan is running) or the air switch has failed. I would contact your local pool professional or do some googling and try to find some videos that apply to your heater. My video was just general heater service on a working heater that had a burned out rollout sensor due to some spider webs inside the burners.
Really helpful ! If the burner is not igniting (I hear the spark) what should I look for ?
Could be a number of things but first make sure the gas or propane supply is turned and coming into the heater. Second possibility is a stuck gas valve or possibly the jet nearest the ignition is clogged which can cause a serious explosion if gas fills the cabinet then ignites. If you're smelling gas and hearing the spark I'd call a service tech, that can e a dangerous situation.
Excellent video! Do you have one for the heat exchanger replacement?
Sorry, not yet but maybe next time we do one I will. Oftentimes though if the heat exchanger goes bad it leaks down onto the burner tray causing damage and since the part is more than half the cost of a new heater many times we give the customer the option to replace the entire unit which can be a better investment. Definitely inspect your burners if it's been leaking for any amount of time or if it's a salt water pool.
Got it, thanks! Mine started leaking last year and while the unit is about 12 years old I really didn't want to invest in a new heater at the huge cost. We're empty nesters and rarely use the pool and I'd take it out but it'll cost me more in landscaping (built into side of hill and wrap-around deck) than doing basic repairs. Maybe a solar cover is in order....
Mine is exactly just like yours it reads clean filter/ strainer service SPA
ROL PR5 BLINKING
PR5 is probably PRS meaning the pressure switch is open. That's usually caused by not enough flow/pressure being delivered to the sensor or a failed pressure switch. ROL stands for rollout condition so that sensor will need to be replaced too but you need to first find out what caused the rollout switch to fail. It's not a switch you can reset, it's actually a fusible link that opens with a certain amount of heat so you'll need to buy a new one. Make sure you get one with the same temp rating as the one you remove, they do vary between heater models and location.
Is there anyway that you can take the tank or radiator out from the heater and clean it and put it back? Mine is too old and when the water circulates it pushes some black and rusted pieces into the pool and jacuzzi water.
Thank you
The part you're talking about is known as the heat exchanger and it can definitely be taken out, cleaned, reamed, etc. Sometimes we see calcium buildup and have to clean out the tubes, there's a tool for that you can hook to a drill. As for the outside of the tubes with the fins take that out and watch with water, do not brush it dry because it can ignite!
This looks pretty involved.
How often should this be performed?
I doubt it’s ever been done to my heater that was installed in 2009.
Would this normally be included in the monthly costs for pool maintenance or be an additional charge?
The manufacturers generally recommend servicing heaters on a yearly basis. With that said a lot depends on the environment... we have customers with heaters that haven't been serviced in 5 years and they are OK yet other customers need this done yearly. We always check when lighting the heater the first time in the spring to make sure there aren't any clogged jets, not doing so can destroy the heater and even cause a fire if the rollout is bad. This service isn't generally covered under pool maintenance but every company does things differently, it's possible that heater service is part of what you pay for your opening. We sell this service as a separate add-on because many customers don't have heaters and as you can see it's time consuming and involved. If your heater is run year round then the likelihood of spiders clogging up your jets is greatly reduced.
Can you show more details on how the pilot assembly attaches to the burner manifold? My brackets were completely rusted and unrecognizable. I purchased a new pilot assembly (002003F) but non of the instruction manuals or diagrams show the pilot brackets and how they attach. I have Raypak P-R406A-EN-C
It's the middle of winter here so we're not servicing any pool currently but when we start opening them back up in May I'll likely make some more videos. We're based in NJ so pools are a seasonal operation. As for the burner trays and even the cabinet rust is often a real problem and even without leaks it seems condensation can cause it to occur. Sorry I can't tell you offhand how it mounts, I know it's attached to the side but giving details without one in hand I cannot. One thing I will suggest to prevent rust in the future is make sure there's ventilation around the heater and if you can have some airspace underneath that helps too. The worst situation is a heater on wet soil or gravel that doesn't dry out. We sometimes have to tell our customer the heater isn't repairable when they get too rusted out and suggest a new unit. Usually that's around the 10 year mark.
Do you think it is possible to remove the whole burner tray and burn wood at the bottom to heat the water instead of using propane and the burner tray?
I don't think that'd work out well at all for a few reasons, first there's not a lot of room down there for a fire, second the insulation on the inside would probably catch fire if it got too hot. In addition the soot from the smoke would choke out the heat exchange in short order, even a yellow flame with gas can soot it up so imagine a real wood fire! Lastly you'd have no safety or control, I would highly advise against lighting a wood fire inside your natural gad or propane heater. Another pool company and myself actually once built a firepit with copper coils around it and a metal conductor plate to heat the pool from a wood fire but after learning how it could potentially explode and burn guests we abandoned the idea.
Is there not a ROL switch to be replaced to get it going again?
Well, if you get the error yes the switch needs replacement but it's important to solve the condition that burned the switch out so you don't ruin the new part.
Hello, thanks for doing this great video! Question, how do you determine if the gas valve is not working? My pilot light does stay on, but burners will not fire up. The millivolts reading is around 350, which seems low? So I ordered a new pilot assembly. But any quick way of testing the gas valve? My unit is Raypak 130a natural gas, it is probably 10 years old. I am waiting for the pilot assembly to be delivered and I have the burner and valve removed from the heater. Before I remove the burner assembly, I checked all the safety switches , even jumped them to see if the burners fire up, but did not work. The safety switches are fine.
So 350mv is low unless that's measured when the gas valve is trying to open... 750 mv is closer to what you should be seeing. The most common culprit is the pilot isn't strong enough to contact the pilot generator correctly so the PG isn't getting hot enough to put out the necessary voltage. Jumping the gas valve by connecting the th to th terminals directly should allow it to open up (but NEVER leave that jumper on). Another possibility is the pilot generator itself is bad, less common than a weak pilot but they do wear out. It sounds like you're on the right track, essentially all the switches are safeties and a complete circuit delivers about 750mw to the gas valve allowing it to open. Sometimes tapping it lightly with the heater turned on can unstick the valve, fixed a couple heaters that way. If you ever replace that heater go with an electronic ignition model, Raypack is a solid choice but they wore on 24V not millivolts so it's more robust, a lot less non firing heater problems.
@@BobsPoolService thank you for the quick response!
I will call you Monday thanks
Sounds good
Thanks for this very very helpful
My RP pool heater has a ROL fault that won’t reset. I also found that the outer casing cas extremely hot. Would doing this maintenance fix the ROL issue?
Cleaning out the burner tray and vacuuming out the top of the heater should fix the overheating but you'll need to buy a new rollout sensor (fusible link), there is no "reset", once it's burned like a fuse it needs to be replaced.
Do you turn off switch breaker inside the house aka fuse panel box
it depends what we need to do, usually we just turn off the power at the heater (there's a rocker switch).
What about the floor of the unit? It appears quite rusty. Mine has developed some holes. Is there a way to replace the floor?
I don't believe they sell that as a part but i've never changed the floor. Unfortunately yes, they often get rusty from leaks or condensation.
Is it okay that the bottom of the heater has a huge hole in it?
Not ideal but there's nothing flammable underneath the heater. This heater was over 10 years old and we replaced it for the customer this season because it was just falling apart and could no longer be serviced.
Cleaned heat exchanger on my 406a still tripping the rol switch what next ?
It's not a re-settable switch like a circuit breaker, once it's tripped the part needs to be replaced even after cleaning. If it continues to trip after cleaning that means there either too much heat inside there or the temp rating of the switch is incorrect (sometimes). I don't want to tell you to do something unsafe but we often put a small jumper lead across the rollout sensor to test it. Another possibility is the wiring that goes to the switch is bad or the connectors that clip onto it loose.
How often should one do this?
If you live in a state where there's a down season and the pool is closed the heater should at minimum be checked. What often happens is spiders build webs inside the jets and burners and if they're not cleared they can cause expensive repairs and possible a fire. If the heater is used year round I'd say not necessary unless there's a problem but it can never hurt to get in there and clean things out.
When I turn on the heater I make sure my gas is on. I hear a click and then I get a PLT error message. I have tried it many times with the same message. I never smell any gas. Could it be the gas valve needs replacing? I have a Raypac R405BL
it could be a lot of things, sometimes believe it or not tapping the gas valve can get it unstuck. If it's a PLT message though that's different than the main gas valve opening. The most common thing we see with pilots if if a pool heater isn't used for awhile spiders can get in and built nests blocking the orifices where the gas needs to flow freely.
@@BobsPoolService thank you for responding
Why does my display screen says ROL and PRS or PR5 ?
ROL means the rollout switch is open (burned out) and PRS means there's not enough pressure to close the pressure switch.
Rudd is the same as Raypak
Rheem too.