I love the first piece of advice. To me, it seems like a corollary to the idea of choosing sounds that fit together. You want your basic tracks to need as little mixing as possible. One thing I've been doing lately, to great effect, is recording my loud and quiet sections with different input gain on my preamp. I know I'm going to need to reduce the dynamic range anyway. So I'd rather just do it at the recording stage. I like to record my vocals in discrete sections. So if I'm coming up to a chorus that's belted after a whispered verse, I'll do a new take with the preamp turned down 10-20 db. It's okay if it's still a little louder, because you want some dynamics, but it probably shouldn't be 20 db louder. I'd rather have everything close to the same volume because it'll save me time editing the clip gain, and it'll mean the compressor isn't working as hard (especially since I often use an outboard compressor).
Hey Joe, I've been into music since I was 16, and I've been messing around with it for about 13 years now. I write my own songs and also handle mixing and mastering myself. I think I have ADHD because I could never keep my focus on RUclips videos that were supposed to explain things to me; I found it more exciting to just mess around on my own and then wonder why it didn't sound right, lol. I discovered you today, and damn, I've never come across someone I can listen to so easily. There's something about the way you explain things that really works for me. I'm binge-watching everything you've done on this channel. Fantastic content!
I have just started in the last few months aiming at zero for my drum recordings and working at getting the best possible sound in the recording , and it has literally taken my end result to the next level. Thanks to you and Graham for those words echoing in my ears girats . ❤
I learned from an old school engineer who came of age during the 70’s. On his Neve and his Trident consoles, in the analog domain, he showed me to trim gain levels aiming at your mix level. Then, when you go to automate and mix, you’re not fighting touchy faders, or pulling things down, down, down. You’re almost already there on your static mix as well, when you start mixing.
Interesting stuff that volume level thing. I was told early and often to leave recording faders at zero and use the gain knob to set levels and leaving lots of headroom. I don't know if it's true or not but the theory at the time was that the faders at zero grab the best signal. Joe, you did a tutorial on setting levels of the tracks as the first part of the mixing process. That was really helpful and solves a lot of issues with mixing as time goes on.
Thanks, Setting relative recording level is a nice idea for easing the Mix process. Though i 'd find this hard in the project studio when your juggling so many roles/tasks. I've learnt before starting a mix, to tweak the event/clip levels on tracks, so the mix process has everything in a relative ball park - makes the mix process more surgical, given the logarithmic type scale of a fader.
Joe, your suggestions resulted in an epiphany for me. I realized that in my earlier multitrack recording days, using an all-in-one multitracking recorder, by default, instigating a new track came with the default settings, including the input at unity gain. Changing anything meant menu scrolling, etc., so adjusting at the inputs with the preamp was just easier. I hadn’t given much thought at the time for how this would affect things later in the process. Full disclosure: digital multitrack recorders were not my first; as single track portable reel-to-reel was where I “cut my teeth”, lol!
As an electronic engineer I still haven't been convinced that setting gain the traditional way is unnecessary. The truth is that all electronic devices have low-level background noise due to thermal and other characteristics. Thus it is a good idea in the analog realm to have a strong signal that is far greater than this noise so that the noise is drowned out by the desired signal. It is also important to not go too hot so that you still have enough headroom that the signal won't be distorted by clipping. Once the signal is digitized, these types of noise issues are gone and instead we have issues of quantization and resolution. These issues are reduced by having a greater bit depth, that is, more bits per sample. But if you record a weak signal, then fewer bits are used to capture the signal and thus digital noise sources might be noticeable. No matter how I think it through, I still come to the conclusion that a strong signal is a good idea. I just now did a search on this subject and my first hit was a PreSonus article that said to set the signal to a strong level. So I'm still unconvinced that it doesn't matter. Maybe it's a matter of whether most people notice any difference in sound, like someone who is happy to listen to music on a low fidelity system may not notice a higher hiss level? Setting the Gain stage strong still seems like the best idea to me, but I am willing to be convinced by a good technical argument.
Ah, I recognized Big Al's face in the thumbnail and had to watch. I loved the Project Studio Network's podcasts from many years back. I listened the Charles Dye interviews multiple times ("Shakiiiiiira…").
Good advice. However, I do think there can be a nice hybrid "in-between" where your main tracks are nice and warm, each leveled off, premixed in say the front 10db of the mix. However, the things that are going to live 20 - 30 db deep in the mix (pads and odd percussion usually), record substantailly higher than 30 db down. This is just to get good detail (bits) to work with in reverbs/effects without sounding grainy. I know, this was more of an issue in 16 bit recording but still.... I would rather have the detail bits and S/N available and not need them than wishing you had more of them later on.
Please i just got a Focusrite saffire pro 40 installed mix control 3.9 and using Logic pro x everything looks fine but logic is not getting any signal Mic plugged into channel 1 reads on saffire nd someone in mix control But Logic is not seeing anything...what could i be getting wrong
I don't want to be "that guy" but just two things to say about the first Advice, here: This will only really work outside of the analogue domain (which most of us, admittedly, deal with anyway) because signal-to-noise is much more of a problem then Another thing to add is this would introduce more noise than necessary, surely?! also creative decisions like levels of individual instruments within a mix would have to be tackled much earlier on while one is wearing ones 'technical hat', so to speak! so unless I'm missing something I'm going to have to pass on the first bit of advise... Great video otherwise as always 👍
If you record any vocal or real instruments, you're in the analogue domain. Unless you're recording to analogue tape, your recording will always be in the digital domain when you capture the performance with your DAW. Tape hiss was the fundamental component of needing higher SNR. If you're recording on your DAW, this becomes redundant. A level of -18/14/12/10dBFS is more than sufficient for any capture you will ever have to make. You're more than likely gonna gain the signal down to -18ish anyway. The point he makes is why record a tambourine at a high level, when you know the first thing you will have to do to it, will be to turn it back down again. Just record it lower (with no signal loss whatsoever) and save yourself, or the mixer, a lot of time. Makes perfect sense... 🤷
@@mikewaldron4492 when I say "analog domain" I meant recording to TAPE, sorry! As for recording at Low gain I honestly feel that, unless you're psychic, you don't really know what volume it's going to be in relation to all the other instruments until mix down and it could be that you'll be pushing it up in volume in which case ya will, whatever the "domain", be increasing noise needlessly It's an interesting point of view though… It reminds me of Bruce Swedian's approach to record in stereo always with instruments/sound sources located as they would be in the finished product
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That taped fader thing sounds like a direct carry over from doing live sound. I never thought of carrying that into the studio!
I love the first piece of advice. To me, it seems like a corollary to the idea of choosing sounds that fit together. You want your basic tracks to need as little mixing as possible.
One thing I've been doing lately, to great effect, is recording my loud and quiet sections with different input gain on my preamp. I know I'm going to need to reduce the dynamic range anyway. So I'd rather just do it at the recording stage. I like to record my vocals in discrete sections. So if I'm coming up to a chorus that's belted after a whispered verse, I'll do a new take with the preamp turned down 10-20 db. It's okay if it's still a little louder, because you want some dynamics, but it probably shouldn't be 20 db louder. I'd rather have everything close to the same volume because it'll save me time editing the clip gain, and it'll mean the compressor isn't working as hard (especially since I often use an outboard compressor).
Hey Joe, I've been into music since I was 16, and I've been messing around with it for about 13 years now. I write my own songs and also handle mixing and mastering myself. I think I have ADHD because I could never keep my focus on RUclips videos that were supposed to explain things to me; I found it more exciting to just mess around on my own and then wonder why it didn't sound right, lol.
I discovered you today, and damn, I've never come across someone I can listen to so easily. There's something about the way you explain things that really works for me. I'm binge-watching everything you've done on this channel. Fantastic content!
When I record, I keep the levels in the middle but on the lower spectrum but not too low, just to give that extra bit of head room.
Great advice Joe. This is exactly how I record so I naturally was pleased to see your take on this.
I have just started in the last few months aiming at zero for my drum recordings and working at getting the best possible sound in the recording , and it has literally taken my end result to the next level. Thanks to you and Graham for those words echoing in my ears girats . ❤
Ronan is the OG, he was making recording videos before youtube even existed. If he wanted he could have had the biggest recording channel on youtube.
Thanks for all you do, Joe!
I learned from an old school engineer who came of age during the 70’s. On his Neve and his Trident consoles, in the analog domain, he showed me to trim gain levels aiming at your mix level. Then, when you go to automate and mix, you’re not fighting touchy faders, or pulling things down, down, down. You’re almost already there on your static mix as well, when you start mixing.
Another great video, Joe. Really enjoy these.
Love the singer impression at 6:12 😂
Is funny 'coz is true :-)
This is Brilliant! Keep them coming Joe! :)
Interesting stuff that volume level thing. I was told early and often to leave recording faders at zero and use the gain knob to set levels and leaving lots of headroom. I don't know if it's true or not but the theory at the time was that the faders at zero grab the best signal. Joe, you did a tutorial on setting levels of the tracks as the first part of the mixing process. That was really helpful and solves a lot of issues with mixing as time goes on.
Wait! Jimi’s dead? What a way to break the news!
Dude your voice tone is insane! Sick!
Great advices!
Great stuff as always, Joe. BTW, I may now have to rename my music production project to "Sausage of Audio." And I thank you for that.
Thanks for sharing these concepts Joe.
Thanks, Setting relative recording level is a nice idea for easing the Mix process. Though i 'd find this hard in the project studio when your juggling so many roles/tasks. I've learnt before starting a mix, to tweak the event/clip levels on tracks, so the mix process has everything in a relative ball park - makes the mix process more surgical, given the logarithmic type scale of a fader.
Joe, your suggestions resulted in an epiphany for me. I realized that in my earlier multitrack recording days, using an all-in-one multitracking recorder, by default, instigating a new track came with the default settings, including the input at unity gain. Changing anything meant menu scrolling, etc., so adjusting at the inputs with the preamp was just easier. I hadn’t given much thought at the time for how this would affect things later in the process. Full disclosure: digital multitrack recorders were not my first; as single track portable reel-to-reel was where I “cut my teeth”, lol!
As an electronic engineer I still haven't been convinced that setting gain the traditional way is unnecessary. The truth is that all electronic devices have low-level background noise due to thermal and other characteristics. Thus it is a good idea in the analog realm to have a strong signal that is far greater than this noise so that the noise is drowned out by the desired signal. It is also important to not go too hot so that you still have enough headroom that the signal won't be distorted by clipping. Once the signal is digitized, these types of noise issues are gone and instead we have issues of quantization and resolution. These issues are reduced by having a greater bit depth, that is, more bits per sample. But if you record a weak signal, then fewer bits are used to capture the signal and thus digital noise sources might be noticeable. No matter how I think it through, I still come to the conclusion that a strong signal is a good idea. I just now did a search on this subject and my first hit was a PreSonus article that said to set the signal to a strong level. So I'm still unconvinced that it doesn't matter. Maybe it's a matter of whether most people notice any difference in sound, like someone who is happy to listen to music on a low fidelity system may not notice a higher hiss level? Setting the Gain stage strong still seems like the best idea to me, but I am willing to be convinced by a good technical argument.
Ah, I recognized Big Al's face in the thumbnail and had to watch. I loved the Project Studio Network's podcasts from many years back. I listened the Charles Dye interviews multiple times ("Shakiiiiiira…").
Good advice. However, I do think there can be a nice hybrid "in-between" where your main tracks are nice and warm, each leveled off, premixed in say the front 10db of the mix. However, the things that are going to live 20 - 30 db deep in the mix (pads and odd percussion usually), record substantailly higher than 30 db down. This is just to get good detail (bits) to work with in reverbs/effects without sounding grainy. I know, this was more of an issue in 16 bit recording but still.... I would rather have the detail bits and S/N available and not need them than wishing you had more of them later on.
Yeah Broh
Please i just got a Focusrite saffire pro 40 installed mix control 3.9 and using Logic pro x everything looks fine but logic is not getting any signal
Mic plugged into channel 1 reads on saffire nd someone in mix control
But Logic is not seeing anything...what could i be getting wrong
Hi Joe! Are you using a Mac or a PC?
Show us that Vox back there bruh.
I don't want to be "that guy" but just two things to say about the first Advice, here:
This will only really work outside of the analogue domain (which most of us, admittedly, deal with anyway) because signal-to-noise is much more of a problem then
Another thing to add is this would introduce more noise than necessary, surely?!
also creative decisions like levels of individual instruments within a mix would have to be tackled much earlier on while one is wearing ones 'technical hat', so to speak! so unless I'm missing something I'm going to have to pass on the first bit of advise...
Great video otherwise as always 👍
If you record any vocal or real instruments, you're in the analogue domain. Unless you're recording to analogue tape, your recording will always be in the digital domain when you capture the performance with your DAW.
Tape hiss was the fundamental component of needing higher SNR. If you're recording on your DAW, this becomes redundant.
A level of -18/14/12/10dBFS is more than sufficient for any capture you will ever have to make. You're more than likely gonna gain the signal down to -18ish anyway.
The point he makes is why record a tambourine at a high level, when you know the first thing you will have to do to it, will be to turn it back down again. Just record it lower (with no signal loss whatsoever) and save yourself, or the mixer, a lot of time. Makes perfect sense... 🤷
@@mikewaldron4492 when I say "analog domain" I meant recording to TAPE, sorry!
As for recording at Low gain I honestly feel that, unless you're psychic, you don't really know what volume it's going to be in relation to all the other instruments until mix down and it could be that you'll be pushing it up in volume in which case ya will, whatever the "domain", be increasing noise needlessly
It's an interesting point of view though… It reminds me of Bruce Swedian's approach to record in stereo always with instruments/sound sources located as they would be in the finished product
Promo-SM 💃
Giant Sausage of Audio Content starting going downhill after their third album.