I remember reading foxhole when I was like 15 because I saw a bunch of fanart on tumblr. I remember seeing the $1.00 price tag and thought “huh, must be pirated” because in what world do authors do that? but I think that sentence really summarizes this entire series
it's actually funny to me how huge this series is in russia despite it’s themes. i remember when the first book came out, it was sold out in a couple of hours, and after that some people even started selling fake books with the same covers, but with a terrible translation lmao and i think it's probably the current bestseller for the russian publisher as well. they even make some goods, such as bookmarks, tote bags, t-shirts, etc. but for me personally, these books made me start learning english, because i just wanted to know how they would end lol and i’m really glad i read them, because if i hadn't, i would never have found out about the raven cycle, which is my favorite series of all time. (and i would never have found your channel which i enjoy to watch so much!)
Thank you so much for the comment and compliments! I noticed the huge amount of tiktoks in russian as well as the russian translation so I noticed it's huge there, but I didn't know how much haha, that's so cool it sold out! I guess queer Russians and gay allies in Russia need some toxic destructive boys in love to cope 💕 and so happy for you that you found the raven cycle 🙏 love both of these series!
I started these books because of tumbler fan arts and holy crap did I fall down the rabbit hole. Not only do I absolutely love these books, but it opened me up to the world of fanfic and I have read an ungodly amount of AO3 AFTG fanfic. Like it’s all I read for a year. It’ll always have a special place in my heart and looking back I still have no clue why it’s so good despite being so bad but I just don’t care.
I think this is an especially good video. I find our cultures obsession with things being perfect and needing to be able to justify every little thing you like is something more people need to question. a lot more people need to see this video right now.
Yeah same I read them in 2016/17 and I bought the books this year haha, I thought they were better the second time so if you liked them I recommend a reread
@@obviouslyqueer update: literally bought the set just 30min ago haha i finished your video and was sold again. I want to write a book this year and honestly maybe i need the energy thos authors books brings for inspiration
@@StrangeLatte omg thats great! I REALLY think so, I mean of course research is important and especially if you wanna be published but the overall "fuck it attitude It's my book" I think is a great way to start and keep reminding oneself of. Good luck with the book that's so exciting!
This video literally summarises how I feel about all for the game!! its so bad and i would never recommend it but its also so good and it might even be one of my comfort books even if it's just traumas and gays and a terrible writing... Also something i find incredible is the importance of some characters to the fandom even if they're almost forgotten in the book ps: i love your channel
It's SO funny that AFTG is so many people's comfortread 😭 I mean I get it! But with this content haha 💔 the AFTG fandom overall is just really lovely. (Thank you!! That means a lot 🥰)
This series ended up on my radar when I was first reading the Raven Cycle. I couldn't even finish the first book because it was so bad. I was baffled by the crossover in the fandoms because the difference in quality of writing and worldbuilding could not be bigger. Regardless, I have been fascinated by the phenomenon of the series' popularity since then, so I really enjoyed this video!
Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it even though you didn't enjoy the book haha. It's a HUGE difference in quality, so I get that a lot of people coming from TRC and expecting something similar are shocked haha
I have another controversial comparison to make: All For the Game reminds me of Banana Fish. I haven't actually read AFTG (yet) but I have watched multiple plot summary/review videos for it, so I think I have a pretty good understanding of the gist of it. The extensive list of trigger warnings, the main characters being queer teenage boys with mafia connections, and the insane unrealistic plot conflicts are very similar between the two.
I read all three books in like a week back in 2021 because a friend recommended them to me. Had no idea what was going on most of the time but ended up obsessing over them for months. So yeah. Truly a phenomenon.
i remember reading it all in a span of 3 days while sick. I think it helped me not question anything lmao was just yeah checks out. Very nice video and i think you nailed why it is so beloved
I am fucking obsessed with aftg. and got into it from seeing a meme online of the relationship with neil and andrew and wanted to know more. So when I see people talk about it. I know that they are bad and when I see people talk about them I don’t want them to bash them because they are good in so many ways. It just takes analysis to understand why they are so good. I also think that the Fannon for the series has the same ‘fuck it’ attitude so it makes it beater because fans retcon-ed it into something a lot better.
Yeah I don't like retcon at all. Like it never gives me anything, and in the case of AFTG (which has soooo much retcon) I like how the fandom has picked out parts of it and made fanon and ignored others.
I feel like I've seen that cover everywhere and until a few days ago never had a clue what it referred too. I've also seen it referenced on fanfic sites as AUs and since I never read AUs and I never put them together. I'm going to have to read these books now, though. I feel like it would be a cathartic experience as a writer who always feels torn between self-indulgence and "proper" storytelling, even though I mostly just do it for fun. I honestly always wondered what would happen if people published books that read more like fanfic and less traditional and am low-key hoping this is a first of a future trend. Almost a reclaiming of what stories get popular away from corporate.
I do think you should read them! They're very different from TRC, but at the same time the fandoms are very intertwined because so many people love them both. And i get why - I mean I really enjoyed both! But in very different ways. But really - read it especially if you need inspiration for your own writing haha. This truly is a "write not what you know but whatever the fuck you want" manifesto.
@@obviouslyqueer I want to but I have way too many unread books, once I get that under control then I'll have to check this series out. I'm sure I'll fall into the "it's trash but I love it (or at least like it)" category lol.
Fascinating. I haven't read these pdfs but I guess that being obscure is no measure of a break from industrialisation any more. 'Indie' is not enough. Being simultaneously gold and toxic, bad but brave, lazy but sacrificing more than mere 'hard work' is probably the interesting measure.
Just found your channel and am working through your videos! Love seeing deep dives on new-to-me media. I was on tumblr at that time, idk how I missed this entirely.
Oh boy. I'm dreading this. I loved this series and I started reading it before it blew up on tumblr (I think 2013? lol) because I was on a huge queer book binge in high school so I was just living in that goodreads section. It's amazing how it became so contentious and now when I look into the tag people mostly talk about how it's bad or share cute fanart. I wonder what it's like to be the author. Considering she never published another series, I suppouse that speaks for itself. Hearing the plot laid out like this, I understand what I liked about it. Still cringe at the cheesy bits but... yeah, I see what got to me there. I wish I could find another series about misfits who were allowed to be messy.
She hasn't written another series but she isn't done with this one haha, if you haven't heard she's realising a new AFTG book this year. It will be about Jean, and his time with the Trojans after Renee rescued him from the ravens. 10 years later haha, so welcome back to the fandom 😬
Oh gosh I love this video because it speaks for/to me! Alone all the comments of reviewers at the beginning! So true! XD "It has like all the triggers in the world"! So true, yet I'm still trash for this series and its characters. 😂I've read the first 2 books and I just started to read the third one so this video totally came at the right time! Thank you! =)
Retcon is something I generally don’t like. But in the fan spaces the attitude towards Nora’s retcon is that it is there and you can take what you like and leave the rest. Again that ‘fuck it’ attitude. I also think the use of Nora’s language like the ease of it makes it super easy to read them really fast.
I remember reading foxhole when I was like 15 because I saw a bunch of fanart on tumblr. I remember seeing the $1.00 price tag and thought “huh, must be pirated” because in what world do authors do that? but I think that sentence really summarizes this entire series
Hahah it does! It fits the entire series that she's giving it out for free
it's actually funny to me how huge this series is in russia despite it’s themes. i remember when the first book came out, it was sold out in a couple of hours, and after that some people even started selling fake books with the same covers, but with a terrible translation lmao and i think it's probably the current bestseller for the russian publisher as well. they even make some goods, such as bookmarks, tote bags, t-shirts, etc. but for me personally, these books made me start learning english, because i just wanted to know how they would end lol and i’m really glad i read them, because if i hadn't, i would never have found out about the raven cycle, which is my favorite series of all time. (and i would never have found your channel which i enjoy to watch so much!)
Thank you so much for the comment and compliments! I noticed the huge amount of tiktoks in russian as well as the russian translation so I noticed it's huge there, but I didn't know how much haha, that's so cool it sold out! I guess queer Russians and gay allies in Russia need some toxic destructive boys in love to cope 💕 and so happy for you that you found the raven cycle 🙏 love both of these series!
I started these books because of tumbler fan arts and holy crap did I fall down the rabbit hole. Not only do I absolutely love these books, but it opened me up to the world of fanfic and I have read an ungodly amount of AO3 AFTG fanfic. Like it’s all I read for a year. It’ll always have a special place in my heart and looking back I still have no clue why it’s so good despite being so bad but I just don’t care.
Yeah in still obsessed and I read them six years ago haha, I always have like 4 andreil fanfics open on my phone
I think this is an especially good video. I find our cultures obsession with things being perfect and needing to be able to justify every little thing you like is something more people need to question. a lot more people need to see this video right now.
Thank you!
I remember reading these back in 2016 or 2018 lmao now here I am in 2022 debating buying the physical books because of nostalgia
Yeah same I read them in 2016/17 and I bought the books this year haha, I thought they were better the second time so if you liked them I recommend a reread
@@obviouslyqueer update: literally bought the set just 30min ago haha i finished your video and was sold again. I want to write a book this year and honestly maybe i need the energy thos authors books brings for inspiration
@@StrangeLatte omg thats great! I REALLY think so, I mean of course research is important and especially if you wanna be published but the overall "fuck it attitude It's my book" I think is a great way to start and keep reminding oneself of. Good luck with the book that's so exciting!
This video literally summarises how I feel about all for the game!! its so bad and i would never recommend it but its also so good and it might even be one of my comfort books even if it's just traumas and gays and a terrible writing...
Also something i find incredible is the importance of some characters to the fandom even if they're almost forgotten in the book
ps: i love your channel
It's SO funny that AFTG is so many people's comfortread 😭 I mean I get it! But with this content haha 💔 the AFTG fandom overall is just really lovely.
(Thank you!! That means a lot 🥰)
This series ended up on my radar when I was first reading the Raven Cycle. I couldn't even finish the first book because it was so bad. I was baffled by the crossover in the fandoms because the difference in quality of writing and worldbuilding could not be bigger. Regardless, I have been fascinated by the phenomenon of the series' popularity since then, so I really enjoyed this video!
Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it even though you didn't enjoy the book haha. It's a HUGE difference in quality, so I get that a lot of people coming from TRC and expecting something similar are shocked haha
I have another controversial comparison to make: All For the Game reminds me of Banana Fish. I haven't actually read AFTG (yet) but I have watched multiple plot summary/review videos for it, so I think I have a pretty good understanding of the gist of it. The extensive list of trigger warnings, the main characters being queer teenage boys with mafia connections, and the insane unrealistic plot conflicts are very similar between the two.
these books are garbage, but they are MY garbage
I read all three books in like a week back in 2021 because a friend recommended them to me. Had no idea what was going on most of the time but ended up obsessing over them for months. So yeah. Truly a phenomenon.
Haha the classic aftg-brainrot
Ok no word to word ive had the same experience
i remember reading it all in a span of 3 days while sick. I think it helped me not question anything lmao was just yeah checks out. Very nice video and i think you nailed why it is so beloved
Haha thank you! 💞
I am fucking obsessed with aftg. and got into it from seeing a meme online of the relationship with neil and andrew and wanted to know more.
So when I see people talk about it. I know that they are bad and when I see people talk about them I don’t want them to bash them because they are good in so many ways. It just takes analysis to understand why they are so good.
I also think that the Fannon for the series has the same ‘fuck it’ attitude so it makes it beater because fans retcon-ed it into something a lot better.
Yeah I don't like retcon at all. Like it never gives me anything, and in the case of AFTG (which has soooo much retcon) I like how the fandom has picked out parts of it and made fanon and ignored others.
i heard trauma, gays, and terrible writing and i downloaded it (for FREE) on apple books immediately
Welcome to the club
I feel like I've seen that cover everywhere and until a few days ago never had a clue what it referred too. I've also seen it referenced on fanfic sites as AUs and since I never read AUs and I never put them together. I'm going to have to read these books now, though. I feel like it would be a cathartic experience as a writer who always feels torn between self-indulgence and "proper" storytelling, even though I mostly just do it for fun. I honestly always wondered what would happen if people published books that read more like fanfic and less traditional and am low-key hoping this is a first of a future trend. Almost a reclaiming of what stories get popular away from corporate.
I do think you should read them! They're very different from TRC, but at the same time the fandoms are very intertwined because so many people love them both. And i get why - I mean I really enjoyed both! But in very different ways.
But really - read it especially if you need inspiration for your own writing haha. This truly is a "write not what you know but whatever the fuck you want" manifesto.
@@obviouslyqueer I want to but I have way too many unread books, once I get that under control then I'll have to check this series out. I'm sure I'll fall into the "it's trash but I love it (or at least like it)" category lol.
Fascinating. I haven't read these pdfs but I guess that being obscure is no measure of a break from industrialisation any more. 'Indie' is not enough. Being simultaneously gold and toxic, bad but brave, lazy but sacrificing more than mere 'hard work' is probably the interesting measure.
Just found your channel and am working through your videos! Love seeing deep dives on new-to-me media. I was on tumblr at that time, idk how I missed this entirely.
Oh boy. I'm dreading this. I loved this series and I started reading it before it blew up on tumblr (I think 2013? lol) because I was on a huge queer book binge in high school so I was just living in that goodreads section.
It's amazing how it became so contentious and now when I look into the tag people mostly talk about how it's bad or share cute fanart. I wonder what it's like to be the author. Considering she never published another series, I suppouse that speaks for itself.
Hearing the plot laid out like this, I understand what I liked about it. Still cringe at the cheesy bits but... yeah, I see what got to me there. I wish I could find another series about misfits who were allowed to be messy.
She hasn't written another series but she isn't done with this one haha, if you haven't heard she's realising a new AFTG book this year. It will be about Jean, and his time with the Trojans after Renee rescued him from the ravens. 10 years later haha, so welcome back to the fandom 😬
Oh gosh I love this video because it speaks for/to me! Alone all the comments of reviewers at the beginning! So true! XD "It has like all the triggers in the world"! So true, yet I'm still trash for this series and its characters. 😂I've read the first 2 books and I just started to read the third one so this video totally came at the right time! Thank you! =)
Can't wait to hear your thoughts on the last one! That's the one for me for sure!
Retcon is something I generally don’t like. But in the fan spaces the attitude towards Nora’s retcon is that it is there and you can take what you like and leave the rest. Again that ‘fuck it’ attitude.
I also think the use of Nora’s language like the ease of it makes it super easy to read them really fast.
Exactly! I'm not a fan of retcon but as you say I think the AFTG fandom has done a great job of picking the best and ignoring the worst haha
Great, now I want to reread it xD
Do it! Do it! Do it!