ancient refinery on a habbitat spam. you never run out of rare resourses, even in the late game spamming research rings. also starbases with progenetor hive is like unkillable, i've been holding x25 crysis with their help like it's nothing
I greatly enjoyed the Archeo-missiles and the Archeo-drones because of one very specific scenario. I played psionic and went full-on camouflage with Encryption, Enigmatic Engineering, the whole thing. A militarily superior devouring swarm empire declared war so I just took two small fleets, cloak-jumped into their borders with the psi jump-drives and went full Northern-Vietman. I took out a few starbases and then cloaked in a randomly generated shield-nullifying nebula that was also a chokepoint. They took the bait and went in with their whole superior fleet. Now the issue was of course that my ships were cloaked, meaning that upon uncloaking they would not have any shields. But because I was in a shield-nullifying nebula, we were actually on even ground. Or rather we would have been, because I took precautions and actually took no shields and went for full armor. So I basically had no disadvantage from being in this nebula whatsoever. The other issue is that the Archeo-drones do reduced shield-damage, but again, no shields for them. Now I'd just wait for the bulk of their forces to leave the system again, so I could just uncloak in the exact right moment and basically ambush the slower half of their forces just before they could make their FTL-jump. They had no shields and their armor didn't matter, since both the missiles and the drones completely ignored them and just attacked their hull directly. By the time the faster half of their fleet jumped back into the system, the others were already destroyed and they too fell fairly quickly.
The Archeo ship shields. On paper the don't have all that much shield HP compared to later shields, but the regen is on par with Dark Matter Shields and the perk increases its HP to between DM and Hyper shields. However what really makes it is the +15% hardening... which stacks. This also frees up your Utility slots that you would have used for a shield hardener for the same percentage, or in addition too to get really hard ;-).
You lose the minor artifacts from your scientist jobs if you convert your homeworld. If you want fleets with archeotech, then losing a significant amount of artifacts by converting to an accumunopolis is very bad.
@@AndrewChumKaser but he is still getting a lot of minor artifacts from orbital research stations, the economic benefits he will be getting from a ecumonopolis will surely be 10 times as good as +1.5 minor artifacts per month.
Been toying with a empire with that origin for a bit, you get around 2-4 on average I find What sucks though, is im fairly sure you don't get a precursor with the origin either, least I haven't in the 6 games I've played with the origin since the new update, don't think I ever played it before the update, so im not sure if that's just always been a thing Though, the origin is still handy for a good headstart if your lucky enough to get some other digsites, cause man in the late game does artifacts become a major pain, cause those weapons are solid
@@Austin555661 you can only find the precursor sites or digs after you finished your mid game event chain, but the chance to find them is 3 times higher. if you got any unexplored systems left at that time :(
@Austin555661 on the shoulders of giants should spawn 5 sites, so you should get a minimum of 5 minor artifact income, then there's the chance that one or more of those sites give more than 1 artifact deposit. I had a game where I ended with 14 income just from 5 arch sites aside from the 5 on the shoulders of giants gives. It led to me getting l gates without any research spent and several of the very nice precursor buildings. (Which by the way, the class 4 singularity gives 250 energy for nothing but a random roll of reverse engineering.)
@@sparrow9663 I've had em spawn no artifacts decently commonly. It really is just an rngfest for it But it is still neat for the extra artifacts early on, just cause those archeo weapons hold good power
Oh yea, also I think the point of the nano missile launcher thing is to counter point defense. Each one of their missiles is really tiny and it fires at autocannon rates. It saturates point defense, allowing things like torps to nuke the enemy safely
That may well have being the intention but they shred ships faster than torps can hurt battleships and that's before taking the perk for extra 33% damage. It is a stream rather than alpha and you do have to wait for the things to arrive at target but they are much more versitile as the effect is the same vs all class of ship. Only tier 4 strike craft do slightly better without the perk but lag behind afterwards.
Even with point defense, some of those missiles STILL hit the target. Because they ignore armor and shields, that's good damage. Sure, they dont do much to hull, but they still ignore shields and armor, which are basically 2 additional health bars you gotta work through otherwise. Outfit a bunch of ships with these, and no matter the point defense of the enemy, you can overwhelm them pretty quickly. Downside: you'll probably burn through a lot of materials just keeping your fleet up with frigates, which arent good for taking hits.
Yep, add in Driller Drone strike craft, you ignore shields with one and armour with the other. When you get the shield shredder it gets tempting to mix in a few to open the ships up to drilling and perhaps neutron launchers
Currently the tooltip doesn't take into account the increased damage Archeo weapons get with the Rubicator and the Ascension perk. The Collapser for example shows as a 20 damage/day, but with the perk and Rubicator it actually does 29.7 per day. With the perk figure in an additional 33% damage over what the tooltip tells you, with the perk and Rubicator it's basically +50% damage.
For the research speed thing: The Faculty of Archaeostudios grants +100% research speed, increasing to +150% on a Relic world. The devs just didn't put the effects together in a clear way that makes it appear buggy.
The main issue I had with this archeotech stuff is that you can only stockpile about 3000 minor artifacts. Even with a minor artifact income of 29 per month, I still couldn't properly maintain a full fleet (about 2000 fleet limit) in the late game. Oh sure, with enough patience, you can build them - once. But the gods help you trying to reinforce a fleet that size with a stockpile of 3000... To run all the techs, you need a stockpile at least 3-5 times as big.
@@daviddragonheart6798 Sadly, no. I did build several starbases wirth resource silos, but it didn't increase the cap on minor artifacts. Unless they need to be built on planets instead... I haven't tried that.
The whole system needs to be rebalanced IMO. As it stands, you're encouraged to either focus on archeotechs (in which case you grab the ascension perk) or ignore them entirely. If you're using lots of archeotechs, then the 3000 minor artifact limit severely prevents you from maintaining a large fleet. But if you're not using archeotechs at all, then you're sitting on this massive stockpile that simply accumulates faster than you can possibly burn through it.
Well I've gone with them and have s killer early mid game fleet. All the tech and the artefact stockpile was there. So I ran it down but I have the Rubricator relic world so can make extra. Go for Alien Logs early on, with Map the Stars there's decent odds of finding it to exploit early game.
The advantage of archeo weapons, for the most part, is that you can get them very early. They’re on par with tier 4 weapons and you can have them by tier 2/3. So it’s great for early wars, but it really falls off.
The exception being the Saturator Artillery having the same stats as Gigacannons at base while ignoring the Ascension and Rubicator buffs, but with higher shield damage at the cost of armor damage. Plus IMHO the Collapsar still holds its own against Gammas when factoring in those buffs and armor pen. Oh, and the Ruination Glare is the only alternate T slot available and it's a reduced range but massively higher DPS version of the base one.
From my experience, they range in power factor from about as good as tier 3 to end tier level. Due to their side grade nature, it can be a bit hard to figure out how good they are. But there are times I have kept them to late game. Especially when you factor in Ascension and Rubricator buffs. Getting these weapons early can really be a leg up if you're lucky. That is, if your economy can supply the needed minor artefacts. But on the other hand. If you get the really early, you should just need a few ships to really dominate.
@@haesung2148 Very true. But I see that is a way to balance it out. You can get one or two really potent ships early game. But not a whole fleet. And you do not want to lose it. So that is good for the overall pace of the game and makes them feel special. (Also, you need to unlock an ascension perk first to gain the full benefit. That you can do pretty early, but you're not that likely to go with it as your first perk. It is a risk reward thing to do.)
It feels like most combat archeotech is heavily geared towards early conquest - you get it at T3 with massive research speed bonuses, the lump minor artifacts from digs are still relevant, and with the AP + rubricator the weapons are very close to a (poorly scaling) T5. Playing on 0.5x tech cost (while artifact economy remains unchanged) kind of undermines this advantage
The shield and shield hardening one is insane, because you're not constrained by the limited auxilliary slots for hardening any more, but the shield and armour one falls off once you get T5 shields or the anti-matter ones and T4+ armour.
@@TheFlibidy yeah that’s basically it I just got really lucky on my fear of the dark play through and got like +100 minor artifacts a month. So I decided to have a bit of fun and did a full load out of the shields and armour that buffs shield regen. It was really good mid game unless the AI was running full kinetic most things would just bounce off.
The Faculty of Archestudies is working as intended, the description is just weird. It gives +100% research speed for Archeotech, and another +50% if it's built on a relic world. It just showed you the combined value from the building + "on a relic world" modifier on the building, and then pointed out it was +50% if built on a relic world, it is not supposed to give +200%.
It's weird building coding. I swapped it so former relic worlds get the bonus still in my game (Which is partly for compatibility with Gigastructures' Frameworld too). The buildings always show currently active effects, then there is a custom description. The mod without gigas compatibility is on the workshop BTW.
I found that looking at values on this ship builder with archaeotech stuff to be deceptive, and under-represent the actual values. For instance, buffs to shields would not show up, but I could see that parts like the pulse armor are much stronger than the ship builder leads you to believe if you inspect the already built ships. I compared a ship with pulse armor and one with even Neutronium Armor and Hyper Shields via inspecting a built ship and found the pulse armor was superior.
Archeotech weapons don't show the damage boost they get from the ascension perk or rubricator in the ship builder, so they are *slightly better*. the nano cloud is also better because it fires 10* faster than missiles so it isn't as countered by point defense, it also goes straight to hull like disruptors which reduces enemy combat effectiveness unlike shield and armour hits
I made an empire called "The Galactic Historical Society" for the memes and to test the new archeotech. Ended up conquering half the galaxy before unlocking Battleships.
Conquering other nations and stealing all their artefacts in the name of historical preservation and appreciation... So basically the British Empire in Space? :)
The zroni precursors give a starbase building which summons a permanent artificially storm in the system which it’s built, it nullifes shields, massively hits subspace speed, and shrouds the system from sensors. Using this, and the ancient ramparts, I had a 20k starbase absolutely shred a 100k khan fleet. It was the best sight ive ever seen. I later lost that same game due to opening up the L-gates that riddled my empire, and letting free the grey swarm. They killed my archeo-fleets faster than I could get new minor artifacts. :(
So recently finally bought some the dlcs and my first new run has been an archeotech empire. I have a full fleet (400k so far) using the archeo missiles and the shield and armour techs. Perhaps the rate of minor artifact supply has been increased as I've had no problems. Though to fair its been a very lucky map. Barred galaxy and ive had 90% of 1 bar to myself due to my spawn location being very close to one end making early choke point via early war to wipe one civ and lucky placement of a fallen empire helping block things off giving easy control my half of the galactic bar. And the connection between my galaxy bar at far end with the other bar is choked by another fallen empire. So 90% of my play has been peacfully exploring settling and getting all of the dig sites to my self for one half of the galaxy. The other galactic bar has been a long war between 7 to 9 other empires.
The base bonus from the Faculty of Archaeostudies is 100%, so the 150% it's showing is already incorporating the 50% bonus. I think that applies to any tooltip that shows a bonus from the archeoengineering ascension perk as well. As for the ministry of truth, it does produce influence, but I think it only produces something like 0.1 per month or so, and as such the tooltip rounds it down to 0. If you look at the breakdown of influence gain from the actual influence display at the top, pretty sure you'll see it. For a super defensive starbase, I've found stacking those defensive archeotech modules (the ramparts) and then just loading up on those archeotech missile cloud defense platforms is deceptively powerful, one of the few setups I've had where an enemy fleet will throw themselves at my starbase and take heavier losses from their fleet than I do with my defense platforms, as boosted shields and shield hardening greatly increases their survivability. It is, however, very expensive on minor artifacts. Also part of what makes the missile cloud powerful is that they fire significantly faster than point defense, and if you're firing missiles faster than they can shoot them down, they will start getting through in numbers, but you really need to double down on the missiles in order for the overwhelming firepower to pay dividends. I do agree that the "fancy" kinetic and laser weapons really fall off, though I still like the armor that applies shields; the two for one gets you overall more defense than base one or the other in combination I believe, and on larger ships you can throw in a little shield hardening booster.
From my last game, the only archaeotechs I used en-masse were the refinery, pulse armor, shield hardener, point defense and faculty of archaeo-study, which you can get from a digsite. One fleet wipe and your entire empire requires a complete downgrade redesign though.
0:23 still dominate? Sir, I don't think you keep track of your won/failed challenges ratio. To give you an idea, it's as good as most people's torrent upload/download ratio.
Archeotech enjoyer here. They work best in combined arms with traditional weapons. 2 disruptor and 1 nano missile is still enough to overwhelm most defenses due to fire rate. As for the Ancient guns, they dont have any minimum range, which is there only advantage, still kinda bad. Archeotech ships synergize pretty well with Psionic which give bonus shield hardening as well. The main goal is to get just the slight edge with archeo weapons, not to run them entirely.
I found that certain techs can screw your bastions because the computer doesn't know how to outfit them properly. I started avoiding archaeotech after this bar some useful ones such as the point defence gun, manufacturing plant and the tech building that gives an extra science director. Even with the relic world start and the rubicator the weapons are not up to scratch compared to normal weapons apart from the massive X slot ones. Even researching the armour and shields messes with your bastions, so researching them can really cause problems.
Driller drones with the saturator is good, AI doesn't really build reactive armor so by the time fleets engage the driller drone will have already debuffedatk speed through hull penetration
I'm having a blast with these techs. The nano missiles just melt everything early/mid game. Just corvette spam with nothing but those and watch the enemy hull get shredded before they've gotten off a second volley
I just wonder why you need so many pots, books and such inside a gun in the first place. It is like building a railgun with a toaster, a chair, a cheesy romance novel and a garden gnome.
im in love with the ancient refinery once i obtain that i unbuild all my gas.crystal, mote buildings and turn them into something else, since a few refineries alone gave me like +23~ a month in all three
Loving the macro batteries even if they're half the dps of gauss batteries, same for the hybrid armor plates. the only drawback is I can barely afford my fleets now due to the artifact cost
Bear in mind that the bonuses from Archaeoengineering dont show up in the Ship Designer, only after the ships have been built. The Archaeotech kit IS better than basic tech, but only if you have the Ascension Perk to boost it
I'm mixing the swarm cloud missiles in with whirlwind and strike craft, even mix of battleship/cruiser/destroyer all with artillery computer. No alpha strike but in the fleet comp but no losses against starbases and decent performance against similarly sized ai fleets.
I'm dying to try nano-launcher+pulse armor Become the Crisis run, these launchers outspam any PD imaginable and pulse armor is really good with perk, it is better than shieldsV+armorV combination. All we lack at this point is ancient sheep designs that can be dug up or even included in the archeo perk. It seems so on the surface, but they never give it to us :(
They are not really so much better than ordinary weapons, but you can get HUGE damage bonuses from ascensions perks, relics etc. So i think in the end you can get more damage from archaeotech weapons than from normal.
"Don't need more than one refinery world" - Say that when you play on 1000 stars, Grand Admiral, 200 years into the game. I had 6 refinery worlds and it was barely enough, lol.
🤔sure the base dmg of the Archeo weapons might be lower than their non archeo counterparts, but doesn't the lack of a minimum range help keep your artillery ships from constantly having to try to re-adjust their range against smaller faster ships help to offset that? not to mention the guaranteed dmg boost from the ascension perk if you choose to take it, as well as the Rubicator if you can get it
First League for Archeotech is actually pretty good, since you get a relic world out of it, so if you start as a Remnant origin, that means you get at least 2 relic worlds, so a total of 300% archeotech research speed, and 2 artifacts per month at base value. This is NOT counting any digsites which could have an artifact deposit when completed, but at minimum, that's not bad. You'll need more to use Archeotech in your ships, though.
The special building, Faculty of Archaeostudies, from which you get these bonuses (archeotech research speed, minor artifacts, etc.) has an Empire Limit of 1/1. So you can only build it on one of your Relic worlds (thus no stacking bonuses).
The thing about the Archeo build is that its well ... Ancient , its out of date , passed its prime , it was Once good but there is just too much better now.
Once you have endgame tech, the weapons fall off pretty hard but it’s a good advantage until then. The big advantage is the buildings and the artifact income. You can instantly grab your precursor secret and spam the artifact actions on cooldown in the late game.
I wish I could have The Rubricator JUST ONCE! Gosh, I don't know how people get so lucky. P.S. Can anyone explain what the point of the Ancient Macro Batteries could be? Their accuracy sucks, and the rest of their stats aren't worth much either. Sure, they don't have minimum range, but that hardly justifies using them over Gauss Cannons or the almighty Kinetic Artillery!
There is admiral destiny trait for 30% hit chance and 30% tracking. Combine it with line combat computer and you can rid of this terrifying miss chance if you really want it for some reason.
Does anyone have a good resource for learning how to best manage loyalty? I always just maximize loyalty until they are at cap and then start taking advantage of them, but when I see people who know what they're doing, (like here: 9:12) they tend to immediately have negative loyalty.
Archeo ship components are just too pricey in terms of Minor Artifacts. If it was the same level of investment as strategic resources it would be a strong alternative even to late game, but when you're losing entire fleets to endgame crises and a fully archeo-tech Destroyer costs like 300+ minor artifacts with artifact stockpile capping at 3000, there are issues.
i played with archeotech , theyr weapons are simply better . but i understood very fast that i could not realy afford more than 1 fleet with those components. it cost simply too much to rebuild all ships if you use it on all fleets. it gave me an actual reason to have more than 1 design for ship size.
I gotta disagree with you EpO, if you want to specialize your empire in having a massive economy, 1 ancient refinery per world is plenty balanced enough. especially if you don't play with pop scaling and you keed *alot* of alloys because modded games with NSC for example, do have some hella expensive ships
Quick question: I noticed at the beginning of the game, your technologies only costed 1000 research for the super early ones, while mine cost 2000. Is this a setting or something? Where can I find it if so?
Anyone else find the exploits less interesting? I know that autocannons and vassal blobbing are part of the game right now but they're clearly unbalanced and not working as intended (the dev's even acknowledged the vassal willingness problem and are looking to fix it). Maybe it's just me but I feel it's a shame how many videos consist of abusing game mechanics. If it's because it's not possible to beat GA without it no reason not to drop the difficulty.
Played with a friend 2 days ago, and yeah, archeotech is a massive disappointment as far as "offense" components go. Buildings are awesome tho, and having an ancient raffinery on every single word is chef's kiss
What's your favourite Archeo tech?
ancient refinery. it slaps so hard.
Nice tips:)
With tec:)
ancient refinery on a habbitat spam. you never run out of rare resourses, even in the late game spamming research rings.
also starbases with progenetor hive is like unkillable, i've been holding x25 crysis with their help like it's nothing
I greatly enjoyed the Archeo-missiles and the Archeo-drones because of one very specific scenario.
I played psionic and went full-on camouflage with Encryption, Enigmatic Engineering, the whole thing.
A militarily superior devouring swarm empire declared war so I just took two small fleets, cloak-jumped into their borders with the psi jump-drives and went full Northern-Vietman.
I took out a few starbases and then cloaked in a randomly generated shield-nullifying nebula that was also a chokepoint. They took the bait and went in with their whole superior fleet.
Now the issue was of course that my ships were cloaked, meaning that upon uncloaking they would not have any shields. But because I was in a shield-nullifying nebula, we were actually on even ground. Or rather we would have been, because I took precautions and actually took no shields and went for full armor. So I basically had no disadvantage from being in this nebula whatsoever. The other issue is that the Archeo-drones do reduced shield-damage, but again, no shields for them.
Now I'd just wait for the bulk of their forces to leave the system again, so I could just uncloak in the exact right moment and basically ambush the slower half of their forces just before they could make their FTL-jump. They had no shields and their armor didn't matter, since both the missiles and the drones completely ignored them and just attacked their hull directly.
By the time the faster half of their fleet jumped back into the system, the others were already destroyed and they too fell fairly quickly.
The Archeo ship shields. On paper the don't have all that much shield HP compared to later shields, but the regen is on par with Dark Matter Shields and the perk increases its HP to between DM and Hyper shields. However what really makes it is the +15% hardening... which stacks. This also frees up your Utility slots that you would have used for a shield hardener for the same percentage, or in addition too to get really hard ;-).
As a massive ecumonopolis fan I'm dieing inside every time you skip the +1 housing tech
:)
You lose the minor artifacts from your scientist jobs if you convert your homeworld. If you want fleets with archeotech, then losing a significant amount of artifacts by converting to an accumunopolis is very bad.
@@AndrewChumKaser that’s why I didn’t go it!
@@AndrewChumKaser but he is still getting a lot of minor artifacts from orbital research stations, the economic benefits he will be getting from a ecumonopolis will surely be 10 times as good as +1.5 minor artifacts per month.
@@AndrewChumKaser then use the first leagues relic world for an ecu
Montu with this origin: *sells everything to private collectors*
So fun fact, on the shoulders of giants will give you like 10 minor artifact income.
Oh that's a nice fact you got there
Been toying with a empire with that origin for a bit, you get around 2-4 on average I find
What sucks though, is im fairly sure you don't get a precursor with the origin either, least I haven't in the 6 games I've played with the origin since the new update, don't think I ever played it before the update, so im not sure if that's just always been a thing
Though, the origin is still handy for a good headstart if your lucky enough to get some other digsites, cause man in the late game does artifacts become a major pain, cause those weapons are solid
@@Austin555661 you can only find the precursor sites or digs after you finished your mid game event chain, but the chance to find them is 3 times higher. if you got any unexplored systems left at that time :(
@Austin555661 on the shoulders of giants should spawn 5 sites, so you should get a minimum of 5 minor artifact income, then there's the chance that one or more of those sites give more than 1 artifact deposit. I had a game where I ended with 14 income just from 5 arch sites aside from the 5 on the shoulders of giants gives. It led to me getting l gates without any research spent and several of the very nice precursor buildings. (Which by the way, the class 4 singularity gives 250 energy for nothing but a random roll of reverse engineering.)
@@sparrow9663 I've had em spawn no artifacts decently commonly. It really is just an rngfest for it
But it is still neat for the extra artifacts early on, just cause those archeo weapons hold good power
Oh yea, also I think the point of the nano missile launcher thing is to counter point defense. Each one of their missiles is really tiny and it fires at autocannon rates. It saturates point defense, allowing things like torps to nuke the enemy safely
That may well have being the intention but they shred ships faster than torps can hurt battleships and that's before taking the perk for extra 33% damage. It is a stream rather than alpha and you do have to wait for the things to arrive at target but they are much more versitile as the effect is the same vs all class of ship. Only tier 4 strike craft do slightly better without the perk but lag behind afterwards.
Even with point defense, some of those missiles STILL hit the target. Because they ignore armor and shields, that's good damage. Sure, they dont do much to hull, but they still ignore shields and armor, which are basically 2 additional health bars you gotta work through otherwise.
Outfit a bunch of ships with these, and no matter the point defense of the enemy, you can overwhelm them pretty quickly. Downside: you'll probably burn through a lot of materials just keeping your fleet up with frigates, which arent good for taking hits.
Yep, add in Driller Drone strike craft, you ignore shields with one and armour with the other.
When you get the shield shredder it gets tempting to mix in a few to open the ships up to drilling and perhaps neutron launchers
Its not stated in the ascension perk tooltip but the archioengineers ascension perk does make you 3x more likely to draw archiotechs.
Seems a lot of tooltip fixes are needed around it. I don't think it reflects if you take the Ascension Perk in the Ship Designer, etc.
Currently the tooltip doesn't take into account the increased damage Archeo weapons get with the Rubicator and the Ascension perk. The Collapser for example shows as a 20 damage/day, but with the perk and Rubicator it actually does 29.7 per day. With the perk figure in an additional 33% damage over what the tooltip tells you, with the perk and Rubicator it's basically +50% damage.
Archeotech weapons are decent, you are forgetting all +% dmg bonuses that are not counted in the weapon stats in ship designer.
For the research speed thing: The Faculty of Archaeostudios grants +100% research speed, increasing to +150% on a Relic world.
The devs just didn't put the effects together in a clear way that makes it appear buggy.
The main issue I had with this archeotech stuff is that you can only stockpile about 3000 minor artifacts. Even with a minor artifact income of 29 per month, I still couldn't properly maintain a full fleet (about 2000 fleet limit) in the late game. Oh sure, with enough patience, you can build them - once. But the gods help you trying to reinforce a fleet that size with a stockpile of 3000... To run all the techs, you need a stockpile at least 3-5 times as big.
IIRC you can make resource silos and increase the amount of artifacts you can keep at max. Not sure though, never had enough artifacts to test that.
@@daviddragonheart6798 Sadly, no. I did build several starbases wirth resource silos, but it didn't increase the cap on minor artifacts. Unless they need to be built on planets instead... I haven't tried that.
The whole system needs to be rebalanced IMO. As it stands, you're encouraged to either focus on archeotechs (in which case you grab the ascension perk) or ignore them entirely. If you're using lots of archeotechs, then the 3000 minor artifact limit severely prevents you from maintaining a large fleet. But if you're not using archeotechs at all, then you're sitting on this massive stockpile that simply accumulates faster than you can possibly burn through it.
Well I've gone with them and have s killer early mid game fleet. All the tech and the artefact stockpile was there. So I ran it down but I have the Rubricator relic world so can make extra.
Go for Alien Logs early on, with Map the Stars there's decent odds of finding it to exploit early game.
There is an opportunity for you to become a crisis. Then there will be access to ships that ignore the cost in resources. Only minerals.
The advantage of archeo weapons, for the most part, is that you can get them very early. They’re on par with tier 4 weapons and you can have them by tier 2/3. So it’s great for early wars, but it really falls off.
The exception being the Saturator Artillery having the same stats as Gigacannons at base while ignoring the Ascension and Rubicator buffs, but with higher shield damage at the cost of armor damage. Plus IMHO the Collapsar still holds its own against Gammas when factoring in those buffs and armor pen.
Oh, and the Ruination Glare is the only alternate T slot available and it's a reduced range but massively higher DPS version of the base one.
From my experience, they range in power factor from about as good as tier 3 to end tier level. Due to their side grade nature, it can be a bit hard to figure out how good they are. But there are times I have kept them to late game. Especially when you factor in Ascension and Rubricator buffs.
Getting these weapons early can really be a leg up if you're lucky. That is, if your economy can supply the needed minor artefacts. But on the other hand. If you get the really early, you should just need a few ships to really dominate.
The problem is the minor artifact cost in the early game is almost impossible to maintain so it is not exactly useful in the early game either.
@@haesung2148 Very true. But I see that is a way to balance it out. You can get one or two really potent ships early game. But not a whole fleet. And you do not want to lose it. So that is good for the overall pace of the game and makes them feel special.
(Also, you need to unlock an ascension perk first to gain the full benefit. That you can do pretty early, but you're not that likely to go with it as your first perk. It is a risk reward thing to do.)
Some of them look very nice late game with ascension slot.
It feels like most combat archeotech is heavily geared towards early conquest - you get it at T3 with massive research speed bonuses, the lump minor artifacts from digs are still relevant, and with the AP + rubricator the weapons are very close to a (poorly scaling) T5. Playing on 0.5x tech cost (while artifact economy remains unchanged) kind of undermines this advantage
25:51 "Scooby-doo refugees arrive" 'ALRIGHT GANG OUR PLANET JUST GOT DESTROYED, LET'S SPLIT UP AND LOOK FOR CLUES!'
I really love the archeo techs I don’t know if they are better but the shields and armour worked really good for me
The shield and shield hardening one is insane, because you're not constrained by the limited auxilliary slots for hardening any more, but the shield and armour one falls off once you get T5 shields or the anti-matter ones and T4+ armour.
@@TheFlibidy yeah that’s basically it I just got really lucky on my fear of the dark play through and got like +100 minor artifacts a month. So I decided to have a bit of fun and did a full load out of the shields and armour that buffs shield regen. It was really good mid game unless the AI was running full kinetic most things would just bounce off.
PRO TIP: Reverse engineering can give you the ability to build Fallen empire buildings.
It was also super expensive! Wanted to save for fleets! But yes it can and it’s pretty cool!
Try it with shoulders of giants, probably the most guaranteed minor artifact deposits
How do you reverse engineer buildings tho
The Faculty of Archestudies is working as intended, the description is just weird.
It gives +100% research speed for Archeotech, and another +50% if it's built on a relic world. It just showed you the combined value from the building + "on a relic world" modifier on the building, and then pointed out it was +50% if built on a relic world, it is not supposed to give +200%.
It's weird building coding. I swapped it so former relic worlds get the bonus still in my game (Which is partly for compatibility with Gigastructures' Frameworld too). The buildings always show currently active effects, then there is a custom description.
The mod without gigas compatibility is on the workshop BTW.
The buildings and starbase modules are good, ancient refinery is insane, and the ship modules are too expensive for what they do.
actually valid tl;dr of archeotech
I found that looking at values on this ship builder with archaeotech stuff to be deceptive, and under-represent the actual values. For instance, buffs to shields would not show up, but I could see that parts like the pulse armor are much stronger than the ship builder leads you to believe if you inspect the already built ships. I compared a ship with pulse armor and one with even Neutronium Armor and Hyper Shields via inspecting a built ship and found the pulse armor was superior.
Archeotech weapons don't show the damage boost they get from the ascension perk or rubricator in the ship builder, so they are *slightly better*. the nano cloud is also better because it fires 10* faster than missiles so it isn't as countered by point defense, it also goes straight to hull like disruptors which reduces enemy combat effectiveness unlike shield and armour hits
I made an empire called "The Galactic Historical Society" for the memes and to test the new archeotech. Ended up conquering half the galaxy before unlocking Battleships.
Conquering other nations and stealing all their artefacts in the name of historical preservation and appreciation... So basically the British Empire in Space? :)
@@JaceMorley If the British Empire only did all that conquest just to fill their museums and for no other purpose lol
Same bro but I was also a driven assman so either way…
The zroni precursors give a starbase building which summons a permanent artificially storm in the system which it’s built, it nullifes shields, massively hits subspace speed, and shrouds the system from sensors. Using this, and the ancient ramparts, I had a 20k starbase absolutely shred a 100k khan fleet. It was the best sight ive ever seen. I later lost that same game due to opening up the L-gates that riddled my empire, and letting free the grey swarm. They killed my archeo-fleets faster than I could get new minor artifacts. :(
So recently finally bought some the dlcs and my first new run has been an archeotech empire. I have a full fleet (400k so far) using the archeo missiles and the shield and armour techs. Perhaps the rate of minor artifact supply has been increased as I've had no problems. Though to fair its been a very lucky map. Barred galaxy and ive had 90% of 1 bar to myself due to my spawn location being very close to one end making early choke point via early war to wipe one civ and lucky placement of a fallen empire helping block things off giving easy control my half of the galactic bar. And the connection between my galaxy bar at far end with the other bar is choked by another fallen empire. So 90% of my play has been peacfully exploring settling and getting all of the dig sites to my self for one half of the galaxy. The other galactic bar has been a long war between 7 to 9 other empires.
The base bonus from the Faculty of Archaeostudies is 100%, so the 150% it's showing is already incorporating the 50% bonus. I think that applies to any tooltip that shows a bonus from the archeoengineering ascension perk as well.
As for the ministry of truth, it does produce influence, but I think it only produces something like 0.1 per month or so, and as such the tooltip rounds it down to 0. If you look at the breakdown of influence gain from the actual influence display at the top, pretty sure you'll see it.
For a super defensive starbase, I've found stacking those defensive archeotech modules (the ramparts) and then just loading up on those archeotech missile cloud defense platforms is deceptively powerful, one of the few setups I've had where an enemy fleet will throw themselves at my starbase and take heavier losses from their fleet than I do with my defense platforms, as boosted shields and shield hardening greatly increases their survivability. It is, however, very expensive on minor artifacts. Also part of what makes the missile cloud powerful is that they fire significantly faster than point defense, and if you're firing missiles faster than they can shoot them down, they will start getting through in numbers, but you really need to double down on the missiles in order for the overwhelming firepower to pay dividends. I do agree that the "fancy" kinetic and laser weapons really fall off, though I still like the armor that applies shields; the two for one gets you overall more defense than base one or the other in combination I believe, and on larger ships you can throw in a little shield hardening booster.
From my last game, the only archaeotechs I used en-masse were the refinery, pulse armor, shield hardener, point defense and faculty of archaeo-study, which you can get from a digsite. One fleet wipe and your entire empire requires a complete downgrade redesign though.
0:23 still dominate? Sir, I don't think you keep track of your won/failed challenges ratio. To give you an idea, it's as good as most people's torrent upload/download ratio.
Archeotech enjoyer here. They work best in combined arms with traditional weapons. 2 disruptor and 1 nano missile is still enough to overwhelm most defenses due to fire rate. As for the Ancient guns, they dont have any minimum range, which is there only advantage, still kinda bad. Archeotech ships synergize pretty well with Psionic which give bonus shield hardening as well. The main goal is to get just the slight edge with archeo weapons, not to run them entirely.
I found that certain techs can screw your bastions because the computer doesn't know how to outfit them properly. I started avoiding archaeotech after this bar some useful ones such as the point defence gun, manufacturing plant and the tech building that gives an extra science director. Even with the relic world start and the rubicator the weapons are not up to scratch compared to normal weapons apart from the massive X slot ones. Even researching the armour and shields messes with your bastions, so researching them can really cause problems.
Driller drones with the saturator is good, AI doesn't really build reactive armor so by the time fleets engage the driller drone will have already debuffedatk speed through hull penetration
The one use I have found for Archeo tech so far is going Crisis and make nano cloud menacing corvettes since they never cost minor artifacts
I'm having a blast with these techs. The nano missiles just melt everything early/mid game. Just corvette spam with nothing but those and watch the enemy hull get shredded before they've gotten off a second volley
The guy just glosses over getting 3 relic worlds with origin, first league and rubricator :p
I just wonder why you need so many pots, books and such inside a gun in the first place.
It is like building a railgun with a toaster, a chair, a cheesy romance novel and a garden gnome.
I really like the addition of these modules & Misc-Tech! I have not done a Pure Archeotech run yet however... Perhaps it is time.
im in love with the ancient refinery once i obtain that i unbuild all my gas.crystal, mote buildings and turn them into something else, since a few refineries alone gave me like +23~ a month in all three
Really like that they added all this content to ancient relics.
It isn't?
Loving the macro batteries even if they're half the dps of gauss batteries, same for the hybrid armor plates. the only drawback is I can barely afford my fleets now due to the artifact cost
The relic giga cannons slap pretty damn hard
Habitable Worlds Survey event keeps popping up WAY late into games since the patch for me too. It's weird.
Please paradox let us do more with food
Me as soon as Ep rolled First League in their Relic World-lover video: Holy shit
that build would be nice with the more events mod or an extra archeo sites mod
Bear in mind that the bonuses from Archaeoengineering dont show up in the Ship Designer, only after the ships have been built.
The Archaeotech kit IS better than basic tech, but only if you have the Ascension Perk to boost it
I'm mixing the swarm cloud missiles in with whirlwind and strike craft, even mix of battleship/cruiser/destroyer all with artillery computer. No alpha strike but in the fleet comp but no losses against starbases and decent performance against similarly sized ai fleets.
btw , the advantage of the archeogausscannon is that they don't have min-range , so they can shot at any range .
I'm dying to try nano-launcher+pulse armor Become the Crisis run, these launchers outspam any PD imaginable and pulse armor is really good with perk, it is better than shieldsV+armorV combination.
All we lack at this point is ancient sheep designs that can be dug up or even included in the archeo perk. It seems so on the surface, but they never give it to us :(
They are not really so much better than ordinary weapons, but you can get HUGE damage bonuses from ascensions perks, relics etc. So i think in the end you can get more damage from archaeotech weapons than from normal.
boutta make this fanatic spiritualist militarist and combine it with a machine cult origin mod
not me thinking these techs where add by a mod I added, because they seemed way to good.
oh well you jsut found imperium of man in your game,now i can die peacefully knwoing that i saw equvilent of imperium of man in stellaris
If you want to have a fun time menacing class ships don’t require any rare resources… including minor artifacts ;)
"Don't need more than one refinery world" - Say that when you play on 1000 stars, Grand Admiral, 200 years into the game. I had 6 refinery worlds and it was barely enough, lol.
Do you think you’d be able to do a necroids with minor faction video by chance? Awesome videos
So you're basically playing as the Adeptus Mechanicus.
🤔sure the base dmg of the Archeo weapons might be lower than their non archeo counterparts, but doesn't the lack of a minimum range help keep your artillery ships from constantly having to try to re-adjust their range against smaller faster ships help to offset that? not to mention the guaranteed dmg boost from the ascension perk if you choose to take it, as well as the Rubicator if you can get it
First League gives you a second relic world :eyes:
If it barely works out, even with getting the Rubricator chain and a second Relic world... it's going to be tough to pull off without it.
Become the crisis lets you build archeo components for minerals
Vassal Spam is kind of out of control these days... This is without using Autocannons to cheese Fleet Power too?
I was using auto cannons I think!
7:34 yep, found some Swiss cheese 🙃
Yea nano launchers are insane, though they are not as good against starbases I have found
Should you get lucky with a 2nd or even a 3rd remnant world, i thought once minor artifact income becomes decent.
Archeotech only community game when?
First League for Archeotech is actually pretty good, since you get a relic world out of it, so if you start as a Remnant origin, that means you get at least 2 relic worlds, so a total of 300% archeotech research speed, and 2 artifacts per month at base value.
This is NOT counting any digsites which could have an artifact deposit when completed, but at minimum, that's not bad. You'll need more to use Archeotech in your ships, though.
The special building, Faculty of Archaeostudies, from which you get these bonuses (archeotech research speed, minor artifacts, etc.) has an Empire Limit of 1/1. So you can only build it on one of your Relic worlds (thus no stacking bonuses).
The thing about the Archeo build is that its well ... Ancient , its out of date , passed its prime , it was Once good but there is just too much better now.
What planet number would you recommend for this?
are disruptors really that good? I was putting them on my fleets but they were barely getting any kills... so I switched them up...
It's good for early game, other weapons are better in late game. If you have a large fleet, you can never renew it
This is literally one of the first things I did in this new patch.
Once you have endgame tech, the weapons fall off pretty hard but it’s a good advantage until then. The big advantage is the buildings and the artifact income. You can instantly grab your precursor secret and spam the artifact actions on cooldown in the late game.
Do you see the effects of the Ascension Perk inside the Ship Designer?
i think the tooltips all have a section that shows what additional stats the module would gain from the ascension perk
How well would this build work as a machine empire outta curiosity
I wish I could have The Rubricator JUST ONCE! Gosh, I don't know how people get so lucky.
P.S. Can anyone explain what the point of the Ancient Macro Batteries could be? Their accuracy sucks, and the rest of their stats aren't worth much either. Sure, they don't have minimum range, but that hardly justifies using them over Gauss Cannons or the almighty Kinetic Artillery!
There is admiral destiny trait for 30% hit chance and 30% tracking. Combine it with line combat computer and you can rid of this terrifying miss chance if you really want it for some reason.
i am trying this build and i got the rubricator 2 jumps from my capital, feeling very lucky
I'm really confused, how are you getting 3 scientists for research rather than just the the one head of research?
I think it's supposed to be 100% + 50% but the tooltip updates to show the 150% in the first instance. Not completely sure.
Thats. Litterly what it means.
100% + 50% = 150%
Does anyone have a good resource for learning how to best manage loyalty? I always just maximize loyalty until they are at cap and then start taking advantage of them, but when I see people who know what they're doing, (like here: 9:12) they tend to immediately have negative loyalty.
The archeo tech is great early to mid game and falls off once you have late game tech
Some of components are worth it late game with ascension perk
I feel like exploiting fleet power to vassal ai defects the purpose of a challenge run
So you've basically played as Mechanicus Explorators then?
Archeo ship components are just too pricey in terms of Minor Artifacts. If it was the same level of investment as strategic resources it would be a strong alternative even to late game, but when you're losing entire fleets to endgame crises and a fully archeo-tech Destroyer costs like 300+ minor artifacts with artifact stockpile capping at 3000, there are issues.
i played with archeotech , theyr weapons are simply better . but i understood very fast that i could not realy afford more than 1 fleet with those components. it cost simply too much to rebuild all ships if you use it on all fleets.
it gave me an actual reason to have more than 1 design for ship size.
Are you getting the 7800x3d for late game stellaris?
I still have a like 4yr old GPU lol! I might upgrade soon…
I'm trying to play gigastructural engineering with a Intel laptop from 2012.
I gotta disagree with you EpO, if you want to specialize your empire in having a massive economy, 1 ancient refinery per world is plenty balanced enough. especially if you don't play with pop scaling and you keed *alot* of alloys because modded games with NSC for example, do have some hella expensive ships
Do the nomads play through again! It’s been updated!
Coming this weekend! :)
@@Ep3o what day? Because it is the weekend for me
@@kaelcoates2396 Sunday most likely!
@@Ep3o 😁
Of course James May is an expert on old junk…
I hate when the Khan pops right as I enter the system.
Quick question: I noticed at the beginning of the game, your technologies only costed 1000 research for the super early ones, while mine cost 2000. Is this a setting or something? Where can I find it if so?
There’s a base research cost setting in the game creation screen
I play at 0.5x tech cost to make videos easier and quicker to record! This applies to everyone in the game, including AIs!
@@Ep3o Oh thank you! That explains a lot. I might do that if I want some speedier games in the future!
Cheese
Archeo-Cheese
@@Ep3oThat is a great idea. I decree that this shall be added to the game with utmost importance.
Happily be her snack i will
Anyone else find the exploits less interesting? I know that autocannons and vassal blobbing are part of the game right now but they're clearly unbalanced and not working as intended (the dev's even acknowledged the vassal willingness problem and are looking to fix it). Maybe it's just me but I feel it's a shame how many videos consist of abusing game mechanics. If it's because it's not possible to beat GA without it no reason not to drop the difficulty.
Shouldn't archeo tech just be better than standard tech ?
With how expensive it is I feel they should be more powerful
Played with a friend 2 days ago, and yeah, archeotech is a massive disappointment as far as "offense" components go. Buildings are awesome tho, and having an ancient raffinery on every single word is chef's kiss
yeah, the archeo stuff got nerfed way hard after they released it
they’re a bit crap after early game
Ooooh Archeotech.
Ah yes, the boomer empire.
First ?
I claim the title!
Such power...
First in my heart
montu you silly goose
It would appear so