Hey, is there an explainer about what the DB does anywhere? Does it direct me to footage on RUclips, or does it require a FlowGrappling login for a lot of the footage? Thanks! It's a great idea
It's so impressive that even without as much competition experience as the others, everyone seems to really listen to Nicky on the mats. No point really just interesting.
He has the most analytical mind, which is great for match review. He's also a great teacher who spent a lot of time with Gordon Ryan and John Danaher, who are themselves also great teachers (even if they all don't get along now). Rod Brothers are more meat than brains, and Craig has a "git gud" approach to teaching 😂
Folk style wrestling had a concept called Ride Time. Perhaps submission grappling could incorporate a system where the person underneath their opponents mount or inside their back control is penalized every set amount of seconds. This would simulate the pressure from strikes and encourage movement on the bottom.
I remember a Ryan Hall DVD where he says something like "Oh isn't it cool when two guys are rolling around all over the mat? No, you know what's really cool is Roger Gracie pinning a guy in mount and not letting him out until he submits him"
I favour this sort of ruleset as a spectator. First time that i have managed to watch an entire event without skipping every ten seconds, and im a fan of the sport. So for the casual eye i think its better to have this approach even if it leads to less controlled submissions. The no time limits sub only or ebi rule set suck, but i agree about giving more shidos to the athletes in bottom side control or bottom Mount, that would give them an incentive to escape and would lead to more submissions i think
it was good but its still boring to watch two guys (esp nicky rod does this) just charge each other then push out of bounds when their attack fails. some kind of EBI rules or something where people are in bad positions and have to escape would be more exciting with points. maybe walls/cage would help because even in ONEFC the bjj only parts arent as boring as some adcc/comp things with open mat where you can just ringout each other
@@johnsmith-fk7fwi think that has to do with the fact that there werent so many shidos in the standing position for the people going out of bounds. A more wrestling like approach would probably benefit this format, but overall i think the quintet team based format is the best form of grappling to watch
@@nabilben3959 team is definitely really good, and then if you add a cage so theres no dumb ref resets/pushouts (which imo make it harder for casual viewers, my gf had no idea wtf they were doing with the ref lol) and both people's attacks/defense are tested with some kind of compromised position you have to start from, i think itll show off bjj better. or maybe more combat JJ type events where you can slap people to make it more exciting to? lol but definitely team based is better i agree 100%
15:57 I’ve seen Jay hit that exact sequence in training footage before. Cool to see how guys at the highest level transfer what they do in the gym to the competition mats.
No, match time is too short and very few submissions. EBI matches are 2 minutes longer, that's a 25% increase over quintets 8 minute matches.. The EBI overtime is better. What we need is 15 minute matches.
You should get a shido if you are pinned in my opinion. If they don't explode to escape, creating submission opportunity you eventually win by pinning them almost like in judo. This ruleset is definitely inspired by judo team matches
I've just started a jiu jitsu competition with, in my opinion, the most Exciting Ruleset. At the second event BSFC 2, which was held last weekend, 15 out of 18 matches ended in submission.
8:38 THIS is the biggest different between pure submission grappling and MMA. Jiu-jitsu relies on space either forced upon your opponent or by capitalizing on their mistakes. There's no incentive to give space up depending on the format. Whereas in MMA, you have the threat of strikes.
me and jozef talked about this after quintet ,the stalling is definitely one of the reason quintet4's submissions is getting fewer . cause not getting sub is kind of a win, why risk escaping . Also , the meta now is different . before it was ebi rule set people only cares about submissions thats what they focus on,but now everyone is preparing for adcc , so people are more focusing on positional pin. and also even if you get shido u start in turtle , now a days people have really good turtle defense its hard to get someone's back .
Yeah exactly. You get the $12 rate until you cancel the subscription. Just our way of thanking the people that sign up early when the product has limited features and is a bit clunky
I subbed to the database, there is a lot of work to be done. I think it needs automatic timestamps, and a lot of tags are incorrectly applied. Hope it improves and i can revisit it in a year or so
This just emphasizes your reset point even more cause it shows it is really easy to get wrong… but like you said in the video, Nicky rod had a weave grip.. he didn’t have elbow inside.. so when you said “oh yea I had this even better grip” and then PJ weaved his leg in instead.. that is where they were. PJ was right.
Yeah exactly! PJ did a great job of being an advocate for himself. It seemed like nicky tried to get a way with not letting PJ get that lasso in and PJ made sure that he did
I think we will see a lot more quintet like rule sets. As someone who trains and watches BJJ most BJJ matches are boring apart from the technical geeking out. Craig was even saying Flo was very interested in how quintet did on views.
@@LIMIBJJ I don’t. I wish I did. Would be very interesting. I just recall him saying in a recent recap video about flo was intrigued by how well quintet did vs some of their other content.
when im coaching my guys at tournaments im a psycho about making sure my guy has whatever advantage he had when they get reset. "HE HAD AN UNDERHOOK REF!!!!!"
The real truth is, it's not so much the ruleset; Jiu Jitsu is simply nowhere near done macro evolving yet. In short, it's not so much the game right now as it is the players.
honestly, idk to much but I do feel like a lot of these mistakes come from an overemphasis of wrestling and stylish movements as opposed to actual jiujitsu. I feel like the top b team guys love the flashyness of wrestling but often times puts them in terrible positions
I'm trying to do jujitsu I'm there to submit people or get submitted I don't want to be in a wrestling match I think it's b******* how it's more catch wrestling than BJJ anymore!!
The modern synthesis is grappling. Wrestling (and to a lesser extent nagawaza) has been integrated because it is effective. Why would you want to practice an inferior approach?
Hey Jake I have a podcast called Chee-Tash and I wanted to reach out to you to see if I could interview you for it. Do you have an email I can contact you at? I saw you were on Instagram, unfortunately the only social media I am on is twitter. Chris
Outlier Database: outlierdb.com/
What I’d like to be able to do is watch a chapter of an instructional, search the database for the title and see it applied.
Hey, is there an explainer about what the DB does anywhere? Does it direct me to footage on RUclips, or does it require a FlowGrappling login for a lot of the footage? Thanks! It's a great idea
Would love a breakdown of Jozef Chen’s Adcc trials run. The guard passing and everything else was so clean I’d love to know your thoughts
100%
It was tripod passing from Gordons body lock DVD disc 4-5
Such a cool event. I plan to get to it, just a lot on the plate right now!
It's so impressive that even without as much competition experience as the others, everyone seems to really listen to Nicky on the mats. No point really just interesting.
Danaher has never competed. You'd be an idiot not to listen to him.
He has the most analytical mind, which is great for match review. He's also a great teacher who spent a lot of time with Gordon Ryan and John Danaher, who are themselves also great teachers (even if they all don't get along now).
Rod Brothers are more meat than brains, and Craig has a "git gud" approach to teaching 😂
True that
Folk style wrestling had a concept called Ride Time. Perhaps submission grappling could incorporate a system where the person underneath their opponents mount or inside their back control is penalized every set amount of seconds. This would simulate the pressure from strikes and encourage movement on the bottom.
that is how EBI OVertime rules work.
I remember a Ryan Hall DVD where he says something like "Oh isn't it cool when two guys are rolling around all over the mat? No, you know what's really cool is Roger Gracie pinning a guy in mount and not letting him out until he submits him"
Haha jiu jitsu cool is much different than the average persons version of cool
B Team vs New Wave in a nutshell.
The depth of analysis on this channel is insane.
Thank you!
6:57 he also talks about this in new wave - side control system. Somewhere in vol 2
That mention of going from KOB to NS and pinning an arm in the process; I was immediately able to apply it in sparring yesterday. Thanks!
Amazing! I am glad you found it so helpful! Thanks for leaving the comment!
Armbars aren’t real
Jiujitsu exists in a paradox where nothing works until it does and everything works until it doesn't.
TMFINR
I don't get the reference
Because they weren't controlling the wrist and hand
@@awallerfamily wrists aren’t real
Craigs cross lat grip also fits nicely w his octopus guard system. Maybe another thread to pull on from there..
Ah very cool thank you!
First time watching one of your videos and I've learnt a lot already. Great content mate
I favour this sort of ruleset as a spectator. First time that i have managed to watch an entire event without skipping every ten seconds, and im a fan of the sport. So for the casual eye i think its better to have this approach even if it leads to less controlled submissions. The no time limits sub only or ebi rule set suck, but i agree about giving more shidos to the athletes in bottom side control or bottom Mount, that would give them an incentive to escape and would lead to more submissions i think
it was good but its still boring to watch two guys (esp nicky rod does this) just charge each other then push out of bounds when their attack fails. some kind of EBI rules or something where people are in bad positions and have to escape would be more exciting with points. maybe walls/cage would help because even in ONEFC the bjj only parts arent as boring as some adcc/comp things with open mat where you can just ringout each other
🤡
@@johnsmith-fk7fwi think that has to do with the fact that there werent so many shidos in the standing position for the people going out of bounds. A more wrestling like approach would probably benefit this format, but overall i think the quintet team based format is the best form of grappling to watch
@@nabilben3959 team is definitely really good, and then if you add a cage so theres no dumb ref resets/pushouts (which imo make it harder for casual viewers, my gf had no idea wtf they were doing with the ref lol) and both people's attacks/defense are tested with some kind of compromised position you have to start from, i think itll show off bjj better. or maybe more combat JJ type events where you can slap people to make it more exciting to? lol
but definitely team based is better i agree 100%
Agreed!
15:57 I’ve seen Jay hit that exact sequence in training footage before. Cool to see how guys at the highest level transfer what they do in the gym to the competition mats.
Yep it is very cool that they post the training footage online for us to see!
11:15 dante leon vs ethan also had the same katagatame finish
Yep yep plan to talk about that in the K Guard video!
Also super excited for the next video!.
I prefer the control based stuff since I'm lazy. I got like 3 good scrambles a match
Haha me too my man!
Way better than EBI rules, let’s be honest.
No, match time is too short and very few submissions. EBI matches are 2 minutes longer, that's a 25% increase over quintets 8 minute matches.. The EBI overtime is better. What we need is 15 minute matches.
I like the team format though.
The team aspect is very cool
You should get a shido if you are pinned in my opinion. If they don't explode to escape, creating submission opportunity you eventually win by pinning them almost like in judo. This ruleset is definitely inspired by judo team matches
True that! Craig said this as well in his video!
Excellent advice on resets and overall another fire video
Much appreciated my man thank you!
I've just started a jiu jitsu competition with, in my opinion, the most Exciting Ruleset. At the second event BSFC 2, which was held last weekend, 15 out of 18 matches ended in submission.
Ah right on thank you!
standing people up from mount is crazy
Yeah wild haha
these videos are top notch mate keep it up
That arm drag set up is triangles ALL DAY it's good stuff
Ah very interesting!
Another great vid. Subbed to outlier.
Much appreciated thank you for the support! Talk to you in the discord!
Your RUclips example of the rear arm triangle w has Ruotolo making the figure four on the neck side, not the armpit. So there are two variations
excellent as always Thank you!
Much appreciated thank you!
First! Love ur content and the outlier database is amazing
Much appreciated thank you for the support! Have a ways to go but it is coming along!
This was dope. Thank you
8:38 THIS is the biggest different between pure submission grappling and MMA. Jiu-jitsu relies on space either forced upon your opponent or by capitalizing on their mistakes. There's no incentive to give space up depending on the format. Whereas in MMA, you have the threat of strikes.
It's also why I enjoy knuckling their carotid artery so much hahaha - the opponent has to respect it.
Spark the fire
amazing videos
Thank you!
I thought the no heelhook rule was gonna suck but this was a great contest
Yeah it was fun to watch!
What would have been Jay Rods end goal with the shin pin on North South? What would have been his next step?
Do you have a video that touches on the near and far side arm drag from half-guard?
I kinda talk about it a lot but maybe this video would be a good place to start ruclips.net/video/iG_RwWmakY4/видео.html
me and jozef talked about this after quintet ,the stalling is definitely one of the reason quintet4's submissions is getting fewer . cause not getting sub is kind of a win, why risk escaping .
Also , the meta now is different . before it was ebi rule set people only cares about submissions thats what they focus on,but now everyone is preparing for adcc , so people are more focusing on positional pin. and also even if you get shido u start in turtle , now a days people have really good turtle defense its hard to get someone's back .
Can you explain what grandfathered on the site is as I couldn't find details about it there. Is it a guaranteed lifetime monthly rate?
Yeah exactly. You get the $12 rate until you cancel the subscription. Just our way of thanking the people that sign up early when the product has limited features and is a bit clunky
What does a tight waste grip do
Great vid.
Thank you!
Amazong video as always, needs more eoghan though 😂
Hahahaha true that!
I subbed to the database, there is a lot of work to be done. I think it needs automatic timestamps, and a lot of tags are incorrectly applied. Hope it improves and i can revisit it in a year or so
That is the goal! Appreciate you giving it a shot. We are on the path, but have to start somewhere!
nice, thanks
Thank you for the comment and the support!
This just emphasizes your reset point even more cause it shows it is really easy to get wrong… but like you said in the video, Nicky rod had a weave grip.. he didn’t have elbow inside.. so when you said “oh yea I had this even better grip” and then PJ weaved his leg in instead.. that is where they were. PJ was right.
Yeah exactly! PJ did a great job of being an advocate for himself. It seemed like nicky tried to get a way with not letting PJ get that lasso in and PJ made sure that he did
I think we will see a lot more quintet like rule sets. As someone who trains and watches BJJ most BJJ matches are boring apart from the technical geeking out. Craig was even saying Flo was very interested in how quintet did on views.
Do you know how it ended up doing on views?
@@LIMIBJJ I don’t. I wish I did. Would be very interesting. I just recall him saying in a recent recap video about flo was intrigued by how well quintet did vs some of their other content.
Jay rod just has the dog in him
True that!
when im coaching my guys at tournaments im a psycho about making sure my guy has whatever advantage he had when they get reset.
"HE HAD AN UNDERHOOK REF!!!!!"
Man it happens so often. The reset is such a tough problem to solve!
If Gordon wasn't so damn big, Craig Jones would be best in the world.
Doubtful
My brother in Christ is there any form of grappling that you actually like watching
Hahahaha I like a lot of it as long as it is no gi haha
Legalize heel hooks, and move to 10-minute rounds.
I would rather have exciting matches than boring matches with every one ending in submission.
👊🏼
👊🏼
The real truth is, it's not so much the ruleset; Jiu Jitsu is simply nowhere near done macro evolving yet. In short, it's not so much the game right now as it is the players.
True that
honestly, idk to much but I do feel like a lot of these mistakes come from an overemphasis of wrestling and stylish movements as opposed to actual jiujitsu. I feel like the top b team guys love the flashyness of wrestling but often times puts them in terrible positions
Style points!
Wrestling is literally working to gain better position, you make no sense
*fewer
I like it I will change it
I'm trying to do jujitsu I'm there to submit people or get submitted I don't want to be in a wrestling match I think it's b******* how it's more catch wrestling than BJJ anymore!!
In myyyy day!
The modern synthesis is grappling. Wrestling (and to a lesser extent nagawaza) has been integrated because it is effective. Why would you want to practice an inferior approach?
Unfortunately submission only formats are often prone to stalling which makes them boring especially for casual audiences
Jujitsu finally learns about team events being fun but still can't make a good ruleset
Haha it was a great event
Hey Jake
I have a podcast called Chee-Tash and I wanted to reach out to you to see if I could interview you for it.
Do you have an email I can contact you at? I saw you were on Instagram, unfortunately the only social media I am on is twitter.
Chris
Always good videos, keep up your great work. 🫵
Thank you! 👊🏼