Dragoon vs. LeMat: Which Revolver Is Better?
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- In this video, I’ll give a tabletop comparison between the LeMat revolver and the Colt Dragoon revolver. Be sure to subscribe to my channel for more videos. Thanks for watching!
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The LeMat is fragile in some regards, but also seems to keep running when it breaks. This is a good comparison video.
Yeah, I agree. If something does break on a Colt, it’s usually enough to keep it from working.
The Lemat is just cool looking and I'd like one except for the insane price, especially with all the issues it has.
@PickledCactus same
I would say the grip angle on the LeMat hearkens back to the old single-shot percussion/flintlock dragoon pistols that were used prior to the 1847 Walker. Both the 1848 Dragoon and the LeMat are horse pistols, after all.
That was my thought too as the grip is more conducive to firing down from a horse than level at someone.
Looks like a sawn off rifle grip with that angle
Also very French styling to the LeMat-- which fits, as Dr. Jean LeMat was from New Orleans....
Also very French styling to the LeMat-- which fits, as Dr. Jean LeMat was from New Orleans....
The dissasembly pin on lemat can be rotated to hold it better, had same problem and it fixed it
Have a peek at the cavalry model if you buy one. That pin is a lever similar to a break action shotgun. I suspect itd stay latched a lot better. The trigger hook might aid in maintaining your grip in cocking too.
As much as like the lemat looks and idea I'm always going to choose a colt
Me too.
I love the idea of the LeMat... I can't help but think it's the great grandfather of the Taurus Judge. Something about having a shotgun and pistol all in one is... Epic.
Really like the “skull cracker” feature on the butt of the LeMat!
It's just a lanyard loop
I love the LeMat - it's an awesome concept and could have been a game changer as far as pistols went...BUT...as noted, it has too many challenges so if my life was on the line I would go with the Dragoon or my own 1851 Navy.
Waow, the Le'Mat is cooler than i thought.
The uberti colts have such a smooth action. I prefer it to the uberti remingtons or any other cap and ball. I love the smooth cocking effort with the colts as well as the sturdy loading levers with the 1851 navy and 1860 army models and the easy rotating of the cylinder with lighter loads from the 1851 navy and the 1860 army with the ridges on the arbor. If I use a 15 grain load of 3f black powder and a thick lubed wad with an uberti 1851 navy .36 and a 25 grain load of 3f black powder and a thick lubed wad with an uberti 1860 army .44 I can do 30 shots in a session without needing to clean the piece and the action remains smooth
LeMat is just so clumsy in every aspect, I love it
If i had to make a choice as to which one i would cary into battle, i would pick the LeMatt every single time. More shots, plus a shot gun barrel.
I'd go full Outlaw Josey Wales -- 2 LeMats crossdraw, 2 1860 or 1851 in shoulder holsters.... Reloading? I'll do that back in camp!
LeMat gets style points, but the colt wins in just about every other category. Whether I'm out on the frontier in the late 1860s or just looking for a fun range implement, the Colt offers a lot in terms of usability and durability.
Nah the LeMat is a much greater gun you give it to a blacksmith in the 1860's and it's even better with no more too thin metal that can break and it's more accurate too
If I had to choose lemat all the way just because of the 20 Guage underbarrel 2 guns in 1
Plus the LeMat has more shots.
Very well done and an important resource for all the young shooters getting into cap and ball revolvers!
Thanks!
To keep the loading lever from falling under recoil, the quick fix back in the day was a leather strap tied around the barrel and loading leaver. I’m sure you already was aware of this. Just throwing my 2cents in
He's mentioned it in previous videos for the LeMat and the Walker, both of which do that far more than the Dragoon.
@@seanfoltz7645 yea I figured he knew I’ve not seen any other videos of this guy just stumbled on this one. I myself am relatively new to cap and ball shooting as it seems like a cheap alternative to shooting during these times. I bought a traditions revolver at a yard sale last week for 50 bucks lol not bad price for a new hobby.
@@Bill308A10 Sadly, not too much cheaper as I recently paid $20 for 100 balls and $11 for 100 caps - still had powder so not sure on that but figure you're probably looking at $40 for 100 shots, which works out to $20 for 50 versus 9mm which is averaging around $30 for 50, so two thirds the cost.
While you got an awesome price for the revolver you're still going to need to spend upwards of $50 or so to get the various powder measuring and nipple accessories and don't be cheap with the cap holding/applying device as having it suddenly spray caps all over the place sucks.
Of course the big advantage of cap and ball is that it's a slow, casual style of shooting so unlike the 9mm, where you can easily burn through a few hundred rounds in an afternoon, you'll only go through a fraction of cap and ball in that same time.
The big trick is finding an outdoor range which allows it if you don't have somewhere you can legally fire the weapon.
@@seanfoltz7645 funny you mentioned caps spraying all over the place it happened to me with a cheap stamped metal capper I was using. Needless to say I was fumbling through the grass with practically a magnifying glass trying to find them lol. I do have the luxury of shooting in my back yard as I’m out in the country and have enjoyed playing with different loads and the long reload times makes one appreciate the satisfaction of shooting. I can definitely see that pricing for rounds ,equipment and utensils has reached outrageous levels. To combat this I purchased a bullet mold from lee precision as I’m already casting my own buckshot for 12ga. Anywho it’s still a blast this new hobby and I’m excited to teach my little boys all about shooting, that’s the main satisfaction of the whole thing which justifies the investment lol maybe not according to my wife 😂.
@@Bill308A10 LOL, I've been there too Bill, hence the warning.
I'm jealous but also happy for you that you can shoot out back - airguns only for my back yard I'm afraid.
I've been thinking about the bullet mold as well but right now my focus is learning how to make the paper cartridges for the cap and ball - just got in the kit this guys sells and am hoping to sit down and fiddle with it this weekend.
Yeah, teaching the next generation is the most important part - your boys are beyond lucky to have their first memories of learning how to shoot be with a cap and ball pistol.
Very good comparison. Thank you for sharing!
Dragoon, LeMat & Starr seem like the Old West equivalent of fallout legendary weapons sometimes.
Picked up a signature series 3rd model colt dragoon today i love it you can feel the quality difference vs the reproductions
Dustin: Watch all your videos. You inspired me to pick up the Colt 1851 Navy I have now. (Pietta version) And making things better, I moved OUT of Seattle to a place a little more gun friendly. My only hint to owners is to lube that latch where the loading lever locks on the barrel. Prevents wear, and will make that lock down for the lever work every time without dropping on you. Obtaining caps a problem lately, but I stocked up with 500 when supplies were good. Had to drive half that amount in miles each way to get them. (*laughs*)
One thing I REALLY lIke about the LeMat is the checkered grips!
I always liked the LeMat, its interesting to say the least.
I want a lemat but with a colt style grip. Also cartridge converted.
I've been carrying the lemat now for two years and it's the best gun .........
Of the 2 Id take the Dragoon every time. The loading lever might drop under recoil but at least it won't fall of like the one on the Lemat many of the originals are missing the lever because it fell off. The cap jamming issues on a colt can also be easily fixed. The only thing the Lemat has going for it imo is the shotgun barrel. With all that said personally Id prefer a 1860 army or navy if I were in the carrying in the days of cap and ball revolvers.
Had a LeMat previously, but sold it off. Sometimes you regret stuff that you do. It sure was unique, even used it in main match CAS. Timing was done with a calendar..!!!
Great video as always. Thank you for sharing the information. I have the 1851 colt and the 1858 Remington( replicas) love them both. Thinking of getting cartridge converter for the Remington.
The hammer for the shotgun barrel being inaccessible is a very deliberate choice, you do not want to fire the shotgun on accident when you're trying to lob rounds downrange. Either you engage the shotgun hammer before beginning to fire or you need to think of it as a "Use the bullets to find cover, use the shotgun when the opponent has found your cover" sort of thing, a last resort when the chips are down considering its poor range.
Alternatively it may have been meant as an execution tool to give the guy or the animal you just shot a humane way out of prolonged suffering- Or just to do the deed when you find Wild Bill at the poker table and you stand behind him.
Although rather unexpected in it's time, might I suggest that the shotgun barrel becomes a flare launcher, to call in air support? I thought not.
I know how much you enjoy these old guns,.. just curious. What is your daily carry weapon, revolver or semi-auto.
Semi-auto.
To very cool guns. The lemat is so Victorian. And the dragoon cartoonishly large.
Realising the power of movies & tv shows, who learned us the lie that the old west was a one gun place! When it just was what the prop department had available!
The value of the LaMat. Was the. Extra couple of shots.that made it good for Calvary use.
But the LeMat is the AR of the black powder era- 9 rounds of .44 and a shot round... Nothing else came close.
Great review enjoyed the video
This isn't really a fair comparison in my opinion. The Dragoon is basically an updated version of the Walker Colt. The Walker had some of the same issues you bring up with the Lemat. The loading lever would bounce loosed during firing. So the Dragoon was built with the latch to hold it. There are several more but I don't want to write a novel
The LeMat was designed in 1856, which means not only did it have the Dragoon to learn from, it had the lessons learned for 1851 Colt Navy available to them as well.
I don’t think I would ever pay that much for A gun unless it was a colt SAA but it is a unique gun for sure
The Lemat is the best choice, more shots. Also has a shotgun barrel, the colt does not. Kevin Phoenix
I would not mind getting a 3rd model dragoon they had all the improvements of the horse pistols
Awesome info Brother! I feel that the Lemat is just over designed, nice but just to much going on. Thumbs-up video ~John
Since the dragoon won this, maybe next should be dragoon vs 60 army, and winner of that against something to find the best one of the lot
The Dragoon is a superior weapon by far having owned both. The ramming on the Lemat is near worthless you can't load a paper cartridge. The shotgun nipple is a smaller size than the cylinder nipples. The Lemat and the Starr DA are the two worse percussion revolvers I ever owned the most expensive, I sold them both.
Lemat is the gun I use in rdr2
Wow, if only the LeMat was better designed but we don't always get what we want.
A very good and informative video. Isn't it interesting how several Confederate generals and calvary units chose the LaMat as their primary sidearm. Also "Blackie Thomas" has a video series on black powder revolvers in which he demonstrates how he modified his rear sights to bring his Colts to point if aim. Check it out. Keep these excellent videos coming..!
the LeMat looks like a Calvary pistol lmao
The lemat is the tacticool of the 1850s
Already knew the answer when I saw the title lol I want a Dragoon so bad.
It’s a very fun revolver!
If you’re Guns of the West who’s Guns of the East?
Probably Mike
That would be AK Operator's Union 47/74.... 😂
The desert eagles of the cap and ball world
I’m sure there are those who really like the LeMat revolver. I just don’t care for it enough to have it in my collection. I’m a Colt or Remington person.
I find them interesting (the lemat),but it seems too impractical. I'd like to have one in the same way car collectors want an old corvair. Lol.
The barrel detent problem could turn the LeMat into a hand grenade if fired with sufficient misalignment.
The soft lead ammo would give sufficiently to prevent that but it would likely result in the need for full strip, clean and inspection to ensure nothing delicate was damaged as well as to remove scraps of lead from it.
So while it wouldn't be fun happening, it wouldn't be THAT dangerous.
I guess the upside of the lemat is when everything breaks you still have a gun.
Do modern LeMat's fix some of the issues with the loading lever and such?
Unfortunately, they have the same issues.
@@GunsOfTheWest thank you for the quick reply! Just found your channel and I am really enjoying it. I love the western era, along with Victorian and Edwardian. Such fascinating times.
Modern replicas offer only two technical improvements over the originals: steel quality and standardized screw thread sizes. The thing about being exacting replicas is they inherit design issues when it comes to dimensions and fit. That's why there's a market for gunsmiths modifying/correcting the issues with new parts or refits.
Could you make the pin hole a threaded hole for a screw
The LeMat seems like a contraption of a firearm. Too much possible mechanical problems for me. I definitely don't like the handle design.
So the just needed to double down like two load lever that could lock together at the end of the pistol also lock out so u could load two at a time an load the last that either to the left or right and so the loading good then I guess same goes for the primer striker
Quite obviously the design of the Colt is more intuitive, but the LeMat is designed as a strictly Cavalry weapon! Though I would want to shoot the Colt, I would want the LeMat sheerly as a historical Confederate display weapon!
I believe that all the pistols from the Patterson to the cartridge era were one cylinder and then saber or use it as a club time. 10 shots with a LeMat, 6 with a Colt. I'd go toss up cause they're both not gonna get reloaded til after action. Slight edge to Colt cause a bit sturdier.
On my 1847 I bent the capture spring for the loading lever slightly forward (toward the muzzle) it no longer drops when shooting.
Le Mat is cool!!!!
Dragoon theses nuts
Dragoon - practically
Lemat - cool factor
Dragoon for me. Of course I'd love to have a Lemat, but it would definitely just be more of a novelty than a carry gun. I actually like the height of the front sight on the Colts because I learned 35 yrs ago how to adjust aim for close shots (you just have to gain a feel for it with practice) and I know that at 75 to 100 yds I'm dead on and can drop (some fictitious villain) without doing that at all, whereas with a taller sight, I would have to aim higher, which I'm not good at with a pistol because the barrel itself blocks the target. As for everyone that complains about dropping loading levers and always ties them up or some similar horrific method, just slap it back up on your leg or hand like I've been doing for years and was done by those that came before us. Like you said, it's not 'that hard'....lol I don't know of anyone that would want to get off shots faster anyway, because one needs to turn it to the side and cock anyway to let any caps fall out. All this was how we always did it in reenactments on horse or on foot in the cav. It all becomes natural movement. All that said, I do wish that Uberti or Pietta would start expanding into other revolvers, other than has been the normal since the late 50's. Some Tranters would be to my liking, very much so, and I'd pay the price.
I think you nailed the review! The LeMat has cool/weird factor but you must be dedicated to the sport to dive into one.
The LeMat is an acquired taste. While the Colt Navy is great for learning the basics of operating/maintaining a blackpowder percussion revolver and the Remington is the meat-and-potatoes of shooting performance, you have to already be comfortable with the foibles of blackpowder revolvers before you can deal with the idiosyncrasies of a LeMat-- a beginner risks being put off on revolvers in general if they start with this gun.
@@BogeyTheBear I know, I have 4 revolvers that I use regularly, all are Colts.
Is the bullet still supported or is it just not affordable anymore?
6:52 The dragoon looking alittle different
You are comparing two reproductions. A lot of your criticisms may be attributable to quality control issues in manufacturing, rather than to design flaws. I would like to know if the originals had the same issues. It is quite possible that the originals were better made.
Hey Dustin you have one of those Ultrasonic Cleaners don't you? do you find yourself cleaning by hand more often or using the Machine? they're a considerable investment but one Id wager is worth making. what do you think?
How much of a difference is there between Dragoon & Walker?
Biggest difference is the barrel. They have the same sized frame but the Walker barrel is longer with a different latching system for its ramrod.
Dragoon
Since the lemat is a French design I believe, it's pronounced oui oui lemat. ( Lol ). Great video! Ruger Rich
Simple answer: The Walker
At what range do you think the Lemat shotgun would be effective to?
I saw a guy firing one-- he hit out to 15 yards with the shot barrel. He used raffia for wadding, too.
Dragoon, at a guess.
With modern choices on 6 shooters, I'm still surprised there is no modern version of a Lemat. Like shooting 22 and or 22mag and shooting 410 and 45LC.
.....
Holy shit your right
WHY IS THAT NOT A THING
I designed a modern LeMat back about 1990. The secret? Hinged frame like a Webley!
Problem is, BATFE won't approve a metallic cartridge handgun over .50"... Eliminates any useful shot barrel. Besides, I didn't have the million$ of dollars for machinery, tooling, buildings, employees.... 😏
Definitely Dragoon!!!
Just curious. You in Utah?
I am.
@@GunsOfTheWest my sister taught school in Provo back in the 60s out there and I thought that looked like familiar country
🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸👍
im not a fan of the shape of lemat grip.
Another point: Sam Colt wasn't a Confederate sympathizer. In fact, he didn't have an ounce of sympathy for anything anywhere in his body.
He had sympathy for his wallet, straining to hold all that cash! 😂
Considering the LeMat is a failed piece of crap, I'll go with a Dragoon any day.
Basically the reason why the south lost the civil war lmao :)))