That last scene of Angel hugging Faith while a tortured Wesley drop the knife and it fades to Black and all you hear is the rain with no music. BEAUTIFUL AND TRAGIC😢
That ending never fails to get me no matter how many times I’ve seen it. Faith is just so broken and fragile despite her hard exterior. Begging Angel to kill her and then just collapsing into his arms in the rain while wesley drops the knife is so heartbreaking.
It's such a little thing, but I love that Phantom Dennis was trying to protect Cordy (and Wesley) by not letting her into her own apartment, because Faith was already inside waiting for her. That's a good ghost. 😉😊
This episode is a personal fave, any episode with Eliza as Faith is usually gone be a top tier episode 🤷🏻♂️ the ending of this episode just confirms why she’s one of the best written and complex characters in the franchise. 10/10 performances 👏
@@volourn9764 if your only take away was “faiths shallow and was always evil” then you legit just missed the ENTIRE point of the show and her character arc, like this is why media literacy is REALLY important cuz not only does the show itself DIRECTLY contradict ur opinion here and PROVE faith wasn’t “evil” but also common sense and logic means frankly that’s just NOT how people work and operate. She wasn’t born evil, she was a truamatized and alone TEENAGE girl who let’s not forget is YOUNGER than Buffy and was ostracized and made to feel like an outsider by Buffy at almost EVERY opportunity simply cuz Buffy couldn’t handle her feelings of jealousy. Has they been nicer to and handled faith differently she wouldn’t have been so easily swayed by the FIRST person who was kind to her like full stop🤷🏻♂️ you wanna ignore all the GOATED and nuanced writing for faiths arc just to reduce her to being “evil” than go right ahead but the facts disagree so the rest of ur aren’t playing that game of revisionist history😤👏👏 if you don’t like her as a character whatever, you don’t gotta make stuff up and reduce her characters arc and writing tho 🤷🏻♂️
@AustinSamson1999 Blaming everyone but Faith while pretending that Buffy never suffered trauma yet Buffy never turned evil. Faith was evil, selfish, cruel, abusive, and scum from the moment she was introduced. And, why rewrite history? Buffy tried to be friends with Faith. Faith used it to try to corrupt Buffy, frame her for murder, and literally chose to work with the Mayor. Lol Buffy, FYI, was also young when she was called. Faith is what? A year younger? Lol Faith is a top 20 character in the franchise. Definitely not one of the best.
@@volourn9764 if ur stupid maybe that’s how you can interpret it🤷🏻♂️ Buffy throwing a tantrum at EVERY thing Faith did, including eating her FRIES in the first episode she appeared in is a thing that exists and eveybody cna go rewatch. Facts don’t care about ur feelings, there’s MORE than enough evidence that shows the nuance in what happened. Faith 100% has responsibilitie for what she did but trying to PRETEND Buffy’s repeated behavior had nothing to do with it is stupid and ignores all context🤷🏻♂️ I never blamed others without blaming Faith smart guy, im sayang reducing her entire arc to being “evil” when they made it VERY CLEAR she was an ALONE, and SEXUALLY ABUSED girl who was YOUNGER than Buffy with ZERO support systems in a family OR. A watcher. Clearly she’s going to have a DIFFERENT response to things than Buffy did, who even WITH all her privleages STILL did stupid shit like voluntarily let angle live after defeating him in the mall episode KNOWING he’d kill more people or taking off to live in the city for months or trying to rush the potential into a suicide mission in season 7 so don’t act like she’s perfect buddy. Faith was a traumatized teenage girl who needed help and love, and bottom line is she buffy handled thing different things would have ended up differently cuz Faith wouldn’t have neeeed to seek outside validation. Again, FACTS OVER FEELINGS the writing ITSELF makes this clear stay triggered about it she’s better written than more than half of ur “top 20” list I can guarantee 🤣 muted enjoy crying into the void loser. Facts over feelings and NOTBING you’ve said is supported by facts so 🤷🏻♂️☺️🫡
@AustinSamson1999 You have a lot of feels, and so few feels. And, why bring up seasons that she hasn't watched yet? Spoiling, even hinting, is rude. These watches are obtaining *because* they are blind views.
Remember episode 7 of Buffy season 1 ("Angel")? Angel tried "suicide by cop" by letting himself get killed by Buffy. Faith basically tried the same thing here. So it makes sense he didn't fall for her act. Takes one to know one I guess...
I'm surprised none of the other comments mention this yet, so I'll say it: the rain at the end was real. They wanted to use sfx to make rain for that scene but couldn't afford it, and then it conveniently was actually raining while they were shooting. If you want more Eliza Dushku, I suggest you watch _Dollhouse_ at some point. It stars Eliza and was created by Joss (he is not a great person, but between _Buffy_ and _Angel_ and _Firefly,_ he definitely made some fantastic tv, and _Dollhouse_ holds up to those imo).
Indeed. She gets to show her range, and it deserves way more appreciation (the ensemble cast is amazing too) I can never quite square the Whedon hate though. I became disillusioned with him *years* ago, when he started down that "woke scold" path himself. The fact he's a domineering "creative" and happy to exploit his social capital for personal gain doesn't make him a monster. It just means he was never the hero. He's just a very ordinary person. He treats his friends well and can be incredibly petty when people threaten his ego. He REALLY just needed people to deflate that ego a bit. Sadly, that doesn't seem to happen in his particular industry. If you're the goose laying the golden eggs, you are shielded from consequences. You stop laying those eggs, and under the nearest bus is your next destination. I have friends just like what I hear of him... They aint perfect, but they don't exactly deserve a hate mob bc they can be arseholes sometimes. Just seems a LOT of the stories boil down to "we didn't get on" I can TOTALLY empathise with anyone he hurt being angry with him, even hating him. But plenty of the hatemob I see target him are no different from him. Just my 2c on that controversy :P
@@DmGray From what I've heard of the Whedon controversy, he cheated on his wife, then tried to gaslight her into believing he wasn't when she confronted him with evidence about it. So it's more than just "he was kind of a dick". As someone who's been cheated on and gaslit about it myself, that kind of behavior is unacceptable by anyone. That said, I do try to separate the art from the artist. Whedon's a shitbag, but his work is amazing. It becomes a bit hard when deciding how to handle that economically: you can't financially support the art without supporting the artist. So my solution to that... is torrenting 😁
@@IceMetalPunk I guess I just don't have the same visceral reaction to rumours, accusations or even the reality of cheating. It's not good, because breaking promises is not good. But I've never really understood jealousy. If cheating and lying discounted a person from society, an AWFUL lot of people would fail that test. (pretty much every guy I know who has been "successful" with women is a serial cheat. Almost enough to make me believe the whole "women like to be treated like shit" hypothesis. & I know it's not a gendered issue, bc women cheat just as often as men. Maybe more :P Think many people just don't like to be lonely & are a mess of neuroses) I fall back to the "he's just a very ordinary person, not a saint" Put yourself in that position. You're an insecure guy (as he obviously is) You have young, beautiful women start to pay attention to you, heap you with praise and lavish you with affection. Are you VERY sure you would keep your virtue? I'll never know for sure, bc it sure as shit won't happen. But that temptation can't be dismissed. (it's also that part of "me too" that never gets mentioned. It takes two to tango, and if the bad behaviour weren't rewarded by "enough" people, it wouldn't happen. It's just that an AWFUL lot of *unwilling* people were harmed by the culture that builds) I also don't think denying wrongdoing is the same as gaslighting. Gaslighting is a great deal more nefarious and the bar on my believing that accusation is always gonna be higher than a he said/she said where both parties have a vested interest and extreme emotion. Again, he's just a very ordinary kind of jerk, it's the LEVEL of vitriol targeting him I find disturbing. I was quietly detesting the man for his public positions almost a decade :P
That desperate 'I'm Bad, I'm Evil' breaks me every time, all that time buried deep, hating herself and pretending not to care, trying to earn herself a 'way out' because she's so hurt and alone, amazing performance.
A brilliant episode from S1 really a two part episode with the next one Sanctuary. Here we see Faith again who has completely lost control, after escaping Sunnydale from Buffy. She comes to L.A. to wreak more havoc. A brilliant comedy moment when Angel is talking to the 'Suit' in Wolfram & Hart with business speak, and he doesn't know who he is, a parody of Michael J Fox in Secret Of My Success. A fantastic ending in the alleyway in the rain ( this show loves alleyways in the rain) with Faith begging Angel for help after her serious nervous breakdown. Angel knows what she has gone through and offers help. A great final shot of Wesley in the distance as well dropping the knife. One of the most iconic endings to any episode in The Buffyverse.
no matter how good a person you are, after been tortured for hours most people would have said what he said and he would have ended her life too if he had gotten the chance
Faith is a character that comes more alive in the rewatches. There are so many subtle elements put in that on the first time through, it's pretty much impossible to see all that's going on. The roots for this episode come from the episode with her in Buffy's body. She was finally able to see how her life could have been. When she took Buffy's body, it freed her from the baggage of her past. That is, until she slept with Riley. If you watch that scene again really closely, you will notice the camera view chops around. That's an old film technique to depict a break in the mind of the character. I can't say for certain what it was, but it changed Faith. Likely it was forcing her to remember something traumatic in her past. The whole experience have her an honest look at what she had become. That last scene with Buffy, she wasn't even fighting Buffy, she was trying to kill her old self. This episode picked up from that. It's not obvious, but this entire episode was Faith trying to kill herself. She committed crimes all over, leaving an obvious trail of destruction that would be easy for the cops to follow. Then she injured a cop. Basically, she was setting things up so the cops would come after her with a vengeance and she would force them to kill her. Suicide by cop is the term commonly used. Then the lawyers told her Angel was in town. She accepted the job to kill him so quickly, not because she had any intention of killing him ,but because he was the best solution to her problem. If the cops came for her, she would likely kill a bunch before they could kill her, which she didn't really want to do. Angel would be able to kill her much more easily with less innocent bystanders being hurt. She tested him with the gun to test how much he still hated her. Knowing he didn't hate her, she went out to motivate him, give him the blood lust he would need to kill her. So she hurt Cordy and tortured Wes. It seems like she's out of control then whole show, but she's actually everything she did was towards that single goal. Force someone to kill her to give her the punishment she feels she deserves. It's such a crazy episode.
FAAAAAAAITH! I've just stumbled upon your reactions with this one, my fave episode of Angel, and I'm so glad to see how sympathetic you are to Faith. I've come across some reactors who don't like her at all, but she's always been a heartbreaking character to me, and I feel so bad for her. The final scene in this episode destroys me every time. Eliza absolutely slayed (no pun intended). In an interview, she said that ending felt "cathartic" for her. She was going through a lot of struggles in her personal life at the time and related a lot to Faith. Glad that she's in a much happier place now.
Really enjoyed hearing your thoughts at the end of this episode - Faith is one of the most interesting characters I've encountered in any TV show, and this is one of those episodes where it really feels like they're doing something HUGE with the story.
Wesley in Angel Season 1 is a completely different person from Wesley in Buffy Season 3 , Wesley from Buffy Season 3 if he got taken by Faith he would be crying and begging for his life but Wesley here is like nah I'm not giving you shit cut me up if you want to but I'm not giving you the satisfaction at all , Wesley has truly grown a pair 🔥💯
I'm glad you noticed the acting from Faith and how she was looking for just someone, anyone, to believe in her and care for her and forgive her. She played it so well when Wesley insulted her and she went from torturing him to thinking someone might be able to accept what she's done to immediately going back to bad when he insults her and ramping things up. It's such a great little insight into her character and the mindset of that character at the time and not a lot of reactors notice how Eliza plays that scene.
Good Reaction :^) ... You're right about the tear drop tattoo. (A few years ago I had jury duty where one of the defendants/accused had three tear drops and was a gang member. I would've had to request a sidebar and tell the judge that I can't be impartial to this murdering scumbag. Luckily I wasn't selected for that trial).
Best onscreen ending of all time of anything. And it's so well build, that it tooks until this last scene, that the connection between the flashbacks and the present actions - suicide by the police - are revealed. By the way: The rain was real. They want rain, couldn't afford the rain machine and while shooting the rain started - in California! Seems like God and/or St. Peter is a fan of Faith.😊 It's Elizas favorte episode. Everyone failed on Faith, she is like the one, who falls through all saftey nets. This is why she is still likeable. If you want more Eliza, you should react to "Tru Calling" and "Dollhouse", both shows with her in lead and 26 episodes each. You won't regret it.
Indeed - and earlier in the episode, she took the chance that Angel would shoot her, if he'd pulled the trigger twice, double tap could have ended her misery.
A lot of people read Faith's character as a strong young girl because she's the slayer and also because she's very independent at such a young age...but what I've always seen was a scared traumatized little girl, pretending to be cool/with a hard exterior but in reality is just screaming for help. She's scared, alone and desperate for atention.
People also forget that she’s a _child._ Buffy is 18. Faith can’t be more than 17. She had a very abusive childhood and deeply traumatic adolescence. And then became a slayer, had her watcher murdered in front of her, and was on the run since then.
I think it’s interesting that Faith often starts fights with vampires without having a stake (it’s a running gag for her to borrow one from Buffy). But this time, she deliberately doesn’t have one - and that’s part of what tells Angel what she really wants.
The end of this episode breaks me every time I see it. She choose to attack Cordy and torture Wesley because she wanted Angle to kill her. She felt she deserved it and wanted to give him a reason to do it. The characters are are so well written and acted. I wanted so much for Faith to get help and accept that help, and start to forgive herself. Powerful episode.
Yes! I was waiting for this episode, the character depth shown is amazing. Both Faith & Angel had more emotional range shown here than in Buffy, to me at least. We saw Faith struggling on Buffy, especially in the body swap episode, but the way this was written was amazing. I love that they returned to this, this idea that Angel could get through to Faith was something I loved in Buffy. I mean the idea of internal darkness, and a soul struggling against it, is something Angel would know about. I also really believe the flashback episode in Angel where you saw Angel being turned & killing his Dad is something I feels plays into this. I pointed it out in the episode but Angelus played a bit with Angel's Dad, tormented him a bit, but he killed Angel's sister immediately which leads me to believe that Angel loved his sister deeply enough that it stll resonated a bit with Angelus and he killed her immediately in the hallway of the house rather than taunting & plaything with her. Just a theory, but I think that bond he had with his sister lends something to this probable connection with Faith. Lastly, I disagree with your statement that Faith could kill Angel because she's a slayer, all slayers are eventually killed by a vampire, usually surviving ten to twelve years. Buffy is one of the best trained Slayers & we saw Angelus & Buffy fight no holds barred, Angelus not only held his own but put her on the ground for a bit in that fight, even Spike thought Angelus would win, before Buffy rallied of course, but don't underestimate Angel's fighting abilities. Angel is old enough a vampire to be stronger than you would expect & he's a trained fighter at monastaries etc.
Yep this right here is the reason if James Marsters was not on Buffy I would watch Only this show I love how Dark Angel show The Wesley Torcher scene yeeks and Flashbacks of Angelus and Darla where kills The One that will ultimately get him in Souled, and The Ending of him useing he's experience with knowing what Evil is so him at the End Holding Faith is just Powerful 💯
"I know what you want.. but I'm not going to make it easy for you"... Faith wanted him to go vamp face to make her feel like she was just ridding the world of another monster
Eliza was indeed offered a regular role on the series (that was Joss's original plan), but she chose to go to college instead. (She's just turned 19 when this is being filmed.) Does her appearance here mean things have changed? Keep watching and see. (Obviously, Dakara already HAS. But I don't spoil future developments when commenting, so…)
When she's torturing Wesley, at that point she wants Angel to come for her. As angry and disappointed as she is in Wesley, I don't think she intended to kill him, she was just biding time until Angel got there and did enough to get Angel to kill her. Plus, she's pretty angry at Wesley. One of the reasons she probably didn't take Cordy is because she doesn't have any [real] history with Cordy.
Yeah that's nice and all but if the person who's torturing me is expecting me to sympathize with them.... OH FUCK NO, BURN IN HELL So I understand Wesley's reaction while getting tortured and him grabbing the knife, he was not going to hesitate to stab her with it but he then saw Angel hugging her thus the dropping of the knife
Such a fantastic episode and crossover. Faith is wonderful. Giles and the others really shouldve tried harder with her, instead of letting her fester in a dingy motel. No wonder she was drawn to the Mayors fatherly influence, hes the only one to ever give her anything
Yeah, he would. He's the superior fighter. Slayers are not unbeatable. Fruggin' Spike murdered two in 1vs1 fights, and Angel is way better than Spike. Even Buffy has been bested including literally been killed by the Master.
@@volourn9764 and yet none of this proves Angels the superior fighter to faith full stop🤷🏻♂️ Faiths always been shown to be equal to Buffy EVERY time they fought including BEATING her in a 1v1 in the sequel comics fare and square. Meanwhile Buffy’s beaten Angel and shown to scale above him MULTIPLE times in seaosn 2 alone. This isn’t a debate, in a full on fight Faith scales above him and would by his OWN admission. Faith being mentally unstable and holding back hoping he’d kill her is the only reason she didn’t kill him outright here, cope harder 🤷🏻♂️
@@volourn9764 facts over feelings 🤷🏻♂️ Faith beat buffy, Angel couldn’t. End of discussion. Faith was WINNING agaisnt Angel in this episode and was STILL holding back hoping he’d kill her, fact not an opinion. The comics are cannon and set after EVERYTHING feat wise in the show meaning their all at their PEAKS. Even if I don’t yes comics Faith still DOGWALKED Angel and Buffy multiple times so stay mad ☺️
I mean, Slayers are _by design_ stronger than vampires for the literal singular purpose of slaying them. Angel himself states that Buffy is stronger than him. And Faith is just as strong as Buffy.
Great reaction to a great episode that continued the broken tale of the Dark/Rogue Slayer arc that is Faith and a possible reckoning of sorts for the charcter.... Like you said, the writing was great with the similarities of the path that Angelus/Angel has walked and whether or not it is one that Faith will go, but like you said at least there's hope there more than ever before... And that final showdown of Angel/Faith as he knew that she felt the guilt and self loathing deep down for all that she's done and wanted to pay for her sins by having Angel kill her..... just a great ep overall and a well conceived story arc.... can't wait to see where the tale goes from here..... as always, great stuff D that nets you another CTU today.... Keep em coming!
Faith is very complicated, and damaged. I gave a brief theory on one of your BTVS reactions and I do stand by it. I love the sub-plot that the writers have made here.
Love this episode but gotta admit I disagree with you on the "Piece of sh" moment. How many times did people say good things to her, like I know you're good inside and she doesn't care at all. Even in this episode Wesley said to her "I also believe in my heart that you're not a bad person" just before she hits Cordy. I'm convinced it wouldn't have changed one bit if he had said something nice. She would have probably been angry shouting liar or making fun of him as she did so many times before with others. Great episode and yes, Eliza is an amazing actress and Faith an awesome character.
Faith is just so complex and it's great to explore. You could well be right about how she would have reacted having changed what was said. This is what makes for great TV - keeps the discussions going
There are villains who are just plain simple evil. Nothing complex, just born to cause chaos and destruction, and it's not hard to write them. But then there are villains who aren't truly evil, they do villainous things, they talk a big game about wanting destruction, and lashing out at the heroes or innocent people... but deep down... they are just broken people not wanting to deal with their issues, and hurting others as they were hurt. This episode nails the reality of Faith, she isn't truly evil, she was on true evil's side for a while, she enjoyed the thrill of having no rules, and reveled in the role of being the bad guy. But she is at her core a good yet broken person. She desires to love and wants to be loved, but she doesn't know how, and the only person who got close to her set her on a terrible and dark path. Angel sees the soul in her that's being tortured, and he knows the pain and loneliness of feeling irredeemable. He is the only one that can physically confront Faith, and also confront her on her level. It's a wonderful ending.
Faith using her actions as a way of justifying the way she thinks (rightly and wrongly) people have mistreated or misjudged her is very special writing. She isn't a good person. She's a broken person. Abused and isolated. Barely functional but with extreme potential. I genuinely think that the flaws that Whedon wrote into his characters are what make them so believable, and the shows so good and so timeless.
What we do know about Faith is deeply disturbing. Raised by an alcoholic and absent mother. High school dropout. Sexually promiscuous as a young teen. Called into the darkness of being a Slayer, and intoxicated by the violence and power. Witnesses her Watcher be horrifically murdered. Lives on the street, supporting herself by shoplifting, picking up older men in bars(and likely robbing them). Knows way too much about BDSM as a 17 year old pre-internet. Emotionally and physically isolated. Envious and jealous of Buffy's life and status. Groomed by a wickedly intelligent and amoral father figure-the only one she's ever known. Brutally injured, brain damaged and comatose for 8 months. Yikes.
The Mayor _genuinely_ loved her as a daughter though. To the point where his love for her was able to be exploited by Buffy to kill him. He also loved her beyond the grave, by making her his tapes and leaving magic for her, just in case she woke up and he was gone. He also visited her by having his spirit possess animals to sit by her bedside and keep her company while in her coma.
Faith has: beat up a girl for her clothes, terrorized Joyce, violated Buffy's body by stealing it, r*ped Riley, tried to kill Angel after once before trying to poison him to death, knocked out Cordy, tortured Wesley...and you're like "I still think she's a good person. I want her to be a good person."😂 It's like, well she drowned those kids in the car but I think deep down inside she's a good person and needs a quiet sit down to talk and hug it out.😂 Wesley went awhile being tortured, which btw is a mirrored scene of when Angel tortured Giles...and you seem disappointed or upset at the victim for lashing out at his abuser by calling her a piece of sh*t. What?!😅😂 It's like, let me put on these blinders and believe she's a good guy because she's a female character who's a badass. No. Whatever she got done to her, up until this point, is 100% owed. She went down a very long rabbit hole of rock bottom to finally come to the understanding that she needs to atone for her sins, just like Angel did. Loved the parallel with his past and her present realities. I know you felt relief at seeing her finally show some remorse, because the rabbit hole was getting darker and darker. I'm wondering how much longer would you have held fast to her being redeemable if she kept going? This show does spin your mind about on the complexities of these characters. I rib you just because I honestly do love your optimism. I can see the wheels turning displayed on your worried expression. So many characters have done some really awful things, yet we can't help forgiving and caring for them. The show does not feed into that over the top "girl power" trope of today that seems to excuse all flaws and wrong doing because the female character is a badass. This holds them accountable and therefore makes them very human and relatable. But mostly it gives them a foundation to build character growth on. I think it makes for a better and more interesting story than a shallow "Girl power saved the day because she's powerful and perfect." For me, that doesn't sit well for either genders. I believe you said you've watched Smallville, so you see what I'm getting at. The show focused more on the Clark's journey and not just being the indestructible superhero. It made you want to know more about the complexity of who he is behind the hero. Eliza is a brilliant actress as well as the whole Whedonverse alumni. Cream of the crop, imo. Anywho, I'm playing catch up with the Buffyverse now cuz I'm lovin' your reactions. Btw...the SPN universe is an adjacent one to the Whedonverse. Ben Edlund is a major reason for that. Cheers🤗🥰
Soooo, since you're a couple of seasons ahead, I don't suppose you're feeling like maybe uploading the next episode right now? Asking for a friend. Please and thank you.
Ok it took me 20 years to ask this; is that the apartment of the guy at bus station or Wesley? Cause Angel didn't need an invite which means if it's bus station guy did she kill him?!
I think we assume it's the bus station guy and there's a reference somewhere in the show to him being in hospital and describing her so maybe he died after that? Or it's a plot hole, who knows.
I don't agree with that. Why would this be arguably the worst Buffy episode?? have you forgotten the puppet episode, the fish people episode, the cyber demon trying to date Willow episode, all of season 6 and 7 the most boring seasons of Buffy but I do agree this is arguably one of the best episode of Angel
@@WillsonT011 Ok, well check fan polls and such. It consistently ranks near the absolute bottom. Rolling Stone had it as the worst episode in the show. I'd say there is an argument there.
@@hardybryan how in the world is this considered the worse or arguably the worse in any poll of any kind🤨 I put this episode as one of the greatest episode from both Buffy and Angel combined😎
I hate Faith. I always have hated Faith since the moment she showed up in Sunnydale. I was never surprised when she turned bad cause I never thought she was good. It's interesting to me that you like her.
Since I don't like Wesley, and I no longer like Cordelia at this point, I'm team Faith. If I could rewrite this show, I would keep her, and get rid of Cordelia ;)
That last scene of Angel hugging Faith while a tortured Wesley drop the knife and it fades to Black and all you hear is the rain with no music. BEAUTIFUL AND TRAGIC😢
should be made into a poster
This episode and the Buffy episode where Faith is fighting her own body and calling herself a murderous b*tch. Shows how much she hates herself.
That ending never fails to get me no matter how many times I’ve seen it. Faith is just so broken and fragile despite her hard exterior. Begging Angel to kill her and then just collapsing into his arms in the rain while wesley drops the knife is so heartbreaking.
It's such a little thing, but I love that Phantom Dennis was trying to protect Cordy (and Wesley) by not letting her into her own apartment, because Faith was already inside waiting for her. That's a good ghost. 😉😊
Best ghost host.
The end of this episode is one of the best and most famous moments in the Buffyverse.
This episode is a personal fave, any episode with Eliza as Faith is usually gone be a top tier episode 🤷🏻♂️ the ending of this episode just confirms why she’s one of the best written and complex characters in the franchise. 10/10 performances 👏
I find Faith shallow as a puddle. The acting makes the character here. Faith was always evil.
@@volourn9764 if your only take away was “faiths shallow and was always evil” then you legit just missed the ENTIRE point of the show and her character arc, like this is why media literacy is REALLY important cuz not only does the show itself DIRECTLY contradict ur opinion here and PROVE faith wasn’t “evil” but also common sense and logic means frankly that’s just NOT how people work and operate. She wasn’t born evil, she was a truamatized and alone TEENAGE girl who let’s not forget is YOUNGER than Buffy and was ostracized and made to feel like an outsider by Buffy at almost EVERY opportunity simply cuz Buffy couldn’t handle her feelings of jealousy. Has they been nicer to and handled faith differently she wouldn’t have been so easily swayed by the FIRST person who was kind to her like full stop🤷🏻♂️ you wanna ignore all the GOATED and nuanced writing for faiths arc just to reduce her to being “evil” than go right ahead but the facts disagree so the rest of ur aren’t playing that game of revisionist history😤👏👏
if you don’t like her as a character whatever, you don’t gotta make stuff up and reduce her characters arc and writing tho 🤷🏻♂️
@AustinSamson1999 Blaming everyone but Faith while pretending that Buffy never suffered trauma yet Buffy never turned evil. Faith was evil, selfish, cruel, abusive, and scum from the moment she was introduced. And, why rewrite history? Buffy tried to be friends with Faith. Faith used it to try to corrupt Buffy, frame her for murder, and literally chose to work with the Mayor. Lol Buffy, FYI, was also young when she was called. Faith is what? A year younger? Lol Faith is a top 20 character in the franchise. Definitely not one of the best.
@@volourn9764 if ur stupid maybe that’s how you can interpret it🤷🏻♂️ Buffy throwing a tantrum at EVERY thing Faith did, including eating her FRIES in the first episode she appeared in is a thing that exists and eveybody cna go rewatch. Facts don’t care about ur feelings, there’s MORE than enough evidence that shows the nuance in what happened. Faith 100% has responsibilitie for what she did but trying to PRETEND Buffy’s repeated behavior had nothing to do with it is stupid and ignores all context🤷🏻♂️ I never blamed others without blaming Faith smart guy, im sayang reducing her entire arc to being “evil” when they made it VERY CLEAR she was an ALONE, and SEXUALLY ABUSED girl who was YOUNGER than Buffy with ZERO support systems in a family OR. A watcher. Clearly she’s going to have a DIFFERENT response to things than Buffy did, who even WITH all her privleages STILL did stupid shit like voluntarily let angle live after defeating him in the mall episode KNOWING he’d kill more people or taking off to live in the city for months or trying to rush the potential into a suicide mission in season 7 so don’t act like she’s perfect buddy. Faith was a traumatized teenage girl who needed help and love, and bottom line is she buffy handled thing different things would have ended up differently cuz Faith wouldn’t have neeeed to seek outside validation. Again, FACTS OVER FEELINGS the writing ITSELF makes this clear stay triggered about it she’s better written than more than half of ur “top 20” list I can guarantee 🤣
muted enjoy crying into the void loser. Facts over feelings and NOTBING you’ve said is supported by facts so 🤷🏻♂️☺️🫡
@AustinSamson1999 You have a lot of feels, and so few feels. And, why bring up seasons that she hasn't watched yet? Spoiling, even hinting, is rude. These watches are obtaining *because* they are blind views.
Remember episode 7 of Buffy season 1 ("Angel")? Angel tried "suicide by cop" by letting himself get killed by Buffy. Faith basically tried the same thing here. So it makes sense he didn't fall for her act. Takes one to know one I guess...
I'm surprised none of the other comments mention this yet, so I'll say it: the rain at the end was real. They wanted to use sfx to make rain for that scene but couldn't afford it, and then it conveniently was actually raining while they were shooting.
If you want more Eliza Dushku, I suggest you watch _Dollhouse_ at some point. It stars Eliza and was created by Joss (he is not a great person, but between _Buffy_ and _Angel_ and _Firefly,_ he definitely made some fantastic tv, and _Dollhouse_ holds up to those imo).
Dollhouse, yes! 💯
Dollhouse is a wild ride.
Indeed. She gets to show her range, and it deserves way more appreciation (the ensemble cast is amazing too)
I can never quite square the Whedon hate though.
I became disillusioned with him *years* ago, when he started down that "woke scold" path himself. The fact he's a domineering "creative" and happy to exploit his social capital for personal gain doesn't make him a monster. It just means he was never the hero. He's just a very ordinary person. He treats his friends well and can be incredibly petty when people threaten his ego.
He REALLY just needed people to deflate that ego a bit. Sadly, that doesn't seem to happen in his particular industry. If you're the goose laying the golden eggs, you are shielded from consequences. You stop laying those eggs, and under the nearest bus is your next destination.
I have friends just like what I hear of him... They aint perfect, but they don't exactly deserve a hate mob bc they can be arseholes sometimes.
Just seems a LOT of the stories boil down to "we didn't get on"
I can TOTALLY empathise with anyone he hurt being angry with him, even hating him. But plenty of the hatemob I see target him are no different from him.
Just my 2c on that controversy :P
@@DmGray From what I've heard of the Whedon controversy, he cheated on his wife, then tried to gaslight her into believing he wasn't when she confronted him with evidence about it. So it's more than just "he was kind of a dick". As someone who's been cheated on and gaslit about it myself, that kind of behavior is unacceptable by anyone.
That said, I do try to separate the art from the artist. Whedon's a shitbag, but his work is amazing. It becomes a bit hard when deciding how to handle that economically: you can't financially support the art without supporting the artist. So my solution to that... is torrenting 😁
@@IceMetalPunk
I guess I just don't have the same visceral reaction to rumours, accusations or even the reality of cheating.
It's not good, because breaking promises is not good. But I've never really understood jealousy.
If cheating and lying discounted a person from society, an AWFUL lot of people would fail that test. (pretty much every guy I know who has been "successful" with women is a serial cheat. Almost enough to make me believe the whole "women like to be treated like shit" hypothesis. & I know it's not a gendered issue, bc women cheat just as often as men. Maybe more :P Think many people just don't like to be lonely & are a mess of neuroses)
I fall back to the "he's just a very ordinary person, not a saint"
Put yourself in that position.
You're an insecure guy (as he obviously is)
You have young, beautiful women start to pay attention to you, heap you with praise and lavish you with affection. Are you VERY sure you would keep your virtue? I'll never know for sure, bc it sure as shit won't happen. But that temptation can't be dismissed. (it's also that part of "me too" that never gets mentioned. It takes two to tango, and if the bad behaviour weren't rewarded by "enough" people, it wouldn't happen. It's just that an AWFUL lot of *unwilling* people were harmed by the culture that builds)
I also don't think denying wrongdoing is the same as gaslighting. Gaslighting is a great deal more nefarious and the bar on my believing that accusation is always gonna be higher than a he said/she said where both parties have a vested interest and extreme emotion.
Again, he's just a very ordinary kind of jerk, it's the LEVEL of vitriol targeting him I find disturbing. I was quietly detesting the man for his public positions almost a decade :P
That desperate 'I'm Bad, I'm Evil' breaks me every time, all that time buried deep, hating herself and pretending not to care, trying to earn herself a 'way out' because she's so hurt and alone, amazing performance.
So impressed with Eliza in the last scene. ;c And major props to the writing/storytelling.
A brilliant episode from S1 really a two part episode with the next one Sanctuary. Here we see Faith again who has completely lost control, after escaping Sunnydale from Buffy. She comes to L.A. to wreak more havoc. A brilliant comedy moment when Angel is talking to the 'Suit' in Wolfram & Hart with business speak, and he doesn't know who he is, a parody of Michael J Fox in Secret Of My Success. A fantastic ending in the alleyway in the rain ( this show loves alleyways in the rain) with Faith begging Angel for help after her serious nervous breakdown. Angel knows what she has gone through and offers help. A great final shot of Wesley in the distance as well dropping the knife. One of the most iconic endings to any episode in The Buffyverse.
I was waiting for this episode...
no matter how good a person you are, after been tortured for hours most people would have said what he said and he would have ended her life too if he had gotten the chance
Faith is a character that comes more alive in the rewatches. There are so many subtle elements put in that on the first time through, it's pretty much impossible to see all that's going on.
The roots for this episode come from the episode with her in Buffy's body. She was finally able to see how her life could have been. When she took Buffy's body, it freed her from the baggage of her past.
That is, until she slept with Riley. If you watch that scene again really closely, you will notice the camera view chops around. That's an old film technique to depict a break in the mind of the character. I can't say for certain what it was, but it changed Faith. Likely it was forcing her to remember something traumatic in her past.
The whole experience have her an honest look at what she had become. That last scene with Buffy, she wasn't even fighting Buffy, she was trying to kill her old self.
This episode picked up from that. It's not obvious, but this entire episode was Faith trying to kill herself. She committed crimes all over, leaving an obvious trail of destruction that would be easy for the cops to follow. Then she injured a cop.
Basically, she was setting things up so the cops would come after her with a vengeance and she would force them to kill her. Suicide by cop is the term commonly used.
Then the lawyers told her Angel was in town. She accepted the job to kill him so quickly, not because she had any intention of killing him ,but because he was the best solution to her problem.
If the cops came for her, she would likely kill a bunch before they could kill her, which she didn't really want to do. Angel would be able to kill her much more easily with less innocent bystanders being hurt.
She tested him with the gun to test how much he still hated her. Knowing he didn't hate her, she went out to motivate him, give him the blood lust he would need to kill her. So she hurt Cordy and tortured Wes.
It seems like she's out of control then whole show, but she's actually everything she did was towards that single goal. Force someone to kill her to give her the punishment she feels she deserves.
It's such a crazy episode.
Brilliant episode, my fave ep of Angel and the best Faith episode of the show IMO.
FAAAAAAAITH! I've just stumbled upon your reactions with this one, my fave episode of Angel, and I'm so glad to see how sympathetic you are to Faith. I've come across some reactors who don't like her at all, but she's always been a heartbreaking character to me, and I feel so bad for her. The final scene in this episode destroys me every time. Eliza absolutely slayed (no pun intended). In an interview, she said that ending felt "cathartic" for her. She was going through a lot of struggles in her personal life at the time and related a lot to Faith. Glad that she's in a much happier place now.
Really enjoyed hearing your thoughts at the end of this episode - Faith is one of the most interesting characters I've encountered in any TV show, and this is one of those episodes where it really feels like they're doing something HUGE with the story.
Wesley in Angel Season 1 is a completely different person from Wesley in Buffy Season 3 , Wesley from Buffy Season 3 if he got taken by Faith he would be crying and begging for his life but Wesley here is like nah I'm not giving you shit cut me up if you want to but I'm not giving you the satisfaction at all , Wesley has truly grown a pair 🔥💯
The ep where Angel found its' feet. Wes dropping the knife is my favourite moment of the series
I'm glad you noticed the acting from Faith and how she was looking for just someone, anyone, to believe in her and care for her and forgive her. She played it so well when Wesley insulted her and she went from torturing him to thinking someone might be able to accept what she's done to immediately going back to bad when he insults her and ramping things up.
It's such a great little insight into her character and the mindset of that character at the time and not a lot of reactors notice how Eliza plays that scene.
Good Reaction :^) ... You're right about the tear drop tattoo. (A few years ago I had jury duty where one of the defendants/accused had three tear drops and was a gang member. I would've had to request a sidebar and tell the judge that I can't be impartial to this murdering scumbag. Luckily I wasn't selected for that trial).
Oh yes, here we go! Been waiting for this one 🎉
Best onscreen ending of all time of anything.
And it's so well build, that it tooks until this last scene, that the connection between the flashbacks and the present actions - suicide by the police - are revealed.
By the way: The rain was real. They want rain, couldn't afford the rain machine and while shooting the rain started - in California! Seems like God and/or St. Peter is a fan of Faith.😊
It's Elizas favorte episode.
Everyone failed on Faith, she is like the one, who falls through all saftey nets. This is why she is still likeable.
If you want more Eliza, you should react to "Tru Calling" and "Dollhouse", both shows with her in lead and 26 episodes each. You won't regret it.
Indeed - and earlier in the episode, she took the chance that Angel would shoot her, if he'd pulled the trigger twice, double tap could have ended her misery.
Top 3 best ending of a episode in the buffy verse and notice only person faith was go break down to was angel and angel already knew what she wanted
One of the best Angel episodes ever
A lot of people read Faith's character as a strong young girl because she's the slayer and also because she's very independent at such a young age...but what I've always seen was a scared traumatized little girl, pretending to be cool/with a hard exterior but in reality is just screaming for help. She's scared, alone and desperate for atention.
She's a heartbreaking character
People also forget that she’s a _child._
Buffy is 18. Faith can’t be more than 17. She had a very abusive childhood and deeply traumatic adolescence. And then became a slayer, had her watcher murdered in front of her, and was on the run since then.
Just found this awesome channel while searching Lucifer reactions! Love your taste in shows.
Awesome! Thank you!
One of my fave Angel eps, one of the strongest eps of s1 and a real turning point for the show.
Faith" you can't take me, no one can take me!
The viewers: Buffy can!
I think it’s interesting that Faith often starts fights with vampires without having a stake (it’s a running gag for her to borrow one from Buffy). But this time, she deliberately doesn’t have one - and that’s part of what tells Angel what she really wants.
The end of this episode breaks me every time I see it. She choose to attack Cordy and torture Wesley because she wanted Angle to kill her. She felt she deserved it and wanted to give him a reason to do it. The characters are are so well written and acted. I wanted so much for Faith to get help and accept that help, and start to forgive herself. Powerful episode.
Yes! I was waiting for this episode, the character depth shown is amazing. Both Faith & Angel had more emotional range shown here than in Buffy, to me at least. We saw Faith struggling on Buffy, especially in the body swap episode, but the way this was written was amazing. I love that they returned to this, this idea that Angel could get through to Faith was something I loved in Buffy. I mean the idea of internal darkness, and a soul struggling against it, is something Angel would know about. I also really believe the flashback episode in Angel where you saw Angel being turned & killing his Dad is something I feels plays into this. I pointed it out in the episode but Angelus played a bit with Angel's Dad, tormented him a bit, but he killed Angel's sister immediately which leads me to believe that Angel loved his sister deeply enough that it stll resonated a bit with Angelus and he killed her immediately in the hallway of the house rather than taunting & plaything with her. Just a theory, but I think that bond he had with his sister lends something to this probable connection with Faith. Lastly, I disagree with your statement that Faith could kill Angel because she's a slayer, all slayers are eventually killed by a vampire, usually surviving ten to twelve years. Buffy is one of the best trained Slayers & we saw Angelus & Buffy fight no holds barred, Angelus not only held his own but put her on the ground for a bit in that fight, even Spike thought Angelus would win, before Buffy rallied of course, but don't underestimate Angel's fighting abilities. Angel is old enough a vampire to be stronger than you would expect & he's a trained fighter at monastaries etc.
one of the best of season 1
Yep this right here is the reason if James Marsters was not on Buffy I would watch Only this show I love how Dark Angel show The Wesley Torcher scene yeeks and Flashbacks of Angelus and Darla where kills The One that will ultimately get him in Souled, and The Ending of him useing he's experience with knowing what Evil is so him at the End Holding Faith is just Powerful 💯
I am with you, Faith is a brilliantly written character. Way more complex and tortured then most.
And thats saying something about the Buffyverse.
"I know what you want.. but I'm not going to make it easy for you"... Faith wanted him to go vamp face to make her feel like she was just ridding the world of another monster
Eliza was indeed offered a regular role on the series (that was Joss's original plan), but she chose to go to college instead. (She's just turned 19 when this is being filmed.)
Does her appearance here mean things have changed? Keep watching and see.
(Obviously, Dakara already HAS. But I don't spoil future developments when commenting, so…)
I think we saw a glimpse of why Faith did what she did at the end of the episode. I’m sure you’ve seen the Buffy episodes.
When she's torturing Wesley, at that point she wants Angel to come for her. As angry and disappointed as she is in Wesley, I don't think she intended to kill him, she was just biding time until Angel got there and did enough to get Angel to kill her. Plus, she's pretty angry at Wesley. One of the reasons she probably didn't take Cordy is because she doesn't have any [real] history with Cordy.
Yeah that's nice and all but if the person who's torturing me is expecting me to sympathize with them.... OH FUCK NO, BURN IN HELL
So I understand Wesley's reaction while getting tortured and him grabbing the knife, he was not going to hesitate to stab her with it but he then saw Angel hugging her thus the dropping of the knife
Damn, Eliza can act.
Such a fantastic episode and crossover. Faith is wonderful. Giles and the others really shouldve tried harder with her, instead of letting her fester in a dingy motel. No wonder she was drawn to the Mayors fatherly influence, hes the only one to ever give her anything
100% this!!!
Eliza really put her Dushkussy into this
I thought of this and now I have to make sure I’m not the only one suffering
“She’s one of _us_ now. She’s a monster”
“She’s an innocent victim.”
“So were _we…_ once upon a time.”
“…once upon a time.”
16:00 If Faith was in control of her emotions there is no way Angel could beat her.
Yeah, he would. He's the superior fighter. Slayers are not unbeatable. Fruggin' Spike murdered two in 1vs1 fights, and Angel is way better than Spike. Even Buffy has been bested including literally been killed by the Master.
@@volourn9764 and yet none of this proves Angels the superior fighter to faith full stop🤷🏻♂️ Faiths always been shown to be equal to Buffy EVERY time they fought including BEATING her in a 1v1 in the sequel comics fare and square. Meanwhile Buffy’s beaten Angel and shown to scale above him MULTIPLE times in seaosn 2 alone. This isn’t a debate, in a full on fight Faith scales above him and would by his OWN admission. Faith being mentally unstable and holding back hoping he’d kill her is the only reason she didn’t kill him outright here, cope harder 🤷🏻♂️
@AustinSamson1999 comics. Talk about cope. Buffy beats Faith repeatedly. The fact you use silly comics makes this discussion useless.
@@volourn9764 facts over feelings 🤷🏻♂️ Faith beat buffy, Angel couldn’t. End of discussion. Faith was WINNING agaisnt Angel in this episode and was STILL holding back hoping he’d kill her, fact not an opinion. The comics are cannon and set after EVERYTHING feat wise in the show meaning their all at their PEAKS. Even if I don’t yes comics Faith still DOGWALKED Angel and Buffy multiple times so stay mad ☺️
I mean, Slayers are _by design_ stronger than vampires for the literal singular purpose of slaying them.
Angel himself states that Buffy is stronger than him. And Faith is just as strong as Buffy.
Great reaction to a great episode that continued the broken tale of the Dark/Rogue Slayer arc that is Faith and a possible reckoning of sorts for the charcter.... Like you said, the writing was great with the similarities of the path that Angelus/Angel has walked and whether or not it is one that Faith will go, but like you said at least there's hope there more than ever before... And that final showdown of Angel/Faith as he knew that she felt the guilt and self loathing deep down for all that she's done and wanted to pay for her sins by having Angel kill her..... just a great ep overall and a well conceived story arc.... can't wait to see where the tale goes from here..... as always, great stuff D that nets you another CTU today.... Keep em coming!
Faith is very complicated, and damaged. I gave a brief theory on one of your BTVS reactions and I do stand by it. I love the sub-plot that the writers have made here.
Love this episode but gotta admit I disagree with you on the "Piece of sh" moment. How many times did people say good things to her, like I know you're good inside and she doesn't care at all. Even in this episode Wesley said to her "I also believe in my heart that you're not a bad person" just before she hits Cordy. I'm convinced it wouldn't have changed one bit if he had said something nice. She would have probably been angry shouting liar or making fun of him as she did so many times before with others. Great episode and yes, Eliza is an amazing actress and Faith an awesome character.
Faith is just so complex and it's great to explore. You could well be right about how she would have reacted having changed what was said. This is what makes for great TV - keeps the discussions going
@@DakaraJayne Totally! And you could also be right as well!! I guess only faith knows!😉
There are villains who are just plain simple evil. Nothing complex, just born to cause chaos and destruction, and it's not hard to write them. But then there are villains who aren't truly evil, they do villainous things, they talk a big game about wanting destruction, and lashing out at the heroes or innocent people... but deep down... they are just broken people not wanting to deal with their issues, and hurting others as they were hurt.
This episode nails the reality of Faith, she isn't truly evil, she was on true evil's side for a while, she enjoyed the thrill of having no rules, and reveled in the role of being the bad guy. But she is at her core a good yet broken person. She desires to love and wants to be loved, but she doesn't know how, and the only person who got close to her set her on a terrible and dark path.
Angel sees the soul in her that's being tortured, and he knows the pain and loneliness of feeling irredeemable. He is the only one that can physically confront Faith, and also confront her on her level. It's a wonderful ending.
“She’s one of _us_ now. She’s a monster”
“She’s an innocent victim.”
“So were _we…_ one upon a time.”
“…once upon a time.”
Faith using her actions as a way of justifying the way she thinks (rightly and wrongly) people have mistreated or misjudged her is very special writing.
She isn't a good person.
She's a broken person. Abused and isolated. Barely functional but with extreme potential.
I genuinely think that the flaws that Whedon wrote into his characters are what make them so believable, and the shows so good and so timeless.
it would be cool
Buffy nor Giles didn't contact anyone because they didn't know where she went.
You should watch Eliza in Tru Calling!! It only got 2 seasons but it’s soooo good
Yes the Slayers is stronger than a vampire however, like Spike has proven, Slayers are beatable even by a vampire😮
What we do know about Faith is deeply disturbing. Raised by an alcoholic and absent mother. High school dropout. Sexually promiscuous as a young teen. Called into the darkness of being a Slayer, and intoxicated by the violence and power. Witnesses her Watcher be horrifically murdered. Lives on the street, supporting herself by shoplifting, picking up older men in bars(and likely robbing them). Knows way too much about BDSM as a 17 year old pre-internet. Emotionally and physically isolated. Envious and jealous of Buffy's life and status. Groomed by a wickedly intelligent and amoral father figure-the only one she's ever known. Brutally injured, brain damaged and comatose for 8 months.
Yikes.
It's a wonder she's sane at all.
The Mayor _genuinely_ loved her as a daughter though. To the point where his love for her was able to be exploited by Buffy to kill him. He also loved her beyond the grave, by making her his tapes and leaving magic for her, just in case she woke up and he was gone. He also visited her by having his spirit possess animals to sit by her bedside and keep her company while in her coma.
What do you expect ? She was torturing him. Ofcourse he was going to call her how she was behaving. How she’s been all this time
Faith has: beat up a girl for her clothes, terrorized Joyce, violated Buffy's body by stealing it, r*ped Riley, tried to kill Angel after once before trying to poison him to death, knocked out Cordy, tortured Wesley...and you're like "I still think she's a good person. I want her to be a good person."😂
It's like, well she drowned those kids in the car but I think deep down inside she's a good person and needs a quiet sit down to talk and hug it out.😂
Wesley went awhile being tortured, which btw is a mirrored scene of when Angel tortured Giles...and you seem disappointed or upset at the victim for lashing out at his abuser by calling her a piece of sh*t. What?!😅😂
It's like, let me put on these blinders and believe she's a good guy because she's a female character who's a badass. No. Whatever she got done to her, up until this point, is 100% owed.
She went down a very long rabbit hole of rock bottom to finally come to the understanding that she needs to atone for her sins, just like Angel did.
Loved the parallel with his past and her present realities.
I know you felt relief at seeing her finally show some remorse, because the rabbit hole was getting darker and darker.
I'm wondering how much longer would you have held fast to her being redeemable if she kept going?
This show does spin your mind about on the complexities of these characters.
I rib you just because I honestly do love your optimism. I can see the wheels turning displayed on your worried expression.
So many characters have done some really awful things, yet we can't help forgiving and caring for them.
The show does not feed into that over the top "girl power" trope of today that seems to excuse all flaws and wrong doing because the female character is a badass. This holds them accountable and therefore makes them very human and relatable.
But mostly it gives them a foundation to build character growth on. I think it makes for a better and more interesting story than a shallow "Girl power saved the day because she's powerful and perfect." For me, that doesn't sit well for either genders.
I believe you said you've watched Smallville, so you see what I'm getting at. The show focused more on the Clark's journey and not just being the indestructible superhero. It made you want to know more about the complexity of who he is behind the hero.
Eliza is a brilliant actress as well as the whole Whedonverse alumni. Cream of the crop, imo.
Anywho, I'm playing catch up with the Buffyverse now cuz I'm lovin' your reactions.
Btw...the SPN universe is an adjacent one to the Whedonverse. Ben Edlund is a major reason for that.
Cheers🤗🥰
Soooo, since you're a couple of seasons ahead, I don't suppose you're feeling like maybe uploading the next episode right now? Asking for a friend. Please and thank you.
Buffy and Angel don't talk to each other anymore. Seemingly the only people still talking are Cordy and Willow.
I mean..... she literally just tortured the shit out of Wesley.... can you really blame him for NOT trying to redeem her in that moment lol
For the Algorithm 🌹
Ok it took me 20 years to ask this; is that the apartment of the guy at bus station or Wesley? Cause Angel didn't need an invite which means if it's bus station guy did she kill him?!
I think we assume it's the bus station guy and there's a reference somewhere in the show to him being in hospital and describing her so maybe he died after that? Or it's a plot hole, who knows.
Arguably the best episode of Angel right alongside arguably the worst episode of Buffy.
I don't agree with that. Why would this be arguably the worst Buffy episode?? have you forgotten the puppet episode, the fish people episode, the cyber demon trying to date Willow episode, all of season 6 and 7 the most boring seasons of Buffy but I do agree this is arguably one of the best episode of Angel
@@WillsonT011 which is why I wrote arguably.
@@hardybryan there is no argument, at least on The Buffy one. On the angel one, I agree with
@@WillsonT011 Ok, well check fan polls and such. It consistently ranks near the absolute bottom. Rolling Stone had it as the worst episode in the show. I'd say there is an argument there.
@@hardybryan how in the world is this considered the worse or arguably the worse in any poll of any kind🤨 I put this episode as one of the greatest episode from both Buffy and Angel combined😎
I hate Faith. I always have hated Faith since the moment she showed up in Sunnydale. I was never surprised when she turned bad cause I never thought she was good. It's interesting to me that you like her.
Since I don't like Wesley, and I no longer like Cordelia at this point, I'm team Faith. If I could rewrite this show, I would keep her, and get rid of Cordelia ;)
get rid of Cordy?! That's blasphemy haha
Girl, u did that Meatloaf song 🎵 so perfect. Do you know you have Perfect Pitch 🔥🔥🔥