The Importance of Silent Hill's Camera Design
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- Опубликовано: 18 мар 2024
- Silent Hill's camera style was part of its unique identity.
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I reckon the RE2R Fixed Camera Mod creator/s will be in high demand for the SH2 remake.
Took them 5 years to do RE2 lol
You think RE2 Remake started as fixed camera?
Means jack sht if ue5 isn't programmed to allow RE levels of modding, it's never gonna happen.
Best case senario: "Sh2r directors cut - classic edition..."
I find it almost impossible to get new gamers into games with fix camera angles or cinematic camera angles. It's sad to see these types of camera styles be rejected so hard that it's only alive in certain Indie games.
I disagree. I have witnessed first hand COUNTLESS first-time newbs, total zoom zoom gamers, absolutely fall in love with the classic RE and SH games, after little bit of persuasion and instruction. The biggest, saddest problem nowadays really is the fact that many younger, more casual players not only have never played anything but these FPS or OTS shooter type of modern games, but also have NEVER had to actually learn how to play a new game... all because majority of all modern crap is pretty much carved out of the same wood, controls and style-wise. Thus, my recommendation is to educate first and ease this culture shock as much as possible, and put some value into the obligatory learning-curve phase.
Or, if you want to be a meanie, you can remind them that literal 9 -year-old ESL kids could beat and speedrun these games 25 years ago, so there's zero excuses why an adult couldn't do the same in 202X.
@@GugureSux I'm honestly glad you've had better luck than me on that front but I've had the complete opposite experience. Even boomers didn't like it because they never played those kinds of games when they were young.
@@GugureSux You hit the nail, sir. It's all down to video game players refusing to learn unfamiliar mechanics. The homogenized nature of modern video games means no one needs to learn anything other than what the defaults have become. Then, they accuse anything with even slightly different controls as being "dated" or "clunky".
Video games used to come with thick-ass manuals for a reason. Because just like board-games, you were supposed to LEARN how to play them before you could actually play them properly. But that takes time and effort, you see.
@@GugureSuxYeah, like when younger gamers jump into Tomb Raider 1 and do not bother to learn the controls in the manor, and then complain about the controls.
@GugureSux You just summed up my entire issue with the modern gaming audience in a more straightforward way than I ever could. If I tried to explain the same thing it would have been a page long rant.....people just don't want to expose themselves to new experiences because they've been conditioned by safe, easy, mechanically milqetoast games for over a decade.
Alternate title for this video could have been "The Angle of the Dangle in Silent Hill". If the video gets taken down just reupload it with that title for good luck.
The og trilogy sure does leave me at an angle & I ain’t exactly dangling when it do.
@@ASSLEVANIA 😏👍
@@ASSLEVANIA ** Henry, Walter and Eileen are sitting on their front porch, looking down dejectedly. "Nobody loves us, do they Henry?" says Eileen. "No- they really don't. Don't look at me! You think it's my fault? Could it maybe possibly be because of all that weird foreskin stuff that Walter is into?" says Henry. Walter snaps back "Like it's completely my fault! Ha! Henry has as much flavor as a rice cake. He looks like he could have already been lobotomized. And he is constantly crawling into weird holes. If you find a weird hole, chances are that Henry is either currently crawling through it or has crawled through it recently. And people think I'm a weirdo. Oh, by the way, do either of you want this weird doll I found?" Eileen slightly frowns, looks disapprovingly at Walter, then a sadness crosses her face as she looks into Henry's eyes. Then... her mouth turns into a very slight smile. "Well, at least we we aren't Downpour." **
The point of this little tale is to always remember that when you don't include SH4 in the original, well loved set of games- it feels it. It's already had a hard enough life. It should never be made to feel like it's a bastard stepchild and not part of the biological SH family. Please, be nice to SH4. And remember, there are some weirdos out there actually consider it to be superior to SH3.
The angle of my dangle is proportionate to the heat of my meat
James’ member dangled around his ankles as he strangled the languid and ragged angles of the nurses. Their bangles clang-eled whilst he thrust his protuberant schmoshmangle up against her ramjangles. Becoming entangled he could hear some keys jangle. Out of the corner of his eye. He could see old miss daniels. The poor old dear had never even seen a schmoshmangle. And covered the eyes of her grey haired cocker spaniel.
I’m really happy you have been so focused on this. It always bothered me that all the analysis of silent hill has focused on the story without ever considering the aesthetics. I remember 10 years ago people were even claiming that the early games has no consistent aesthetic. To me it’s very weird the extent to which people who enjoyed the dumbed-down western silent hill games will bend over backwards claiming untrue things about the first 4 games to defend them. Changing, non-player controlled camera angles were an important innovation in the transition to 3D and it was sad to see them go in the mid-00s. To be honest, I loved the RE:2 remake and it’s camera, but that was one game. It has gotten the point where several, otherwise beautiful games look exactly the same because of the use that exact camera and character positioning. It’s sad because, especially in the case of silent hill, you had real artists who understood cinematography. I don’t think you have the same respect and understanding of film in many modern games.
Saying this before I watch, but the fixed cameras are what added to the dread, the feeling of not being in control.
It created a sense of voyeurism, that the Otherworld itself is alive, an entity, watching your character and relishing in the horrors it unearthed from the dark depths of the human psyche.
You, as the player, could only see what it wanted you to see, and this in itself provided more of a personal connection to the world and the protagonist, as they themselves struggled to see through the fog and darkness.
It’s a shame modern gamers dismiss this with “tank controls suck and that’s why fixed cameras suck!”
I feel like the thing most fixed camera angle detractors don't quite get is that:
1. You can make fixed camera angle games without tank controls. Originally people thought you couldn't because the bonus of tank controls was that your character would keep moving in their facing direction regardless of wherever their alignment was as opposed to yours, but developers have long since cracked this and plenty have established controls that do this with regular third person directional controls; opting to have the character continue moving in a chosen direction until the controls are released and your character returns to "Neutral".
2. The appeal of "Fixed Camera Angles" are cinematic shots... And you still SEE these from time to time in games, you just don't realize it. Uncharted uses them all the time; panning and widening shots that show off environments, focus on a "stage" where NPC's are talking while you can move in the background, etc. They're not EXCLUSIVE to horror, horror just makes the best use of them.
With that in mind, the reason they are so important to games like Resident Evil or Silent Hill is because of what they SAY. Everyone thinks they are against fixed camera angles until you're looking at Harry Mason through a foreground shot where your view is peering through other objects and it FEELS like you are a malevolent observer voyeuristically stalking Harry. They make you FEEL as if you're more than just a spectator or player, you are the director or enemy itself predating upon him. Fixed camera angles can tell a story and while Resident Evil would (mostly) use them for environmental shots, Silent Hill was a masterclass when it came to using them in a classical horror movie sense.
Sometimes the shots came from the perspective of the floor where an item was and it would make your protagonist feel large and oppressive, other times it would be the exact opposite and your character would be a tiny patt of the screen only visible through a tiny flame illuminating a very constricted circle around them while EVERYTHING else was washed in darkness, something SO much more terrifying that just having a first person perspective staring down a dark hallway; your obscured vision now doubled and blindness being expressed in the entire environment around you.
And the thing is... You can do things with these shots you could never do in other horror games, for example: Having an enemy spawn down the other half of the corridor coming after you, allowing you to SEE the full scope of the chase and adding that extra tension, something you just can't do with first person or third person over-the-shoulder. All that cinematic crap I just spewed about how it makes you "feel" gets cranked to 11 the moment these games employ enemies that TAKE ADVANTAGE of that view. Hiding enemies behind objects in the foreground, showing you every surrounding foe in a landscape shot to emphasize how SURROUNDED you are, focusing shots that linger on objects or unsavory things to subtly say, "Hey this thing is important, maybe come back to this later".
They were an art form that ADDED to the horror...
And then they were gutted at one point because someone somewhere decided "These are outdated and serve no purpose beyond tank controls" because "I just say so, believe me bro". When people say they don't like fixed camera angles, I straight up don't believe them, either that or it gives me the impression that they've only WATCHED the content on RUclips and never actually PLAYED the games, therefore never actually having experienced them first hand. Games like Capcom's Haunting Grounds are entirely reliant on them, but you'd probably see a Remake these days where the camera is just locked onto the protag's shoulders like in Resident Evil despite those fixed angles being a DEFINING feature of that game that EVERYONE recognizes them for. If you don't like'm? Well, you've probably experienced either cases of poorly implemented fixed camera or just don't like the discomfort associated with it. That's okay, but please don't act like there is "no reason" people love this style.
Nothing quite like playing the first 4 silent hill games on a big old CRT TV and a PS2. If the Silent Hill 2 remake sucks, i'm glad I still have the original to go back to.
In SH1, Alchemilla Hospital, there's a room where you'll notice something fused on the back wall wiggling its tentacles. But you don't see this at first, because the camera, in typical fashion, is facing the character when you enter the room. You don't know what's in front of you, all you hear is that weird squishy noise coming from the other end of the room. So what i did was that (in order to get a glimpse of what i'm dealing with before i run into unwelcome surprises) i slooowly shifted the camera away from my character (L2/Change View) towards the left side of the screen from where my character was standing, where this weird set of tentacles began to creep into the frame. 😄It was this really fun (albeit somewhat staged) "horror movie moment" that i feel can only be recreated with this sort of camera design. 👍
So many memories created
I'm surprised you didn't mention SH1 has an unlockable "Self-view" mode, which is an alt camera mode that place the view roughly over Harry's head and allow you to play the game in a pseudo over the shoulder modern style.
And when you play SH1 this way, while it can be fun at times, it also makes even more evident how the magic of the camera angles is take away when you're able to see everything coming from the characters perspective.
My main issue with the detractors of classic survival horror mechanics is they want to force the notion that "Fixed camera's/tank controls are outdated" and they cannot just accept them as just another genre of gameplay...like I get it, you don't like these controls and game design and you prefer action games with horror aesthetics, but that doesn't mean every game must have action game controls just because you don't want to get out of your comfort zone and think these mechanics were just made due to "software/hardware limination".
By that logic turn based RPGS and 2D platformers are also "outdated".
Granted, there are games that utilize Free Aim OTS shooting mechanics that does survival horror well, but they're few and far inbetween and it's because of very specific design choices that stop them from becoming full blown action (RE2 Remake and Cold Fear come to mind).
Exactly
The shift in camera choice for the Silent Hill 2 remake really goes to show how little we view videogames as a serious art form. We don't look at old/formative styles as something to be celebrated or preserved, but as something to be updated, homogenised or gotten rid of altogether. I can already hear the IGN review that will inevitably praise the modern camera and controls as being objectively better than the original.
Add to this the excuses they always give that can literally mean nothing like: "its clunky" "its outdated" "its janky". I understand that there is a level of annoyance to older cameras that made it difficult to control but i dont understand the need to completely discard the concept instead of seeking to improve it
The new camera angles can be cinematic, up close and personal, and done very effectively. So just bc it doesn’t have fixed camera angles doesn’t mean it’s soulless. When fighting against enemies in this game the angle makes them feel far away. I’m not scared of an enemy far away I’m scared of an enemy that’s obviously close and I’ll feel that way thru the 3rd person camera close to James
@@ariz2578 I'm glad that's your preference. And luckily for you that's how every single game is made nowadays. The point of the video is that the fixed camera is a dying art that is being replaced by a new camera style that is ubiquitous and generic.
I remember in first Silent Hill, at the beginning where you we're looking for Cheryl, there's a moment when you we're in the alley, and camera switch to overhead view, and you could see rusty piper obscuring a view a bit and Henry somewhat hidden behind them. This is where I knew that fixed camera is best camera for any horror game, and that opinion did not change. The best horror games every made have fixed cameras, and there's a reason for that.
Yes
Yeah……It’s the first clip he shows and the most commonly referenced camera angle in the series
@@mattmas6628 No, Im talking about when you go back and theres a cheryl notebook, its better example
@@Pawlacz2137iam pretty sure that a lot of people would consider re4 to be one of the best horror games ever made.
@@matinhannak3649 And we are not talking sbout this people.
What I liked about the older SH titles was how the camera placement and angles were just as important to telling a story as was the dialogue or what was on screen. My favorite was for Silent Hill 2 and how the camera angles often reflected how James felt. My favorite example is after when Maria gets killed by Pyramid Head when they try to make to the elevator. The way the camera is angled downward at James, him slumped against the elevator door with magdalene playing in the back. You feel how defeated and powerless he was that he couldn't save Maria. It clearly shook him as it subconsciously reminded him of Mary and her dying.
Or the Camera Angles in the Prison Cells. You could just feel how imprisoned and claustrophobic James feels. I'm afraid that Feeling can't be reproduced in the Remake with over the Shoulder Camera 🤦♂️
You should talk about Fatal Frame next. Its another excellent survival horror series with classic fixed camera angles
Fatal Frame was unique in how it used a separate first person camera for its combat, sidestepping the usual complaints about fighting enemies with fixed camera angles. Which is why it's sad they still ditched the camera angles for a generic third person view in the last two games.
Which ones are worth playing?
@@jayros4269All of them, really but the PS2 games are better than the two later games
That first nightmare alleyway camera freaks me out to this day.
mayo when camera:
The word "cinematography" instinctively came to mind seeing the Silent Hill 1 camera work again. It's the same thing but the intentionality and highly curated nature of it made the experience that much more special because of the attention to every single detail. It also gave every environment an additional layer of personality to further set them apart.
Never stop what you are doing man. I get extremely excited whenever I see you post a new video. I have never played silent hill and yet I clicked on this as soon as I saw it. You definitely set your self apart from other content creators. Giving your blunt and sometimes harsh opinions (even when I disagree) is such a breathe of fresh air. Keep it up
"Mary... where the FUCK are you?" - NüJames probably
"-Maria...you've got to be fucking kidding me!
- I'm not your fucking Mary! Bitch can't even swim!"
"these things are not fucking human"
*NUjames (after headshoting an enemy): Boom, headshot!/Quick lobotomy/ A nurse won't fix that
" NüJaaaaaaames FUCKING Sunderlaaaand!!"
“I gotta get the fuck outta this town”
I also cannot understand why they aren't making the SH2 Remake with fixed cameras. Why any of this companies doesn't do that anymore. It would be so delicious to the eyes and the immersion!
Mostly to cater to newer audiences that saw survival horror in 2010s when OTS perspective is the way to be. Unfortunately almost none of them except maybe Capcom or Tango Games understand how to make OTS without being obnoxiously monotonous.
4:11 for sure. The swooping camera angle freaked me out back in the day. Almost as profound as meeting The Licker for the first time 😅
Can't wait for the modern fanboys who only played OTS games to watch and comment on this video just to create discourse about how old, janky and archaic this style of presentation is in a horror video game setting.
There's already one comment like this above the comments
unfortunately a game without modern camera cant be made today, normies would melt, they are not used to it anymore, the best that devs could do is a optional camera but i think they dont even care to do it anymore, they think its not worth it.
Every time some (viral marketer) says shit like this, someone comes and makes [the thing that cannot be made], becomes famous and rich, and makes the others around him seem like total fools. FF ditched turn-based combat using the same excuse, and while its popularity and quality has taken a nose dive, other games like Persona 5 and Like A Dragon 7-8 fly off the store shelves world wide.
When it comes to the classic RE-style cinematic camera angle and gameplay, let's not forget that it was the 2014 HD re-release of REmake1 that literally sold millions overnight and "revived" RE series. And now we got a ton of indie devs replicating the OG RE style, with and without the camera angles (see: Tormented Souls and Signalis).
Thank you for this video! A few months ago, I complained on Twitter about how the Silent Hill 2 "remake" looked boring with this same-y over-the-shoulders camera that every action game uses nowadays, and how much better Silent Hill used to be with fixed camera angles. Then, a complete random person replied to me telling that what I was saying was stupid, because "Silent Hill never had fixed camera angles". I was like: "WHAT ARE YOU EVEN TALKING ABOUT?" and I showed dozens of images with fixed camera angles all over the old Silent Hill games. He never replied back. If your video existed then, it would be much easier for me to explain what I was saying.
I have several videos on horror camera angles and I like to think they can always be used for reference going forward.
I'll just wait for the inevitable fixed camera angle mod for SH2R.
Tormented souls mentioned, cry of fear ost on background, camera´s disvantage of every camera position, what a masterpiece of video.
The camera angles of Silent Hill are so underrated. It's crazy how triple A games have become so homogenised that you either have straightforward first-person camera, or over-the-shoulder cameras and that's it.
I played Silent Hill for the first time in 2023 (1-4) and I agree with everything you said. I hate drooling all over a game and fanboying but the opening sequence of Silent Hill 1 actually had me scared and creeped out. The camerawork and sound design are legendary and haven't aged a bit - and this is coming from a (old) zoomer. I don't detest modern gaming nor do I cling on to the past because I was born in a time where I don't belong to a older demographic, yet at the same time I don't feel like part of the younger audience. I suppose that is what awoke a curiosity in me to revise "older" games and see how they shaped the industry and how people perceived them and continue to do so.
And you are so bang on about camera in Silent Hill. I can't imagine getting rid of it because there is genuine skill and thought put into it. It makes me appreciate the game even more because every shot in the games feel thought out and meticulously planned, and not mindlessly put in for padding.
I might also add that the way the camera is used it's like a best of both worlds - cinema and game. It's not overly smooth and follows the character in a way that it makes you feel like you're watching a movie, like you do with so many triple A games today. It manages to be its own unique thing and not feel derivative or uninspired.
Team Silent cooked so hard with this series.
fix camera is a masterpiece art style in gaming, no matter how many zoomers say it’s “oUt dAtEd”
Don't care if you are still using this type of camera angle in 2024. Your game is obviously going to flop...the majority don't want it anymore. This isn't the year 2000. One simple mistake and your company is done for plus, only a small company wants to continue using this angle now
Hate it or love it. The new camera system is much better for a modern player
I guess, the best for the Silent Hill 2 remake can be a mix of third person over shoulder camera for the more combat section, an fix camera por areas more of exploration, puzzles or transition or importan areas.
Imagine in the remake of when u beat the game it unlocks a new “OG camera” mode and you can play with og camera angle
I do love your analysis of the cinematography of games.
I feel like a lot of modern gamers and devs have gaslit themselves into thinking that any kind of fixed camera style is outdated because old games used to have them, even though that makes no sense when you think about it for more than 5 seconds.
Yeah but that logic 2d fighting games are outdated.
I honestly prefer Silent Hill's camera angles compared to Resident Evil's due to it being alot more dynamic and overall just felt alot more fun yet still terrifying to play. For me it manages to feel like a interactive horror movie with its presentation and I love everything about it.
I think that if it's not absolutely well planned and intended this way like in RE4 or Dead Space, the over the shoulder camera is the worst possible camera to use in a horror game.
Because it gives you a complete contiousnes of your surroundings even if you are not looking in that direction, eliminating pretty much any possible surprise element.
How I could explain this was that back then, twin sticks weren't a thing, hell the OG ps1 controller didn't originally come with one, so the devs had to make do with creating interesting ways to make the camera work depending on the situation, so you know, the player could SEE what is going on despite not having an inherent way to control the camera.
Now these days, devs just slap on camera that is controllable with the right stick, and call it a day not even accounting how in some cases for example, the camera could be blocked. I don't mind camera management, but nothing can be done about things that are out of your control like devs not taking camera into consideration in some games where the camera can be controlled.
Imagine if twin sticks, or perhaps another d-pad was implemented in the third or fourth generation of consoles; camera management in Sonic the Hedgehog anyone?
It's gotta partially be laziness. They don't want to have to intelligently and artistically frame every space. It's a lot of work. Just let the player look all around.
@@underthemayo Could also be a stigma of controllable camera being mandatory. I don't think I've seen (at least somewhat acclaimed or well known) recent third person games where there wasn't controllable camera at least at the top of my head.
Thanks for the consistently great videos Mayo 🔥
Glad you like them!
I've never touched a survival horror game but the way you lay out their positives gives me a lot of respect for them and makes me wanna try them! Idk where I would get my hands on the old Silent Hills or Resident Evils though 😅
You can easily get at least the RE1 Remake remastered for a reasonable price across platforms. Which is considered the definitive way to experience, RE1. Unless you are that much of a purist and want the OG of the OG
Totaly agree
8:57 Yeah, that's right! They made a game that controls more like Silent Hill than the Silent Hill remake they are working on!
I'm not sure SH2 remake will hit the same with a different camera design.
If anything I believe they should add an option to use classic camera angles and design.
i really cannot understand why in 2024 this issue still even exists. just waiting for the day camera view is something that you just are able to choose at the start or idk dlc... thankful truly for mods and the people who create them for free ... when the companies that initially gave them to us just no longer will do it. makes no sense to me.
A thing that gets me with Silent Hill is that, its camera style allows the player to explore the town. And guess the main appeal of the games? That's right, the town. Being able to see sights of the town in specific angles from exploring the streets to seeing the unadulterated and tight alleyways introduces you to the Silent Hill. Sure it may not be as great as the first three games, but each time it does, it feels unique (except for maybe Homecoming, we don't talk about it). Silent Hill 4, has a very ethereal appeal in its presentation making each level feel like something out of Jacob's Ladder or a surrealist fever dream. And even Downpour gets the idea by allowing you to explore a dreary abandoned city drenched in rain.
It's not just Silent Hill that does this, other games also uses cinematography to enhance basic experience from time to time. One may even notice how games like Outlast takes cues from found footage genre, and how third-person over the shoulder also gives way for the player to freely rotate their view to at least get a feel of their surroundings, like in Evil Within 2, and even The Last of Us series. There's also the Max Payne series, you get the point. Style and presentation that works for the game at hand.
Bloober team on the other hand does away with what makes Silent Hill unique. Sure, over the shoulder is functional, but even then it feels so tight that its style of over the shoulder seemingly doesn't fit this game. It worked for Resident Evil 2 remake because it's enhancing the claustrophobic feel of the RE2 original, but that's not the case with Silent Hill. The atmosphere only ever becomes tight in certain spaces you're mostly gonna be exploring wide areas, like well, the town streets. So, it's not even the idea that they're using OTS, it's how they utilize it that's the problem. Evil Within 2 manages to create a strong atmosphere with over the shoulder but it doesn't have to feel static or tanky janky. Unlike its predecessor that tries way too hard to blend cinematography and over the shoulder gameplay. I'm not even gonna mention how the animations looks rather bland and doesn't present the identity of the original enemy presentation. It's honestly frustrating, since, other games get it, why can't they? And I'm sick of hearing the defense of "it's more modern and convenient", no, it's not. It's badly executed even among the modern games released for the past 10 years.
I love silent Hill 2 camera movement cause it had art. Team silent were inspired from movies like Jacobs ladder and others but Jacobs ladder more because of James character model and the monsters movements but more important is the camera movement. If you want see a silent Hill 2 movie watch Jacobs ladder. Ps if you want to see some monster designs that inspired team silent look up Francis bacon painting so surreal.
Just wanted to say, you’re the reason I decided to give the remake of the original Resident Evil a try, and I am so glad I have been going through it! As someone who didn’t play these types of games as a kid or as they came out, and continued to avoid playing them due to being turned off by the fixed camera system, it has been an incredible look at where the modern titles came from. As a big fan of RE Biohazard and an enjoyer of Village even though it was a bit rough, playing the original RE remake for the fixed camera and RE2 remake for the story progression has been a really fun time! Wouldn’t have decided to give any of it a go if it wasn’t for your content, keep it up man! 💛
Makes it all worth it.
Nice analysis 👍
Thank you🌹🙏
Is that cry of fear soundtrack i hear in the background?😮
Yes, yes it is (and I love it)
I only have a little experience with fixed camera. To be honest, I don't like it that much when it comes to moving around and killing enemies, but I do love how cinematic it looks. It definitely makes the game more scary and appealing.
That's kinda the point. Especially classic SH and RE games are not meant to be "zombie shooters", as they are sooo often portrayed as nowadays. The combat is kinda secondary, risky aspect of SURVIVAL horror, and it revolves more about tactical choices, recognizing threats and opportunities, and usually about positioning and timing. In a way, it plays more like a board game, not a shoot'em up. Still, the main challenge and appeal usually lies in the semi-open ended exploration, problem solving and planning of your next course of action, all while juggling with the limited pool of supplies and unknown horrors that lurk.
I am not only worried about the Silent Hill 2 Remake, I am devastated and trying to get the SH2: Enhanced Edition.
6:17 Third person action cameras zooming in should honestly be a non issue. The walls should just go invisible. An example as old as 2001for this would be Bungies Oni.
You read my mind. Word for word ♡
Good argument, balanced, enough examples.
I especially like how you pinpoint the difference in terms of camera angle between Silent Hill and Biohazard
I’d like to mention that Code Veronica has more moving camera angles as far as I know
The intro of this video could have been lot more powerful and intense if you used the original visual effects from PS2 version, which really is something that acts in tandem with the fixed camera design.
Having said that, great video as usual! long time SH fan here :)
In conclusion, Resident Evil 4 killed the genre.
Silent Hill 2 sometimes uses camera angles for symbolism or thematic suggestion, too; something which will likely be lost in the remake, unfortunately.
Very good point. The mannequin with Mary's cardigan facing James when he finds the flashlight hanging from the cardigan pocket from Silent Hill 2 is a great example of this.
The overall sh2 remake is extremely far from being related to the source material. It's just a reboot with a RE Remake feeling
Maybe "Elastic Camera" would be a good term for it.
ALISA MENTIONED!!
also i really hope the sh2 remake has an option or even new game+ modifier that uses fixed camera angels
fuck man i was just about to sleep. it’s 4am but fuck it
Dino Crisis 1 actually had full 3d graphics, but its camera definitely was not as fancy as in SH.
wish there would be more games like silent hill series
Have you played lost in vivo? It's pretty good. Unfortunately no silent hill camera angles, if that's what you're onto
You mean like Resident Evil 1-Zero?
Or Fatal Frame franchise?
Or Tormented Souls?
Or Alisa:: The Awakening?
The SH2 remake not using fixed cameras is likely a rule instated by Konami tbh. Bloober has proven they can utilize them but Konami is sorta dumb lol
I personally dont mind the OTS for SH2 remake. Its just a modern look at the classic game. I would have preferred dynamic fixed cameras, sure. But as long as they work with the camera system im ok with it! :')
When we needed his SH takes the most, he returned!
Just wait for me to get to downpour's opening scene.
best thing to do is a mix of 3rd and fixed for the remake, keep the 3 person for most of the game when doing combat but add a sick fixed camera angle for specific scenes
No. That never works. Yes, it's been done countless times already, and it's always either disorientating, or just inefficient bandaid solution that results players scanning every corner in OTS view before moving.
Happened so already in 2005 with the Cold Fear, the earliest "RE4 clone" there was, and every other similar game since.
The Silent Hill devs were artists drawing from art and films, and they understood how to use a camera in the way films use it. Bloober is made up of game devs who only know how to imitate other games.
100% agree, the cinematography is something very much lost in modern over the shoulder style
love the intro 👌
Play Gravity Rush
The Fatal Frame series also has great camera work, in some ways helping to amplify a scary moment
This video should be a mandatory watch for anyone wanting to discuss the topic.
in classic RE, the camera and controls worked in concert. go to any stream of the RE1 remake on twitch and watch a first playthrough where the player picked "modern" controls and is getting a headache while fighting the camera angles the entire time
Yeah, it wasn't made for alternate controls but other games implement those controls way better and they work fine.
This is why i really like your channel. I've found myself saying the same thing over and over with respect to many aspects in life (not just videogames) and that is that there's a horrendous lack of artistry and creativity in most things these days. I suspect the sheer amount of stuff and having too much content now waters it down a fair bit, but it's more fhndamental than that.
For me art and creativity and expression is the only thing that makes life worth living and interesting to any real degree and i can't see why people would value anything above that if they were being truly honest.
Maybe it's all just in my head though.
Thanks. Ever since my god of war video Ive tried to be a channel you go to when you're thinking "why isn't anyone talking about x?". Whether positive or negative. Like, no one was talking about the weapon synergy caused by the headshot stagger change in RE4 remake.
People dont often talk about how important the camera work was in this older games and i want to be that voice. As much as I can, at least.
A whole generation of gamers have missed out on the true cinematic experience offered by great camera work. The kind of stuff that can really make or break immersion.
I do miss the times where Camera Angles were just as much a Core identity to a Video game as much as everything else and NOT because of engine limitation.
Nowadays it's all trend chasing and player convenience which don't get me wrong i really like experimenting with different camera designs in video games and i appreciate the game play convenience but was the sacrifice really worth it ?
I think people need to understand that some games,Especially Horror games compliments and are intentionally designed with said Camera angles in mind and I also think people just overall dislike and want to complain about Camera Designs for the wrong reasons and wanted every horror games to have THEIR favorite Camera Angle as if its a requirements without realizing said games might lose their charm if they were designed that way...and yes even Fixed Camera.
Like i don't think i would nearly as much enjoy games like Dead Space if it had Fixed Cameras or Amnesia if it was a Third person game instead of what they are actually design for, i.e One has Over the shoulder and the Other is First person and both remains as an excellent and immersive horror games despite both not having fixed camera angles.
I originally wasn’t upset that the Silent Hill 2 remake was going to be third person. I never played the original, so i thought it would be another Resident Evil 2 situation. (Context: the RE2 remake was my first RE game that i played and made me fall in love with the serious) However you really changed my mind! I never realized how dynamic the camera angles are. I am really disappointed that Silent Hill 2 remake is chasing the trends of the RE2 and Dead Space remake, but there’s still a chance that the remake can be enjoyable
It's crazy to me that developers have moved away from fixed camera angles with this big cinematic push games try to have now. It makes way more sense than a behind the shoulder camera for that type of game. They just have no faith in gamers to adapt to anything. If there were more of these types of games less people would complain and would probably learn to see the value in fixed cameras. Fixed cameras are better for certain types of games anyway like god of war for instance and obviously it's great for horror as well as artistic reasons. I'd take a fixed camera any day over a camera going up my ass in a combat heavy 3rd person action game like gow because you can actually see what the hell is going on around you. Also it just gives the game a more epic grand look.
What are your thoughts on the Silent Hill 2 Remake Gameplay Trailer?
I'll have a video out tomorrow
Great upload. I really wish silent hill 2 kept the OG camera. Its one of the biggest things that seperate silent hill from the rest. I am still looking forward to silent hill 2 remake but it is a pity.
1:03 this sums up every horror game these days 🤦♂️ !!!
I got unreasonably happy for the cry of fear music
Will you be checking out Alone in the Dark Mayo? Gmans video has me sold.
Really? I'll have to give it a look
This is what the description of silent hill 2 demake says on the PlayStation store.
“The remake moves from the original’s fixed camera viewpoints to an over-the-shoulder perspective, putting you closer to what James sees, for a more thrilling, more immersive experience as you explore the town and come face-to-face with monsters.”
God they REALLY have to try to sell it to us. Those old camera styles just were not THRILLING and IMMERSIVE.
This is honestly the number 1 reason why the new games will be good, but not great, and it's staggering that no one has really mentioned it before
edit: also, one of the biggest creep factors in the early SH games is when there is something gross in the background that you just can't perfectly focus your camera on.
Hey Mayo, are you going to play the new Alone in the Dark Game?
looking into it
If they recreate this one in the SH2 Remake, it'll be a awesome experience not just for players who've played the original. But to modern gamers who haven't experienced fixed camera angles. Can't for the mods to work on SH2 Remake.
That's true actually, people seriously underestimate the capabilities of newer generation to get into classic style of games and defend poor execution as "easier for the new players to understand".
Meanwhile I've seen a Vtuber who hasn't played any Silent Hill absolutely fall in love with these classic camera angles and gush over the presentation and atmosphere. How can the new gen get into something if you don't let them try?
It happens all the time. New people get into classic horror games easily.
Things that work for RE (over the shoulder) won't really work for SH's artistic style.
But here’s the thing. The SH2R does make use of camera angles from what we seen so far. It’s not like the older games exactly but still makes use of mystery and isn’t that what SH camera angles r for?
For example:
1. In the initial reveal trailer, at the end, James is walking slowly towards a gazebo but the camera is focused on him and his cautious walking. Later the camera lifts over his shoulder to quickly reveal Maria in a blurred image. This adds the sense that both us and James feel weary and can barely make out who it is but once we do get a closer look that’s when it hits James that Maria looks like Mary.
2. When James is jumping to the next fire exit in the combat trailer the camera angle is looking at James from below jusssstttt like the original.
3. There’s a few seconds of when James meets Eddie in the bathroom and is obscured by the cameras ANGLE and lack of focus.
So just bc the gameplay isn’t in a fixed camera angle doesn’t mean the cutscenes can’t be and keep in mind bloober r thinking of these angles. So if ur disappointed the remake is “modern” then at least enjoy the cutscenes and just try to have fun without going into it with a pessimistic view.
Because the cutscenes are supposed to be a "scene" hence uses film techniques to present themselves. The point of a proper game optimized to fixed cam is to make it feel as if you're playing a scene within a movie. To have it only be available as a cutscene just means "You can look but you can't touch", does that in any way fun to you?
Yes I know and that’s what I like about the trailer. Yes I also agree I do like the fixed angle bc it does indeed make u feel like ur watching Leon/james ect. but the new camera make u feel like UR James not just watching him go thru SH but UR IN SH with James .I mean im not treating a camera angle as, look but don’t touch, what is this a strip club?😂😂 I don’t see it that way. To have the cutscenes in this fashion pays homage to the original game and despite the gameplay camera being different there’s still SH vibes in the cutscenes to enjoy and I can appreciate that. I like the new more detailed and intimate look a 3rd person camera brings to SH and now in 4k. So yes it does look like fun thank u 😊
Over the shoulder camera worked for RE4 original because it was primarily action game, with lots of shooting.
Doesn't work as well for regular horror, or hacknslash likr God of War
I'm not saying Silent Hill wasn't particularly clever with its camera angles, but didn't most 3D fixed camera angle games play around with their camera angles to some extent since they were no longer bound by static 2D images? (And before that, the PS1 Final Fantasy games would occasionally overlay 3D characters on top of moving FMV backgrounds)
Even Code Veronica did some tracking and panning shots.
These types of camara angles always give me headache but I understand why it's loved
Understanding is all we're asking for. We regularly got mocked for saying we like this stuff even though we have strong reasons for it.
Alright, you know the drill: Top 25 Silent Hill Camera Angles PWEEEEEEEEAASSEE!
Thank you for this. Blooper Team are brain dead..
3:58 Kudos to you for giving Christophe Gans his flowers..
Have you ever played Lost in Vivo? It doesn’t have these camera angles (unfortunately) but it’s a pretty good Silent Hill inspired horror game!
It's on the recommendation list
Your gonna try Alone In The Dark? it seems faithful to the original games and the fact that both Gamespot and IGN didn't like it I gives me hope.
I'll give it a look
@@underthemayo Also maybe try playing Alone in the Dark: The New Nightmare. Originally came out on the PS1, has some very unique (for it's time) lighting design elements with the use of the torch, somehow the dev team got the light from the torch to interact with the pre-rendered backgrounds, illuminating the backgrounds somewhat 'realistically'. It's not the best survival horror game of that era with many frustrating aspects, but it could make for an interesting future video
you are truly 90s horror genre NERD , truly hardcore fan 👌👌
The new camera angles can be cinematic, up close and personal, and done very effectively. So just bc it doesn’t have fixed camera angles doesn’t mean it’s soulless. When fighting against enemies in this game the angle makes them feel far away. I’m not scared of an enemy far away I’m scared of an enemy that’s obviously close and I’ll feel that way thru the 3rd person camera close to James
>far away enemies are not scary
>Pyramid head introduction
You might as well make something first person if you wanna make something feel up close and personal. Not like Silent Hill 2 Remake uses its camera to great advantage in any way to present itself, compared to a lot of games that fully utilizes over the shoulder to effective degree (i.e Evil Within 2, The Last of Us), because of how boring and static it looks.
Man, stop trying to depress me. We all know the design in any SH game in the making will be complete ass. It's been ass since Homecoming and sure as well Konami won't bother to do jack shit
wish I had more to say, but this is just a good video. feels like all I could say was already said.
We need fixed angles back.
The Silent Hill 2 remake was going to get backlash even if it had a follow cam. Bloober Team is the SH fan's Lex Luthor.
Also, to be fair, all though Dino Crisis 1 is not a very good game it does use a similar camera to SH. It also has a follow cam.