SUBARU owners .. DETONATION could KILL your engine
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- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- Probably the most important video that I have ever done if you are going to modify your Subaru.
Detonation, pinking or knock is THE most destructive force inside an engine. This is what it sounds like and what you can do to hear it.
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You are probably the first person out there that has done a “ det “ sound recording. Brilliant this will help a lot of people 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
I think so in the Subaru world and particularly to have live datalog recording going at the same time. kinda proves me banging on about wearing det cans I think 👍
Andre Simon made a video about this with an audio sample a couple of years ago. He too is a strong advocate for Audio Knock Detection while tuning because even the latest ECU's still get it wrong. He was in a Nissan 350Z in his video.
I have heard from so many people in the US that their tuners don't use them, but are used to engines letting go. Strange that the dots aren't being joined up.
Thank you 🙏
i hated the fact that even after paying for a somehow expensive course they never demonstrated how it sounds, they said look for a popcorn popping sound when in fact it is closer to dropping corn in a muffled can, or closer to opening your mouth slightly while eating pop rocks (candy that crackle in mouth).
The other thing is, if you are relying on an after market ECU to detect knock, first step is to actually induce knock, and while listening to it you set the ECU threshold, so listening is an absolute must.
This video is gold to whoever is just starting to tune. Don't be scared to induce knock on low load to familiarize yourself with how it sound, engine isn't producing enough power to hurt itself immediately, but long exposure to soft knock will eat the boundary layer and destroy the piston. try do it it for 10 seconds or so, record it and keep listening to it, at first it is hard especially soft knock but it will become natural.
Absolutely. Inducing this first stage of Det is the normal tuning process ... then obviously wind it back for safety 👌👍
Engine tuner here. I only work on Saab's and also use a block Mic when doing high HP tunes. The Saab Trionic ECU's use Ionisation measurement on each cyl and in general the ecu reacts super fast (even quicker than i can pick it up). With some of the cars i work on being nearly 30 years old its really cool that they are this advanced.
That is cool 😎👍
2:58-3:00...what that it!?
Holy cow, that was subtle!
And THAT has the capacity to kill your engine quick!
Super helpful video Duncan, thank you!
Yeah, that's the start of it. That's the point to stop adding timing or leaning it out. That was a single gear pull on the dyno, through multiple gears in the real world it would get worse and much louder cracks of Det would happen rather than this sparkle.
The sparkle should be heard by the ecu and action should be taken by it but as you can see it didn't. That would kill the engine. It might not happen as quickly as massive det but it will kill it all the same.
Thanks Fred ..chat soon 🙏
Another great video from a top bloke! I remember 3 years ago you did my mapping on my WRX Hawkeye, you took the time out to explain everything you did and how it works. I can't thank you enough!
Thanks Josh. Glad you enjoyed it. Hope the car is still running strong 😎
I've been waiting for this video for months 👌
I hope it didn't disappoint 😁😁🙏
The mic in the detcans sounds perfect 👌
thanks mate. It picked up the sound perfectly 😁👍
I'm having flashbacks after watching that 😂
Great video!
thanks mate 🙏 and yeah yours was much worse 😱
Many stock Subaru roms disable feedback (and fine) knock correction slightly above 6k rpm
The iam rough correction gets dropped beyond 5500 as std but feedback and particularly fine learning continue until 6800 rpm on this rom. The ecu will will still make some corrections if It hears something. The point with this video is that the ecu doesn't hear everything and certainly shouldn't be trusted as the only source of determination as to whether it is detonating. It is irresponsible to trust the ecu that way.
16bit ecus r notorious for detecting balls and not knock 😂😂while the 32bit detect sometimes even the gear change for knock. Even if I have to go around the block I use knock monitor and headphones 🎧🎧 when tuning any sort of car. Excellent video and very very informative for subaru users ❤❤
Exactly mate, you can run over a rabbit and the ecu detects phanton knock, engine on the verge of getting sent to the moon and sees nothing. the inconsistencies are scary. What isn't inconsistant is your det cans and hearing.
Lol yeah. Scary that some people rely on or trust the ecu though 😱
Very interesting video!! I can clearly hear the "sizzlin bacon" sound!! I have a stock 2021 STi and have watched numerous youtube tuners go balls to the wall but I'm not a tuner and don't know what or why they're doing whatever they're doing but this what you've shown makes 100% sense to me!!!
Thanks for that Greg. Yeah I have no idea why some tuners will do that .. maybe it is for 'content' but to me it is an irresponsible level of trust in a potentially deaf ecu.
@@racedynamix I just had a crazy thought of using the car stereo as an input and listening to the engine on your speakers and after a couple minutes googling I found this! Specifically the 1 minute mark LOL! ruclips.net/video/yfvrSEdrPU0/видео.html
Good video duncan,
This is why ive made some 👍
Great to hear..thanks Colin 🙏🙏
This is amazing!
thanks mate 🙏 I hope it helps people 👍
Bloody hell I am going to have to drive my car wearing det cans now lol
lol
Great video and thank you. Can you
Tell please,where to attach the det cans on the engine?
Almost anywhere is good. The sound carries very well. I bolt mine to the top of the inlet manifold by the intercooler bracket 👍
Fantastic video..!!! So that’s just the initial crackle of Det? So the worse the Det is the more obvious is it sounds?
@@tomeaton7139 Yes, exactly. Proper det is much kiuder, much clearer sound. This sound says "enough timing thank you"
@@racedynamix so when your working on timing are you always trying to take it to the point of starting Det? Before pulling it back slightly for safety.
@@tomeaton7139 yes. When I hear this sparkle, that is the max timing then I take it back a bit for safety margin.
The endless videos i see on youtube of to the moon tuners who do this everytime is shocking. If I were a tuner and someone just spent 20k on their engine build and just shoved 40psi through it for content and numbers without this essential tool, and then sent the piston and rods to the moon shortly after, i wouldn't sleep at night. Costs like 50 dollars to make.
Absolutely Ben. Thanks for watching 🙏
Great vid, 👍
thanks Mel 🙏
every subaru owner with a air intake asking why their DAM values are skewed. the detonation is not optimal. air intakes slow down air velocity, the MAF sensor reads it low and tells the engine to use less fuel. the presence of unmetered oxygen ignites and overheats the piston rings, cylinder walls gradually....
@@06wrxRAR exactly. all of those need tuning / mapping 👍
When i bought my wrx. Someone had put a little tune on it or its because the o2 sensors was not working and the fuel graph was off the scale on the rollers. The mapper i used first stopped doing mapping because they caused problems with there cars. I was new to the scene at the time and car had engine knock at no. 16 if thats right and det and took 2 hours to map and make it better. They put the wrong year map on it and had wavey boost. They only map to 260bhp on a wrx and because they had a case against them by damaging a engine after it was mapped.
Cost me double though with 260 not enough and to put it right. upto 290bhp
😊👌
@@michaelbaker6723 I am not sure what you are meaning saying knock at number16 but yeah there have been lots of so called Mappers over the years that have tried to map subarus. Most have disappeared now thankfully.
@@racedynamix I can’t remember im sure they said about a number needed to be zero. But it might of been something else but at the time it was showing alot of knock. I like mappers who can map a car and not these bedroom mappers that buy the map and put it on your. My toy now is a motorbike and i had that on the rollers.
old skool "pinking" sound
👍👍
Hi I like your videos I have a question why my subaru has overbosst/fuel cut how I can put more boost but no cut my fuel
Hi.. what model and year is yours ?
I know it’s a little off topic but I wanted to know what’s your opinion on the vf 34 on v6 Stis worth the consideration or just keeping the stock vf24 and maybe send it for a rebuild when needed ?
Thx for the great content you put out for us absolutely grew into a big fan of the channel!
Hi.. There isn't a huge amount of difference between the two turbos tbh, or at least not enough of a difference to warrant change imo. Rebuild/hybrid it when needed I reckon 😎
Thanks for the quick heads up! Was always wondering if the ball- bearing design would be worth the upgrade as it’s a oem+ upgrade I was keen on getting someone knowledgeable to give his insight! Thanks again. In one of your recent videos you said magic number for classics in your opinion was around 100 less than newage, is it because of the need to swap a 6 speed in a classic at that point or what’s your reasoning if I might ask? :)
Hi . just bought a 2010 wrx hatch 2.5 with a very smokey engine blue smoke), been messed with sti injectors and intercooler claimed 300 bhp not had a chance to strip it down yet fingers crossed the block is not toast🤞 . can the original map be put back on the ecu is that something you could do for me once the engine has been sorted ? 👍
@@johnbickle4654 Yeah easy enough to revert the map to std. I doubt whether it was anywhere near 300 with the std turbo 👍👍
idk anyone in the US that uses Det cnas which is alarming. and a lot of them turn off knock sensors because of “ghost knock” which is eveb more alarming. its scary out here.
Yeah that would scare the heck out of me... 😱
Hi I bought a 2003 2.0 wrx sti type uk and it has the ppp installed. Am led to believe that the ecu is locked and cannot be remapped! Is this the case? I was looking to add a bigger turbo clutch and injectors and fuel pump and induction kit to try get near 400hp. The car has 76k on it. Is there any options for me to achieve this or there abouts
Hi. Not locked to me 😂😁
turbo... needed to get 400 but your std Vf35 should do 350, just depends on how close to 400 you want.
Injectors.. your std injectors will get you to almost 400.. again it depends on how close to 400.
clutch.. std clutch will hold that power. Replace with Exedy pink when/if it goes imo.
Fuel pump will definitely be needed.
FMIC would help.
Obviously needs mapping/tuning.
Hth 👍
Was the car on pump or ethanol? Is the knock resistance of ethanol enough to overcome the lack of sensitivity of the knock sensor?
This was on pump fuel. Ethanol tends not to det in quite the same way but still the same issues of the std ecu being deaf to it on occasion 👍
Could you remotely tune my subi ?
yes mate.. if you sign up for the Academy .. there is a remote tune option 👍
Do you know any tuners in WA that you know use the detcans?
Where is WA ? Western Australia ? I am afraid I don't..sorry 😔
@@racedynamix I’m from Washington State, US. Any recommendations would be lovely, definitely.
Hey Duncan, what’s your experience with aftermarket ECU’s and det control control? Have you seen instances where they don’t respond to det too, or is their det control much more reliable (obviously ecu dependant)?
He's mentioned that the syvecs ecus are really good, link not so great, but I bet he still wears det cans!
@@phillynn5923 absolutely, would be silly to not use them regardless. I’m on Emtron personally, just wondering if there’s some aftermarket ECU’s that are seeing all knock events.
Regardless of the ecu u have to calibrate and set the thresholds for the knock levels and this can only be done by using det cans or knock monitor .... Only then u can rely on the ecu knock detection and corrections .
@@WAGONNOS I know this, what I’m trying to establish is the reliability of those ECU’s once this has been set. Will they catch every event, and are some more reliable than others?
The aftermarket ecus vary tbh, some have knock control that is simply awesome and can be relied on to protect the engine. Others are less so where knock control has been added as an after thought. I will be doing a video at some point soon (ish) on that.
All require background noise levels being set up and sensitivity set up so as to ensure they pick up real det and do something about it before it goes beyond the sound heard in the video.