Also the pink 350Z and the R33 wide arch are Andy Barnes's cars and he is a good friend of ours, sumo power have their new HKS pink GTR dragger so that record wont be around for much longer, we are only after the RB25 record atm....
@svt11111 Thats why vipers are still in the 230mph range in the standing mile while Supras are in the 240s, Lambos are in the 250s and the Ford GT is at 267. And no SW didn't stick a 6 speed or IRS on his car because thats what the car came with from the factory. If you look at the specs of SWs Supra it wasn't fully gutted at all. There are photos on Supraforms for Christ's sakes! The race weight of the Supra was 3200lbs.
This is cush an awesome video. All of the cars purely represent what Japan is capable of! People get the wrong idea of how well these cars can perform.
Twin superchargers, Holley blower, air intakes, nitrous oxide system, race tires, titanium pipes, lightweight body, I removed everything, the door panels, passenger's seat, back seat, dashboard, even the trunk interior was removed, I only have the speedos and gauges needed for the superchargers and nitrous oxide.That's about just the simple list, I have many more mods, and as for my time, I called up my brother, he told me 7.950.
I was there at JapShow Finale, and there definately was not a car that went faster that the GTC in the 4WD class. Shame Dee Ireland's Supra gave up the ghost, would have been nice to see that in action. Got up close to the ChargeSpeed one though, and Tim Webster almost ran me over, so I'm happy :)
The guy who owns (i think its still current) the 3rd quickest GTR in the world has that feature. Look up GTR700 drag, FOX drag combat final video. The commentators even discuss it.
Yeah man,the Muscle definitely is the best option in drag racing.There is just no substitute for displacement.I at the moment own an Audi 200TQ,but im hoping that one day i will have the honor to own a 70` Charger R/T with a blower,most likely Weiand.
The R32, R33 and R34 all have the same RB26DETT engine. Also the R32 is the lightest at 1480kg, the R33 at 1530kg and the R34 at 1540kg-1580kg depending on the specs.
the song at 1:58 isnt under an real catagory, but you can find it by typing in the search bar "wild" or to find many loops like this type in "long" another good lop thats very hard tp find is called "motorcross" check it out, and "three pointer" is awesome
@ronkerjake I agree with your opinion. But you'll be amazed by how much power you can squeeze out from the 2JZ-GTE, even with stock turbines. Aftermarket turbines, well you already know whats gonna happen. I guess when you have that much potential under the hood naturally most people would want to show it off. 1/4 mile drag is the easiest way to do so.
i cant believe how important tuning is. I see so many young kids bolting on big turbos and not seeing any kind of engine management. Shep and Rau are the shit 6-7 sec quarters. DSM rules the show
I agree. I would doubt that most of the people would make the comments that they do if they were standing in front of the person they are commenting on.
Im sure a good combo will be an aluminum v6, destroked to 3.25" stroke with a 4.125" bore.. thats 4.3 liters there and Itll probably weigh as much as a boosted iron I-4.. maybe less.... making more power, safely if it has a valvetrain setup to make power up at 7500/8000rpms.. Thatll be a nice substitue for a Lotus Exige..
@Weazell.... hmmm i deffinetly agree with you on that ive gotten into numerous arguements about this, people just refuse to believe a 6,500lb diesel pickup will beat their little ricer
Of course Muscle cars can do that, there is no replacement for displacement. But this IS impressive, because they have much, MUCH smaller engines. And to run those times is still very noteworthy.
@TestECull If they like their paint jobs like that fine with them. If their car is built for the 1320 that's fine with them. Actually those who drift usually have very good cornering machines. When you have a big turbo it is normal that you put a bigger exhaust than stock.
Personally I like High Tech, so the more valves and more electronics, the more turbos, superchargers and whatever else you can dream up, is better. And if you can make it larger then it really flies. BUT then there is the budget. $100,000 a motor just to do a rebuild is just not in everybody's budget.
@mike623030 a few of the imports are worthy of running with the v8's like the Supra,which is RWD and its motor,the 2jzgte,is capable of making 980+hp on it's stock block
@svt11111 And its a record breaking 7 second car. There are 6 speed Supras in the 8s all boost on E85 that are full weight like the GSS Supra. Also most serious drag racing cars have 2 steps, everything from Cobras, Z06s, Camaros etc.
@svt11111 One last thing, the record is who gets the best time, not how they do it or what they use to get there. Because of that the Supra hold the record not a Viper or Vette or anything else. And its not like its a big deal either because there are full weight 6 speed Supras not on the bottle that are doing low 8s.
well ive got a nissan silvia s13 with a rb 25 in it and i find the iron blocks to hold alot of boost im running 23psi and it holds up like a charm. i have no reason to complain!! ill post vids soon of it drifting
American muscle is way more reliable after market wise, i still like imports but but when you over tune them they tend to cause more problems. still very nice run with the skyline
Well IDK about these guys, but in the NHRA, the top fuelers running over 300 mph (has been over 330 mph) with the car dancing all over the lane, it looks damn fast to me and those boys look like they have their hands full, and then some.
I wasnt thinking of a skyline I-6 when I was talking about lightness, (I'm not a fan of Iron block engines, even though that Iron block is what allows it to take such massive boost) I was thinking more of something like lotus elise, areal atom, ect.. simply a matter of preference, I like small light quick cars that are fun to drive and can still return good mpg... and sadly, in America, that is a losing combo (small cars are looked down upon here) oh well, life goes on
very nice, i respect mucles like that - i really like the hemi cuda ('70) but if i were to have any car under like 100,000, even 50,000 it would have to be something like a supra, rx7, or a silvia.
@lions66666 The fact that it's import has nothing to do with it. The R33 Skyline uses an electronic AWD and traction control system. So, running that much power through the drive train causes the traction control to freak out. Had they dumped that kind of power into a Supra, they would have posted a much better time.
@TheCourtneyCG I agree. But it depends on what you're using them for. Supras are definitely better for drifitng but skylines will win in acceleration. (This is assuming stock settup)
No need to be insulting, now, I was talking about normal or sports cars, not super cars.. the ssc aero is a 700,000 dollar supercar with almost 1,200 hp (200 more than veyron) so it should be able to beat its top speed! Same with the Viper aCR, huge 8 litre V-10 (much bigger engine than anything else in top ten)= speed, nurburgring is a high speed course after all. I'm just tired of america using monster power or displacement to win its battles.
All these jingles are from a program that can only be found on later model macintosh computers, the program is called garageband and is STRICTLY( which sucks) for macs
@Adam781 you don't need to, maybe i exagerated but from a sports car point of veiw it makes sense. ya a honda insight isn't going to do laps around lambos but compared to the US they have us beat. these cars were ment to be modified and so a tube chassis means nothing really. most people that have the money to buy a nice supra aren't looking to keep it stock or keep the setup thats on it. Asia made theyre cars to be personalized. Scion is a great ex. just a new one. what about florida?
I hear you bro, m not disputing you,Even OLD 60's Nova, if u put enough cash with POlY bushings and suspension kit/air suspension, you can go around a corner just as good as an RX8, i just brought up straight line performance cuz this video is about drag racing, if this was an auto cross video i wouldnt of said what i said.. got me?
I knocked 5 psi out of my rear tyre and went from 13.5 at 106mph to 10 flat at 145mph - I then held hands with a friend and we 'believed together' to get into the 8's.
HP = Torque x RPM . . . so considering your car does like 9000rpm, and a cummins will turn 3500 on a good day, that means to beat your horsepower figure, he needs almost 3x more max torque. And he makes it from 250rpm all the way to 3500, not just from 7000 to 9000. All that weight is nothing for a engine that has the potential to put out 2000ftlbs
To be fair, the Americans sell WAY more vehicles than any other nation. The Ford F150 pickup is America's best selling vehicle, always has been. The world's best selling most years since WWII. Best selling "car" is a slight-of-hand trick, because cars don't outsell trucks.
i disagree. if you think cars handle like in arcade games whereas they wont spin out when the throttle is pressed down fully or even during high speed cornering, you are just wrong. Drivers have to control their arms and legs to control the cars they want to. Also, in drag races, the drivers will have to manage the sudden g-force when they accelerate at full throttle.
it depends on the class they race under. a world record under a class where you are alloweed to use different specs is uncompareable... otherwise a top fuel car would have the world record
yeah, i got you. and i want a '70 nova, but not for autocross. something about rwd, a half of a frame, and a chevy V8 pulling the front wheels off the ground... mmm.
i dunno i think im gonna put a home made cold air intake, a plywood bodykit and a 2x4 wing... and maybe a few stickers, each one add like 5 rwhp right?
Well, thank you for clearing that up. By the way, you didn't have to make it personal. Is it too hard for you to disagree with someone and yet be polite?
also if ya fix the exterior fo reasonable purposes ie. Bodykit fo the reason of fittin da turbo and/or mor airway, that aint no rice especially wen a car is built fo racing: Supra, Skyline etc.
hey i got a project for my chemistry class and i chose how chemistry is involved in racing and i would like to talk about how carbon fiber parts, nitrous, and race tires are made. i would like you guys to let me know if im missing something THANKS.
@cfranchitti This skyline is beyond taking corners too, just so you know. Any car doing eight seconds in the quarter is going to handle like a dump truck. I don't care who made it.
well,yeah,but imagine gliding around turns at 80,or holding a car side ways at 50,there are more things than just straight lines.Though having the skin pulled back on your face is fun too.
I agree with the weight of the v12's but i disagree that almost any car goes quickly around corners. Look at all the v8 muscle cars; none of them are quik on circuit, only in str8 line
Ummm it does.... How can you obtain weight? its how strong gravity pulls against an object with no gravity nothing will heave weight. Yes weight does get shifted but ultimately its the gravity that increase that weight more to allow for more traction. All Lateral acceleration will cause some sort of a G-force but unless you're going stupidly quick you wont feel it
I will admit most of the video was dull. But that R33 skyline at 9:58 was worth it all. THATS A PROPER SOUNDING IMPORT. I'd swear it was just shy of a Formula 1 exhaust note.
AHHH yes. It has a genuine GTR chassis still. Do you know what a tube frame chassis is?? It means it is a completely new car mad out of tubes. Nothing the same as a supra. Its just got a fibreglass shell on it to make it look like a supra. There isnt a single supra part in the WHOLE car. Street based cars is more what i ment.
AAAHHH! Skylines and Supras, my all time faves. Excellent footage of Japan's finest.
got to take my hat off to you guys. i'm not into all the high tech turbo stuff myself, but you can't argue with numbers like that.
I agree, people dont realize how heavy modern cars are. On top of that when you put a too small motor for all that weight, you have a lot to overcome.
Also the pink 350Z and the R33 wide arch are Andy Barnes's cars and he is a good friend of ours, sumo power have their new HKS pink GTR dragger so that record wont be around for much longer, we are only after the RB25 record atm....
THANK YOU!!! finally, someone who actually knows the difference between ricing and tuning. AMEN BROTHA!!
@svt11111 Thats why vipers are still in the 230mph range in the standing mile while Supras are in the 240s, Lambos are in the 250s and the Ford GT is at 267. And no SW didn't stick a 6 speed or IRS on his car because thats what the car came with from the factory. If you look at the specs of SWs Supra it wasn't fully gutted at all. There are photos on Supraforms for Christ's sakes! The race weight of the Supra was 3200lbs.
sound in 1.44 . is oh my god.. FANTASTIC
This is cush an awesome video. All of the cars purely represent what Japan is capable of! People get the wrong idea of how well these cars can perform.
this is heaven for any tuner fanatic
Twin superchargers, Holley blower, air intakes, nitrous oxide system, race tires, titanium pipes, lightweight body, I removed everything, the door panels, passenger's seat, back seat, dashboard, even the trunk interior was removed, I only have the speedos and gauges needed for the superchargers and nitrous oxide.That's about just the simple list, I have many more mods, and as for my time, I called up my brother, he told me 7.950.
I was there at JapShow Finale, and there definately was not a car that went faster that the GTC in the 4WD class.
Shame Dee Ireland's Supra gave up the ghost, would have been nice to see that in action.
Got up close to the ChargeSpeed one though, and Tim Webster almost ran me over, so I'm happy :)
The guy who owns (i think its still current) the 3rd quickest GTR in the world has that feature. Look up GTR700 drag, FOX drag combat final video. The commentators even discuss it.
RX-7 and honda S2000 hv been my all tome fav..
Yeah man,the Muscle definitely is the best option in drag racing.There is just no substitute for displacement.I at the moment own an Audi 200TQ,but im hoping that one day i will have the honor to own a 70` Charger R/T with a blower,most likely Weiand.
The R32, R33 and R34 all have the same RB26DETT engine. Also the R32 is the lightest at 1480kg, the R33 at 1530kg and the R34 at 1540kg-1580kg depending on the specs.
the song at 1:58 isnt under an real catagory, but you can find it by typing in the search bar "wild" or to find many loops like this type in "long" another good lop thats very hard tp find is called "motorcross" check it out, and "three pointer" is awesome
@ronkerjake
I agree with your opinion.
But you'll be amazed by how much power you can squeeze out from the 2JZ-GTE, even with stock turbines. Aftermarket turbines, well you already know whats gonna happen.
I guess when you have that much potential under the hood naturally most people would want to show it off. 1/4 mile drag is the easiest way to do so.
i cant believe how important tuning is. I see so many young kids bolting on big turbos and not seeing any kind of engine management. Shep and Rau are the shit 6-7 sec quarters. DSM rules the show
I agree. I would doubt that most of the people would make the comments that they do if they were standing in front of the person they are commenting on.
Im sure a good combo will be an aluminum v6, destroked to 3.25" stroke with a 4.125" bore.. thats 4.3 liters there and
Itll probably weigh as much as a boosted iron I-4.. maybe less.... making more power, safely if it has a valvetrain setup to make power up at 7500/8000rpms..
Thatll be a nice substitue for a Lotus Exige..
@Weazell.... hmmm i deffinetly agree with you on that ive gotten into numerous arguements about this, people just refuse to believe a 6,500lb diesel pickup will beat their little ricer
Of course Muscle cars can do that, there is no replacement for displacement.
But this IS impressive, because they have much, MUCH smaller engines. And to run those times is still very noteworthy.
ahhhhhh sweet swwet santa pod. ive been to a vauxhall car show there about a year ago when i was 11 nd had the time of my life
@TestECull If they like their paint jobs like that fine with them. If their car is built for the 1320 that's fine with them. Actually those who drift usually have very good cornering machines. When you have a big turbo it is normal that you put a bigger exhaust than stock.
Personally I like High Tech, so the more valves and more electronics, the more turbos, superchargers and whatever else you can dream up, is better. And if you can make it larger then it really flies.
BUT then there is the budget. $100,000 a motor just to do a rebuild is just not in everybody's budget.
I dont know if your talking about the recording being for this car, but the Red Victor 1 does the 1/4 mile in 7.8, and still being street legal
@mike623030 a few of the imports are worthy of running with the v8's like the Supra,which is RWD and its motor,the 2jzgte,is capable of making 980+hp on it's stock block
@svt11111 And its a record breaking 7 second car. There are 6 speed Supras in the 8s all boost on E85 that are full weight like the GSS Supra. Also most serious drag racing cars have 2 steps, everything from Cobras, Z06s, Camaros etc.
and don't forget that the tires, and the tire pressure might have something to say on the scoreboard too.
FUKIN ridiculous...turbos, speed, style...OMFG..luv it.
@svt11111 One last thing, the record is who gets the best time, not how they do it or what they use to get there. Because of that the Supra hold the record not a Viper or Vette or anything else. And its not like its a big deal either because there are full weight 6 speed Supras not on the bottle that are doing low 8s.
it was a world record for the r33 gt-r at the time, i think theyre in the high 7's now
@Kamei2 this one has three things... awd, 6 cylinders, and the fact its a datsun
Viper twin turbo 1900 hp 7.99 1/4 mile. Did it in July the year before.
@cfranchitti second part is so true, and they wonder why people choose the safer more managable better handling and much much cheaper imports.
well ive got a nissan silvia s13 with a rb 25 in it and i find the iron blocks to hold alot of boost im running 23psi and it holds up like a charm. i have no reason to complain!! ill post vids soon of it drifting
because u cant never get enough of a supra and the power that it produces
American muscle is way more reliable after market wise, i still like imports but but when you over tune them they tend to cause more problems. still very nice run with the skyline
Well IDK about these guys, but in the NHRA, the top fuelers running over 300 mph (has been over 330 mph) with the car dancing all over the lane, it looks damn fast to me and those boys look like they have their hands full, and then some.
look at the Skyline final race that guy had like 2 feet advantage when the light turn green he was moving his car forward little by little
I wasnt thinking of a skyline I-6 when I was talking about lightness, (I'm not a fan of Iron block engines, even though that Iron block is what allows it to take such massive boost) I was thinking more of something like lotus elise, areal atom, ect.. simply a matter of preference, I like small light quick cars that are fun to drive and can still return good mpg... and sadly, in America, that is a losing combo (small cars are looked down upon here) oh well, life goes on
...gt4's and alltracs are killer cars to work with
this was filmed b4 the viper done it just wasn't posted on here straight away
very nice, i respect mucles like that - i really like the hemi cuda ('70) but if i were to have any car under like 100,000, even 50,000 it would have to be something like a supra, rx7, or a silvia.
ZR1 specs
Weight : 3348.8 lbs
Horsepower: 620 bhp ; 101 bhp / liter
Torque: 595 ft lbs
Engine: LS9 90º V 8 ; 6.162 liter / 376 cu in supercharged
Power to weight : 0.41 bhp / kg
HP/ Liter: 101 bhp / liter
GTR Spec-V specs
Weight: 3703.8 lbs
Horsepower: 485 bhp
Torque: 434 ft lbs
Engine: VR38DETT V 6 ; 3.799 liter / 231.8 cu inch, twin turbo
Power to weight: 0.29 bhp / kg
HP/Liter: 128 bhp / liter
guys this record has been beat, the new record is an r32 gtr ran a 7.5, his name is reece mc gregor
@lions66666 The fact that it's import has nothing to do with it. The R33 Skyline uses an electronic AWD and traction control system. So, running that much power through the drive train causes the traction control to freak out. Had they dumped that kind of power into a Supra, they would have posted a much better time.
sorry correction.. tynan's subaru wrx impreza has just done a new p.b 7.69
yea it was something like 11.183 secs @ 134.03mph (6:36), off hand.
Not bad for a front wheel drive.
Straight 6 engines are almost a thing of the past sadly. Soon they will be a rare engine to have.
they may be fast, but man when you roll up in the rolls, cant be beat
that shows you what traction with an awd does. i saw a supra run a 10.2xx at 168
Ive been asking that question for months, good luck
yes the corvette is truly a great car... ill admit it is one of the best cars ever made.. although personally i prefer tuners.
@TheCourtneyCG I agree. But it depends on what you're using them for. Supras are definitely better for drifitng but skylines will win in acceleration. (This is assuming stock settup)
No need to be insulting, now, I was talking about normal or sports cars, not super cars.. the ssc aero is a 700,000 dollar supercar with almost 1,200 hp (200 more than veyron) so it should be able to beat its top speed! Same with the Viper aCR, huge 8 litre V-10 (much bigger engine than anything else in top ten)= speed, nurburgring is a high speed course after all. I'm just tired of america using monster power or displacement to win its battles.
All these jingles are from a program that can only be found on later model macintosh computers, the program is called garageband and is STRICTLY( which sucks) for macs
that place = heaven for me!
@Adam781 you don't need to, maybe i exagerated but from a sports car point of veiw it makes sense. ya a honda insight isn't going to do laps around lambos but compared to the US they have us beat. these cars were ment to be modified and so a tube chassis means nothing really. most people that have the money to buy a nice supra aren't looking to keep it stock or keep the setup thats on it. Asia made theyre cars to be personalized. Scion is a great ex. just a new one. what about florida?
I hear you bro, m not disputing you,Even OLD 60's Nova, if u put enough cash with POlY bushings and suspension kit/air suspension, you can go around a corner just as good as an RX8, i just brought up straight line performance cuz this video is about drag racing, if this was an auto cross video i wouldnt of said what i said.. got me?
nice...the R33 and the Big block Chevy Supra
this is true just look at the lack of quality and effort to keep origional to the older muscle car bodies i was disapointed
Maye it is because the skyline had a little more power and double the ways to put it on the road. I think.
I knocked 5 psi out of my rear tyre and went from 13.5 at 106mph to 10 flat at 145mph - I then held hands with a friend and we 'believed together' to get into the 8's.
@Twixx32 Thats incorrect v6s make more torque than inline 6s.
damn i wanna see that skyline vs. the norris design evo! great vid!
that supra was a beast in the end, spinning 3rd
I've seen an HKS tuned skyline doing a quarter mile in 7.95s at 181 mph
HP = Torque x RPM . . . so considering your car does like 9000rpm, and a cummins will turn 3500 on a good day, that means to beat your horsepower figure, he needs almost 3x more max torque. And he makes it from 250rpm all the way to 3500, not just from 7000 to 9000. All that weight is nothing for a engine that has the potential to put out 2000ftlbs
To be fair, the Americans sell WAY more vehicles than any other nation. The Ford F150 pickup is America's best selling vehicle, always has been. The world's best selling most years since WWII. Best selling "car" is a slight-of-hand trick, because cars don't outsell trucks.
i disagree. if you think cars handle like in arcade games whereas they wont spin out when the throttle is pressed down fully or even during high speed cornering, you are just wrong. Drivers have to control their arms and legs to control the cars they want to. Also, in drag races, the drivers will have to manage the sudden g-force when they accelerate at full throttle.
thats why you build your internals.... but with that much power your right
it depends on the class they race under.
a world record under a class where you are alloweed to use different specs is uncompareable... otherwise a top fuel car would have the world record
yeah, i got you. and i want a '70 nova, but not for autocross. something about rwd, a half of a frame, and a chevy V8 pulling the front wheels off the ground... mmm.
@unaccurate Just a tip... Download Firefox and the Adblock Pro addon. Presto! No more annoying adds!
i dunno i think im gonna put a home made cold air intake, a plywood bodykit and a 2x4 wing... and maybe a few stickers, each one add like 5 rwhp right?
Thanks for posting this video.
Well, thank you for clearing that up. By the way, you didn't have to make it personal. Is it too hard for you to disagree with someone and yet be polite?
You can get an old FC running that for about $12k total, including the cost of the car.
Yeah You guys have to remember Skylines n Supras have Straight 6s. not V6s.
and beside that Franchitti is right.
also if ya fix the exterior fo reasonable purposes ie. Bodykit fo the reason of fittin da turbo and/or mor airway, that aint no rice especially wen a car is built fo racing: Supra, Skyline etc.
hey i got a project for my chemistry class and i chose how chemistry is involved in racing and i would like to talk about how carbon fiber parts, nitrous, and race tires are made. i would like you guys to let me know if im missing something THANKS.
@DerHamsterHamburg yes mate,its in the UK :)
@cfranchitti This skyline is beyond taking corners too, just so you know.
Any car doing eight seconds in the quarter is going to handle like a dump truck. I don't care who made it.
R33 uses and RB class engine. It is a straight 6.
well,yeah,but imagine gliding around turns at 80,or holding a car side ways at 50,there are more things than just straight lines.Though having the skin pulled back on your face is fun too.
I agree with the weight of the v12's but i disagree that almost any car goes quickly around corners. Look at all the v8 muscle cars; none of them are quik on circuit, only in str8 line
@unaccurate get rid of add by getting kaspersky internet security or using firefox with a plug in
Ummm it does.... How can you obtain weight? its how strong gravity pulls against an object with no gravity nothing will heave weight. Yes weight does get shifted but ultimately its the gravity that increase that weight more to allow for more traction. All Lateral acceleration will cause some sort of a G-force but unless you're going stupidly quick you wont feel it
the finale was sweet. Nissan rules!
Must be a track record. Reece Mcgregor from NZ holds the current world record at 7.57. Go NZ and Croydons!
i need the sound track for this video.. the video is sick. the music makes it better
@cfranchitti im sure somones said this b4 so i wont be a dick about it but
they are inline 6;s they are a whole lot different than v 6's
@BIHxJDMxSUPRA No matter what/how you say it, no 7 second supra is a "street car". Just because you throw on some street wheels doesn't make it one.
I will admit most of the video was dull. But that R33 skyline at 9:58 was worth it all. THATS A PROPER SOUNDING IMPORT. I'd swear it was just shy of a Formula 1 exhaust note.
That car has one sick vtec!!!! Probably twin vtec.
i have a r33 and it is a great car on locg trips.
AHHH yes. It has a genuine GTR chassis still.
Do you know what a tube frame chassis is?? It means it is a completely new car mad out of tubes. Nothing the same as a supra. Its just got a fibreglass shell on it to make it look like a supra. There isnt a single supra part in the WHOLE car. Street based cars is more what i ment.
i think the record by an r33 is in the 7 second range, by the hks r33 running the hks high deck block
@svt11111 Thats in your opinion. Its easy to do 7s with a 8.4L. It takes a lot of skill to do it with a 3.0L