Was I wrong about the W140 S class?
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- Опубликовано: 23 авг 2019
- Is the W140 a better car than I thought it was?
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I have a 98 s600 and have spent a pretty penny keeping it alive but no car i have ever owned has bought me the joy that car does at tbe end of the day its all about the effort you want to put into that relationship my wife isnt cheap and often gives me headachs but i keep her around as well
i own a model of 92. (velvet interior withouth options) andd i looove it.... no lot of options but LWB and 406 HP engine
w140 its cheapest of M-B 600 in maintain cost !!!! (i own w220 in more) ..
im sure w221 or old w100 is worst in prices.
@@alanaliyev456GT do you not have electric heated seats,or bose hifi sunroof e.t.c
@@alanaliyev456GT If yours is a 600SE or SEL 91-92 ,you claim 406 hp ,it is 408hp . From late 92 -93 ,HP was 402 ,from 94 up it was 397/6 hp .
Additionally for your Knowledge:
The very 1st 5 Pagani Zonda C12's ,received the un-modified same 408HP engine , 1 is still in one of those cars today ,i believe it is Mr Pagani's own car.
Now go Celebrate ,you just gained an extra 2HP,lol.
@@raycroal yes but in France.( If my memory dont fail) 600 had lot of SERIAL GEAR.... i have boose sono.. rear front heat seat.....i m just surcto have onre option : REAR AIR COOLED BLOCK
When i drove w140 first i felt i am like a king or boss
I remember when I was 23 years old I would go test drive them and felt the same way, like the best feeling in the world
Really I have only ever been in the backseat of mine
To correct you I think you meant "mafia boss"
Yahh trueee😍🤣
Drive a good W126 560SEL euro and you are the emperor!!
Well, Pierre; you are finally getting less wrong.
You're first 'hate' video on the W140 I'd had mine a couple of years and coming from 15 years of Lexus was very impressed. Now I am at 6 years. 160K miles and in those 6 years I've spent $1000 in repairs ( Parts AND Labor). The wood is impeccable, unlike the horribly cracked thin veneer they used in the 123-6 cars. The 722.6 5 speed tranny is as bulletproof as the inline 3.2l engine. The "early electrical' you deem unacceptable was due to biodegradable harness rubber that is/was no more a problem than getting the timing belt replaced on a Lexus LS420. The harness, however, you only have to do once. I could list a ton of improvements that came with the 140 like the double pane glazed glass, brilliant audiophile audio system, 3 person memory driver and passenger......But it seems to be 'hip to hate' here so I will stop there.
Your last response to me was that everyone has their own opinion but we are not talking fat vs skinny girls here; we should rather be talking reliability, performance, quality, and features. These are not subjective. and BTW: You clean up nicely!
thanks Eric. sounds like you got a good one!
Everything works (yes, even lumbar bladders) on my stock 96' S500 with 230k miles. The M119 engine is the most trouble free motor I've ever had. NO oil burn and once you swap out those pesky plastic cam oilers for metal ones, not much else to do. A really penultimate sedan.
Mine is good but it has some minor issues. Not bad though.
I got 2 W140's. A 94 S350 TD (The Kaiser), which I love, this is my workhorse, my everything car (mind you, I got 8 old cars, plus another 2 supposedly daily drivers, which are no older than 2 years old, but I prefer to drive The Kaiser), and then, I own a 95- S600....or rather, it owns me (Stacy).....she is like a secret lover..... she does things to you, that you would not imagine anyone else doing, yet, she punishes you, by spending inordinate amounts of money, fixing her and maintain her.....and at the end of the day, you do it with a smile, because you know what is waiting for you, once you get her back from the shop.....! Does it make any sense? (don't answer that....I know).
Yes, W-140's are heavy, and complicated, uneconomical, and you need to know how to massage them, so they will not buck off their backs, but what a pleasure to drive them. This morning I was on the highway, driving The Kaiser, doing around 70ish, I turned on the CD player, and Bach Cello Sonatas came in.....what a pleasure was my hour long ride! It was worth every minute of it! Only a car as smooth and as quiet as a W140 can do that for you. Complications....a small price to pay for the exquisite pleasure to the senses. Life is complicated, no reason for me to want to get rid of it!!!
Sorry Pierre, I am not intending disagreeing with you....just another opinion, from an un-illuminated MB enthusiast!
I just bought a 1995 s600. I know nothing about cars but i love the way it looks and i dream if driving it, but it needs suspension work and a bunch of other things. I dont know where to start😅. Im looming for a specialist to look it over because i can only imagine how nice it must feel to drive this beast when its all done
Thanks for the mention and the kind words, Pierre. My W140 (a 96 S420) has been growing on me since I bought it in December. I've driven it about 12k miles since. Initially it needed a good amount of sorting out, despite being a well cared for car. There were electrical, suspension, transmission, and engine issues all in the first 2-3 months. This meant a few thousand dollars more had to be invested. Overall, I'm very impressed with the W140 quality from an engineering perspective. It was a giant leap forward for Mercedes from the W126 in terms of modernizing their designs. They introduced CAN into the market, which paved the way for all modern car technologies (love them or hate them). Materials used were high quality and it was still an overbuilt car. For example, look at the single piece of wood on the center console or the design of the front hubs and wheel bearings. The ride quality set the standard for the S class going forward and feels much like a W221 or W222 on the road. It also brought remarkable technologies like ESP to the market. It's great in the snow. It's very safe. Its amazingly comfortable. The sound system is outstanding. The 722.6 transmission is silky smooth and efficient, such a major improvement over the 722.3/.4s. The M119 is bullet proof and mine doesn't consume or leak a drop of anything. For all these reasons and many more, the W140 deserves respect. Now, that said, I still find myself looking at W124s or W126s to replace it and drive daily. Not because the W140 is a bad car, but because the earlier cars are really great cars too. And they feel more like "home" to me than a W140 does. I'll be happy to keep driving it a while longer if nothing good comes up, but its days are numbered in my fleet.
the last sentence...lol
Can I buy it from you
My 93' W140 is the ship I'm going down with. Other cars strive to be "dependable. Mine is relentless.
93’ gang🔥🔥
@@CalebOrvik I'm another in the '93 gang
I have 600SEL black/beige in as new condition,Drives like a Freight train on steroids ,no other car like it . Above 110% perfect . These cars are not for the "i don't know anything about mechanical or just go to the MB Dealer" .
The type of people that gave the W140 the bad reputation are the Cheap buyers & cheap maintaining once , those are the once that spread the bad words around the net etc .Since when does a Super luxury car get high maintenance from Cheap China Junk parts or 2nd hand parts ,then they wonder a week later "Ooh ,it broke again ,what a shitty car the w140 " ,No wonder WHY .
Pierre is a mechanic who specializes in mercedes benz, and he's the one that is saying the w140s can be a pain in the ass. He surely does not fit into the "i don't know anything about mechanical" category, and I do not believe his opinion is based on the opinions from that type of people - his opinion is more likely based on his daily experience working on MB vehicles as a pro. If he says it can get very complicated, I believe it can get even more complicated for the regular car folks.
I drove W123, W124 coupe, W126 and W140. All of them were nice. But honestly when I drove W140 I could not step back again to the W126. If I have enough money and time. The only Mercedes I will be back for.. is The W140. And thank you for the advice because I used to be W140 owner and I understand what do you mean. Thank you.
I completely agree! There are a lot of W126 fans out there that swear blind they were the pinnacle, but it's simply not true. The W140 was a VAST improvement.
I remember when my brother in law bought a W126 at auction and I owned a W140. I was so excited to go suss it out and take it for a drive but I was genuinely disappointed! The cabin felt much less insulated (further inspection saw the doors are half the thickness and only has single pane glass) and the interior felt very flimsy in comparison with a lot of the wood trim falling away.
@@19jacobob93 true & well explained.
Again, I see this video two weeks too late. Could have used your opinion before buying my '96 S420. But I love it and I love fiddling with old cars so I'm extremely happy to discover its inner workings getting it perfect. It's amazing what I have fixed cost free using RUclips university. I also loved my 1991 500SE but I didn't want another 126 because it does feel like it was designed in the seventies and I avoid anything with air suspension so the 140 will be as modern as I'm prepared to go - and I've dreamt about owning one since I was 14. Now I bought the S420 in Cape Town for the equivalent of $2400. It's my daily ride but I only do about 3 miles a day at most. What is surprising is the reaction of people when I pull up in it. You'd think I arrived in a Concord or something. The fact that older Mercs lasts so well means there are many 123s, 124s and 126s in terrible condition being used by people who bought it because it's cheap. The average guy can't discern between those and a fantastic 560 SEL that is actually much more collectable and expensive than a 140 of which the bad ones are all being stripped for parts so the relatively few you do see are always well looked after and still looks like a million bucks. It won't become a modern classic investment but there are certainly enough enthusiasts to keep a few of them going for another decade or so. Modern Mercs suck by the way. The magic is no longer there. Anything with plastic headlamps that turns yellow is off my list so let's hope my car lasts a couple of years.
They do demand respect..... W140 is bad ass car.. ..period. Dont care what otheres say.
I own a 94 S320 i love it.. I will have it burried with me..lbvs
Somebody in south Africa just did that . Google it
Enjoy your videos, became a Mercedes mechanic back in 1982 @ the dealership. Had my own shop for the last 30yrs. Seen alot of stuff. I love the old 123s & 126s owned them too. I live in Pennsylvania where rust would get them. Were built like tanks and you could fix about anything on them. Keep up the great videos!
This is the car that got me interested in classic Mercedes ,it is timeless🔥❤😍
I have a 1995 S320, has just over 200k miles, and is in very decent condition, everything but the lumbars works as it should! It has been extremely reliable over the last 5 or so years, however, I have found that it does seem to have it's own set of issues just like any other model line. Repair info can sometimes be a problem to find, as well as certain parts, and the sheer bulk of parts attached to one vehicle and all it's systems can be a little bit overwhelming. Not to even mention the wiring harness problems....
Btw, about the harnesses... everyone seems to think that the engine harness is the only one that has the "crumbling insulation" issue. Well, unfortunately it's not limited to just the engine (upper and lower) harnesses. I have had strange issues from time to time, and it the problem sometimes ends up being a bare wire (insulation crumbling) in some kind of bizarre place on the car, that has been untouched since new. So just be aware of that. Those types of problems take the longest to find it seems.
Otherwise, I must say that I love the car, I don't have any desire to sell it off, and I think that it is another very special car in a long line of very special cars! Nothing drives quite like it!
you;re the second person who has told me that all of the harnesses are affected.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 Interesting! It seems to be VERY random occurrences, but when it happens it's sometimes in an area that is exposed to heat, or maybe outside air (smog) etc. Like for instance the wiring going to the mirror (folding type) a small section of wire is exposed when the mirrors are folded, this wire on both sides started to disintegrate and cause all kinds of electrical weirdness. Took me a while to find it as always!
@@Johnathan_Waters i think its the movement that does the mirrors and seat harnesses
Thanks Pierre for your no-nonsense truth approach ...very informative...Anthony from Kenya
thank you Anthony!
My first car was a w126! 89 300se! Second was a w140 92 400se
Third 93 500sel, 4th 93 R129 SL 500.
6 years later now I got a w140 95 S500 120k miles And 6th R129 98 SL500 120k miles! Let me tell you something this older polish mechanic told me with my 93 500SEL he said they put sweat, blood and soul in the making of this car and it takes more than love to keep it running! At the time I was having my first kid so I sold the 140 & 129 cuz I couldn't keep up and continue going with it plus I was only 22 years old and didn't know anything about repairs or DIY! Now I'm a beast tho! Just finish almost restoring my w203 c32 AMG every suspension arm n link, new fuel pumps all the seals and hoses up front with water pump and pullies, rebuilt the valve body with trans go stuff! And 140 and r129 are rock solid but I'm gonna go nuts at them with maintenance and repairs since I just acquired my own star diagnostics system! And no they're not bad cars or trash it's just the length you're willing to go to seek perfection! W140's ride better than any S class before or after those are facts! U just hated them cuz you don't like going to those lengths! I promise!! You've probably told people to buy W220's over 140's!!! Stick with your 190's and 124's and 126's those cars even my daughter can work and fix! It doesn't require a " master mechanic" they're I'd say about 30% more complicated than a camry!
I have a 92 300sd . And is great a love it . And I had problem with my center vent . But now It all fix running great
I got my w140 a little over a year ago in horrible shape, missing window and mirrors. Hadn't moved in 5 years. It's a diesel so it fired right up with a new battery. I had never really dove deep into a car and really worked on a car like I have my 140. It's easier to work on than my Mercury or my Nissan from around the same era. I love the way I feel and the way it drives, nobody cuts you off in a w140 haha
I’ve owned a 1993 500SEL for almost 15 years, only repairs: fan clutch, bracket in the self leveling suspension, small leak in fuel pump assembly, headlight switch and replacement of a bulb in passenger AC temp switch. Not sure if harnesses were replaced by previous owner or I’ve been lucky. Have traveled worry free all around the US with family and luggage. Most reliable car I’ve owned, got me into Mercedes and now I own a 230S, 200, 560SEL, 450SEL, G55, SLK350 and sadly an S55 (fun but over complicated W220)
Nick Palla My W-140 is a 1997 S-320 short wheel base, I have owned the car for 8 yrs. with very little problems. I absolutely love the car, the 3.2 twin cam six is a bulletproof engine, silky smooth and very reliable. We all know how reliable the W-124 E-320 was.. same drive train in an S-class body.
That's great Nick! I guess before you. The car somebody must have replaced the head gasket, correct? I think that the s320 was a great combination of Mercedes engineering and Mercedes efficiency
@@thisisnightshop2037 Hi Pierre, correct the head gasket was done at 24k by Mercedes. I think they revised the gasket, that was the issue. I've owned a few w126 + w124's a 1990 300se, 1990 560sec, 1995 e420, 1994 300ce... great cars. I feel that the W140 is the last of the classic Mercedes where high quality build, price no object, was the mindset. Look at the S-class generation after the W140... no comparison
yes, in a way Mercedes was still doing their best when they built the 140, in terms of build quality.
Working as a Benz tech at a dealership in the early 90s I remember that we had to change out The oem pirelli tires on all the W140s as they didn, t want to stay round for long. After wasting lots of time trying to match balance the Pirellis MB just gave up and let us hang new Michelins. Maybe if they hadn't spent so much money over engineering the car they could have installed real heavy car tires to begin with. Hard to believe they made money on the W140.Not to mention they wouldn't have had to try to get their money back by coming out with the pathetic W220 Chasis!
Why do these cars have 4+ owners? Because people give up when they realize the cost
...AND...
Because the 5th owner knows there is still value.
Also, five owners later, and 40 plus years later, the car still exists...and in style, if done right.
@@RoyalHippieGangstercom I just bought a 99 W140 Grand edition for $2000
I know the value and willing to spend $3k or less on making it tip top
25 years is a long long time in the car world. i doubt the new Mercedes will even be driveable in 25 years.
@@xmaxbabilo i own two 600 ...a W140 1992 sel and a guard w220 of 2001.... . I love both... im not rich but i never want let theses amazing cars
The W140, IMHO, was the pinnacle of MB. Still, if you must have any older Benzitos, invest in a Star diagnostic tool. You can also pick up a Snap On brick with MB cartridges for really cheap... I own a 99 CL500 with less than an impressive 115k on’er... On the prowl for an S420 🤷🏼♀️
very interesting. I guess that's what you have to do, diagnose the car yourself. But I still think it's impressive that you've managed to drive your CL500 and manage its diagnostics yourself
i am her ,i have a 98 cl600 and it has been extremely reliable,rust can be a problem though,mine is silver but the c140 in black is awesome,what color is yours
W140 is not anymore complicated compared to the w126. Both use vaccum systems for everything. They both have lots of electrical. It doesn't take a genius to own one lots of people on RUclips work on them and own it.
W126= Claudia Schiffer.
W140= Phil Hartman as "Susan" on SNL.
Wow, pulling out the big guns! LMAO
Hey, Pierre, thanks for the video and content.
May I ask you about the W210 chassi? What do you think? Wich is better: W210 or a W124? Both gas and six cylinder.
In fact I am a big fan of the W210 B4, wich means that it was factory armored, with a V8 engine. What do you think about making a video talking about this kind of special car by Mercedes?
Thanks and good luck!
W124 of Course
W210 is a Chrysler
My 380 SL 1981 stumbles maybe about 30% of the time when starting.
It correct it self with in 30 seconds to 1 minute.
Any idea?
Thanks Pat
I had w140 s350 for years. I bought it for 1800 euros. No problems with electronics. Rust yes, but in time that could all be resolved.
What’s those antennas called that are on both sides of front bumper?
Were you wrong? That's a very subjective question! I think it's safe to say that the answer would be yes and no. Any long time W140 owner will tell you that they're nearly impossible to keep up with. To make matters worse, there are very few people that will work on them or that are even willing to work on them, and a lot of dealerships will turn W140 cars away at the door. Actually, a lot of dealerships will turn anything away that is over 10-15 years old. It's not just the W140.
I'm sure that most of us have heard the jokes about W140 cars. Such as "The W140 was made by hooking an air hose to a W124 and inflating it", and "The W140....the Mercedes with a genetic disorder". There are more, but every one I've heard always weighs heavily on it's looks and design. I never hear any jokes about the electric gremlins or anything related to the drive train. Regardless, the point here is to say that while they may not be an attractive car to the majority or easy to keep up with on repairs they're probably the last repairable car Mercedes made......to some extent. The last two models years did see improvements on reliability, but the previous models pretty much put a bad taste in the majority of the public's mouth. Mercedes lost soooooo many loyal customers due to the W140. The biggest reason for that is that a W140 wasn't a car you could buy new and keep for a lifetime like the previous models. (at least not without spending thousands and thousands of dollars) We have to remember that the design of the W140 was heavily influenced by pre-planned obsolescence. It wasn't designed to last more than 10-15 years with regular use and/or exposure to the elements. Mercedes was able to literally build the best car in the world (at the time) while using sub par materials and pinching pennies everywhere they could. They pulled it off, but the ramifications afterward were hard to swallow. The name suffered, quality controls was down, and thousands of lifetime customers shook their heads in disappointment while seeking out other makes. Mercedes would LOVE to sweep the W140 under the proverbial rug.
Touching on the drive trains, the gasoline engines were really robust and long lived with proper care. The diesels were a crap shoot, even when new. The OM 603 had cylinder head problems to the end, and the OM606 was plagued with premature timing chain and sprocket wear causing the engines to self destruct. Maintenance is key, but far too many ignore the 100,000 mile interval in which the timing chain/rails/tensioner have to be renewed. Both diesel engines did not take being overheated even one time. The aluminum cylinder heads allowed for a lot of flexibility, they were light weight, but they were extremely weak. Especially compared to the OM617 engines that had a cast iron cylinder head.
BUT......even the biggest critic/cynic of the W140 would be taken aback if they were to ride in a well sorted W140. Yes, the ride. Not the drive. Though, the models with rear self leveling suspension rode very harsh compared to the ones with standard suspension. And yes, that is with good accumulators. The inside of a W140 is a really nice place to be......provided the sacrificial one or two a/c evaporators have been devoted to the troubled spirit that constantly plagues a W140. The very early models saw Roser leather, but shortly after the debut of the W140 the Roser tannery closed its doors. Mercedes then started using a very low quality leather, but it didn't matter since they never intended the cars to last more than 10-15 years. Options were many, but color choices were somewhat limited compared to its predecessors. Sadly, far too many ended up being white or some other beige on beige or silver on gray color combination.
If you seek out a W140, buy the best example you can that needs the least. You may pay more up front, but the savings in the long run are worth it. The experience of enjoying your car is what counts at the end of the day. It matters not what model or marque one has. If you love the car it'll love you back. Even a LADA or a YUGO will give someone pleasure if treated right! ;)
well said Aaron.
I'm going to actually disagree that the W140 was designed with planned obsolescence. I have worked on a few and owned one and they are designed in a way that literally everything is quite easily replaceable and accessible, and of course literally every single part is numbered.
They were absolutely designed to be used and fixed for as long as physically possible. Any and all downfalls are down to diving too deeply into, at the time, new technologies that weren't well established and therefore not very reliable.
I honestly can't think of anything on a W140 over the years that I haven't been able to fix in the garage the same way as on a W123!
A man gave me a 97 s600 with a v12 engine. It had 155,000 miles on it. He couldn’t stand to look at it when someone dented the driver side doors. He said GOD told him to give it to me for absolutely nothing. Although I have a 996 Porsche , I can honestly say I’ve never had any car that I enjoy as much as the 97 v12. The power is downright scary. After having it a few months I called and asked if he was sure he heard from GOD because the car begs to be run hard and I worry about getting a ticket for speeding over 100mph. It does hv a few probs with switches not working and accumulators but to drive a monster like this daily is more than a thrill. The challenge is trying not to fix everything and spending thousands in pursuit of perfection
I have 3 w140's. An s600 euro spec with 150k, a prestine s500 with 116k miles and a daily 99 s500 with 178k miles. I also have a prestine 1986 420sel. My favorite car is the 420sel but by far the best ride I have ever had is my 95 s500. The s600 is unlike any other car but can be a pain to work on. But with all this said the w140 is a great daily and not bad to work on.
interesting...I hope one day to have your level of patience. i think its great that you have taken on not one- but three of these things.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 lol. Good one. I've seen what you can do and admire your work. It's a hobby for me but love it.
Well said. I think the W140 deserves some respect and to be preserved. I do like mine.
The SDL replaced my wonderful S320 @ 100K miles, wanting to avoid the situation you note below - but no major gremlins surfaced while I truly enjoyed the S320 (but I could not resist the SDL with 45K miles @ the time) having seen many W140s with over 200K miles; no doubt at a cost
How funny that you made this video. At work last night in Long Island City, there were three 140s on one block, one of which was an S350. Stately vehicles for sure, especially from head-on, but nothing like a 126.
One of the problems with the w140 is that, while not a bad looking car, it is only distinctive because of its size and weight
Pierre Hedary Agreed. Doesn’t come close to living up to the 126’s prestige. I’d say definitely due in part to the computer and internet boom.
I’d take a 280S over an S500.
My S500 coupe has been incredible 😍 things a Beast.
My w140 Central Lock is not working. it is too complicated to fix .I wish I could find a shop can handle the Central Lock issue
I had a 93 w140 and I loved it so much I think it was worth every penny. Granted it was a ton of work and money and I had a Mercedes specialist figure out a mountain of weird issues, such as wiring and fuel injection issues. And all the parts were costly , especially that motorized rear view mirror (which was genius by Mercedes FYI). Everyone I met loved it and wanted to buy it off me. I would do it again in a heart beat. But I agree, it’s a fussy expensive car.
While I feel my '87 300SDL (w/67K miles) will give me more maintenance peace of mind over the S320 I replaced it with (@100K miles) the few electrical gremlins I experienced were well worth the comfort that I now miss
So wait, which one do you own now?
one of the frustrating things about cars with lots of electronics is that the Gremlins get worse as time goes on. You end up fighting a losing battle
that's the way i feel about my lotus! haha! will it start today? what code will i read this morning? it's all part of the "charm"
What kind of Mercedes do you have? I have a friend who has a 116 280 SE and a lotus elan. this 280 SE is pretty much as daily driver and has just over three hundred thousand miles on it. I've asked him why he just kept the car all these. he said that the 116 acts as a foil to the usually temperamental lotus. Mostly because it always starts.
Sorry for my late reply. I just bought a 1970 250. I bought a Lotus Evora last year thinking it would be a reliable supercar on a budget. I'll tell you right now I would trust the w114 more than I do the Evora.
Hello brother i have a problem with my s320 w140 swaped engine with e320 1996 and when i turn my wheels at the max the car almsot dies (stalls) does anybody know what should i change
I know what it is
How can the 350d be better than s320? I dont understand and have driven both. What do you mean?
Doesn't the W140 300SD (and the W126 350SD/L) have the infamous rod bender engine? We didn't get the S Class Diesels here in Australia until the modern units, but I remember all the threads of failing engines on the various mercedes lists of the late 90s for cars in the USA.
they can bend rods but they are not as bad as people say.
The is always a kind of passion involved in old Mercedes. I had a bad experience with my W220 AMG transmission, but the car was amazing to drive. There’s always some luck involved in used cars as well. I’m driving a W140 and it is awesome, I hope I don’t be in any electrical issues in the future.
W220 was Chrysler
Thanks Pierre for the advice! I'm currently pining for hoovies e63 wagon...(which is an electrical nightmare!)
junk. go vintage Lou. Tyler sold almost all of his good cars.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 ok. W126 it is then...
I am selling my w124 300ce 1991, l have two kids and need some space . I am looking for w124 e320 or e420, and also w140 e420. What do you think is the best ?
I have 1992 140w 300sd turbo 2nd transmission problem it is slipping doesnt go into 3rd..also the auto trunk is not closing, glow plug indicator not coming on..has 250k miles on it...good solid carm but now has issues🤔
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I'm on my 3rd 140...a '94 S500. Low miles, one previous owner, never seen a snowflake (SoCal car now in Indiana.) Yeah, I replaced the engine harness the 1st week I got it but, other than that, the car's been relatively trouble free. I've got a '98 w210, '00 C215 and '95 R129 as well so you'd probably call me a glutton for punishment. Surprisingly though, I haven't had much of a problem with any of them. I admit I wish I still had my '83 300SD as well. Love your work. 👍
The R107 and the W126 is the final episode!!!
i own a W140 300 SE 3.2 and so far it has been working ok but its not as complicated as the W220 chassis and onward
I Had a w140 and unfortunately I wrecked it.all I can say is that I’m still around today because of that car and now I drive a w126 and I love the car but I must say I personal feel that you can’t go wrong with the w140
Interesting. your story certainly does not surprise me. I always believe that the 140 was one of the safest cars on the road
I always believe that that car would save somebody's life. Basically one of the best justifications for owning it is the safety
Pierre I love your work and your passion and thanks for all the good videos
I want to change the suspension to something lower and tighter any suggestions 1998 s600
this is a fully hydraulic suspension,. so maybe calibrate it to sl600 version?
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 how is that done,ps mine only has sls shocks in the rear the front are normal
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 no really now, i have read some of the things you have been saying, now you tell me how one can calibrate their w140 suspension to sl600 version,you tell me how that is done.i know it sounds lovely saying calibrate to sl600 version so tell me how YOU would do that.
i don't know....it's just a QUESTION. Not my area of expertise at all. Why are you such an asshole?
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 because you are the asshole that told me to use a thermostat from a diesel in my m120 when they don't fit.if you really do know your stuff with these older models from 50-80 my advise is stay where you have knowledge you are making glaring mistakes with the 90's cars.if people are taking what you are saying as advice(and i think they are)you are sending them down the wrong path.can you imagine if julio rodriguez went into his mercedes dealer asking to get his s600 suspension calibrated to sl600 status? he is gonna be making a bit of a fool of himself isn't he? there is nothing wrong with not knowing something nobody needs to know everything. the only answer i could give him is to change the springs for thicker w140 springs or go aftermarket,convert the sls to normal dry shocks and buy stiffer shocks maybe bilstien no8, but you usually need to use the thinest spring pad for those, or if he wants to spend big big bucks there is an AMG conversion for shocks, springs and sway-bars, i have the manual somewhere and could send him it if needed.
Can you do a deep dive video on the W124?
I own 2 w140. 97 s420. 98 s500 pure driving enjoyment. These cars can be picked up in south Florida for under 4k
Ps.the 97 cost me $2100 with 212k on the clock this garage kept gem drove back to ALABAMA and didnt miss a beat. Mercedes benz from the 90's
THE ABSOLUTE BEST.
W140 till the bitter end.
i have 2 w140. milage is 13.000 km and the other one is 120.000 km. i have also w221 with 21.000 km. from my opinion w140 is still the best car in the world. if you dont believe me please come to jakarta, indonesia. i will be happy to show it to you piere. regards ronny from indonesia
I'm never selling my W140! 1994 S320 with 140k miles.
Thanks for your assessment of the W140. I think it boils down to what you want the car for. I have been driving the S320 for going on 20+ yrs. I have found:
1. It's comfortable on the road. It's quiet and smooth: one can drive can drive comfortably all day at 80+.
2. At some 4600 lbs (loaded), it is one of the safer vehicles on the road.
3. Its reliable. Always got me home.
4. The only mechanical problem was the head gasket. (100K). I supect that was due to shutting the engine down before ensuring it was cool.
I live in Southern California, the car is always garaged, and doesn't go out in the rain (too many drivers out here don't know about wet streets). Never had any electrical issues except light bulbs on occassion.
In May 2019 I bought a one-owner 1993 400SEL with a little over 150k miles in Seattle for $1,700. Nearly immaculate. Only problems were that the Bose Beta components were missing from the trunk, the left turn signal was on permanently (which I fixed myself cheaply), and a right rear door that initially wouldn't open but magically started opening on its own. Has it been perfect? No. Has needed many wear-and-tear things replaced in keeping with a nearly 30 year old, 150k+ car. Only unexpected thing -- which is common with the '92 and '93 W140s -- is that the gauge cluster failed (known electrical glitch). Love the car and worth every penny I paid for it and then some. That said, would I recommend one as your only car for daily use? Nope. It's not a Camry :)
Since I own a W140 (1992) I can speak to sufferance. It’s old school big body float is a true marvel of Merc engineering. If your into bank fault driving @ triple digit speeds with cruse control engaged, this is your car. When things don’t work right you can blow up your wallet. Air system powering the locks, doors, soft close will fail. ASR faults and hvac issues are consuming time suckers. Expensive things can pile up if not dealt with. Hey, it’s only money!
RJ W140 C107 W210 Estate
Going to buy a w140 s320 tonight probably with 173 k miles for 2300 is it worth it ? How far should I get before I need to drop anything over a grand into it ?
Hello, Anthony Cruz and thank YOU so much for your question(s), we want to answer you as quickly as possible.
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I own a 97 s320 and absolutely love the car, it's much much better than some modern cars on road today interms of ride quality and styling.
Would never sell it
What about the w140 vs the w220 model
Driven both....I’d take a late model w220 anyday. Looks a lot more modern, more reliable.
Next year, I am thinking of getting one. In our market here in New Zealand we get some prestine cars for sale at very good prices. And most Mercedes Benz are well looked after, garaged cars. I just love the interior and smooth drive of the W140.
Interesting. Which version do you think you're going to get?
@@thisisnightshop2037 I will look at the last years of the W140. I have found that the last of any Mercedes Benz models are always well detailed.
@@mohabatkhanmalak1161 The problem with the late W140 is rust. The problem with the early w140 is the wiring loom. However, the early W140's are seen as the better built cars.
@@colmfarrel4742 You got that correct ,later models have been stripped of a fair few quality parts ,starting with the replacement of the Chrome Ashtray chrome Trunk handle on early once into cheap Plastic onto the later once. Wiring harnesses can be repaired,the only bad repair on a w140 & a nightmare at that is if the Ac evaporator or Heater core starts leaking , that's on all W140's ,it has never been addressed by MB,wiring harnesses repair is not to bad to repair on your own if you know how to use a Solder Iron ,been there done that ,lol .
Pierre I think you may some things skewed. I can take w140 600 in for service at Mercedes however they will not touch my w111 coupe I want my air fuel adjusted correctly and it’s is beyond the mixture screw for my altitude. So that would be a great video to post. The inner workings of the injection pump for the m130 and I think it’s the same for m129. But for your average guy with average tools the older ones are best. The w140 is one heck of a care when it’s right though. Keeping those hands clean I see love your vids just wish there were more hands on thanks keep it up!
The audio is 100 times better
a whole lot seems skewed to me,like how he thinks the 722.3/5 is stronger than 722.6,like how the w124 is a great car even though it suffers from wire harness problems but the w140 is bad because it has wire harness issues.he is telling people to buy deisel w140 when those engines have weaknesses that the petrol ones don't have and how he is saying a 560sel is much less complicated than a w140 s500 when it isn't really if you know what you are doing they are pretty similar cars.the truth be told the w126 would confuse more mechanics where i am than the w140
Ray, you tell me which car is more popular...the 126 or the 140?
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 the w126 was built oveer a longer period and sold more,but what has that to do with anything
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 popular does not mean it is better.
Answer from a 2 year W140 owner: yes you are right
Hi there, I have a S320L from 1996 with 88K KM on board. Whole package cost me 6K EUR. But It really surprises me that in the US w140 have a higher price tag, weird. And I also do not understand why you would recommend the 350 TD w140 as the engine is very unreliable and prone to breaking before 200 000 km. At least in Europe that is, so I wonder why did you consider it as a very good car? Does Mercedes use a different engine on the 350 TD's in the US?
It is the best car ever made...
I used to have 3 of em..
I used to have a S300 4 doors,after that a CL500 coupe and after that again a S500.
I have a 94 S500 coupe/C140
These cars & the sedan were designed to cruise at Autobahn speeds effortlessly from Germany to the Alps in a day.
110 mph for hrs
Okay, my 1994 S420 is trying to die and I just won't let it... It's problem now is from a stop position I put the excelerator to the floor and it barely crawls... I was told its the fuel injectors so I had them cleaned that did not fix the problem, the weird thing is sometime at night or other times during the day, in other words when it want to it will run like a champ... on the freeway after I pass the jerking sputtering, spitting it will drive like new but as soon as I start to slow it begins its crippling act again... Now I'm told to change the "Camshaft Position Sensor" just the sensor not the cam adjustor's ... so I did... maybe 25% better, since all this has been going on the transmission has been leaking like a fountain and it's violent when switching gears... the transmission guy said " no sense in fixing the tranny till you fix the engine... back to square 1 ... I thought after lots of internet searching it maybe the "Mass air Flow sensor" that's tomorrows trial... the thing is again when I'm rolling at 40 mpgs it's a beautiful thing... any suggestions... I hope... but not like every shop I've been to saying they hate this year... no parts don't have an easy fix... just leave $2000 on their desk and come back in a few months... Oh I've had the "biodegradable wire harness change already ... If you're in Calif. L.A. Long Beach Ill get it to ya....
Check your catalytic converter. (Do you smell something like burnt powder, when your car begins to stumble?) You might be able to add a catalytic converter cleaner in to your fuel and get a bit more life out of the unit, but I would replace it eventually.
I'm fortunate, in a way, because I live in Thailand most of the time, and the cars here show no sign of corrosion, which I know is an issue for the W140, especially on the wings.
The interiors appear to be very durable, which is another reason I like them. Owners seem less inclined to mess with them too, so they are often very original, which is pleasing. Try finding a W124 or W126 that still has both the original steering wheel and gear knob...
Add in the quietness and sense of occasion, and you've got yourself a car worth keeping on the road.
I'd have to agree with you about Jaime K. He is one of the most meticulous and persistent Mercedes enthusiasts I know. Dan P. is right up there too.
Keep up the good work Pierre.
Rick
Thank you so much. I really enjoy knowing people like you guys are out there
Does Jaime K still have a web page? Please post a link. I subscribe (not active for a while) and remember Jaime posting questions when he was in his teens.
I meant I subscribed to the Mercedes mailing list. While I am still subscribed I rarely check in. The guys there seem to have solved all known Mercedes problems and have moved on to other things.
@@OscarGarcia-sk8px there's still an occasional on topic post, lol.
@@OscarGarcia-sk8px here you go. www.jaimekop.com/
what do you think about the replica that made slang500
the gullwing? its cool...not sure what it has to do with 140
@@faizrahman7671 use a R129
Well, I think it's much better than any other replica
I believe he built that car on r171 chassis, not r129. Really cool build for sure. Another is the 190e EVO built on the c63 chassis.
@@ulrichskaarsgard7848 r170 amg 32
A white S600 97 coupe w/ 7 owners and 38k miles sold for 40K USD last month.
There seems to be an inverse correlation of complexity /unreliability to value in the collector car market. The more complex (technically advanced in it's time) the more desirable it is to collectors. Off course there are exceptions to this rule. The W140 was not well received by the motoring press as being too heavy, too complex, too boxy...etc. In general Mercedes have not been seen as collector car with some exceptions. I still want a W140 V12 coupe.
I love how you finish this post. Hopefully you have a bootleg SDS system because you're going to need it.
I never liked the C140 due to the front. However, I do love looking at them from the rear 3 quarter view.
@@thisisnightshop2037 I do I bought a chinese knock off on eBay for for my w215,
We need a 129 vid Pierre! 😁
Yes, please Pierre.
Ok!
Was the 140 diesel sold in US ?
yes, 1993-95 as 300sd/s350
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 terrible.. diesels suck..
#300Dforlife
Owning any classic MB will at some point cost you money. It all comes with long term ownership. I own three Merc's. One of them is a black 1992 W140 500sel and yes I have spent money on repairs, most of it electrical. But I have a lot of free months with no money spent and that's all golden cruising time. The ride is like driving a big steel ball bearing in a groove. At some point (80 to 90 mph) you float! : ) People always ask me, do you do weddings.
After the less then stellar success of the W140, Mercedes decided to never have so many eggs in one basket. Ever since, Mercedes has increased the number of models. How many distinct chassis are there now? 12? Other then the 2017+ S Class and the E Class, they all look like polished turds, the SUVs in particular.
ughh...so many.
After 99 they ALL JUNK.
My take on the W140 has always been that they were the ultimate "handsome" car -- an evolution of styling dating back 40 years. I know nothing about the diesel-powered ones, but the engines really didn't matter much in terms of reliability. It was everything else in the car that could and would go wrong. As for the M120, its only problem was its size, or forgive me, I meant "physical packaging" of course, even in the 140's massive engine bay nothing was easy. And if you have never addressed MB's transition from actual workshop manuals to paperless software -- there's a mean and likely apocryphal tale that it was outsourced to Bulgaria or somewhere -- then that might make an interesting discussion. Assuming you can do it without cussing, of course.
Jack, you hit the nail on the head. figuring out how to service the Mercedes from that era is like trying to decipher the Kensington ruin stone. Unless you have lots of hands-on experience with it, none of the details are explained.
Up here in Canada more so Ontario and Quebec the w140 ranges from 2500 to 10 000 most of them sitting either high mileage dailys garage queens or hacked up low mileage decent cars with problems that no one wants to fix but selling them is another story S600 V12s pre face lift or any year always gunna be 10K and gone the same week it's posted owners like me asking 5K for decent shape V8 models get stuck with the cars cause everyone thinks there all money pits comparing receipts with other cars I've owned I disagree only thing I spend ungodly amount on is fuel 1.58 a liter when economy is booming my wallet cries but I still love my 400se hands down best car I've owned
wow- a 400se...rare and very cool!
W210 was also not the car everyone was expecting to see coming down front Mercedes-Benz conveyor😁 but look, that changed the whole Mercedes-Benz E class line😇
123 , 126 ,124 the SLs from the beginning had about them an aura that the likes of the 140 could never hope to replicate . Downward trajectory ever since . . .
yes, i usually approach those cars with excitement. But when somebody brings a 140 into my shop, I usually approach it with a lot of fear and anxiety.
Pierre Hedary in 92 MB got a new CEO and from then on things just ain’t been the same . 240Ds , 5 cylinder 300Ds 124s were part of my youth . They bear no resemblance to these plastic chariots produced today .
Tend to disagree after driving most of them and settling on a W140. The refinement is incredible in comparison to prior models and makes for a much more comfortable daily driver. The engineers at Mercedes threw their all at the 140 like they had never done before and it really shows in the construction and the near ridiculous attention to detail.
@@thisisnightshop2037 Cant handle it ? Lol
With any Mercedes you better be able to turn a wrench.
If not prepare to pay and God knows I love a Mercedes!
I drive a W212. It’s been one of the best and most t
My desire w140 is the 600SEL/SEC.or the S600L and it had to be grand edition or the two tone colors. The only thing I hate abt w140 is the gas consumption,the rest is part of life when u own one.W140 is a gentle giant trained to dance on it toes..I saw one in Africa in 1992 my heart jumped and up till now I have a PTSD
I like the w140 I have one and how u been man haven't seen u on n a while
what model do you have?
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 s320 95
I have a 1992 500SEL W140. I bought it last year with 85,000 miles from the original owner. Now I have it up to 96k. It’s been a great car but definitely sunk a lot of money into it. Replaced rear accumulators for the shocks $600. Wiring harness $1,600. New tires $500. 3 oil changes $80 each. Otherwise I’ve never had a problem. Very dependable. Expensive to upkeep but drives like a dream and I get tons of compliments on it. The level of comfort and performance is amazing.
a little patient sorting....how is the ac, suspension, sunroof, etc? it;s the comfort items that bother me the most.
Mercedes Classic with Pierre Hedary AC blows cold, suspension is perfect now that I replaced the accumulators, sunroof works and no leaks. The key is to find a one owner garages example like I did and take good care of it
You probably never drove a well kept w140.
The w140 i believe is the grand finale of auto industry... the end of the road... the best that can be made by human...
I owned w123s extremely low mileage ones, w126, w124 etc but the w140 deserves more respect... thats the best sedan ever made on planet earth... its faults are logical... more gadgets more issues... you have to pay to play...
If w123 where this highly equiped and refined they would have the same little issues...
I strongly believe the car industry toped out at the w140 .
Now this is the most accurate statement on here, including the video! The issues boil down to new technologies that weren't as well developed and therefore reliable at the time, however they are what made it the king at the time.
The rest of the car is just simply the best ever produced like you said. The level of engineering gone into the W140 is just staggering and people lost sleep, blood, wives, jobs etc. developing it but they never lost the soul.
they are great cars but not 126 standard
we had a 98 s500 and but 240000 miles on it....dont recall any major issues, except damn cupholder broke..
i think still they have the best looking mb center consoles
good friend loves the 140s but only the early ones because he feels they were made better, with quality parts compared to latter ones with more plastic and biodradable crap......too bad they lack the 5 speed
The 5-speed automatic is just like all of those interior parts. It's temperamental and fragile. The seven 22.3 is one of the best transmissions ever made
I guess since you have two w126s I know which cars you prefer
Apart, from the centre consoles in a W111, W113, and W100 I would agree with you. That said I have always thought the W124 had a perfect centre console giving the W140 a run for it's money.
@@thisisnightshop2037 where do you get this from mate? the the 4 speeds all lose reverse and the 722.6 last much longer and is considered bomb proof by the experts are you delibratly trying to lead people down the wrong path
the 722.6 got better with time but only the late 722.3 loses reverse. its an easy fix. no control units, no problems. The 722.3 is the best trans mercedes built.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 i think the consensus is 722'6
We should not forget that Mercedes spent over one billion dollars to improve on the W126, which was already a great car! Seems there are many people out there who are not very fond of the W140, and I am not sure if they are being objective, or even fair. It would be a mistake to look at the W140 Mercs outside of the perspective of the 1990s! The Merc W140 was not the only thing "awkward" to come out of the 1990s, and even the biodegrading wiring problem was also common on other German automobiles. Generally speaking, (especially aesthetically,) the 1990s was not the best decade.
I have owned an insane number of Mercs over the past 35 years, and I can certainly "notice" the differences between the W126 (for example) and the W140 Mercs. Yes, a W126 SEC is a wonderful and great looking car, but the W140 S-coupe is the better car. (Keep in mind that wiring harnesses can be swapped out, and sometimes at fairly cheap prices.) Yes, the W126 560SEL is also another great looking car, but the W140 S500/S600 sedans are better in most aspects. Am I crazy, you might be asking? Sure, there are the electrical gremlins, which can be fixed. But, mechanically the W140 is a great car, in coupe or sedan form. The W126 series, for the most part, looks better and there is no getting around that fact, just as there is no getting around the fact that the W140 is the better car overall, (looks be darned! :D ) My daily is a W140 1995 S500 coupe, and it has been my daily driver for the past three years. Outside of the annoying climate control regulator/blower motor failures, (water seems to be getting into the chamber, saturating the blower motor,) it has been a great car! (Knock on wood!) It looks great, (despite its 1990s awkwardness,) and people are shocked to hear that it is a 25 year old car. The interior is in great condition, and if motivates fairly nicely. It has a great Bose sound system, (unlike the horrible sound systems found in the W126's) and handles like a Daddy long legs on a brick wall. Did I mention that it has a great interior? (And who can deny that the W140 has the better quality leather and woodwork, compared to the W126!)
It isn't my intent to convince anyone, and truth be told, what do I care? It is okay to dislike a car, based on subjective reasons, and there are great cars out there that I do not personally care for. (Did I mention that I once coined the phrase, "Friends don't let friends drive BMW's?!") We can wax philosophical all we want, at the end of the proverbial day, EVERY Merc generation has its own host of "issues!" I can write a Chinese opera regarding the Godawful climate control "thingy" on the late 1970s W123 Mercs. (Yes, the units that were also used on the Chrysler models of the period.) These units tended to crack and were expensive to repair. Sure, you could bypass them, (and many folks did,) yet, it was a highly annoying failure! Let's also talk about "rust" and the Mercs of the 1970s and the 1980s. Again, did Mercs ever have radios worth listening to before the W140?! (Etc., etc., etc....)
This is good analysis, but dollar for dollar the 126 is still a better car.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 Not to nitpick, but this is a subjective opinion, rather than an objective one. Mercedes-Benz, for example do not agree with such an assessment, and they built these cars.
Sadly, the W140 is an easy car to hate, and all for the wrong reasons. I will always have a soft spot in my heart for the W126 Mercs, and especially the SEC variants, (one of my favorite cars out of some 200+ owned was a 1991 560SEC.)
Yet, I can feel the difference between the SEC and the S-Coupe in my bones. In ALL aspects, the S-Coupe is the better car. Is it more sophisticated? Of course! A similar discussion must have taken place when the Ford Model A replaced the well-loved Model T. While the Model T's looked wonderful, the Model A that replaced it was the better car, by far.
Thank you for your kind replies. :)
Does the W140 have more electronics than the W126? Barely, not by the W126's last update. The quality of these cars varies by year and region, and a W140 can pass a point of no realistic return due to neglect. The cars were produced with little regard for cost and parts/repairs reflect that. In my experience mechanics well versed in them don't find them impractical.
umm...that's not true at all. The 126 can run of its ke controller crashes, whereas the w140 is stranded.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 no that is true,i don't think anything jeremy C said was untrue,and is the most realistic comment i have read yet.i think you are just banging your drum like a big kid who likes this one better than that one.the w140 is not complicated no-one i know can fix the complicated w126 ezl units. w126 had hydraulic suspension option available with,abs,asr traction control,electric heated seats front and rear electric windows sunroof e.t.c you cannot just talk away as if these cars are so different like all the other sheep who keep repeating that w124 was the last proper benz when the w210 is far superior its only fault was to be painted poorly. in general the cars have been improving
what do you do when the circuit board fries Ray? who will make you another one. I have had zero ezl failures on 126s. ZERO.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 Why do people complain about EZL failures? I have a friend who gripes about it and insists that the old condenser and points system is better. I've owned 4 of these cars (unfortunately 2 of them are no longer with us), and have never had EZL problems. Honestly I worry more about making sure I do the transmission fluid every 15k miles then I do about the car not starting.
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 my car was built april 98 and nothing has or will fry
You should really get that cough attended to 🤔😂
A late gen w140 in dark colors look great but an equivalent w126 will beat it down everytime. I love the w126 for the simplicity and (by modern standards) not all that heavy. W140 ride better but I'm sure a hpf w126 would match as well? Oh and w140s rust to
I think that generally the 126 does everything better.however, the 140 gives you a sense of total isolation, like you are driving a very fast tank. My understanding is that some people find this sensation very appealing, particularly on long trips and if they have a v12.
The nicest 126 is the 560 SEC.. period
I was told the diesel 140 engine blows up at 60k miles from new. Lol
no, not always. I work on alot of 3.5 diesels and when maintained on time they seem to do as well as any other 603 engine.
The S-Class that's a stinker is the one that came out right after the W140, no one wants those - very complex and cheap looking styling, not the quality of the w140. In 2008 I think they redesigned it, those look nice but still seem smaller than the w140 and are packed with electronic gimmicks that are prone to break for the used car buyer like me ;)
The poor mans diesel Merc is the W201 190D, in Africa they are called ,the African donkey,and muched loved
haha it's true. I won one.
next2normal 190D 2.5 turbo probably my ideal Mercedes .
@@neilrafferty2097 like to put a mild turbo on my 1992 2.5,
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 like to hear how you won one
@@mercedesclassicswithpierre1753 Won one? Have you done a video on this?
kind of disappointing with how mercedes has been about supporting the w202. couldn't get wearable parts i needed as they'd all gone NLA
yes it is...especially because these cars are everywhere!
I have a w140 s600 here in Australia they are very much sort after but allot of them here have high KLM. mine has 68,000klm which is low next year I should be Abel to sell it for around $50kaud
Hey do you still have the S600, is it Australian delivered? I'd consider buying.
Interesting opinion. What is the basis of your analysis? The 140 is arguably the greatest car ever made. An old old Mercedes does not compare in the overall experience. The parts and overall quality? Sure the old old is incredible.
U talk about King of road