I started with the Dewalt portable and ended up getting a cabinet saw. My biggest problem with the portable was keeping the fence aligned with the fence. I prefer the cabinet saw if I have the room for it.
I cannot disagree with the point you are making in this video. From a production and efficiency standpoint you are right. I personally have a nice shop with stationary equipment and I just like being in it. My hobby is woodworking and my shop is my fortress of solitude; my happy place. I remodel homes for a living and really love my new smart station and I'm looking forward to incorporating more of your benches and fixturing in the future. Track saws and guides are game changers and fantastic to have on the job site. I think I just like having lots of tools:)
Like my Therapist said, admitting that you just like having lots of tools is the first step. One day at a time, brother. One day at a time. See you at the session on Thursday. This was a breakthrough moment for certain! Nothing makes me happy like my tools.
I own and have owned a custom cabinet shop for over 40 years. A track saw and contractor saw are ok for a garage set up if you don't mind moving stuff around all the time. A dedicated cabinet saw with off bearing table and easy loading area will blow that type of setup away. Not to mention a 3 to 5 HP saw. My guys aren't even allowed to put anything on the outfeed table other than what's being cut. This is a comparison of apples and oranges. My opinion is that track saws and portable saws filled a niche that allows semi-pro craftsmen to compete with true business owners without investing in a commercial property which you really need to set up dedicated work areas. One last thing is that track saws and portable table saws cannot be beat for site work.
Ron YOU are the best power tool you own. Some woodworkers and low knowledge diyers sometimes think tools will substitute knowledge, expertise, and experience. Great video thanks for sharing all these years. Stay safe.
For years I used a decent contractor table saw. Problem is they typically have aluminum tops, and all the ones I tried had slight "out of plane" issues on either side of the blade. Cast iron has not had that problem in my experience. Also, an induction motor/belt setup is far quieter than the dirct drive motors on contractors saws. That alone is a big deal for people in residential settings. I got a "hybrid" table saw from Grizzley so its got the cast iron top and induction motor, but lighter base. Best thing I ever did for my level woodworking, which is slow and high quality.
Maybe if you're rough framing and tolerance varies from 1/2 inch to 1/16 inch but fine joinery only comes from heavy stable machine cutting tools or tedious hand tool use.
I agree with what you said in the context you provided. As long as you are working cabinets, finishing and sticking with 4/4 materials, your setup is awesome. But when you start building furniture there could be somethings that just don’t lend themselves to your setup. Working with rough sawn 8/4 or thicker hardwood, creating veneers, etc. The last time I did what you do was nearly 30yr ago. I’m a hobby woodworker now. Until recently, I shared my shop with cars. My cabinet saw was, still is, on wheels and moved to the side when not in use. It’s definitely not portable to a job site, but portable enough for a small workshop. I think if I started over today I might not need a cabinet saw. But I’d definitely want my bandsaw, jointer, thickness planer, and drill press. I love my tracksaw. I use it to breakdown sheet goods so much easier, safer, and better for my back. The tracksaw with the MFT style table make the mitersaw almost obsolete, the exception being crown molding. What we have today really opens the door for new ways of doing things. Folks can get started in woodworking with less investment and still enjoy the speed and accuracy of power tools. Contractors can be more efficient and cost effective. There are so many affordable options like CNCs, 3D printers, lasers, welders, etc. it’s an exciting time for folks who love to be creative and make things.
Well I’ve been in the trade since 1973, worked on site and in big workshops. I have both a small metabo table saw for over 12 years now and can not fault it. I also have several Felder full size machines, one being a 2.5 mtr long sliding table saw, had this over 10 years. I’ve watched you over the years now and again and came to the conclusion, that you like to push your products and ideas and sell plans. There is no way on earth that that set up that you have in your garage can produce consistent and accurate units, panels etc. European sliding table saws are in a different league, they are precise and accurate end of. And why you need Millions of holes drilled in every top that you have, is beyond me but each to there own it wouldn’t do for us all to think the same. So good luck for the future 😉
Pearls of wisdom, Ron! I'm a handyman, doing rough/finish carpentry (among other things), and the key thing is portability. You do have to bring the tools and the materials to the jobsite. I find I lose time and money when I have to go back into my shop to work on things.... The trac saws are a game changer and I use my Makita constantly for breaking down sheet goods and making closet shelves. Aside from the function of each tool I always look at the weight, as I'm constantly moving it around. The portable Milwaukee table saw I have is great, but doesn't get used too often.
Ron, I appreciate the engineering of your setup. I traded my cast iron table saw for a Makita cordless trac saw and haven't looked back. Looking forward to ordering your plans for my job site setup.
Solid advice Ron. I’ve come to the same conclusion, in much the same way over time. Thanks for all your wisdom over the years, it’s helped me fathom things out.
I agree with the space issue but I've got to say that when I went from a jobsite saw to a cabinet saw is was a night and day difference in my work and the ease of work. There are just so many more options with a cabinet saw so for me and where I'm at in my woodworking I couldn't imagine going back
You're not going to find a good scoring blade in any contractor or portable saw. If you are making cabinets and getting any good jobs at all, you can at least pay for a used German panel saw.
@@tomruth9487 There will always be 'better'. a portabale saw will in many cases cut good enough. Many do not need that million dollar fine cut, that maybe will be hidden anyway when everything assembled. anyway, people can spend their money however they want
As a hobbyist woodworker I had to go for equipment that saved me space without sacrificing quality. After 10 years I now have almost the same setup as you do. Thanks for sharing your extensive experience!
I’m in a 12x16 woodshop myself and I bought a cabinet contractor style saw off Facebook recently and I gotta say being I’m regretting it the more time goes on. I should have just saved up and bought the sawstop mini cts and been done with it. I could have built it into my workbench and had so much more space. I got a good deal on it, but I hate being cramped or having to much clutter…..
I also have a "one car" workshop and I've had a few contractor saws over the years that were adequate for my purposes. But a few years ago I had the opportunity to purchase two vintage Rockwell Unisaws (model 34-450) for $350 CAD including the Delta Unifence. I used the both to make one complete saw with all original parts. It has a 1.5HP Rockwell motor. Although ~60 years old the saw, wired for 240V, is a beast! I wouldn't part with it for all the Sawstops on the planet!
I have to agree that a good track saw has eliminated my desire for a larger table saw. Might seriously look at downsizing my jobsite pro to the smaller unit
I would agree with Ron, particularly if you are a DIYer or occasional cabinet maker. However, one big pitfall is the set up of the compact table saw. They rarely come out 100% square blade to fence, and long rip cuts can show this up. Spend the time to adjust your top to ensure blade is square to fence AND the miter slots and you can do some good precision work on a compact TS.
The Dwalt table saw has a geared fence that locks on both ends. Cuts very accurately. On the other hand my dad's $5K Delta saw not so much with its single point fence lock.For Plywood I use a track saw which cuts very accurately.
Lots of good points for mobile and tiny space folks. While my space is small, I can't imagine getting rid of my cabinet saw for one of the smaller types. I like "stationary" when it comes to table saws. Too much can go wrong.
I bit the bullet and invested $8k in a good used panel saw. It just raised the level of what I can do and a scoring blade certainly is nice. If you're going to make cabinets and compete with factories, you need some tools. But I've kept my cabinet saw in a smaller version, as there are still things it does better than my panel saw.
Ron I must admit, when I downsized my shop when I moved 12 years ago, and bought my MFT/3 and TS55 RBQ. I've never been sorry for loosing all that heavy iron. Yeah, I've got a moderate job site table saw, but I mostly use it with a cross cut sled to cut small pieces. And until last year, I didn't have a miter saw, cause I wasn't doing any crown molding. I'd love a Festool DF500 but dowels work just fine for alignment of cabinet sides or joining crown molding.
@@nasarazam Almost all sheet goods, and molding now. No slabs any more. For the most part I farm out drawer fronts and doors to shops that specaise in that work. That's why I can get away with a smaller shop.
Ron thanks so much for the videos they are incredibly helpful for a young dude like me trying to decide on what tools to invest in and what set up to buy into. I intend to build all the smart gadgets and gizmos you’ve created after the project I’m on. I’ll probably buy a track saw soon as well, why do you prefer to TSO parallel guides to Festool as parallel guides? Thanks again for all you do!
i wish youtube would allow pictures in the comments. ive made some awesome furniture grade pieces with portable table saws. i once bought a craftsmen from a yard sale for $10. put a new blade on it and used it to build a solid oak vanity that looked like an old library index, stamped copper sink. sold it for $1k. ive had the larger dewalt jobsite saw for the last 6 years and its a champ. ive used jigs to achieve angles beyond what the saw offers. my only gripe with the "jobsite" saw....it has no crank wheel for adjusting the trunnion!!! i zero out a digi level on the deck then set to blade and its always a matter of fussing around. could and should be better.
A big cabinet saw is the "Queen of the Shop" and demands a pretty permanent placement right in the middle of the floor, a "Smart Shop", a track saw, or even a Radial Arm Saw (which sits on the wall of the shared space) is a much better choice if you aren't a full time cabinet maker.
I couldn't agree more! If I had the time (life span) to do it again, given today's options for portability & accuracy, I would build & buy w/ efficiency of space & accuracy in mind. It makes little sense to swap out my Sawstop at this point; I've had it for 20ish years & it has served my digits well. Still, I enjoy your efficient designs and clever utility & will watch & learn & absorb as able. I wish we could bring our Prius into the garage; Northern VT won't allow a car & even my hand tools to coexist in a shared environment. On TSO. Products look solid, but they don't accommodate Mafell track saws. Won't give up that elegant engineering for anything. Mahalo!
There is no way that this portable setup could replace full sized shop machinery. I would like to see you rip through some 2.5 inch white oak without burning the edges on your small saw.
You completely miss the point of his video. He's speaking Specifically about on site work for cabinetry, trim, and closets......NOT production shop work! Why would you need to rip 2.5 in oak to build kitchen cabinets?????
Yes, a Festool,TS55 will not cut a 2.5” oak, but a TS70 will, no not burn the edge. Like any saw, you need the right blade for ripping hard wood, a plywood blade is not going to work well. That said, I have used a TS55 to rip a 2” Acacia slap plank, without burning.
Portable saws are great! I love my DeWalt cordless - But - when I need to rip through a fee hundred feet of 2 inch hardwood my Unisaw is what I use - besides the motor power, heavy stationary saws use heavy blades that don’t deflect.
I agree that for the specific scenario you've proposed having a big powerful cabinet saw is the preferred set up. The question is: How many weekend / hobbyist craftspeople are doing that sort of work? And do they have the luxury of enough space to have those large stationary tools?
@@77gmcnut There is no doubt that the materials used for construction have changed. We have moved away from solid wood to sheet goods and other proprietary products for most construction. Dimensional lumber is now only used for framing in all but the most expensive homes. Wood-framed construction has become very complex compared to my 1916 farmhouse. I believe that, apart from conservation, owning a full-sized table saw and a Stanley No. 5 plane is no longer essential. Ironically, modern construction projects seem to require more tools than my grandfather ever had in his toolbox. Nowadays, you need a Smart Shop just to carry all the fastening and cutting tools. I'm not sure what weekend or hobbyist craftspeople do these days. They seem to have been regulated or “complexed” out of most work. It's not the luxury of having enough space that's the issue, but rather the luxury of time and money.
Trim carpenter since 1979 I have had a lot of portable/ job site table saws . And some are very good . Especially for everyday stuff. But when I do a big job with a lot of nice trim ,built ins etc . I will be on the job a while I bring my big table saw . No comparison to the job site saw . So much better . More precise and stable . And yes I rip a ton of 4x8 cabinet grade plywood in it . Albeit , it's a 2 man job . I see guys with track saws and really wouldn't want one . '
They're not available in the US, but I picked up a festool TKS 80 2nd hand off marketplace. Absolute killer saw with the outfeed and sliding table. I use my friends saw stop cabinet saw a lot, and it's okay, but like you I find the small TKS (& a track saw) is the perfect sweet spot.
I get around in a Mercedes metris. Long wheel base. 79” drawer slides I bought that are made to carry cargo under those large RVs with access from the sides. So 79” deep in my case. About 24 wide, (wide enough for two systainers to fit width wise and not rattle). Barn doors on the van that fold all the way back to the sides, 270 degree. The drawer will cantilever and lock in place 54” from the back of the van. Inside the drawer I have a set of 60” linear slides. On the slides I built a base for the festool csc sys 50. See where I’m going with this? It’s ridiculous. Open the back doors, slide out the saw and the height is right there too. I rarely lift the saw. 😊
@@TheSmartWoodshop I’m really interested to know if a box joint jig can be set up on a job site saw and be as accurate as one set up on a full size table saw. Thanks
Saying things like “on the job” or “on the jobsite” or “building/remodeling homes” leads me to believe that a majority of the materials being used are construction grade stuff. Plywood, dimensional lumber, etc. If that’s what you’re primarily working with then I’d probably agree with your point on the tablesaw. Not much power is needed. But go try to rip some 8/4 hard maple on a jobsite saw and tell me it works well. Also, when working with dimensional lumber and building/remodeling homes you aren’t (typically) tasked with milling lumber. So before you could even get to the point of running that 8/4 hard maple through a table saw you’d need to joint and plane it. All this to say, what you are doing dictates your tools/setup. Calling a big tablesaw a waste of money (obviously video titles are inflammatory to drive views and fair enough on that) is as true as it is untrue depending on what you are making. There’s always sacrifices that need to be made. Money, space, etc all play into what people can have. But always remember that the best tool for the job is the tool that works best for you.
that cts has as much power as a full size sawstop cabinet saw lmao. I've cut Australian hardwood and burls on mine which is wayyyyy harder than maple and it has absolutely no problem. Even if you need full size, Taiwanese made cabinet saws masking themselves as American (powermatic, harvey, laguna, ss) are a huge waste of money compared to a 2nd hand, European, sliding panel saw.
@TheSmartWoodshop Well I have a sliding table saw and I used track saws before, I find track saws a pain to setup properly, on a slidung table saw i can set a knife line to the edge of the blade which is a lot more precise and faster as well.
Sliding table saws are fantastic and the ideal tool for breaking down plywood. I would own one if I had a fixed shop. However, as a general contractor and finish carpenter, my top priority is being able to take the shop to the job. Nothing-absolutely nothing-is more important than portability. If a company offered me a fully equipped shop with an 8x10 CNC machine, a 12-foot stroke saw, and all the other great, big tools, and all I had to do was give up my portable shop, it would take me less than a millisecond to say, "Thanks, but I'll pass." I am not a woodworker; I am a carpenter and home builder. I build homes and buy my tables and chairs. The bonus for me is that I can do everything I did with my fixed shop in my garage using the tools I have now. On the other hand, even if I had the big tools and shop, I would still need my portable shop. 😎
For sheet goods, yes a cabinet saw may be a bit overkill, but out of everything going from CTS to 3hp PCS is the difference in noise. I really hate jobsite saws now.
I’ll absolutely agree with you on the track saw, but I have used a good portable table saw and found it frustrating, awkward, lack of power, … my current saw is a modified old cast iron Craftsman new fence, motor, and miter gauge (that is that 90%+ saws need) I’ll match it against most any table saw Your system looks to be excellent but not for me
Monte- I have the SkllSaw portable table saw and it has plenty of power (due to the worm-drive motor) & comes with its own wheeled stand which is designed to make it easier for 1 person to load it into the back of my truck when it is in the "collapsed" position. My frustration comes from the rack & pinion fence system which greatly diminishes the ability to add any kind of aftermarket infeed & outfeed tables ( which I think is the greatest weakness of these types of saw).
I bought a Cabinet saw 20 plus years ago. I would not need it today because of the track saw and major improvements in table saws. Sawstop is Amazing I agree with Ron on this issue
I've come to the same conclusion as you, but the cabinet saw is a lot quieter than the portable saw. And that does make the shop more comfortable. As my career is focused on quiet products, I'm struggling to make a decision for the louder, but more practical solution for my hobby.
@@TheSmartWoodshop I see how you have a tight, flexible, and highly optimized system. And how the CTS fits what you are doing. But a nicer piece of equipment is still missed even if it doesn’t fit your overall system as well.
Shame that there arent really precise small table saws on the market for fine furniture makers. The new festool mini tablesaw might scratch that itch... I understand that general carpentry doesnt perhaps need that kind of accuracy but some trades do.
I heard some good things about that Festool Mini. But I've also looked at the Festool w/ SawStop (the only saw available in Europe with that technology), comes at an eye watering €2200 and by all accounts their proprietary fence and slide system is awful and goes out of alignment all the time.
Ahh I dunno bout out performing a cabinet saw, for me a contractor saw is where it's at, so I can move it and its accurate, jobsite saws are just that, and then there's dust collection that a jobsite saw sucks at..it's just a bold statement saying it out performs cabinet, but I see your point, and have seen some beautiful stuff made off a jobsite saw...
Cabinet table saws are only needed for right tilt miters, if you buy a cabinet saw with a left tilt thats a waste. Although the jobsite tavle saws are only left tilt im still waiting on a corded jobsite right tilt. Also the panel saws in shop are amazing
So it seems like this would be true for doing house building with carpentry and cabinet work. I wonder if that would work as well that for work for furniture work? @Ron have you had opportunities to build furniture? and if so how well do you think this would work well for furniture work?
I don’t build furniture aside from bookcases, dressers, mantels, cabinets, and similar items - basically, everything I build is a box. Therefore, a cabinet saw offers no advantage for my work. If I were to set up a shop with stationary equipment, I’d choose a sliding table saw, which can do everything a cabinet saw can do and more. As for whether my system would work for a furniture builder, I can’t say for sure. However, I believe most furniture builders prefer large, stationary shop equipment, as mobility isn’t typically a priority for them.
This looks like it needs a perfectly flat floor. In fact, it seems like your floor has a leveling compound floated on top. Many garage floors are simply not leveled to any degree. But otherwise not bad.
Sounds to me like you guys criticizing him saying hes fake, or does crappy work and what not, dont actually know what you are talking about. Ive seen some damn nice work done on some portable work stations. Its more about the craftsmans ability than the tools.
It's always the negative vocal ones that are the "internet geniuses".. if thhey were half as talented as they claim they'd be out in the shop, not watching youtube videos like this one
That sounds interesting. What materials were you working with? I could see how that would be the case with plywood or 4/4 hardwoods. Did you have an opportunity to try to cut 8/4 or 12/4 hardwoods? Would love to hear your thoughts.
@kennysoutherland9801 I'm sure that is where a difference would be noticable. I've only cut melamine and 4/4 walnut on both. But I've cut thicker maple and oak on the CTS and it made good cuts. I haven't tried the PCS on the same thickness yet but I'm sure I'll get a chance to. There's a shop close by with 5 of them and my friend also has one that I use sometimes.
I feel bad for the homegamers who, if they move shops they take 2 weeks of solid work just to pack it all up, and then they have to hire professional movers and still have to worry about things breaking. I've gotten overloaded with tools and now glad to be parting with them for a more rational setup. What if you could pack up and move your entire garage in say 3 hours. Think of the peace of mind that would be.
30 years building furniture, I disagree, I have a Delta 3hp and Powermatic 5 hp for ripping one saw the blade tilts to the right, the other one tilts to the left.
I agree; building furniture is different. I hope I made it clear that I’m speaking as a carpenter who builds and remodels houses, specializing in finish carpentry. I build boxes: cabinets, closets, bookcases, staircases, and buildings. I couldn’t build a rocking chair if my life depended on it.😎
I officially challenge anyone to make a square part 450mm x 450mm 18 mm ply better than me with a 20k saw. I'll use my track saw and parf guide any takers? and on top of that I will make ten that are not only perfect but exactly the same. You will only have to produce one perfect part with your Cabinet saw any takers?
No, it was about ROI at the time. I was offered a CNC to promote on the channel, but I decided it wasn’t the right fit for me at that point. In the future, I may decide to try a CNC, but first, I want to get into 3D printing.😎
Both saws have their place. If space limited then a compact saw is fine. But there is no way in hell a table top saw outperforms a stationary cast iron saw.
Couple thoughts: Not all job sites are conducive to setting up a shop; also, there’s a ton of set, breakdown time, no matter how smart. When the site works, of course, especially if you use Rob’s methods. My cabinet shop is the center of my shop universe and sound of a direct drive table saw is unbearable. I’m not generally a fan of any sentence that starts with “ you should” Love ya Ron.
Stop lying, Ron. A small jobsite saw can't launch an 80# sheet of plywood into your belly at 40MPH like a 3-phase cabinet saw can. Be honest with your viewers!!
Work smarter, not harder.The portable installation tools are just that, a compromise for portability. I'm ten times more productive in the shop with permanent, heavy tools, with plenty of space to support them, and more space for assembly, etc. Having everything at hand, clamps, glue, work tables, rolling tables to move stock from machine to machine. To be efficient, all tools must be ready to be used without moving things out of the way in order to set other things up. Bringing a cast iron cabinet saw to a job site would be as foolish as thinking a portable saw can do everything in a shop that a shop saw does.
It’s a big world with room for more than one opinion. I had a large shop and really enjoyed it, but building on-site was more productive and profitable for me. The fixed-base shop became a cost, not an asset. I’m speaking as a general contractor and finish carpenter. I had multiple trucks, trailers, and crews. My biggest expense was labor, and the most efficient use of their time was on-site. 😎
Im 30 yrs in at my own shop. Every shop needs at least an old school powermatic 10" with a Bissemeyer 52" fence. Dialed in just right you can cut out an entire kitchen in just hours and its bad ass on front and back. Then you get into all the shapers, jointers, wide belt etc. Those small saws are for job sites.
As a cabinet and furniture maker for 40+ yrs I can tell you a big heavy cabinet saw definitely has a few pluses. Mainly the quality of the cut. But what do I know - it's not like I've been doing construction work and stealing design ideas for 30 yrs.
No way. A cabinet saw will outperform that site saw in every metric. And the extra space it takes up? Negligible. You will never go wrong buying heavy when it comes to stationary woodworking equipment.
@@guytech7310 Depends on the job. If you're ripping big sheets, a track saw is great. But each cut needs a bit of time to set up accurately, and if you're building (for instance) a bunch of kitchen cabinets or drawers, a table saw with a fence or slide will let you make the many identical parts for your project in a fraction of the time. I don't have a lot of space so I compromised between the two: I added 2 clamps to the workbench to quickly and accurately mount my saw's track in a fixed position, parallel to an adjustable fence and dead square to a removable end stop. That lets me me set up for square cuts quickly, and I can easily make repeated cuts with accuracy. (Note that when working with a fence, considerations regarding kickback apply just as with a table saw)
The ginormous table saw I have suspected is a woodworkers status symbol for many. Of course then to justify it you need to build cross cut sleds. Maybe get rid of your miter saw to justify the cross cut sleds. And the 220 feed for the saw too. Keep up the clear thinking!
Hardly a status symbol. They have much more power are safer to use with large work pieces and stay calibrated much longer. A portable table saw is called a jobsite for a reason. It is for onsite small cuts or thin rips and typically does not have workhorse quality.
@@CrazyManwich For you not a status symbol. However I suspect that is not the case for many. Quality in what regard? Certainly not for sheet goods. Of course if you are in an industrial setting all bets are off. For most DIY, the cast iron monster table saw could be a show off tool. Track saws for example are not in your face tools, they just are unrivaled for sheet goods. Ron does not seem to have any challenges sans the big iron. Hey, if a big table saw works for you, why not. Each to his own. There is more than one way to go.
I do not understand how a portable table saw will out perform a dedicated sliding table saw. They are different tools for different jobs but to say a portable table saw will out perform a sliding table saw is ridiculous.
Sounds like all you do is rough construction and some rough cabinetry. In that case your little saw should be adequate. I’ve been doing fine woodworking for well over your 30 years and swear by my cabinet saws! Superb power and precision. Just get the right tool for the job and don’t make generalizations…
Robert, thank you for your comment and I'm new to woodworking, so please tell me what fine woodworking means. I've read and heard that a lot but I don't really know what it means.
My special is Finish Carpentry, but I do frame as well. I don't know what 'rough cabinetry' is?🤔 I do not build fine furniture like rocking chairs and such, but I build houses from start to finish. 😎
Compact table saw + track saw. Track saw is so much better than large table saw since you do have to push the plywood & you can cut at any possible angle. The track saw has total made a large table saw obsolete. The compact table saw is useful when you have to rip small boards down (ie cutting 1" pieces out of a large plank).
@@davidflanagan4977 I think that is kind of his point... he's not ripping 8/4 anything... most he works with is 3/4 and it might not even be solid, let alone hard. He has simply said that, for what he does, portable tools have done the job AND allowed him to save time/money by working onsite. Personally, I'd like to upgrade to something with a cast iron top but then I work exclusively in a shop and not onsite.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
Pros and Cons with each.
So I have both!
I started with the Dewalt portable and ended up getting a cabinet saw. My biggest problem with the portable was keeping the fence aligned with the fence. I prefer the cabinet saw if I have the room for it.
I cannot disagree with the point you are making in this video. From a production and efficiency standpoint you are right. I personally have a nice shop with stationary equipment and I just like being in it. My hobby is woodworking and my shop is my fortress of solitude; my happy place. I remodel homes for a living and really love my new smart station and I'm looking forward to incorporating more of your benches and fixturing in the future. Track saws and guides are game changers and fantastic to have on the job site. I think I just like having lots of tools:)
Like my Therapist said, admitting that you just like having lots of tools is the first step. One day at a time, brother. One day at a time. See you at the session on Thursday. This was a breakthrough moment for certain! Nothing makes me happy like my tools.
@@irenovatedmv 🪚🔨🪛😃
My mouth watered when he talked about all his old full size setup. The portable system is nice but it doesn’t make my mouth water like that.
I own and have owned a custom cabinet shop for over 40 years. A track saw and contractor saw are ok for a garage set up if you don't mind moving stuff around all the time. A dedicated cabinet saw with off bearing table and easy loading area will blow that type of setup away. Not to mention a 3 to 5 HP saw. My guys aren't even allowed to put anything on the outfeed table other than what's being cut. This is a comparison of apples and oranges. My opinion is that track saws and portable saws filled a niche that allows semi-pro craftsmen to compete with true business owners without investing in a commercial property which you really need to set up dedicated work areas. One last thing is that track saws and portable table saws cannot be beat for site work.
Ron YOU are the best power tool you own. Some woodworkers and low knowledge diyers sometimes think tools will substitute knowledge, expertise, and experience. Great video thanks for sharing all these years. Stay safe.
For years I used a decent contractor table saw. Problem is they typically have aluminum tops, and all the ones I tried had slight "out of plane" issues on either side of the blade. Cast iron has not had that problem in my experience. Also, an induction motor/belt setup is far quieter than the dirct drive motors on contractors saws. That alone is a big deal for people in residential settings. I got a "hybrid" table saw from Grizzley so its got the cast iron top and induction motor, but lighter base. Best thing I ever did for my level woodworking, which is slow and high quality.
Maybe if you're rough framing and tolerance varies from 1/2 inch to 1/16 inch but fine joinery only comes from heavy stable machine cutting tools or tedious hand tool use.
I agree with what you said in the context you provided. As long as you are working cabinets, finishing and sticking with 4/4 materials, your setup is awesome. But when you start building furniture there could be somethings that just don’t lend themselves to your setup. Working with rough sawn 8/4 or thicker hardwood, creating veneers, etc. The last time I did what you do was nearly 30yr ago. I’m a hobby woodworker now. Until recently, I shared my shop with cars. My cabinet saw was, still is, on wheels and moved to the side when not in use. It’s definitely not portable to a job site, but portable enough for a small workshop. I think if I started over today I might not need a cabinet saw. But I’d definitely want my bandsaw, jointer, thickness planer, and drill press. I love my tracksaw. I use it to breakdown sheet goods so much easier, safer, and better for my back. The tracksaw with the MFT style table make the mitersaw almost obsolete, the exception being crown molding. What we have today really opens the door for new ways of doing things. Folks can get started in woodworking with less investment and still enjoy the speed and accuracy of power tools. Contractors can be more efficient and cost effective. There are so many affordable options like CNCs, 3D printers, lasers, welders, etc. it’s an exciting time for folks who love to be creative and make things.
Very true! Thanks for sharing your expertise. 100% agreed, track saw and parallel guides is the way to go for breaking down sheet goods
Well I’ve been in the trade since 1973, worked on site and in big workshops. I have both a small metabo table saw for over 12 years now and can not fault it. I also have several Felder full size machines, one being a 2.5 mtr long sliding table saw, had this over 10 years. I’ve watched you over the years now and again and came to the conclusion, that you like to push your products and ideas and sell plans. There is no way on earth that that set up that you have in your garage can produce consistent and accurate units, panels etc. European sliding table saws are in a different league, they are precise and accurate end of. And why you need Millions of holes drilled in every top that you have, is beyond me but each to there own it wouldn’t do for us all to think the same. So good luck for the future 😉
Felder is awesome.😎🤙
Pearls of wisdom, Ron! I'm a handyman, doing rough/finish carpentry (among other things), and the key thing is portability. You do have to bring the tools and the materials to the jobsite. I find I lose time and money when I have to go back into my shop to work on things.... The trac saws are a game changer and I use my Makita constantly for breaking down sheet goods and making closet shelves. Aside from the function of each tool I always look at the weight, as I'm constantly moving it around. The portable Milwaukee table saw I have is great, but doesn't get used too often.
Ron, I appreciate the engineering of your setup. I traded my cast iron table saw for a Makita cordless trac saw and haven't looked back. Looking forward to ordering your plans for my job site setup.
Solid advice Ron. I’ve come to the same conclusion, in much the same way over time. Thanks for all your wisdom over the years, it’s helped me fathom things out.
Very welcome
I agree with the space issue but I've got to say that when I went from a jobsite saw to a cabinet saw is was a night and day difference in my work and the ease of work. There are just so many more options with a cabinet saw so for me and where I'm at in my woodworking I couldn't imagine going back
Track saw setups I’m seeing is the real game changer. And I have over 40 years experience
Man you got a WIG board in the background…. WILDLY IMPORTANT GOALS
I need to do that!!
Ron …love how you explained the system (which I use) this will allow some to see it’s advantages ..very good job !
Thanks, Ron!
I like cabinet saws, they feel great and seem much quieter . I’m happy that you are thriving, but I’m into cabinets and sliding panels
You're not going to find a good scoring blade in any contractor or portable saw. If you are making cabinets and getting any good jobs at all, you can at least pay for a used German panel saw.
@@tomruth9487 There will always be 'better'. a portabale saw will in many cases cut good enough. Many do not need that million dollar fine cut, that maybe will be hidden anyway when everything assembled. anyway, people can spend their money however they want
@@Rimrock300 So true.
Great video! Love all your input etc 😊
This was engaging and an interesting perspective. Thanks for sharing.
Glad it was helpful!
So glad I found your channel. I grew up working in small shops with my dad and grandfather we always made do with the space we had.
As a hobbyist woodworker I had to go for equipment that saved me space without sacrificing quality. After 10 years I now have almost the same setup as you do. Thanks for sharing your extensive experience!
I’m in a 12x16 woodshop myself and I bought a cabinet contractor style saw off Facebook recently and I gotta say being I’m regretting it the more time goes on.
I should have just saved up and bought the sawstop mini cts and been done with it. I could have built it into my workbench and had so much more space.
I got a good deal on it, but I hate being cramped or having to much clutter…..
I also have a "one car" workshop and I've had a few contractor saws over the years that were adequate for my purposes. But a few years ago I had the opportunity to purchase two
vintage Rockwell Unisaws (model 34-450) for $350 CAD including the Delta Unifence. I used the both to make one complete saw with all original parts. It has a 1.5HP Rockwell motor. Although ~60 years old the saw, wired for 240V, is a beast! I wouldn't part with it for all the Sawstops on the planet!
I can carry every tool I own. 😎🤙
I have to agree that a good track saw has eliminated my desire for a larger table saw. Might seriously look at downsizing my jobsite pro to the smaller unit
No replacement for 220 cabinet saw power makes all portable saws feel like toys. Love your stuff for job site work though
I would agree with Ron, particularly if you are a DIYer or occasional cabinet maker. However, one big pitfall is the set up of the compact table saw. They rarely come out 100% square blade to fence, and long rip cuts can show this up. Spend the time to adjust your top to ensure blade is square to fence AND the miter slots and you can do some good precision work on a compact TS.
The Dwalt table saw has a geared fence that locks on both ends. Cuts very accurately. On the other hand my dad's $5K Delta saw not so much with its single point fence lock.For Plywood I use a track saw which cuts very accurately.
Lots of good points for mobile and tiny space folks. While my space is small, I can't imagine getting rid of my cabinet saw for one of the smaller types. I like "stationary" when it comes to table saws. Too much can go wrong.
I love my cabinet saw compared to my old contractor saw
I bit the bullet and invested $8k in a good used panel saw. It just raised the level of what I can do and a scoring blade certainly is nice. If you're going to make cabinets and compete with factories, you need some tools. But I've kept my cabinet saw in a smaller version, as there are still things it does better than my panel saw.
Thank you and RUclips university, where we can get such wisdom from a lifetime of real word experience.
This is extremely helpful for me planning on building a small wood shop
Ron I must admit, when I downsized my shop when I moved 12 years ago, and bought my MFT/3 and TS55 RBQ. I've never been sorry for loosing all that heavy iron. Yeah, I've got a moderate job site table saw, but I mostly use it with a cross cut sled to cut small pieces. And until last year, I didn't have a miter saw, cause I wasn't doing any crown molding. I'd love a Festool DF500 but dowels work just fine for alignment of cabinet sides or joining crown molding.
Do you work just with plywood or do you rip hardwood with your track saw
@@nasarazam Almost all sheet goods, and molding now. No slabs any more. For the most part I farm out drawer fronts and doors to shops that specaise in that work. That's why I can get away with a smaller shop.
I agree. I think the SawStop CTS is the best saw on the market.
It is the best choice for the way I work. I am sure that others with different needs would not agree with me.
Ron thanks so much for the videos they are incredibly helpful for a young dude like me trying to decide on what tools to invest in and what set up to buy into. I intend to build all the smart gadgets and gizmos you’ve created after the project I’m on. I’ll probably buy a track saw soon as well, why do you prefer to TSO parallel guides to Festool as parallel guides? Thanks again for all you do!
I used the FT guides for years. They are not well designed. ruclips.net/video/mqA9edtoSCs/видео.htmlsi=wJMJnSiaoiONBCme
i wish youtube would allow pictures in the comments. ive made some awesome furniture grade pieces with portable table saws. i once bought a craftsmen from a yard sale for $10. put a new blade on it and used it to build a solid oak vanity that looked like an old library index, stamped copper sink. sold it for $1k. ive had the larger dewalt jobsite saw for the last 6 years and its a champ. ive used jigs to achieve angles beyond what the saw offers. my only gripe with the "jobsite" saw....it has no crank wheel for adjusting the trunnion!!! i zero out a digi level on the deck then set to blade and its always a matter of fussing around. could and should be better.
Great information!
A big cabinet saw is the "Queen of the Shop" and demands a pretty permanent placement right in the middle of the floor, a "Smart Shop", a track saw, or even a Radial Arm Saw (which sits on the wall of the shared space) is a much better choice if you aren't a full time cabinet maker.
I couldn't agree more! If I had the time (life span) to do it again, given today's options for portability & accuracy, I would build & buy w/ efficiency of space & accuracy in mind. It makes little sense to swap out my Sawstop at this point; I've had it for 20ish years & it has served my digits well. Still, I enjoy your efficient designs and clever utility & will watch & learn & absorb as able. I wish we could bring our Prius into the garage; Northern VT won't allow a car & even my hand tools to coexist in a shared environment. On TSO. Products look solid, but they don't accommodate Mafell track saws. Won't give up that elegant engineering for anything. Mahalo!
There is no way that this portable setup could replace full sized shop machinery. I would like to see you rip through some 2.5 inch white oak without burning the edges on your small saw.
I have that same small saw. I don't think it would have a problem.
A small saw might do it occasionally, but for everyday use, heavy cuts and longevity, the cabinet saw will win. Is also quieter.
Yeah this guy is a construction guy, different type of wood work as opposed to a fine furniture maker or large scale molding and trim maker.
You completely miss the point of his video. He's speaking Specifically about on site work for cabinetry, trim, and closets......NOT production shop work! Why would you need to rip 2.5 in oak to build kitchen cabinets?????
Yes, a Festool,TS55 will not cut a 2.5” oak, but a TS70 will, no not burn the edge. Like any saw, you need the right blade for ripping hard wood, a plywood blade is not going to work well. That said, I have used a TS55 to rip a 2” Acacia slap plank, without burning.
Thanks Ron
Portable saws are great! I love my DeWalt cordless - But - when I need to rip through a fee hundred feet of 2 inch hardwood my Unisaw is what I use - besides the motor power, heavy stationary saws use heavy blades that don’t deflect.
I agree that for the specific scenario you've proposed having a big powerful cabinet saw is the preferred set up. The question is: How many weekend / hobbyist craftspeople are doing that sort of work? And do they have the luxury of enough space to have those large stationary tools?
@@77gmcnut There is no doubt that the materials used for construction have changed. We have moved away from solid wood to sheet goods and other proprietary products for most construction. Dimensional lumber is now only used for framing in all but the most expensive homes. Wood-framed construction has become very complex compared to my 1916 farmhouse.
I believe that, apart from conservation, owning a full-sized table saw and a Stanley No. 5 plane is no longer essential. Ironically, modern construction projects seem to require more tools than my grandfather ever had in his toolbox. Nowadays, you need a Smart Shop just to carry all the fastening and cutting tools.
I'm not sure what weekend or hobbyist craftspeople do these days. They seem to have been regulated or “complexed” out of most work. It's not the luxury of having enough space that's the issue, but rather the luxury of time and money.
Looking at his shop surfaces I can tell that this guy is holier than thou.
Trim carpenter since 1979
I have had a lot of portable/ job site table saws . And some are very good . Especially for everyday stuff. But when I do a big job with a lot of nice trim ,built ins etc . I will be on the job a while I bring my big table saw . No comparison to the job site saw . So much better . More precise and stable . And yes I rip a ton of 4x8 cabinet grade plywood in it . Albeit , it's a 2 man job . I see guys with track saws and really wouldn't want one . '
No idea Robert Redford was a cabinetmaker!
They're not available in the US, but I picked up a festool TKS 80 2nd hand off marketplace. Absolute killer saw with the outfeed and sliding table. I use my friends saw stop cabinet saw a lot, and it's okay, but like you I find the small TKS (& a track saw) is the perfect sweet spot.
I'd take a 12in panel saw with a scoring blade any day of the week and twice on Sunday.
I get around in a Mercedes metris. Long wheel base. 79” drawer slides I bought that are made to carry cargo under those large RVs with access from the sides. So 79” deep in my case. About 24 wide, (wide enough for two systainers to fit width wise and not rattle).
Barn doors on the van that fold all the way back to the sides, 270 degree. The drawer will cantilever and lock in place 54” from the back of the van. Inside the drawer I have a set of 60” linear slides. On the slides I built a base for the festool csc sys 50. See where I’m going with this? It’s ridiculous. Open the back doors, slide out the saw and the height is right there too. I rarely lift the saw. 😊
Thanks for sharing !
Thanks for your information
😎🤙
@@TheSmartWoodshop I’m really interested to know if a box joint jig can be set up on a job site saw and be as accurate as one set up on a full size table saw. Thanks
Yes absolutely
Saying things like “on the job” or “on the jobsite” or “building/remodeling homes” leads me to believe that a majority of the materials being used are construction grade stuff. Plywood, dimensional lumber, etc. If that’s what you’re primarily working with then I’d probably agree with your point on the tablesaw. Not much power is needed. But go try to rip some 8/4 hard maple on a jobsite saw and tell me it works well. Also, when working with dimensional lumber and building/remodeling homes you aren’t (typically) tasked with milling lumber. So before you could even get to the point of running that 8/4 hard maple through a table saw you’d need to joint and plane it. All this to say, what you are doing dictates your tools/setup. Calling a big tablesaw a waste of money (obviously video titles are inflammatory to drive views and fair enough on that) is as true as it is untrue depending on what you are making. There’s always sacrifices that need to be made. Money, space, etc all play into what people can have. But always remember that the best tool for the job is the tool that works best for you.
that cts has as much power as a full size sawstop cabinet saw lmao. I've cut Australian hardwood and burls on mine which is wayyyyy harder than maple and it has absolutely no problem. Even if you need full size, Taiwanese made cabinet saws masking themselves as American (powermatic, harvey, laguna, ss) are a huge waste of money compared to a 2nd hand, European, sliding panel saw.
@TheSmartWoodshop Well I have a sliding table saw and I used track saws before, I find track saws a pain to setup properly, on a slidung table saw i can set a knife line to the edge of the blade which is a lot more precise and faster as well.
Sliding table saws are fantastic and the ideal tool for breaking down plywood. I would own one if I had a fixed shop. However, as a general contractor and finish carpenter, my top priority is being able to take the shop to the job. Nothing-absolutely nothing-is more important than portability. If a company offered me a fully equipped shop with an 8x10 CNC machine, a 12-foot stroke saw, and all the other great, big tools, and all I had to do was give up my portable shop, it would take me less than a millisecond to say, "Thanks, but I'll pass."
I am not a woodworker; I am a carpenter and home builder. I build homes and buy my tables and chairs. The bonus for me is that I can do everything I did with my fixed shop in my garage using the tools I have now. On the other hand, even if I had the big tools and shop, I would still need my portable shop. 😎
For sheet goods, yes a cabinet saw may be a bit overkill, but out of everything going from CTS to 3hp PCS is the difference in noise. I really hate jobsite saws now.
I’ll absolutely agree with you on the track saw, but I have used a good portable table saw and found it frustrating, awkward, lack of power, … my current saw is a modified old cast iron Craftsman new fence, motor, and miter gauge (that is that 90%+ saws need) I’ll match it against most any table saw
Your system looks to be excellent but not for me
Monte- I have the SkllSaw portable table saw and it has plenty of power (due to the worm-drive motor) & comes with its own wheeled stand which is designed to make it easier for 1 person to load it into the back of my truck when it is in the "collapsed" position. My frustration comes from the rack & pinion fence system which greatly diminishes the ability to add any kind of aftermarket infeed & outfeed tables ( which I think is the greatest weakness of these types of saw).
I bought a Cabinet saw 20 plus years ago.
I would not need it today because of the track saw and major improvements in table saws. Sawstop is Amazing
I agree with Ron on this issue
Thanks, great info
I've come to the same conclusion as you, but the cabinet saw is a lot quieter than the portable saw. And that does make the shop more comfortable. As my career is focused on quiet products, I'm struggling to make a decision for the louder, but more practical solution for my hobby.
The Jobsite Pro is hard to beat. It’s a better saw than the CTS. In my case, the smaller size wins, but I do miss the Jobsite Pro.
@@TheSmartWoodshop I see how you have a tight, flexible, and highly optimized system. And how the CTS fits what you are doing. But a nicer piece of equipment is still missed even if it doesn’t fit your overall system as well.
Shame that there arent really precise small table saws on the market for fine furniture makers. The new festool mini tablesaw might scratch that itch... I understand that general carpentry doesnt perhaps need that kind of accuracy but some trades do.
I heard some good things about that Festool Mini. But I've also looked at the Festool w/ SawStop (the only saw available in Europe with that technology), comes at an eye watering €2200 and by all accounts their proprietary fence and slide system is awful and goes out of alignment all the time.
I prefer having access to both cutting options. I'm a bit of a maximalist.
The beauty of having options. My current standard: no tools that I can’t pick up and carry on my own.😎🤙
Ahh I dunno bout out performing a cabinet saw, for me a contractor saw is where it's at, so I can move it and its accurate, jobsite saws are just that, and then there's dust collection that a jobsite saw sucks at..it's just a bold statement saying it out performs cabinet, but I see your point, and have seen some beautiful stuff made off a jobsite saw...
Cabinet table saws are only needed for right tilt miters, if you buy a cabinet saw with a left tilt thats a waste. Although the jobsite tavle saws are only left tilt im still waiting on a corded jobsite right tilt. Also the panel saws in shop are amazing
Panel saws are god level
What's the story with Open House @ 100 Davis St.?
So it seems like this would be true for doing house building with carpentry and cabinet work. I wonder if that would work as well that for work for furniture work? @Ron have you had opportunities to build furniture? and if so how well do you think this would work well for furniture work?
I don’t build furniture aside from bookcases, dressers, mantels, cabinets, and similar items - basically, everything I build is a box. Therefore, a cabinet saw offers no advantage for my work. If I were to set up a shop with stationary equipment, I’d choose a sliding table saw, which can do everything a cabinet saw can do and more. As for whether my system would work for a furniture builder, I can’t say for sure. However, I believe most furniture builders prefer large, stationary shop equipment, as mobility isn’t typically a priority for them.
This looks like it needs a perfectly flat floor. In fact, it seems like your floor has a leveling compound floated on top. Many garage floors are simply not leveled to any degree. But otherwise not bad.
Sounds to me like you guys criticizing him saying hes fake, or does crappy work and what not, dont actually know what you are talking about. Ive seen some damn nice work done on some portable work stations. Its more about the craftsmans ability than the tools.
It's always the negative vocal ones that are the "internet geniuses".. if thhey were half as talented as they claim they'd be out in the shop, not watching youtube videos like this one
where did you find the shirt?
I own a SawStop CTS and I've used a SawStop PCS and there's not much difference in the quality of cut when using the same blade on both saws.
That sounds interesting. What materials were you working with? I could see how that would be the case with plywood or 4/4 hardwoods. Did you have an opportunity to try to cut 8/4 or 12/4 hardwoods? Would love to hear your thoughts.
@kennysoutherland9801 I'm sure that is where a difference would be noticable. I've only cut melamine and 4/4 walnut on both. But I've cut thicker maple and oak on the CTS and it made good cuts. I haven't tried the PCS on the same thickness yet but I'm sure I'll get a chance to. There's a shop close by with 5 of them and my friend also has one that I use sometimes.
@@TheRealGOTdurrrred cool. I'm surprised to hear that about the oak and maple. Good to know. Thanks!
Nice vid. Why is your voice different??
I have a sliding table saw and I still want a cabinet saw and a cnc 😅
I feel bad for the homegamers who, if they move shops they take 2 weeks of solid work just to pack it all up, and then they have to hire professional movers and still have to worry about things breaking. I've gotten overloaded with tools and now glad to be parting with them for a more rational setup. What if you could pack up and move your entire garage in say 3 hours. Think of the peace of mind that would be.
A good track saw would save even more space…
Smart man
😎🤙
30 years building furniture, I disagree, I have a Delta 3hp and Powermatic 5 hp for ripping one saw the blade tilts to the right, the other one tilts to the left.
I agree; building furniture is different. I hope I made it clear that I’m speaking as a carpenter who builds and remodels houses, specializing in finish carpentry. I build boxes: cabinets, closets, bookcases, staircases, and buildings. I couldn’t build a rocking chair if my life depended on it.😎
You made it clear Ron some just aren’t absorbing the facts on the video
What do I need 10 pockets for?
I officially challenge anyone to make a square part 450mm x 450mm 18 mm ply better than me with a 20k saw. I'll use my track saw and parf guide any takers? and on top of that I will make ten that are not only perfect but exactly the same. You will only have to produce one perfect part with your Cabinet saw any takers?
LOL Track saw. I can get it accurate enough to less than 10mils.
So I have to ask. If money wasn't an option would you have got that expensive CNC?
No, it was about ROI at the time. I was offered a CNC to promote on the channel, but I decided it wasn’t the right fit for me at that point. In the future, I may decide to try a CNC, but first, I want to get into 3D printing.😎
Oh, another Cabinet Maker's Prius in the wild? I hope you know the guy. If not, find him :)
Good points 👍
Love it
Both saws have their place. If space limited then a compact saw is fine. But there is no way in hell a table top saw outperforms a stationary cast iron saw.
Couple thoughts:
Not all job sites are conducive to setting up a shop; also, there’s a ton of set, breakdown time, no matter how smart.
When the site works, of course, especially if you use Rob’s methods.
My cabinet shop is the center of my shop universe and sound of a direct drive table saw is unbearable.
I’m not generally a fan of any sentence that starts with “ you should”
Love ya Ron.
No construction workers use a cabinet saw. Wood workers use cabinet saws
Ripping big sheets on a jobsite saw is just more dangerous. But if you need a saw for moving around thats what the jobsite saw is designed for.
Table saws of any size are not a good choice for breaking down plywood. Track saws are faster, safer, and make a cleaner cut.
Lost me at Prius…
A 16 year old Prius with 250,000 miles and going strong. The F150 has to be kept on a battery tender as it gets driven 200 miles a year. 😎🤙
Great content! I would suggest decreasing the rotation speed of the tripod face-tracking camera. The rapid panning can be distracting.
It is on the slowest setting. I am not the only one that has complained about the jerkiness. DJI needs to add a damping like they have on drones. 😎🤙
I hope Helene has not damaged your area too much.
Stop lying, Ron. A small jobsite saw can't launch an 80# sheet of plywood into your belly at 40MPH like a 3-phase cabinet saw can. Be honest with your viewers!!
Work smarter, not harder.The portable installation tools are just that, a compromise for portability. I'm ten times more productive in the shop with permanent, heavy tools, with plenty of space to support them, and more space for assembly, etc. Having everything at hand, clamps, glue, work tables, rolling tables to move stock from machine to machine. To be efficient, all tools must be ready to be used without moving things out of the way in order to set other things up. Bringing a cast iron cabinet saw to a job site would be as foolish as thinking a portable saw can do everything in a shop that a shop saw does.
It’s a big world with room for more than one opinion. I had a large shop and really enjoyed it, but building on-site was more productive and profitable for me. The fixed-base shop became a cost, not an asset. I’m speaking as a general contractor and finish carpenter. I had multiple trucks, trailers, and crews. My biggest expense was labor, and the most efficient use of their time was on-site. 😎
Laughs in dado stacks
You make a strong argument Ron 😎
Im 30 yrs in at my own shop. Every shop needs at least an old school powermatic 10" with a Bissemeyer 52" fence. Dialed in just right you can cut out an entire kitchen in just hours and its bad ass on front and back. Then you get into all the shapers, jointers, wide belt etc. Those small saws are for job sites.
One correction it's a Delta10" Unisaw and Bissemeyer fence 😊
As a cabinet and furniture maker for 40+ yrs I can tell you a big heavy cabinet saw definitely has a few pluses. Mainly the quality of the cut. But what do I know - it's not like I've been doing construction work and stealing design ideas for 30 yrs.
I think it looks like you've made pretty good money. The rest would be gravy and a bit greedy.
I don't know if I can take woodworking advise from somebody who drives a Prius.
You don’t know who this guy is? (Answer: A living legend.) Or is this comment a joke?
How does the car you drive affect your wood working abilities? What an idiot comment.
And my bicycle is cheaper, takes up less space in my garage and will outperform a Ferrari!
No way. A cabinet saw will outperform that site saw in every metric. And the extra space it takes up? Negligible. You will never go wrong buying heavy when it comes to stationary woodworking equipment.
Track Saw: Hold my beer!
@@guytech7310 Depends on the job. If you're ripping big sheets, a track saw is great. But each cut needs a bit of time to set up accurately, and if you're building (for instance) a bunch of kitchen cabinets or drawers, a table saw with a fence or slide will let you make the many identical parts for your project in a fraction of the time.
I don't have a lot of space so I compromised between the two: I added 2 clamps to the workbench to quickly and accurately mount my saw's track in a fixed position, parallel to an adjustable fence and dead square to a removable end stop. That lets me me set up for square cuts quickly, and I can easily make repeated cuts with accuracy. (Note that when working with a fence, considerations regarding kickback apply just as with a table saw)
@@kaasmeester5903 You can set up a jig for the track saw for multiple cuts.
The ginormous table saw I have suspected is a woodworkers status symbol for many. Of course then to justify it you need to build cross cut sleds. Maybe get rid of your miter saw to justify the cross cut sleds. And the 220 feed for the saw too. Keep up the clear thinking!
Hardly a status symbol. They have much more power are safer to use with large work pieces and stay calibrated much longer.
A portable table saw is called a jobsite for a reason. It is for onsite small cuts or thin rips and typically does not have workhorse quality.
@@CrazyManwich For you not a status symbol. However I suspect that is not the case for many. Quality in what regard? Certainly not for sheet goods. Of course if you are in an industrial setting all bets are off. For most DIY, the cast iron monster table saw could be a show off tool. Track saws for example are not in your face tools, they just are unrivaled for sheet goods. Ron does not seem to have any challenges sans the big iron. Hey, if a big table saw works for you, why not. Each to his own. There is more than one way to go.
It gets even more challenging since some of my tools were three-phase, requiring a 5 hp rotary phase converter.
I do not understand how a portable table saw will out perform a dedicated sliding table saw. They are different tools for different jobs but to say a portable table saw will out perform a sliding table saw is ridiculous.
I completely agree with you-saying a portable table saw will outperform a sliding table saw is ridiculous. 😎🤙
Sounds like all you do is rough construction and some rough cabinetry. In that case your little saw should be adequate. I’ve been doing fine woodworking for well over your 30 years and swear by my cabinet saws! Superb power and precision. Just get the right tool for the job and don’t make generalizations…
Robert, thank you for your comment and I'm new to woodworking, so please tell me what fine woodworking means. I've read and heard that a lot but I don't really know what it means.
My special is Finish Carpentry, but I do frame as well. I don't know what 'rough cabinetry' is?🤔 I do not build fine furniture like rocking chairs and such, but I build houses from start to finish. 😎
Don't Balk at Ron Paulk
Rough cabs!!!
When was the last time you were working on a job site? You always seem to be in your garage
Compact table saw + track saw. Track saw is so much better than large table saw since you do have to push the plywood & you can cut at any possible angle. The track saw has total made a large table saw obsolete. The compact table saw is useful when you have to rip small boards down (ie cutting 1" pieces out of a large plank).
Yeah, just try and rip 8/4 hard maple through that toy saw...
Is this a joke
@@davidflanagan4977 I've ripped Oak plywood & even Solid Oak planks with a tracksaw.
Are you using a Dull blade?
@@davidflanagan4977 I think that is kind of his point... he's not ripping 8/4 anything... most he works with is 3/4 and it might not even be solid, let alone hard. He has simply said that, for what he does, portable tools have done the job AND allowed him to save time/money by working onsite. Personally, I'd like to upgrade to something with a cast iron top but then I work exclusively in a shop and not onsite.
my mafell track saw has the same power as your shitty, full size, chinese cabinet saw