Also check out the Virgin's Promise, which I think is a fantastic alternative to the Hero's Journey. Where the Hero's Journey is about going on an adventure, battling monsters, and ultimately protecting the status quo of the community... Virgin's Promise is about claiming one's power, disrupting the status quo, and ultimately transforming the community for the better.
Omg I finally found my people 😊 I don't know or can't find anyone here that read as much as I do and love Jungian psychology ❤ I love this video, it's helped connect together so many things.
Hello, im from brazil and actually, im interested in creating a good history. Studing about narrative and archetype, i somewhat step on the "heroine journey", and i had to tell, this is really fascinating. Thanx for you video, you just open my mind to a new topic to study more haha
This was so thought provoking, thank you! This has helped me realize I have a lifelong pattern of abusive relationships and betrayals from women. It’s a reoccurring theme that I must figure out how to heal and integrate.
The Divine guided me to your channel. Thank you for turning me to Marie Louise von Franz - never heard of her, but I've heard of Jung all of my life. Just like you said. Your explanations are so helpful. I've been frustrated with a lot of the prevalent teachings on the hero's journey and even how Joseph Campbell is interpreted. It's no surprise to me that Marie Louise von Franz may have been overshadowed by Carl Jung. Just like how nobody talks about Aleister Crowley’s wife Rose Edith Kelly, even though she was a great mystic and channeler. (Rose Edith Kelly is the one who actually performed the channeling that Crowley transcribed to create the Book of the Law...but why should anyone credit her, right?)
This was a real eye opener for me and you broke it all down wonderfully. I’ve been on my own journey of self discovery and relate much to what you described. I’ve added both books to my buy asap list. I’m wondering if you’ve read Women Who Run With Wolves?
I always thought the hero's journey can be applied to both the man or the woman. I don't agree with the differences. Sure, they can be used as a guide to a story. But, from my understanding, If you boil down the hero's (male or female) journey more, like the modern story circle, you pretty much get the same major changes and growth. Not all man's journey is outward and not all women's journey is inward. In great stories the hero (male or female) has both the inward and outer journey.
@@PersephonesSister These are guides anyway, so I guess it's just another approach. But obviously the archetypes and externals that differentiate male or female changes as society changes. That's why I always thought the basic journey can apply to both, at the crux. At any rate, it's always good to also be able to move away from typical journey's in order not to have predictability.
Yes totally. One of the ways I differentiate them is the hero’s journey as the extraverted journey, and the heroine’s as the introverted one. Generally, the former seeks an outer treasure while the latter seeks inner power. But these are all just different ways of outlining the same process of self-discovery of course!
I'm with you on the outer and inner changes of the hero and heroine in both of the structures. My take is that it shouldn't be a differentiating factor. However, I am fascinated by the idea of the "separation from the feminine" and the subsequent reunion with it. It's a very interesting take.
As a male writer, I often find thinking about the heroine’s journey as a way to help create deep, well rounded male characters as well as vital female ones. I believe everyone has both masculine and feminine heroine/hero’s journey inside of them.
Hi there! Thank you so much for the content that you create. This is the first video I have stumbled upon of yours, and immediately I had to subscribe. I will definitely be doing a deep dive of your channel and the ideas that you share on there. I am working towards being an illustrator and creating a visual novel of my own that incorporates themes of the hero's journey. What's interesting is that I had no idea of the heroine's journey until I have met you, and it's crazy because the main character of my story deals with becoming whole by journeying into the depths of herself. Once, again, thank you for this video, I find it very helpful and relatable, not only with the art that I create, but also with the journey within myself!
Dear Mariana, This and the other video on the Heroine's Journey are some of the clearest quality explanations of this important concept I have heard. John Truby tries to explain the feminine myth in his book on Genres, and he uses this Jungian approach as well. Still, I have doubts that the Archetype Goddess has actually been tapped at all because the powerful Goddess is portrayed as dark according to Jung, Murdock, etc., but never good. What about Glynda the White witch in Oz? The Wonderful Wizard of Oz was written in 1900, and Jung split from Freud around 1913, so Frank Baum likely didn't know Jungian analysis. Maybe his journey for the heroine was different from Jung's, namely it included a positive Goddess. Isn't "Descent" to the Goddess which appears in the violent anti-Goddess epic poetry of Gilgamesh based on the assumption that the Goddess is a horrible monster that needs to be killed, head cut off, etc., and replaced with a male God (just like uppity women and the laws of Assyria and Greece that men could beat their wives in order to control them easier). I'm not totally convinced to accept a male perspective (Jung, Truby) on female archetypes. We may need to keep thinking on this one, but tell me or point me in a direction if I'm missing something. Thanks!
It is marvelous how the musical Wicked took the idea to another level with the two witches at first at odds but soon find each other. The song For the good is such a moving song of the love of two women, the duet with Glinda and Elphaba says so much as the dark and light witches are brought together in synergy creating new energy leading to a rebirth. "Like a handprint on my heart, And now whatever way our stories end, I know you have re-written mine By being my friend." The rest of the words in the song bring tears to your eyes and hairs rise on the back of your neck. One must laugh though, that Elphaba left with the straw man, a symbol of the hollowness of much male authority, to finally leave oz (the unconsciousness). In my heart I just hope that Glinda and Elphaba meet again in some way, perhaps before they both pass. Thanks once again. (Shaun)
No not anymore unfortunately but I may offer something like it in the future! Also we are reading the Heroine’s Journey in my book club if you’re interested! Check out www.sorormysticapodcast.com/the-cloister 👍
not sure yet if I agree with you, I am writing my dissertation on the heroines journey. Maybe Jordan Peterson's approach of the female hero (beauty and the beast) is wrestling with your view here. Nonetheless, you have a thought provoking and high quality video which has really made me think. All the best
You compared them to sort of an extrovert journey and an introvert journey. Does that mean an introverted man could follow a sort of pattern of the heroine's journey? Perhaps not as gendered ofc but yearning for spiritual/familial reconnection and healing etc. I'm just curious
I so love your channel- and the deep dives you take us on. One individual that keeps popping into my conciousness is Jezebel. My mother's church tells tales of Jezebel, and encourages the congration to boo, hiss and catisgate. My hackles are up, and from my own investigations see jezebal as a powerful leader, a strong woman. She defended her pagan indiginous culture and was murdered. I would LOVE to know your perspective.
I love it! But I’m confused with something. One of the first steps is a mentor. My question is how does one get a mentor? Do I wait for one? Do I google available mystic mentors? Can a RUclips channel be one? Can this channel be one??
Understand that the hero's journey and the heroine's journey are just story structure books. If you want to apply it to your life then go ahead, but know that it may not what you are looking for. But yes, if men and women were to use these as life blueprints as you infer, then we would be a lot happier depending as to which one we correspond with. The problem is what the goal is for the hero's journey. That is what gets in the way a lot of the time.
@@Srindal4657 it just feels like the hero’s journey is patriarchal and I don’t want to follow something that puts women down. I feel as though the heroines journey is for both and works but thank you!
The link was at the top of the video, but here it is ✨ The Real Divine Feminine & Patriarchy | The 3,000 year old secret that changed the world ruclips.net/video/YUqsq1Q8rV8/видео.html
Thank you for your video. I have this budding theory that the Heroine's Journey isn't about reclaiming the feminine so much as reclaiming our truest essence which is what is shut down within both men and women and what "the feminine" goes within to find. I enjoyed listening to your insights and have subscribed. 😃
4:45 I'm sorry to say that you've totally misunderstandood the point of the Hero's Journey, which is, in fact, to return to one's community of more use than at the outset. I think that a Heroine's journey that doesn't reach or teach this part of the cycle can only aslo miss the entire point of the journey. Becoming more femanine or masculine is not a goal, especially in a multi gendered world where sexually constricting roles are being abandoned. I'm saddened to come across such a regressive approach to any kind of human journey, that it's apotheosis should be assumed to be gain for oneself, without reference to community is belittling and destructive, and sadly, submits to a capitalist war like narrative of journeying for personal gain.
This video is a very quick overview of the main themes of the book that I find important. I do not in any way believe the hero or heroine’s journeys are about becoming more masculine or feminine. I believe the heroine’s journey is one of the ways of understanding why our society has become so richly diverse and risen beyond gender constrictions. You have misunderstood my thoughts entirely.
i do not think you understood any of this video. that’s definitely a common and misfortunate narrative in many discussions like these online but that’s not at all the case here.
The hero and heroines journey also has to do with being outcasted by a large group in the story who completely misunderstands what they are going through by the evils of people in the world’s society. Also the choosing of darkness or light. There is also coming to grips with a much darker aspect of reality representing dreams and death. Nobody wants to talk about that last part as it goes into spooky theory territory.
Also check out the Virgin's Promise, which I think is a fantastic alternative to the Hero's Journey. Where the Hero's Journey is about going on an adventure, battling monsters, and ultimately protecting the status quo of the community... Virgin's Promise is about claiming one's power, disrupting the status quo, and ultimately transforming the community for the better.
Thank you for this comment. Between this and the video I’ve got three new books on my wishlist.
You won’t be everyone’s cup of tea, but you are definitely a very rare and high quality one. Thank you so much for sharing.
Agreed.
I can't disagree with you
Omg I finally found my people 😊 I don't know or can't find anyone here that read as much as I do and love Jungian psychology ❤ I love this video, it's helped connect together so many things.
you deserve more subscribers mam
Love, Appreciation ❤ 🙏
This is one of the best RUclips videos I have ever seen! Love it. Thank you. ❤🙏🏼
Thanks for the explanation. It was really interesting to see this under-discussed archetype.
love your personality, and your depth and breadth of knowledge; I'd sign up to take a class with you any day!
Aw that’s so sweet 😍
Hello, im from brazil and actually, im interested in creating a good history.
Studing about narrative and archetype, i somewhat step on the "heroine journey", and i had to tell, this is really fascinating.
Thanx for you video, you just open my mind to a new topic to study more haha
Love the depth and intelligence of your posts.
Thank you so much that means a lot!
This was a fascinating video. I could listen to you analyze movies for hours.
Really enjoyed this. Thank you. The music was subtle and a nice touch. I look forward to watching more.
Thank you so much’
Literally, just got chills!
Great. I love the Dorothy part and the ruby slippers. Many thanks.
Another nuanced, rich video. Looking forward to the 22nd!
✨✨
I’ve been hoping to find content like yours for a while. You are an inspiration 💕✨
Aw thank you so much, so glad you’re here! ♥️
Recently stumbled on your channel and Im absolutely loving this. Cant wait to dive a lot more into what you teach, don't stop!
❤️🙏
This was so thought provoking, thank you! This has helped me realize I have a lifelong pattern of abusive relationships and betrayals from women. It’s a reoccurring theme that I must figure out how to heal and integrate.
This was great.
Well done! Top job explaining the hero's journey versus the heroine's journey. I look forward to hearing more from you.
So grateful for this video ❤
Commenting to boost the channel, very interesting!
Thank you it was a good post.
The Divine guided me to your channel. Thank you for turning me to Marie Louise von Franz - never heard of her, but I've heard of Jung all of my life. Just like you said. Your explanations are so helpful. I've been frustrated with a lot of the prevalent teachings on the hero's journey and even how Joseph Campbell is interpreted.
It's no surprise to me that Marie Louise von Franz may have been overshadowed by Carl Jung. Just like how nobody talks about Aleister Crowley’s wife Rose Edith Kelly, even though she was a great mystic and channeler. (Rose Edith Kelly is the one who actually performed the channeling that Crowley transcribed to create the Book of the Law...but why should anyone credit her, right?)
If Joe Campbell were alive today, he might realize that the journey of the hero is to the Divine Feminine.
I agree, and if you read some of his work carefully I think he already thought so ♥️
So if the hero's journey is to the divine feminine the heroine's journey is about remembering that she herself is and contains the divine feminine.
This was a real eye opener for me and you broke it all down wonderfully. I’ve been on my own journey of self discovery and relate much to what you described. I’ve added both books to my buy asap list. I’m wondering if you’ve read Women Who Run With Wolves?
Yes it’s so good!
Hi! This is the first video of yours I see and I love it. Very interested in your work!
Thank you and welcome!
Great job ❤
I always thought the hero's journey can be applied to both the man or the woman. I don't agree with the differences. Sure, they can be used as a guide to a story. But, from my understanding, If you boil down the hero's (male or female) journey more, like the modern story circle, you pretty much get the same major changes and growth. Not all man's journey is outward and not all women's journey is inward. In great stories the hero (male or female) has both the inward and outer journey.
Yes, as can the heroine’s journey!
@@PersephonesSister These are guides anyway, so I guess it's just another approach. But obviously the archetypes and externals that differentiate male or female changes as society changes. That's why I always thought the basic journey can apply to both, at the crux. At any rate, it's always good to also be able to move away from typical journey's in order not to have predictability.
Yes totally. One of the ways I differentiate them is the hero’s journey as the extraverted journey, and the heroine’s as the introverted one. Generally, the former seeks an outer treasure while the latter seeks inner power. But these are all just different ways of outlining the same process of self-discovery of course!
I'm with you on the outer and inner changes of the hero and heroine in both of the structures. My take is that it shouldn't be a differentiating factor.
However, I am fascinated by the idea of the "separation from the feminine" and the subsequent reunion with it. It's a very interesting take.
As a male writer, I often find thinking about the heroine’s journey as a way to help create deep, well rounded male characters as well as vital female ones. I believe everyone has both masculine and feminine heroine/hero’s journey inside of them.
You do not need to apologise for being you and expressing your authentic expression.
Hi there! Thank you so much for the content that you create. This is the first video I have stumbled upon of yours, and immediately I had to subscribe. I will definitely be doing a deep dive of your channel and the ideas that you share on there. I am working towards being an illustrator and creating a visual novel of my own that incorporates themes of the hero's journey. What's interesting is that I had no idea of the heroine's journey until I have met you, and it's crazy because the main character of my story deals with becoming whole by journeying into the depths of herself. Once, again, thank you for this video, I find it very helpful and relatable, not only with the art that I create, but also with the journey within myself!
Thank you, so glad you’re here!
Dear Mariana, This and the other video on the Heroine's Journey are some of the clearest quality explanations of this important concept I have heard. John Truby tries to explain the feminine myth in his book on Genres, and he uses this Jungian approach as well. Still, I have doubts that the Archetype Goddess has actually been tapped at all because the powerful Goddess is portrayed as dark according to Jung, Murdock, etc., but never good. What about Glynda the White witch in Oz? The Wonderful Wizard of Oz was written in 1900, and Jung split from Freud around 1913, so Frank Baum likely didn't know Jungian analysis. Maybe his journey for the heroine was different from Jung's, namely it included a positive Goddess. Isn't "Descent" to the Goddess which appears in the violent anti-Goddess epic poetry of Gilgamesh based on the assumption that the Goddess is a horrible monster that needs to be killed, head cut off, etc., and replaced with a male God (just like uppity women and the laws of Assyria and Greece that men could beat their wives in order to control them easier). I'm not totally convinced to accept a male perspective (Jung, Truby) on female archetypes. We may need to keep thinking on this one, but tell me or point me in a direction if I'm missing something. Thanks!
It is marvelous how the musical Wicked took the idea to another level with the two witches at first at odds but soon find each other. The song For the good is such a moving song of the love of two women, the duet with Glinda and Elphaba says so much as the dark and light witches are brought together in synergy creating new energy leading to a rebirth. "Like a handprint on my heart, And now whatever way our stories end, I know you have re-written mine By being my friend." The rest of the words in the song bring tears to your eyes and hairs rise on the back of your neck. One must laugh though, that Elphaba left with the straw man, a symbol of the hollowness of much male authority, to finally leave oz (the unconsciousness). In my heart I just hope that Glinda and Elphaba meet again in some way, perhaps before they both pass. Thanks once again. (Shaun)
I love it! I am glad I found you! Is the webinar available?
No not anymore unfortunately but I may offer something like it in the future! Also we are reading the Heroine’s Journey in my book club if you’re interested! Check out www.sorormysticapodcast.com/the-cloister 👍
@@PersephonesSister oh, thank you, I will check
not sure yet if I agree with you, I am writing my dissertation on the heroines journey. Maybe Jordan Peterson's approach of the female hero (beauty and the beast) is wrestling with your view here. Nonetheless, you have a thought provoking and high quality video which has really made me think. All the best
You compared them to sort of an extrovert journey and an introvert journey. Does that mean an introverted man could follow a sort of pattern of the heroine's journey? Perhaps not as gendered ofc but yearning for spiritual/familial reconnection and healing etc.
I'm just curious
Yeah I think that’s an interesting possible perspective!!
This is very interesting. I have never considered The Hero's Journey to be exclusively for men. Even if it's historically been default...
Is there another webinar?!?! I’m beyond interested:)))
Not one currently but make sure to follow me on Instagram if we release one again!
I so love your channel- and the deep dives you take us on. One individual that keeps popping into my conciousness is Jezebel. My mother's church tells tales of Jezebel, and encourages the congration to boo, hiss and catisgate. My hackles are up, and from my own investigations see jezebal as a powerful leader, a strong woman. She defended her pagan indiginous culture and was murdered. I would LOVE to know your perspective.
I love it! But I’m confused with something. One of the first steps is a mentor. My question is how does one get a mentor? Do I wait for one? Do I google available mystic mentors? Can a RUclips channel be one? Can this channel be one??
Yes I think all of those make sense!
@@PersephonesSister Thank you!
Could this also work for men too? I don’t wanna follow the hero’s journey if it has a lot of cracks so I’d like to try the heroines journey
Understand that the hero's journey and the heroine's journey are just story structure books. If you want to apply it to your life then go ahead, but know that it may not what you are looking for. But yes, if men and women were to use these as life blueprints as you infer, then we would be a lot happier depending as to which one we correspond with. The problem is what the goal is for the hero's journey. That is what gets in the way a lot of the time.
@@Srindal4657 it just feels like the hero’s journey is patriarchal and I don’t want to follow something that puts women down. I feel as though the heroines journey is for both and works but thank you!
BUT WHICH VIDEO ABOUT THE ARCHETYPAL FEMININE AM I SUPPOSED TO WATCH?
There was no link, I would love that link, please :D
The link was at the top of the video, but here it is ✨
The Real Divine Feminine & Patriarchy | The 3,000 year old secret that changed the world
ruclips.net/video/YUqsq1Q8rV8/видео.html
Thank you for your video. I have this budding theory that the Heroine's Journey isn't about reclaiming the feminine so much as reclaiming our truest essence which is what is shut down within both men and women and what "the feminine" goes within to find. I enjoyed listening to your insights and have subscribed. 😃
I definitely have a mother complex.
Is it wrong to call a female character a hero?
Of course not! This book uses the word heroine, and so I am too for this video 👍
4:45 I'm sorry to say that you've totally misunderstandood the point of the Hero's Journey, which is, in fact, to return to one's community of more use than at the outset.
I think that a Heroine's journey that doesn't reach or teach this part of the cycle can only aslo miss the entire point of the journey.
Becoming more femanine or masculine is not a goal, especially in a multi gendered world where sexually constricting roles are being abandoned. I'm saddened to come across such a regressive approach to any kind of human journey, that it's apotheosis should be assumed to be gain for oneself, without reference to community is belittling and destructive, and sadly, submits to a capitalist war like narrative of journeying for personal gain.
This video is a very quick overview of the main themes of the book that I find important. I do not in any way believe the hero or heroine’s journeys are about becoming more masculine or feminine. I believe the heroine’s journey is one of the ways of understanding why our society has become so richly diverse and risen beyond gender constrictions. You have misunderstood my thoughts entirely.
i do not think you understood any of this video. that’s definitely a common and misfortunate narrative in many discussions like these online but that’s not at all the case here.
The hero and heroines journey also has to do with being outcasted by a large group in the story who completely misunderstands what they are going through by the evils of people in the world’s society. Also the choosing of darkness or light. There is also coming to grips with a much darker aspect of reality representing dreams and death. Nobody wants to talk about that last part as it goes into spooky theory territory.