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I just compare *The fume* generated from soldering with a cigarette... it's slowly going to kill your lugs over time. Which is bad. Yes i know... i reply over 1year later. But better later than never lol.
Guys he is right get an extractor. My dad is a plumber and uses flux to solder pipes together and after 30 years of that - as he has no extractor or protection for his lungs - he breathes like he smoked. So guys please don't be like him get an extractor.
Mitchell wodach different amounts by large comparison. Plumbing solder is usually much larger than the 1mm solder wire smd hobbiests use. Louis' flux globs are magnified. Take it from Big Clive who has been doing this for decades...
My grandfather has been soldering for 50 years almost everyday without extractor. He also smokes, which doesn't help him. He is now 70% blind and can't breath properly without sounding like a ran a marathon while having a cold.
What is in the fumes being extracted? My doctor said flux is animal fat and if it were causing issues, it would make me cough or feel bad in some way but I never have. And smoking will make you cough way before 30 years. That being said I still plan to get one just in case. I also got a lead test and my levels were barely measurable. I read that most lead absorption comes from ingestion not inhalation and I always wash my hands after and usually wear nitrile gloves while soldering.
Just a note: the circle of grey stuff doesn't come from the solder and flux, it's just dust. The discoloration, on the other hand, comes from the solder and flux fumes. None the less, it is important to get a fume extractor.
When I did repair in the Army. They took this very seriously. In-fact, they would have extractors built overhead into the ceiling. They have to pay for work related disabilities so it shows how serious the damage can be when the Army spends the most money on fume extraction.
I started playing with/learning electronics as a kid and quickly learned that I needed some kind of extraction, I'm asthmatic and even small amounts of soldering got at my chest, I made an extractor with a cheap fan and some cooking extractor filter, it worked to an extent and you could see the crap building up on the filter paper. At 16 I started working in an electronics factory and saw the crap in my filter in my Metcal extractor and realised how much my home made extractor wasn't filtering... I brought a Metcal extractor as soon as I began working for myself and always use it,even for a quick, 1 minute job, it wasn't cheap (about £600 or $900) but it was well worth it. There is nothing at all macho about fucking up your health.
If you exhaust your fumes outdoors you can use any KW fan you prefer without filtration. "Bounce house" centrifugal blowers move serious air so I use those to ventilate my welding room in my shipping container shop.
In Austria you have to use fume extraction our repair guys workplace gets checked randomly about once a year by an health inspector and when there would be no fume extractor they would close down the whole office.
A boss that actually takes Health and Safety at work seriously and does what is right because they want people to finish work as healthy as they started their shift then leads from the front and not only makes sure his place of work is safe but tells the world what to do on youtube ! that is a new one on me. Louis, you often talk about "cleaning up your part of the world", this right here is how its done !
set up an inline fan out the window with some ducting. tape /seal off the extra parts of the window so your don't get fumes blowing back...ide guess like 25 bucks at homedepot. done ;) broke man's gotta solder
To be honest I don't think this is an issue for a hobbyist. A half hour a month of solder fumes doesn't seem like a big deal. But I am 100 percent onboard with proper PPE and fume extraction if you're doing this with any level of regularity.
+Jacob Rau I'm a 'hobbyist' learnist kind, I choose electronics for my future. And I solder like 7H a week. This video kinda wakes me up real bad. I'm saving my money now.
The cheapest way to get a very good protection is just by buying a real half facepiece respirator mask and wearing that while soldering. I do this as a hobbyist. New filters do cost only about 12 €. Of course a fume extraction device is better, because it also cleans the room, while i have to open all the windows and leave the room after the work is done, but a respirator mask is better than nothing and much more versatile. The half facepiece respirator mask does only cost you 22 € and will be usable for years.
I completely agree with you, there is nothing more important than the health. Health is the only wealth. Its simple as why some people choose not to smoke.
soo if its that "disgusting ..shit".. why you dont look like that all the time ? www.flickr.com/photos/148198851@N02/32396182513/ :D:P ..(.... dont read next text if you dont have anythink beter to do.. i supose nothing more what someone dont write before) .....i can give to you hunderts of this mask for free ..they just need some shiping from Poland. you will be more healty :D......ok ok i get you point i just.. :P i my self hate all fumes and even at work undergroud some times in 10-20x than max alowable levels dont know how many more dust than outside and im near one people that using mask near all that time with some excludings. there are even some peoples that dont want put mask on when dont see own hand by that many dust in "air" and they like some testosterone gorila say stupid things that by he meaning put me in position that im some freak stupid idiot...... in that situations i think ex.: why he just dont make suicide or he never clean at home hehe what he talk to he wife when she cleanig ? Back to video: regular air all around us is ...... "this ..shit what is go inside you body" go there even when you not solder and will be just sit.. read book or doing nothing .... you breath little less this "shit... some of is stop on filter... but i dont think you not using some dust mask only for good looking (yy i know you use air conditioner but he grab some to) or run some vacumm cleaner 24/7/365 like that he will grap in that normal conditions without moving from one place a few kilograms of "this shit" and you not will be need take "this inside you body" and you will be fastest on 4miles etc. (personaly i use not all time but i have make some "fumes smoke snake eater" made from many connected old vacum cleaner flex pipes and hair dryer's suck air outside home) ......
It's a nice comparison ,but most of that black stuff is normal dust , I think what you should show is that the used filter is yellowish from the rosin fumes, as for fume extractors , usually the cheap thin carbon filter don't really do the job, like your filter ,the best way is to buy a shower fan and a hose and blow it out the window
Indeed. Most of the stuff caught in the pre-filter is regular dust: lint and dead skin. It looks yucky but found in every home, and is mostly harmless and comes out with a cough. That's what the pre-filter is there for, to make sure the later filter stages don't clog up. That does *not* invalidate the need for fume extraction and filtering obviously, but the nasty stuff mostly comes in the form of ultrafine particles or solubles.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I have some of those air purifiers that operate on the same principle, a fan, a filter, and a pre-filter, and the pre-filter always looks scummed up like Louis's pre-filter just from household dust and such. Or you can look at your furnace filter and see how quickly it gets filled. I don't know what smoke would look like on a pre-filter, maybe like the filter of a cigarette I guess.
Thank you, I now feel slightly proud of my fume extractor. It isn't exactly top of the line, but I think it was worth buying now that I have started to solder more often.
+Samuel Doye You don't need top of the line, just as long as you are thinking about it and put effort in to not inhale that crap. I bought the FA-430 because it was worth it to not deal with wasting time researching what to buy when I had a stack of stuff to do, and I know if I buy something made by Hakko(besides the FM-206) it will work. But it doesn't mean everyone has to spend that much on their own setup.
I wish my dad would listen to your advice. I've tried talking to him about the importance of ventilation and limiting exposure to smoke/chemicals but he has this old school mindset that none of that stuff matters.
The big stuff isn't really that unhealthy. The human body is able to excrete large and coarse particle. Nano-sized particles and sharp particles like asbestos however is a different matter. Also metallic fumes and anything else than carbon might give an unwanted result from the body..
have you ever ate a pizza ? In other news when I did a deep dive into the notion that saliva and nostril hair filter out particles over a certain size I found the basis of this theory came from a two day workshop held by the World Health Organisation on the ceramic industry, funded by companies making ceramic materials and the evidence was the companies said their employees were not worried about the dust. I did the research as I am a union health and safety representative of a large company and the company H&S Officer put forward this argument when I was compiling about dust from buffing. When I asked for a peer reviewed study that the body expels the larger particles he said he would get me one. At the next meeting he said "he would have it next month". I presented my findings and asked had he ever ate a hamburger because they are quite large. By the next meeting the job causing the dust had been moved to elsewhere with a extraction system, but he would still get me the study. That was two years ago, crickets
I dont solder enough to get a fume extractor, but that doesn't mean i dont take care to protect myself from it, i use a box fan near a window and solder near that to pull the fumes away.
I have the same Hakko fume extractor. 2 hours heavy soldering in a small room and no sings of any flux smell. Don't be cheap, get one of these and save your lungs
+toly78 So true, we aren't talking about something slightly irritating, or bad smelling. These fumes are POISON, and will damage your lungs in ways that may never heal. Its just as bad, if not worse than, cigarettes!
Yeah, anyone who has gotten flux in a small cut on their hands can tell you it doesn't feel great at all. Good indication that getting into your lung tissue is not fantastic either.
It is way worse then smoking! Ask any lady that has worked at a radio factory in the old days, soldering all day long without a extractor or any thing to protect them. You doesnt know anyone that worked there? Well most have died with lungcancer...
You are right. Once i asked in an internet forum about electronics a couple of years ago about the right filter type for a respirator mask to do soldering work. They laughed at me, but i knew in this case i am more smart than them, so i just called the company of the respirator mask directly and got an answer. I don't solder much in a year, but when i do it, i use always my half facepiece respirator mask when soldering. BTW. new filters costs me only about 12 €, but it's worth the money because my lungs are more important.
To be fair you asked about a respirator mask, so yes that'd get a laugh as you dont want or need a mask for soldering. Ideally you remove the fumes before the get near your face. It sucks it away from a few inches from the iron.
Thanks for not trivializing the health risks associated with soldering. I've always wanted to get started so I can fix a whole bunch of broken retro hardware, but _this_ is the whole reason why I still haven't.
After watching this video I'm thinking back when i was learning to solder spending 5 minutes breathing in lead smoke and burning my fingers to solder 2 wires together. Very eye opening. I solder electronics for model cars.
You are so right, I did not have a fume extractor and started to get respiration related problems but I did not know the cause until I started looking your videos and you talked about fume extraction. I'm also in the independent repair business (but I do measurement and calibration gear) It was a bit difficult to make/find one in a way it is not giving problems. One like you have is no option, I'm surrounded by testgear and often the whole instrument that needs repair is on my desk. So I have to preposition it constant. I now have a commercial one that has a lamp-like swingarm I mounted on a metal bridge-like frame I made over my desk . It has a big but silent 230V fan and a carbon filter. It really makes a difference. (the Alu-frame is to guide f.i. testleads, support things against tipping over or mounting things for a test setup.) Fred
I went cheap, I have a regular air filtering system on one side of my soldering workplace, and also I have two small PC case fans on a small stand on the second side. That made a horizontal air flow from the fans directly through my whole workplace to the filtering system. Even though both the air filter and the fans are fairly low power (90W filter and 2x4W fans), the wind current is so strong, that I have to increase soldering temperature by 50 to 100 degrees to prevent it from cooling down my soldering tips and the solder joints before i finish the work. I think it is actually more convenient setup than those tunnels because you don't need this setup to be close to you, the air current is strong enough so that you can place them further away and still benefit from the filtering. The air current covers completely my work space, no need to set up anything, it makes a kind of a horizontal air curtain. The filter I bought used for 50€ (and changed all the filter parts of course), the fans are part of my own preheater that I designed by myself, they were for few €. When I put it on full power, I can even light a small camp fire on the workplace and not smell any smoke :P
Fume extraction is essential for any work like this. I wish I had one when I used to do a lot of electrical work in cars. I always had a fan blowing it out. Now I have extraction in my home work shop for painting, laser cutting, dust, etc. extremely well worth the one time investment. It keeps the work area cleaner, saves your lungs, and helps you get more work done by staying healthier.
This is a very important message for all of us who enjoy soldering electronic kits. In fact I just paused the video and ordered a fume extractor online. I will wait for it to arrive before continuing my oscilloscope project. In the past I used a simple fan to pull the fumes away from my workbench and hopefully out the window. It helped a bit, but it was too noisy and often the windows were closed. So this video will be a beneficial word to the wise for all soldering enthusiasts. Good work. Now I will check out your vegetarian video!
Lou, you are such an inspiration man. I watch your videos every day. I feel like you GET people like us. You teach very valuable lessons in EVERY video and in different ways. I pray you never stop keeping people like us in line. Thank you.
Louis, loads of respect for you taking a solid line on health. The side effects of not using fume extraction are real and very bad. Specifically, the fumes from the burning rosin (resin, flux, whatever) are nasty. Some refer to occupational asthma or industrial asthma or other terms, but it is real and I live the effects of it after a lifetime in the industry. Many doctors palm it off as 'adult onset' asthma, but it is real. When I started as a 16 year old apprentice in the military, we did not use ventilation or fume extraction - safety was all about cleaning or protecting the work area, not our health! At least our militaries did eventually change that attitude and do care for their people now, but for me that was halfway through my career. The effects can be very long term and may not show up for 20+ years. Once the immune system becomes vulnerable through the long term fume exposure, it also preps the body to be less immune to other allergens. So essentially, the industrial asthma opens the way for me to have asthmatic reactions to other allergens! Please, please everybody, take the fume extraction seriously.
A FFU(fan filter unit) cost only about 150＄ in China (that's just the retail price for single unit), it is an affordable investment. However, smaller factories in China get virtually no protection at all.
This video 3 years on got me to buy a basic fume extraction system, i cant afford the 500 dollar one but the 50 dollar one online with a carbon filter will do a world of difference to fumes coming straight up into my face thankyou for this video
For my soldering i just bought a bit of MDF board. Screwed a 120mm high airflow PC fan to it and using some PVC pipe fittings attached a bit of small aircon duct to it. Then i stick the MDF board in my window and blow the fumes right outaide. Cost me all of about $20
I have used the smaller desk fans with the carbon filter in them and they work, they are okay, at least better than nothing. I upgraded my set up and got an inline mains extractor fan unit (they are usually used in bathrooms and stuff) and some ducting. Ducting on the the desk to the fan, then from the fan to out the window. Direct, high volume extraction to outside. No fumes or anything in the room and no need for filters etc. Whole set up was like $40.
Just got my fume extractor in the mail today after using a cheap hakko smoke absorber for a year. Finally saved up enough money for it. My lungs thank you Louis.
This is great. I occasionally solder but have been ignorant for a couple years. Thanks for being so vocal on the matter...glad this video popped up while searching for something else.
I'm using a Shop-Vac as a fume extractor, I simply hooked a hose to the exhaust port, ran it out the window and ran the intake hose in front of my work area. The whole thing only cost 60 bucks used at a yard sale and works phenomenally.
Shop vacs rock and don't need filters if exhausted outdoors. The polyethylene conical dust separators that fit atop any pail or drum you like are great for collecting machining chips from my lathe and mill so if you want to keep crap out of your vacuum check those out. I use the ancient trick of panty hose over the filters to greatly extend their life (by several years in my cases).
Wow. This is the most reasonable advice I've seen online in regards to the subject of soldering fumes. People get so defensive and downright hateful when you even imply that maybe you could be breathing in LEAD rather than just flux. So many soldering tutorials where dudes don't wear gloves. It's pretty sad. I've also seen adult men get soaked in led acid battery fluid all over their hands like no big deal. Every single molecule of lead that enters your bloodstream via your skin, lungs, mouth, or eyes will stay in your body FOREVER. I am also extremely poor, I make less thank 12k per year. I solder outdoors with a fan I got from goodwill sucking up the fumes right in front of my work. I also wear a soldering gas mask rated for lead filtering during extended work sessions, and I always wear latex gloves.
Hi Louis last night 18 sept i ended up in hospital as an emergency admission, where i was given a chest X-ray the doctor explained i had unexplained shadows on my lungs, which i guess would explain my slight breathlessness. I don't smoke, i live in the country but i do electronics repairs etc without a fume extractor. Silly me, THANK YOU.
couldn't afford a good extractor, so i got a pc fan and some filters and made my own, i hung it above mt desk on the wires and it works pretty well for me. Thank you for encouraging me to think about my health, I've been breathing in this crap for too long.
I made my own solder sucker out of a 12v marine inline fan and flex dryer tubing. Sounds like a jet when it’s on high but the Fumes go outdoors far away. I also weld with flux core wire on galivanized steel outdoors with a huge shop fan and a respirator. PPE is your only hope! Never ever let some fool tell you different!
I also use eye protection because one time while just reattaching a connection I had some sort of air bubble form I think and a small dot of molten solder was sent flying...it arced and hit me about one inch below my right eye. I stopped immediately and went to find my safety glasses I had buried in some other gear. That little dot of solder burned quite a bit but I was very thankful it only hit my cheek.
I am still using the hold-your-breath technique as a hobbyist. I ordered a nice USB powered desk fan of Ebay but it still hasen't arrived. I'll probably have to buy another one.
I always wear a small mask when soldering. I also keep one or 2 fans on and open all of my windows. Something about inhaling any type of fume scares me. since a few of my relatives died of Lung Cancer. I think it's great that you spread awareness about it.
I want to begin soldering. I love this thing and everytime I'm watching videos about this, specially from Louis. Fumes were always a concern for me, I didn't even started it yet because I can't figure how to set up a system for this. Everytime I've soldered for hobby until now I've ended up with a headache. This is probably a simptom I don't want to have regularly if I really get into this business. So, since I live in Brazil, and in here everything is like third world country, and most of the electronical stores that works with solder doesn't even care about health, only about money making, I don't think we have good options for fume extraction...
Excellent video! I'm glad Dave said about you! I made my own years ago using a 12"x 22" carbon filter and fan from an indoors grow room! the ones they use to remove the smell when growing weed... So people saying it cost to much!! they are wrong as you can buy a grow room air scrubber kit for $20-$100+ from ebay etc... It may help to save your life!!
I've got a shop-vac that would work decently as a cheap solution for fume extraction. It has an inlet and outlet with a filter in the middle. Hook up a hose to both ends and run the outlet outside if you're worried about anything that makes it past the filter. Should work pretty well and was only about $30-50. Plus it can still be used as a vacuum.
You can build a beastly extractor for peanuts using the small or large shop vac of your choice and any HEPA and activated charcoal filter panels you wish. Mine is a small shop vac whose hose fits the cut-off end of an antifreeze jug which took longer to wash off than connect. You can use clamps, magnets or zip tie yours as I did to a spare monitor arm. Filters are key. You can match or beat commercial units simply by using appropriate filter media but the best way is to exhaust outdoors because "filter and recirculate" does not give you FRESH air. Plumbing shop vacs is easy as is cutting a panel to insert in a window so your fume extractor also draws clean air into your workspace. If you exhaust your air you don't need to filter it. I collect all the shop vacs large and small I can score cheap (yard sales etc) and have them throughout my shops. If you place your filter on the exhaust side of the vacuum it can be large, bulky and mount anywhere including walls (unused wall space should be put to work for zero footprint equipment locations, I even hang my 1U server like a painting).
I’ve only soldered like twice to replace some game cart batteries & try to start repairing my Genesis controller ports, and I had no idea this was a an issue, even with lead-free solder. And my preexisting asthma wouldn’t help either. One time when my mom was right all along. Even if I’m moving my soldering outside, I’m gonna look into a Hakko FA-400 filter. Or use that high power fan my dad has in his garage. Thanks for this vid, it’s been a month or 2 since I first soldered in my room and this just adds to why I should never do that ever again.
A good way to do this on a budget is what I'm doing, take a high power bathroom inline extractor fan, place hoss on both ends, one end goes into the loft and out under the eaves, the other end comes through the ceiling and sits above the soldering station, job done, no filters needed, extracts as well as the expensive ones.
I felt like crap without any fan. I got a Lasko box fan, took it apart and sealed a cheap carbon filter at the intake, then got a small desk fan which I put right where I'm working aimed at the box fan intake. Totally worked.
I'm with you on the fumes but when I solder I just open a window and stick a box fan in it. I don't do it for a living through. May father used to make tattoo needles for a living (between jobs as a machinist). The funny thing is he was paranoid about the fumes and actually took the time to build a basic fume extractor yet he smoked two pack a day. He has COPD now.
So i hate buying filters, so i plumbed in a system to just vent outside. More expensive in the short term, much much cheaper in the long term. It is also quieter.
hey, what you showing in the prefilter is just normal dust, that precisely what the prefilter do, filter the normal dust dot get me wrong, im totally with you with the fact that we have to do the max to not breath fumes i dont have a real fume extractor, but i do like you say: i have the one with a simple fan and carbon filter, i open the windows and catch my breath whan i see fumes lol
I do a lot of soldering in my dorm room and I have a 3 layer carbon filter and some ducting as my home-made fume extractor. Also comes in handy for vaping without setting off the fire alarm ;)
up until I watched your videos ( started a while ago) I didn't even know the fumes were any harmful at all. Obviously I looked into it and now have a flexible pipe with a blower to suck the fumes from me workbench directly outside, spent probably like 30 bucks on it but it does the job for me. And yes I know it probably isn't ideal but it's the only way for right now how to efficiently get the fumes away from me. Thanks for the video Luis :)
"I don't give two s**** of a f*** what everyone else is doing". As a business owner and wholesaler I've said that to so many customers over the years. In fact I've said those exact words quite a number of them. Bravo to you sir.
*JESUS FUCKING CHRIST*!!! Thank you! Thank you so much good sir! Ugh, is this stuff so complicated for all of these people?! Just unbelievable. I am already screwed, I have cancer, asthma, kidney failure, and a plethora of tumors, so I could *easily* justify how it's pointless for me to use a fume extractor, and despite my current financial state of being, I still find it important to have built my own activated charcoal fume extractor. It's just unbelievable that people would put forth the thought and effort into justifying the ridiculous malarkey that you are calling out in this video! Once again, I really do greatly admire your 'no bullshit' approach to what is right. Most of the people that stand behind their perception of what is right do so passively, with the whole, "Ummm... Yeah, I um... I think that maybe people should probably always use a fume extractor, um, because even if they don't care, um.. Well... The people around them maybe, ummm, might not want the, ummm, odor, sort of, you know, having to smell the odor... Plus, all of the, ya know, purported health issues, I mean, they probably aren't true... ", and so on and so on, just passively trying make some weak ass argument instead of just saying, "Hey, get a soldering to iron, because that shit is bad for you, and if you work at home, your wife, your children, hell, even your fucking dog doesn't need that crap in their body man!"... My apologies for the rant, and for the probably weaving in and out of the lane of the topic at hand... I just wanted to thank you kindly for taking the path of integrity and just saying, without any possible gap for misunderstanding, to point out that which *YOU KNOW* to be right, without any semblance of doubt! Well done good sir, and good on you! Thank you once more! Be well!
Wow! You surprise me when ever I watch your video of course positively!! You proved me that i am not crazy as so many others telling me! Continue as you are a nice guy!. Thanks Michael from Vienna Austria
Thanks for video, very good example on visualizing what happens if one don't care. Just got myself a fume extractor (similar to PACE 200) tonight for my homelab.
This was brilliant, particularly the analogy to the repition and tolerance of racist statements. I'm a newbie in the electronics world and have been holding off on soldering until my cheapo fume extractor arrived from China. It got lost in the mail. How lucky can a person get? Now I'll wait a little longer and buy a proper fume extractor. Thank you. Roberta Laidman
We had air extraction at the repair shop I used to work in 20 years ago, just tubes and a fan to blow it outside. And the way these tubes looked like on the inside after a few months !! Tar and sticky goo from the flux all over!
hey for the people who are broke and love to solder. I'm setting up an inline fan with some exhaust ducting to exhaust to outside. Louis has a closed loop system which filters air and replenishes the air in the room. A cheaper option would just be exhaust to outside. like a dryer vent. I'm going to be setting this up on my station after seeing that abortion of an air filter. Thanks again louis for the psa! 80 year old me thanks you.
I had to do a tiny bit of soldering on one of my guitars recently. The jack needed to be replaced, so I had to solder it loose, install the new one and then solder the wires back in place. I actually put a desk fan at a speed/distance where I got maximum airflow over the desk without cooling down the soldering iron/components too much. I had two large windows open for ventilation and still I held my breath while hanging over the desk to solder everything in place. There's no way I'm gonna inhale all that garbage. If I had to do soldering on a regular basis, I'd get a fume extractor for sure.
great clip, important topic. not to make fun but solder smell has a bit of nostalgia for me, but non the less i have a diy fume extractor with a carbon filter because in the end i value my heath above all
I agree that a fume extractor is important if you are soldering regularly. if flux fumes burn my eyes, then it's pretty obvious it's bad for my health.
We have our own filter mechanisms too. Namely hairs in the nostrils and the windpipe to grab the large pieces and wet mucus to micro filter anything else! So you are not completely unprotected without a filter, but yea don't breathe in the toxic fumes. Better safe than sorry. You can also use a small vaccum cleaner to such the fumes, im sure everyone has one of those in their office.
I got a fume extractor years ago. I picked up a cheap mod kit from a surplus store, and screwed it to a 120mm fan. Rather than the typical computer fan, I used the high flow, 120 volt, all metal fans that we installed on motor drivers at my old job. Good airflow. I got a rotary inline lamp switch and some power cords from the same surplus shop, and wired up simple fume extractors that you could just place on the bench and run, with no extra power supply or wall wart. I loved the kit so much, I bought enough kits for all the soldering stations at work and told them to use the shit. If they weren't sure whether it was worth it to spend on 'em, fuck it. FREE. Just use the shit! It was super simple. They did like it and did pay me. I still have, and still use mine, though these days, that old industrial fan has a but of a rattle to it. I should look into replacing it. Over the years, I got my hands on a bunch of variacs, and learned I could plug the fan into a variac to control it's speed. Even dialing it back to 90-100 volts greatly reduced the noise, while still giving a pretty good suck. The original kits only had the white filters, like your prefilter, but I got a set of carbon filters to sit behind the white filter later on. The flux fumes always bothered me. I used to just open a window and hope a breeze would clear it, but that doesn't work in winter, or in heavy rain. I wish I had had a good (or even a cheap) fume extractor when I was still a kid!
Thank you for making me aware. I just bought one. You might have lengthened my life there... in 30 years I might think back and you could have been a life changer there :)
first of, you should check the inner filter too, the thing you see on the thin outer filter is just dust and other kind of dirty particals, the inner filter is actualy the filter that filtrates the fume, your fume extrator manual should say when that filter needs to be replaced. second, i was soldering as a hubby and foundt that when ever i would have soldered then i would have alot of slime in my throat the rest of the day, so i builded one my self with just a dust filter, 3 active carbon filters and 4 pc fans, some scrap plastic that i had laying around, a went flex tube, 1 self made circuit board and some glue, it took me 1 hour to make(drawing a plan, making pcb, soldering, gluing stuff together etc..) and that fixed my problem. thats what borders me too that so many sacrifice thier health just because they are too "cool" for spending 1 hour on making a fume extractor, its not even that expensive especialy not for an electronic repair shop or anyone else who repairs alot of electronics, i think i spend around 10$ in total on it where the active carbon filters where the most expansive. 10$ for saving youre health is like no cost at all compared to end up having asma or living with oxygen mask rest of life because of broken lungs.....
Tip: Cheap but not so comfortable over long times: A KN95 / PPP3 mask. Some people have them still at home from Covid time. Perfect protection, even better than a fume extractor because nothing will get through, unlike with fume extractors, where your face is usually quite near to the fumes.
I weld most of it is enclosed spaces, bought a painter helmet and air fan. I was called Buck Rogers because the helmet looks like a space helmet with a hose on back of it.
I replaced my Sega Genesis Shadowrun save game battery via soldering a couple years ago. Totally not worth it. I did not know what I was breathing for the couple of seconds of soldering. Thank you for this PSA!
I did Radon mitiagtion fan, exaust out (not recycle crap back inside), higher volume of air, better suction, way!! more silent, and in the end, cheaper!
On the cheap for lab work and soldering, I just use a 40$ exhaust hooked up to a socked activated carbon filter tube for 25$ and some flanged flex tubes for 12$. I have asthma and early COPD and to much BS in my lungs to take to many chances even if I can not afford a 400$ fume extractor. You could just set the exhaust assembly with a filter on the floor and it will clean the air in the room but to protect the motor and for just in case, I hook it up to suck through the filter and out a window. I mean it is pretty good and does not even leave a smell, the flex tubes can easily be moved on the fly next to my work. It will not only protect you, but it will also completely deodorize the air given time. I use a 6 inch but a 4 inch would be fine for just soldering and flux fumes.
I've been using the hold breath/desk fan for years but was planning to build a cheap computer fan/tubing system soon. I dig your take on this issue Rossmann.
A cheap solution is to get a "6 inch mixed flow fan" off eBay or Amazon for like $40, and a 6" dryer / air conditioning duct, and to just vent it outside. Way better than nothing.
I use an old industrial soldering filter made by whomever made Polinex & SmokeEater filters. The prefilter is mostly dust and debris. The electrostatic grid filter sticks the fumes to it, and then there is an activated charcoal filter. The electrostat filter gets washed down & reused. I wear gloves and dump the wash water where I want the weeds to die. If it is nice outside, I just run an exhaust fan out the window. I burned some inscence and the exhaust fan actually sucks out more smoke & fumes than the extractor/filter. The carbon filters can be dumped out and refilled with new activated charcoal. The prefilter can be cut from hammock style furnace Hepa filter sheets, and the electrostatic is just a wash rinse repeat affair, and it takes a lot of flux, lead, tin, schmutz, & other stuff out of the air. The 1970s price on my filter? $3,400. I just have to improvise to replace the filters. The hoses get tossed out every few years too.
I work on vacuum cleaners, which does involve soldering every so often, but I keep a big air purifier at one end of my workbench that I run on hi all day as I work. Vacuum repair and service is a very dusty job, and I have allergies, and just don't want to breathe it all in anyway, its also cut way down on the dust in the store as well. We have 2 more smaller air cleaners around the store too. And if I'm soldering something, I do it right in front of the one on my bench, so it sucks it all in, not me or my lungs. And if I have my face right up near the fumes, I'l take a deep breath of clean air first, and then slowly breathe out my nose to prevent it from even wafting up my nose as I hold my breath. As long as I'm not sucking it in my nose or mouth, I can watch the smoke/vapor waft into the front of my air cleaner.
Exactly, I don't want it going in anywhere, nose, mouth, or eyes. I really don't even want the stuff coming up against my skin. And I have noticed that the slow exhaling will push the rising fumes away from my face as they get sucked to my right and gone forever. The few times I've had it go up my nose, I had to go immediately and blow my nose, it burned and made my eyes water, I almost could feel it poisoning me. Probably more in my head, but still, I don't really want cancer in my respiratory system, or even lead poisoning, God forbid! I have enough sinus problems with my normal allergies, and don't want or need to add to that.
Have a large inline extractor fan with suitable air hose to deal with the smoke at the source. I do like flux fumes, but they're not good for you so up the chimney they go.
The bad stuff is not on the first filter, that ist just regular house dust which you always inhale and it isn't harmful. That filter is just there to protect the more expensive filters ( I guess).
i went to a program called job corps, and one day i was doing the high school program in a room by myself. the maintenance staff decided they were going to solder the air-shafts that day with the ac still on. all of the solder fumes went into the room i was in and it really hurt my eyes and i was coughing for days. the nurses there prescribed eye drops. very painful few days before my eyes and lungs got back to normal
It would be great to get that Hakko unit, but it costs the equivalent of more than $1200 where I am (UK), so I'm building my own setup out of flexible 5" and 4" PVC air duct tubing, connectors, intakes, home made plywood box, etc. I bought the plywood as cheap offcuts from B&Q. Not so far decided which fan(s) to use, but I have all sorts up to screaming fast Yate Loons, so plenty of options. Only thing I haven't done yet is source the filter (or decide where in the construction it will be positioned), will do that today. The PSU came from an external SCSI case, so nicely compact. I don't have a window I can open wide horizontally though (it's the type that's hinged at the bottom, leaving a gap at the top that's about 11cm max), so the plan is for an intake via 5" tubing about 1m long (hanging down from a shelf), through a box with the fan(s), then out via 4" tubing just a bit more than 1m long (positioned horizontally) so the end (with a stiff connector fitted) can be jammed into the window gap at the top. It should work ok. Depending on the fan(s) used, I might also fit noise cancelling foam and panelling inside the box to quiet it down a tad, and it'll have rubber feet to help prevent fan vibration from going through into the shelving unit (one of those large blue industrial types). If anyone's interested, I'll take pics of the construction and the final setup when it's done. I was going to include links to the relevant ebay items, but for some reason I can't CTRL+C/CTRL+V the links (another YT thing?).
Had a board assembler job for Honeywell in the mid-1980s. We had a lot of great equipment at our workstations, but fume extraction wasn't part of the deal, and we cleaned our boards with freon sprayers. I can only imagine that the inside of my lungs look just like that filter. Including the chunks of yellow tape.
Just a little thing to add: make sure you get a fume extractor with a normal prefilter. This prestage filter is just for filtering out big particles (normal dust and some debris), so that they don't get stuck on the main (HEPA) filter like in your Hakko extractor. Helps to make the expensive HEPA filters run longer and more effective, because it get's only cluttered up with the fine particles. Apart from that: Use a fume extractor, you do not want to get that sh*t into your lungs. It does cause asthma and is under the suspicion of causing lung cancer, too.
When you are completely disconnected from the hobbyist community that you thing those are the cheap versions. That's madness hakko branded equipment is so premium it's silly, students and hobbyists use Chinese unbranded hot air and soldering stations and frankly they work fine, I've used jbc stations at university and they are good but not £800 premium good. For normal moderate use the t12 soldering iron clones are perfect, you can get a full setup for about £30. As for hot air the style of station reviews by Dave from the eevblog that cost about £30-£40 are great for the money. Finally fume extraction, personally I'd go with buying a carbon filter and a fan and simply throwing once together because the low end fume extraction market is not great.
On one hand you say the low end fume extraction isn't great but you also say you would buy one and then throw away. So I presume you mean they are ok to use but should be periodically replaced/disposed of?
even at the mayor repair centers here in the U.S don't use such a good extraction system like tbe one that you have. at the most they use the fan with a small filter type of system. kudos to you for using a quality filtration system. in the only place i see a befter solution is in VGA REWORK
I got a purifier filter box from a thrift store for 20 bucks. That was custom made probably for some elderly person . Stripped the UV light and added a hose and 2x AC fans, carbon filter. I lucked out. Way better then my cobbled thing I had before.
You could always use a dryer hose and 12v computer fan and maybe a 10 inch fan with rear tapered to the hose and out the window using whatever to seal it.
I bought one of the POS small Hakko extractor mainly because I have Jack shit for room around my solder iron. And it was all because you drove the point home that I really need one. Even if it does require me to position what I'm soldering close to the extractor. One day I'll be able to get the big boy!
I'm wondering if you redid this video today what would you recommend? I'm a stained glass artist that does soldering and I totally agree with you and trying to find resources to choose a decent fume extractor.
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Louis Rossmann I know this is an old video, it looks like that filter is taking out some of the city traffic fumes as well which is good.
So what's your thought on lead free solder?
I just compare *The fume* generated from soldering with a cigarette... it's slowly going to kill your lugs over time.
Which is bad.
Yes i know... i reply over 1year later. But better later than never lol.
Do the desktop fume irrigators work almost as well as the larger floor units?
Guys he is right get an extractor. My dad is a plumber and uses flux to solder pipes together and after 30 years of that - as he has no extractor or protection for his lungs - he breathes like he smoked. So guys please don't be like him get an extractor.
+DJHMrSquirrel1 That sucks. :(
Mitchell wodach different amounts by large comparison. Plumbing solder is usually much larger than the 1mm solder wire smd hobbiests use. Louis' flux globs are magnified. Take it from Big Clive who has been doing this for decades...
My grandfather has been soldering for 50 years almost everyday without extractor. He also smokes, which doesn't help him. He is now 70% blind and can't breath properly without sounding like a ran a marathon while having a cold.
What is in the fumes being extracted? My doctor said flux is animal fat and if it were causing issues, it would make me cough or feel bad in some way but I never have. And smoking will make you cough way before 30 years. That being said I still plan to get one just in case.
I also got a lead test and my levels were barely measurable. I read that most lead absorption comes from ingestion not inhalation and I always wash my hands after and usually wear nitrile gloves while soldering.
Will do, thanks for sharing.
Just a note: the circle of grey stuff doesn't come from the solder and flux, it's just dust. The discoloration, on the other hand, comes from the solder and flux fumes. None the less, it is important to get a fume extractor.
When I did repair in the Army. They took this very seriously. In-fact, they would have extractors built overhead into the ceiling. They have to pay for work related disabilities so it shows how serious the damage can be when the Army spends the most money on fume extraction.
I started playing with/learning electronics as a kid and quickly learned that I needed some kind of extraction, I'm asthmatic and even small amounts of soldering got at my chest, I made an extractor with a cheap fan and some cooking extractor filter, it worked to an extent and you could see the crap building up on the filter paper. At 16 I started working in an electronics factory and saw the crap in my filter in my Metcal extractor and realised how much my home made extractor wasn't filtering... I brought a Metcal extractor as soon as I began working for myself and always use it,even for a quick, 1 minute job, it wasn't cheap (about £600 or $900) but it was well worth it. There is nothing at all macho about fucking up your health.
If you exhaust your fumes outdoors you can use any KW fan you prefer without filtration. "Bounce house" centrifugal blowers move serious air so I use those to ventilate my welding room in my shipping container shop.
In Austria you have to use fume extraction our repair guys workplace gets checked randomly about once a year by an health inspector and when there would be no fume extractor they would close down the whole office.
Do you work in Tridonic or Lighting (Zumtobel Group) in Austria ?
A boss that actually takes Health and Safety at work seriously and does what is right because they want people to finish work as healthy as they started their shift then leads from the front and not only makes sure his place of work is safe but tells the world what to do on youtube ! that is a new one on me. Louis, you often talk about "cleaning up your part of the world", this right here is how its done !
As a guy who's slowly learning to solder, I was not aware this was an issue. I'll have to figure something out.
You can get the Hakko Fa 400. It's only $90 and will get the job done for you.
set up an inline fan out the window with some ducting. tape /seal off the extra parts of the window so your don't get fumes blowing back...ide guess like 25 bucks at homedepot. done ;)
broke man's gotta solder
To be honest I don't think this is an issue for a hobbyist. A half hour a month of solder fumes doesn't seem like a big deal. But I am 100 percent onboard with proper PPE and fume extraction if you're doing this with any level of regularity.
+Jacob Rau
I'm a 'hobbyist' learnist kind, I choose electronics for my future.
And I solder like 7H a week.
This video kinda wakes me up real bad. I'm saving my money now.
The cheapest way to get a very good protection is just by buying a real half facepiece respirator mask and wearing that while soldering. I do this as a hobbyist. New filters do cost only about 12 €.
Of course a fume extraction device is better, because it also cleans the room, while i have to open all the windows and leave the room after the work is done, but a respirator mask is better than nothing and much more versatile.
The half facepiece respirator mask does only cost you 22 € and will be usable for years.
I completely agree with you, there is nothing more important than the health. Health is the only wealth. Its simple as why some people choose not to smoke.
Yes!!
soo if its that "disgusting ..shit".. why you dont look like that all the time ? www.flickr.com/photos/148198851@N02/32396182513/ :D:P ..(.... dont read next text if you dont have anythink beter to do.. i supose nothing more what someone dont write before) .....i can give to you hunderts of this mask for free ..they just need some shiping from Poland. you will be more healty :D......ok ok i get you point i just.. :P i my self hate all fumes and even at work undergroud some times in 10-20x than max alowable levels dont know how many more dust than outside and im near one people that using mask near all that time with some excludings. there are even some peoples that dont want put mask on when dont see own hand by that many dust in "air" and they like some testosterone gorila say stupid things that by he meaning put me in position that im some freak stupid idiot...... in that situations i think ex.: why he just dont make suicide or he never clean at home hehe what he talk to he wife when she cleanig ? Back to video: regular air all around us is ...... "this ..shit what is go inside you body" go there even when you not solder and will be just sit.. read book or doing nothing .... you breath little less this "shit... some of is stop on filter... but i dont think you not using some dust mask only for good looking (yy i know you use air conditioner but he grab some to) or run some vacumm cleaner 24/7/365 like that he will grap in that normal conditions without moving from one place a few kilograms of "this shit" and you not will be need take "this inside you body" and you will be fastest on 4miles etc. (personaly i use not all time but i have make some "fumes smoke snake eater" made from many connected old vacum cleaner flex pipes and hair dryer's suck air outside home) ......
Kazimierz Różański please rephrase in simple speak
Kazimierz Różański just had a stroke
@@bbaovanc lol
It's a nice comparison ,but most of that black stuff is normal dust , I think what you should show is that the used filter is yellowish from the rosin fumes, as for fume extractors , usually the cheap thin carbon filter don't really do the job, like your filter ,the best way is to buy a shower fan and a hose and blow it out the window
Indeed. Most of the stuff caught in the pre-filter is regular dust: lint and dead skin. It looks yucky but found in every home, and is mostly harmless and comes out with a cough. That's what the pre-filter is there for, to make sure the later filter stages don't clog up. That does *not* invalidate the need for fume extraction and filtering obviously, but the nasty stuff mostly comes in the form of ultrafine particles or solubles.
Get quadcopter motors, they are so just so strong , but consume about 150watts.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I have some of those air purifiers that operate on the same principle, a fan, a filter, and a pre-filter, and the pre-filter always looks scummed up like Louis's pre-filter just from household dust and such. Or you can look at your furnace filter and see how quickly it gets filled. I don't know what smoke would look like on a pre-filter, maybe like the filter of a cigarette I guess.
Thank you, I now feel slightly proud of my fume extractor. It isn't exactly top of the line, but I think it was worth buying now that I have started to solder more often.
+Samuel Doye You don't need top of the line, just as long as you are thinking about it and put effort in to not inhale that crap. I bought the FA-430 because it was worth it to not deal with wasting time researching what to buy when I had a stack of stuff to do, and I know if I buy something made by Hakko(besides the FM-206) it will work. But it doesn't mean everyone has to spend that much on their own setup.
I wish my dad would listen to your advice. I've tried talking to him about the importance of ventilation and limiting exposure to smoke/chemicals but he has this old school mindset that none of that stuff matters.
The big stuff isn't really that unhealthy. The human body is able to excrete large and coarse particle. Nano-sized particles and sharp particles like asbestos however is a different matter. Also metallic fumes and anything else than carbon might give an unwanted result from the body..
like silica
have you ever ate a pizza ? In other news when I did a deep dive into the notion that saliva and nostril hair filter out particles over a certain size I found the basis of this theory came from a two day workshop held by the World Health Organisation on the ceramic industry, funded by companies making ceramic materials and the evidence was the companies said their employees were not worried about the dust. I did the research as I am a union health and safety representative of a large company and the company H&S Officer put forward this argument when I was compiling about dust from buffing. When I asked for a peer reviewed study that the body expels the larger particles he said he would get me one. At the next meeting he said "he would have it next month". I presented my findings and asked had he ever ate a hamburger because they are quite large. By the next meeting the job causing the dust had been moved to elsewhere with a extraction system, but he would still get me the study. That was two years ago, crickets
I dont solder enough to get a fume extractor, but that doesn't mean i dont take care to protect myself from it, i use a box fan near a window and solder near that to pull the fumes away.
So do I.
I have the same Hakko fume extractor. 2 hours heavy soldering in a small room and no sings of any flux smell. Don't be cheap, get one of these and save your lungs
+toly78 So true, we aren't talking about something slightly irritating, or bad smelling. These fumes are POISON, and will damage your lungs in ways that may never heal. Its just as bad, if not worse than, cigarettes!
Yeah, anyone who has gotten flux in a small cut on their hands can tell you it doesn't feel great at all. Good indication that getting into your lung tissue is not fantastic either.
It is way worse then smoking! Ask any lady that has worked at a radio factory in the old days, soldering all day long without a extractor or any thing to protect them. You doesnt know anyone that worked there? Well most have died with lungcancer...
Hakko fume extractor is your new lungs
I'm assuming they use a HEPA main filter in the back?
Do they have a carbon component as well as particle filter?
You are right.
Once i asked in an internet forum about electronics a couple of years ago about the right filter type for a respirator mask to do soldering work. They laughed at me, but i knew in this case i am more smart than them, so i just called the company of the respirator mask directly and got an answer.
I don't solder much in a year, but when i do it, i use always my half facepiece respirator mask when soldering.
BTW. new filters costs me only about 12 €, but it's worth the money because my lungs are more important.
To be fair you asked about a respirator mask, so yes that'd get a laugh as you dont want or need a mask for soldering.
Ideally you remove the fumes before the get near your face. It sucks it away from a few inches from the iron.
@@maulerrw Some protection is better than none.
Thanks for not trivializing the health risks associated with soldering. I've always wanted to get started so I can fix a whole bunch of broken retro hardware, but _this_ is the whole reason why I still haven't.
After watching this video I'm thinking back when i was learning to solder spending 5 minutes breathing in lead smoke and burning my fingers to solder 2 wires together. Very eye opening. I solder electronics for model cars.
You are so right, I did not have a fume extractor and started to get respiration related problems but I did not know the cause until I started looking your videos and you talked about fume extraction. I'm also in the independent repair business (but I do measurement and calibration gear)
It was a bit difficult to make/find one in a way it is not giving problems. One like you have is no option, I'm surrounded by testgear and often the whole instrument that needs repair is on my desk. So I have to preposition it constant.
I now have a commercial one that has a lamp-like swingarm I mounted on a metal bridge-like frame I made over my desk . It has a big but silent 230V fan and a carbon filter. It really makes a difference. (the Alu-frame is to guide f.i. testleads, support things against tipping over or mounting things for a test setup.)
Fred
I went cheap, I have a regular air filtering system on one side of my soldering workplace, and also I have two small PC case fans on a small stand on the second side.
That made a horizontal air flow from the fans directly through my whole workplace to the filtering system.
Even though both the air filter and the fans are fairly low power (90W filter and 2x4W fans), the wind current is so strong, that I have to increase soldering temperature by 50 to 100 degrees to prevent it from cooling down my soldering tips and the solder joints before i finish the work.
I think it is actually more convenient setup than those tunnels because you don't need this setup to be close to you, the air current is strong enough so that you can place them further away and still benefit from the filtering. The air current covers completely my work space, no need to set up anything, it makes a kind of a horizontal air curtain.
The filter I bought used for 50€ (and changed all the filter parts of course), the fans are part of my own preheater that I designed by myself, they were for few €. When I put it on full power, I can even light a small camp fire on the workplace and not smell any smoke :P
Fume extraction is essential for any work like this. I wish I had one when I used to do a lot of electrical work in cars. I always had a fan blowing it out. Now I have extraction in my home work shop for painting, laser cutting, dust, etc. extremely well worth the one time investment. It keeps the work area cleaner, saves your lungs, and helps you get more work done by staying healthier.
This is a very important message for all of us who enjoy soldering electronic kits. In fact I just paused the video and ordered a fume extractor online. I will wait for it to arrive before continuing my oscilloscope project. In the past I used a simple fan to pull the fumes away from my workbench and hopefully out the window. It helped a bit, but it was too noisy and often the windows were closed. So this video will be a beneficial word to the wise for all soldering enthusiasts. Good work. Now I will check out your vegetarian video!
Lou, you are such an inspiration man. I watch your videos every day. I feel like you GET people like us. You teach very valuable lessons in EVERY video and in different ways. I pray you never stop keeping people like us in line. Thank you.
Louis, loads of respect for you taking a solid line on health. The side effects of not using fume extraction are real and very bad. Specifically, the fumes from the burning rosin (resin, flux, whatever) are nasty. Some refer to occupational asthma or industrial asthma or other terms, but it is real and I live the effects of it after a lifetime in the industry. Many doctors palm it off as 'adult onset' asthma, but it is real. When I started as a 16 year old apprentice in the military, we did not use ventilation or fume extraction - safety was all about cleaning or protecting the work area, not our health! At least our militaries did eventually change that attitude and do care for their people now, but for me that was halfway through my career. The effects can be very long term and may not show up for 20+ years. Once the immune system becomes vulnerable through the long term fume exposure, it also preps the body to be less immune to other allergens. So essentially, the industrial asthma opens the way for me to have asthmatic reactions to other allergens! Please, please everybody, take the fume extraction seriously.
Imagine all the people in Chinese factories who inhale these fumes daily with no filters.
+TheAmmoniacal This. You can say a lot about Chinese production facilities but they're often better equipped than most small US operations.
+Alex Brook This is sadly true.
A FFU(fan filter unit) cost only about 150＄ in China (that's just the retail price for single unit), it is an affordable investment. However, smaller factories in China get virtually no protection at all.
OSHA
OOHshit
This video 3 years on got me to buy a basic fume extraction system, i cant afford the 500 dollar one but the 50 dollar one online with a carbon filter will do a world of difference to fumes coming straight up into my face
thankyou for this video
For my soldering i just bought a bit of MDF board. Screwed a 120mm high airflow PC fan to it and using some PVC pipe fittings attached a bit of small aircon duct to it. Then i stick the MDF board in my window and blow the fumes right outaide. Cost me all of about $20
Excellent, you are preaching to the choir but this is one of the many aspects of the electronics repair industry that doesn't get enough publicity!
I have used the smaller desk fans with the carbon filter in them and they work, they are okay, at least better than nothing. I upgraded my set up and got an inline mains extractor fan unit (they are usually used in bathrooms and stuff) and some ducting. Ducting on the the desk to the fan, then from the fan to out the window. Direct, high volume extraction to outside. No fumes or anything in the room and no need for filters etc. Whole set up was like $40.
Just got my fume extractor in the mail today after using a cheap hakko smoke absorber for a year. Finally saved up enough money for it. My lungs thank you Louis.
This is great. I occasionally solder but have been ignorant for a couple years. Thanks for being so vocal on the matter...glad this video popped up while searching for something else.
I'm using a Shop-Vac as a fume extractor, I simply hooked a hose to the exhaust port, ran it out the window and ran the intake hose in front of my work area. The whole thing only cost 60 bucks used at a yard sale and works phenomenally.
Shop vacs rock and don't need filters if exhausted outdoors. The polyethylene conical dust separators that fit atop any pail or drum you like are great for collecting machining chips from my lathe and mill so if you want to keep crap out of your vacuum check those out. I use the ancient trick of panty hose over the filters to greatly extend their life (by several years in my cases).
Dude, your words are the fucking truth! Even in the not-so-distant future! Thanks for the great message!
Wow. This is the most reasonable advice I've seen online in regards to the subject of soldering fumes. People get so defensive and downright hateful when you even imply that maybe you could be breathing in LEAD rather than just flux. So many soldering tutorials where dudes don't wear gloves. It's pretty sad. I've also seen adult men get soaked in led acid battery fluid all over their hands like no big deal. Every single molecule of lead that enters your bloodstream via your skin, lungs, mouth, or eyes will stay in your body FOREVER.
I am also extremely poor, I make less thank 12k per year. I solder outdoors with a fan I got from goodwill sucking up the fumes right in front of my work. I also wear a soldering gas mask rated for lead filtering during extended work sessions, and I always wear latex gloves.
Hi Louis last night 18 sept i ended up in hospital as an emergency admission, where i was given a chest X-ray the doctor explained i had unexplained shadows on my lungs, which i guess would explain my slight breathlessness. I don't smoke, i live in the country but i do electronics repairs etc without a fume extractor.
Silly me, THANK YOU.
couldn't afford a good extractor, so i got a pc fan and some filters and made my own, i hung it above mt desk on the wires and it works pretty well for me. Thank you for encouraging me to think about my health, I've been breathing in this crap for too long.
I made my own solder sucker out of a 12v marine inline fan and flex dryer tubing. Sounds like a jet when it’s on high but the Fumes go outdoors far away.
I also weld with flux core wire on galivanized steel outdoors with a huge shop fan and a respirator.
PPE is your only hope! Never ever let some fool tell you different!
I also use eye protection because one time while just reattaching a connection I had some sort of air bubble form I think and a small dot of molten solder was sent flying...it arced and hit me about one inch below my right eye. I stopped immediately and went to find my safety glasses I had buried in some other gear. That little dot of solder burned quite a bit but I was very thankful it only hit my cheek.
I am still using the hold-your-breath technique as a hobbyist. I ordered a nice USB powered desk fan of Ebay but it still hasen't arrived. I'll probably have to buy another one.
I always wear a small mask when soldering. I also keep one or 2 fans on and open all of my windows. Something about inhaling any type of fume scares me. since a few of my relatives died of Lung Cancer. I think it's great that you spread awareness about it.
I want to begin soldering. I love this thing and everytime I'm watching videos about this, specially from Louis. Fumes were always a concern for me, I didn't even started it yet because I can't figure how to set up a system for this. Everytime I've soldered for hobby until now I've ended up with a headache. This is probably a simptom I don't want to have regularly if I really get into this business. So, since I live in Brazil, and in here everything is like third world country, and most of the electronical stores that works with solder doesn't even care about health, only about money making, I don't think we have good options for fume extraction...
+Tribes11 window and a big fan!
Excellent video! I'm glad Dave said about you! I made my own years ago using a 12"x 22" carbon filter and fan from an indoors grow room! the ones they use to remove the smell when growing weed... So people saying it cost to much!! they are wrong as you can buy a grow room air scrubber kit for $20-$100+ from ebay etc... It may help to save your life!!
I've got a shop-vac that would work decently as a cheap solution for fume extraction. It has an inlet and outlet with a filter in the middle. Hook up a hose to both ends and run the outlet outside if you're worried about anything that makes it past the filter. Should work pretty well and was only about $30-50. Plus it can still be used as a vacuum.
You can build a beastly extractor for peanuts using the small or large shop vac of your choice and any HEPA and activated charcoal filter panels you wish. Mine is a small shop vac whose hose fits the cut-off end of an antifreeze jug which took longer to wash off than connect. You can use clamps, magnets or zip tie yours as I did to a spare monitor arm.
Filters are key. You can match or beat commercial units simply by using appropriate filter media but the best way is to exhaust outdoors because "filter and recirculate" does not give you FRESH air.
Plumbing shop vacs is easy as is cutting a panel to insert in a window so your fume extractor also draws clean air into your workspace. If you exhaust your air you don't need to filter it.
I collect all the shop vacs large and small I can score cheap (yard sales etc) and have them throughout my shops. If you place your filter on the exhaust side of the vacuum it can be large, bulky and mount anywhere including walls (unused wall space should be put to work for zero footprint equipment locations, I even hang my 1U server like a painting).
I’ve only soldered like twice to replace some game cart batteries & try to start repairing my Genesis controller ports, and I had no idea this was a an issue, even with lead-free solder. And my preexisting asthma wouldn’t help either.
One time when my mom was right all along. Even if I’m moving my soldering outside, I’m gonna look into a Hakko FA-400 filter. Or use that high power fan my dad has in his garage. Thanks for this vid, it’s been a month or 2 since I first soldered in my room and this just adds to why I should never do that ever again.
A good way to do this on a budget is what I'm doing, take a high power bathroom inline extractor fan, place hoss on both ends, one end goes into the loft and out under the eaves, the other end comes through the ceiling and sits above the soldering station, job done, no filters needed, extracts as well as the expensive ones.
I felt like crap without any fan. I got a Lasko box fan, took it apart and sealed a cheap carbon filter at the intake, then got a small desk fan which I put right where I'm working aimed at the box fan intake. Totally worked.
I'm with you on the fumes but when I solder I just open a window and stick a box fan in it. I don't do it for a living through. May father used to make tattoo needles for a living (between jobs as a machinist). The funny thing is he was paranoid about the fumes and actually took the time to build a basic fume extractor yet he smoked two pack a day. He has COPD now.
So i hate buying filters, so i plumbed in a system to just vent outside. More expensive in the short term, much much cheaper in the long term. It is also quieter.
hey,
what you showing in the prefilter is just normal dust, that precisely what the prefilter do, filter the normal dust
dot get me wrong, im totally with you with the fact that we have to do the max to not breath fumes
i dont have a real fume extractor, but i do like you say: i have the one with a simple fan and carbon filter, i open the windows and catch my breath whan i see fumes lol
I do a lot of soldering in my dorm room and I have a 3 layer carbon filter and some ducting as my home-made fume extractor. Also comes in handy for vaping without setting off the fire alarm ;)
Even one of thous cheapo Air filters on amazon would be good as long as it has a paper filter thats meant for "smoke"
+KingOfKYA anything beats nothing
up until I watched your videos ( started a while ago) I didn't even know the fumes were any harmful at all. Obviously I looked into it and now have a flexible pipe with a blower to suck the fumes from me workbench directly outside, spent probably like 30 bucks on it but it does the job for me. And yes I know it probably isn't ideal but it's the only way for right now how to efficiently get the fumes away from me.
Thanks for the video Luis :)
"I don't give two s**** of a f*** what everyone else is doing". As a business owner and wholesaler I've said that to so many customers over the years. In fact I've said those exact words quite a number of them. Bravo to you sir.
*JESUS FUCKING CHRIST*!!! Thank you! Thank you so much good sir! Ugh, is this stuff so complicated for all of these people?! Just unbelievable. I am already screwed, I have cancer, asthma, kidney failure, and a plethora of tumors, so I could *easily* justify how it's pointless for me to use a fume extractor, and despite my current financial state of being, I still find it important to have built my own activated charcoal fume extractor. It's just unbelievable that people would put forth the thought and effort into justifying the ridiculous malarkey that you are calling out in this video! Once again, I really do greatly admire your 'no bullshit' approach to what is right. Most of the people that stand behind their perception of what is right do so passively, with the whole, "Ummm... Yeah, I um... I think that maybe people should probably always use a fume extractor, um, because even if they don't care, um.. Well... The people around them maybe, ummm, might not want the, ummm, odor, sort of, you know, having to smell the odor... Plus, all of the, ya know, purported health issues, I mean, they probably aren't true... ", and so on and so on, just passively trying make some weak ass argument instead of just saying, "Hey, get a soldering to iron, because that shit is bad for you, and if you work at home, your wife, your children, hell, even your fucking dog doesn't need that crap in their body man!"...
My apologies for the rant, and for the probably weaving in and out of the lane of the topic at hand... I just wanted to thank you kindly for taking the path of integrity and just saying, without any possible gap for misunderstanding, to point out that which *YOU KNOW* to be right, without any semblance of doubt!
Well done good sir, and good on you!
Thank you once more! Be well!
Stop your blasphemy of Jesus’ name. Cuss out Muhammad or other pagan gods.
Wow! You surprise me when ever I watch your video of course positively!! You proved me that i am not crazy as so many others telling me! Continue as you are a nice guy!. Thanks Michael from Vienna Austria
Thanks for video, very good example on visualizing what happens if one don't care. Just got myself a fume extractor (similar to PACE 200) tonight for my homelab.
This was brilliant, particularly the analogy to the repition and tolerance of racist statements. I'm a newbie in the electronics world and have been holding off on soldering until my cheapo fume extractor arrived from China. It got lost in the mail. How lucky can a person get? Now I'll wait a little longer and buy a proper fume extractor. Thank you. Roberta Laidman
We had air extraction at the repair shop I used to work in 20 years ago, just tubes and a fan to blow it outside. And the way these tubes looked like on the inside after a few months !! Tar and sticky goo from the flux all over!
hey for the people who are broke and love to solder. I'm setting up an inline fan with some exhaust ducting to exhaust to outside. Louis has a closed loop system which filters air and replenishes the air in the room. A cheaper option would just be exhaust to outside. like a dryer vent.
I'm going to be setting this up on my station after seeing that abortion of an air filter. Thanks again louis for the psa! 80 year old me thanks you.
I had to do a tiny bit of soldering on one of my guitars recently. The jack needed to be replaced, so I had to solder it loose, install the new one and then solder the wires back in place. I actually put a desk fan at a speed/distance where I got maximum airflow over the desk without cooling down the soldering iron/components too much. I had two large windows open for ventilation and still I held my breath while hanging over the desk to solder everything in place. There's no way I'm gonna inhale all that garbage. If I had to do soldering on a regular basis, I'd get a fume extractor for sure.
great clip, important topic. not to make fun but solder smell has a bit of nostalgia for me, but non the less i have a diy fume extractor with a carbon filter because in the end i value my heath above all
I agree that a fume extractor is important if you are soldering regularly. if flux fumes burn my eyes, then it's pretty obvious it's bad for my health.
We have our own filter mechanisms too. Namely hairs in the nostrils and the windpipe to grab the large pieces and wet mucus to micro filter anything else! So you are not completely unprotected without a filter, but yea don't breathe in the toxic fumes. Better safe than sorry. You can also use a small vaccum cleaner to such the fumes, im sure everyone has one of those in their office.
I got a fume extractor years ago. I picked up a cheap mod kit from a surplus store, and screwed it to a 120mm fan. Rather than the typical computer fan, I used the high flow, 120 volt, all metal fans that we installed on motor drivers at my old job. Good airflow. I got a rotary inline lamp switch and some power cords from the same surplus shop, and wired up simple fume extractors that you could just place on the bench and run, with no extra power supply or wall wart. I loved the kit so much, I bought enough kits for all the soldering stations at work and told them to use the shit. If they weren't sure whether it was worth it to spend on 'em, fuck it. FREE. Just use the shit! It was super simple. They did like it and did pay me. I still have, and still use mine, though these days, that old industrial fan has a but of a rattle to it. I should look into replacing it. Over the years, I got my hands on a bunch of variacs, and learned I could plug the fan into a variac to control it's speed. Even dialing it back to 90-100 volts greatly reduced the noise, while still giving a pretty good suck. The original kits only had the white filters, like your prefilter, but I got a set of carbon filters to sit behind the white filter later on.
The flux fumes always bothered me. I used to just open a window and hope a breeze would clear it, but that doesn't work in winter, or in heavy rain. I wish I had had a good (or even a cheap) fume extractor when I was still a kid!
Thank you for making me aware. I just bought one. You might have lengthened my life there... in 30 years I might think back and you could have been a life changer there :)
first of, you should check the inner filter too, the thing you see on the thin outer filter is just dust and other kind of dirty particals, the inner filter is actualy the filter that filtrates the fume, your fume extrator manual should say when that filter needs to be replaced.
second, i was soldering as a hubby and foundt that when ever i would have soldered then i would have alot of slime in my throat the rest of the day, so i builded one my self with just a dust filter, 3 active carbon filters and 4 pc fans, some scrap plastic that i had laying around, a went flex tube, 1 self made circuit board and some glue, it took me 1 hour to make(drawing a plan, making pcb, soldering, gluing stuff together etc..) and that fixed my problem. thats what borders me too that so many sacrifice thier health just because they are too "cool" for spending 1 hour on making a fume extractor, its not even that expensive especialy not for an electronic repair shop or anyone else who repairs alot of electronics, i think i spend around 10$ in total on it where the active carbon filters where the most expansive.
10$ for saving youre health is like no cost at all compared to end up having asma or living with oxygen mask rest of life because of broken lungs.....
Tip: Cheap but not so comfortable over long times: A KN95 / PPP3 mask. Some people have them still at home from Covid time. Perfect protection, even better than a fume extractor because nothing will get through, unlike with fume extractors, where your face is usually quite near to the fumes.
I weld most of it is enclosed spaces, bought a painter helmet and air fan. I was called Buck Rogers because the helmet looks like a space helmet with a hose on back of it.
We see more and more peoples trying to build some by theirself... I think your video made a real impact Louis!
Amen,this man is speaking nothing but facts.....PERIOD
I replaced my Sega Genesis Shadowrun save game battery via soldering a couple years ago. Totally not worth it. I did not know what I was breathing for the couple of seconds of soldering. Thank you for this PSA!
I agree you need an extractor, I think most of that 1st layer is dust and you’ll get that soldering or not
I did Radon mitiagtion fan, exaust out (not recycle crap back inside), higher volume of air, better suction, way!! more silent, and in the end, cheaper!
On the cheap for lab work and soldering, I just use a 40$ exhaust hooked up to a socked activated carbon filter tube for 25$ and some flanged flex tubes for 12$. I have asthma and early COPD and to much BS in my lungs to take to many chances even if I can not afford a 400$ fume extractor. You could just set the exhaust assembly with a filter on the floor and it will clean the air in the room but to protect the motor and for just in case, I hook it up to suck through the filter and out a window. I mean it is pretty good and does not even leave a smell, the flex tubes can easily be moved on the fly next to my work. It will not only protect you, but it will also completely deodorize the air given time. I use a 6 inch but a 4 inch would be fine for just soldering and flux fumes.
This fume extractor was first thing that i have spotted when firstly watching your video and ofc started looking for one on ebay.
Excellent video, we use fume extractors in a small electronics manufacturing operation. health is #1, period !!
I've been using the hold breath/desk fan for years but was planning to build a cheap computer fan/tubing system soon. I dig your take on this issue Rossmann.
Your advice is second to none.
Honestly I've never even thought about fume extraction. I don't work with that type of stuff, but I totally see what you're saying.
A cheap solution is to get a "6 inch mixed flow fan" off eBay or Amazon for like $40, and a 6" dryer / air conditioning duct, and to just vent it outside. Way better than nothing.
I use an old industrial soldering filter made by whomever made Polinex & SmokeEater filters. The prefilter is mostly dust and debris. The electrostatic grid filter sticks the fumes to it, and then there is an activated charcoal filter. The electrostat filter gets washed down & reused. I wear gloves and dump the wash water where I want the weeds to die. If it is nice outside, I just run an exhaust fan out the window. I burned some inscence and the exhaust fan actually sucks out more smoke & fumes than the extractor/filter. The carbon filters can be dumped out and refilled with new activated charcoal. The prefilter can be cut from hammock style furnace Hepa filter sheets, and the electrostatic is just a wash rinse repeat affair, and it takes a lot of flux, lead, tin, schmutz, & other stuff out of the air. The 1970s price on my filter? $3,400. I just have to improvise to replace the filters. The hoses get tossed out every few years too.
I work on vacuum cleaners, which does involve soldering every so often, but I keep a big air purifier at one end of my workbench that I run on hi all day as I work. Vacuum repair and service is a very dusty job, and I have allergies, and just don't want to breathe it all in anyway, its also cut way down on the dust in the store as well. We have 2 more smaller air cleaners around the store too. And if I'm soldering something, I do it right in front of the one on my bench, so it sucks it all in, not me or my lungs. And if I have my face right up near the fumes, I'l take a deep breath of clean air first, and then slowly breathe out my nose to prevent it from even wafting up my nose as I hold my breath. As long as I'm not sucking it in my nose or mouth, I can watch the smoke/vapor waft into the front of my air cleaner.
+compactc9 the idea is to get it before it goes up your nose, because by then you;'re already screwed. whatever works!
Exactly, I don't want it going in anywhere, nose, mouth, or eyes. I really don't even want the stuff coming up against my skin. And I have noticed that the slow exhaling will push the rising fumes away from my face as they get sucked to my right and gone forever. The few times I've had it go up my nose, I had to go immediately and blow my nose, it burned and made my eyes water, I almost could feel it poisoning me. Probably more in my head, but still, I don't really want cancer in my respiratory system, or even lead poisoning, God forbid! I have enough sinus problems with my normal allergies, and don't want or need to add to that.
Have a large inline extractor fan with suitable air hose to deal with the smoke at the source. I do like flux fumes, but they're not good for you so up the chimney they go.
I made my own extractor with flexible ducting that goes out the Window, connected to a fan on my desk, very cost effective as no filters to change
The bad stuff is not on the first filter, that ist just regular house dust which you always inhale and it isn't harmful. That filter is just there to protect the more expensive filters ( I guess).
i went to a program called job corps, and one day i was doing the high school program in a room by myself. the maintenance staff decided they were going to solder the air-shafts that day with the ac still on. all of the solder fumes went into the room i was in and it really hurt my eyes and i was coughing for days. the nurses there prescribed eye drops. very painful few days before my eyes and lungs got back to normal
It would be great to get that Hakko unit, but it costs the equivalent of more than $1200 where I am (UK), so I'm building my own setup out of flexible 5" and 4" PVC air duct tubing, connectors, intakes, home made plywood box, etc. I bought the plywood as cheap offcuts from B&Q. Not so far decided which fan(s) to use, but I have all sorts up to screaming fast Yate Loons, so plenty of options. Only thing I haven't done yet is source the filter (or decide where in the construction it will be positioned), will do that today.
The PSU came from an external SCSI case, so nicely compact. I don't have a window I can open wide horizontally though (it's the type that's hinged at the bottom, leaving a gap at the top that's about 11cm max), so the plan is for an intake via 5" tubing about 1m long (hanging down from a shelf), through a box with the fan(s), then out via 4" tubing just a bit more than 1m long (positioned horizontally) so the end (with a stiff connector fitted) can be jammed into the window gap at the top. It should work ok.
Depending on the fan(s) used, I might also fit noise cancelling foam and panelling inside the box to quiet it down a tad, and it'll have rubber feet to help prevent fan vibration from going through into the shelving unit (one of those large blue industrial types). If anyone's interested, I'll take pics of the construction and the final setup when it's done. I was going to include links to the relevant ebay items, but for some reason I can't CTRL+C/CTRL+V the links (another YT thing?).
Had a board assembler job for Honeywell in the mid-1980s. We had a lot of great equipment at our workstations, but fume extraction wasn't part of the deal, and we cleaned our boards with freon sprayers. I can only imagine that the inside of my lungs look just like that filter. Including the chunks of yellow tape.
Just a little thing to add: make sure you get a fume extractor with a normal prefilter. This prestage filter is just for filtering out big particles (normal dust and some debris), so that they don't get stuck on the main (HEPA) filter like in your Hakko extractor.
Helps to make the expensive HEPA filters run longer and more effective, because it get's only cluttered up with the fine particles. Apart from that: Use a fume extractor, you do not want to get that sh*t into your lungs. It does cause asthma and is under the suspicion of causing lung cancer, too.
When you are completely disconnected from the hobbyist community that you thing those are the cheap versions. That's madness hakko branded equipment is so premium it's silly, students and hobbyists use Chinese unbranded hot air and soldering stations and frankly they work fine, I've used jbc stations at university and they are good but not £800 premium good. For normal moderate use the t12 soldering iron clones are perfect, you can get a full setup for about £30. As for hot air the style of station reviews by Dave from the eevblog that cost about £30-£40 are great for the money. Finally fume extraction, personally I'd go with buying a carbon filter and a fan and simply throwing once together because the low end fume extraction market is not great.
On one hand you say the low end fume extraction isn't great but you also say you would buy one and then throw away. So I presume you mean they are ok to use but should be periodically replaced/disposed of?
@@jamest4198 True, recently I have gone back to basics on fume extraction, basic fan and an open window.
Thank you for this video. A lot of things that had to be said here.
even at the mayor repair centers here in the U.S don't use such a good extraction system like tbe one that you have.
at the most they use the fan with a small filter type of system.
kudos to you for using a quality filtration system.
in the only place i see a befter solution is in VGA REWORK
I got a purifier filter box from a thrift store for 20 bucks. That was custom made probably for some elderly person . Stripped the UV light and added a hose and 2x AC fans, carbon filter. I lucked out. Way better then my cobbled thing I had before.
You could always use a dryer hose and 12v computer fan and maybe a 10 inch fan with rear tapered to the hose and out the window using whatever to seal it.
Even just a simple pc fan pointed so it blows away the fumes can go a long way to make things better
I bought one of the POS small Hakko extractor mainly because I have Jack shit for room around my solder iron. And it was all because you drove the point home that I really need one. Even if it does require me to position what I'm soldering close to the extractor.
One day I'll be able to get the big boy!
I'm wondering if you redid this video today what would you recommend? I'm a stained glass artist that does soldering and I totally agree with you and trying to find resources to choose a decent fume extractor.
Mine actually just came in yesterday. You mentioned this a few months back and i was sold. Thanks +Louis Rossman
+Mem Baker Glad to hear!
Worked in a bar in my youth. Used electrostatic air cleaner in bar, in those days I saw how nasty cigarette smoke was in a small bar.