Rolling For Stats Can be Problematic in D&D
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- Опубликовано: 19 авг 2024
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Also my understanding is old-school D&D was more of a war game, lots of dead characters that was just part of the fun. Rolling up stats doesn't really make sense on a character you'll be playing for 7 years, but it might be fine for 3 sessions.
False idea, dnd went up to level 20 even back then and it took years.
@@dominicleclerc1343 He didnt say that the game didnt go to level 20. It's just that a characters expected lifespan was way-way-way shorter in oldschool dnd.
@Dominic Leclerc it went _beyond_ level 20, there was no upper limit. 30th level characters were killing minor gods....
And dual classing (only for Humans) meant that you could just add classes together (it had limitations on your character as they levelled up in the second class however).
Demi Humans had multiclassing that worked differently, you chose all your classes at the start, and there were race restrictions on who could multiclass in what, but you levelled all of them at the same time.
Also various races had Max level restrictions on _some_ classes, but not all.
@@dominicleclerc1343 good luck reaching those levels though when early dnd was a deathtrap
@@casbot71 if my dm said “this character is definitely going to survive and you’ll get a chance to really bond with them.” Id be looking for rediculous ways to get them in to danger.
Yeah it can be an issue especially when you don't do it together and someone shows up with 3 18s lol
I rolled 4 18s in front of the DM
@@ignerius9878 did they cry XD
@@ignerius9878 did they bleed?
I had one 20 skill (racial bonus) and a 18 at level 1. I also rolled in front of the dm if you don’t believe me.
@@kinsan3501 no I believe I just know people who pretend to roll on an iPad and just bs it it's no fun:b
In one of the 5e games I play, we roll for stats. But once it is rolled, everybody uses that set. So it's kind of like a buffed standard array
This is the only balanced way to do it besides point buy.
Otherwise someone always wins and someone always loses.
Ohh, I like that, gonna do that next time the gang insists on rolling
@@mrptr9013 We went around the circle each rolling one stat. Then we choice who got to roll for the remaining. So we all get everyone's luck.
We basically all rolled stats and then wrote it on a paper and then selected which person’s to use and it ended being mine 18,17,17,15,15,10
Or nerfed standard array if you roll bad.
This exact issue just came up in my second campaign because of my players, mostly, preferring to roll for stats. At Lvl 1, two of my players have 18 AC, and another (The Bard) has a 20 in Charisma. It's fun to have to work around, but so hard to balance encounters. Lol
Okay, except even without rolling for stats, using chainmail and a shield you can have an AC of 18
Well, I don't think it's a bad thing, as long as they all have above average statistics, rather than just some of them.
That's how I do: I tell my players "If you don't like what you rolled, you can roll again, but you can have only 1 statistic above 15 and must have at least 1 at or below 10"
@@chad3166 not only that, but you dont even need the strength requirement, it just slows you down instead
So to be clear... two of your players have an AC that can easily be achieved with point buy. And one single player has 1 single stat that is 20 (of course you fail to mention their other stats).
If that is giving you trouble balancing encounters, rolling for stats isn't the problem.
@@bwolos well, it is a single statistic important for Bard, and bards can get really annoying depending on level
My preferred method of rolling for stats is a shared roll. One of the players rolls stats as normal, but everyone takes those rolls. This way, the players are at least balanced amongst each other.
I prefer when everyone rolls, and then everyone gets to select one of the rolled arrays (an array can be selected multiple times).
I do that as well. it works pretty well.
Interesting concept
I've been thinking of doing that for my new group as well, having shared numbers, but one of my group members really wants to do point buy and I would prefer a balanced party. So I've been contemplating to letting people choose whatever method they want, as long as they're total modifier bonus (before race bonuses) lie between +3 and +5
I remember playing AD&D. Rolling for my character to introduce in the campaign was hilarious. I rolled first for my character class to be a paladin. Then I proceeded to roll a 16, 14, 14, 18, 17, 14 in front of everyone, including the DM. He allowed it as I was going to be level 1 in a group of level 6s and they were all chaotic or evil aligned. The kicker was rolling for exceptional strength. It was a lot of fun trying to police the party.
Why did your dm make you level 1?
@@ZenthosSohtnezthat was common back then, for whatever reason
@@ZenthosSohtnezyou leveled up a lot faster since you roughly got the same xp, but the required xp went up exponentially per lvl. He would have caught up with them in just a few sessions.
@@ms.aelanwyr.ilaicos it was common for adventurers to be of differing levels in AD&D. It's why so many old-school modules say they're apropriate for characters form Levels X to Y. AD&D also had each class level up differently
I run something that a friend of mine called “Heroic Character creation”. Roll your stats if you didn’t get at least two 15s roll them again, keep doing this until you have at least 15s in at least two stats. This ensures that so long as you pick your class and subclass wisely you’ll always be effective at what you do.
Edit: I’m glad so many of you find this helpful!
I like it, gonna try and remember this for later
My original DM always allowed us to reroll anything less than a 10, and let us change our highest roll to a 16 if it was less than that. Of course, there were times when players opted not to do this for roleplaying reasons
@Waltimate similar for my current dm, but instead of rerolling to 16s, we get 3 sets and we can allocate stats with those sets to our liking.
i don't like the idea if all that + no chance of under 10 rolls, so instead i considered the average of of the lowest and highest possible(60 and 108) added + 10 to lowest and - 8 to highest, and essentially say of those 3 rerolls you can reroll FULLY (no cherry-picking the specific lowest stat) till you get them within that average.
unless you're satisfied with one specific roll before the rerolls of course.
average i noticed tends to be be 75-80, which is not excessively strong all things considered, especially with the kind of games we play.
@@iota-09
Without imposing throwing out values less than ten, the average sum of all stats with the standard rolling procedure is already ~ 73.47 (mean value for each is 12.2446, mode is 13).
This is, on the average, already slightly higher than what on can expect to get from either point buy or standard array.
So with the odds slightly more in your favor, and the room for more chaotic results than other methods (which I see as a plus, personally), I rather enjoy the standard roll up procedure as it is.
When I DM, though, I just tell my players to roll up sets of stats until they find one they think is “fair.” If they are terrified of getting any stats under 10, fine. Don’t. If they feel they need to have at least two stats of 15+, great. If they (like me) like getting a couple of high stats and at least one really low stat, sweet, do it.
It might create a little disparity in party stats, but it generally matches each character’s desires play style, and it hasn’t caused *my* party any problems yet.
Ya definitely have to let players reroll if they roll really terribly. Me and my dad and brother were setting up to play one time, and me and my dad roll characters. BETWEEN THE TWO OF US we have one 15, two 13s, and everything else is lower. One person rolled a 15 and then all 12 or lower and another rolled two 13 and then all 12 of lower (and both had stats lower than 8 I don’t remember the exact number).
And on the flip side my first character ever rolled 18, 16, 16, 13, 12, 12
He was like a god compared to everyone else except one other character who rolled 18 17 for their highest.
So I think you definitely want to limit the terribleness that someone can be forced to endure, and similarly you probably want to reserve the right to nerf the lowest stats. It’s ok if someone rolls high on their stats but if you have no weakness (like at least one thing under 10) it’s kind of boring. It’s nice to have one value that’s kind of bad and it’ll end up in either str int or cha so it won’t have a huge impact but it gives you the ability to roll play easier I think
One time, i rolled for stats and i thought i did so well, but then i realized you can get the sane set of scores through point buy and that made it even scarier
Player: *somehow rolls all 3s*
DM: no rerolls
"so i literally cant do anything as a dwarf..."
The giant barbarian: "YAY DWARF BOWLING BALL!!"
Tought luck. I once rolled everything between 11 and 7, and that cavalier is one of my most beloved characters
I have a d20 with a preference for landing on 4.
My introduction to tabletop games was AD&D in 1996. Back then you generated your Ability scores by rolling 3d6 _in order._ So you roll 3d6 and that's your Strength, roll another 3d6 and that's your Dexterity, and so on. On top of that, every Class had minimum required scores (good luck getting to play a Paladin), and every Race except Human had minimum _and maximum_ scores, meaning you could lock yourself out of multiple Race options by _rolling too well_ (though I don't know many DMs who actually enforced that).
[Edit: Side note, when my brother roll up his first D&D character ever, he used the "3d6 in order" method, and rolled 18, 18, 17, 18, 17, 18, and then 99 on the d100 for Exceptional Strength. It was ridiculous and I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't watched it happen. The race and class he chose? Human Fighter.]
By 1996, 3d6 in order hadn't been the standard for over a decade and a half. By the time of 1ed AD&D, the official position was "you can use 3d6 in order, but it's not recommended." 2ed also presented 3d6 in order as only one of a set of options.
@@chakatfirepaw I have Player's Handbook (2nd printing, May 1995) in front of me right now. "Rolling Ability Scores" on page 18 shows the "3d6 in order" as Method I, and then follows with Method II through VI under the heading "Alternative Dice Rolling Methods", and the text "If you would rather play a character of truly heroic proportions, ask your DM if he allows players to use optional methods for rolling up characters." This heavily implies, if not outright states, that "3d6 in order" was still considered the "standard" method, though I'm sure only the most hardcore-purist tables actually used it (none of the DMs I know did). I assume Method V (roll 4d6 and drop the lowest, arrange how you like) was the most popular method, since it's been the "standard" since 3rd Edition.
@@arcticbanana66 As what method to use was a DM's decision, it's better to look at what the DMG says. While the 2ed DMG doesn't have the direct advice against using 3d6 in order that the 1ed DMG did, it also presents it as "fast, but luck-heavy and tends to result in meh characters."
That's why my group does the box method. This is basically everyone rolling stats, and adding what they rolled into a 6 by 6 grid then they can circle the row, column, or diagonal they want as their stats.
I do this all the time and never had s problem
I always give my players 2 options:
1) you take standard stats from PHB
2) you roll for stats and can do it 2 times (if first was bad for you)
They can do both and choose better option
That's why I just give my player a rule that if they roll under the value of standard array, they can reroll. It makes sure everyone has relatively balanced characters and a good time.
if you have a bunch of rules and floors just to make rolling feasible you may as well just use point buy lol
So you just gave your players more power than they would have normally? Alright I guess
@@thickums5344 absolutely! My players are stronger and feel better, I get to throw more fun encounters at them, it's a win for everybody. In the end, a few more points than average isn't going to throw off the balance that much.
At that point why not make a fancy higher array if all you are doing is fudge the dice until they fit good enough...
Sounds like a waste of time, if you want everyone to have higher stats, just give them the higher stats. This is just point buy, but with extra annoying steps.
I like rolling for stats, but I've found having the party roll together (each one rolling 4d6 drop the lowest) so they share stats helps with this a bit. It keeps them on the same level
"4d6, drop lowest, mix & match as desired" isn't OP, it should just be the standard.
@@charlesboots6508 Right?
I feel like you're a newish DM. As the issue in this video has never been a issue for me after I learned how challenge rating works and how to counter the parties strats.
@@stock_movie1875 It's not about learning CR or party strats- this is about keeping the PCs on an equal level so no one feels like an extra in someone else's story. Also not a big fan of wild assumptions out of virtually no context my guy.
@@drfeelgoodinc. If they feel like that then it's because they are BEING TREATED as an extra
That’s why my dm is having all of us roll stats together and all take the same numbers
I do like Matthew Mercer's add: regular Roll for Stats, but the sum of all 6 rolls cant be below 70
That's an interesting take. So if your total is below 70, does he say to basically add points to your stats until you make up the difference or just scrap the numbers and roll again?
Still bad as you can still get large swings. 10 point difference is all the ASI between level 1 to 20 for a non-fighter character. And that 10 point difference is quite likely.
Simple solution, just roll for the party as the DM and let everyone use that block of numbers OR just buff the standard array. It’s only a problem if you let it be a problem
2nd option is bad imo. Now you characters are just needlessly more stronger and you have even more rebalancing to do.
Or hear me out. Learn to properly understand basic enemy mechanics like challenge rating, pack tactics, and using their own stats against them.
@@Terker2 Not really. I’ve had NO trouble after buffing my players a bit. Rebalancing only becomes an issue if you go insane with it, I’m not suggesting you give them four 18s and two 16s
@@stock_movie1875
1. Challenge ratings can be horribly unreliable.
2. I’ve never had balancing issues after buffing my players, especially since my table prefers the high-fantasy epic type of games.
3. My point was mainly preferring to the first half of his video where he talks about the potential inequality, which is fixed with my two methods which are plenty common -I’m not a revolutionary that came up with this idea….others use them.
4. Enemy combat mechanics go way beyond simply “using their own stats against them” or pack tactics lol. You’re oversimplifying the issue. There are creatures with bad stats that can still kill a party. Some creatures have good stats but no abilities that really make them a threat. Some creatures are just hit point sponges despite their challenge rating. I also don’t see what buffing a party has to do with pack tactics -unless you’re saying the party should employ pack tactics or try to meta game by memorizing stat blocks of monsters
Honestly rolling for stats is fun especially when you get a high stat then low stat, it can make the character more powerful in some areas but lack luster in others and you figure ways around the problem.
its fun when it does that but like personally I usually end up 11s and 13s... Pretty bland stats
I normally end up with bad to normal stats
For some reason stat rolls hate me
So I use the buy system
@@fabi3790 yeah I mean you can use point by but you know ur allowed a reroll, also depending on ur dm they might allow you to keep trolling till it's at least balanced lol. Altho that might get tedious and annoying if you have bad rolls
@@Theredmeep852 oh you can reroll?
I didn't play DnD yet (just read the rules)
But Pathfinder 1e
There we used the buy.
Tbh i like buy. Because i have to get a "strategy" how to use my points
I wish point buy let me drop and raise scores more so I could get those high highs and low lows without having to chance jt
Man literally forgot that Custom Lineage (and pre-errata Changeling) can start with an 18 in a stat, allowing 20 at level 4.
Custom lineage is also an optional rule
There is a reason why there was an errata, innit?
@@Xyronyteyes it's an optional thing but at the same time a basic human gets a free+1 to ALL stats and a free feat at level 1....
Me and my veteran group of players and our DM have a very interesting way of how we roll for stats which I think people should try once in a while. If you have a good solid group that you consistently play with and know you're going to be able to do a full campaign with. Try this. Everyone rolls their standard set of stats. But instead of the stats being for your character. They're added to a massive pool of every stat that everyone rolled. And then everyone comes together and picks and chooses which stats they want and everyone has to work together to minimax together what they want and what they don't. It allows us to make sure everyone has one bad stat that is their dump stat and everyone else gets what they wanted.
I am still in the middle of my first campaign now but I have rolled up for characters for it. My DM's rule is that at least two stats must be above fifteen or you and completely reroll and start over as many times as you need to until you get to stats above 15.
What the point of rolling then?
@@user-yh4zm3nz6y some level of randomness I guess?
@@Ringohulk777 at this point its the bad type of random. Some player will get 15 15 8 6 9 10 and the other 18 17 8 14 16 13
It wouldn't feel fair, if its a long campaign that is. If it's a one shot it might be fun.
I usually use the Dungeon Dudes standard array.
Lvl 8 for a 20 in a stat is a long way to go.
Also point buy creates a problem for classes that focus on multiple stats. Like barbarians and monks have their ac based on con+dex or dex+wisdom.
Group Rolling: 24d6 are rolled by the party (split evenly).
Remove the 4 lowest and 2 highest rolls (this could be changed to 6 lowest, 3low/3high, or whatever as long as 6 dice are removed)
You now have a pool of 18 rolled dice. Each player can arrange these dice into their custom stats (3 dice per stat)
*gives the fun and variability of rolling for stats while giving everyone the same potential power without the samey rigidity of standard point buy*
I think a fun idea would be to roll together with the whole group and then they can build their characters together it's a great way to introduce each other maybe even write backstory together or other fun things
I play in a campaign where we all not only rolled dice for stats, but also for surviving the first session our DM gave us all a +2 that we could use however we wanted, so I got Wisdom and constitution to 16 and dexterity at 20 as a variant human monk level 1. And even so in the fighting he manages to make it difficult for everyone 😂
Well you playing a monk probably helped with the last part...
@@thestylemage2092
Well, here’s the thing. I’ve given several DMs the gaming equivalent of Vietnam Flashbacks in regard to my Monk builds. Are they the powerhouse that a GWM Battlemaster Fighter is? Usually no. But, they can pull off some unique BS that no other class can quite match, especially with an inventive/tactical player.
Perception of power is a little.. sideways, in a lot of online DnD forums. The majority of it is rooted in legitimate stats and breakdowns, but it often results in cases where, if a particular feature or class or combo exceeds another by 1.1 dpr, the “over preforming” one is lauded as the only viable choice, and all others are considered underbalanced trash... this isn’t practical. Since there’s so much situational content in an improvisation based puzzle game with combat, what shines depends entirely on the context, and thoughtful application.
@@thestylemage2092In my group we have a wizard bladesinger and a druid of the moon, and that druid of the moon has a multiple personality condition that makes him change from time to time or certain events, so he can be a wizard, a warlock, a cleric, a paladin and I don't remember what else, so the group as such is not weak. In my case I have a living weapon monk from eberron and I use all the optional features of tashas, I have Eldritch claw magic object, and I have mobility feat, we are still low level due to the fact that the campaign was paused (I am the one with the highest level and I am level 5), so That with that you could better qualify the group (there is someone else in the group but being a rookie he does not have that much experience playing in combat, I am not counting it, he is an armorer artificer)
I actually like rolling for stats better. Cause I like to leave it to luck for my stats and if they are horrible then I can incorporate the reason why into my character backstory/lore. It’s been a minute but if I remember correctly we rolled 4 d6’s and take away the lowest roll and add the three rolls together. Do that until you have enough rolled numbers and then assign the any of those numbers to each stat
Yes, that is how rolling for stats works.
One idea my DM incorporated into a roll for stats campaign is allowing the players to roll multiple times. 6 rolls a set so you have the stats for your character and then 3-4 sets. Then you choose one from among those sets
You may have one where you roll perfect and get an 18 in one or two stats but an 8 and a 9 in another. While another set may have at most a 14-15 but your lowest is a 12.
The one problem came from one player having the best luck I’ve ever seen and didn’t roll lower than a 16. It was of course the barbarian.
I've been writing my own tabletop rpg murder mystery recently. I'm using the same stats as D&D but having the numbers be listed as literally just what the plus or minus to the roll would be (i.e. 6 is a really good number). Each player selects a job for their character which affects their backstory and special abilities (kind of like their class but real-world and not so combat related), and each job also comes with one stat set at 5 (quite high) and one at -3 (quite low). For the other 4 stats, they roll a D4 four times and assign the numbers to the other stats, but they're not allowed to have more than one 4 (plus one of my players rolled three 1s and I felt so bad that I made a new rule that you could only have two 1s). The point, besides me being excited about my own mechanics, is that something similar could be implemented when rolling for stats in normal D&D: you can have one stat over 16, for example, and you need one under 8, but you can reroll if you get 3+ numbers under 8. Something like that to keep the excited randomness of rolling for stats but keep it in a certain middling realm and make it more fair for the whole party. You could change those parameters if you want higher or lower leveled players in the campaign.
This reminded of when me and my dm first started playing and didn't really know how to do stats, so I ended up with a nat 20 in...everything.
I played a variant human zealot barbarian named Frank who specialized in using other characters (mainly the Fire Genasi Rouge) as Thrown weapons.
I forgot to mention this was a Level 4 character.
I like rolling for stats, simply because it allows character more times to choose feats over asi. Personally, I think asi are boring as hell and feats are fun. I'll take the extra work in balancing as long as the characters are enjoying the options they have available
May i present to you the option to use poit buy but simply with more points? Fair, powerful, its the players choice and fault if they chose bad and not the dice gods will.
@@user-yh4zm3nz6y I would love to do that but I have a lot of very new players, and if it isn't on ddb then they will be so confused haha
@@Melvinious nothing complicated just ise one of the many stats calculator and use custom settings, its not that hard and its the little investment that pays of sooo much.
The character with a 14/12/13/12/10/7/9 array, seeing the other player already at 20 at level 1...
@@thestylemage2092 a know the feeling and let me tell ya it doesn't feel good(
5e was NOT built around point buy.... The default method for acquiring stats IS rolling for them. It's in the PHB. Point buy and standard array are VARIANT rules. Page 12 under "Determining ability scores" if you don't believe me."
Exactly!
Well I’m pretty sure multiclassing was something they went into it knowing they’d have it be a feature but look multiclassign is OPTIONAL
You are right, however, all official D&D play requires point buy and bans rolling, so it's a bit of a mixed bag from the devs
Adventure League is not "official" D&D, it is a rules adjacent platform using a standardized rules for "equal" play. What is printed in the books is "official" D&D and the intended rules for the vast majority of players who will play D&D. Saying Adventure League is the "official" D&D is like saying tournaments are the "official" ways to play games. @@Xyronyte
Next OP will be telling us that feats do not reflect the intended play experience 🙄
On the second character I ever played, I rolled two 18s. Being a Monk, I put them into Dex and Wis. After racial bonuses and the first ASI, I had a +5 to hit and an unarmored AC of 20 at level 4. It felt awesome as a new player to just crush everything and to be untouchable, but looking back I absolutely overshadowed all of my party members.
Our way of rolling stats is 4d6, reroll 1s and 2s, take the highest 3. It's fun and it works.
I like playing kinda crappy characters "Who's got the highest wisdom to make the check? Adam, what's yo-" "nah I ain't good at anything, just move on"
I mean, I kinda disagree that it makes other players feel crappy, though mostly due to my own personal experience with rolling for stats. There are also ways to prevent players from getting super shitty rolls, like how I personally do it is you roll seven sets of 4d6, ignoring the lowest roll, and can then choose six out of the seven you roll.
I remember that in a manual of the 3.5 version, stats are chosen by dice rolling, but made sure that the maximum in a single stat for a level 1 player was 12 and the minimum was 3 or something.
“Point-Buy Stats Can Be Problematic” video when???? 👀
@MonkeyDM
Proposed alternate solution:
DM rolls the stats once, whichever method you prefer. The resulting numbers are the stats that EVERYONE must use. Pick and choose which blocks they go in, but you MUST use those numbers.
For extra sadism, make them pick thier classes before the roll.
From the little still of the Short I thought you were dressed in a prison costume
The method I used on my last campaign (which is a 2-DM campaign with a friend of mine) is that you roll for 3 scores, and the 3 other rolls will be the complement to 25 of the first 3. It ensures everyone has the same total stat score (75), creates decently powerful characters, and still allows for level 1 20 score and the excitement that goes with it, with a price to pay for it (being a 7 elsewhere). Any roll below a 7 could be re-rolled once, and if still below 7 would become a 7, as that is low enough to be handicap while not completely incapacitating, and maintaining the rule without breaking Bounded Accuracy
My dm once had everyone roll for stats, and then took the highest total and told us all the adjust our stats until our totals matched that one. That was fun
In my homebrew, I've borrowed and modified Pathfinder 2's system of point buy where every step of character creation gives you boosts to scores, and at the end you get free points to put wherever.
once i rolled my stats and i got five eightings.
Something my table is going to try for our next time we roll up characters is doing a dice pool. Everyone rolls for stats like normal, but you take something like your 2 highest and 1 lowest roll and put them in a pool. Then as a party you go around the table and discuss how you want to split up those numbers.
Sometimes my DM would try a demigod stat homebrew, where he grants all of us a free 20, but any 18-20's rolled after become 8-10's.
My rolling is so insane practically everyone is a Demi god and that balances everything out
Speaking of demigods, it's pretty nice to play next to a min maxing demigod if you knew it would happen beforehand.
It gives a great opportunity to test stuff, you can try a utility or support role, and your herculean party member all the pressure off in a lot of situations.
Plus, RP has been really fun. In the past, we've played around with some hilarious social dynamics.
I’ve tried quite a few things for starting stats in my groups, and there is something fun about rolling.
One of my favorite alternatives was an extended point buy. I’ve had players who really like playing a character with a -2 in something. So, you had 33 points, but base stat was 6. It cost 1 point to go from 6 to 8. And I let them spend 3 points to take a stat to 16 since I personally don’t mind players having an 18 at level one. Especially if means they’ve gimped something else I can toy with.
Found this out the hard way recently, I rolled up a level 10 cleric to join a campaign and ended up with a +5 to Wisdom and +4 to Constitution, ended up just being the glue for the party in any major battle. Needed some good roleplay so I ended up using my -1 Intelligence and +0 Charisma very well for accidentally causing fights. Such a fun campaign.
This is why at my table I enforce a maximum total limit and a minimum total limit. So the actual total difference between the highest and lowest rollers doesn't end up being too large.
Everyone at the table rolls a statline. Everyone at the table can then choose any of the statlines.
My favorite way for doing stats is everyone shares from the same rolled stat array. It was a ton of fun as we rolled 2 complete stat arrays and all chose which one to use. Super interesting seeing 7 PCs (including 2 Clerics) all pick and choose where our shared array went.
In my 1 & only campaign, we did a buffed version of rolling for stats. 5d6 drop the 2 lowest. And if your stats were especially high or low compared to other players, the DM would just alter some of your stats. I rolled like mad & the DM just said "that 17 is now a 7." I honestly loved it.
I had one of my players roll really good stats while I was DMing, to the point where they were carrying every fight. They were playing as a wooden warforged, so I did the only thing I could think of to make them suffer: I gave them wood lice. Every time they attacked, the wood lice would slowly eat away at his insides. Very fun
DnD house rules for our table regarding stats went like this. You roll out 6 numbers with dice and record them at the table with a witness. Then you get to decide wether you want to keep your rolls or use the cookie cutter stats that we used at the table. " 18, 16, 14, 12, 10, 8.
I’m playing my first campaign and my dm was with us to help us make our characters and nerfed some of our rolls to make it more balanced
I did a weird system for my Curse of Strahd game and my players loved it. You roll a d6, then add the result to a 12 and subtract it from a 13. Then a d8, adding it to 10 and subtracting from 15. Finally a d10, adding to 8 and subtracting from 17. Once youve done that, you've got a set of random stats that always add up to a total of 75.
Fun idea for stat rolling, take all the stats and divide them evenly amongst party members, and DM if need-be. Make each person roll once each until 6 rolls have been completed
Those 6 values are then applied just like Standard Array.
Let's say it's a party of 5, and then the DM.
The party rolls 11, 13, 8, 17, 16
The DM rolls 10
8, 10, 11, 13, 16, 17 would then be that group's version of 8, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15.
I've never had that hard of a time balancing, but to each their own.
My table used a point buy rework that I made, where it functions identically to normal point buy, but you have 34 points, and can use 3 to increase from 15 to 16, and from 16 to 17. Rolling can still give better stats if you want to gamble on it, but it no longer creates such a massive power gap between the guy that rolled multiple 14+ stats, and the guy that chose not to risk it. We also allow the choice between either a single reroll for the gambling types, or a switch to point buy, when they inevitably end up with, like five stats under 8 because all of us have negative luck irl, lol
So I need to create my own homebrew.
In my current campaign I rolled both high and low. So at level 1 my Fallen Aasimar Sorcerer had 20 Charisma and 8 Constitution. I spoke with the GM about it being a better balance than putting the 8 in something that wouldn't have mattered.
Something my very 1st DM did to combine balance and randomness was have us each roll a D6 and add it to a point pool for point buy (don't remember the exact numbers, it was 13+ years ago)
I once rolled a character with all 10's and had to play it for several sessions. It was in maybe 2nd edition, back when you didn't get stat increases.
In my most recent games, I've used this rule to create strong but variable character experiences: roll 7 stats and drop the lowest, using 4d6 (drop the lowest). Then, if that outcome is less preferable to the player than an array, you can use the array instead.
This insures your character is always viable, but you have the opportunity to play something more chaotic if you wish, as you might see a roll that inspires something fun for you.
I'm a strong proponent in making sure players love their characters, but I also believe having bad stats isn't and shouldn't always be seen as a guarantee that you'll have a bad experience at the table.
Counter point. The dice make nice sound when I roll them
We roll as a group with each player rolling some stats
I’ve been tempted by the idea of just sitting somewhere while recording myself, until I get 20 in all stats.
Though that’s a 0.00000002% chance.
"20 in a stat is normally only reached starting from level 8"
My LV4 Tieffling Paladin with 20 charisma : Bruh...
One way to counteract this is to basically roll one set of stats for everyone to use. Maybe each player rolls for 1-2 stats and the combined rolls give you an array that everyone can distribute however they wish. I personally just use a modified point buy (30 points instead of 27 cuz my players like to round off some numbers and it helps MAD classes), but I get the love for rolling stats. As a DM and as a group we have been firmly entrenched in the "roll less dice" mentality since we play to just to have fun, hang out, eat snacks, and just mess around with jokes since our games are on the more light-hearted side.
One note to consider, after Custom Lineage was added to the game, an 18 in a stat was now possible at level 1
Take a 15, +2 for racial, then choose a +1 feat that corresponds with your +2.
So 20 can be reached as early as level 4
And, even without custom lineage, fighters can get a 20 at level 6
I accidentally stayed up until 4am one time trying to roll my stats juuuust right... I have a problem...
I plan on using a third method in my home brew system, to avoid the similar issue which can occur in point buy systems. The problem of one guy with mid stats across the board because he doesn’t want anything to be low, and the other guy with half high stats and half low ones, which is kind of a more traditional way of specking. This system would say if you had six stats, say, and 1 was the highest and 6 was the lowest, you could assign a 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6 to each of them. That way everyone has similarly specked characters.
When I do stats, everyone logs their stat arrays, and any other person can pick a rolled array another player has
We've had issues with this in the past. What my party came up with is we roll 2 stat blocks and choose which one we want. Also if the overall modifier bonus is less than +4 then we can re-roll those stat blocks. This usually helps balance things out because just about everyone gets 2 great stats that are 14 or up before racial bonuses
You could split it, give them a portion they divide as they like, then the last part they roll a (smaller) die to still have some chance/luck in their stats (and even that could be capped, once you have rolled up your total number, you stop and the remaining stats are unimproved).
in one of my recent campaign, since we had 6 players, everyone rolled one set of 4d6 dl and this way we all had the same stats set, just organized differently
In our grou we all roll for stats and pick all characters to have one that we all agree upon
We do 4d6 drop the lowest number and roll two sets. Generally if both sets are average or abysmal we let them reroll until they have at least one really solid one in the set. Standard array is optional but we just really like getting to roll the math rocks. 😊
Ok BECMI you rolled the dice.
Always been that way.
Rolling for stats created some difficulties at my table. I had some players who were incredibly lucky, rolling in front of me and getting two 18s abd nothing below a 12 where the next player had all scores from 7 to 13. And yet another player who would roll stats & then try to "discreetly" throw his character away if he didn't get at least three 18s and any scores were below 14
Whenever I run games now, I started with an alternate Array that I made because I like to make combat and challenges more difficult than usual for any given level. I take big inspiration from Dark Souls types for my homebrew stuff so I give my players 17, 15, 14, 12, 10, 8 as their Array to pick from
Randomizing stats is hilarious,
We once had a campaign where after choosing basics for our characters, we were to roll stats, and roll backstory elements that would give a +1 to one of the stats depending on backstory.
It was funny to see a witch with strength double that of a knight
The moment I took over as DM I did point buy and it’s been the best experience both for my players and me as a DM.
That's why I use the Standard Array for every PC I build. The most I get at LV1 is an 18 after Racial Bonus.
Unless I use the +2 on a Dump Stat (like my Shadow Sorcerer Half-Orc changing an 8 in STR to a 10), this adds *FLAVOR!*
I used to try and DM for people I find on Reddit. I kept running into players who would insist on rolling for stats even though I would always request on point buy. They would then leave after rolling poorly or try and convince me to allow them to roll dice in person without a camera. The few people who would stay would brag about how cool and OP their characters were.
I found a stat system that avoids the problem of some players being stronger than others, while still rolling for stats. It involves rolling a die 6 times, and then using a baseline number, like 13, and having each die result added to one stat and subtracted from another.
Ok not only did my friend do that but he also said in the stats you need hed allow the highest roll to go into that slot. Its pretty insane he allows that.
We've been playing D&D since 1985. We have always rolled stats in front of the DM. We usually take our characters from 1st to 10th level and that can take more than a year to do playing four hours once a week. While in yesteryears we followed the game module information on leveling characters, our DMs now have their own worlds, create their own campaigns, and occasionally break the rules to keep us having fun and not bog us down in the rules lawyering. We usually design our characters before rolling for stats. Some require better dice rolls than others, but usually having at least two 16s (you can have more than two 16s if that is what you roll at the time) and everything else a 16 and below is where we stop rolling. But some characters usually need a bit "more" especially if the party is lacking a healer or mage-type because no one wanted to play one when we decided what we wanted to play. It's incentive to play a character you didn't want to play originally. As for what is going on in D&D, we leave up to the community, but we do have to say we've grown past what the original books and publishers provided. While we still abide by most of the rules in the books, we almost never consider the modules coming out. Going through the recent book-like module of Dungeon of the Mad Mage (DotMM) was actually very boring until our DM found the much more entertaining "Companion"[DotMM(C)] add-on to go with it. Why do I feel that even our old original D&D modules (we DO still have the originals) had a lot more in them? But it was still quite a slog in DotMM(C) compared to our normal sessions that are usually much more colorful with direct character storylines and roleplay. Oh we typically have a combat every session, but it's not the total focus of the session. And our characters go up levels as they reach milestone events or achievements so it can take quite a while before the DM feels we're ready to go on to the next higher mobs/boss--which is usually when we're all comfortable with it. We don't rush up the levels like we used to do. It's no longer a race to level 20 for us. We like to enjoy the ride and occasionally do a little sightseeing along the way. Maybe it was the way DotMM(C) was in a hardback book format and really gave you no room to write down notes? Old style modules were usually manila folder-like board with stapled together paper and almost never all that thick unless it was a very big module or "multi-module" pack that took the characters up a lot of levels. Like the original Ravenloft, Temple of Elemental Evil, or the Giants Series. It takes me back thinking of all the clipped notes, loose pieces of paper, and highlighted text our old modules have. LOL Simpler times without as much corporate greed?
My DM more or less fixed stat roll with the following modification:
If you roll above 15, you have to take any higher points and put them in another stat of your choice at half value (so roll a 19 and you can put [19-15]/2=4/2=2 points in another stat). Max you can start with in any stat is 15, and you can only have 15 in two stats unless you roll 15+ three times, after that the max is 14. No minimum tho, so you can start with 4 int if you wanted to - generally you'd allocate some of the excess points to the low rolls too. You MAY reallocate points from rolls of 13 or higher as well, same 2 to 1 ratio, dropping that roll to 12 max.
as they say in my group: no seas trolo man
The way I like to handle stats is roll up 6 sets of 4d6, drop the lowest, then you can take from one number to add to another, so if u roll a bunch of mediocre stats, you can alter it to give your character strengths AND weaknesses. This generally makes specialists who are best paired with a variety of party members, generalists and specialists alike
This is why I usually have a group pool. Say I have 3 players. Each player rolls 3d6 twice. They all then use everything rolled as their pool. They can arrange however they wish.
One of the DMs I play with has a rule that you can roll stats, but the total has to be between 78-82, otherwise you can use a modified point buy of 18,16,14,12,10,8. No player has ended up far more powerful than others, and we just recently finished a CoS campaign.
well once a player wanted to roll d20's for his Orruk character (a race based on warhammer orks) so they where pretty silly so he had a 5+ in strength but a score of 2 in int, he rp'd his character as having memory issues and such so honestly i still love Derek and will do it again
My table when we roll for stats, we do it kind of differently. We still want the random stats but we don’t want anyone to suffer so we have a minimum total of like 75 that we invoke.
What this means obviously is you take the total and added up and if it’s 75 or greater is the legal stat it unless someone wants to suffer or has a funny meme idea. We also allow our players to roll three different sets and she was the one they want most. It’s definitely not the OG method but it’s really fun for us.
Embrace chaos, fuck balance.
My father + DM Just Has us roll 6 numbers and makes all of us use those same numbers
As someone with notoriously bad luck, I really don't want to roll for something as integral as my stats
Relevant Story Time about dice rolls:
As a person who has really bad stat rolling luck I've been one of the underpowered characters,. I even rolled 3 8's, 2 9's and a 12 once. This character was a nightmare to play as because he could do almost nothing, they were basically like an escort companion. Stat rolling flat, as an unlucky person, isn't the best way to do stats, but I once had a DM that used a modified stat roll.
Min 8, Max 15, anything that ended up being higher than a 10 was taken out of a modified point buy total.
Yeah, understandable -glances at my three 18s on my plasmoid druid-