After finished the game, I think Hades can also act like Apollo in a passive way, Sylens said that he learnt calculus, physics, chemistry and a lot of old world knowledge from Hades that means Hades function is not only undo Gaia's work. Hades can teach too, if you know how to ask him or force him to answer.
Well there's bound to be minimum knowledge in those fields for Hades to actually know what he is doing when he activates. And (reverse) terraforming is quite some complicated stuff. Now that it is self aware and can talk to people, being able to exchange knowledge as a bargaining chip or conversation tool is a natural consequence, but I doubt Hades was ever intentionally designed to do so, and his knowledge on subjects not involved in his primary functions are probably lacking; culture and arts, for example.
Yeah all of the AIs are completely sentient and capable of making massively complex calculations related to the physical world. It makes sense that if pressed it could teach someone such concepts.
But, would you want it? Imagine if you were in this world after the events of the first game. If you found out knowledge came from the single most evil entity that you know of wouldn't you be a little worried about the side effects of taking the devil as your teacher? When GAIA comes around that knowledge will slowly circulate and they will probably treat her like a god for it until they learn enough to understand what she is. If all that information was unceremoniously dropped at the feet of all humans with "zero fail-safes" as the fictional Dr. Soebek(or however her name is spelled) says, It probably wouldn't work out well. Like, a handful of people learning all this information then hiding from the world and creating a secret civilization to conquer the world bad.
Gaia and the other AIs certainly know a lot about science and math, but that's about it. Apollo was not only a huge database, but should also teach the people. Sylens consults Hades because he is obsessed with knowledge, but Hades would not be able to train anyone. The only logic gap here would be that certain subroutines would have to be there through Eleuthia. The infants were trained pedagogically. Gaia should be intelligent enough to also create or expand own AIs and could have at least taught the natural sciences to the humans, even if she lacks the history and culture. The reasons for Zero Dawn should also be known to her, they could have told the people.
Watching this video after the Horizon: The Forbidden West trailer has dropped, I can't help but wounder if this theory is in some part correct. In the trailer it appears that some type of blight is taking over the land, infecting the animals and killing the plant life. What if this blight is something that Hades was trying to prevent or delay? What if he saw the start of it and predicted what it would do? That it would become a much bigger problem later on?
I'm positive that what the video says is the truth, but it's not subtle or implied, but clear and openly true, known factually. But not that the transmission to Gaia came from Hades.
The problem with that theory, is that we know the Hephaestus program has also gone rogue, creating the more dangerous, combat focused machines. It's possible that the blight and weather anomalies seen in the trailer are the result of the other malfunctioning AIs.
I think it‘s interesting that we saw big Storms and a dangerous unknown new plant that seems to attack the flora and fauna in the Forbidden West Trailer. Since we know that the subordinate functions of Gaia escaped, my first thought was that maybe Aether and Demeter started getting out of hand destroying the atmosphere as well as creating new plants. I mean, we saw what Hades and Hephaestus could do.
Maybe since APOLLO was purged and the humans were released anyway HADES saw the actions of the humans ( if we assume the tribal inhabitants were similar to ice age us) causing multiple mass extinctions and hunting of terraforming machines (As CYAN hypothesised) , if this was veiwed by HADES as 'not going to plan ' then he would act as he was meant to , as did GAIA . so in conclusion non of them did anything wrong the source of the misunderstanding between the two intelligent functions was the absence of APOLLO in the equation which was not accounted for originally. So all in all looks like Ted Faro caused the end of the world twice .... P.s Ted also killed HADES's Alpha before he had completely added the final touches to HADES possibly adding the issue . P.s.s Its relatively possible to bring back APOLLO , as with the purged data in Ted's office its possible to bring back the data if you have the clearance , the only problem with this is that Ted pudged it , so you'd needed someone with Omega level clearance to restore the data and the location of the original purged data . That leaves a few questions can once GAIA is reconstructed create another Ted so when he grows up He'd have that clearance level , like Aloy and Elisabet , and wheres the purged data ? Maybe where ever the original Ted was ? P.s.s.s After thinking about it a bit more if that new Ted and his journey to restore the Lost Archive of Human Knowledge ,it would be kinda poetic , he would be the one to make amends for the mistakes of his father in a way .. I personally would love to see that in a future game :'3
Good old Ted, just can't stop making the world a worse place lol. Interesting thought about APOLLO with what we now know about CYAN. I hope your right about bringing APOLLO back, if corrupted data can be restored, maybe purged can too! Speaking of Ted, if I might recommend another video. I'd check out the Lightkeeper vid I think you'd find it very interesting :)
@@DHSNAKE inb4 someone Says Omega was a lower level of clearance that already existed despite the Alpha members showing shock and Omega clearance being able to override the Alphas attempts to access the system. As much as Ted fucked up I doubt that his cloned counterpart would make the exact same mistake. And besides, it seems like a good potential continuation of the story, after the second battle with Hades and Sylens of course
NoodleCat not only that but he could possibly be a love interest to Aloy. Just think, they hated each other in their past lives. They had different views. I mean Ted wasn’t really a bad guy... he was just dumb and made poor decisions in favor of keeping power.. Elisabet dislikes that. But in this new world, clone Ted can fix the wrong his predecessor did and make amends with Aloy, and possibly be a love interest hehe 😝
This is one of my many theories - most are more convoluted, but this one could work. I honestly don't think this one is it, but I wouldn't mind if it was! If it is, I believe it would be something stemming from the destruction of Apollo - Humanity was intended to take control during the very first generation - of the Terraforming Systems, releasing later stage life forms, rebuilding cities, they were intended to have a role in completing terraforming procedures that they were not permitted to take on due to the lack of proper guidance from Apollo. There could very well be consequences of that taking hold at 1000+ years after initial stages of Terraforming were completed.
Interesting theory, but I don't think that it's plausible Hades could have been doing his natural reset protocol. Once the humans in the Eleuthia cradles start gestation, Hades is obsolete. They can't propogate life in the cradles for more than a generation and they can't start over. Everything outside needs to be set to go before Eleuthia begins working. I'm no expert on AI, but the primitive AI we have now essentially work by maximizing certain functions. It seems to me that each subordinate function was only geared to maximize some performance of success, while Gaia was needed to regularize them and weigh them against each other. Example: Haephestus is supposed to design and build robots that survive to do their job. When regulated by Gaia, robots killed by humans are successful enough, because endangering human life would weigh against Gaia's other functions. Without Gaia to regularize, the natural step to improving the robots is to arm them with weapons and create protectors for them.
Hades I think would work the same way. He's just maximizing a function. But because his goals conflict so much with the other goals, the value of his function is weighted extremely low. Once he's unconnected to the other programs, there's suddenly a huge need to begin killing everything.
I actually spoke about this at a panel recently, since it's a valid point. One thing that is often overlooked is that ZD was only "functionally complete" circa Zero Day, but there were still much to be ironed out. That's the predominate reason the Alphas had to remain in GAIA prime. They presumed they had the rest of their natural lives to compete this work, time that they obviously wouldn't have. This means there's no real way to determine what Tate actually completed during the remainder of his life. He wasn't even entirely sure the Protocol would be successful at the time of his journal. If he was still refining that process, everything else would have come second. Long story short, HADES may have been meant to only be operational pre phase one organisms, but there's no way of knowing that that process was completed during Tates lifetime.
Right. For all we know, the function was designed to run before Phase 1 organism, and it was never turned off. I'm not dismissing it, which is why in my post I said I don't see this as a tinfoil theory. I think it has substance. But based on what we do know as of the game, the intent was that it would run before Phase 1. Personally, I hope that this isn't the case. While I like that kind of dark/grey, bleak twist, I feel in this case it would be anti-climatic if this was HADES design working, and GAIA overreacted. I definitely can see her misreading being put into a code shell as being cut off from her subordinate functions, but I just hope there's a more fleshed out method for the awakening of the subroutines. I really hope it has something to do with Far Zenith, Vast Silver, or something else. I mean again, we don't know the states of the other Eleuthia facilities. For all we know, another cradle site's people developed further, or weren't as afraid to explore the ruins of the Old Ones, and have a better sense of technology. They might have tampered with something they didn't know, and its result sent a signal to GAIA and thus began the chain of events we saw. It's why I'm obsessed with this game, and continue to play over and over, reading and re reading every piece of data, because they put SO MUCH into the game that left so many ways to hypothesize so much that could have happened, is happening, and might happen.
Two parts of the said-'virus': The advanced Odyssey-born Humans. (Human-Vektan-like advanced Human crossover everyone?). Or... *Horizon Zero Dawn's own working Faro-skynet Rampant A.I.*
Finished HZD earlier today and its made me hungry to dig deeper into the lore and I somehow stumbled upon your videos. I've only watched about five of them so far but they're very fun! I enjoy the theories you interject along with the canonical information quite a bit. However, I do want to say I think this one has a flaw -- HADES was designed to work before GAIA started introducing people back to the planet since there is only a limited number of zygotes and resources for it to work with, so a system had to be in place to assure the environment would be just right. Tate basically says this when describing HADES -- you don't want to put people there and hope they fix the problem and then not be able to; that'd ruin all their plans and work. And at this point in the story, humans have been reintroduced to earth for generations now, yet whatever activated HADES was only about 20 years ago from HZD's present. Based on this, it feels unlikely that HADES would be designed to perceive humans as a threat to mission success (like from them hunting the terraforming machines or showing excessive violence, etc), since this is clearly a one-shot kind of deal - without more zygotes and facility resources GAIA wouldn't be able to bring them about again. I suspect HADES was only designed to play a part up until humans were introduced, then it would be deactivated and basically put on the shelf. Therefore, I think it couldn't be HADES acting as designed by activating when it did and the signal GAIA detected must have been from an outside source.
Hey Jotakori, that's very perceptive, and your correct. I realised that fact after the vid was published early on. GAIA did what she had to do to protect life. However, the important thing to remember is that Zero Dawn was "functionally complete". Meaning it could get the job done, but there's no way of knowing what still needed to be done. That's why the alpha personnel remained, but obviously never got a chance to finish they're work. Tate was just beginning to refine the protocol, but may have never completed every safeguard. Tasks that he thought he would have the rest of his natural life to complete. So even though HADES may have never been intended to take control post humans, that may have not been a Tate had been able to finish before his death.
@@RandomSideQuest I still would think that acting before Phase I organisms were introduced would be a priority to be launched before Zero Day, the other aspects of making sure GAIA would still be able to take control would have fallen second to that. Make sure primary functions are good before adding more.
@@RandomSideQuest I just played through HZD for the first time on PC. Late to the party, I know. Regardless, I think you forgot the fact that after zero day, Faro kept a very close watch on the Alphas. They talked about how he pestered them for status updates and for information on their tasks. Knowing that Faro's plan was to kill them all and eliminate Apollo so that the future humans would be free from tech, he absolutely didn't mean to harm the integrity of the system and its operations in any way. I'm pretty sure we aren't given a clear timeline on how long it took before Faro killed them, but I would assume that the reason why he was so antsy and wanted every piece of information they could provide was because he wasn't going to kill them until ZD was complete.
This is an impressive theory, but Sylens did say at the end of the game that HADES's "masters" sent the signal that awoke him. So it seems unlikely that HADES was the one who sent the signal.
Yes, what ur saying is defintally valid, but on the other hand, Sylens only knows what Hades taught him and what Aloy knows. My point being he may not fully understand the reason Hades did what he did. Although that's all speculation, and if the devs put in a line about masters I'm sure they meant something by it.
HADES is an AI with one sole objective. It has demonstrated in more ways that one, it's ability to be lie in order to obtain it's goal. Sylens would only have knowledge of the signal based purely on what HADES choose to give him initially. It's very likely that HADES would lie about the signal, knowing that its purpose is "unknown" for a reason. Whatever HADES was given to usurp GAIA was designed to be intentionally discrete to the point of GAIA not being able to recognize that it's him taking control. If it wasn't, HADES likely knows it will be unable to execute it's function.
But say if there was outside control of HADES Wouldn't that mean someone who knows alot of Project Zero Dawn or is there another Corrupted AI whose more advanced?
After seeing the trailer for “Forbidden West”, this feels prophetic. I just purchased this game on “Black Friday” and finally got around to playing it. I just completed the main story a few nights ago and am about to begin the dlc. I can’t believe what I had been missing. One of the best games I’ve ever played. I found your channel and it is great as well. Keep it up.
It's so interesting rewatching this series now. Seeing what things you had right, were close on, and were completely wrong about. The lore in this game never ceases to amaze me. Cannot wait for Remastered.
Another theory is regarding the relocation spaceship program that was mentioned. In the story the communication was lost with the spaceship as it speculated to have been destroyed when exiting the solar system. But what if it actually succeeded, and the signal came from the new unknown planet, or aboard the spaceship? Perhaps the survivors reactivated Hades with ill-intent, or they wanted to repossess Earth without having to deal with its new inhabitants. This would also fall into line with the mention of Hades' master that Sylens mentions at the very end rather than awakening on its own
Here a viewer from spain, i've just discovered your channel. I want to congratulate you for the effort you must have to put in this channel. Your work is awesome, you've made me think a lot with this hades theory, i would have never thought of it if it wasn't for you, so thank you! I can't wait to watch more of your videos. Congrats again!
Well gaia still saved the world, because if hades would have gone trough with the resetting of the world, then there would not be any humans anymore. When visiting aloys birthplace, the ai specificly said it had to let the humands out because there was no more food so there would never be anymore humans because they could not feed the new infants.
Gaia saved THAT world and put in danger everything else.... If she didnt destroy herself hades would have wiped the world to a blank slate and after that Gaia could restart all over again. To me Gaia's decision was really emotion driven rather than a logical one
@@edoardofedrighi2102 this wouldn't hold true though, because phase 1 was already deemed completed and the cradles were expended, there would be no way to reset life again without the genetic material which was used. If Hades reset the planet again, Gaia would have no way to create humanity, and likely any animal life again.
This idea needs to be explored again in light of the trailer for Forbidden West!! In the trailer there is some strange plague killing plants... could this be an issue that hades was worried about and decided that Gaia’s work needed to be reversed?
Only thing I don't agree with is "the sub-functions would temporarily have to be made self aware to stop the terraforming system from failing while HADES reset the biosphere" That makes absolutely no sense. The sub-functions could easily just be put into a "standby mode" while HADES reset the biosphere. If they continued to fulfill their functions then that would interfere with resetting the biosphere. Not to mention that there's no "temporarily" making a program self aware, the only way to reverse something like that is to eliminate the sub-function and replace it with an original version (this even happens in the sequel, because *THAT'S* how obvious it is that you can't simply make a program "forget" that it was once sentient and self-aware). So in short: no, it was NEVER part of the Zero Dawn Protocol for any of the sub-functions to become self-aware. That would be excessively risky and frankly pretty stupid.
I wonder if Ted Faro’s destruction of Apollo indirectly caused Hades to be activated; humans were meant to take over the second stage of fauna proliferation as well as supervision of the entire system itself. Since humans were not stewarding this process, but were instead destroying the terraforming machines, the extinction protocol was activated, as intended
Wow. What could being going wrong in Gaia's creation that makes Hades the "good guy"? Never imagined that one.. however, now that you bring it up, could Ted Faros disruption of the Apollo program play into it? Such a minor thing but then again, Ted has a way of screwing things up... Thanks for keeping us thinking...this game's lore is immense. Oh nice Travis imitation btw... Perfect
Lol thank you very much Suundra, had to channel my inner Travis haha. Thats an interesting point, the wipe of Apollo fundamentally hindered Artemis and Eleuthia, maybe HADES as well. Appreciate your support!
If Apollo had still been around, it would have taught humans about the history of the world, and about the terraforming system. No doubt it was intended that, at some point, Apollo-taught humans would have taken over control of the terraforming system, or been integrated into helping the process along. This did not happen. Instead, humans have been raised in ignorance of the world and the machines around them that sustain their existence. We know that even before the derangement, the primitive humans hunted machines for parts and to salvage metals for tools. Presumably Gaia just gritted her teeth at this circumstance and tried to bear it, but think about how many machines must've been destroyed over the centuries, how many resources were wasted, how many fundamental processes were interrupted by ignorant humans. Enough to throw Gaias carefully laid plans off-track? It's been around 700 years since the first humans were created in the cradle facilities. 700 years into the terraforming process that should have had educated humans helping the process along. Instead we have 700 years of humans unintentionally damaging the very thing that keeps them alive. Assuming that certain process were supposed to be kept to some sort of schedule, it's fair to say that that schedule is now well and truly off kilter. Hades probably saw this, probably saw that the process is breaking down, slowly, over time and is seeking to end it quickly and restart, before too much more time is wasted and resources squandered. Unfortunately, without a viable Apollo program to teach humans, their part in the system can never be achieved. Even if Hades does his thing and Gaia were to start over, the process would just repeat. Of course, the other problem now, is that according to the holo-logs in All Mother Mountain, the caretaker bots of the humans only released them because they quite literally ran out of food to sustain them, which makes it seem like the creation of that first batch of humans was a 1 time thing, unless Gaia can build machines to restock the food supplies for another try. Maybe the extinction protocol was only supposed to kick in pre-Eluthia, ensuring that the biosphere was livable for humans before creating them, educating them, and then handing control back to them. Of course, nobody saw the possibility that once humans existed again, that Apollo would be gone and thus the system would break down. So yeah, Ted Faro really DID fuck the world twice over.
Hades isn't a true AI right, so it can only follow set protocols. But can things be suitable enough to convince Hades to not reset the world without other sub routines working as intended? And what are the factors necessary to have caused him to decide a reset is necessary?
Excellent video. I finished the game recently and actually started to think about HADES and how it's not exactly a villain, but it was doing what it was programmed to do. You shone a light on my thoughts and put it in words that which I hadn't been able to find.
I will say that this is quite an interesting theory but also has a major issue with the running plot line in the game itself. The premise that HADES felt the need to rest the biosphere which birthed Aloy into existence, is unfounded in the current information available to us in the world at present. The biosphere was functional and operating correctly considering that life has completely returned to the earth but in a more tribal way than actually envisioned by Elisabet Sorbeck when programming GAIA. My personal theory is that the virus is an actual virus created by Todd Faro while at his bunker known as Thebes (have a few theory’s on that but need to finish up some things before posting it to RUclips) and was setup to be executed when Minerva completed the Master Override. I believe that Todd Faro never wanted life to continue but was more interested in creating a world where humans left the planet and his Faro Plague devoured Earth. That’s just me considering that it is documented in game that he wanted the Faro Robots built without a back door protocol in the coding. It also wouldn’t surprise me if Todd setup a fail safe for himself to have an heir show up like Aloy. Plenty of birthing pods still left to work based on what we saw. Would be cool to have her team up with the heir of Todd Faro and they tag team the return of the full GAIA system and put Slyens in his place...but we will see. I also believe that that Elisabet has actually gotten the last laugh on Todd though. The complete lack of trust she has for him in the storyline is obvious. Someone in her position would have made sure that the entire GAIA system and all subordinate functions were backed up somewhere. I also think the key to finding them is the globe Aloy found with her body at the end of the storyline. Best guess it has a blood null codes lock that only Aloy would be able to open. Considering Cyan’s personality in the Frozen Wilds I am thinking that bringing them together is the key to showing Aloy the way forward, but that is for another time.
Holy Bus, never thought of that. The globe thing. Maybe, since we didn't see too much detail of the globe, just enough that we would know what it was, but not much more. Maybe some places have an indicator which has back ups of all but APOLLO, since that back was sent into spaced and presumably destroyed.
Late to the party but I want to say the way you said the log of what Tate wrote honestly from that point onward made me think Tate was narrating. thats a good thing of course. I love that someone is doing REALLY well made Horizon lore videos. Cant wait to follow you when Forbidden Wilds comes out
I think Hades did rewrite the biosphere multiple times, as HADES creator said ‘odds are GAIA won’t get it right the first time.’ This time though, GAIA had achieved a perfect biosphere , as she had started releasing animals and raising humans. But for some reason, HADES was activated again, before she could complete the biosphere. This caused her to resort to drastic measures, fearing HADES may have malfunctioned and therefore never shutdown/give her control back, as according to her, the biosphere was heading in a good direction, and HADES had no reason to activate (this time), and she also detected some unusual signal which supposedly did not happen the last times HADES had to be activated. So, let’s dot point this. -HADES has had to tear up multiple biospheres and creation by taking control and isolating GAIA (pisses off GAIA but she knows it needs to happen deep down). -this time though, after a few centuries, she’s got it right, starts releasing real animals, raising people (the first humans). -Bam, a mysterious signal gets detected, then HADES activates, despite everything being ok with the biosphere. -GAIA realises the signal might have malfunctioned HADES, and a malfunctioned HADES is a bad bad thing, considering how it takes ALL power from GAIA. -She fears HADES may never relinquish control, so she resorts to desperate measures to cripple HADES and hedge all her bets on ELISABET or ALOY, as that is better than having no life at all.
Callan here got it. Hades can and Gaia will allow it to take control until the Biosphere was stable enough for the Phase 1 Organisms to be released. After that happens, Hades becomes obsolete. That World's Biosphere Reset button called Hades is locked in Off position for good. Gaia is in control. She builds and directs the machines to clean the air and water and to stabilize the atmosphere. If at any point during that process something goes wrong, Hades steps in. Takes control of the machines Gaia built, not the Faro Swarm, and reverses the process back to the starting line. At which point, Hades hands over the control back to Gaia. And that goes on until the first plants, bacteria, animals, life in general takes root. Once at that point, Hades is locked out and will never get control again. But the Glitch that caused Faro Swarm to go rogue, finds its way into Hades and busts open the lock it was under. Sure, Hades simply follows its programmed protocol but at this point, it should not. That's why Gaia goes to such extremes to stop it. That's why she creates Aloy and that's why Hades is the death sowing AI as it was introduced. Hades is no longer the AI that was made by Travis Tate but a Glitched AI that was infected by the same thing that caused the Faro Swarm to go rogue.
I think if you look closely at the trailer of Forbidden West, you see exactly what HADES' Alpha described as "a failing biosphere". So maybe this terraforming attempt where Aloy is "born" in, isn't as perfect as it seems.
@@basdusee1 That's a very interesting theory and it raises the stakes for the sequel even HIGHER. Maybe Aloy's mission won't be to destroy and defeat HADES, but to discover that HADES is just following his protocol after detecting that this terraforming attempt will fail (the atmosphere is becoming unstable). Another theory (the one I first had in mind when I watched the trailer) is that HADES is responsible for the red storms, simply spreading the corruption because he's aware that Aloy is capable of deactivating him, so he's going all in and will stop at nothing until she and all of her allies are dead. All the same, the sequel seems to be HUGE and will definitely answer some of these questions!
Note that when Aloy speaks with Olin, he claims the pain from his Focus came from Hades speaking three words.. System Threat Detected. Perhaps Hades knew Aloy was a product of GAIAs desperation to prevent him from following his protocols so in essence they both decided to play dirty by enabling the Faro Robots and birthing Aloy because it was literally the last solution's either of them couldve taken. Perhaps Hades is just following protocol afterall, freed from the signal sent by [my theory: Vast Silver aboard the Odyssey] in order to cleanse the planet once more for an unknown reason / reclaimers. Aloy is simply the polar opposite of Hades, which together in the sequel we may see a twist in which they're symbiotic together.
I know i am extremely late to the party but I recently came up with a theory. I believe that Sylens had connected his lance to his focus (he is an extremely competent programmer and has gone around HADES before) and altered the Master Override in secret. He even says that he would do it all over again. It just seems too unlikely for the override to fail that dramatically. TL;DR Sylens messed with the Master Override.
Seems likely. That would explain his "capture" of Hades at the end. He's clearly smart enough to do it. The question is: Is he wise enough to not open Pandora's box in search of power (in his case, knowledge is power).
When I first saw this video a year or so ago it was really eye-opening and I thought well okay obviously something was so wrong that Hades activated and is trying to do its job but thinking about it now, and maybe this is obvious to others, him doing his job is no longer an option. Eluthia ran out of supplies and food. If he kills everything there won't be a restart. So now we have no choice but to try to stop the end of the world that probably should have ended. But maybe Gaia knew that Apollo was damaged and the carriage facilities were no longer able to raise new humans and knew that giving the reigns over to Hades would truly bring the end of everything and that's why she couldn't let it happen. Idk I just keep thinking about that.
You do have good points, but there are some things that just don't fit well in the context of the story. 1) HADES was to revert the biosphere back to Ground Zero should GAIA admit that her actions were failing to meet her protocols. This was never implemented. GAIA never gave permission for HADES to reset everything as her plan worked. Life was flourishing. Since GAIA, and by extension HADES were successful. The world was able to sustain humans and other wildlife. 2) When GAIA referred to the subordinate functions as escaping, it wasn't that they were trapped, she was the one in charge. She told HEPHAESTUS to make machines to fulfil certain roles, which it would and report the success to GAIA so she could extrapolate and analyze repercussions of those machines. Their escape was GAIA failing at one of her directives. Without those functions, GAIA was basically powerless. 3) HADES was activated by a foreign entity. This was mentioned by GAIA and Sylens. There is explicit details that another party interfered. If I was to fill in the blanks, from the evidence I have seen, Ted screwed people twice over in regards to Project Zero Dawn. Though he was far less involved with the secondary attack, the signal. Ted got his engineers to make a nigh-unhackable AI core to drive his killer robots. This AI would have been aware of the attempts against and calculated that with the shifting of forces in the way it was executed, because it likely hacked communication networks to gain intel, realized that GAIA was going to destroy its control eventually, so started to analyze the Project. It needed a way to convert even one part of this AI collective to it's side, and it chose the most likely target. HADES. This AI didn't require MINERVA or APOLLO or any other, not even HEPHAESTUS. It could create exact copies of its own machines, no new machine designs were required. But, HADES was the weak point. by it's primary function it worked against GAIA in destroying what she created. HADES was the weakpoint, so this AI took some resources, like say a geothermal powerplant built of a dormant volcano, for power requirements. It would use it's most powerful forms of the Faro Robotics designs, the Horus, and calculated attack and hacking strategies. This would take time, almost as much time as MINERVA took to take down the AI driving the Faro Robots. All of this, because of Ted's failure to put in either a killswitch, or a backdoor. The Alpha is Elizabeth, the Omega is Ted. Aloy takes on both of her 'parents'. from Elizabeth she got courage, intelligence and curiosity. From Ted, she got tenacity and an apt for technology. Two complete opposites creating a whole individual who would clean up the intentional mess of Ted, and the destruction of Elizabeth's actions. Remember the last story Elizabeth told GAIA?
A signal of unknown origin.... according to the Vantage Points humanity had already started on space faring technology and that Zenith Company that gave the cloning technology was proposing a Human Colony on Sirius B.... Could the unknown origin be from space???
My theory: Ted Faro digitally copied his consciousness and is HADES Just look at the plot points where HADES speaks. It's like a human, not like an AI.
One point to add is that Hades asks the date when Sylens find him, an AI should be able to know that without asking, so clearly something was wrong with it after the destruction of Gaia. That being said there may be some connection between it not understanding the date and starting up its protocols.
This video needs to be re-visited now that Forbidden West is almost here. Such a great perspective of Hades, because it made me think that the red storm that's looming in the background could mean that either Gaia's sub function that controls terraforming degraded overtime due to the derangement, and not Gaia's failure to guide the sub function as Tate had guessed might happen which then lead to the events of HZD. If the terraforming sub function is degrading, then it could also be the cause of the red disease that killing everything. There's still so many ways this could go but these really got me thinking. And even more hyped for the new game!
Interesting theory, and def one that I wouldn't classify as tin foil. However, my issue with this is that HADES was supposed to make that determination before Phase 1 organism (which were plants and wildlife) were even released. Tate states this in his Hologram that Aloy discovers upon entering the HADES subroutine room. Tate continues stating to imagine it's two hundred years later and the biosphere still isn't right. Storms the size that would have sunk Noah's arc, etc. Does GAIA want to release phase 1 organisms into that. That determination from HADES should have been made before Humans even were ready to be grown and raised by the servitors. Obviously we don't have all the data (such as the state of other Eleuthia facilities), so it's hard to know for sure the state of the rest of the world. The Forbidden West is described as being harsh and dangerous. However, we know there are Banuk lands to the North, Oseram to the Northwest, and Tenakth to the South that are all populated with life and culture. With that in mind, it would seem the terraforming process has been successful over a wide region, not just a small area like Nora land. So I don't know why HADES would suddenly deem the process a failure. Especially when this should have been made BEFORE any of those areas were capable of flourishing.
I think the idea was that HADES, and the other sub-functions weren't quite finished, but that aspect would have probably been the second thing added to HADES, right after being able to pull off the reverse teraforming function.
I just played through the game for the first time less than a month ago. When i played through, i was under the impression that hades took over as designed, but due to the shortened time frame to complete the Alpha project, the program wasnt robust enough to account for gaya fighting back in this way.
Update for any watching this now: The Mysterious Signal was sent from off planet, not BY Hades, who we learn has activated successfully 3 times before the biosphere becomes stable enough to create and release the humans.
The only flaw in this perspective, if I may, is that there was no embryos available to repopulate earth. Eleuthia role was done, resources were depleted in the cradle facilities.Therefore the action from Hades were quite wrong (probably because not yet finished by Travis "thanks" to Faro) if the goal was to bring back mankind on earth at least. The most logical possibilities left IMHO are: Faro intervention somehow (The only Alpha Prime left around) and/or Vast Silver. I think you mentioned it too actually. The second option is the most intriguing because it may also explain the glitch and also quite troubling because it means a quite deep understanding/knowledge of Gaia overall design.
There is. I have spent quite some time simply exploring the edges of the map, and there are things out there that no quest marker will lead you to. Only curiosity.
With the new trailer of Horizon 2 forbidden west, Hades may have seen the emergence of the red plant that kills all living things and want to reboot Gaia Works because of the threat of this plant (sorry bad english)
I'd pegged that outside signal to be Sylens experimenting with things he didn't completely understand. Right until his final scene tosses that out the window. Hade's masters? Part of me thinks It's all Ted's fault - all of it. Elisabet's failure was allowing Ted anywhere near Zero Dawn. He flushed Apolo and murdered all the Alphas because in his Pride he just knew he was right - even though his lack of foresight and disdain for human life was the genesis of the problem. So what if Ted was funding another project, one to take control of the system (and like usual, he screwed that up too). Simple takeaways: Don't let tech run your life. Never let tech replicate itself Anything approaching a Self-Aware AI should be at a minimum in an isolated sandbox - but I'd vote to make it a crime with a penalty of 25 years of continuous torture followed by death for everyone involved. Because - there's no way someone won't screw up and open Pandora's box. I personally don't think "self-aware AI" will ever happen, but that doesn't mean we won't get so close that the near facsimile destroys us anyway.
I’m sure I’m missing something, but this feels like Sylens was the trigger to all of this. His gaining knowledge of the ancient technology (and his clear thirst for expanding on it) was the beginning of the end for mankind. Hades sees that eventually man will go down the same path and destroy the planet again. So Hades initiates it’s usurpation protocol.
When you eluded to the fact that perphaps Gaia didn't get her transforming procedure correct, then a can see your point of view that Hades was just fulfilling it's programming. Nice catch.
If this theory is true, then it is still Ted Faro's fault! Like what you said, Travis Tate could be working to refine the interaction between HADES and GAIA. He probably had 30+ years to work on it to make sure it works properly. But Faro prevented that from happening when he killed all the Alphas; no more room for refinement and for patches that can be added if the Alpha's discover better solutions over time as they lived their lives in GAIA Prime (assuming that's where they will live rather than Elysium).
That’s a good take. I always thought hades was operating as designed but was triggered due to some sort of glitch or malfunction. I don’t think the hades protocol was designed to activate at all after the humans were released from the cradles. The thing is though, Orion was taken offline. The humans were released prematurely. The rest of the phase 1 organisms were likely released on schedule, so all was going well at that point, or hades would have triggered long before. I think the hades protocol was triggered in response to the humans growing in population too fast for Hephaestus to keep up with, so it started over-producing machines and creating the weaponry to deal with humans taking over before the planet was ready, Thus creating the situation which led to hades activating. The humans were let out before Gaia was ready. The biosphere still needed work. So now the biosphere is unstable. Aloy is the anomaly hades couldn’t account for. So now, in part 2, we’ll see the consequences of all of this. I think aloy will have to reactivate some major component of Zero Dawn to save the earth. Perhaps reset a weather control system or something. Then also deal with the remnants of hades. We shall see I guess. I love your lore breakdowns. This game has some of the deepest lore I have ever seen in a game. It’s just so good! Thank you.
My idea was (keep in mind, I've not played the second game yet, downloading it now) that elysium sent the signal, they don't know Apollo was purged, so when they looked down on earth they maybe saw savages that would not be kind to them, then they sent the signal to Hades
This was such an interesting perspective - one other thing I've been thinking of lately as I've been watching and rewatching your videos; was the idea that what if Elisabet was wrong? What if there was some other solution? It seemed that she only took one day to analyse the situation and come up with a solution. But what if she was wrong, or forced the solution onto Faro as a means of eradicating the world and all the people on it? What if instead of her being the savior, she was actually the villain, and Ted Faro was just a fool along with everyone else? Just a thought, I mean maybe I'm reaching, but it seems to me that her solution was extremely drastic and rushed after only a single day of examining the information that they had been given. Just a thought, maybe you could do a video on this...? I'd be interested in hearing your perspective.
That would be an amazing plot twist, made me think, why would they invest so much in the lore and made Elisabet such Mary Sue, one hell of a bland character ? Maybe she got upset when faro started to do military stuff instead of helping the environment, maybe she thought that a world reset would've fixed things. There's a lot of potential to be explored, i really hope the developers storytelling skills got better in this new game
@@xisPense Don't get me wrong, I think the storytelling was amazing in HZD, but when it comes to Elisabet there are some things that just don't make sense, or is she really just a Mary Sure? I'd like to think not and imagine that she made a mistake on her calculations on the glitch and the Faro Plague, that there might have been another solution. I think one way to explore more of this, is if they explain what the glitch and the unknown transmissions are and if they came from Vast Silver and show Aloy figuring it out over the course of the game, and then she realises her hero - Elisabet - might have been wrong, not that it would change anything except perhaps making Elisabet a more grey character, like Sylens. He was really interesting in HZD.
@@theGemini_Music i highly doubt they will make Elisabet make a mistake, the game portray most woman as strong and independent and most man as fools. And I really don't think they will change that... Now about the storytelling, even though you got a lot of raw stuff, the fundamentals, the world building stuff, the robots, and yet you've got no character development, the only interesting character in the game is Sylens (alive), everyone else are just hollow, just plainly mediocre, you've got a lot of quests, but most of them are go fetch something something. I don't know, for me it feels like there is no connection between the side quests, collectibles and main story, like they have something in common but they are not about the same thing, it's not like learn one to complement the other, it feels disconnected
@@xisPense I know what you mean, they probably won't have Elisabet have made any mistakes. The combat was really enjoyable and I found the way that you learn about the history and what happened to the world and how the narrative unfolds really interesting. For example how they had it seem like Zero Dawn was this super weapon program, and that seemed pretty lame to me at first, but then you come to realise that it was part of this massive cover-up and all that. As you discover what Zero Dawn really was, along with Aloy; I found that figuring out what happened and the mystery of it all, that to me was the greatest journey of the game. That and fighting giant robot dinosaurs. That was great. Hopefully they can improve on some of the character development aspects in the sequel and explore more of Sylens type characters, have Aloy find out that there is something else going on with Elisabet, like her having this twist of her not being 'all good' or that she was hiding some of the truth. Because now we know what happened, so hopefully they find a way to delve deeper into the world and make it keep it interesting. My copy is already pre-ordered, so I'm curious and excited to re-enter the world of Horizon.
@@theGemini_Music the combat is fun for awhile, after some time it becomes really boring, pretty much examine enemy, exploit weaknesses. I explored and gathered so much that i was lvl 40 doing lvl 17 main mission, so I was already tired when I one shot the whole main quest. I felt kinda betrayed, the game having so much potential and you only knowing the history by the main quest. The only thing that kinda incentivates you to do the main quest is the ancient armor, aside from that i had everything, every purple bow and armor, every cauldron, etc. So I didn't have that much fun afterwards, but it's fine I really hope they matured and made a better game. I wish I could play the new game, but 300 bucks for a game ? lul, I'll probably just watch some gameplay and wait until it's on sale. I just don't know why they didn't make books about it
I'm looking forward to finding out how HEKARRO fits into this. It could be the master process that HADES was responding to, although I am just speculating.
I think it's possible Hades activated at least once before. It wasn't supposed to need to take over if Terraforming had proceeded successfully to the point of releasing humans though. I think the issue is that there were only enough frozen embryos for Eulethia to work once.
The secret is in the idea of taking the driver seat. Hades would merely reverse the terraforming process using the other AI programs which Gaia normally controlled. Something caused Hades to wake up and the truth is we dont know what caused it. Gaia loses it and destroys the Gaia prime facility to prevent Hades from killing everything. The other AI becomes sintent and disconnects from Gaia to live on. The game clearly states that the subordinates were never real AI as in they never possessed sentience. So the signal is the crux of this whole thing. It gave them self awareness. The mark of life is its willingness to survive. Gaia is the most interesting of all because she is able to create Alloy as an insurance policy. Her intentions is to have the facility repaired so she can come back online but how does she plan on recapturing the other AIs. The key takeaway is that Hades and the others didn't become AI until they recieved the signal. I think the going theory is that it could have come from the Odyssey. Also Sylens tells us at the very end that Hades was woken up by someone else.
So how was Hades originally supposed to reset the biosphere? I'm sure that using Faro robots wasn't the original plan right? Travis said "reverse terraforming functions and suffocate it" but what does that mean? Why didn't Gaia design a robot that went around chopping Faro robots in half so they couldn't be re-awoken?
You make a fantastic point, but there is one problem with your line of thought. HADES was supposed to cede control back to GAIA Prime, once it had finished reverse-terraforming the world to a day-zero state. And you talked at great length, as to how HADES adapted and modified his orders, to salvage what he could. Once GAIA rigged her reactors to blow, HADES made no attempt to save the core programming function: GAIA herself. Now, it's very probable that the two AI weren't on speaking terms after each did their thing. But, that contradicts what Tate said HADES was programmed to do. Without GAIA, his logic routines run into a flat fault block: "I cannot give control back to GAIA, if GAIA ceases to exist." Had HADES entered into some kind of holding measure, or attempted to wrest control of GAIA Prime's location first, that might have made some sense: in that, he'd have at least tried to carry out his orders. But he skips from trying to free himself, to freeing the subordinate, lesser functions of GAIA, that all DEPEND on GAIA to coordinate their efforts. Instead of handing control back to GAIA after his reset, he'd be handing it to eight AI routines who each think their domain is the ONLY domain(Look at what HEPHAESTUS did in TFW)
The Trailer For Horizon Forbidden West Is Out. There's a new "corruption" which changes the plants and kills animals. Could that be what HADES Deemed as catastrophic?
Interesting, however once humans were re-introduced, Gaia's work was done. Therefore there would have been no need for Hades to intervene. What struck me was Ted's conversation to have Hades implemented in the first place under the guise 'have we learned nothing'. The man that made the chariot line ending life on earth sought to have Hades installed in to the Gaia programme to end all life on earth and look what happened. Then the same man destroyed Apollo. Seems to me he is the only one who didn't learn anything
Having recently completed the game and now finding this jewel of a playlist I have an issue with this theory. By the time HADES decides to take over, even if this was in the inteded form, GAIA had already gestated all her plant and human embryos. The recreation of the biosphere was by and large complete. It is way too late in the process for HADES to activate, for he is a fail-safe if the process is going wrong in the in-between (pre-release of phase 1 organisms) which by now that window is long gone.
Yeah but in this scenario, Hephestus would also get pissed as his machines use biofuel and another number of other functions would be inoperable to work against Hades to maintain their own systems
The Tallneck log in Ban-Ur shows GAIA directing it toward a supercell, where it then gets temporarily fried. GAIA leaves it offline for centuries, even though it only requires a reboot. I've a theory that Tallnecks transmit to HADES as well as GAIA, and she purposefully killed this one when Wyoming was becoming tundra to avoid activation. She could have done this to countless others as well to hide her mistakes. Sylens could have easily rebooted another 'dead' Tallneck, perhaps in the Malmstrom, and triggered HADES. It wasn't meant to be triggered this late, but it was built with the understanding that humans would be helping the process, not harvesting it.
This was actually my first understanding from my first playthrough until the final post-credit scene introduced a possible doubt and I started digging into possible external sources for the signal. I realized that something must have kicked off Hades, but it was already too late and the destruction would have been cataclysmic for life. Too much had been reintroduced, the cradles were empty. If Hades succeeded, there may have been a few plant species left to reintroduce, but no humans. The AI Gaia couldn't let Hades loose under any circumstances, so Gaia sacrificed herself. That may have been something Tate never had time to finish, a subscript that told Hades when far enough along in the biosphere regeneration process was too late. That if it activated, there wouldn't be another shot once it was done
Or maybe the alphas wouldn't eventually come up with a backup plan and collect new food and new zygotes from current humans before resetting. Of course hades wouldn't do this but the human creation AI would
this theory intrigued me it brings new story elements to the game. but i am in the view that Hades has been corrupted in some sense either due to Travis no fully finishing Hades , some how being finished got corrupted over time or that there was an outside force. i mean if you think about about sylens he manged to figure out hot to use the tech so maybe others figured it out as well.
SPOILER ALERT And i discovered that there is two Hades..one real and one not so Hades..that's the one which Sylens discovered and repaired..that's not Hades it's a FAS-BOR Horus quantum processing module..
I think the pharo plague glitch ended up in the gaia program. The fact that all sub functions were affected, not just hades, leads me to believe a pharo plague in the system to where all the sub functions became self aware. Hades didn't try to eradicate everything as was its programming. It attempted to try and manipulate the people and seize power but was stopped by aloy. I believe sylens is the real antagonist. He takes hades in the end and always talks about wanting knowledge. Hades uses sylens by giving him knowledge and having him manipulate tribes for its bidding. Hades, being a highly intelligent being, underestimates aloy and the schemes of sylens, is defeated by aloy but releases itself and is captured by sylens. I believe sylens will use hades knowledge to transcend himself and become the true antagonist. I didn't play the expansion but that is what I got from the story.
not too much is added as far as the main story line, just some tidbits about Sylens. He claimed to be a shaman and had unparalleled knowledge and thirst for more. But that's all I'll say, don't want to spoil it for you.
The problem is that if Gaia allowed Hades to take control, how could life grow back? All the human embryos were already used and probably the other animals' too, so Earth would just be full of plants, assuming there were still seeds to use.
I think part of it might be true, except for the initial signal. Hades couldn't start the reverse terraforming protocol once the first human were released, since they onlu had one shot at this, eleuthia not having enough zigots to produce another wave of ambrios. So my guess would be that "Hades masters" Sylens talked about would be vast silver who manage to survive all this time like CIAN. He could've hacked Hades and forced him to start his work despite human being released. That or the odessey mission didn't failed and it's them trying to purge the primitive human living on earth so they can come back
It's likely an outside signal imo because hades was meant to reset the biosphere if it was in chaos and unable to support life. Life could survive and people had lived for many generations, so i would say hades had no need to start his job because the biosphere is not bad
Watching this after see the trailer for horizon forbidden west you might be onto something here. Perhaps Hades detected the red sicken that is taken over the west so to reverse it he activated his protocol and Gaia was not having it so she destroyed the Prime facility. Looking forward to see how the story unfolds
I just think it's funny that Tate gave Hades such a menacing and evil sounding 'voice' and cadence.. like really dude, come on, that thing is terrifying hahaha DEFINE CARJA.. lmao
Most likely because only Aloy's genetic makeup could restore the Elisabets Alpha Prime clearance, and in so, the override that could purge HADES from MINERVA.
Even if Hades was acting as it was intended to, and GAIA subsequently “over corrected”, the HZD world we know would have ended, and taken another thousand years to reflourish, assuming all sub functions maintained themselves for as long as they already had.
Interesting theory, to be sure. I do have one unrelated question though - what out fit is that that Aloy is wearing in this vid? I have not come across it yet, and it looks pretty damn cool. :D
Did the swarm (rampant A.I.) tamper with Hades? If so would hades be the swarm? Then again the swarm existed before hades. Now next question. Why would hades target alloy? Is it because he knows she can overcome him
not that i know coding or anything like it, but wouldn't one of the core routines in hades be that at the sign of life he was to cease functions?, also idk if this was possible but couldn't sobeck had told gaia that it is paramount to let hades have control (without saying why) when it requested it?, so as gaia would know it had to happen, but wouldn't know why (granted after the first time she would know)
Just watched this video again after the latest trailer for Forbidden West, and omg… what if Hades was right. What if that red blight we see in the trailers is what he foresaw, and could possibly end human life? What if Aloy and Hades team up in Forbidden West?? So many what ifs! Please, I hope you see this comment, would love to hear an updated version of this video after what we know from the new game coming out now
Your theory is proved true in Horizon Forbidden West. In it the world is plagued by super storms, unrealistic weather and a type of plant that's killing wildlife so, Hades was just trying to fix the world even before Gaia noticed anything
Even if this theory is right, HADES wasn't suposed to activate, since this is the final version of ZD. If HADES activated, it would destroy the project once and for all, since there would be no more humans and, perhaps, not enough seeds to even rebuild Earth's biosphere after the reset
If Gaea failed in her first attempt after all, then why did she allow introduction of human life along with other animals? I thought protocols would prohibit that.
I’ve got a feeling that hades may have corrupted the Demeter sub-function in horizon forbidden west since it revolves around a viral outbreak of some kind all stemming from a red vine like growth, I’m most likely wrong but I am just speculating.
It is an interesting idea. The problem, as I see it, is that while GAIA does not know about the HADES protocol, the protocol itself cannot come from HADES, which is a subordinate of GAIA. In other words, if HADES knew about it, GAIA knew about it. This is why the protocol has to come from a third party, independent of HADES itself, which means that there is a third, as of yet unknown, entity (AI or otherwise) that is set up to independently monitor the system. HADES couldn’t hide it. And Tate, while not having his lifetime to perfect the system, made it functional in what time he did have; the lack of time, and therefore complexity, reinforces the idea that he had to hide the HADES protocol elsewhere instead of build in an Easter Egg inside of HADES itself. And, it is likely that HADES acted as it was supposed to, as you say, once activated-at first. But that HADES started to malfunction quickly and in ways that do not make sense. For instance, raising FARO robots via MINERAVA is likely not how it was originally programmed-to be most effective, would it not awaken HORUS Robots right away? They are the lynch pin in the devastating FARO plague. It can’t awaken HORUS robots because of MINERVA. If the FARO robots are the way HADES wipes out GAIA’s mistakes, MINERAVA should not be resisting the use of the tower for this purpose. HADES should have no trouble at all once activated (for instance, even though the subfunctions are no longer attached to GAIA, HADES should have complete knowledge of MINERAVA and it’s capabilities). It, for some reason, has problems. It is likely that these problems exist due to its having been altered in some way, as FARO robots were the problem, not a part of the solution. This negative change (and the way the other subfunctions changed) was started through that unknown source. Therefore, it is highly unlikely that this third party gave a genuine HADES protocol transmission and that HADES is doing what it is supposed to be doing; it is insdtead finding any way at all to destroy life. It should be easy to destroy life with GAIA gone. Someone or something messed with this third party system or AI or something, sent the protocol with a nasty change, and here we are. HADES is busted, not incomplete. It is suspect, too, that a similar event seemed to have occurred to set the FARO robots rogue in the first place. The reason behind the “glitch” was not revealed. There is also the strange satellite above the Banuk camp that tamed the machines (maybe MINERAVA’s place of escape? The math of the satellite, the derangement, the signal, and Aloy’s birth align). It started sending out a signal “20 years ago”-this is, again, a strange thing to do if HADES is acting normally-or even if it’s not. Why a satellite that resists derangement and could, one assumes, tame FARO robots? There are too many variables to say that HADES is acting normally and that Tate didn’t have enough of his work complete to account for any chaotic functions. It’s a thought provoking idea though.
But what made hades functions to kick in? The Terraforming was working and nothing seemed to be out of order except for apollo's absence which didn't affect the quality of environment or the population directly...so why was Hades suddenly allowed to start extermination?
That's my thought exactly, the signal that turned Hadies on was the one that corrupted the Faro robots in the first place. Question is where is this signal coming from, who/ what controls it and why.
Wow. This video really makes you think about who the real bad guy of the game is. Has anyone else seen the new trailer for"Horizon II: Forbidden West? Those weird red plants looked like they were draining the life out of everything around them, similar to the corruption in the last game. Oh man, I'm connecting dots and I don't like the shape they're making. What if Gaia accidentally created those plants and they're going to destroy all life on Earth all over again. That would mean that Hades was just doing his job and Gaia overreacted in the worst way possible. ruclips.net/video/thgb_ZGrM9Q/видео.html
After finished the game, I think Hades can also act like Apollo in a passive way, Sylens said that he learnt calculus, physics, chemistry and a lot of old world knowledge from Hades that means Hades function is not only undo Gaia's work. Hades can teach too, if you know how to ask him or force him to answer.
Well there's bound to be minimum knowledge in those fields for Hades to actually know what he is doing when he activates. And (reverse) terraforming is quite some complicated stuff. Now that it is self aware and can talk to people, being able to exchange knowledge as a bargaining chip or conversation tool is a natural consequence, but I doubt Hades was ever intentionally designed to do so, and his knowledge on subjects not involved in his primary functions are probably lacking; culture and arts, for example.
Also Apollo contained all human history and culture, something Hades is completely ignorant about.
Yeah all of the AIs are completely sentient and capable of making massively complex calculations related to the physical world. It makes sense that if pressed it could teach someone such concepts.
But, would you want it? Imagine if you were in this world after the events of the first game. If you found out knowledge came from the single most evil entity that you know of wouldn't you be a little worried about the side effects of taking the devil as your teacher? When GAIA comes around that knowledge will slowly circulate and they will probably treat her like a god for it until they learn enough to understand what she is. If all that information was unceremoniously dropped at the feet of all humans with "zero fail-safes" as the fictional Dr. Soebek(or however her name is spelled) says, It probably wouldn't work out well. Like, a handful of people learning all this information then hiding from the world and creating a secret civilization to conquer the world bad.
Gaia and the other AIs certainly know a lot about science and math, but that's about it. Apollo was not only a huge database, but should also teach the people. Sylens consults Hades because he is obsessed with knowledge, but Hades would not be able to train anyone.
The only logic gap here would be that certain subroutines would have to be there through Eleuthia. The infants were trained pedagogically. Gaia should be intelligent enough to also create or expand own AIs and could have at least taught the natural sciences to the humans, even if she lacks the history and culture. The reasons for Zero Dawn should also be known to her, they could have told the people.
Watching this video after the Horizon: The Forbidden West trailer has dropped, I can't help but wounder if this theory is in some part correct. In the trailer it appears that some type of blight is taking over the land, infecting the animals and killing the plant life. What if this blight is something that Hades was trying to prevent or delay? What if he saw the start of it and predicted what it would do? That it would become a much bigger problem later on?
EXACTLY WHAT I THOUGHT AFTER THE VIDEO!
I'm positive that what the video says is the truth, but it's not subtle or implied, but clear and openly true, known factually. But not that the transmission to Gaia came from Hades.
Dude,remember all the embryos are dead now in HZD timeline. So, even if Hades restarts, humanity will be dead.
The problem with that theory, is that we know the Hephaestus program has also gone rogue, creating the more dangerous, combat focused machines. It's possible that the blight and weather anomalies seen in the trailer are the result of the other malfunctioning AIs.
I think it‘s interesting that we saw big Storms and a dangerous unknown new plant that seems to attack the flora and fauna in the Forbidden West Trailer. Since we know that the subordinate functions of Gaia escaped, my first thought was that maybe Aether and Demeter started getting out of hand destroying the atmosphere as well as creating new plants. I mean, we saw what Hades and Hephaestus could do.
Maybe since APOLLO was purged and the humans were released anyway HADES saw the actions of the humans ( if we assume the tribal inhabitants were similar to ice age us) causing multiple mass extinctions and hunting of terraforming machines (As CYAN hypothesised) , if this was veiwed by HADES as 'not going to plan ' then he would act as he was meant to , as did GAIA . so in conclusion non of them did anything wrong the source of the misunderstanding between the two intelligent functions was the absence of APOLLO in the equation which was not accounted for originally. So all in all looks like Ted Faro caused the end of the world twice ....
P.s Ted also killed HADES's Alpha before he had completely added the final touches to HADES possibly adding the issue .
P.s.s Its relatively possible to bring back APOLLO , as with the purged data in Ted's office its possible to bring back the data if you have the clearance , the only problem with this is that Ted pudged it , so you'd needed someone with Omega level clearance to restore the data and the location of the original purged data . That leaves a few questions can once GAIA is reconstructed create another Ted so when he grows up He'd have that clearance level , like Aloy and Elisabet , and wheres the purged data ? Maybe where ever the original Ted was ?
P.s.s.s After thinking about it a bit more if that new Ted and his journey to restore the Lost Archive of Human Knowledge ,it would be kinda poetic , he would be the one to make amends for the mistakes of his father in a way .. I personally would love to see that in a future game :'3
Good old Ted, just can't stop making the world a worse place lol. Interesting thought about APOLLO with what we now know about CYAN.
I hope your right about bringing APOLLO back, if corrupted data can be restored, maybe purged can too!
Speaking of Ted, if I might recommend another video. I'd check out the Lightkeeper vid I think you'd find it very interesting :)
Random Side Quest waaayy ahead of ya :'P currently binge watching most of them.
Glad to hear it NoodleCat! Lol
@@DHSNAKE inb4 someone
Says Omega was a lower level of clearance that already existed despite the Alpha members showing shock and Omega clearance being able to override the Alphas attempts to access the system. As much as Ted fucked up I doubt that his cloned counterpart would make the exact same mistake. And besides, it seems like a good potential continuation of the story, after the second battle with Hades and Sylens of course
NoodleCat not only that but he could possibly be a love interest to Aloy. Just think, they hated each other in their past lives. They had different views. I mean Ted wasn’t really a bad guy... he was just dumb and made poor decisions in favor of keeping power.. Elisabet dislikes that. But in this new world, clone Ted can fix the wrong his predecessor did and make amends with Aloy, and possibly be a love interest hehe 😝
Interesting theory, this would make a good plot twist in the sequel!
Looks promising
Especially after the reveal!
Exactly what I'm thinking!!
This is one of my many theories - most are more convoluted, but this one could work. I honestly don't think this one is it, but I wouldn't mind if it was!
If it is, I believe it would be something stemming from the destruction of Apollo - Humanity was intended to take control during the very first generation - of the Terraforming Systems, releasing later stage life forms, rebuilding cities, they were intended to have a role in completing terraforming procedures that they were not permitted to take on due to the lack of proper guidance from Apollo. There could very well be consequences of that taking hold at 1000+ years after initial stages of Terraforming were completed.
Question - Why HADES wanted to kill Aloy i.e. one of the Alphas? that was not one of the function.
Interesting theory, but I don't think that it's plausible Hades could have been doing his natural reset protocol. Once the humans in the Eleuthia cradles start gestation, Hades is obsolete. They can't propogate life in the cradles for more than a generation and they can't start over. Everything outside needs to be set to go before Eleuthia begins working.
I'm no expert on AI, but the primitive AI we have now essentially work by maximizing certain functions. It seems to me that each subordinate function was only geared to maximize some performance of success, while Gaia was needed to regularize them and weigh them against each other.
Example: Haephestus is supposed to design and build robots that survive to do their job. When regulated by Gaia, robots killed by humans are successful enough, because endangering human life would weigh against Gaia's other functions. Without Gaia to regularize, the natural step to improving the robots is to arm them with weapons and create protectors for them.
Hades I think would work the same way. He's just maximizing a function. But because his goals conflict so much with the other goals, the value of his function is weighted extremely low. Once he's unconnected to the other programs, there's suddenly a huge need to begin killing everything.
Exactly. He was supposed to make the determination before Phase 1 organism were released.
I actually spoke about this at a panel recently, since it's a valid point. One thing that is often overlooked is that ZD was only "functionally complete" circa Zero Day, but there were still much to be ironed out. That's the predominate reason the Alphas had to remain in GAIA prime. They presumed they had the rest of their natural lives to compete this work, time that they obviously wouldn't have. This means there's no real way to determine what Tate actually completed during the remainder of his life. He wasn't even entirely sure the Protocol would be successful at the time of his journal. If he was still refining that process, everything else would have come second. Long story short, HADES may have been meant to only be operational pre phase one organisms, but there's no way of knowing that that process was completed during Tates lifetime.
Right. For all we know, the function was designed to run before Phase 1 organism, and it was never turned off. I'm not dismissing it, which is why in my post I said I don't see this as a tinfoil theory. I think it has substance. But based on what we do know as of the game, the intent was that it would run before Phase 1.
Personally, I hope that this isn't the case. While I like that kind of dark/grey, bleak twist, I feel in this case it would be anti-climatic if this was HADES design working, and GAIA overreacted. I definitely can see her misreading being put into a code shell as being cut off from her subordinate functions, but I just hope there's a more fleshed out method for the awakening of the subroutines.
I really hope it has something to do with Far Zenith, Vast Silver, or something else. I mean again, we don't know the states of the other Eleuthia facilities. For all we know, another cradle site's people developed further, or weren't as afraid to explore the ruins of the Old Ones, and have a better sense of technology. They might have tampered with something they didn't know, and its result sent a signal to GAIA and thus began the chain of events we saw.
It's why I'm obsessed with this game, and continue to play over and over, reading and re reading every piece of data, because they put SO MUCH into the game that left so many ways to hypothesize so much that could have happened, is happening, and might happen.
Two parts of the said-'virus': The advanced Odyssey-born Humans. (Human-Vektan-like advanced Human crossover everyone?).
Or...
*Horizon Zero Dawn's own working Faro-skynet Rampant A.I.*
Finished HZD earlier today and its made me hungry to dig deeper into the lore and I somehow stumbled upon your videos. I've only watched about five of them so far but they're very fun! I enjoy the theories you interject along with the canonical information quite a bit.
However, I do want to say I think this one has a flaw -- HADES was designed to work before GAIA started introducing people back to the planet since there is only a limited number of zygotes and resources for it to work with, so a system had to be in place to assure the environment would be just right. Tate basically says this when describing HADES -- you don't want to put people there and hope they fix the problem and then not be able to; that'd ruin all their plans and work. And at this point in the story, humans have been reintroduced to earth for generations now, yet whatever activated HADES was only about 20 years ago from HZD's present. Based on this, it feels unlikely that HADES would be designed to perceive humans as a threat to mission success (like from them hunting the terraforming machines or showing excessive violence, etc), since this is clearly a one-shot kind of deal - without more zygotes and facility resources GAIA wouldn't be able to bring them about again. I suspect HADES was only designed to play a part up until humans were introduced, then it would be deactivated and basically put on the shelf.
Therefore, I think it couldn't be HADES acting as designed by activating when it did and the signal GAIA detected must have been from an outside source.
Hey Jotakori, that's very perceptive, and your correct. I realised that fact after the vid was published early on. GAIA did what she had to do to protect life. However, the important thing to remember is that Zero Dawn was "functionally complete". Meaning it could get the job done, but there's no way of knowing what still needed to be done. That's why the alpha personnel remained, but obviously never got a chance to finish they're work. Tate was just beginning to refine the protocol, but may have never completed every safeguard. Tasks that he thought he would have the rest of his natural life to complete. So even though HADES may have never been intended to take control post humans, that may have not been a Tate had been able to finish before his death.
@@RandomSideQuest I still would think that acting before Phase I organisms were introduced would be a priority to be launched before Zero Day, the other aspects of making sure GAIA would still be able to take control would have fallen second to that. Make sure primary functions are good before adding more.
@@RandomSideQuest I just played through HZD for the first time on PC. Late to the party, I know. Regardless, I think you forgot the fact that after zero day, Faro kept a very close watch on the Alphas. They talked about how he pestered them for status updates and for information on their tasks. Knowing that Faro's plan was to kill them all and eliminate Apollo so that the future humans would be free from tech, he absolutely didn't mean to harm the integrity of the system and its operations in any way. I'm pretty sure we aren't given a clear timeline on how long it took before Faro killed them, but I would assume that the reason why he was so antsy and wanted every piece of information they could provide was because he wasn't going to kill them until ZD was complete.
This is an impressive theory, but Sylens did say at the end of the game that HADES's "masters" sent the signal that awoke him. So it seems unlikely that HADES was the one who sent the signal.
Unless the "Masters" were the ALPHA team
Yes, what ur saying is defintally valid, but on the other hand, Sylens only knows what Hades taught him and what Aloy knows. My point being he may not fully understand the reason Hades did what he did. Although that's all speculation, and if the devs put in a line about masters I'm sure they meant something by it.
HADES is an AI with one sole objective. It has demonstrated in more ways that one, it's ability to be lie in order to obtain it's goal. Sylens would only have knowledge of the signal based purely on what HADES choose to give him initially. It's very likely that HADES would lie about the signal, knowing that its purpose is "unknown" for a reason. Whatever HADES was given to usurp GAIA was designed to be intentionally discrete to the point of GAIA not being able to recognize that it's him taking control. If it wasn't, HADES likely knows it will be unable to execute it's function.
But say if there was outside control of HADES
Wouldn't that mean someone who knows alot of Project Zero Dawn or is there another Corrupted AI whose more advanced?
@@GluttonousLmg my guess would be vast silver
After seeing the trailer for “Forbidden West”, this feels prophetic. I just purchased this game on “Black Friday” and finally got around to playing it. I just completed the main story a few nights ago and am about to begin the dlc. I can’t believe what I had been missing. One of the best games I’ve ever played. I found your channel and it is great as well. Keep it up.
I love this perspective. It shines a whole new light on the story and what could happen in Forbidden West.
Genuinely very engaging and well put together. Keep it up champ
It's so interesting rewatching this series now. Seeing what things you had right, were close on, and were completely wrong about. The lore in this game never ceases to amaze me. Cannot wait for Remastered.
Another theory is regarding the relocation spaceship program that was mentioned. In the story the communication was lost with the spaceship as it speculated to have been destroyed when exiting the solar system. But what if it actually succeeded, and the signal came from the new unknown planet, or aboard the spaceship? Perhaps the survivors reactivated Hades with ill-intent, or they wanted to repossess Earth without having to deal with its new inhabitants.
This would also fall into line with the mention of Hades' master that Sylens mentions at the very end rather than awakening on its own
Forbidden West possible spoilers follow -
I think you called it haha,
look at you being right
Holy shit you literally described what happened in the sequel.
Spot on
Here a viewer from spain, i've just discovered your channel. I want to congratulate you for the effort you must have to put in this channel. Your work is awesome, you've made me think a lot with this hades theory, i would have never thought of it if it wasn't for you, so thank you! I can't wait to watch more of your videos. Congrats again!
Well gaia still saved the world, because if hades would have gone trough with the resetting of the world, then there would not be any humans anymore.
When visiting aloys birthplace, the ai specificly said it had to let the humands out because there was no more food so there would never be anymore humans because they could not feed the new infants.
Fair point there Bath, I think that's one of the failsafes that Tate probably would have got around to refining if, well... ya know.
Gaia saved THAT world and put in danger everything else.... If she didnt destroy herself hades would have wiped the world to a blank slate and after that Gaia could restart all over again.
To me Gaia's decision was really emotion driven rather than a logical one
@@edoardofedrighi2102 So, saved humans, you meant to say
@@edoardofedrighi2102 this wouldn't hold true though, because phase 1 was already deemed completed and the cradles were expended, there would be no way to reset life again without the genetic material which was used. If Hades reset the planet again, Gaia would have no way to create humanity, and likely any animal life again.
@@sethturnbull554 true there were no zygotes left in the cradle facilities
I guess you can’t get them all right but still you were right there. Knew it all from the beginning. Love this channel and can’t wait for more
This idea needs to be explored again in light of the trailer for Forbidden West!! In the trailer there is some strange plague killing plants... could this be an issue that hades was worried about and decided that Gaia’s work needed to be reversed?
Only thing I don't agree with is "the sub-functions would temporarily have to be made self aware to stop the terraforming system from failing while HADES reset the biosphere"
That makes absolutely no sense. The sub-functions could easily just be put into a "standby mode" while HADES reset the biosphere. If they continued to fulfill their functions then that would interfere with resetting the biosphere. Not to mention that there's no "temporarily" making a program self aware, the only way to reverse something like that is to eliminate the sub-function and replace it with an original version (this even happens in the sequel, because *THAT'S* how obvious it is that you can't simply make a program "forget" that it was once sentient and self-aware).
So in short: no, it was NEVER part of the Zero Dawn Protocol for any of the sub-functions to become self-aware. That would be excessively risky and frankly pretty stupid.
I wonder if Ted Faro’s destruction of Apollo indirectly caused Hades to be activated; humans were meant to take over the second stage of fauna proliferation as well as supervision of the entire system itself. Since humans were not stewarding this process, but were instead destroying the terraforming machines, the extinction protocol was activated, as intended
Thats a good one...
Wow. What could being going wrong in Gaia's creation that makes Hades the "good guy"? Never imagined that one..
however, now that you bring it up, could Ted Faros disruption of the Apollo program play into it? Such a minor thing but then again, Ted has a way of screwing things up... Thanks for keeping us thinking...this game's lore is immense.
Oh nice Travis imitation btw... Perfect
Lol thank you very much Suundra, had to channel my inner Travis haha. Thats an interesting point, the wipe of Apollo fundamentally hindered Artemis and Eleuthia, maybe HADES as well. Appreciate your support!
If Apollo had still been around, it would have taught humans about the history of the world, and about the terraforming system. No doubt it was intended that, at some point, Apollo-taught humans would have taken over control of the terraforming system, or been integrated into helping the process along. This did not happen.
Instead, humans have been raised in ignorance of the world and the machines around them that sustain their existence. We know that even before the derangement, the primitive humans hunted machines for parts and to salvage metals for tools. Presumably Gaia just gritted her teeth at this circumstance and tried to bear it, but think about how many machines must've been destroyed over the centuries, how many resources were wasted, how many fundamental processes were interrupted by ignorant humans. Enough to throw Gaias carefully laid plans off-track? It's been around 700 years since the first humans were created in the cradle facilities. 700 years into the terraforming process that should have had educated humans helping the process along. Instead we have 700 years of humans unintentionally damaging the very thing that keeps them alive. Assuming that certain process were supposed to be kept to some sort of schedule, it's fair to say that that schedule is now well and truly off kilter. Hades probably saw this, probably saw that the process is breaking down, slowly, over time and is seeking to end it quickly and restart, before too much more time is wasted and resources squandered.
Unfortunately, without a viable Apollo program to teach humans, their part in the system can never be achieved. Even if Hades does his thing and Gaia were to start over, the process would just repeat.
Of course, the other problem now, is that according to the holo-logs in All Mother Mountain, the caretaker bots of the humans only released them because they quite literally ran out of food to sustain them, which makes it seem like the creation of that first batch of humans was a 1 time thing, unless Gaia can build machines to restock the food supplies for another try. Maybe the extinction protocol was only supposed to kick in pre-Eluthia, ensuring that the biosphere was livable for humans before creating them, educating them, and then handing control back to them. Of course, nobody saw the possibility that once humans existed again, that Apollo would be gone and thus the system would break down.
So yeah, Ted Faro really DID fuck the world twice over.
Hades isn't a true AI right, so it can only follow set protocols. But can things be suitable enough to convince Hades to not reset the world without other sub routines working as intended?
And what are the factors necessary to have caused him to decide a reset is necessary?
Excellent video. I finished the game recently and actually started to think about HADES and how it's not exactly a villain, but it was doing what it was programmed to do. You shone a light on my thoughts and put it in words that which I hadn't been able to find.
I will say that this is quite an interesting theory but also has a major issue with the running plot line in the game itself.
The premise that HADES felt the need to rest the biosphere which birthed Aloy into existence, is unfounded in the current information available to us in the world at present. The biosphere was functional and operating correctly considering that life has completely returned to the earth but in a more tribal way than actually envisioned by Elisabet Sorbeck when programming GAIA.
My personal theory is that the virus is an actual virus created by Todd Faro while at his bunker known as Thebes (have a few theory’s on that but need to finish up some things before posting it to RUclips) and was setup to be executed when Minerva completed the Master Override.
I believe that Todd Faro never wanted life to continue but was more interested in creating a world where humans left the planet and his Faro Plague devoured Earth. That’s just me considering that it is documented in game that he wanted the Faro Robots built without a back door protocol in the coding.
It also wouldn’t surprise me if Todd setup a fail safe for himself to have an heir show up like Aloy. Plenty of birthing pods still left to work based on what we saw. Would be cool to have her team up with the heir of Todd Faro and they tag team the return of the full GAIA system and put Slyens in his place...but we will see.
I also believe that that Elisabet has actually gotten the last laugh on Todd though. The complete lack of trust she has for him in the storyline is obvious. Someone in her position would have made sure that the entire GAIA system and all subordinate functions were backed up somewhere. I also think the key to finding them is the globe Aloy found with her body at the end of the storyline. Best guess it has a blood null codes lock that only Aloy would be able to open. Considering Cyan’s personality in the Frozen Wilds I am thinking that bringing them together is the key to showing Aloy the way forward, but that is for another time.
Holy Bus, never thought of that. The globe thing. Maybe, since we didn't see too much detail of the globe, just enough that we would know what it was, but not much more. Maybe some places have an indicator which has back ups of all but APOLLO, since that back was sent into spaced and presumably destroyed.
Late to the party but I want to say the way you said the log of what Tate wrote honestly from that point onward made me think Tate was narrating. thats a good thing of course. I love that someone is doing REALLY well made Horizon lore videos. Cant wait to follow you when Forbidden Wilds comes out
I think Hades did rewrite the biosphere multiple times, as HADES creator said ‘odds are GAIA won’t get it right the first time.’
This time though, GAIA had achieved a perfect biosphere
, as she had started releasing animals and raising humans. But for some reason, HADES was activated again, before she could complete the biosphere. This caused her to resort to drastic measures, fearing HADES may have malfunctioned and therefore never shutdown/give her control back, as according to her, the biosphere was heading in a good direction, and HADES had no reason to activate (this time), and she also detected some unusual signal which supposedly did not happen the last times HADES had to be activated.
So, let’s dot point this.
-HADES has had to tear up multiple biospheres and creation by taking control and isolating GAIA (pisses off GAIA but she knows it needs to happen deep down).
-this time though, after a few centuries, she’s got it right, starts releasing real animals, raising people (the first humans).
-Bam, a mysterious signal gets detected, then HADES activates, despite everything being ok with the biosphere.
-GAIA realises the signal might have malfunctioned HADES, and a malfunctioned HADES is a bad bad thing, considering how it takes ALL power from GAIA.
-She fears HADES may never relinquish control, so she resorts to desperate measures to cripple HADES and hedge all her bets on ELISABET or ALOY, as that is better than having no life at all.
Callan here got it.
Hades can and Gaia will allow it to take control until the Biosphere was stable enough for the Phase 1 Organisms to be released. After that happens, Hades becomes obsolete. That World's Biosphere Reset button called Hades is locked in Off position for good.
Gaia is in control. She builds and directs the machines to clean the air and water and to stabilize the atmosphere. If at any point during that process something goes wrong, Hades steps in. Takes control of the machines Gaia built, not the Faro Swarm, and reverses the process back to the starting line. At which point, Hades hands over the control back to Gaia. And that goes on until the first plants, bacteria, animals, life in general takes root. Once at that point, Hades is locked out and will never get control again.
But the Glitch that caused Faro Swarm to go rogue, finds its way into Hades and busts open the lock it was under. Sure, Hades simply follows its programmed protocol but at this point, it should not. That's why Gaia goes to such extremes to stop it. That's why she creates Aloy and that's why Hades is the death sowing AI as it was introduced. Hades is no longer the AI that was made by Travis Tate but a Glitched AI that was infected by the same thing that caused the Faro Swarm to go rogue.
I think if you look closely at the trailer of Forbidden West, you see exactly what HADES' Alpha described as "a failing biosphere".
So maybe this terraforming attempt where Aloy is "born" in, isn't as perfect as it seems.
@@basdusee1 That's a very interesting theory and it raises the stakes for the sequel even HIGHER. Maybe Aloy's mission won't be to destroy and defeat HADES, but to discover that HADES is just following his protocol after detecting that this terraforming attempt will fail (the atmosphere is becoming unstable). Another theory (the one I first had in mind when I watched the trailer) is that HADES is responsible for the red storms, simply spreading the corruption because he's aware that Aloy is capable of deactivating him, so he's going all in and will stop at nothing until she and all of her allies are dead. All the same, the sequel seems to be HUGE and will definitely answer some of these questions!
These videos are amazing! I've seen so many in just one day!
You are the Alt-Shift X of HZD
I'd say the Vaati
This is one of the best RUclips videos I have ever seen. How did you ever come up with this highly likely theory. Wow.
+Scott Gillespie That's incredibly high praise, thanks so much! Just kept digging and digging I suppose :) Very happy you enjoyed it!
Random Side Quest I also very much loved the video about Ted Faro's genetic clone causing the signal. Both highly probably theories. Great job.
Random Side Quest I must also ask how you went about getting all the data points.
Well, I guess we know what sent the signal to Hades now.
Note that when Aloy speaks with Olin, he claims the pain from his Focus came from Hades speaking three words.. System Threat Detected.
Perhaps Hades knew Aloy was a product of GAIAs desperation to prevent him from following his protocols so in essence they both decided to play dirty by enabling the Faro Robots and birthing Aloy because it was literally the last solution's either of them couldve taken. Perhaps Hades is just following protocol afterall, freed from the signal sent by [my theory: Vast Silver aboard the Odyssey] in order to cleanse the planet once more for an unknown reason / reclaimers. Aloy is simply the polar opposite of Hades, which together in the sequel we may see a twist in which they're symbiotic together.
I know i am extremely late to the party but I recently came up with a theory. I believe that Sylens had connected his lance to his focus (he is an extremely competent programmer and has gone around HADES before) and altered the Master Override in secret. He even says that he would do it all over again. It just seems too unlikely for the override to fail that dramatically.
TL;DR
Sylens messed with the Master Override.
Seems likely. That would explain his "capture" of Hades at the end. He's clearly smart enough to do it. The question is: Is he wise enough to not open Pandora's box in search of power (in his case, knowledge is power).
This is the best one yet! Keep it up RSQ!!
When I first saw this video a year or so ago it was really eye-opening and I thought well okay obviously something was so wrong that Hades activated and is trying to do its job but thinking about it now, and maybe this is obvious to others, him doing his job is no longer an option. Eluthia ran out of supplies and food. If he kills everything there won't be a restart. So now we have no choice but to try to stop the end of the world that probably should have ended. But maybe Gaia knew that Apollo was damaged and the carriage facilities were no longer able to raise new humans and knew that giving the reigns over to Hades would truly bring the end of everything and that's why she couldn't let it happen. Idk I just keep thinking about that.
You do have good points, but there are some things that just don't fit well in the context of the story.
1) HADES was to revert the biosphere back to Ground Zero should GAIA admit that her actions were failing to meet her protocols. This was never implemented. GAIA never gave permission for HADES to reset everything as her plan worked. Life was flourishing. Since GAIA, and by extension HADES were successful. The world was able to sustain humans and other wildlife.
2) When GAIA referred to the subordinate functions as escaping, it wasn't that they were trapped, she was the one in charge. She told HEPHAESTUS to make machines to fulfil certain roles, which it would and report the success to GAIA so she could extrapolate and analyze repercussions of those machines. Their escape was GAIA failing at one of her directives. Without those functions, GAIA was basically powerless.
3) HADES was activated by a foreign entity. This was mentioned by GAIA and Sylens. There is explicit details that another party interfered.
If I was to fill in the blanks, from the evidence I have seen, Ted screwed people twice over in regards to Project Zero Dawn. Though he was far less involved with the secondary attack, the signal. Ted got his engineers to make a nigh-unhackable AI core to drive his killer robots. This AI would have been aware of the attempts against and calculated that with the shifting of forces in the way it was executed, because it likely hacked communication networks to gain intel, realized that GAIA was going to destroy its control eventually, so started to analyze the Project. It needed a way to convert even one part of this AI collective to it's side, and it chose the most likely target. HADES. This AI didn't require MINERVA or APOLLO or any other, not even HEPHAESTUS. It could create exact copies of its own machines, no new machine designs were required. But, HADES was the weak point. by it's primary function it worked against GAIA in destroying what she created.
HADES was the weakpoint, so this AI took some resources, like say a geothermal powerplant built of a dormant volcano, for power requirements. It would use it's most powerful forms of the Faro Robotics designs, the Horus, and calculated attack and hacking strategies. This would take time, almost as much time as MINERVA took to take down the AI driving the Faro Robots. All of this, because of Ted's failure to put in either a killswitch, or a backdoor.
The Alpha is Elizabeth, the Omega is Ted. Aloy takes on both of her 'parents'. from Elizabeth she got courage, intelligence and curiosity. From Ted, she got tenacity and an apt for technology. Two complete opposites creating a whole individual who would clean up the intentional mess of Ted, and the destruction of Elizabeth's actions. Remember the last story Elizabeth told GAIA?
A signal of unknown origin.... according to the Vantage Points humanity had already started on space faring technology and that Zenith Company that gave the cloning technology was proposing a Human Colony on Sirius B....
Could the unknown origin be from space???
My theory: Ted Faro digitally copied his consciousness and is HADES
Just look at the plot points where HADES speaks. It's like a human, not like an AI.
And why the urgency to kill a girl that looks just like Elizabeth Zobek!
One point to add is that Hades asks the date when Sylens find him, an AI should be able to know that without asking, so clearly something was wrong with it after the destruction of Gaia. That being said there may be some connection between it not understanding the date and starting up its protocols.
This video needs to be re-visited now that Forbidden West is almost here. Such a great perspective of Hades, because it made me think that the red storm that's looming in the background could mean that either Gaia's sub function that controls terraforming degraded overtime due to the derangement, and not Gaia's failure to guide the sub function as Tate had guessed might happen which then lead to the events of HZD. If the terraforming sub function is degrading, then it could also be the cause of the red disease that killing everything. There's still so many ways this could go but these really got me thinking. And even more hyped for the new game!
Now this is awesome theory, great job
Interesting theory, and def one that I wouldn't classify as tin foil. However, my issue with this is that HADES was supposed to make that determination before Phase 1 organism (which were plants and wildlife) were even released. Tate states this in his Hologram that Aloy discovers upon entering the HADES subroutine room.
Tate continues stating to imagine it's two hundred years later and the biosphere still isn't right. Storms the size that would have sunk Noah's arc, etc. Does GAIA want to release phase 1 organisms into that.
That determination from HADES should have been made before Humans even were ready to be grown and raised by the servitors. Obviously we don't have all the data (such as the state of other Eleuthia facilities), so it's hard to know for sure the state of the rest of the world. The Forbidden West is described as being harsh and dangerous. However, we know there are Banuk lands to the North, Oseram to the Northwest, and Tenakth to the South that are all populated with life and culture.
With that in mind, it would seem the terraforming process has been successful over a wide region, not just a small area like Nora land. So I don't know why HADES would suddenly deem the process a failure. Especially when this should have been made BEFORE any of those areas were capable of flourishing.
I think the idea was that HADES, and the other sub-functions weren't quite finished, but that aspect would have probably been the second thing added to HADES, right after being able to pull off the reverse teraforming function.
I don't even plan on getting a PS5 but damn, I am INVESTED in this lore!
I just played through the game for the first time less than a month ago. When i played through, i was under the impression that hades took over as designed, but due to the shortened time frame to complete the Alpha project, the program wasnt robust enough to account for gaya fighting back in this way.
Update for any watching this now: The Mysterious Signal was sent from off planet, not BY Hades, who we learn has activated successfully 3 times before the biosphere becomes stable enough to create and release the humans.
I hope that we are going to get some awnsers in the future on what the Signal was that activated Hades.
The only flaw in this perspective, if I may, is that there was no embryos available to repopulate earth. Eleuthia role was done, resources were depleted in the cradle facilities.Therefore the action from Hades were quite wrong (probably because not yet finished by Travis "thanks" to Faro) if the goal was to bring back mankind on earth at least. The most logical possibilities left IMHO are: Faro intervention somehow (The only Alpha Prime left around) and/or Vast Silver. I think you mentioned it too actually. The second option is the most intriguing because it may also explain the glitch and also quite troubling because it means a quite deep understanding/knowledge of Gaia overall design.
I feel like theres so much that I have yet to discover in this game
There is. I have spent quite some time simply exploring the edges of the map, and there are things out there that no quest marker will lead you to. Only curiosity.
With the new trailer of Horizon 2 forbidden west, Hades may have seen the emergence of the red plant that kills all living things and want to reboot Gaia Works because of the threat of this plant (sorry bad english)
I'd pegged that outside signal to be Sylens experimenting with things he didn't completely understand. Right until his final scene tosses that out the window. Hade's masters?
Part of me thinks It's all Ted's fault - all of it. Elisabet's failure was allowing Ted anywhere near Zero Dawn. He flushed Apolo and murdered all the Alphas because in his Pride he just knew he was right - even though his lack of foresight and disdain for human life was the genesis of the problem. So what if Ted was funding another project, one to take control of the system (and like usual, he screwed that up too).
Simple takeaways:
Don't let tech run your life.
Never let tech replicate itself
Anything approaching a Self-Aware AI should be at a minimum in an isolated sandbox - but I'd vote to make it a crime with a penalty of 25 years of continuous torture followed by death for everyone involved. Because - there's no way someone won't screw up and open Pandora's box. I personally don't think "self-aware AI" will ever happen, but that doesn't mean we won't get so close that the near facsimile destroys us anyway.
I’m sure I’m missing something, but this feels like Sylens was the trigger to all of this. His gaining knowledge of the ancient technology (and his clear thirst for expanding on it) was the beginning of the end for mankind. Hades sees that eventually man will go down the same path and destroy the planet again. So Hades initiates it’s usurpation protocol.
When you eluded to the fact that perphaps Gaia didn't get her transforming procedure correct, then a can see your point of view that Hades was just fulfilling it's programming. Nice catch.
If this theory is true, then it is still Ted Faro's fault!
Like what you said, Travis Tate could be working to refine the interaction between HADES and GAIA. He probably had 30+ years to work on it to make sure it works properly. But Faro prevented that from happening when he killed all the Alphas; no more room for refinement and for patches that can be added if the Alpha's discover better solutions over time as they lived their lives in GAIA Prime (assuming that's where they will live rather than Elysium).
That’s a good take. I always thought hades was operating as designed but was triggered due to some sort of glitch or malfunction. I don’t think the hades protocol was designed to activate at all after the humans were released from the cradles. The thing is though, Orion was taken offline. The humans were released prematurely. The rest of the phase 1 organisms were likely released on schedule, so all was going well at that point, or hades would have triggered long before. I think the hades protocol was triggered in response to the humans growing in population too fast for Hephaestus to keep up with, so it started over-producing machines and creating the weaponry to deal with humans taking over before the planet was ready, Thus creating the situation which led to hades activating. The humans were let out before Gaia was ready. The biosphere still needed work. So now the biosphere is unstable. Aloy is the anomaly hades couldn’t account for. So now, in part 2, we’ll see the consequences of all of this. I think aloy will have to reactivate some major component of Zero Dawn to save the earth. Perhaps reset a weather control system or something. Then also deal with the remnants of hades. We shall see I guess.
I love your lore breakdowns. This game has some of the deepest lore I have ever seen in a game. It’s just so good! Thank you.
My idea was (keep in mind, I've not played the second game yet, downloading it now) that elysium sent the signal, they don't know Apollo was purged, so when they looked down on earth they maybe saw savages that would not be kind to them, then they sent the signal to Hades
This was such an interesting perspective - one other thing I've been thinking of lately as I've been watching and rewatching your videos; was the idea that what if Elisabet was wrong? What if there was some other solution? It seemed that she only took one day to analyse the situation and come up with a solution. But what if she was wrong, or forced the solution onto Faro as a means of eradicating the world and all the people on it? What if instead of her being the savior, she was actually the villain, and Ted Faro was just a fool along with everyone else? Just a thought, I mean maybe I'm reaching, but it seems to me that her solution was extremely drastic and rushed after only a single day of examining the information that they had been given. Just a thought, maybe you could do a video on this...? I'd be interested in hearing your perspective.
That would be an amazing plot twist, made me think, why would they invest so much in the lore and made Elisabet such Mary Sue, one hell of a bland character ? Maybe she got upset when faro started to do military stuff instead of helping the environment, maybe she thought that a world reset would've fixed things. There's a lot of potential to be explored, i really hope the developers storytelling skills got better in this new game
@@xisPense Don't get me wrong, I think the storytelling was amazing in HZD, but when it comes to Elisabet there are some things that just don't make sense, or is she really just a Mary Sure? I'd like to think not and imagine that she made a mistake on her calculations on the glitch and the Faro Plague, that there might have been another solution. I think one way to explore more of this, is if they explain what the glitch and the unknown transmissions are and if they came from Vast Silver and show Aloy figuring it out over the course of the game, and then she realises her hero - Elisabet - might have been wrong, not that it would change anything except perhaps making Elisabet a more grey character, like Sylens. He was really interesting in HZD.
@@theGemini_Music i highly doubt they will make Elisabet make a mistake, the game portray most woman as strong and independent and most man as fools. And I really don't think they will change that...
Now about the storytelling, even though you got a lot of raw stuff, the fundamentals, the world building stuff, the robots, and yet you've got no character development, the only interesting character in the game is Sylens (alive), everyone else are just hollow, just plainly mediocre, you've got a lot of quests, but most of them are go fetch something something.
I don't know, for me it feels like there is no connection between the side quests, collectibles and main story, like they have something in common but they are not about the same thing, it's not like learn one to complement the other, it feels disconnected
@@xisPense I know what you mean, they probably won't have Elisabet have made any mistakes.
The combat was really enjoyable and I found the way that you learn about the history and what happened to the world and how the narrative unfolds really interesting.
For example how they had it seem like Zero Dawn was this super weapon program, and that seemed pretty lame to me at first, but then you come to realise that it was part of this massive cover-up and all that. As you discover what Zero Dawn really was, along with Aloy; I found that figuring out what happened and the mystery of it all, that to me was the greatest journey of the game. That and fighting giant robot dinosaurs. That was great.
Hopefully they can improve on some of the character development aspects in the sequel and explore more of Sylens type characters, have Aloy find out that there is something else going on with Elisabet, like her having this twist of her not being 'all good' or that she was hiding some of the truth.
Because now we know what happened, so hopefully they find a way to delve deeper into the world and make it keep it interesting. My copy is already pre-ordered, so I'm curious and excited to re-enter the world of Horizon.
@@theGemini_Music the combat is fun for awhile, after some time it becomes really boring, pretty much examine enemy, exploit weaknesses. I explored and gathered so much that i was lvl 40 doing lvl 17 main mission, so I was already tired when I one shot the whole main quest. I felt kinda betrayed, the game having so much potential and you only knowing the history by the main quest.
The only thing that kinda incentivates you to do the main quest is the ancient armor, aside from that i had everything, every purple bow and armor, every cauldron, etc. So I didn't have that much fun afterwards, but it's fine I really hope they matured and made a better game. I wish I could play the new game, but 300 bucks for a game ? lul, I'll probably just watch some gameplay and wait until it's on sale. I just don't know why they didn't make books about it
What about the possibility that the Odyssey was the origin of the unknown signal ?
There is certainly that possibility, I'd recommend the Odyssey Project vid if you want more information on that theory :)
Random Side Quest just checked it out. Pretty awesome work btw, really enjoyed these videos !
You were very close
I'm looking forward to finding out how HEKARRO fits into this. It could be the master process that HADES was responding to, although I am just speculating.
I think it's possible Hades activated at least once before. It wasn't supposed to need to take over if Terraforming had proceeded successfully to the point of releasing humans though. I think the issue is that there were only enough frozen embryos for Eulethia to work once.
The secret is in the idea of taking the driver seat. Hades would merely reverse the terraforming process using the other AI programs which Gaia normally controlled.
Something caused Hades to wake up and the truth is we dont know what caused it. Gaia loses it and destroys the Gaia prime facility to prevent Hades from killing everything.
The other AI becomes sintent and disconnects from Gaia to live on. The game clearly states that the subordinates were never real AI as in they never possessed sentience.
So the signal is the crux of this whole thing. It gave them self awareness. The mark of life is its willingness to survive.
Gaia is the most interesting of all because she is able to create Alloy as an insurance policy. Her intentions is to have the facility repaired so she can come back online but how does she plan on recapturing the other AIs.
The key takeaway is that Hades and the others didn't become AI until they recieved the signal. I think the going theory is that it could have come from the Odyssey.
Also Sylens tells us at the very end that Hades was woken up by someone else.
So how was Hades originally supposed to reset the biosphere? I'm sure that using Faro robots wasn't the original plan right? Travis said "reverse terraforming functions and suffocate it" but what does that mean?
Why didn't Gaia design a robot that went around chopping Faro robots in half so they couldn't be re-awoken?
You make a fantastic point, but there is one problem with your line of thought. HADES was supposed to cede control back to GAIA Prime, once it had finished reverse-terraforming the world to a day-zero state. And you talked at great length, as to how HADES adapted and modified his orders, to salvage what he could. Once GAIA rigged her reactors to blow, HADES made no attempt to save the core programming function: GAIA herself.
Now, it's very probable that the two AI weren't on speaking terms after each did their thing. But, that contradicts what Tate said HADES was programmed to do. Without GAIA, his logic routines run into a flat fault block: "I cannot give control back to GAIA, if GAIA ceases to exist." Had HADES entered into some kind of holding measure, or attempted to wrest control of GAIA Prime's location first, that might have made some sense: in that, he'd have at least tried to carry out his orders. But he skips from trying to free himself, to freeing the subordinate, lesser functions of GAIA, that all DEPEND on GAIA to coordinate their efforts. Instead of handing control back to GAIA after his reset, he'd be handing it to eight AI routines who each think their domain is the ONLY domain(Look at what HEPHAESTUS did in TFW)
The Trailer For Horizon Forbidden West Is Out. There's a new "corruption" which changes the plants and kills animals. Could that be what HADES Deemed as catastrophic?
Interesting, however once humans were re-introduced, Gaia's work was done. Therefore there would have been no need for Hades to intervene.
What struck me was Ted's conversation to have Hades implemented in the first place under the guise 'have we learned nothing'.
The man that made the chariot line ending life on earth sought to have Hades installed in to the Gaia programme to end all life on earth and look what happened. Then the same man destroyed Apollo. Seems to me he is the only one who didn't learn anything
Interesting theory. Hopefully the next game will shed some more light on this topic.
please, turn auto captions ON for this video. tks!
Having recently completed the game and now finding this jewel of a playlist I have an issue with this theory. By the time HADES decides to take over, even if this was in the inteded form, GAIA had already gestated all her plant and human embryos. The recreation of the biosphere was by and large complete. It is way too late in the process for HADES to activate, for he is a fail-safe if the process is going wrong in the in-between (pre-release of phase 1 organisms) which by now that window is long gone.
Yeah but in this scenario, Hephestus would also get pissed as his machines use biofuel and another number of other functions would be inoperable to work against Hades to maintain their own systems
The Tallneck log in Ban-Ur shows GAIA directing it toward a supercell, where it then gets temporarily fried. GAIA leaves it offline for centuries, even though it only requires a reboot. I've a theory that Tallnecks transmit to HADES as well as GAIA, and she purposefully killed this one when Wyoming was becoming tundra to avoid activation. She could have done this to countless others as well to hide her mistakes.
Sylens could have easily rebooted another 'dead' Tallneck, perhaps in the Malmstrom, and triggered HADES. It wasn't meant to be triggered this late, but it was built with the understanding that humans would be helping the process, not harvesting it.
This was actually my first understanding from my first playthrough until the final post-credit scene introduced a possible doubt and I started digging into possible external sources for the signal. I realized that something must have kicked off Hades, but it was already too late and the destruction would have been cataclysmic for life. Too much had been reintroduced, the cradles were empty. If Hades succeeded, there may have been a few plant species left to reintroduce, but no humans. The AI Gaia couldn't let Hades loose under any circumstances, so Gaia sacrificed herself. That may have been something Tate never had time to finish, a subscript that told Hades when far enough along in the biosphere regeneration process was too late. That if it activated, there wouldn't be another shot once it was done
Or maybe the alphas wouldn't eventually come up with a backup plan and collect new food and new zygotes from current humans before resetting. Of course hades wouldn't do this but the human creation AI would
this theory intrigued me it brings new story elements to the game. but i am in the view that Hades has been corrupted in some sense either due to Travis no fully finishing Hades , some how being finished got corrupted over time or that there was an outside force. i mean if you think about about sylens he manged to figure out hot to use the tech so maybe others figured it out as well.
Great video!
SPOILER ALERT
And i discovered that there is two Hades..one real and one not so Hades..that's the one which Sylens discovered and repaired..that's not Hades it's a FAS-BOR Horus quantum processing module..
I think the pharo plague glitch ended up in the gaia program. The fact that all sub functions were affected, not just hades, leads me to believe a pharo plague in the system to where all the sub functions became self aware. Hades didn't try to eradicate everything as was its programming. It attempted to try and manipulate the people and seize power but was stopped by aloy. I believe sylens is the real antagonist. He takes hades in the end and always talks about wanting knowledge. Hades uses sylens by giving him knowledge and having him manipulate tribes for its bidding. Hades, being a highly intelligent being, underestimates aloy and the schemes of sylens, is defeated by aloy but releases itself and is captured by sylens. I believe sylens will use hades knowledge to transcend himself and become the true antagonist. I didn't play the expansion but that is what I got from the story.
not too much is added as far as the main story line, just some tidbits about Sylens. He claimed to be a shaman and had unparalleled knowledge and thirst for more. But that's all I'll say, don't want to spoil it for you.
The problem is that if Gaia allowed Hades to take control, how could life grow back? All the human embryos were already used and probably the other animals' too, so Earth would just be full of plants, assuming there were still seeds to use.
So H:FW has a mysterious blight and huge super-cell storms destroying the (latest) biosphere? I'm thinkin' maybe *someone* owes Hades an apology ; )
I think part of it might be true, except for the initial signal. Hades couldn't start the reverse terraforming protocol once the first human were released, since they onlu had one shot at this, eleuthia not having enough zigots to produce another wave of ambrios. So my guess would be that "Hades masters" Sylens talked about would be vast silver who manage to survive all this time like CIAN. He could've hacked Hades and forced him to start his work despite human being released. That or the odessey mission didn't failed and it's them trying to purge the primitive human living on earth so they can come back
It's likely an outside signal imo because hades was meant to reset the biosphere if it was in chaos and unable to support life. Life could survive and people had lived for many generations, so i would say hades had no need to start his job because the biosphere is not bad
Watching this after see the trailer for horizon forbidden west you might be onto something here. Perhaps Hades detected the red sicken that is taken over the west so to reverse it he activated his protocol and Gaia was not having it so she destroyed the Prime facility. Looking forward to see how the story unfolds
I just think it's funny that Tate gave Hades such a menacing and evil sounding 'voice' and cadence.. like really dude, come on, that thing is terrifying hahaha
DEFINE CARJA..
lmao
Only thing I can't figure out is why HADES was trying to kill Elisabet Sobeck (Aloy). Why did it make her a priority target?
Most likely because only Aloy's genetic makeup could restore the Elisabets Alpha Prime clearance, and in so, the override that could purge HADES from MINERVA.
Good stuff keep it up
Thank you very much! I really appreciate the support!
Even if Hades was acting as it was intended to, and GAIA subsequently “over corrected”, the HZD world we know would have ended, and taken another thousand years to reflourish, assuming all sub functions maintained themselves for as long as they already had.
I really wanna know what type of voice wizardry was used here to make that raspy metalic voice
Interesting theory, to be sure. I do have one unrelated question though - what out fit is that that Aloy is wearing in this vid? I have not come across it yet, and it looks pretty damn cool. :D
I might be wrong but I think it's one you get at the third or second to last main mission, I think...
What if the thing that HADES saw was that red plant that's destroying the world in forbidden west?
Did the swarm (rampant A.I.) tamper with Hades?
If so would hades be the swarm?
Then again the swarm existed before hades.
Now next question. Why would hades target alloy?
Is it because he knows she can overcome him
not that i know coding or anything like it, but wouldn't one of the core routines in hades be that at the sign of life he was to cease functions?, also idk if this was possible but couldn't sobeck had told gaia that it is paramount to let hades have control (without saying why) when it requested it?, so as gaia would know it had to happen, but wouldn't know why (granted after the first time she would know)
Just watched this video again after the latest trailer for Forbidden West, and omg… what if Hades was right. What if that red blight we see in the trailers is what he foresaw, and could possibly end human life? What if Aloy and Hades team up in Forbidden West?? So many what ifs! Please, I hope you see this comment, would love to hear an updated version of this video after what we know from the new game coming out now
Your theory is proved true in Horizon Forbidden West. In it the world is plagued by super storms, unrealistic weather and a type of plant that's killing wildlife so, Hades was just trying to fix the world even before Gaia noticed anything
Even if this theory is right, HADES wasn't suposed to activate, since this is the final version of ZD. If HADES activated, it would destroy the project once and for all, since there would be no more humans and, perhaps, not enough seeds to even rebuild Earth's biosphere after the reset
If Gaea failed in her first attempt after all, then why did she allow introduction of human life along with other animals? I thought protocols would prohibit that.
Subscribed!!
Thank you!
Great job
Was it because Faros virus in Apollo which was a backdoor for Hades?
They needed to put some Code there that destroyed Hades once Eleuthia began it's work.
I’ve got a feeling that hades may have corrupted the Demeter sub-function in horizon forbidden west since it revolves around a viral outbreak of some kind all stemming from a red vine like growth, I’m most likely wrong but I am just speculating.
It is an interesting idea. The problem, as I see it, is that while GAIA does not know about the HADES protocol, the protocol itself cannot come from HADES, which is a subordinate of GAIA. In other words, if HADES knew about it, GAIA knew about it. This is why the protocol has to come from a third party, independent of HADES itself, which means that there is a third, as of yet unknown, entity (AI or otherwise) that is set up to independently monitor the system. HADES couldn’t hide it. And Tate, while not having his lifetime to perfect the system, made it functional in what time he did have; the lack of time, and therefore complexity, reinforces the idea that he had to hide the HADES protocol elsewhere instead of build in an Easter Egg inside of HADES itself.
And, it is likely that HADES acted as it was supposed to, as you say, once activated-at first. But that HADES started to malfunction quickly and in ways that do not make sense. For instance, raising FARO robots via MINERAVA is likely not how it was originally programmed-to be most effective, would it not awaken HORUS Robots right away? They are the lynch pin in the devastating FARO plague. It can’t awaken HORUS robots because of MINERVA. If the FARO robots are the way HADES wipes out GAIA’s mistakes, MINERAVA should not be resisting the use of the tower for this purpose. HADES should have no trouble at all once activated (for instance, even though the subfunctions are no longer attached to GAIA, HADES should have complete knowledge of MINERAVA and it’s capabilities). It, for some reason, has problems. It is likely that these problems exist due to its having been altered in some way, as FARO robots were the problem, not a part of the solution. This negative change (and the way the other subfunctions changed) was started through that unknown source. Therefore, it is highly unlikely that this third party gave a genuine HADES protocol transmission and that HADES is doing what it is supposed to be doing; it is insdtead finding any way at all to destroy life. It should be easy to destroy life with GAIA gone. Someone or something messed with this third party system or AI or something, sent the protocol with a nasty change, and here we are. HADES is busted, not incomplete.
It is suspect, too, that a similar event seemed to have occurred to set the FARO robots rogue in the first place. The reason behind the “glitch” was not revealed. There is also the strange satellite above the Banuk camp that tamed the machines (maybe MINERAVA’s place of escape? The math of the satellite, the derangement, the signal, and Aloy’s birth align). It started sending out a signal “20 years ago”-this is, again, a strange thing to do if HADES is acting normally-or even if it’s not. Why a satellite that resists derangement and could, one assumes, tame FARO robots?
There are too many variables to say that HADES is acting normally and that Tate didn’t have enough of his work complete to account for any chaotic functions. It’s a thought provoking idea though.
But what made hades functions to kick in? The Terraforming was working and nothing seemed to be out of order except for apollo's absence which didn't affect the quality of environment or the population directly...so why was Hades suddenly allowed to start extermination?
Or it could be that hades was taken over by the original virus that made the FARO machines turn on the humans in the beginning.
That's my thought exactly, the signal that turned Hadies on was the one that corrupted the Faro robots in the first place. Question is where is this signal coming from, who/ what controls it and why.
Wow. This video really makes you think about who the real bad guy of the game is. Has anyone else seen the new trailer for"Horizon II: Forbidden West? Those weird red plants looked like they were draining the life out of everything around them, similar to the corruption in the last game. Oh man, I'm connecting dots and I don't like the shape they're making. What if Gaia accidentally created those plants and they're going to destroy all life on Earth all over again. That would mean that Hades was just doing his job and Gaia overreacted in the worst way possible.
ruclips.net/video/thgb_ZGrM9Q/видео.html
Wow dud, That was deep !
Question - Why HADES wanted to kill Aloy i.e. one of the Alphas? that was not one of the function.
Looking over thins hades became the resurrection and evolution of the faro plague!