The wood that was replaced by washers didn't just disappear. The bump at the end of the neck is a result of that wood being displaced upwards.if you think about it, it's the path of least resistance. I've never seen this on a guitar before, but occasionally on older Fender basses, particularly ones that have had the end of the fingerboard planed thinner to counter the 'tongue rise' effect.
It didn't show with the notched straight edge and he said the high frets didn't lift. It appears to be a bad setup from the factory or someone leveled the frets around the high one. A lot of people use short leveling sanders or attempt to do just problem areas and not level the board the frets with a sander that is full length. Combined with not using a notched straight edge first before leveling. When you use the nut on the truss to apply tension one way or the other, the ends of the fret board can dive or raise. I was surprised he didn't show us the results after leveling the high frets b4 he put it back together. Also, when leveling with strings off, then stringing it up and adjusting the truss can throw the leveling off ass the wood can bend unsymmetrically. Fenders are pretty good. Mahogany almost always has to be leveled under tension.
Brian Mascarin I think you’re 100% correct. It’s no coincidence the two high frets are directly over the compressed neck wood. Fender’s rosewood cap is not a whole lot thicker than a veneer, it’s not going to add any resistance and neither will two standard fret wires. Owner compounded the problem by continually cranking on the truss rod instead of leveling the frets.
@@HBSuccess No way..so My JM signature strat had what seemed to be a slight hump in in the heel area (originally had some buzz, and noticed it). I leveled with a fallaway and it seemed to help but still some slight buzzing. Added washers and tightened up that seemed to help for a day or so and relief is back... any suggestions? If it really is soft wood in the truss rod hole does that mean its gonna keep pushing up on the heel area of the fingerboard? , what to do?
Nice work as always. I have come across this problem a few times. Last time, I concluded the nut had been replaced with one that didn't have enough thread length. A washer is not a machined bushing, it is punched out of flat stock, so it is rounded on one side and burred on the other. It will flex, and a stack of them will act like a spring. I like the idea of gluing in the the lowest one, but I would respectfully suggest either finding another nut with more thread length, or making one yourself by tapping and cross-cutting a stainless bushing. Another option would be to have a single solid spacer bushing turned by a machine shop. You just supply OD, ID and length, and often a little job like this they will do on the spot. It will take them minutes. If you have a mate with a lathe, it will probably only cost you a six-pack. As for random high frets, this is also not uncommon. I have worked in a guitar factory, and fret wire from different models can get mixed up. I'm not sure how it got past the set up room though! I really like your point about getting a false reading of relief from the high frets. This would be confusing for an inexperienced person setting up their own axe. Thanks for your videos.
I have learned quite a bit of valuable information from watching both your electric and acoustic videos. Now I feel more comfortable doing fret work on my guitars. Thanks so much!
What i really don’t understand is the negative feedback some leave here! You’re kind, funny and honest. You invest several hours to release these videos since we all know you could do your jobs much faster if you didn’t have to worry about the video camera etc. but, still, people will dislike it! Unbelievable! I hope that won’t stop you! Wish i could be your apprentice!
Twoodfrd thanks for noticing my comment I meant every word and more. You fixed the Fender strat electric guitar it was the frets all the time and you fixed the truss rod washers nut or what ever.Thanks for the nice video be blessed with loving care and grace.
Your teaching skills are outstanding. Wood does compress. You can run out of thread travel at some point.. But it seems that the fix was the high frets on the end giving extra trouble. Thanks for sharing again.
twoodfrd it was the frets all the time but you fixed that thats what counts I enjoyed the video and saw final great results. Thanks for the nice video be blessed with love care and grace.
Thanks for this.. very useful. I have something similar happening with a Cabronita I have with a double truss rod. Thought I was imagining it for 2 years
My John Mayer signature Strat had the exact same neck issue. Without a ton of washers, the neck couldn’t intonate or setup correctly!! Eventually I sold the neck and body - and put the rest of the pickups and hardware in a custom shop neck and body. MUUUUCH better. But no one should have to do that with a JM Strat.
Personally I like to add .002" - .003" of "fall away" to the last 5 frets. I find it allows for a bit lower action for the "shredders". It was especially helpful in the 90's with the scalloped fret board craze.
@@Monomonmamon Raw linseed oil not boiled. Boiled hardens and is a finish. Raw linseed soaks in and slows water movement in the finger board. You put a few drops on, cover the whole board and wipe of the excess. Once a year. Lemon oil is too thin and evaporates.
It's nostalgic to use 1950's technology and get all the period-correct look/feel/design...You unfortunately get all the mechanical issues those vintage guitars tend to develop over time also. =[
I believe you. At the risk of offending some people, I’ll say that vintage designs were good in their respective eras, but I prefer modern truss rods and modern manufacturing processes.
I learn a lot from your videos, funny thing is that most of the times that you upload a video comes to my hands a guitar with a similar problem and i already know what to do . In this case, a "bow" in the frets. Cheers from Chile
With regard to linseed oil for necks. My stepfather was a cabinet maker/ joiner by trade, 60 odd years of it. A real tradesman. Beautiful work. He taught me about using linseed oil on necks. The trick is mix it 50/50 with mineral turpentine. Use VERY sparingly, and as you say, WIPE IT ALL OFF. If you do that it won't be a worry. All my guitars for the last 55 years, with rosewood fret boards, have had this treatment, once a year. My older guitars woodwork, is in perfect shape. Doesn't stink, and isn't sticky/tacky either.
I made my own lemon oil by soaking shredded clementine and lemon rind in baby oil. It's pretty amazing how brand new it makes fretboards look after a couple of soaks and vigorous scrubs with a tooth brush until there is no more visible dirt coming off of the board onto the cloth, and it smells really nice. I have a little over 200ml of it left and it should last me years. The toothbrush method seems to work really well, wiped off after with a microfiber cloth.
From this video found I had same issue on my Mayer Sig Strat.. and got some ideas: Measured how sunk truss nut was (2mm), cut a 2mm walnut plug out of the Fender truss hole plugs they sell (got all my washers out though). CA glued walnut plug into hole bottom, let dry, added more CA to edges of walnut plug (waxed threads first and avoided getting CA on them by using pipette). Essentially created a solid base for truss Rod nut to push against. I also did a fret level (w/fallaway on upper frets) because the upper fretboard had a slight hump. Also did a heat treatment on neck/fretboard to straighten neck. Left neck in a backbow press for a week or so. Everything’s great now but it took a lot of work to get right. I am guessing the wood under fretboard was pushing up on high frets. If you have a JM strat & get buzzing, probably this is the issue. Awesome guitar & worth all the hassle but what a PITA.
I've just set up a 2008 JM Strat for a friend, and I too had truss rod adjustment problems. To get the neck flat enough, I really had to tighten the nut as much as I dared. All the adjustment happened over just a few degrees of of turn. I must have had the neck off and on again about 10 times before I got the neck bow set up correctly, all the time hoping that the rod didn't snap. Given all the time this type of neck has been made for, you'd have thought Fender would have got it right by now.
Glad you fixed it. If I were to have to extract the washer, I would have put a very thin layer of superglue on the face of a small metal tube and stuck that to the washer. If that failed, I would drill two opposing pilot holes with the smallest drill bit I have, then screw two long thin screws into the washer to pull it out.
I seem to remember seeing a vid where JM says he does intentionally plane a bit of relief into the middle frets, but I'm not sure if that was done at the factory per his specs. Thanks for another awesome vid.
Having done loads of strats, the neck shrinks more than the heel. Same on some acoustics. The heel "bulge" shows up in many strats as they age. There is a lock washer that fits the strat, and can be bent flat with needle nose. I have also come across that same problem, where you can not tighten the truss rod enough. The flattened lock washers fit well and work fine.
Hate, hate, hateeeeeee, those truss rods that are in the “wrong end” of the neck! What a pain in the ass! ...LOL... Great Vid! See you at Timmies #1 for a Lg Double Double, eh! :)
I really prefer the screwdriver adjustment though, I really wish guitar makers would just drop the Allan key adjustment thing, and put a screwdriver adjustment at the headstock
I had the same exact issue with a 62 reissue Stratocaster and came to the same conclusion that the wood under the truss rot adjusting nut was soft. After I added the third washer, I sold the guitar.
Imagine the damage that could have been inflicted from a couple of high frets were someone less experienced been charged with handling this job! Those frets would probably have been ground down to almost nothing chasing the phantom neck bow, great catch!
FWIW I use walnut oil on fretboards. Won’t get gummy like linseed and won’t attack inlay and binding glue like lemon oil. Ran across it totally by accident. I was out of everything else and my niece had some walnut oil her purse. Why I have no idea.. but she did so I tried it. Worked great so that’s my go to now. 😂. Still using the same jar she gave me 3-4 yrs ago.
I love .011, I set all my guitars to it. I like the feel but also in my not so broad experience the guitars seem to ring out acoustically better when the relief is above .010.
I would have turned a spacer on the lathe equal length to the stack of washers and used that with one lock washer. It's crazy to stack that many lock washers together.
A lot of people do not understand a 1/4-20 nut and bolt at 1 (one) ft.lb. t. will put over 200 psi. on the washers. The glue will just brake. And I hate to troll a master like this guy.
...plus I love the smell of linseed oil. I use it on bare wood guitars and ukus and although it takes forever to cure all woods and even metals like it as a thin organic protective layer. I have made about a hundred different instruments, including shakuhachi and didgeridoos using linseed oil as a seasoning and protective substance. When bamboo, for instance, is rolled and heated over a propane stove linseed oil seeps into the heated wood, inside and out. Poor people love linseed oil. Linseed oil can be applied over and over over the years and will eventually even form a thin and flexible layer of goodness.
I have a nice 78 Tokai, and the trust rod rattles on the open A string I used spring washers that won't come out, the big problem is that I used stainless steal washers that do not mix with the carbon steel truss rod over time it might rust. The rattle is still there.
I have had a local luthier work on my guitars, I had him do something called fall away. The last 5-6 frets are lower than the other frets, since I never play the highest notes on the fretboard.
Just discovered your channel, interesting problem with a mushy truss rod. The multi washer problem looks like it might be similar to a related albeit very different issue when shimming mountings on industrial machines. The rule is never more than 3 shims - or they will act like a spring. I think if you replaced most of the stack of washers with a solid spacer then the mushiness will go away. BTW - love your work! Excellent videos
You should go to Lee Valley and pick-up their 4pcs picks kit... It will set you back about 20 clams (if memory serves me right) but comes in super handy in those cases where you need to grab something (or dig a doggone washer) at the bottom of a hole..
I suspect the compression on that bottom washer may have caused the wood to act like a clamp onto the washer as the downward tension pulls in the surrounding wood to clamp the edge of the washer, 2 possible attack methods there would be to somehow score around the washer with a very fine blade but due to the access size and restrictions you risk a actual blade breaking and staying wedged in plus you would have to make the tool to do it, my chosen method however would be to drill and tap the washer and then use a machine screw to remove the washer, this way very large upward forces can be applied with little risk of causing damage, although the drilling is the risky part and its a weigh up to whether it is really a big issue if it cannot be removed. I am primarily an Electrical Engineer and its that engineering side of me that gets my interest in videos like this, nothing better than to see a professional take in what has become firewood and through skill and experience restore it to a full working guitar.
Michael Marsh Even john's Black1 had issues lol the wiring was not soldered fender didn't took care of him + his deal with fender made him play only fender which I guess he hates since he loves using other brands 🤦🏻♂️
@@taotuhao5969 I do not know alot about soldering, all I know is John Mayer said his Black1 was unsoldered when it was delivered from the fender directly lmao
There's a bunch of "green" (soft) necks from Fender, mostly basses, mostly with the truss rod nut on the bottom (like this one) and mostly made in Mexico. Nothing new.
I bought a new player's model strat over the winter, buttercream. The first 3 frets buzzed. I had to give a brand new guitar a resurface. It plays great now. The gibson SG i bought last year came with 2 dead on arrival tuners and a few other issues. They are both great guitars now, but I should learn to buy in stock flavors instead of ordering blind, because each is different.
Or... if that rod does break some day, you might get a router and a piece of walnut and make a skunk stripe on that neck, then insert the new rod, like they do at the factory. Just a thought. I've never done that. The last neck that had a broken truss rod went into the garbage. Just got a new neck -- bolt on, of course. I'm enjoying these electric guitar repairs. They're fun. Great diagnosis of the issue, and a nice, clean repair. Informative and entertaining, as usual.
@@OtherTheDave Yeah...I believe that was set-neck guitar, however. With a bolt-on neck it's possible to route out the channel, but I've never tried it. Maybe cheaper just to buy another neck.
Perihelion77 I went looking for the video. If this is the one I was thinking of, it wasn’t a set neck, it was a neck-through... even better! 😁 ruclips.net/video/Uozzynq9hPg/видео.html I know these stewmac videos are at least half ads for stuff they sell, but some are just plain interesting. They did one about a ceramic guitar!
I suspect the original owner cranked that rod tighter till he heard a pop and stopped. Then they added washers till it became obvious a new neck was needed so they sold it to guitar center or on reverb.
I would say you'd think by about the 4th washer you'd want to get it professionally repaired however it seems they did one better and sold it on reverb or to guitar center.
In fact, it is perfectly normal for the nut thread to be short and the nut itself to be made of a harder material than the truss rod... The typical trouble with "classic" anchors, I never seen before with two-way-action truss rods.
Great video - I have the exact same guitar and exact same symptoms - Great guitar but neck won't hold relief and upper frets buzzing. Did a fret level and added fallaway but eventually goes back to buzzing due to too much relief. Had 3 washers in there but removed two and now a single washer compressed into the truss hole wood. Can't get last washer out. Concerned and what should I do - did this fix last? Other options? Thanks for any advice. UPDATE: Got all washers out. Cut a Fender walnut truss hole plug to match depth of sunk nut (2mm) & wick glued side edge of plug with thin CA glue (avoiding the rod). Worked great. Doing this fix (and fretboard heat & lengthy flatten jig press treatment to reset wood memory + fret level) fixed my guitar neck. Took a lot of work and fiddling. Thanks for the video & inspiration to fix this issue.
yeah i dont think i would ever go to high in price unless it was from a luthier working on one guitar at a time, mass produced just spend enough to get some quality parts and set up your self.
I have exact same guitar.. neck problem on mine. have heard of a few others online which have twisted or humped necks.... mine had terrible buzz on upper frets... so I did a fallaway... but the damn thing won’t hold the action stable... I flatten using truss adjust (very snug) & added washers.. won’t hold and action gets high after a few weeks. PITA... there must be a defect on these.. bad wood, etc. I think what’s happening is wood near nut is compressing and forcing up under rosewood at uppermost frets.
Yes I've seen that develop over time, especially when too much torque was applied on the screws in softer woods. If the shim is placed between the screws (at frets 20/21) that can be avoided. But really it's difficult to deform properly dried hard maple in a short distance like that.
For sure those split lock washers have no business adding vagueness to the adjustment! Granted I work in a machine shop but I’d have made a brass spacer of the right height vs a stack of washers. Of course with them all bonded together that should remove any movement in the stack
The only thing l might have tried to get that last washer out might be a couple quick blasts with compressed air. I might have given it a few squirts of air to see if it might get behind the washer and float it out. An extra minute or two of effort, that probably wouldn't work. But itd keep me awake at night wondering...
Not sure why the two lock washers are included in that stack. They will be “mushy” until they get loaded to the point of flattening. Also, about gluing them to each other and to the side of the truss rod hole, before compressing. Have you considered using a small bushing / spacer instead of the washers? There are various sizes / combinations of ID, OD and length. Seem like a solid stainless steel cylinder would perform more consistently than a stack of machine bolt washers and lock washers.
I was wondering of it was possibly not a factory bodge, but the fret level situation makes me pretty sure it's factory. Spring washers? I also hear there's quite a lot of 'green' wood in recent Fender guitars... They also got prosecuted in the EU for price rigging recently. Oh dear
I have exact same guitar and the neck is giving me fits. After checking with a notched straightedge, it appeared to have a hump near 12 fret. I leveled frets with a fallaway. Seemed slightly better. Still some string buzz, action a bit high. Added washers and retightened and it initially seemed better.... but pulled the guitar out after a couple days and it seems the relief is back...ugh what a PITA guitar. Wondering what to do now? Soft wood may be the issue in the truss rod pocket? Gonna recheck the neck. Wish someone made a spacer instead of adding a ton of washers. how to harden up soft wood that is compressing?
@@budandbean1 , perhaps I can spell flummox because it's so close to "lummox", a term for a big guy who's maybe not so bright.....like my 120 pound Anatolian Shepherd. I sometimes refer to him affectionately as "dunderhead" or "lummox" when we take walks together; upon meeting the dog for the first time right after we adopted him, my favorite veterinarian said " He is the perfect dog for your family, because hes just a big doofus". Isn't language fun?!
I've seen them dress the last four or six Frets up by the body ... grinding lower to create more relief down there on the neck ... your thoughts ??? I know you didn't do it ... I saw you knocked down just the 2 high ones ... love your channel ... thanks ... Dave ...
On your previous strat video ... I thought , I wonder if Dan Erlickman can play like that ..., great ending to a learned a lot from that video. Your humour is quite good too. Where do you get the thin super glue ? Cheers Alberta Dave
That mark by the trussrod,end of the fingerboard is where someone has taken one of those cheater bars to try to adjust the trussrod without removing the neck completely.. those things work with tele guitars but not so much with strats.. ask me how I know..lol
I learned one thing today - tung oil isn’t made from tongues. I can sleep happily now
When I hear those three words "Hey there gang..." it just perks up my day, thanks!
Every guy watching this be thinkin' "bet i could get that washer out"
Just need a bigger hammer.
Magnets.
@@Scodiddly thats one of my two thoughts on it as well
Dynamite......
onemans world that could fix it and also add road worn heavily 👌🏼
The wood that was replaced by washers didn't just disappear. The bump at the end of the neck is a result of that wood being displaced upwards.if you think about it, it's the path of least resistance. I've never seen this on a guitar before, but occasionally on older Fender basses, particularly ones that have had the end of the fingerboard planed thinner to counter the 'tongue rise' effect.
Oh that’s an interesting idea!
It didn't show with the notched straight edge and he said the high frets didn't lift. It appears to be a bad setup from the factory or someone leveled the frets around the high one. A lot of people use short leveling sanders or attempt to do just problem areas and not level the board the frets with a sander that is full length. Combined with not using a notched straight edge first before leveling. When you use the nut on the truss to apply tension one way or the other, the ends of the fret board can dive or raise. I was surprised he didn't show us the results after leveling the high frets b4 he put it back together. Also, when leveling with strings off, then stringing it up and adjusting the truss can throw the leveling off ass the wood can bend unsymmetrically. Fenders are pretty good. Mahogany almost always has to be leveled under tension.
Brian Mascarin I think you’re 100% correct. It’s no coincidence the two high frets are directly over the compressed neck wood. Fender’s rosewood cap is not a whole lot thicker than a veneer, it’s not going to add any resistance and neither will two standard fret wires. Owner compounded the problem by continually cranking on the truss rod instead of leveling the frets.
Oh shit!!! Yer right!
@@HBSuccess No way..so My JM signature strat had what seemed to be a slight hump in in the heel area (originally had some buzz, and noticed it). I leveled with a fallaway and it seemed to help but still some slight buzzing. Added washers and tightened up that seemed to help for a day or so and relief is back... any suggestions? If it really is soft wood in the truss rod hole does that mean its gonna keep pushing up on the heel area of the fingerboard? , what to do?
Nice work as always. I have come across this problem a few times. Last time, I concluded the nut had been replaced with one that didn't have enough thread length. A washer is not a machined bushing, it is punched out of flat stock, so it is rounded on one side and burred on the other. It will flex, and a stack of them will act like a spring. I like the idea of gluing in the the lowest one, but I would respectfully suggest either finding another nut with more thread length, or making one yourself by tapping and cross-cutting a stainless bushing. Another option would be to have a single solid spacer bushing turned by a machine shop. You just supply OD, ID and length, and often a little job like this they will do on the spot. It will take them minutes. If you have a mate with a lathe, it will probably only cost you a six-pack.
As for random high frets, this is also not uncommon. I have worked in a guitar factory, and fret wire from different models can get mixed up. I'm not sure how it got past the set up room though!
I really like your point about getting a false reading of relief from the high frets. This would be confusing for an inexperienced person setting up their own axe. Thanks for your videos.
You make my days better.
Lots of love from Alberta
Fascinating insight and top notch attention to detail. Great work sir.
Amazed each time i watch your videos. Thank you for the great information.
Love your videos - great knowledge transfer and your voice is very soothing in an over-excited world. Thank you!
I have learned quite a bit of valuable information from watching both your electric and acoustic videos. Now I feel more comfortable doing fret work on my guitars. Thanks so much!
Always enlightening and entertaining to watch a craftsman at work. Cheers from Macleay Island Queensland Australia
Guitars are guitars. Thanks, Ted. Always delightful/satisfying to watch your presentations, regardless of instrument.
My exact issue with high frets solved! Thanks for doing what you do.
That is top notch guitar tech work! The fret rocker is always your friend. Thank you so much for this video!!!
I have always loved watching your videos you definitely know what your doin your channel is one of the best on youtube
Very creative and knowledgable fix.
Your talents never fail to amaze. Who would have thought it was a high fret causing the relief to appear off?
Superb quality video and craftsmanship, well done!
A Fender signature MIA.. so much about quality control over there. Great job again, sir.
Damn those 15 minutes flew by
What i really don’t understand is the negative feedback some leave here! You’re kind, funny and honest. You invest several hours to release these videos since we all know you could do your jobs much faster if you didn’t have to worry about the video camera etc. but, still, people will dislike it! Unbelievable!
I hope that won’t stop you! Wish i could be your apprentice!
Another master class in how its done right.
Twoodfrd thanks for noticing my comment I meant every word and more. You fixed the Fender strat electric guitar it was the frets all the time and you fixed the truss rod washers nut or what ever.Thanks for the nice video be blessed with loving care and grace.
Your teaching skills are outstanding. Wood does compress. You can run out of thread travel at some point.. But it seems that the fix was the high frets on the end giving extra trouble. Thanks for sharing again.
Great insights into fret and fingerboard reliefs.
twoodfrd it was the frets all the time but you fixed that thats what counts I enjoyed the video and saw final great results. Thanks for the nice video be blessed with love care and grace.
Thanks for this.. very useful. I have something similar happening with a Cabronita I have with a double truss rod. Thought I was imagining it for 2 years
My John Mayer signature Strat had the exact same neck issue. Without a ton of washers, the neck couldn’t intonate or setup correctly!! Eventually I sold the neck and body - and put the rest of the pickups and hardware in a custom shop neck and body. MUUUUCH better. But no one should have to do that with a JM Strat.
Personally I like to add .002" - .003" of "fall away" to the last 5 frets. I find it allows for a bit lower action for the "shredders". It was especially helpful in the 90's with the scalloped fret board craze.
I always build them that way.
After watching your videos I am pretty confident in my abilities to open a repair shop. 😁
yeah and after 45 years of watching E,R type tv drama's, I am looking for my first patient, for open heart surgery
Awesome work, love your channel!!!!
My favorite video making guy dude.
Unpopular opinion: linseed oil smells incredible, as does high quality turpentine. (Painter here)
Flax seed oil works very well and also smells great
I remember sniffing the linseed oil bottle after using it for the first time I used it on my fretboard
@@Monomonmamon Raw linseed oil not boiled. Boiled hardens and is a finish. Raw linseed soaks in and slows water movement in the finger board. You put a few drops on, cover the whole board and wipe of the excess. Once a year. Lemon oil is too thin and evaporates.
A little whiff of acetone is not so bad either XD !!
Ever had it catch on fire?? Lol
How odd. Interesting bit of fault finding there and great video too, this is one to remember.
That is shocking for such an expensive guitar.
It's nostalgic to use 1950's technology and get all the period-correct look/feel/design...You unfortunately get all the mechanical issues those vintage guitars tend to develop over time also. =[
I worked over 15 years as a repairman and have seen all kind of problems on Custom Shop Fender and Gibson Guitars…you wont believe what I saw.
I believe you. At the risk of offending some people, I’ll say that vintage designs were good in their respective eras, but I prefer modern truss rods and modern manufacturing processes.
I learn a lot from your videos, funny thing is that most of the times that you upload a video comes to my hands a guitar with a similar problem and i already know what to do . In this case, a "bow" in the frets. Cheers from Chile
With regard to linseed oil for necks. My stepfather was a cabinet maker/ joiner by trade, 60 odd years of it. A real tradesman. Beautiful work. He taught me about using linseed oil on necks. The trick is mix it 50/50 with mineral turpentine. Use VERY sparingly, and as you say, WIPE IT ALL OFF. If you do that it won't be a worry. All my guitars for the last 55 years, with rosewood fret boards, have had this treatment, once a year. My older guitars woodwork, is in perfect shape. Doesn't stink, and isn't sticky/tacky either.
I made my own lemon oil by soaking shredded clementine and lemon rind in baby oil.
It's pretty amazing how brand new it makes fretboards look after a couple of soaks and vigorous scrubs with a tooth brush until there is no more visible dirt coming off of the board onto the cloth, and it smells really nice. I have a little over 200ml of it left and it should last me years.
The toothbrush method seems to work really well, wiped off after with a microfiber cloth.
Nice work Ted and not a solder/sodder in sight. Sad to say that Nigel is now in therapy. We hope he pulls through!
From this video found I had same issue on my Mayer Sig Strat.. and got some ideas: Measured how sunk truss nut was (2mm), cut a 2mm walnut plug out of the Fender truss hole plugs they sell (got all my washers out though). CA glued walnut plug into hole bottom, let dry, added more CA to edges of walnut plug (waxed threads first and avoided getting CA on them by using pipette). Essentially created a solid base for truss Rod nut to push against. I also did a fret level (w/fallaway on upper frets) because the upper fretboard had a slight hump. Also did a heat treatment on neck/fretboard to straighten neck. Left neck in a backbow press for a week or so. Everything’s great now but it took a lot of work to get right. I am guessing the wood under fretboard was pushing up on high frets. If you have a JM strat & get buzzing, probably this is the issue. Awesome guitar & worth all the hassle but what a PITA.
I've just set up a 2008 JM Strat for a friend, and I too had truss rod adjustment problems. To get the neck flat enough, I really had to tighten the nut as much as I dared. All the adjustment happened over just a few degrees of of turn. I must have had the neck off and on again about 10 times before I got the neck bow set up correctly, all the time hoping that the rod didn't snap. Given all the time this type of neck has been made for, you'd have thought Fender would have got it right by now.
Glad you fixed it. If I were to have to extract the washer, I would have put a very thin layer of superglue on the face of a small metal tube and stuck that to the washer. If that failed, I would drill two opposing pilot holes with the smallest drill bit I have, then screw two long thin screws into the washer to pull it out.
I just subscribed to your channel. Let me tell you, your videos are very interesting and also calming to watch. Very cool!
I seem to remember seeing a vid where JM says he does intentionally plane a bit of relief into the middle frets, but I'm not sure if that was done at the factory per his specs. Thanks for another awesome vid.
Having done loads of strats, the neck shrinks more than the heel. Same on some acoustics. The heel "bulge" shows up in many strats as they age. There is a lock washer that fits the strat, and can be bent flat with needle nose. I have also come across that same problem, where you can not tighten the truss rod enough. The flattened lock washers fit well and work fine.
I agree with you on the lemon oil vs linseed oil.
Hate, hate, hateeeeeee, those truss rods that are in the “wrong end” of the neck! What a pain in the ass! ...LOL... Great Vid! See you at Timmies #1 for a Lg Double Double, eh! :)
First thought I had as well. There are so many far superior options now making this trussrod completely obsolete.
Same, it's stupid. But the headstock looks soooo good with no cavity
I am actually building a mustang, i already finished the neck, and I intentionally put the truss rod down there. I really like it
@@danielsgrunge Then use those wheels at the other end capped off with a piece of wood. That way you can have the best of both worlds.
I really prefer the screwdriver adjustment though, I really wish guitar makers would just drop the Allan key adjustment thing, and put a screwdriver adjustment at the headstock
I had the same exact issue with a 62 reissue Stratocaster and came to the same conclusion that the wood under the truss rot adjusting nut was soft. After I added the third washer, I sold the guitar.
Very clever fix.
Imagine the damage that could have been inflicted from a couple of high frets were someone less experienced been charged with handling this job! Those frets would probably have been ground down to almost nothing chasing the phantom neck bow, great catch!
Love this guitar. I'll have one someday!
Thanks I learned something. thanks again
another job well done.
Friday afternoon job from Fender.
David Noble this made me lol
Conjunctival forceps!! LOL! (I love your tools...)
FWIW I use walnut oil on fretboards. Won’t get gummy like linseed and won’t attack inlay and binding glue like lemon oil. Ran across it totally by accident. I was out of everything else and my niece had some walnut oil her purse. Why I have no idea.. but she did so I tried it. Worked great so that’s my go to now. 😂. Still using the same jar she gave me 3-4 yrs ago.
I love .011, I set all my guitars to it. I like the feel but also in my not so broad experience the guitars seem to ring out acoustically better when the relief is above .010.
You can thin linseed oil down. You don't have to slather it on with a paint roller. Also, the smell is lovely.
rewatching.. "I even tried a vacuum cleaner" kills me. I love this video lol
Guirian fret file... you're old school. I like that
I would have turned a spacer on the lathe equal length to the stack of washers and used that with one lock washer. It's crazy to stack that many lock washers together.
I doubt he reused the lock washers.
I did not reuse the lock washers.
Always nice to own a lathe or 2.
@@stratocaster1greg I have 4 and 3 of them are cnc.
stratocaster1greg ....especially a metal cutting lathe where you can whip out truss rod slugs on demand lol. That’s Jerry Rosa territory.
A lot of people do not understand a 1/4-20 nut and bolt at 1 (one) ft.lb. t. will put over 200 psi. on the washers. The glue will just brake. And I hate to troll a master like this guy.
...plus I love the smell of linseed oil. I use it on bare wood guitars and ukus and although it takes forever to cure all woods and even metals like it as a thin organic protective layer. I have made about a hundred different instruments, including shakuhachi and didgeridoos using linseed oil as a seasoning and protective substance. When bamboo, for instance, is rolled and heated over a propane stove linseed oil seeps into the heated wood, inside and out. Poor people love linseed oil. Linseed oil can be applied over and over over the years and will eventually even form a thin and flexible layer of goodness.
Good catch!
I have a nice 78 Tokai, and the trust rod rattles on the open A string I used spring washers that won't come out, the big problem is that I used stainless steal washers that do not mix with the carbon steel truss rod over time it might rust.
The rattle is still there.
Three tone sunburst became two tone. I like a very yellow in the center.
Thanks very much for the tips and the opportunity to learn. Thumbs up to crush a troll.
Diagnostic genius
I have had a local luthier work on my guitars, I had him do something called fall away. The last 5-6 frets are lower than the other frets, since I never play the highest notes on the fretboard.
Just discovered your channel, interesting problem with a mushy truss rod. The multi washer problem looks like it might be similar to a related albeit very different issue when shimming mountings on industrial machines. The rule is never more than 3 shims - or they will act like a spring. I think if you replaced most of the stack of washers with a solid spacer then the mushiness will go away. BTW - love your work! Excellent videos
more than 3 washers would act like a spring? how so?
@@matimaui se Rob Mods comments below
You should go to Lee Valley and pick-up their 4pcs picks kit... It will set you back about 20 clams (if memory serves me right) but comes in super handy in those cases where you need to grab something (or dig a doggone washer) at the bottom of a hole..
I suspect the compression on that bottom washer may have caused the wood to act like a clamp onto the washer as the downward tension pulls in the surrounding wood to clamp the edge of the washer, 2 possible attack methods there would be to somehow score around the washer with a very fine blade but due to the access size and restrictions you risk a actual blade breaking and staying wedged in plus you would have to make the tool to do it, my chosen method however would be to drill and tap the washer and then use a machine screw to remove the washer, this way very large upward forces can be applied with little risk of causing damage, although the drilling is the risky part and its a weigh up to whether it is really a big issue if it cannot be removed.
I am primarily an Electrical Engineer and its that engineering side of me that gets my interest in videos like this, nothing better than to see a professional take in what has become firewood and through skill and experience restore it to a full working guitar.
Really Fender? A John Mayer Signature with those issues? What are we now, Gibson?
Michael Marsh Even john's Black1 had issues lol the wiring was not soldered
fender didn't took care of him + his deal with fender made him play only fender which I guess he hates since he loves using other brands 🤦🏻♂️
@@Monomonmamon Are you talking about the Kinman harness that eliminate soldering? I had read that the solderless system was reliable. I guess not?
@@taotuhao5969 I do not know alot about soldering, all I know is John Mayer said his Black1 was unsoldered when it was delivered from the fender directly lmao
There's a bunch of "green" (soft) necks from Fender, mostly basses, mostly with the truss rod nut on the bottom (like this one) and mostly made in Mexico. Nothing new.
I bought a new player's model strat over the winter, buttercream. The first 3 frets buzzed. I had to give a brand new guitar a resurface. It plays great now. The gibson SG i bought last year came with 2 dead on arrival tuners and a few other issues. They are both great guitars now, but I should learn to buy in stock flavors instead of ordering blind, because each is different.
Or... if that rod does break some day, you might get a router and a piece of walnut and make a skunk stripe on that neck, then insert the new rod, like they do at the factory. Just a thought.
I've never done that. The last neck that had a broken truss rod went into the garbage. Just got a new neck -- bolt on, of course. I'm enjoying these electric guitar repairs. They're fun.
Great diagnosis of the issue, and a nice, clean repair. Informative and entertaining, as usual.
I _think_ I saw them take the fret board off a neck to get at a broken truss rod once on the stew mac channel.
@@OtherTheDave It can be done, especially on a "slab board" like this. The curved veneer boards would be very tricky to get off and put back on.
@@OtherTheDave Yeah...I believe that was set-neck guitar, however. With a bolt-on neck it's possible to route out the channel, but I've never tried it. Maybe cheaper just to buy another neck.
Perihelion77 I went looking for the video. If this is the one I was thinking of, it wasn’t a set neck, it was a neck-through... even better! 😁
ruclips.net/video/Uozzynq9hPg/видео.html
I know these stewmac videos are at least half ads for stuff they sell, but some are just plain interesting. They did one about a ceramic guitar!
I have gotten that high fret at the high end of the fret board when I use a two way rod to remove back bow.It happens a lot for me.
I suspect the original owner cranked that rod tighter till he heard a pop and stopped. Then they added washers till it became obvious a new neck was needed so they sold it to guitar center or on reverb.
this is some high end stuff when you think about it
I would say you'd think by about the 4th washer you'd want to get it professionally repaired however it seems they did one better and sold it on reverb or to guitar center.
Yay new vid
I like the electric stuff, too
In fact, it is perfectly normal for the nut thread to be short and the nut itself to be made of a harder material than the truss rod... The typical trouble with "classic" anchors, I never seen before with two-way-action truss rods.
My favorite line, “I even tried a vacuum cleaner”
I made a joke to my wife immediately, who was sitting next to me while I watched; then you said, "Have fun with that sentence."
Great video - I have the exact same guitar and exact same symptoms - Great guitar but neck won't hold relief and upper frets buzzing. Did a fret level and added fallaway but eventually goes back to buzzing due to too much relief. Had 3 washers in there but removed two and now a single washer compressed into the truss hole wood. Can't get last washer out. Concerned and what should I do - did this fix last? Other options? Thanks for any advice.
UPDATE: Got all washers out. Cut a Fender walnut truss hole plug to match depth of sunk nut (2mm) & wick glued side edge of plug with thin CA glue (avoiding the rod). Worked great. Doing this fix (and fretboard heat & lengthy flatten jig press treatment to reset wood memory + fret level) fixed my guitar neck. Took a lot of work and fiddling.
Thanks for the video & inspiration to fix this issue.
that reminds me to not pay TOP dollar for guitars. it.s just bullshit. Love your channel!
yeah i dont think i would ever go to high in price unless it was from a luthier working on one guitar at a time, mass produced just spend enough to get some quality parts and set up your self.
or if you're going to spend 2,000 usd on a guitar support a small company instead of these neolithic corporations who've forgotten quality control!
Pain in the ass truss rod design.
I have exact same guitar.. neck problem on mine. have heard of a few others online which have twisted or humped necks.... mine had terrible buzz on upper frets... so I did a fallaway... but the damn thing won’t hold the action stable... I flatten using truss adjust (very snug) & added washers.. won’t hold and action gets high after a few weeks. PITA... there must be a defect on these.. bad wood, etc.
I think what’s happening is wood near nut is compressing and forcing up under rosewood at uppermost frets.
I've heard the ski jump at the end from shims too.
Yes I've seen that develop over time, especially when too much torque was applied on the screws in softer woods.
If the shim is placed between the screws (at frets 20/21) that can be avoided. But really it's difficult to deform properly dried hard maple in a short distance like that.
For sure those split lock washers have no business adding vagueness to the adjustment! Granted I work in a machine shop but I’d have made a brass spacer of the right height vs a stack of washers. Of course with them all bonded together that should remove any movement in the stack
The only thing l might have tried to get that last washer out might be a couple quick blasts with compressed air. I might have given it a few squirts of air to see if it might get behind the washer and float it out. An extra minute or two of effort, that probably wouldn't work. But itd keep me awake at night wondering...
Not sure why the two lock washers are included in that stack. They will be “mushy” until they get loaded to the point of flattening. Also, about gluing them to each other and to the side of the truss rod hole, before compressing. Have you considered using a small bushing / spacer instead of the washers? There are various sizes / combinations of ID, OD and length. Seem like a solid stainless steel cylinder would perform more consistently than a stack of machine bolt washers and lock washers.
I was wondering of it was possibly not a factory bodge, but the fret level situation makes me pretty sure it's factory. Spring washers? I also hear there's quite a lot of 'green' wood in recent Fender guitars... They also got prosecuted in the EU for price rigging recently. Oh dear
Late to the party but that neck looked like it had had the frets levelled with a back bow.
I have exact same guitar and the neck is giving me fits. After checking with a notched straightedge, it appeared to have a hump near 12 fret. I leveled frets with a fallaway. Seemed slightly better. Still some string buzz, action a bit high. Added washers and retightened and it initially seemed better.... but pulled the guitar out after a couple days and it seems the relief is back...ugh what a PITA guitar. Wondering what to do now? Soft wood may be the issue in the truss rod pocket? Gonna recheck the neck. Wish someone made a spacer instead of adding a ton of washers. how to harden up soft wood that is compressing?
Now that’s a true luthier word... “Flumixed”. Def. Confusing, Hard to believe, just freakin strange... 😂
Buddy Martin Thanks for the definition. That’s the first thing I was wondering. Lol
I believe it's properly spelled as "flummoxed". Great word, I use it frequently. Especially as I age....
good 'un I’m pretty sure you are correct... I’ve never been much of a spel’er....
@@budandbean1 , perhaps I can spell flummox because it's so close to "lummox", a term for a big guy who's maybe not so bright.....like my 120 pound Anatolian Shepherd. I sometimes refer to him affectionately as "dunderhead" or "lummox" when we take walks together; upon meeting the dog for the first time right after we adopted him, my favorite veterinarian said " He is the perfect dog for your family, because hes just a big doofus". Isn't language fun?!
@good 'un 👍🏼 Too funny...
Flax seed oil works very well
I've seen them dress the last four or six Frets up by the body ... grinding lower to create more relief down there on the neck ... your thoughts ??? I know you didn't do it ... I saw you knocked down just the 2 high ones ... love your channel ... thanks ... Dave ...
On your previous strat video ... I thought , I wonder if Dan Erlickman can play like that ..., great ending to a learned a lot from that video. Your humour is quite good too. Where do you get the thin super glue ?
Cheers
Alberta Dave
That mark by the trussrod,end of the fingerboard is where someone has taken one of those cheater bars to try to adjust the trussrod without removing the neck completely.. those things work with tele guitars but not so much with strats.. ask me how I know..lol
First hit the like button and then we go on wach video 😎🎸👍