Let's be realistic here. Paramount/CBS magnanimously threw Denise Crosby a few bones. If they actually wanted her back, they could have easily written Sela into Deep Space Nine as recurring character or part of the cast as a Romulan 'observer' on the station. But Crosby and Sela essentially passed out of existence after TNG ended. She played no observed part in the Federation-Klingon-Romulan coalition against the Dominion. Crosby was better playing Sela and made more of an impression as that character than she ever did playing Natasha Yar.
I always wanted to see a series about the Enterprise NCC-1701-B, watching Captain Harriman struggle with the loss of Captain James T. Kirk on his starship's maiden voyage and how he rises to the call of being Captain at a relatively young age. I guess that series won't be installed until Tuesday.
FWIW there's a great novel from 1995, "The Captain's Daughter" by Peter David that goes into Harriman's fallout; it's a nice crossover between Sulu's Excelsior and Harriman's 1701-B, post-Generations, as well as some backstory on Sulu's daughter Demora.
Can't imagine it as very good for his career going forward, you had one of Starfleet's greatest heroes die on your watch, and any review of the incident isn't going to be explained by "won't be installed until Tuesday".
Poor Tasha Yar. She grows up on a chaotic homeworld dodging rape gangs and scratching for survival. She escapes that life to join the Starfleet Academy, after which she has a few seemingly happy years....until she's ignominiously killed by an evil ooze. Then she pops back up just to go back in time, lose her new love interest, get captured by Romulans, raped again, forced to bear a child, eventually to be executed (if Sela is to be believed). Just a tragic character arc.
@@BTScriviner In Star Trek online we actually find out that she was, though not deliberately. She didn't know her mother was alive until they met again, in a manner of speaking.
The Starfleet uniform of this era is iconic and would be great to see again on screen. However sadly I would not trust the current creators of Star Trek with this era, and I hope they don't touch it.
@Karl Havoc You don't have to actually BE Karl Havoc, to show how you can do the job of being a Karl Havoc, to have a view on Karl Havoc being a bit of a daft sod.
That bit you said at the end about the conflicts at the edges of the Federation persisted even while Earth had a comfortable post scarcity society, reminded me of the fact that the United States has existed in a state of perpetual war for decades while we live our lives without thinking about it most of the time.
Those were better times, really. War has a way of promoting nationalism, and with a little nationalism maybe we wouldn't have the petty social conflicts we have today. Also, maybe we wouldn't be exporting our entire economy to red china. (china purposely not capitalized)
@@XH1927The ever present white man's instinct: to buy your prosperity at the expense of the lives of others, to colonise and destroy and steal the heritage of humanity. You embody it perfectly.
If the current CBS / Paramount pproduction people actually jumped on setting in this lost era, This guy would have to make another RUclips video pointing out all the numerous stuff the CBS/paramount producers got all wrong.
Current CBS/Paramount would not hire this guy because He Does know StarTrek history and Lore. They don't want that. Current CBS/Paramount doesn't like pre-2009 StarTrek at all anymore.
Always wanted a mini series based on Sulu and the Excelsior. Especially after seeing the Voyager Episode where they are going back to the events of the Undiscovered Country as well as a mini series following the Enterprise C with its finally ending with Yesterday's Enterprise tie in. I love the Ambassador class and its my favorite ship in Trek, only the Constitution Refit potentially comes close.
Yes, after VI, there was a buzz about getting an Excelsior series. It was the show I always wanted. Even if they'd waited til after DS9 it would've worked.
According to official canon, the Enterprise-B had a relatively long career, disappearing without a trace in 2329. But we sorely need more backstory behind the Enterprise-C besides what we know from Yesterday's Enterprise.
I've also heard of the time between Star Trek: The Motion Picture and Wrath of Khan as the Lost Era with up to 15 years taking place between the 2 films (and also an attempt to explain why the actors looked they age they did) where we know virtually nothing about their lives.
Yeah it really was strange how many years went by in real time between filming TOS and TMP yet according to ST chronology it’s only a few years gone by, but then in real time only two years passed between the filming of TMP and TWOK but that gap according to ST chronology is supposed to be fifteen years.
@@deadNightwatchman Space Seed aired 2/16/67. TWOK premiered 6/4/82. 1982-1967=15. Now if we're using Star Trek timeline, Space Seed takes place in 2267 while it's said TWOK takes place in 2285 so in reality it was 18 years.
Yesterdays Enterprise was an amazing episode in the middle of a phemominal season. Watched it on first run and was blowen away by the whole story. Always wondered what led Captain Garrett to be in that place in time. The Lost Era would make for an intersting one shot season/series to explore.
I'd love to see when the Enterprise C reenters it's normal time. A story centered around Yar and her daughter would be great. Maybe she wasn't executed. Maybe that was just her daughters way of trying to manipulate Picard.
Star Trek Online actually has a story about what really happened to Yar and the (false) report of her execution. You can find it on Certifiably Ingame's channel (Star Trek Online Story Series E93).
Personally I would absolutely love a 27th century Federation temporal ops focused show. You get the best of everything, you get to see the Federation in the future and how they have developed and have plenty of options for stories and conflicts that remain in the 27th century. But you also get the opportunity to visit other periods in trek history or the history of other alien races in general. Just a really open playground for good writers to both do something new while sprinkling in fan service. Could also introduce some new ally and villain races that are focused around the temporal cold war stuff that enterprise played with, but flesh it out and make it a little bit more interesting.
Star Trek Doctor Who is just about the coolest idea I've read in weeks or months. It would in fact give the writera carte blanche to do... Anything. Explore anywhere. Familiar, exotic, alternating from week to week. Or doing some big build up to a storyline. Who proves it's all possible with enough timey wymies.
In my mind, for my personal well being around ST, I simply ignore Kurtmans IP misrepresentation and destruction along with JJ “no new ideas” Abrams trash.
IIRC One of the bits I found interesting from the lost era was one where the Enterprise B got trapped in an alternate universe for a year trying to rescue the crew of the Excelsior.
I wish they did a series about the Enterprise B right after the disappearance of Kirk. The aftermath of Kirk's accident would've been interesting to see.
I just discovered your channel via Lore Reloaded and the recommendations for watching his videos! I am happy I was brought to your videos! I grew up, and love Star Trek! I enjoy listening to in-depth Lore and analysis of anything Trek! Much appreciation!
Would absolutely kill for a Lost Era show that explored the Enterprise-D, DS9, and Voyager crews' personal histories. Like, an anthology series with episodes exploring everyone's past all culminating with a few cross overs here and there.
I think you are missing the point, that wouldn't really be the lost era. There is half a decade of potential material to explore, no need to focus on those series
n who has no interest in putting out anything even approaching good trek. kurtzman is the covid of the trek universe. unfortunately there is no vaccine
You’re assuming Trek has thoughtful people producing and writing at this time, who respect the ideals, ideas and continuity and major canon of Trek But we don’t have that, so we won’t get it
Awesome video. As a casual Star Trek fan this was really great. I've always wanted to get more into the Lore but never really knew where to start. Thanks and Cheers from Canada!
Interesting to hear just how well this "lost" era has been covered in the novels. I imagine that if a series were made of this period it would be different and therefore immediately upset book fans, ala Star Wars Legends...
True. Owners of the franchise are ‘buy these books, read about the lost adventures’ and then a few year later ‘thanks for the cash suckers, these stories are now worthless’. And the worst part is - novel writers (Kirsten Beyer) is now a writer for the show, undoing her own work on the Voyager novels.
@@ronaldcustard4636 Directly related to Picard as that’s the show she’s writing for: in the ‘Destiny’ timeline, we have a Starfleet that has slipstream technology. No more Borg Collective. A resurrected Data in a new body. Bruce Maddox now a Starfleet Captain (albeit still in AI development). Marta Batinedes seems to be heading up Starfleet Security rather than Commodore Oh.
@@joestraw8870 Yeah I remember all that now I read the books a while ago it seems the pocket books range exist in an alternate timeline now which is a shame had some good ideas with the Caeliar gestalt and the origins of the Borg I wonder why they couldn’t use any of the stuff from the novels?
@@ronaldcustard4636 Money. They’d have had to have paid a royalty every time it was used. I don’t know how much Timothy Zahn got for having named the planet Coruscant in the Star Wars Universe but I suspect enough to make Disney balk at using it in episodes 7-9.
Rachel Garrett wasn’t the first female Starfleet Captain. That honour goes to Madge Sinclair who played the Captain of the USS Saratoga in the opening scenes of Star Trek 4: The Voyage Home.
Captain Erika Hernandez of the Columbia, NX-02, appearing in Star Trek Enterprise preceded both Sinclair's unnamed Saratoga captain or Captain Garrett by a century. No, she was not a "Federation" captain, but she was a Star Fleet captain.
@@brownro214 I stand corrected R on both counts. I was going by the order of when the Star Trek Films were released rather than the actual timeline, which where you corrected me. Hadn’t taken in Enterprise and the NX-02. Oh yes Starfleet Captain, of course, though do the Klingons make the distinction between Starfleet and The Federation? Recall in ST3: Search for Spock, a Klingon Officer referred to The Enterprise as a ‘...Federation Battle Cruiser’. I was probably in Klingon Mode when I wrote my response. Many thanks for correcting me via the actual Timeline.
Fascinating. Finally a very unique and HONEST review of the lost era. I love how you can explain all of the movies, books, and TV shows into one large group. I dare say "Collective" LoL. Love the content, Please continue.........
Star Trek creators could do a tv series on the Enterprise-C; doing the adventures it should have had, in the timeframe when it would have existed at a point between Original Series & TNG. It's such a wide open & available era for usage by a tv series & some new movies for the Star Trek franchise.
I would love to see a show about the Enterprise C exactly as it looked in Yesterday's Enterprise (maybe sans damage). I love everything about that design. It's like the Enterprise D minus everything I hate about it, haha. Unfortunately I don't think that's what they would actually do.
The USS Excalibur , captain McKenzie Calhoun, it was an ambassador class, and had a lot of enterprise-d alumni from one off’s like commander Shelby , Robin Lefler. Lots of books on it and would make a great series.
id also like to see a series based in the 90s exploring Khan and the other augments taking over and the events leading up to and including the eugenics wars and the reason for the 30million(dno if right but this number rings a bell sorta thing lol) deaths it caused
Look up "Enter the Wolves" from DC's Wildstorm imprint. It was published in 2001 but gives a great take on Federation/Cardassian initial relations as well as the final rift between Spock and Sarek.
I'd like to see Capt. Bateson get a show. His dad, a formar Star Fleet security officer could move in with him on his ship, and he could have a lot of witty interaction with his brother who could also be a captain, but would be more by the book and less popularity driven. Maybe his brother could have a poorly hidden crush on that redheaded bridge officer in the background of Bateson's bridge.
Very rarely will I make a comment on youtube videos, but I have to shout you out for the excellent quality and no-nonsense delivery style which you show in this video. If only someone with your respect for the history and lore of this amazing series were advising or playing a role in the development of current Trek, perhaps it would become more similar to its predecessors in quality. Since that is an unlikely fantasy, I will continue to enjoy your videos with satisfaction. Cheers to you!
I would love a 7 year series about Rachel Garret and the Enterprise C ending with the Battle of Narendra III. They could also ad some other ships to skip around with so the show wouldn't just be 100% about the one ship and crew, or have several shows deal with the same timeline therein and show the Klingons, The Cardasians, so on, and so on.
Perhaps instead of Voyager and Enterprise, we should've gotten Excelsior, and another unnamed project starring Yaphet Kotto as an unnamed Haitian captain. I always loved Sir Patrick, but I also always wanted to see that casting too.
I've always wanted to know what the romulans were doing during that isolation period. I always thought they were expanding the other direction! Though map's of startrek are not always accurate! Great video! A lot of fun!
Yeah that's what I always assumed. They even cryptically allude to it a few times in TNG "matters elsewhere had our attention"...etc. I believe they must have had their hands full with another enemy. Might be a good story to tell.
@@dallaslane6927 yes! We're the romulans the aggressor? Or under heavy assault? Did they win or just drive them off? Excellent! We're they fighting some type of war with sentient machines that the picard series touched on??? So many possibilities
Really solid video. Felt as if I were sitting in a Federation History lecture at Starfleet Academy. As fan of old Trek I know all of the points of Federation history you spoke about - the funny thing is, in having presented the way you did made seem as if it were as real as a conversation about 20th century Earth history would be! Really enjoyed it. Thanks.
Part of the charm of having this so-called 'lost era' is that it allows for a necessary element of wonder and mystery. By now, with so many-remakes, re-imaginings, prequels, sequels to prequels, reboots, spin-offs and whatever else, we should all know what a monumental let-down it is to have everything explained away, every nook and cranny forensically exhibited whilst leaving us with nothing to capture our minds and, as I say, wonder! For those who watched the Next Gen. as it was being broadcast the first time around, it was always quite compelling how no comprehensive attempt was ever made to spell out exactly what had happened to everything the Original series created and developed-it forced the audience to continue watching and ultimately REALLY appreciate references and small revelations during the course of TNG's 7 seasons. Captain Kirk himself wasn't even addressed until the first movie, Generations and that added to the kudos simply because by that time Picard and crew had their own weight and gravity and now combing the former with the current was a a major event. Think of Bones, Scotty and Ambassador Spock all making their historic small-screen returns; their absence and unwillingness to explain what happened to each of them in the time that passed allowed writers the room and space to really consider carefully how they should be brought back, mentioned, reintroduced and it made their characters all the richer for it. I think once the travesty that is currently being pumped out via CBS is over, they need to return to canon (because Discovery, Picard and Strange New Worlds is a parallel universe due to the legal implications of splitting the movies a from the tv series-a fact which cannot be disputed now) and perhaps jump ahead in time, once again, and represent the ST universe proper, that we all came to love and know under the Original and Next Gen. eras.
From a literary (writing) and storytelling standpoint that is true. But 2293 thru 2363 covers 70 years! Some of that era could be explored, without destroying the "wonder and mystery" of that time frame.
Just pointing out that star fleet tends to replace Enterprises after being destroyed. Case in point, the USS Enterprise B was an Excelsior class vessel, as was the USS Hood last seen in the far point episode (season 1, episode 1). Bringing the books into this as well. The USS Enterprise C was an Ambassador class vessel, of which the USS Excalibur is apart of. There is other ships between the two above mentioned classes but this is already a long comment.
You have a good point in your video. Another Enterprise-B end was 2329 where the ship was declared lost and presumed destroyed following the crew contracted a deadly virus.
I've always loved the look of the ambassador class Enterprise C ship. It's the missing link from TOS and TNG and it's actually a very nice looking design. Might be my favorite enterprise design. Too bad we don't see more Ambassador class ships.
Thanks OrangeRiver, this is a great exposé of your choice for the Lost Era of Star Trek. Given that name is already referred to in publication, I would not deviate from this but my personal favourite for 'a' lost era would be the 22nd Century; namely the period following Jonathan Archet's captaincy, through to the period just before what is now occupied by the first two seasons of Star Trek Discovery. There is so much that is missing, speculative, vacuous about that era, that it constantly fascinates me. Take the disappearances of the Starships Archon and Antares (referred to in the TOS), Essex (referred to in TNG), and the discovery of the USS Franklin in Star Trek Beyond - all from the 22nd century. I feel that period could also iron out all the inconsistencies we've had over the years regarding the physical appearances of the Kilngons as well. The narrator is a great authority on Star Trek lore, and seriously knows his facts. Paramount should employ him to establish some much-needed continuity, as inconsistencies between the series really rankle. Brilliant video!! 👏🏾 😃👍🏾👌🏿
What I always thought is a anthology series that fallows for one storyline something and move it around a lot, so like do a story with established characters like sulu, or Jake sicso, and then you could introduce new characters and new plots and time lines like a m.a.c.o. Story from romulan war, a mirror universe story, fallow the Bozeman after it returned from being stuck in time, a Klingon crew, a romulan fighting during dominion war, all over the place, start new stories with everyone and wrap up some dead end plots. Answer questions and start all new questions.
Nice video! Agree this is a very interesting time period to explore. I could see it as an ‘Expanse’ style show where you have the ships risking it all on the frontier, the politics at Federation HQ, and seeing other powers react to the Federation’s growth. As a Vulcan friend of mine once said, ‘Fascinating’ 🖖
Dude and I could talk "The History of the Future" and everything else in the ST Universe for hours! I'm impressed! 😃 I'm the Geek that read the Encyclopedia cover - to - cover, watched all episodes and memorized the lines to the 1st 10 movies! Lol! Great job! Keep up the awesome work! LLAP! 🖖😎
I think it would be really cool to have a Trek anthology series to fill in a lot of these gaps. Because there's *this* lost era, but there's another lost era between the NX-01 Enterprise's voyage and the NCC-1701 Enterprise's voyage. Discovery filled that in a **little bit** but there's a whole lot more that can be done with Trek lore!
That was the original idea for Discovery, a different setting and cast every season. That’s part of why so many characters in the first season are pretty odious, like Stamets, and softened up later.
@@merafirewing6591 there’s a lot of the books that I like, but some of them feel very fanfic with every one-off character ever appearing and being instrumental in saving the day. I guess the recent shows have engaged in that a bit too though. Regardless, a new-story-every-season show format like Fargo could’ve explored some of these settings while still leaving PLENTY left unsaid, imo
Very well thought out and put together discussion. Along with the Mirror Universe Eps and the Borg Double Feature - 'Yesterday's Enterprise' - is at the top of what Star Trek offers an audience. A series based on Starfleet's descent (after so much of a brighter future had been achieved by the 23rd Century) into an aggressive, expansionist, fascistic form of militarism would be ... fascinating. 'Topical', too.
I've been a Trek fan since the 80's but I am embarrassed to say I never realized until this video that Undiscovered Country and the opening of Generations took place within the same year.
In my head canon I've always assumed that because of how hard of a life Yar had in the end she got away and faked her own death to live out the rest of her life in peace. In my mind that's why her daughter tells Picard she was executed because she thought if he knew she was alive he would try to find her and bring her back. Plus she would have been in her later years so there was no point in stirring things up.
I remember Voy being held up because we had the first on screen female captain. But here's the thing: If they wanted a female captain, why didn't Paramount make a series about Garrett and the 1701-C?! They'd already established her in "Yesterday's Enterprise," but instead they created Voyager. Seems like a VERY weird choice.
always been curious about this time period, and what was going on in the galaxy while we were still getting thing sorted on earth. like the volcan had warp drive for like 2 thousand years or something. the dyson sphere. so many mysteries that could have a back story.
This Era sounds interesting, however my personal issue with prequels is that you know how it all ends. Most of these major events have a known outcome. I feel like this reduces the stakes. The other issue going backwards is shiny tech. New series, new goodies. All the gear is already established for this time.
It would be lovely to have a series set in the Star Trek Universe that actually had little to do with humans, or with Star Fleet. Show a bit of imagination for once. Then, the technology depicted could have something of a blank canvas. Everyone we meet in Star Trek is usually around the same level of technology, or if not, just a bit higher or varying degrees of lower. When they are at a more advanced, higher level, it was usually in the original series and they are just dicking around pretending to be gods, wizards or some other form of prankster.
I want a USS SOVEREIGN show. It would be from the launch on. In the dry dock next to Sovereigns there would be the 2nd ship of the class, to be called YORKTOWN, but a few episodes in the Enterprise D is destroyed and so YORKTOWN is renamed. That would make a transition from TNG to the future.
This was informative; thanks! The problem with writing a series to slot into the Lost Era is that you have a lot of backstory/canon to maintain and this limits what you can put into story arcs. The safest course is to avoid direct references to characters or events mentioned elsewhere -- you can talk about them, but actually dramatizing them risks continuity errors. Which bring up the first problem: can you sell a Star Trek show that doesn't involve the Enterprise? If not, this limits you to Enterprise B or C, which would also bring an air of inevitability to the show. Alternatively, you could do a reboot and create Yet Another Time Line.😫 Honestly, I think the best thing to do is create a new ship and crew and share the TNG era, which would allow the series to be episodic and not get bogged down in weekly interstellar combat.
its really sad that Paramount doesnt realize the era you talk about would be a HUGE HIT, and its something they should have green lit WAAAAAY before Discovery or the sad and tired Picard. it couldve been all new characters, but a throw back to a perfect trek style, which is what we all want, more than the new formula by the current creators who are very much lacking...
"The Federation did not intervene in the occupation of Bajor by the Cardassians"? But the Federation's own war with Cardassia (which was apparently just ending when TNG started) definitely helped cause the end of the occupation. There were some other things, like helping the El-Aurians which would help build up to the eventual Borg conflicts (along with the Hansens going off to investigate the Borg on their own, leading to Seven).
Would like to see a series around the pre-occupation Bajor, with the rise of power of the Cardassians. Have the initial stages of Bajor entering into the occupation which was presumably upon friendly but false pretenses of the Cardies.
Denise Crosby at a comic convention panel mused that her character was killed by Armus, came back as her alternate universe daughter, who becomes Romulan Empress in novels.
#JusticeForTashaYar
Just found the channel and subscribed! Keep up the good work!
#JusticeForSpocksBrain
@@pathevermore3683 Brain brain... What is brain?
@@annoyed707 AHHH, KILL IT WITH FIRE!!
Let's be realistic here. Paramount/CBS magnanimously threw Denise Crosby a few bones. If they actually wanted her back, they could have easily written Sela into Deep Space Nine as recurring character or part of the cast as a Romulan 'observer' on the station. But Crosby and Sela essentially passed out of existence after TNG ended. She played no observed part in the Federation-Klingon-Romulan coalition against the Dominion. Crosby was better playing Sela and made more of an impression as that character than she ever did playing Natasha Yar.
I always wanted to see a series about the Enterprise NCC-1701-B, watching Captain Harriman struggle with the loss of Captain James T. Kirk on his starship's maiden voyage and how he rises to the call of being Captain at a relatively young age.
I guess that series won't be installed until Tuesday.
FWIW there's a great novel from 1995, "The Captain's Daughter" by Peter David that goes into Harriman's fallout; it's a nice crossover between Sulu's Excelsior and Harriman's 1701-B, post-Generations, as well as some backstory on Sulu's daughter Demora.
Honestly, I'd totally watch that. Really, I'd be open to almost anything set in the Lost Era. Forget pre-TOS or post-TNG, I wanna see more of that! :)
@@windmills_waterfalls9374 excellent read imo. 🖖🏽
And Serpents Among the Ruins, whos the end of Harriman's command...
Can't imagine it as very good for his career going forward, you had one of Starfleet's greatest heroes die on your watch, and any review of the incident isn't going to be explained by "won't be installed until Tuesday".
I wish this guy was writing current Trek. I'd watch that.
Believe me, I've got tons of stuff I could pitch.
@@OrangeRiver Pitch from fans who enjoy cannon... wish that was a thing
I wish a LOT of fans were writing current Trek lmao
@@detectivewiggles i wish atleast one fan was able to advise or directly change the story of current trek
I just want the Cardassian wars told, somehow - preferably in a book, at least.
If they can just sort out the contradictory dates, ages etc...
Poor Tasha Yar. She grows up on a chaotic homeworld dodging rape gangs and scratching for survival. She escapes that life to join the Starfleet Academy, after which she has a few seemingly happy years....until she's ignominiously killed by an evil ooze. Then she pops back up just to go back in time, lose her new love interest, get captured by Romulans, raped again, forced to bear a child, eventually to be executed (if Sela is to be believed). Just a tragic character arc.
The writers can be hard on your character when you demand more screen time or threaten to leave.
@@brownro214 lol!
@@brownro214 Being a woman, as an actor or character, in a Rick Berman production is tough in general.
I always thought Sela was lying about Tasha's execution.
@@BTScriviner In Star Trek online we actually find out that she was, though not deliberately. She didn't know her mother was alive until they met again, in a manner of speaking.
"Yesterday's Enterprise" is so good on so many levels. "Let's make sure history never forgets the name ... Enterprise!"
The Starfleet uniform of this era is iconic and would be great to see again on screen. However sadly I would not trust the current creators of Star Trek with this era, and I hope they don't touch it.
hard agree on both counts
It’s best left in our imaginations you’re so right
I agree. The current custodians of Star Trek simply don't understand or value Star Trek. They want it to be something else.
@Karl Havoc You don't have to actually BE Karl Havoc, to show how you can do the job of being a Karl Havoc, to have a view on Karl Havoc being a bit of a daft sod.
That bit you said at the end about the conflicts at the edges of the Federation persisted even while Earth had a comfortable post scarcity society, reminded me of the fact that the United States has existed in a state of perpetual war for decades while we live our lives without thinking about it most of the time.
Well there is always enemies that want what you have hey it could be worse communism taking over the world
@@gabrielfranco1899 gabriel....
Those were better times, really. War has a way of promoting nationalism, and with a little nationalism maybe we wouldn't have the petty social conflicts we have today. Also, maybe we wouldn't be exporting our entire economy to red china. (china purposely not capitalized)
@@XH1927The ever present white man's instinct: to buy your prosperity at the expense of the lives of others, to colonise and destroy and steal the heritage of humanity. You embody it perfectly.
This guy knows his Star Trek history! He should be hired as a historical advisor to the Star Trek series!
If the current CBS / Paramount pproduction people actually jumped on setting in this lost era, This guy would have to make another RUclips video pointing out all the numerous stuff the CBS/paramount producers got all wrong.
Yes so much history, very valuable and relevant
Really enjoyed this video
He currently working on a map of the unseen part's of the universe. .
Current CBS/Paramount would not hire this guy because He Does know StarTrek history and Lore.
They don't want that.
Current CBS/Paramount doesn't like pre-2009 StarTrek at all anymore.
Always wanted a mini series based on Sulu and the Excelsior. Especially after seeing the Voyager Episode where they are going back to the events of the Undiscovered Country as well as a mini series following the Enterprise C with its finally ending with Yesterday's Enterprise tie in. I love the Ambassador class and its my favorite ship in Trek, only the Constitution Refit potentially comes close.
Takei was pushing for that in the ‘90s too!
Yes, after VI, there was a buzz about getting an Excelsior series. It was the show I always wanted. Even if they'd waited til after DS9 it would've worked.
Takie does nothing but talk shit about everyone he worked with
Ah yes, the episode where Yar chills with Shooter McGavin 🤣
According to official canon, the Enterprise-B had a relatively long career, disappearing without a trace in 2329. But we sorely need more backstory behind the Enterprise-C besides what we know from Yesterday's Enterprise.
‘Star Trek’ doesn’t have a canon of any kind. Paramount whores out the franchise at every opportunity.
I've also heard of the time between Star Trek: The Motion Picture and Wrath of Khan as the Lost Era with up to 15 years taking place between the 2 films (and also an attempt to explain why the actors looked they age they did) where we know virtually nothing about their lives.
Yeah it really was strange how many years went by in real time between filming TOS and TMP yet according to ST chronology it’s only a few years gone by, but then in real time only two years passed between the filming of TMP and TWOK but that gap according to ST chronology is supposed to be fifteen years.
@@bcs2em625 there was like a YEAR between TAS and TMP...that's a LOT of changes in a very short period of time.
@@GeekFilter Maybe in real life. It's at least 10 years between TMP and TWOK. Kirk talks about Khan as "a man [he hasn't] seen in 15 years."
@@deadNightwatchman Space Seed aired 2/16/67. TWOK premiered 6/4/82. 1982-1967=15. Now if we're using Star Trek timeline, Space Seed takes place in 2267 while it's said TWOK takes place in 2285 so in reality it was 18 years.
Karee Sackoff as Rachel Garrett Written and produced by Ronald D. Moore Directed by Jonathan Frakes.
I am all about this idea
I tend to call this the "red uniform era", and I'd love a whole show set in it 😊
Personally, I'd love to see more of the comfortable, slightly sleazy, "blue pyjamas" era of The Motion Picture. Genuinely.
I would LOVE to see the NCC-1701-X era where everyone is totally nude!
@@negativghostrdrThe 1970’s were a hell of a drug
Yesterdays Enterprise was an amazing episode in the middle of a phemominal season.
Watched it on first run and was blowen away by the whole story.
Always wondered what led Captain Garrett to be in that place in time.
The Lost Era would make for an intersting one shot season/series to explore.
I'd love to see when the Enterprise C reenters it's normal time. A story centered around Yar and her daughter would be great. Maybe she wasn't executed. Maybe that was just her daughters way of trying to manipulate Picard.
Star Trek Online actually has a story about what really happened to Yar and the (false) report of her execution. You can find it on Certifiably Ingame's channel (Star Trek Online Story Series E93).
Personally I would absolutely love a 27th century Federation temporal ops focused show. You get the best of everything, you get to see the Federation in the future and how they have developed and have plenty of options for stories and conflicts that remain in the 27th century. But you also get the opportunity to visit other periods in trek history or the history of other alien races in general. Just a really open playground for good writers to both do something new while sprinkling in fan service. Could also introduce some new ally and villain races that are focused around the temporal cold war stuff that enterprise played with, but flesh it out and make it a little bit more interesting.
Star Trek Doctor Who is just about the coolest idea I've read in weeks or months. It would in fact give the writera carte blanche to do... Anything. Explore anywhere. Familiar, exotic, alternating from week to week. Or doing some big build up to a storyline. Who proves it's all possible with enough timey wymies.
Sounds like a great plan as long as they call the main ship USS Tardis
A multi parter where they have to go back and have to make sure entities like the Brog come to be
Nope. They've abused time travel too hard already.
To shoot that show they need to be very smart and inventive and Kurtzman degenerate is not
I consider everything produced by Abrams and Kurtzman to be the "Lost Era".
Now I just have to wait for it to get lost, be lost and stay lost.
How did they go from making something fun like Alias to taking existing IP's and crapping all over them?
I for one can't wait. It has gotten painful.
😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄
YES! Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one.
In my mind, for my personal well being around ST, I simply ignore Kurtmans IP misrepresentation and destruction along with JJ “no new ideas” Abrams trash.
IIRC One of the bits I found interesting from the lost era was one where the Enterprise B got trapped in an alternate universe for a year trying to rescue the crew of the Excelsior.
Thank you for sharing your PhD research paper covering Star Trek”The Lost Years.” You definitely earned your doctorate with this. Well done !
I wish they did a series about the Enterprise B right after the disappearance of Kirk. The aftermath of Kirk's accident would've been interesting to see.
In the newly repaired Enterprise B port side is the James T.Kirk Memorial Hall way.
bring back that Ferris Bueller actor
I just discovered your channel via Lore Reloaded and the recommendations for watching his videos! I am happy I was brought to your videos! I grew up, and love Star Trek! I enjoy listening to in-depth Lore and analysis of anything Trek!
Much appreciation!
Love when RUclips serves me up fresh Trek channels
Would absolutely kill for a Lost Era show that explored the Enterprise-D, DS9, and Voyager crews' personal histories. Like, an anthology series with episodes exploring everyone's past all culminating with a few cross overs here and there.
I think you are missing the point, that wouldn't really be the lost era. There is half a decade of potential material to explore, no need to focus on those series
n who has no interest in putting out anything even approaching good trek. kurtzman is the covid of the trek universe. unfortunately there is no vaccine
The Voyager crew backstories were explored in the novels Mosaic and Pathways.
@@joestraw8870 true
You’re assuming Trek has thoughtful people producing and writing at this time, who respect the ideals, ideas and continuity and major canon of Trek
But we don’t have that, so we won’t get it
Awesome video. As a casual Star Trek fan this was really great. I've always wanted to get more into the Lore but never really knew where to start. Thanks and Cheers from Canada!
Interesting to hear just how well this "lost" era has been covered in the novels.
I imagine that if a series were made of this period it would be different and therefore immediately upset book fans, ala Star Wars Legends...
True. Owners of the franchise are ‘buy these books, read about the lost adventures’ and then a few year later ‘thanks for the cash suckers, these stories are now worthless’. And the worst part is - novel writers (Kirsten Beyer) is now a writer for the show, undoing her own work on the Voyager novels.
@@joestraw8870 How is she undoing her novels?
@@ronaldcustard4636 Directly related to Picard as that’s the show she’s writing for: in the ‘Destiny’ timeline, we have a Starfleet that has slipstream technology. No more Borg Collective. A resurrected Data in a new body. Bruce Maddox now a Starfleet Captain (albeit still in AI development). Marta Batinedes seems to be heading up Starfleet Security rather than Commodore Oh.
@@joestraw8870 Yeah I remember all that now I read the books a while ago it seems the pocket books range exist in an alternate timeline now which is a shame had some good ideas with the Caeliar gestalt and the origins of the Borg I wonder why they couldn’t use any of the stuff from the novels?
@@ronaldcustard4636 Money. They’d have had to have paid a royalty every time it was used. I don’t know how much Timothy Zahn got for having named the planet Coruscant in the Star Wars Universe but I suspect enough to make Disney balk at using it in episodes 7-9.
Loving the new direction for your channel.
I'm a long time viewer, I hope you keep producing content like this for a long time.
Appreciate the support! Absolutely, 100% for sure more like this to come. That's the plan, at least.
Rachel Garrett wasn’t the first female Starfleet Captain. That honour goes to Madge Sinclair who played the Captain of the USS Saratoga in the opening scenes of Star Trek 4: The Voyage Home.
He clearly states First Female captain of the Enterprise. Otherwise, quite correct. wrt the first Federation female starship captain we see.
Captain Erika Hernandez of the Columbia, NX-02, appearing in Star Trek Enterprise preceded both Sinclair's unnamed Saratoga captain or Captain Garrett by a century. No, she was not a "Federation" captain, but she was a Star Fleet captain.
@@brownro214 I stand corrected R on both counts. I was going by the order of when the Star Trek Films were released rather than the actual timeline, which where you corrected me. Hadn’t taken in Enterprise and the NX-02.
Oh yes Starfleet Captain, of course, though do the Klingons make the distinction between Starfleet and The Federation? Recall in ST3: Search for Spock, a Klingon Officer referred to The Enterprise as a ‘...Federation Battle Cruiser’. I was probably in Klingon Mode when I wrote my response.
Many thanks for correcting me via the actual Timeline.
Don't forget captain tryla scott of the USS Renegade....a friend of captain Picard who appeared in the season one TNG episode: "conspiracy."
@@new_yawker901 I vaguely remember her. She was the fastest promoted Captain in Star Fleet history. Played by Ursaline Bryant.
Fascinating. Finally a very unique and HONEST review of the lost era. I love how you can explain all of the movies, books, and TV shows into one large group. I dare say "Collective" LoL. Love the content, Please continue.........
Star Trek creators could do a tv series on the Enterprise-C; doing the adventures it should have had, in the timeframe when it would have existed at a point between Original Series & TNG. It's such a wide open & available era for usage by a tv series & some new movies for the Star Trek franchise.
I would love to see a show about the Enterprise C exactly as it looked in Yesterday's Enterprise (maybe sans damage). I love everything about that design. It's like the Enterprise D minus everything I hate about it, haha. Unfortunately I don't think that's what they would actually do.
The USS Excalibur , captain McKenzie Calhoun, it was an ambassador class, and had a lot of enterprise-d alumni from one off’s like commander Shelby , Robin Lefler. Lots of books on it and would make a great series.
The Ambassador class seems like a TNG styled Constitution class starship.
id also like to see a series based in the 90s exploring Khan and the other augments taking over and the events leading up to and including the eugenics wars and the reason for the 30million(dno if right but this number rings a bell sorta thing lol) deaths it caused
Look up "Enter the Wolves" from DC's Wildstorm imprint. It was published in 2001 but gives a great take on Federation/Cardassian initial relations as well as the final rift between Spock and Sarek.
I'd like to see Capt. Bateson get a show. His dad, a formar Star Fleet security officer could move in with him on his ship, and he could have a lot of witty interaction with his brother who could also be a captain, but would be more by the book and less popularity driven. Maybe his brother could have a poorly hidden crush on that redheaded bridge officer in the background of Bateson's bridge.
And for brunch he would have tossed salads and scrambled eggs...
@@martyklestadt6766 Yeah, I think that's been done, at least in an alternate timeline. I think it was called "Frasier."
How amazing would it be to even see a mini series of this era leading right up to the end of the Enterprise C mixed with the events from TNG.
Very rarely will I make a comment on youtube videos, but I have to shout you out for the excellent quality and no-nonsense delivery style which you show in this video. If only someone with your respect for the history and lore of this amazing series were advising or playing a role in the development of current Trek, perhaps it would become more similar to its predecessors in quality. Since that is an unlikely fantasy, I will continue to enjoy your videos with satisfaction. Cheers to you!
I would love a 7 year series about Rachel Garret and the Enterprise C ending with the Battle of Narendra III. They could also ad some other ships to skip around with so the show wouldn't just be 100% about the one ship and crew, or have several shows deal with the same timeline therein and show the Klingons, The Cardasians, so on, and so on.
Perhaps instead of Voyager and Enterprise, we should've gotten Excelsior, and another unnamed project starring Yaphet Kotto as an unnamed Haitian captain. I always loved Sir Patrick, but I also always wanted to see that casting too.
Great setting you have for a discussion! Relaxing!
I've always wanted to know what the romulans were doing during that isolation period. I always thought they were expanding the other direction! Though map's of startrek are not always accurate! Great video! A lot of fun!
Yeah that's what I always assumed. They even cryptically allude to it a few times in TNG "matters elsewhere had our attention"...etc. I believe they must have had their hands full with another enemy. Might be a good story to tell.
@@dallaslane6927 yes! We're the romulans the aggressor? Or under heavy assault? Did they win or just drive them off? Excellent! We're they fighting some type of war with sentient machines that the picard series touched on??? So many possibilities
I want to see a show about the origins of the mirror universe, and the rise of the Terran Empire.
I'm glad to watch anything Star Trek. That was a fabulous history lesson. Thank you and I will be viewing more of your videos.
Great video, good format, keep it up and I think your channel will grow for sure ! I just subscribed
Really nice to geek out about those books I read ages ago, you know your trek lore. Respect.
This is the most coherent intelligent thoughtful video I have ever seen on RUclips
Well I appreciate that ☺️
Would like to see some content involving the Iconians
Legend fella! Love your commentary and analysis. Keep it coming. Been a fan for years :-)
What an interesting look into that era of star trek, I never knew that it had that much potential. That was awesome!
I like your set and lighting in this video. The content is fascinating.
Outstanding video. I always wondered about this period, and you laid it all out.
This is an era that is an awesome piece of history that should have been more thoroughly further explored. Thanks for the video!
Really solid video. Felt as if I were sitting in a Federation History lecture at Starfleet Academy. As fan of old Trek I know all of the points of Federation history you spoke about - the funny thing is, in having presented the way you did made seem as if it were as real as a conversation about 20th century Earth history would be! Really enjoyed it. Thanks.
Part of the charm of having this so-called 'lost era' is that it allows for a necessary element of wonder and mystery. By now, with so many-remakes, re-imaginings, prequels, sequels to prequels, reboots, spin-offs and whatever else, we should all know what a monumental let-down it is to have everything explained away, every nook and cranny forensically exhibited whilst leaving us with nothing to capture our minds and, as I say, wonder!
For those who watched the Next Gen. as it was being broadcast the first time around, it was always quite compelling how no comprehensive attempt was ever made to spell out exactly what had happened to everything the Original series created and developed-it forced the audience to continue watching and ultimately REALLY appreciate references and small revelations during the course of TNG's 7 seasons. Captain Kirk himself wasn't even addressed until the first movie, Generations and that added to the kudos simply because by that time Picard and crew had their own weight and gravity and now combing the former with the current was a a major event. Think of Bones, Scotty and Ambassador Spock all making their historic small-screen returns; their absence and unwillingness to explain what happened to each of them in the time that passed allowed writers the room and space to really consider carefully how they should be brought back, mentioned, reintroduced and it made their characters all the richer for it.
I think once the travesty that is currently being pumped out via CBS is over, they need to return to canon (because Discovery, Picard and Strange New Worlds is a parallel universe due to the legal implications of splitting the movies a from the tv series-a fact which cannot be disputed now) and perhaps jump ahead in time, once again, and represent the ST universe proper, that we all came to love and know under the Original and Next Gen. eras.
From a literary (writing) and storytelling standpoint that is true. But 2293 thru 2363 covers 70 years! Some of that era could be explored, without destroying the "wonder and mystery" of that time frame.
Extremely thorough. You really know your stuff. Salute.
Just pointing out that star fleet tends to replace Enterprises after being destroyed. Case in point, the USS Enterprise B was an Excelsior class vessel, as was the USS Hood last seen in the far point episode (season 1, episode 1). Bringing the books into this as well. The USS Enterprise C was an Ambassador class vessel, of which the USS Excalibur is apart of. There is other ships between the two above mentioned classes but this is already a long comment.
I didn't realize there were a whole series of novels that covered that era. That's great, thanks. Time to update my audible wishlist! :)
You have a good point in your video. Another Enterprise-B end was 2329 where the ship was declared lost and presumed destroyed following the crew contracted a deadly virus.
Just found this channel! Love it! This guy is a joy to listen to. Subscribed :)
I enjoy your explanations of various periods of Star Trek Canaan... This from someone who watched the original series during the 1970's. Subscribed!
I've always loved the look of the ambassador class Enterprise C ship. It's the missing link from TOS and TNG and it's actually a very nice looking design. Might be my favorite enterprise design. Too bad we don't see more Ambassador class ships.
I started writing a book in this era. I’d love to finish it one day
Thanks OrangeRiver, this is a great exposé of your choice for the Lost Era of Star Trek. Given that name is already referred to in publication, I would not deviate from this but my personal favourite for 'a' lost era would be the 22nd Century; namely the period following Jonathan Archet's captaincy, through to the period just before what is now occupied by the first two seasons of Star Trek Discovery.
There is so much that is missing, speculative, vacuous about that era, that it constantly fascinates me. Take the disappearances of the Starships Archon and Antares (referred to in the TOS), Essex (referred to in TNG), and the discovery of the USS Franklin in Star Trek Beyond - all from the 22nd century. I feel that period could also iron out all the inconsistencies we've had over the years regarding the physical appearances of the Kilngons as well.
The narrator is a great authority on Star Trek lore, and seriously knows his facts. Paramount should employ him to establish some much-needed continuity, as inconsistencies between the series really rankle. Brilliant video!! 👏🏾 😃👍🏾👌🏿
I think it would be cool to have a show set on a non starfleet vessel, only occasionally encountering humans
What I always thought is a anthology series that fallows for one storyline something and move it around a lot, so like do a story with established characters like sulu, or Jake sicso, and then you could introduce new characters and new plots and time lines like a m.a.c.o. Story from romulan war, a mirror universe story, fallow the Bozeman after it returned from being stuck in time, a Klingon crew, a romulan fighting during dominion war, all over the place, start new stories with everyone and wrap up some dead end plots. Answer questions and start all new questions.
Nice video! Agree this is a very interesting time period to explore. I could see it as an ‘Expanse’ style show where you have the ships risking it all on the frontier, the politics at Federation HQ, and seeing other powers react to the Federation’s growth.
As a Vulcan friend of mine once said, ‘Fascinating’ 🖖
Dude and I could talk "The History of the Future" and everything else in the ST Universe for hours! I'm impressed! 😃 I'm the Geek that read the Encyclopedia cover - to - cover, watched all episodes and memorized the lines to the 1st 10 movies! Lol! Great job! Keep up the awesome work! LLAP! 🖖😎
I really like your videos! It's always really good to watch. You really know your stuff
I think it would be really cool to have a Trek anthology series to fill in a lot of these gaps. Because there's *this* lost era, but there's another lost era between the NX-01 Enterprise's voyage and the NCC-1701 Enterprise's voyage. Discovery filled that in a **little bit** but there's a whole lot more that can be done with Trek lore!
That was the original idea for Discovery, a different setting and cast every season. That’s part of why so many characters in the first season are pretty odious, like Stamets, and softened up later.
@@kaitlyn__L I just wish they just leave it alone and let the books fill in the gaps.
@@merafirewing6591 there’s a lot of the books that I like, but some of them feel very fanfic with every one-off character ever appearing and being instrumental in saving the day. I guess the recent shows have engaged in that a bit too though.
Regardless, a new-story-every-season show format like Fargo could’ve explored some of these settings while still leaving PLENTY left unsaid, imo
Why would they call it "Human Rights" instead of "Civil Rights"?
Always really liked the Enterprise-C. Thought it was a really cool looking ship
Very well thought out and put together discussion. Along with the Mirror Universe Eps and the Borg Double Feature - 'Yesterday's Enterprise' - is at the top of what Star Trek offers an audience.
A series based on Starfleet's descent (after so much of a brighter future had been achieved by the 23rd Century) into an aggressive, expansionist, fascistic form of militarism would be ... fascinating. 'Topical', too.
I've been a Trek fan since the 80's but I am embarrassed to say I never realized until this video that Undiscovered Country and the opening of Generations took place within the same year.
In my head canon I've always assumed that because of how hard of a life Yar had in the end she got away and faked her own death to live out the rest of her life in peace. In my mind that's why her daughter tells Picard she was executed because she thought if he knew she was alive he would try to find her and bring her back. Plus she would have been in her later years so there was no point in stirring things up.
I remember Voy being held up because we had the first on screen female captain. But here's the thing: If they wanted a female captain, why didn't Paramount make a series about Garrett and the 1701-C?! They'd already established her in "Yesterday's Enterprise," but instead they created Voyager. Seems like a VERY weird choice.
Excellent Video; I’ve written stories regarding The Lost Era myself.
always been curious about this time period, and what was going on in the galaxy while we were still getting thing sorted on earth. like the volcan had warp drive for like 2 thousand years or something. the dyson sphere. so many mysteries that could have a back story.
I would like a new series that cover enterprises b & c that's at least 4 seasons long though 7 seasons would be ideal.
the lost era, and how real it was, touching on more sensitive subjects could have worked out great to be on modern trek serialized
You make great points. I am now interested in the lost era
"Yesterday´s Enterprise" was one of the most fascinating TNG episodes! Events around the Enterprise C would make a great storyline!
There are several back stories I would love to see portrayed including how Yar survived Narendra 3 and Sela's birth
i just found some of your videos and have really enjoyed them.
Great job tying up loose ends. They should hire you to assist them in continuing the franchise.
This Era sounds interesting, however my personal issue with prequels is that you know how it all ends. Most of these major events have a known outcome. I feel like this reduces the stakes. The other issue going backwards is shiny tech. New series, new goodies. All the gear is already established for this time.
We may know the final outcome, but it is the adventures before that light the way.
I agree - the challenge of showing the technology in a way that feels even vaguely consistent with what has gone before is a big problem.
It would be lovely to have a series set in the Star Trek Universe that actually had little to do with humans, or with Star Fleet. Show a bit of imagination for once. Then, the technology depicted could have something of a blank canvas. Everyone we meet in Star Trek is usually around the same level of technology, or if not, just a bit higher or varying degrees of lower. When they are at a more advanced, higher level, it was usually in the original series and they are just dicking around pretending to be gods, wizards or some other form of prankster.
Nice work!
Excellent highlight of the lost era !!
I like the idea of a possible examination of the "LostEra" in one of the franchise shows in the future.
I want a USS SOVEREIGN show. It would be from the launch on. In the dry dock next to Sovereigns there would be the 2nd ship of the class, to be called YORKTOWN, but a few episodes in the Enterprise D is destroyed and so YORKTOWN is renamed. That would make a transition from TNG to the future.
We are also missing a large stretch of time between Star Trek 5 and 6
The continuing adventures of Garry Seven.
This was informative; thanks!
The problem with writing a series to slot into the Lost Era is that you have a lot of backstory/canon to maintain and this limits what you can put into story arcs. The safest course is to avoid direct references to characters or events mentioned elsewhere -- you can talk about them, but actually dramatizing them risks continuity errors.
Which bring up the first problem: can you sell a Star Trek show that doesn't involve the Enterprise? If not, this limits you to Enterprise B or C, which would also bring an air of inevitability to the show.
Alternatively, you could do a reboot and create Yet Another Time Line.😫
Honestly, I think the best thing to do is create a new ship and crew and share the TNG era, which would allow the series to be episodic and not get bogged down in weekly interstellar combat.
Just found your channel with this vid very interesting
Me too! Great channel!
its really sad that Paramount doesnt realize the era you talk about would be a HUGE HIT, and its something they should have green lit WAAAAAY before Discovery or the sad and tired Picard. it couldve been all new characters, but a throw back to a perfect trek style, which is what we all want, more than the new formula by the current creators who are very much lacking...
"The Federation did not intervene in the occupation of Bajor by the Cardassians"? But the Federation's own war with Cardassia (which was apparently just ending when TNG started) definitely helped cause the end of the occupation. There were some other things, like helping the El-Aurians which would help build up to the eventual Borg conflicts (along with the Hansens going off to investigate the Borg on their own, leading to Seven).
Would like to see a series around the pre-occupation Bajor, with the rise of power of the Cardassians. Have the initial stages of Bajor entering into the occupation which was presumably upon friendly but false pretenses of the Cardies.
I'd love to see a video like this focused on Klingons during the Lost Era.
Denise Crosby at a comic convention panel mused that her character was killed by Armus, came back as her alternate universe daughter, who becomes Romulan Empress in novels.
I just watched Yesterdays Enterprise, so nice to see Yar again
The information that you presented was logically sound. 🖖
Well done. I’d love to see this era too.