Your comparison videos are excellent, thanks for posting them. In your opinion is the sub 37 good for pure synthesis? That is, no presets involved, just sound creation?
Thanks, glad you like the videos. Yes, the S37 is a great synth. It has a panel mode whereby what you see is what you get, so it's very easy to use it like you would any non-preset synth such as the Mini. The modulation routing is very flexible, and using the 2 LFOs/Mod busses can give some lovely rhythmic timbres. Don't forget all the presets have been created using 'pure synthesis' so they're an excellent way of seeing what can be achieved - especially when using the free editor to break down exactly what is happening in each patch. It's a good way of learning the synth and getting some tips and ideas - something that's not possible on non-preset synths, without dealing in hundreds of patch sheets!!
Always thot the Voyager kind of strange with the screen & it is still mono. Really geared toward multitrack recording like all monosynths or modular sequenced events. Then like in the past Moog presents us with a group of more affordable compromises. Anyhow they are the engineers & I guess they have their reasons. In the past our other options were organ or piano.
I love your comparisons. Would you be able to post a comparison videos between the Sub 37 vs Mini D reissue? I don't like the filter or dull boomy character on the voyager so it's between those 2 for me.
Pete Horam thanks for the comment, it's nice to think the uploads are useful. I'm currently editing a sub37 vs Model D video that I hope to upload this week. It's a bit difficult to compare as they're poles in terms of functions and facilities so I'm trying to concentrate on the sonic characteristics. Keep an eye out for it.
@@StarskyCarr Hey nice videos :). I have to very much disagree, Sub 37 has a lot more functionality but its sounding kind of agressive, gritty, overdriven, it doesnt let the other synths breathe in a mix, whilst Little Phatty being a very simple synth sounds amazing round raw but elegant at the same time, that bass holds everything together, invites other synths to the party, instead of squashing them with that saturated sound of the Sub 37. Just an opinion.
Interesting - Moog doesn’t mention that anywhere. I know the headroom was increased, but I never realised they changed the filter... maybe an update is needed :)
@@StarskyCarr No, they didn't change the filter. I think that the increased headroom, which brought with it 50% less distortion, has caused it to have a brighter sound. There's a video on RUclips where a guy compares the Sub to the Subsequent, and you can hear it, there. The subsequent has more presence/clarity, it's sharper and brighter. Personally, I was surprised that I could so clearly hear a difference between them.
Difficult one... have you seen my Model D vs Voyager comparisons? ruclips.net/p/PLWo-iS-wwHXHQMJCqYWwjHktekrSVEXyd My head would say no. As a day to day workhorse the Voyager beats it hands down. Patch memories, the librarian and editor etc all make it a much more useful tool in the studio and live. But it's nice to have a Model D. It forces you to explore and create sounds which is fantastic, but when I go back to the studio I don't want to touch anything in case I lose it - I have to take a photo and make notes in Logic etc. re any realtime controls - which are all covered by MIDI automation on the Voyager. The Model D was a treat, the Voyager is a tool.
Starsky Carr trueeee.. After loosing my patch on the bass station 2 and having to spend hours trying to recreate a sound... It doesn't seem fun if you forget a patch setting lol!! Thank you for the insightful information brother. Going to sub now!!
As mentioned on the other video, I’ve seen your comparison videos... around 3:28 of this one. Thank you once again for these. They are simply incredible!
Maybe take a look at this ruclips.net/p/PLWo-iS-wwHXFoFnwgq-yj0m-JsKQxpjw6 and this ruclips.net/video/pSiDols0VPY/видео.html Very nice, but if cash is tight the Pro 8 - or now the Rev 2 can cover the ground of the P6. The Rev 2 also has FX so even closer.
Matthew Ftinogiannis no, none whatsoever. Have you checked everything in the mixer section is off - or try turning the Sub, Osc 2, noise and external/feedback off and having osc 1 at 50%. Reso at 0 and distortion off. If your getting noise then it sounds like you've got a problem with the synth. Check also you're not modulating the amp with noise via the LFOs.
yeah mate, if i turn everything off in the mixer section and have the master volume up, i get heaps of white noise when i press keys. If i have a single triangle wave at around 50% volume in the mixer that is filtered considerably, I can hear considerable noise in the signal.
Hmm... I've just and a play around, and see what you're saying. With my mixer cranked up I can hear noise with Osc 1at 50% and the filter below around 400Hz. It's nothing like some of my others e.g. the MS20 mini- which is really noisy. Put it this way - I've never noticed it before, but listening carefully yes there is some noise... which I'd expect at these levels (opening the filter fully and osc1 to 100% gives an average 70dB signal at my monitoring position - checked using "dB Meter Pro" on an iPhone. FYI the background noise is 38/39 dB and pressing a key takes it up to 40dB i.e. 1-2db difference. Maybe check to see if yours is giving similar amounts? If its much higher then it sounds like you have an issue). Also, I've just tested and mine is about the same as the Voyager. Hope this helps.
heres a recording i've made of the synth. Its recorded with - osc 1 set to triangle set to a volume of 3 - filter set to 24db per octave at 320hz - master volume set to 5 (12 oclock) - recorded into ableton using a MOTU 4PRE at as close to unity as i could without clipping In the recording I play a low C the sweep the filter all the way counter-clock wise and leave the note held. Then i turn the osc off and play a note to demonstrate the noise I am referring, which occurs irrespective of whether an osc is turned on or not. As you can hear, the noise is very audible when playing nice filtered waves. Would love to hear if yours is the same! thank you link to recording : drive.google.com/file/d/0BxSA4epW6Zh0cVd4dFJVck9NclE/view?usp=sharing
I've replicated what you've done - except I didn't add any level - just brought it in direct through a UAD Apollo without increasing any gain. It sounds exactly the same as yours - you've not got a problem - just an analog synth ;) I've never thought of the Sub 37 as noisy at all... So... ... for comparison I've done the same with my MS20 mini (known for being noisy) - triangle wave at vol 3/10 LPF at 3 turned down then gradually up again so you can hear how loud it is in that - incredible and f*Kin useless!!! with the osc turned up to 10 its still pretty bad and audible all the way to high LPFs. I've hit a key on every step from 0-10 on the filter. Both synths should be in here: www.dropbox.com/sh/mpvkmj0atm60zcy/AAAtAVJYepO7fNQPtmCyLZ4Za?dl=0
what is a good used price for a voyager xl in good conditions?
1800-2500
Your comparison videos are excellent, thanks for posting them. In your opinion is the sub 37 good for pure synthesis? That is, no presets involved, just sound creation?
Thanks, glad you like the videos.
Yes, the S37 is a great synth. It has a panel mode whereby what you see is what you get, so it's very easy to use it like you would any non-preset synth such as the Mini. The modulation routing is very flexible, and using the 2 LFOs/Mod busses can give some lovely rhythmic timbres.
Don't forget all the presets have been created using 'pure synthesis' so they're an excellent way of seeing what can be achieved - especially when using the free editor to break down exactly what is happening in each patch. It's a good way of learning the synth and getting some tips and ideas - something that's not possible on non-preset synths, without dealing in hundreds of patch sheets!!
Always thot the Voyager kind of strange with the screen & it is still mono. Really geared toward multitrack recording like all monosynths or modular sequenced events. Then like in the past Moog presents us with a group of more affordable compromises. Anyhow they are the engineers & I guess they have their reasons. In the past our other options were organ or piano.
I love your comparisons. Would you be able to post a comparison videos between the Sub 37 vs Mini D reissue? I don't like the filter or dull boomy character on the voyager so it's between those 2 for me.
Pete Horam thanks for the comment, it's nice to think the uploads are useful. I'm currently editing a sub37 vs Model D video that I hope to upload this week. It's a bit difficult to compare as they're poles in terms of functions and facilities so I'm trying to concentrate on the sonic characteristics. Keep an eye out for it.
Starsky Carr Awesome thanks!
@@MadelnMachinesisn’t the Sub37 more Dull & Boomy (Grittier, too) than the Voyager … ?
Most people certainly seem to think so?!
Sub 37 or little phatty. Which one should I get?
Sub 37 if you can afford it. It’s leaps and bounds ahead of the little phatty.
@@StarskyCarr Hey nice videos :). I have to very much disagree, Sub 37 has a lot more functionality but its sounding kind of agressive, gritty, overdriven, it doesnt let the other synths breathe in a mix, whilst Little Phatty being a very simple synth sounds amazing round raw but elegant at the same time, that bass holds everything together, invites other synths to the party, instead of squashing them with that saturated sound of the Sub 37. Just an opinion.
Yes, the Voyager sounds brighter. But the Subsequent 37 is brighter than the Sub 37.
Interesting - Moog doesn’t mention that anywhere. I know the headroom was increased, but I never realised they changed the filter... maybe an update is needed :)
@@StarskyCarr No, they didn't change the filter. I think that the increased headroom, which brought with it 50% less distortion, has caused it to have a brighter sound.
There's a video on RUclips where a guy compares the Sub to the Subsequent, and you can hear it, there. The subsequent has more presence/clarity, it's sharper and brighter.
Personally, I was surprised that I could so clearly hear a difference between them.
anti/HUMAN Designs aah OK ... I see. That makes sense. Cheers.
So would you recommend a Model D over a Voyager?
Difficult one... have you seen my Model D vs Voyager comparisons? ruclips.net/p/PLWo-iS-wwHXHQMJCqYWwjHktekrSVEXyd
My head would say no. As a day to day workhorse the Voyager beats it hands down. Patch memories, the librarian and editor etc all make it a much more useful tool in the studio and live. But it's nice to have a Model D. It forces you to explore and create sounds which is fantastic, but when I go back to the studio I don't want to touch anything in case I lose it - I have to take a photo and make notes in Logic etc. re any realtime controls - which are all covered by MIDI automation on the Voyager.
The Model D was a treat, the Voyager is a tool.
Starsky Carr trueeee..
After loosing my patch on the bass station 2 and having to spend hours trying to recreate a sound... It doesn't seem fun if you forget a patch setting lol!! Thank you for the insightful information brother. Going to sub now!!
As mentioned on the other video, I’ve seen your comparison videos... around 3:28 of this one. Thank you once again for these. They are simply incredible!
And I see you have a prophet... Are they worth it to?
Maybe take a look at this
ruclips.net/p/PLWo-iS-wwHXFoFnwgq-yj0m-JsKQxpjw6
and this
ruclips.net/video/pSiDols0VPY/видео.html
Very nice, but if cash is tight the Pro 8 - or now the Rev 2 can cover the ground of the P6. The Rev 2 also has FX so even closer.
hey mate, do you get a heap of noise from the amp section of the sub37?
Matthew Ftinogiannis no, none whatsoever. Have you checked everything in the mixer section is off - or try turning the Sub, Osc 2, noise and external/feedback off and having osc 1 at 50%. Reso at 0 and distortion off. If your getting noise then it sounds like you've got a problem with the synth. Check also you're not modulating the amp with noise via the LFOs.
yeah mate, if i turn everything off in the mixer section and have the master volume up, i get heaps of white noise when i press keys. If i have a single triangle wave at around 50% volume in the mixer that is filtered considerably, I can hear considerable noise in the signal.
Hmm... I've just and a play around, and see what you're saying. With my mixer cranked up I can hear noise with Osc 1at 50% and the filter below around 400Hz. It's nothing like some of my others e.g. the MS20 mini- which is really noisy. Put it this way - I've never noticed it before, but listening carefully yes there is some noise... which I'd expect at these levels (opening the filter fully and osc1 to 100% gives an average 70dB signal at my monitoring position - checked using "dB Meter Pro" on an iPhone. FYI the background noise is 38/39 dB and pressing a key takes it up to 40dB i.e. 1-2db difference. Maybe check to see if yours is giving similar amounts? If its much higher then it sounds like you have an issue). Also, I've just tested and mine is about the same as the Voyager. Hope this helps.
heres a recording i've made of the synth.
Its recorded with
- osc 1 set to triangle set to a volume of 3
- filter set to 24db per octave at 320hz
- master volume set to 5 (12 oclock)
- recorded into ableton using a MOTU 4PRE at as close to unity as i could without clipping
In the recording I play a low C the sweep the filter all the way counter-clock wise and leave the note held. Then i turn the osc off and play a note to demonstrate the noise I am referring, which occurs irrespective of whether an osc is turned on or not.
As you can hear, the noise is very audible when playing nice filtered waves. Would love to hear if yours is the same!
thank you
link to recording : drive.google.com/file/d/0BxSA4epW6Zh0cVd4dFJVck9NclE/view?usp=sharing
I've replicated what you've done - except I didn't add any level - just brought it in direct through a UAD Apollo without increasing any gain.
It sounds exactly the same as yours - you've not got a problem - just an analog synth ;) I've never thought of the Sub 37 as noisy at all...
So...
... for comparison I've done the same with my MS20 mini (known for being noisy) - triangle wave at vol 3/10 LPF at 3 turned down then gradually up again so you can hear how loud it is in that - incredible and f*Kin useless!!! with the osc turned up to 10 its still pretty bad and audible all the way to high LPFs. I've hit a key on every step from 0-10 on the filter. Both synths should be in here:
www.dropbox.com/sh/mpvkmj0atm60zcy/AAAtAVJYepO7fNQPtmCyLZ4Za?dl=0