Mind the Gap, but why?
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
- What’s the deal with the gap on the Tube?
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That shot at finchley road of the two types of trains coming in as you describe them is an absolute masterpiece
I thought the same thing. Sometimes the stars. Well, I guess maybe sometimes the trains align.
Well done Jago, great editing
I wonder how long he had to wait there to get the desired shot. I've seen similar shots from him, so it's probably a recycled clip. Probably all of the video was recycled (not that that's a bad thing).
I actually came to make this comment 😂
Came here to say exactly this. 4:54 if anyone wants to admire it again and again
On a station in Germany, Ostkreuz in Berlin before it was rebuilt- if I remember correctly, there were small notices on the walls which roughly translated said, "owing to the curvature of the platform and the straightness of the carriages, there will inevitably be places where there is a gap between the train and the platform. Take Care!" 'Mind the Gap' is certainly catchier!
The German one is a single word though.
@@julianshepherd2038 Rinderkennzeichnungsfleischetikettierungsüberwachungsaufgabenübertragungsgesetz
What I remember about the Berlin subway was people punching the buttons to open the doors when it was just emerging from the tunnel, and jumping out of the train before it had come to a complete stop. They seemed to have it down to a science.
@@simonh6371German efficiency. One single-word v three.
@@user-bq2ek1xf7i on old trains, the doors are often unlocked slightly before the train comes to a standstill. So while the train is going at high speed, the doors are locked, but they might unlock when the train is below 10 km/h or something like that. This is also the case on some of the older trains on the Paris Metro. But newer trains usually have automated doors, and only open once the train has come to a complete standstill.
I was SO hoping you'd include the Northern Line's Northbound Embankment announcement, and naturally, you did! Well done, sir!
i noticed it when i went by it and was convinced it was an old 70s announcement that they had kept... wasnt far off
I remember his other recorded announcement at Embankment where for years the loop was out of sync, and what we heard was " 'and clear of the doors. St"
It's not often a Jago Hazzard video gives me goosebumps, but the phrase "avoid something else that's underground with you" is oddly terrifying.
That reminds me. I really must go and watch the film "Tremors" again. It's been a couple years.
@@Orion40000 Quatermass and the pit is more apposite.
@@Orion40000Superb film. Me too. Where's that dvd gone?
I find the old recording of "Mind the Gap" comforting, too, and I've never met the man.
He passed through the gap between being alive and being dead
I have a "fun" story related to this, where "The gap" simply wasn't wide enough...
You're almost certainly aware that between Moor Park until just after Wembley Park, the Metropolitan line has an extra set of tracks that allow for the "Fast" and "Semi-Fast" services that don't stop at all stations. Unlike most of the stations on that stretch, Wembley Park actually has platforms for that set of tracks. This is to allow the trains to stop on high-capacity days such as when there is a football match or a concert on.
So far so good. But what it *does* mean is that when not stopping, trains would rattle through the station - inches away from that platform - at 62MPH. And that's also fine - after all, trains do that all over the country all the time for non-stopping services.
At the time of this incid...sorry, *story*, the Met was still running the old A-Class stock. This was before the refurbishment, and they were really showing their age. There were /at least/ two consists at the time that were notorious for sideways rocking at speed (presumably as the wheels rolled up and down the face of the tracks in bends). I'm told it was a failure in the dampers, but take that with a pinch of salt because I think they were letting the wheels wear more than they should, knowing that they were about to go into the modernisation program anyway. But I'm not an insider.
Long story short, one of these monsters came rattling up to Wembley Park, rocking like a pendulum. And the timing was such that it leaned left at the precise second it was passing the end of the platform. It dug into the access ramp, hit the end of the cast concrete structure, and showered the entire platform with dust and lumps of concrete, some of which were large enough that - had someone been on that platform - they would have been spraying that person off the adjacent canopies with a jetwash.
It was a miracle that the train didn't derail and hit the train that was sitting at the adjacent platform. I have no idea what happened to the defective unit afterward, as the driver who told me about it refused to elaborate further.
Often after a busy trip all around London the phrase "Mind the Gap" has been almost on a loop in the back of one's mind.
That and "See it, Say it, Sorted"
I once did not mind the gap on the roman subway, and my full weight was caught by my knee being wider than it. My whole leg looked black and blue for a month. Many made fun of me upon returning for doing the one thing that we are endlessly reminded not to. It's a simultaneous badge of honor and shame.
I remember travelling on the Roman subway. When the train went under Hadrian's wall into Scotland the stations were blocked off or was that Berlin, I can never remember.
@@simonwinter8839 I think she means the underground railway system in Rome, Italy.
I do not believe the ancient Roman Empire had any type of rail network (but happy to be proved wrong).
@@JohnyG29 No kidding !!
@leteethgirl8778 nice profile picture! Did you draw it?
Is there a name for such injury? Tube leg? lol
I live in the USA, I only visit London once a year but love this channel and the voice. I like riding the tube system, it gets you all over, the station have character, the train stations are old historical places....I love visiting UK, i look forward to going in a few weeks,, such a cool city w/friendly people.
Fun fact about the NY subway: the letter and number trains are different sizes and have a different number of doors. This was because they were two different companies and one made tighter turns with smaller cars, resulting in those stations having similar gaps and even moving train platforms
@@godlugner5327Supposedly August Belmont had his Interborough system deliberately designed so that it's clearances were too small for railroad rolling stock since joint operation of commuter trains over rapid-transit trackage was a thing back then (Long Island RR trains once accessed BMT elevated trackage to reach Manhattan, though their cars were of a similar size back then. Also North Shore interurban trains entered Chicago el trackage to reach downtown terminals). This would have been early in the 20th century.
IRT cars can operate over the trackage of the larger BMT and IND lines, and I've been on at least one fantrip where a train of IRT rolling stock traveled on BMT/IND lines. Boarding and alighting had to be supervised closely owing to the gap (an 8'10"/2.69m wide car platforming where 10'/3.04m wide cars normally run).
Only limitation was the stop arms on the BMT/IND signals being on the opposite side of those on the IRT, which meant snagging the IRT trip cocks at their trailing ends during low-speed operation through yards and terninal trackage (since there was no delay on stop-arms rising up once the train exits a block, unlike on main lines)
In his novel "Neverwhere," Neil Gaiman imagined that the fantastical denizens of "London Below" had to mind the gap else tentacled monsters would grab them. There also actually were shepherds at Shepherds Bush.
The original tube trains had end doors only, which minimises the gaps.
Yes, I was going to mention this point... although of course if the rails were on the outside of the curve, then there would be a gap at the car ends. Having said that, staff members were stationed on the trains to open the gates and I assume they would give a verbal warning of the gap directly to passengers getting on and off.
Whato all
That, of course, depends on which way the curve went. The middle of the coach sometimes is the nearest the platform.
Changes to stock can change issues at curved stations. A more extreme example was in New York City, where the City Hall station was abandonned, partially, because the new rolling stock meant that this curved loop platform gave unacceptable gaps. There are a couple of stations there that actually have "gap-fillers" extend from the platforms when a train stops.
@@Mark.Andrew.Pardoe’What Ho!’
Technically, it’s that they had shorter carriages. Short lines/chords match a curve better than longer lines/chords.
5:00 That shot where the two different train types come into view one after the other as you discussed them was just perfect
I'm just picturing Jago standing at the station for hours waiting for this to happen(!)
6 hours later
Just about to say this. *Chef's kiss*
On the mainline, we often hear “why can’t we have level boarding at platforms?”. The answer is “kinetic envelope”. This is the maximum space taken up by the largest trains to use a section of line travelling at linespeed. At my local station, not only is the platform slightly curved, it also has to be at a height and distance to be able to not foul the gauge of a Pendolino travelling at 100mph or a train hauling square ISO containers at 75mph, as well as the stopping traffic. Even on a straight line, trains wobble and sway as their wheels hunt and the suspension compensates. If the platforms had level boarding for a Class 385, a Pendolino at speed may foul it.
Merseyrail can get away with it to some extent as its fleet is captive and its network never hosts outside stock, but even then, they still had to develop the boarding ramps with Stadler because the platforms still need to allow track recording and maintenance stock to pass safely. Where platforms have been raised to provide level boarding, that stock now has to travel at reduced speed.
Same goes for Heathrow (mainline), where boarding was almost seamless with the older stock (I haven’t used the newer Electrostars or Aventras) and every train stops at every station, so is always travelling at less than linespeed anyway.
The problem is made worse in some areas, such as my local station, by trains with 2/3 & 1/3 doors, meaning the doors are closer to the widest part of the gap. Our newer trains have longer carriages than the older BR stock to, making it worse again. Also, the southbound platform (on the outside of the curve) has a very high cant rate (thanks to the 100mph linespeed), meaning the train is also leaning away from you. Must be a nightmare with luggage or small children and I doubt even Stadlers boarding ramps would overcome it.
Badbob knows a lot about trains.
This guy trains.
Thank you for that explaination. I'd not thought about high speed trains wobbling and catching the platform.
The original announcement near the end brought tears to my eyes!
Been such a long time since I was last in a Tube. Fond memories!
Sometimes we are happy and don’t even notice.
Profound and true, bought a tear to my eyes, who’d have thought I’d miss commuting on the tube so much…
When I was a young lad living in Woodford in the 60's, I quickly noticed how I stepped down onto the train at Woodford and other Overground stations, whilst we stepped up to the train at below surface stations.
3:42 Aha! The lesser spotted blue signal, not widely seen outside of LU, although they have existed on BR lines and are widespread overseas.
Is that another techie video for us Jago?
"But tube carriages are not curved, unless something has gone _very_ wrong" made me giggle.
This really made me laugh, thinking back to the retiling at Piccadilly Circus.
Few people realise that tiling round curves, while going right over is impossible, so tiles of hundreds of different sizes were manufactured. The tilers had computer generated CAD drawings and plenty of headaches.
At the top, a gap was left for the lighting tracks, accurate to 1mm by the use of profiles.
While the tilers were all patting themselves on the back, the lighting engineers came along and explained that their were no such thing as curved light fittings, let alone curved fluorescent tubes.
At a cost of tens of thousands, 4 rows of tiles were cut out and replaced to create a series of 8 foot straight lines.
Several years of planning and tile manufacture, but no one had even thought about it until the first platform was completed.
@@wilsjane Funny enough, had they built it in the 2020s, they wouldn't have had to rip-and-replace a thing. Curved and other arbitrarily shaped lighting is _trivial_ with LED technology...
I don't think I've ever had to step up out of a carriage onto a platform. That would really be unexpected, and quite likely painful.
The story of Oswald Lawrence is quite touching. I think I've come across it here before, either on channel or in the comments. For some reason I seem to remember the recording of him almost being lost for ever but retrieved by a stroke of good fortune. I could be wrong, but it's touching anyway. Makes the Underground more human.
It felt weird, it's like that on the northern part of the bakerloo line beyond Queen's park
0:25 idk why but me hearing him say "mind the gap between the platform and the train" just hurts my ears when it was meant to be "mind the gap between the train and the platform". what you have said right there is an abomination of a sentence
fr it’s like saying “chips and fish”
Its been 30 years now since my half decade sojourn in old Blighty. But, by the conclusion of each Jago Hazzard video, I'm filled with affectionate memories of the place. Today, I could almost feel the rush of warm air that precedes each tube train's arrival and smell the acrid reek of hot brake shoes when they do. Nice to know that certain certainties keep rumbling along in the Land of Hope and Glory, despite trying times.
Warm draught! Depends where one is boarding, northbound Northern Line up to Clapham North is a cold one in winter. At the island platform stations the direction of the approaching train announces itself, cold air all the way from Morden.
Jago, One thing I learnt yesterday is the London Underground has its very own subspecies of mosquito, "Culex pipiens molestus". Lots written on the 'net, including the Museum of Natural History and Smithsonian but nothing by Jago Hazard
I'm sure it's on Jago's list
I thought there were separate subspecies on the Bakerloo, Central and Victoria lines, and Oxford Circus is where they interbreed
There is an interesting warning to passengers of the sideways pendulum motion of trains stopping at stations on curved sections of track. The line is that of Vohvinkel - Oberbarmen monorail system in Wuppertal “die Schwebebahn” which is a true monorail - there is only one rail and the trains have double flanged wheels to keep them on the rail. The swinging motion is quite slow and unnoticed when on board except when boarding or alighting. I travelled on the older 1972 stock trains back in 2011, fantastisch.
I have been on that line a number of times and always found the swining very conspicuous.
I like the phrase "Mind the gap". It's short and to the point. Here in Madrid the announcement is "Al salir, tengan cuidado para no introducir el pie entre coche y andén", which translates as, "When leaving, be careful not to introduce your foot between the car and the platform." Not as snappy!
It's probably said in the same time it takes us to say "Mind the gap"! 😆
@@darrenbertram7289 Yep, was going to add "they probably say it really fast and all in one word, though!"
@@darrenbertram7289 haha. I know what you mean, but no. It takes 6.5 seconds. I timed it!
@@Nilguiri 😆😆
@@Nilguiri That's the beauty of a romantic language. Why use 3 words when 13 will do. ! 😀
Mind the gap because it’s Hazzard’ous
🤣🤣🤣
Because Hazzard Does?
I'll get my coat.
I'm glad you bought up the old "Mind The Gap" again, I think they should revert it back on every station, it's a wholesome tail
Yes they should. Absolutely. That voice defines the underground. Its the best "mind the gap".
@@simontay4851 how could we go about making it happen? we need to get rid of the modern ones they have no character
If I don’t misremember, I believe it was Neil Gaiman who elaborated on Why one should “mind the gap” in his novel “Neverwhere”.
The gap is some sort of monster prowling through the tube network.
Yes, but you need to be part of London Below to experience that…
That's what I'm often thinking whenever the phrase comes up. And as I can't be sure that I'm still in London Above I'll definitely mind the gap A LOT. Well done, Neil, once more!
On a recent trip to London we found ourselves at the Northern Line northbound platform at Embankment where we listened out for Oswald's announcement. My son was amazed by the tale of his widow's sadness. Lovely video, Jago. Mind the Gap!!!
"Mind the fast moving trains and don't stumble drunkenly into them" - I am considerably amazed that there aren't many instances of this type of horror happening, but I guess in general, most people do have a sense of potential danger and even when signifantly inebriated, like one Pete Townshend, who wrote "I staggered back to the underground and the breeze blew back my hair, I remember throwin' punches around And preachin' from my chair"
I'm imagining the breeze is the air pushed forward from the arriving train and I can imagine one Pete shaped fellow stumbling backwards, rather than forwards, thereby surviving what would surely be a career ending incident. I'm sure he minded the gap too.
Then again, Shepards Bush Station is known for a considerable movement of air down the escalators. Very considerable in fact! - and I'm assuming this station, because, well, "home" for Pete and recording studios there too! (at the time the words were written)
There's probably a video here that connects music and lyrics and trains in London, but I appreciate that isn't your niche. I'll stop now. Thanks for the great content! ⭐
@@MaD_fXthere’s CCTV footage of many near-misses too, where people fall down but get back up in time. They understandably don’t share the ones that weren’t missed…
We should perhaps remember here the fate of Graham Bond (1932-8th May 1974) the 'Graham Bond Organisation' line-up was Jack Bruce, Ginger Baker and Dick Heckstall-Smith who collectively left some great music. Sadly, Bond left this world aged 36yrs, at Finsbury Park, under the wheels of a northbound Piccadilly Line train. Next year it will be 50 years since that fateful day, fans ought to gather on the 50th anniversary and play the track 'Train Time', the short version (2.24) from the band's 'The Sound of 65' album (Jack Bruce sings lead vocals).
@@stashedawayman1521also Rod d'Ath, who I believe slipped and fell while running for a train, suffering life changing injuries.
Jack took Graham's death particularly hard, he told me. A sad day for British music.
You'd be surprised how many "one under" BTP respond to weekly.
Born and raised in London and the gap still terrifies me...I wish we'd have doors at all stations like on the nicer half of the Jubilee line
Yeah I’ve heard horrible stories from people but I’m not too scared of it because as long as I’m not stupid it doesn’t pose too much of a risk. People who struggle with walking or are older however i feel sorry for especially with how short the dwell time can be
we didn't have problems in the 60s so why are people crying now, welcome to 2023 society
@@petersmith4455 It could be that many of us from the 60s and before, are now looking at walkers and knee replacements and the like (to say nothing of depends), and worry about that ruddy big space at our feet.
@@petersmith4455if 2023 society involves advocating for equal access for anybody who wants to travel independently, count me in. Your narrow view that ignores societal and media changes probably says more about you.
Kings Cross metropolitan/circle line is TERRIFYING during rush hours because of crowds - absolutely a candidate for those great platform doors.
Another Jago Masterpiece. Please reassure me that the 'humps' on platforms for less able travellers are in the same relative location on any given Tube Line (I accept that there can be differences between Tube Lines).
Some other cities have trains with mechanical ‘gap fillers’ which automatically come out when the train stops. It would be good to see these introduced in London, especially where rebuilding the platform wouldn’t be viable.
The issue is, and it would be a huge negative for London, the increased arrival and departure times that these mechanical features bring when retrofitted.
@@richardwillson101 There isn’t any increased time delay for modern features like this - they deploy more quickly than the doors open.
@@richardwillson101
Passengers would board and alight faster. The S stock should have had this feature.
Most modern trains in Switzerland do this, no gap to mind on the Bern S-Bahn, as the trains fill them in. One of my favourite things about Switzerland which I think should come to the UK
There are such platforms in certain stations in New York City.
Really hope that dude running for his train at 4:17 made it
Same
Some years ago while I had the good fortune to get a work posting to Berlin. My German colleagues were eager to wine and dine me due to their fascination with British culture. Over lunch one of the bosses asked me 'What is this Gap on your Underground?' and I replied its the gap, you know, on the platform with the train, and he repeated, 'yes, but what is a gap?'
It turned out that the equivalent of Gap in German is Lucke which means crevice or fissure. So they just couldnt understand why there were announcements warning of a crevice or fissure!
Loved this one, I actually know someone who 'didn't' mind the gap and ended up with a very sore shin and a lifetime of trying to live it down. But we won't let her 😂
Sadly, when I hear "mind the gap" I look down - and then smack my head on the door opening of the door as I get off the tube. Every damn time, I never learn!
Every time I get off at embankment the announcement makes me smile. While tfl is a behemoth and often mismanaged; There are some wonderful decent people who work for it and make it an asset to the city no matter what politicians etc do.
I imagine that the original rolling stock was considerably shorter than the modern and the train would have conformed more closely with the platforms.
The original tube stock had end doors only.
*endors only
@@theextremeanimator4721 Much endorsement for middle doors.
**ewoks intensify**
"Mind the gap" always reminds me of the cannibals at Russell Square in the film Death Line. "Mind the gap" was the only phrase that the cannibals could say.
Ah yes an interesting feature on the Piccadilly Line.
The old Aldwych station was used as the “Russell Sq” station in that film.
But “Mind the falling bodies” from trains around Aldgate ( on the sub surface line) investigated by Mr Sherlock Holmes in the Bruce Partington Affair.
It was "MIND THE DOORS", but yeah, that movie freaked me out as a kid.
@@kron520 I'm sorry I misremembered it, but I will just claim old age as an excuse. About a year after I saw the film I was sent to a course in Greenford, and my employers booked the Russell hotel for me. I always made sure I wasn't the last off the platform when coming back to the hotel!
Which in turn reminds me of the Goon Show episode "The Scarlet Capsule", where workmen digging a hole find a 30' long red cyclinder from which can be heard the word "Minador". It turns out that the capsule is a Tube train that's been shunted into a siding and forgotten and "Minador" is in fact "Mind the doors"....
Can't hear the tannoy announcement without thinking about that film
It’s pretty good to know they cared about level boarding from the very beginning. It also helps make sense of how the Glasgow Subway trains are so level with the platforms, because they have very specific bespoke dimensions. Not that I’ve had many reasons to use it, regrettably, as only a few stations have lifts. But when I can it is actually much nicer than all the ramps with the citywide “low level” trains.
I'm rather surprised that the Underground doesn't have more in the way of the mechanical gap-fillers found at some New York subway stations- in which the platform (or at least the bits near the trains' doors) will come out to meet the train. They would add expense, of course, but there would be definite benefits where safety and convenience are concerned.
I can't imagine what Gap must have paid for this promotion.
Some overground stations, despite not being subject to the limitations of the underground, have worse gaps. Theale station in Berkshire has a massive vertical AND horizontal gap on the Eastbound platform. How do wheelchairs manage? They don't because there is only Footbridge access to both platforms.
Platform doors require massively more space than most stations have available. They’re not a bad idea necessarily, but they’re not an immediate solution and they have a lot of their own engineering problems.
Platform edge doors only require about 10 centimeters of space at the edge of the platform - space that nobody uses anyway, except when getting on and off the train. The issue is not one of lack of space, but rather one of cost.
@@wasmic5z the platform edge doors in places like Tokyo use up far more space than that. I'm not sure why; maybe to give survival space for any passenger caught between closing train doors and closing platform doors.
Even in places like Hong Kong, the structure of the parts that hold the sliding doors are far wider than 10cm; probably more like 30cm.
Merseyrails new stock has gotten rid of both height and distance from the train gap issue
Have you seen videos on The New York Subway? Some of their stations bend ridiculously, but they have a mechanism that slides out of the platform when the train stops, and retracts before it moves off again, to connect to the doors where the gap is most prominent.
I once saw an interview with a New York cop talking about how he once dealt with an incident where a woman fell into the gap - without going into too much detail, it was pretty harrowing.
Those things are ancient and have a habit of getting stuck and ruining the Lexington Avenue line for hours :(
This definitively is a German issue in the general railway network. European railway platforms are generally lower (and one might consider them to be too low) than what one see in the UK, being standardised at a height of either at 550 or 760 mm. On a federal level, platforms are built to be 760 mm tall (with the added advantage), though many states (still) use 550 mm platforms (particularly common on branches and lesser mainlines) and thus you quite often see trains with mismatched platforms (on top of that, some stations have even lower platforms but these merely await renovations).
On top of that, many S-Bahn systems use trains which are optimised for 960 mm tall platforms (i.e. they're stepless high-floor) which exist because they don't serve freight trains (though regional trains still can pass them), so you often have to step up on mixed-traffic tracks, though even on dedicated platforms, one still need to take care of a horizontal gap even on straight platforms. One notable instance I can think of is Frankfurt-Niederrad which has platforms for both S-Bahn and regional trains but due to constructions on that line, some regional trains are redirected to the S-Bahn platforms. Just hope an RE3 train doesn't get redirected because these provide stepless entries for 550 mm platforms.
Regarding U-Bahns, I only have been the one in Berlin so far and as far as I know, you're warned to mind the gap either in Wittenbergplatz or Nollendorfplatz but in general has small, insignificant gaps.
Frankfurt is a semi-example as its isn't fully grade separated but it too provides stepless entries and insignificant gaps in all stations but three: Niddapark, which awaits renovations for a connection to a planned S-Bahn stop, Musterschule, which is on the street-running section (with a hump for stepless entires) and Glauburgstraße, same reason as before. All three of them happened when most stations were built with lower platforms in general and these are the most troublesome ones to retrofit.
When he 3 years old my brother failed to mind the gap and dropped completely through he dislocated his elbow but nobody noticed until some years later when teachers couldn't get him to write properly and to this day dispite several surgeries he is unable to completely straighten that arm
Unrelated to this video, today I received "Rail Atlas London" in the mail, so perhaps I can finally have a bit of an idea what areas you're talking about. And indeed, this channel is the main reason why I ordered that book.
Thank for mentioning visually impairment people like my myself as the can be less obvious if you dont use a cane or have a guide dog. Trains and platforms in general arent well designed for disabled people. Level board trains need more everywhere.
6:32 Awww that’s sweet of them to do so.
That consideration is what I think of as part of the true English character.
One of the best ever. The Gap and curved stations have always confused me, until now. My Thanks to Jago and all the people who asked for this.
Pleased that I was between mouthfuls of coffee for “you are the announcement to my trip hazard”.
I think I would have aspirated.
Hazards (sic) on the underground. I am reminded by this of my first trip on the undergound in the early 1970's. I think it was the bakerloo line, but whatever, it was a deep line (small carriage) and they still used incandescant bulbs for lighting. Being a tall person, I managed to burn my head on one of these.
Mind... the lights.
That happened to me - also on the Bakerloo Line - in the 1980s, because of severe overcrowding. I was simply pushed into the bulb and nearly had to start a fight to get my head away from it again.
With London Underground trains lasting for at least 20 years in service from their initial delivery as-new I have never understood why level boarding on any particular tube line cant be implemented over that kind of timescale. Surely LUL can get a few stations a year "levelled up" every year, so that by the time the next batch of trains is delivered all of the platforms are the same height for the train. The same applies on National Rail as well, where, again, rolling stock is in service for at least 20 years. I think the excuse of it costing alot to resurface a platform is a poor one given the obvious safety and accessibility benefits it would bring.
It depends on the station - as Jago mentioned, the stations between Rayner's Lane and Uxbridge, and on the Bakerloo/Overground between Queen's Park and Harrow & Wealdstone get both deep Tube (small) trains and full-sized trains using the same platforms, so the platforms can't be the correct height for both.
Another uplifting tale, Jago! You are really on the level..
The narration and video timing in the clip at 4:55 is just perfection 👌
The gap has killed people, as has poor platform edge markings.
Out of curiosity, has it ever been measured where the largest gap between train & platform on the network is? That shot of the curved Central Line at Bank looks remarkably gappy.
I'm pretty sure that gap at Bank is the widest... I've often almost leapt on and off trains there!
That Quebec French profanity (starts with T, look it up) heard in the Underground last month was me trying to alight from a deep level carriage where the gap was 20 cm high and 20 cm wide. 😱😅
I had to bend down (I’m 6’4”) and jump out and down simultaneously and avoiding crashing into someone trying to get in…
I’ll be dreaming about it for a while…
“Mind the chasm” surely!
(Seriously I loved my trip!❤🇬🇧)
You should look at Calgary‘s Light Rail Transit (LRT) more commonly known as the C-train
And yes, I’m a little biased because I live in Calgary but I think would be interesting to compare London against
For some reason im watching a video about platform gaps. It must be the occasional injection of sarcastic humour that got me. Anyway im now subscribed and I'll try to keep up.😂
"Both in the comment section... and in real life"? Huhh? When real people are talking about real things here in the comment section, this IS real life. Just because something's not in person doesn't mean it's "not in real life." And just because something _is_ in person doesn't mean it _is_ in real life (live theater, etc.).
I just thought the humps in the platform were just due to subsidence. Now I know it is to provide a level boarding area, you live you learn, Thanks Jago.
When visiting Sydney at the time of the 2000 Paralympics I managed to go hip deep when I didn't mind the gap between the train and the platform at Redfern station. No harm done but it scared the hell out of my young sons.
I noticed the "See it. Say it. Sorted" safety campaign during my first trip to London earlier this month. It reminded me of New York's "See Something. Say Something." post-9/11 slogan. A video about the transit slogans and sayings would probably be interesting -- but I'm not a researcher.
For some odd reason, French people using the tube seem to be particularly irritated with Oswald Lawrence's accent and enunciation, and have a strong urge to imitate and exaggerate his stentorian tones with a terrible Gallic version of his accent.
I've noticed French tourists do this on a number of occasions.
Something about Oswald Lawrence's tones seems to trigger this urge.
"Mind the gap between reality and your expectations." Wise words from "I'm Sorry I Haven't A Clue"
The question is not why is there a gap, it is why are there not more stations with Platform Screen Doors? Of course the answer money. I think of them the same as elevator or lift doors; can you imagine buildings without them? You might be on the 10th or higher floor and be able to fall into the shaft. Well, maybe a bit extreme but you get the idea.
When in London I am allways reminded about the gap between my ambitions and my abilities. And to mind it.
For a man who grew up in the Moscow underground, platform sharing is a completely alien concept for me.
Maybe have a look at Baker Street on the metropolitan. They introduced lights in the gap. But the tail end of platform 2 is a bit scary
The gap at Bank Station is a shocker. I always forget just how big it is. You almost have to leap off.
In New York, they tell us to "watch the gap." I have done so quite a bit, but the gap never does anything.
Mind The Gap is widely used on various Australian State based railways too.
I will not knock the mind the gap warnings because im one of the few people who has fallen into a gap. When i used to commute into london decades ago i used to have to change at London Bridge railway station .One day i simply my foot missed the train while entering and went into the gap and i started to fall into the gap (some ARE dangerously wide) as i was falling i found myself being yanked out by a man grabbing me by the shoulders. My minimal journey afterwards i was kind of shocked and felt fragile all day knowing that i could have ended up seriously injured or dead
That must have been a terrifying moment. I know of someone who also fell down the gap and lived to tell the tale.
@@eattherich9215 I appreciate your concern. tbh I felt like crying most of the day. It all happened too quick to be scary at the time but I did feel like I was being sucked down onto the rails. The train had stopped so obviously that was something psychological. Not a nice experience. I was too stunned to even thank the guy who pulled me up. If by some one in a zillion chance that guy is reading this. Thank you
I FINALLY GOT IT RIGHT!!! Well, almost. I guessed "You are the announcement to my gap."
I'm quite proud of myself now, lol!
I still chuckle at the memory, from the early days of the interwebs, of a website giving 'tourist information' for Americans in London. Along with black cab drivers expecting you to haggle over the fare was the 'fact' that a 'Gap' was a particularly vicious and venomous rodent that had evolved in the tunnels.
The late great Gerard Hoffnung, back in the 1950s, offered tourist guide advice such as "Have you tried the famous echo in the reading room of the British Library?"
@@jaakkomantyjarvi7515 It's all a bit Monty Python 'Hungarian Phrase Book' isn't it? My hovercraft is full of eels.
"vicious and venomous rodent" - I've seen mice on the tracks while waiting in the late evening at Waterloo station for the tube to Queens Park, do they count?
@@kiwitrainguy All vicious and venomous rodents count. I'm wondering if Rupert, my bird-table rat, is vicious and venomous. I hope not.
Hey Jago, can you find out about the ads behind the train, above the tracks? Who changes them, how often and when do they do it. I look at them in all of your videos and wonder. Thanks. Love your voice and channel 💜
Interestingly the worst gaps I’ve experienced have been on mainline rail services. I’ve had to be helped off by the guard on occasion. I’ve had to throw my suitcase off first so I could jump down. It’s been both height and width ☹️
The gaps on tube trains are nowhere near as bad. I wonder why mainline trains don’t say the announcement?
On some UK main line trains you DO get the announcement. IIRC the wording used is “when leaving the train, please make sure you have all personal belongings with you and mind the gap between the train and the platform edge”.
I live in Tunbridge Wells and our main station has a quite large gap in places. I'm fairly certain that we have aural and visual warnings
I heard the "mind the gap" announcement by Mr. Laurence, it's rather authoritative or stern sounding. Good video
The year was 2000, and me a new traveller on the London Underground encountered my first "MIND THE GAP" shouted in the best RSM Parade Ground sound level.
here in Copenhagen, when we got new S-trains in 2000, they were built as low as possible to be in line with the platforms, and wherever possible, the platforms were modified to match the level of the train so there's very little height difference, or the track was relaid lower on the really old protected stations where they can't change the platforms. But the trains also have half-length cars, which was chosen so they can go faster through the fairly tight curves that are unavoidable on a 140 year old network, but it incidentially also means there's less of a gap on curved platforms
How about adding some retractable platform under the doors of the wagon?
If London still had its Roman plan all the cut and cover lines would be nice and straight.
I like trains
The Bank gap is cavernous, but some of the mainline stations I've been to would put Mount Everest to shame! Looking at you, Raynes Park.
Platform 17 at Clapham Junction enters the picture
Yes a few carriages at Bank (or Bonkument station as I call it) the gap is quite large. Forcing you to do a Can-can style movement when alighting 😮
Do you mean Manument/Bonk?
It's a common misconception that the phrase 'mind the gap' was used as a meaningless mantra by the Cannibal in the 1972 horror movie DEATH LINE. In fact he said 'mind the doors'.
I was hoping, at the end, that you might say: "You are the mind to my gap"! Either way the announcement at Embankment is so nostalgic. I'm glad they kept it.
Being a New Englander, I have to say, you never hear that expression here. Most signs would advise people to Watch Your Step, or CAUTION. I also noticed at around 4:29, an old illustration says EXIT, not Way Out as is common today. If they said Way Out over here, people might assume one was orbiting Pluto! As Churchill said Two countries divided by a common language, or something to that effect.
‘Way out’ and ‘Exit’ have different meanings on the Underground. An exit is a boundary of a station where the ticket barrier concourse meets the pavement, shopping arcade, other transport system etc. A way out is a route to an exit.
Physical gaps are caused by funding gaps too. Glad the Piccadilly Line is being modernised! Serving Heathrow, King's Cross & the West End, it still sees a lot of passengers - despite the success of the Elizabeth line.
Even in the 1960s on heavy rail 'up north' I remember many stations possessing low platforms from the footboard days; often the platform had half and half high and low platforms.
Jago, you've spoken about the tunnelling shield that was thought up to make it safer for the workmen. Is there any way you could do a video on how it worked?
On the Swedish rail network, on trains with level boarding, there are announcements for us to mind our gaps too, but in Swedish we don’t have the concise three word phrase but rather “Tänk på avståndet mellan vagn och plattform när du stiger av.” I think that phrase is used in the Stockholm TuB too.
Yes, the official abbreviation for Tunnelbana is TuB, so many Stockholmers say “tuben” (“the tube”) about it, rather than “trikken” as they did when it replaced the trams starting in 1950. And just as a bonus, the official abbreviation for a tunnel train driver is TuTf. 😁
If we're talking wordy ones, I was once on an Austrian train which announced "Im Interesse ihrer eigenen und der Sicherheit anderer Fahrgäste bitte beachten Sie beim Aussteigen den Niveauunterschied zwischen Zug und Bahnsteig" followed by a simple "mind the gap"
In German we also have "Bitte achten Sie beim Aussteigen auf den Abstand zwischen Zug und Bahnsteig" (Please pay attention to the gap between the train and the platform when leaving the train)
This is one of good things when you don't know Swedish, but have common sense. Then you may not care about mumbling from speakers in whatever language. Simply look where you stepping.
Tänk på gapet?
@@drzander3378 😂
Thanks again Jago. The most famous "Gap" is at Embankment where the what is the Charing Cross Branch of the Northern Line was originally built as a loop under the River Thames prior to the extension to Kennington and onwards to Morden.
For someone like me who comes from Switzerland, hearing this announcement was quite funny. Our stations are sometimes so low, you have to take a knee high step to enter a train and nobody will point it out we're expected to watch out ourselves. But they're improving with new rolling stock and adjusting platform heights.
The interior advert at the end just reminded me of the 1980's adverts for 'Brook Street'?, a recruitment agency, they were commonly in two halves, with 'normal girl?', in sn office on one side & 'Brook Street girl' in a more plush office on the other. Funny how your mind works...
The comparison was with "sloppy girl". I doubt very much that such an advert would be accepted today. 😺 For that matter, is there still such a thing as a "temp"? There are agency workers, of course, but how many of them are still secretaries?
What Gap?...Ahaaaaaaaaaaaaa
0:21 I'd contest "See it, say it, sorted" comes very close, mostly because people get annoyed that it's not 'sort it'
0:28 Between the "train and the platform", I think is the way that it goes. :)
I always wondered why they couldn’t have variable-height suspension on these trains, so they could move up/down depending on the platform. Would be expensive but so would altering the platforms every time new stock comes along!