Airspace Chaos | Ozark Airlines Flight 965
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- Опубликовано: 5 июл 2023
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Ozark Air Lines Flight 965 was a scheduled commercial flight from Chicago, Illinois, to Lambert Field in St. Louis, Missouri, with a scheduled intermediate stopover at Greater Peoria Regional Airport in Peoria, Illinois. On March 27, 1968, the Douglas DC-9-15 jetliner operating the flight, carrying 44 passengers and five crew, collided in mid-air with a single-engined Cessna 150F while both aircraft were on approach to the same runway at Lambert Field. The DC-9 landed safely with no injuries to any of its 49 occupants, while both pilots in the two-person Cessna died in the collision and subsequent ground impact.
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• Beautiful Piano & Guit...
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The DC-9 must have been an absolute tank to survive that and land safely.
With 52,000 hours of flight experience on the DC-9, I'm betting DC-9. (Also, I love the lines of the DC-9: whatta beauty...)
-9s were tanks, absolutely
@@davidadcock8717 maybe the Cessna just glanced off the DC9.
@@AlexKienlen Correct. Tanks with wings.
I'll never forget George Kennedy in the movie "Airport": "Who do ya think you're talking to, some kid that fixes bicycles? I know every inch of the 707! Take the wings off this and you could use it as a TANK! This plane is built to withstand anything... except a bad pilot."
@@BillGreenAZThey just call them Patronis. 😂
N8669G was the Cessna 150 I soloed on July 10, 1967, at Pro Flight Air in Springfield Missouri, about 8 months before. RIP to the ones who lost their lives.
The DC 9 sustained light damage to the right wing and a wing flap, with paint smears consistent with contact with the Cessna's propeller and wing.
It’s always a Cessna!
@@desdicadoricevery now and then a Piper gets tangled up,every now and then..!
Thank you for the info, I was wondering what parts of the aircraft were struck. I’m surprised Allec didn’t mention that in the video.
@@GRosa250Same. I was surprised
@@bluecoffee8414 Same here. I wonder why it wasn't mentioned?
OMG! I was a senior at McCluer High school in March of 1968 when this happened! And, as an 18 year old, I already had my Private Pilot's license that I had earned while taking flying lessons at the old St. Charles Airport. I recalled that the Cessna fell onto the parking lot of nearby the Ford car manufacturing plant. McCluer High School was located about 3 miles from the threshold of Runway 24 at Lambert Field, and when that was the active runway, planes would fly over my school at about 1,000 feet. On January 28 (or so), 1968, a Cessna 182 was on final approach to Runway 24 when it ran out of fuel. The pilot attempted to land on our football field but ended up crashing into our gymnasium, a crash that I witnessed. The pilot was killed, but as an 18 year old licensed pilot, his death taught me a valuable lesson about stretching your fuel supply. During the summer of 1969, as a 19 year old college student, I started training for my commercial license and my flight instructor rating at Interstate Airmotive. So, this accident was very personal to me. Man...
Too bad the lesson wasn't learned in this tragedy to avoid the PSA disaster in San Diego ten years later
And didn’t learn after PSA either as we had Aero Mexico Cerritos collision
You read my mind!
When I was in high school a friend was a pilot and we flew his small aircraft, I don't remember what it was, Cessna or a Piper Cub, from Burlington Iowa to St Louis but he had enough sense to not land at Lambert,he flew to a small private airport in the sticks. No traffic at the time.
I'll never understand why they mixed light aircraft traffic with big, hot, fast jets in crowded airspace. It's insane.
I agree
I remember flying Ozark to visit my dad when I was a kid. It was a short flight; it seems about the time we leveled off we were starting our descent. Sometimes, on a Friday night, I'd be the only person on-board the entire plane; often there were only a handful of other passengers. Ozark and a whole bunch of other airlines went out of business in the 80s as I recall.
That's why virtually all regional airlines are subsidiaries of major carriers. An independent like Ozark couldn't generate the revenue to keep itself afloat. It needed to expand or cease operations....it chose the latter.
@@denniswilson8013,
The race to the bottom was championed by the USA commercial airline using citizens. After the end of the CAB and the beginning of commercial passenger airline deregulation the flying public had choices to make:
1. Do I truly value the services provided by the legacy airlines enough to pay the full total costs of providing those services?
2. IF the answer is that I do not truly value those legacy airline service levels enough to fully pay for them, then am I fully prepared to deal with the inevitable end of many of those airlines ?
3. In typical USA fashion, many of those who knew there would be the end of many airlines decided to pay LARGE bribes to enough USA Congressional Representatives and Senators to create the convoluted confounding Essential Airline Service(EAS) System with lots of other people's Federal Income Tax payments. That way a few teeny tiny communities could possibly retain airline service into the future after the legacy airlines stopped providing services to teeny tiny communities. No more B727-100s going full maximum braking into really short runways at teeny tiny town community airfield, so there was the hope that they could use enough of other people's tax payments to bribe another airline to maybe try to use some slightly less costly DC-9 -10s to go full maximum braking into teeny tiny town airfield's short runway .
Eventually the other taxpayers got tired of providing ridiculously huge per seat-mile subsidies so that a small percentage of tiny teeny town residents could fly on a jetliner to Big City airfield, so EAS slowly was reduced in scope and size, except for Alaska and some parts of Hawaii.
That's one heck of a mess that STL had back in the 60s. Overworked ATC, the lack of radar was a recipe for disaster. That DC9 was a tough bird, taking a hit like that and still being able to land normally. And, aside from bringing all the passengers down safely, the cockpit crew, with so much flying experience, was also saved.
Those captains flying for regional with 25k hours were usually WWII AAF transport or bomber pilots, sometimes with callbacks for Berlin Airlift or Korea. These pilots were still in their 40s.
This is one of the mid air collisions where one of the planes lands safely. The other one is the ExcelAire Legacy 600 makes a successful emergency landing after hitting a GOL 737-800.
Don’t forget psa 182 also hit a Cessna
@@wardogiesNeither plane survived that one. Unless you’re thinking of an earlier collision that also involved a PSA flight. That one landed safely. 182 did not.
There's also a GA incident over Colorado a couple years back--www.ntsb.gov/investigations/Pages/CEN21FA215.aspx... Hey, Allec, the final report on that is out, go ahead and put it in your list of incidents to cover at some point. Prime witness was a guy on his first solo.
What about the 73 mid air collision at France one plane landed safely while the other one crashed killing everyone one on board
There was another one in 2015. A Boeing 737-800 collided with British Aerospace 125. The 737 landed safely, but the Aerospace crashed unfortunately. The Aerospace was struck on its fuselage which resulted in cabin depressurization that incapacitated all the occupants on board. The plane kept flying until it ran out of fuel and crashed into the Atlantic Ocean. Until now the wreckage of the Aerospace hasn’t been found….
As somebody from the area, I'm trying to make sense of the locations in the description of the accident. The Cessna said it was over St. Charles which is due west of Lambert Airport. The collision happened 1.5 miles north of the airport, which would have been in Florissant of Hazelwood.
Sounds like the person was confused about where they were
True, I was also confused about that. I'm also from the area
Those were the days before GPS and ADSB when you didn’t really know where you were. You often had to guess, and low hour pilots weren’t that good at it.
As I understood it, the c150 reported in and was expecting a right downwind for 17. If he was west of the field I would expect him to turn left at the appropriate time to join the right downwind for 17 which would then take him northbound. I fail to see the confusion about the location here. What am I missing?
The Cessna reported over St. Charles and was cleared to enter a right downwind for Runway 17. The DC-9 was approaching from the north for the ILS approach to Runway 12R. Both aircraft were northwest of the airport. The DC-9 was cleared to land Runway 17 so they made a left turn for a right-base entry to Runway 17. The Cessna never entered the downwind and flew straight across the final approach course of Runway 17. Both aircraft were flying eastbound, and the DC-9 started to make the right base-to-final turn for Runway 17. The Cessna was flying on the north side of the airport but should have been on the west side of the airport on a right downwind for Runway 17. The controller had a vague idea of what was happening and warned the DC-9 crew of the Cessna on their right side. The controller also attempted to get the Cessna out of the way by telling it to fly straight through the final approach course eastbound and then reenter the pattern using a left base entry to Runway 17. The DC-9 crew failed to see the Cessna even though it should have been visible to them as they were still turning right to line up with Runway 17. The Cessna would not have been able to see the DC-9. The DC-9 pilots saw the Cessna after it was too late to avoid the collision. They turned to the left briefly trying to avoid the collision, but realizing the plane was still flyable after the collision, they turned immediately back towards Runway 17 and landed.
This could have been so much worse- I kept thinking of the PSA182 crash in San Diego which came 10 years later thankfully the Ozark plane wasn't damaged (or not badly) but of course tragic that the Cessna pilots were killed. This seemed like an accident waiting to happen really with ATCs unsuccessfully juggling flights without a totally clear idea of where they were in 3D space.
Yes if the Cessna would have hit the tail section it would have been a PSA crash and right over a populated area.
I have such a great respect for ATCs and could never do what they do.
@dgriffin6074
Yes, you almost never hear about these folks until there is an accident, the amount of
mental gymnastics to keep everything in order is incredible, unsung heros of modern aviation .
Very similar to the San Diego PSA midair 1978
I had the same thought.
Not really.
I’m amazed that there weren’t a lot more accidents like this before ATC got equipment upgrades. I’m guessing there were a lot of near misses. I live on a direct line with a small airport and see many small jets and Cessna’s pass overhead. I also see some aircraft from Ft Lauderdale Int’l and Miami depending on the wind direction. ATC really have their work cut out. Skies are more crowded now than ever.
This was clearly and sadly caused by a systematic failure of the ATC system of the era. This was not the fault of the Tower controller, not even in the least.
As traffic increased at the larger airfields, incidents like this started to rise. Although safety has drastically improved since the '80s, sadly, almost every significant improvement was made *after* a fatal incident revealed the flaw(s).
Here's to those heros who gave their lives that forced those much needed improvements!
Rip to the 2 people who died❤
Ahh, the wild wild west of the earlier days of aviation...
No ADS-B, no GPWS, no ACAS… 😳
@derbagger22
When pilots actually had total control of the aircraft.
more and more traffic due to the jet age and general prosperity, coupled with suddenly outdated facilities and a military git-r-dun attitude among many aviation pros.
1968 which was like a whole different era in aviation. It was a case of see and be seen as the TCAS avoidance system was more that 10 years into the future. And the control tower was obviously understaffed and overworked. They were lucky the Cessna didn't hit the tail or there would have been a PSA 182 crash (and right over a populated area)
The PSA 182 crash involved a Boeing 727 and the impact with the Cessna damaged the leading edge of the wing resulting in a loss of hydraulic fluid and pressure making the 727 uncontrollable. The pilots knew they no longer had control of the plane as it rolled over and dived into the ground. A DC-9 doesn't use hydraulics for the flight controls. It would take a substantial amount of damage to bring down a DC-9 as the flight crew would likely still have some control.
I'm still enthralled and amazed at your videos! Great work!
I flew on Ozark Airlines quite a lot; mostly between St Louis and Dallas, and between St Louis and Philadelphia. Despite its small size compared to larger airlines it was a quality operation. I think that one needs to remember that at the time of this incident, St Louis was one of the few airports that was a hub for two airlines, TWA and Ozark. It was much busier then than it is now. There was also competition for space with the very large McDonnell Aircraft plant located at the airport.
I feel so bad for the pilots and controller. The system had been allowed to become unworkable, but I bet the Ozark pilots and controller carried guilt the rest of their lives.
As I was following the coms from the tower and the 2 aircraft, I felt that as the DC9 Pilot I would have been tempted to abort the approach and go around for another try. Easy to say as an armchair observer I know but not knowing the precise location of another smaller aircraft in the pattern and on the same approach with me would give me the willies.
It would be interesting to know what damage the DC 9 suffered...can't believe that the Cessna did not take out the DC 9's landing gear.
Probably little damage - landing gear on commercial aircraft is titanium alloy while that Cessna is nothing more than a flying tin can.
I was expecting something in the video about it, but nothing. Critical damage to the DC-9 may have been avoided by inches. It's a tinny little airplane but still a propeller can hurt.
Yeah I was kinda wondering the same thing as you. I was gonna ask if anyone knew if the landing gear was down at the time of impact. Cause I agree, you'd think it would've been ripped off or at the very least damaged.
Where did the DC 9 get hit ?
Probably the landing gear and the tires absorbed the impact.
SHEESH! The same thing happened 10 years later in San Diego with PSA Flight 182 and a Cessna. Eerie!
...checking out the New Deal era 360* mural in the rotunda of the Marine Air Terminal at LaGuardia, where the PanAm Clippers flew from...
That later became the home of the PanAm Shuttle...that took the New York Air LGA slots that Frank Lorenzo's Texas Air had to give up when they foolishly acquired Eastern Airlines. More fun facts...Harris Herman was president of the PA Shuttle and had previously worked for New York Air as a SVP. I knew him from there. NYA almost took the lease on the Marine Air Terminal around 1984.
thank you.
This could have been a repeat of PSA Flight 182 if it was just shifted a little to the side.
Oddly, both accidents are 10 years apart.
I don’t know what that music is but I’ll never hear it without thinking of airplane crashes.
Sounds like the towr people were overloaded. I feel so badly, not only for the two pilots that died, but for the flight crew of the DC 9 and the controllers involved. That type of thing stays with you, if you are at all normal.
Lovely graphics and pics.
The instructor pilot of N8669G had 380 hours of flying time. 1:30
Greenhorn!!
Wow 380 and 170 hours in the Cessna. I have a question based on that… Has the number of hours needed to qualify as an instructor pilot changed since then? Surely it has to have…
@@Notoriouskid28250 hours.
@@Notoriouskid28 Affirmative Action! Just bring your drivers license!
Instructors can have as low as 200 hrs or so.. Nothing to do with AA. They just need the required certificates and ratings. Some can do it for less.
Wow great video on that Allec I’m proud of you ✌️😉👍
?
Every single person watching this is wondering why you made no mention of the damage sustained by the Ozark aircraft..maybe do an update?
Thanks.
Also like to know the relative air speeds for both at time of impact.
Or where the cessna came down. Close to houses or businesses?
The DC-9 suffered minor damage to it's right wing and associated flap. They got lucky that day. If people have nine lives, eight of them were used up.
@@trent3872The Cessna crashed, thankfully, into an open parking lot. The plane was totaled, of course, but apparently there wasn’t other damage on the ground.
Well done !!! Beautiful video !
Very unfortunate accident. Interesting video, thank you.
Rip to the two homies on the cesna
Loved Ozark & the DC 9. My first flight, flew Oz many times. Was unfamiliar w/this incident until seeing this video.
R.J., W.C., R.W., and B.L. ...... Burt must be going nuts right now...
ATC has greatly improved since the era in which this happened. Unfortunately it sometimes took these type of accidents for people to see the inadequacy of the system of that time. I'm sure the Ozark Pilots and that Controller felt tremendous guilt over what happened.
I am surprise the Cessna didnt take out the DC-9 entirely....this could have been way worse very easily. By chance the DC-9 survived the glancing hit, Neither planes Pilots were at fault
Wow this kinda like PSA Flight 182 that collides with Cessna 172 in the mid air collision and crashed in San Diego and the passengers on both aircraft were killed and that’s the most terrible tragedy in history.
Yes as one who experienced the September 25, 19780 PSA 182 mid air collision crash first hand, I much agree.
Are you saying that was worst on what basis ?
Total dead was All on both planes + 7 on the ground - it took out like 9 homes entirely, damaged heavily 20 more in a North park San Diego neighborhood, roughly near Adams Ave @ Nile & Boundary St. At that time we had a 2nd house only a mile away from impact zone.
I was at school in El Cajon that AM & saw smoke plume from 25 miles to the East.
This event, which I was heretofore unawares of, is amazing - yet tragic - in that so few lives were lost & 1 plane landed nearly 💯% unscathed.
Most mid air crashes 90% both planes fold up & are lost, catastrophically.
Thankfully, they're rare & one can pretty much count the big ones on both hands or less.
Most were before modern equipment & ATC techniques developed that prevent such - be they runway incursions like the Linate Italy disaster, the LAX one or the penultimate runway incursion, the Tenerife KLM Dutch to Pan Am collision (taking 587 lives)
Or bad mid airs like PSA 182, the GOA Brazilian Rainforest tragedy or the very early on Grand Canyon one in 1956 (?).
In short, theres no good outcome when 2 objects try to occupy the same space at the same time.
@@psalm2forliberty577 I was at Grossmont CC that day. I remember seeing the smoke rising to the southwest, and blowing out to the ocean, because there was a Santa Ana.
@@psalm2forliberty577Well said. Yes, the United-TWA collision over the Grand Canyon was 1956. The same two airlines had a catastrophic collision four years later over /near New York City. All aboard perished in both of them.
Awesome....more old crashes please. I'd really not have to listen to Mini Air cr. to get older ones covered. Salamat Kabayan
I know it is terribly frustrating to traffic controllers - especially when they're really busy - to ask a pilot a question which requires an immediate "affirmative" or "negative" response and receive nothing but "Roger." It's like this: Tower controller, "Cessna 28452, do you see that DC-9 out there to your left that's about to fly straight up your ass!!??" Cessna 28452 pilot, "I understand." And the controller is thinking, "UNDERSTAND, HELL!! Do you see it or NOT!!??"
Excellent
Thanks I hope lessons were learned
Please keep making these videos!
I swear, if I ever hear this music as I board a plane, I will turn around and walk away
Where is the Cessna pizza..that's what we waited for Alex..
Sincerely,
Your long time subscriber..
I flew Ozark back in 1978. A twin engine Cessna what a ride into a Thunder Storm !
Nicely done as usual Mr. Ibay. I've been watching your channel for years and appreciate your thorough analysis of causality and outcome.
FYI, you are not recreating your simulations. You are simply creating them. One could say that you are recreating the situations, however. It's a minor nitpick. Keep up the great work.
Again, to me the odds of two aircaft at the same altitude converging at say 90 degree, to actually hit the same spot and so each other in uch a large space seems very low. A slower aircraft diverging in to the same path would make the odds much higher, but still .......
A tragic loss of those two pilots. They could be retired now after decades of highly successful airline careers, and saved many lives themselves. Very sad.
High wing C150 with limited visibility during maneuvering turns due to windshield pillars, door window pillars, etcetera getting into the way of seeing the other aircraft?
As long as the collision doesn't affect directly to the plane in terms of control and structure, the pilot was able to land safely.
This was just a few miles NE of my current location. I'm directly in line with the approach to 12R.
I wonder if all that guessing by the tower controller was unusual or regularly done?
Terrible performance. Someone should have been told to go around.
No mention was made regarding the outcome of the tower controller. ( I'm not assuming you had that information, Allec)
What I can't understand is in situations like this, When the pilots know that they are so close to another plane and warned . to look out for it. Why don't they break off the approach when they can't find the other plane ?
The time it takes to set pitch and power and the aircraft to react ( dc-9)
you cover ALOT of ground, close to a mile approx. the cessna yea id be on the swivel and really looking
rip cessna
everyone: [expecting replay of PSA 182]
DC-9: "What happened?"
Very sad. It's astonishing that there aren't more plane crashes. ATC is stress.
Major PSA vibes.
What would have been the difference in airspeed of the two craft at time of impact? I would have liked to know that in this vid.
The Cessna was flying at 94.5 knots on a heading of 147 degrees. The DC-9 was on a heading of 162 degrees while descending at 900fpm in a right turn. The impact angle was only 15 degrees but the DC-9 was moving faster and descended onto the Cessna.
@@nocalsteve so what would you think the speed of the DC would have been? More than twice or much less than that because of the turn?
@@jaimhaas5170 My guess would be 120-150 Knots but I don’t know and couldn’t find it in the report.
@@nocalsteve Thanks for checking.
Just like PSA 182 and Cessna 172 (aircraft) did.
My goodness
4 things: 1) Crew of DC-9 Reported, replied, and followed procedures. They stated they were looking for Cessna, but they were also in the last phase of a landing they were cleared for.
2) Crew of Cessna did not respond or report as requested. Even with heavy radio traffic, that reporting is critical. Also, they "suggested" they had the DC-9 in sight.
3) The ATC person seemed to become confused, stating "they are to your right", then "maybe to your left". He must have been truly overwhelmed in the last seconds trying to keep traffic separated..
4) Two place single engine prop plane with low time pilots mixing with jet airline traffic at a large airport is not wise, in my opinion. Not wrong, but a situation that can go bad quickly.
There was a crash in Sioux Falls, SD. The plane hit a snowplow, killing the driver and sending the plane into a spin.
Nice video as always. Please Keep the music lower at the end, at that level it is quite disturbing
Do you have a volume control? Your welcome
@@mcraft2240 very clever, I didn’t think about
Great FS2004 !!!
They only needed a few inches. RIP to the GA pilots. I can't imagine the terror the Ozark pilots felt.
Coming from a layman is 340 hrs of flying very low for an instructor pilot, or is that considered normal. The IP still seems inexperienced to me.
Yes finally my comment about putting the names of the people back into the videos has been answered
Could you tell us what part of the DC-9 was hit, and what damage it caused. Thanks.
Hoping it's not just me, but, is anyone else thinking that 380 hours is a bit light to be an instructor? I grew up around planes. My dad, who was an instructor pilot in the USAF, flew us in and out of small towerless airstrips. I'm not sure the instructor, with his 95 days of flying experience, made the best choice to attempt a landing at an overwhelmed commercial center
Wouldn’t be my first choice of airport for GA
Huh, I never heard of this one before.
PSA Flight 182 prequel…
What flight simulator do you have?
I was on this flight, it was a terrifying day
Wow what can you recall
A fellow I worked with was on this flight. He was headed to Kansas City. He continued to KC on his scheduled flight. If you fall off the horse, get back on!
How did they collide?
I am amazed none of engines got damaged by debris.
If you add some kind of audio instead of having to read these, you'll definitely get a lot more viewers. I'm not a fan of reading the subtitles myself.
I wonder if this Captain Fitch is related to Denny Fitch….?
HOLD ON...@9:57, the caption reads "Flight 965's pilots were able to spot the "Cessna on a real short final," they were unable to spot N8669G." 69G IS THE CESSNA!! How are they ABLE to spot the Cessna but UNABLE to spot 69G, THE CESSNA?!?! What am I missing?? 🤔
Could there have been two Cessnas in the area?
@jamesmelcher9355 that was my initial thought, but there's only 2 aircraft registrations/flight #'s mentioned...69G, the original Cessna, & the Ozark Air flight 965 DC-9, so I dunno. 🤔
The lucky thing dc9 nose hit Cessna not wing like PSA 182 B727 (pilot cant see small Aircraft/Plane)
Was Ozark damaged? Had to be.
What kind of physical contact took place between the two aircraft.
The much larger DC9 wacked the tiny Cessna 150 with it's lower wing surface, skipping cleanly off.
Terrible result for the ill fated Cessna but easily survivable by the tank like DC9.
@@psalm2forliberty577 thanks
No CVR from DC-9 after the collision? ATC lost situational awareness frankly. He knew it and should have waved someone off. You get so much grace if you’re not one of “those people”, he’d be crucified if he was one of them.
What a mess...
Maybe an additional controller would have helped! Just my thoughts.....
ATC Muppetry, but, an Instructor Pilot with UNDER 400hrs, is this normal?
Hello, could you recreate the Vasp 168 flight accident of 1982? It was the worst air accident in Brazil until Gol in 2006
There is a video online about this. I found it and it's good. Plus there is a CVR recording online as well
Pretty weird (and i guess lucky) that this crew just felt a bump and could land normally, while the PSA and Aeromexico flights crashed
The Ozark plane had light damage according to the article in Wikipedia...." All three pilots looked to their right and spotted Cessna N8669G directly abeam the DC-9 cockpit. The captain attempted to dodge the small aircraft but heard and felt a thump of impact. The impact and subsequent uncontrolled descent severed the right wing of the Cessna; the main wreckage and left wing were found in an empty parking lot 6,500 ft (2,000 m) from the approach end of runway 17. The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) characterized the crash as "nonsurvivable". The DC-9 remained controllable and landed on runway 17 without serious incident. It sustained light damage to the right wing and a wing flap, with paint smears consistent with contact with the Cessna's propeller and wing. The damage to PSA 182 was very bad and severed the hydraulic lines which retracted the flaps and slats. Aeromexico got hit in the tail and lost its horizontal stabilizer.
It is unviable to mixed general and civil aviation.
Get a flight instructor with more than just 380 hours in the air. Guy might have been really out of his element.
The ATC controller's instructions were just ridiculous and totally confusing. Lot's of maybe's, could be's, maybe left or may be right, ahead of you, or below you, etc., etc. No wonder this accident happened. There should've been no maybe's; only hard facts. How was this type of operation allowed back then if there was no positive radar control and any proper sequencing procedures in place?
How? Local airfield not generating enough net profit to pay for ALL the equipment, manpower, etcetera of a fully staffed radar equipped control tower plus ALL the added costs to the ARTCCs that will have to help feed the aircraft into and out of the rest of the National Airspace System .
So they juggle with human lives and hope for the best.
Look, they did it with flights over the Grand Canyon for decades before the big collision caused them to decide that allowing the Grand Canyon Airspace mess shouldn't be allowed to continue.
Instructor pilots can have only 380 hrs of flight time?! Luckily this did not become PSA 182.......
No the FAA allows just 250h
Hopefully for just smaller planes?
Dink pilots have to have to their hands held.
Please air india flight 182
Personally, I'm not flying on any airline named Ozark.
They merged with TWA in 1986.
You can't. Can't fly TWA anymore either
Or any airline named after a mountain range, like Allegheny!
Would you prefer "Hillbilly Airlines" ?!?
@@gizmonicman9879
Exactly.
Hard to read white letters
Instructor pilot trainee = student pilot.