Overthinking it, Paul. I would LOVE you to make an active speaker as well. I don’t necessarily need you to build in a streamer, phono, etc. Ideally I would use it like a studio monitor and connect my preamp to it via XLR. Isn’t that doable?
Yea but if you check out reviews of high-end active gear, that's what people expect in an active speaker. Your likes and dislikes are different from other people's, so I think the problem here is that it now becomes a question of how to build an active speaker for EVERYONE. It's harder to build an active system for discerning audiophiles, than it is to build a mass market Bluetooth speaker
The biggest pain in the neck with a subwoofer is when a plate amp dies. Especially if it's a high-end subwoofer and they don't make a plate amp to fit that opening. Separate components don't last forever, and when one kicks the bucket it can be replaced with something else. With an active speaker, after 5 years or so if the amplifier dies the whole system is usually worthless. Amplifiers enclosed spaces with little ventilation is never a good idea, even class D. There are plenty of powered bookshelves on Amazon for the millennials. To me they make great garage speakers. But it ends there.
@@Viagra_risk_PERMANENT_insomnia BHK, at his age, was most certainly suffering from hearing loss, so certainly he could hear what couldn't be measured.
I would certainly have a problem with active speakers. You still need wires , mains cables and bluetooth isn't good enough really. Also how would I plug in my 2 turntables, 2 tape decks, CD player and FM tuner. I can upgrade my amp, loudspeakers etc in stages. I can also stream , choosing various devices. Also if your amp goes down and is beyond cost effective repair, you've no loudspeakers.
I want stereo equipment to look like stuff made in the 1970's. I want chrome. I want wood. I want brushed finishes. I want highly machined knobs. I want real meters. I want a million buttons and switches that I'll never use. I want stuff to look like the high prices that are paid for stuff. I don't like expensive stuff with one button or knob on it and plastic construction. It looks cheap and it looks like something everyone else could build. Retro cars were big about 15 years ago. I think someone needs to start making retro stereo equipment with modern sound. Stuff from the 70's looks way cooler than anything made today.
YES! Agree. Instead of buying a car when I was 15yo in 1973, I bought my first stereo, a Pioneer Int.Amp with a BSR turntable and Pioneer 2way air suspension speakers. I still LOVE the brushed aluminum panel and big toggle switches and big turned knobs. From across the room I could see my amps status. Then this black painted crap where standing 12 inches away I can't see any status of anything. 50 years later we still have this black on black junk that I can't see or read. Since the 70s all my future purchases in stereo were visually boring.
The thing is that the really neat stuff from the '70s were the receivers. And besides all of the knobs, switches and dials they had those big long AM/FM tuner displays that covered a third of the face. Today we have streamers with great displays such as the Eversolo and Hifi Rose units, so if they could make displays in a size to replicate an old receiver I think it would be possible to recreate the look and feel of the vintage pieces. They would probably have to be pretty expensive but I believe they would be popular for a lot of people.
@@funny0000000 Yes, I tend to miss my first receiver I got from my parents at age 9 in the 1970s. It was a Bang & Olufsen BeoMaster 901 and it looked amazing with solid brushed aluminum front and aluminum buttons and sounded awesome. It made me convince myself to take an audio engineering degree a decade later and to take a job at Bang & Olufsen as my first job where engineers had the privilege to join home testing getting everything for free. For example, I got a BeoCenter 9000 receiver with Beolab Penta active speakers system for testing shortly after I started and had that system been launched today, people would think of it as something from the future. Nowadays things look boring.
I've had both. Passive crossovers add more distortions, especially temporal distortions, thus tweeters play ahead of bass drivers. Active crossovers require an amplifier per channel - this requires spending a lot more money on amplifiers or buying multiple cheaper amplifers which lose the musical gusto in good performances. I'm current passive with 500W monoblocks (which are small boxes, due to the spacial advantages of switch-mode power-supplies) as I prefer these amps to cheaper amps and I don't yet have the money for lots of monoblocks.
Active speakers, while promising, are dumb. A failure of any internal component renders the system useless. You're at the mercy of the manufacturer to maintain inventory of replacement parts. Imagine investing thousands of dollars in a system and having something fail after a number of years, only to find that the manufacturer no longer stocks the parts needed for repair.
the same as a passive system. When your external Amp breaks you also have a useless system and need replacement of the manufacture... This ,guarantee, argument is as always nonsense
Yes, I do want an active streaming speaker. I personally do not think the FR30 or 20 for that matter is not an ideal. My high end listening room has 3-way horn loaded speakers with separate mono amps for every driver and that will not change. That said, I have a very nice system in my study that if I did not already own it, I’d be looking for quality active-streaming speaker. I do have Kef LS60 wireless speakers in our bedroom and they also serve as outdoor speakers when we are entertaining; takes 10 minutes to move them to our back patio and plug into an outdoor 120VAC outlet. It’s my understanding Kef has done extremely well with their wireless LS speakers. B&W has recently introduced a high end wireless tower. The FR10 would seemingly be an ideal candidate for that market sector.
Prioritizing all in one solutions over separate's eliminates too many products that are bought, sold and profited from everyday. The business model still needs to make sense. Offering 1 product in your audio component lineup to accommodate those people that prioritize convenience over sound quality is plenty to accommodate the audio buying public at large. Yes Paul's all in one speaker's would rival the best out there, but they would also cost a small fortune. No shade intended. The best doesn't come cheap. Plenty of respectable offerings out there in that category. KEF immediately comes to mind.
For an audiophile it's usually the changing of gear and trying things that allure, so the ultra high end stuff would probably not sell too well. But for those of us who buys a system and don't change things just because it's possible, sure. It is exciting times to be into DIY audio as well, you can easily remove a zero on the price by building yourself and running it active.
Makes sense for some, I suppose, but not for me. I think Paul overcomplicated the answer. Active speakers can and should be driven from a preamp, which can have all the stuff like streaming built into it, if one so wishes. I will keep and use my old-fashioned equipment preferentially.
I think that active speakers for the home will not be audiophile. Not because it is not possible, rather because no compromise makes the speakers not competitive. I am also not convinced that it can sound better.
I think you've hit the nail on the head. I'm sure good active systems are possible, but this would involve many compromises. It rules out tubes, class A, and likely most class a/b of any power. No tweaking with cables. No fine tuning with anything basically.
I believe they will surely make active speakers, but audio files will not go for them. Anytime that you have someone else's opinion regarding crucial sub components that will be stuffed in a box, you take away the whole Joy of an audio file choosing their on sound from a specific preamplifier, amplifier, whether or not it uses tubes, what class of amplifier is used, etc etc etc. Just like anything else that is "made", someone will eventually buy it, but just because it is made does not mean it is going to sell enough to stay in business......
Excellent question. PS Audio is well equipped to make such speakers considering their in-house engineering competencies on both speaker and electronics side.This video made me just remember my first active speakers from B&O called Beolab Penta that I got in 1988. It's a really amazing active speaker way ahead of its time in a tall pentagon shaped cabinet (to avoid standing waves) and it's quite well engineered acoustically with 9 drivers each side and some very innovative features (e.g. soft clipping). I recently bought a pair of KEF LS60 for my dining room (cost US$5,000). For that particular location, they are just really perfect as I have no desire to create an area with amp and other electronic boxes. This video made me realize that the majority of locations in my house are better suited for active speakers. For example, in my home office I use a pair of KEF LSX II (with Velodyne servo subwoofer). My garage speakers, bedroom speakers and home theatre speakers are also active. So PS Audio is missing out on a lot of potential business of serving more rooms where you don't want the mess of boxes and wires.
@@Jorge-Fernandez-Lopez You need a power cable per speaker. Music is streamed through WiFi. That's it. A setup with streamer, DAC, pre-amp and power amp makes no sense in almost any room except my listening room and home theatre room. My office room, dining room, garage, kitchen, bedrooms, master bath room, pool table room and outdoor gazebo just simply aren't places for having some rack system with all the wires and therefore I use active speakers in those places. Also, moving CDs around the house is very annoying thus streaming is the way to do multi room audio nowadays.
@@ThinkingBetter More power cables than a classic setup. I suppose that active speakers with streamer, amplifier and DAC could be practical, or "make more sense", till some random component fail in any module included in these box. Would it be easy to update or repair these costly and heavy speakers in ten or twenty years ? Does it make any sense from an ecological and economic perspective? Some people believe that extremely expensive power cables make a difference? Do they need one more cable now?
Good old Penta's I had the MK3 verision myself, but they was a little " to big for my living room" or wife says haha. So now I have some passiv sonetto III. A big differance, I do perf the sonetto sound and look, but the Pentas was nice that for movies I could just " up the bass with the bass extention " and that made it solid for movies, and then music I could turn it down to 1 again. So yes I agree with you I think active speakers brings ALOT that can help in any room, big as small, and alot more options one can have with actives.
@@Jorge-Fernandez-Lopez Less power cables, no degrading interconnects or speaker cables and everything remote controlled from app giving access to around 100 million music tracks in lossless FLAC CD quality or better at a cost less than a system with discrete components and better performing as everything is optimized for maximum synergy. And there are less chances something will break because you run less power supplies and overall less components. If a speaker breaks concerning the electronics inside, it’s fixable but sending an entire speaker to some repair center if the amp inside is broken is of course less convenient than just sending some amp box. In the other hand, if you someday perhaps a decade or two after purchase want to refresh your system with new capacitors, you only need to do it in two boxes.
ATC has a good success story about their active speakers. Many prefer the active version of the speakers for better overall sound quality and performance compared to passive versions with expensive external amplification. Now PMC started with their active versions with their mid range speakers and my initial listening impression is positive ❤
Someone said that he got some second hand active PMCs for a second system, just plugged his iPod in to try, and it blew his main system into the weeds, so he used them ever since, but what I want to know, is WHY active sound so much better.
Take the active monitors used by sound engineers. One of the considerations is heat. Class AB produces heat you need heatsinks or the heat will degrade components in less than 10 years.
How about dedicated active amp, xover (etc), module for known (PS) speakers? Maybe something PS could do with a mind to an open standard. In my other hobby of astronomy, we have some agreed communication standards across all brands (ASCOM, etc), but also proprietary stuff linked to system lock-in via convenience. Of course the night sky is well mapped for centuries so pointing and tracking sky objects has a large commonly agreed objective aspect. 🙃
I genuinely can see the value in the convenience and efficiency of an all-in-one active speaker with streaming built in. However, for me I would miss the modular approach of separates. The possibility of playing with synergy to achieve a certain sound. I don’t think I can forego that part of the hobby.
I am all for active speakers. I like listening to some of them, but loathing most of them. When I get to the point where I might buy a pair of actives I’m not excited at all… and let’s face it - if you don’t feel excited for something that you are going to enjoy, it’s not something you’d want to buy - a pair of Aspen speakers and a BHK amp gets me super excited though - is it just me, or do other people also find active speakers rather boring?
I'm 36 as well, and i am too choosing active any time over passive and all the separate shenanigans. I'm not only scared of the technicalities of it all, but i also find them ridiculous in price, space requirement and added complexity.
@@nodammit Unless those separates are artsy fartsy passion projects with a philosophy behind them (which i suspect is more often than true research and development)... and the integrateds are simply well proven circuitry with components adjusted to different levels of pricing.
@@Gary_Hun It makes no difference. Whether you're comparing "artsy fartsy" separates, or "proven circuitry" separates, the cost of the components will be added to the cost of the speaker when they're combined. So, if you didn't like the cost of your chosen components when they existed as separates, you're not going to like the cost any better when they're combined.
Making their own speakers was probably the first step into eventually moving to active systems. I see the problem though - getting a younger generation into high end audio can secure the future for a hi-fi company - but the younger generation doesn’t have the disposable income for a killer active speaker. The old fuddy-duddy audiophile wants lots of impressive boxes and active speakers wouldn’t fit in that playground. It would be the future of high end audio itself that I’d be more worried about.
Thank you very much for your videos - and especially for this one! 👍 In my opinion active speakers are the future - at least at the upper end. The danger I see is to load too much requirements on such a project. So the suggestion would be - as step one: No streaming, no wireless connections, no "computer" inside ... Just 3 power amplifiers into the box of a 3-way speaker, a bigger one for bass (could be class D), a middle wattage one for the mid range, and a low wattage one for the tweeter. Than the active crossover network and simple analog input terminals to be connected to the output of a preamp (symmetrical or / and unsymmetrical). As simple as possible. It will fill the need of the majority of the audiophile customers. For those, that want more (the younger ones with DSP, digital / optical input, wireless, streaming ...) additional device(s) can be added outside the loudspeaker. That's step two - on demand and for additional money. Keeping the pure active speaker more affordable (or requiring less compromises to keep a certain price limit) for us "normal" ( = elder 😁) customers. Best regards from Germany! 🍀
Hail the great Paul admitting this is the future 😂 I’m so happy with my active speakers. Thank you for the honest open information you always provide us 🙏
Thanks Paul. An active “audiophile” loudspeaker would be like a non-iron dress shirt or corrected-grain dress shoes. The people who make them don’t invest in the best quality materials, as the draw is their convenience and lower cost compared to higher end alternatives.
No Paul, instead, let me propose to you a way to go, forget built-in streaming options Tha just makes for a quickly aging product that will stop being useful in a few years. Instead build a lineup of very nice looking, great sounding active speakers with balanced inputs directly to its built-in Amp. Or better yet make the AMP detachable so you can easily upgrade to a better unit down the line, maybe with Ethernet of wifi connections, or just swap it out if it ever stops working. Another option is to also have a DAC built-in and just have digital inputs on the back, maybe with DANTE support. But the real thing is: either make a separate streamer device that will conect to the speaker via XLR or just partner with a company that already does that and just sell their streamer through your website, that avoids the issue of you having to endlessly support the speaker which is expensive. Instead use a streamer with like, a Linux based software stack or anything that's easy to update and manage that decreases cost to your company and makes for a better product to the consumer. But I do agree it can't be 20.000,00 RN it would need to come in at a cheaper price. But hey think about not needing to spend on physical crossover parts eh.
I think active studio monitors could be a GREAT product category for PS Audio to look into, especially now with Octave Records' good name to put behind them. Trying to integrate a DAC, streamer and all that though? Probably not worth the trouble, given your current target demographic. Not that they wouldn't sell of course; I'm sure they would. But dropping the cost of an entire system on a single product all at once, whose signal chain you're now rigidly stuck with, kind of defeats the point of the hobby for many enthusiasts; the journey to find "your" system, as it were.
I hear and use now for over 10 Years Active Studio Gear at home for listening and i never want to go back to passive stuff. The Acouracy, Detail & Imaging of good Monitors are (in my experience) far better than a passive system for the same price. For me there is only one System Style i choose : Active + Bass / Subwoofer Concept (Double Bass Array) and everything set up & tuned for the personal taste via DSP. No Monoblocks, no passive floorstanders, no cable nonsense - just performance
All over again? We dealing with this same situation back in the 90’s to cut the costs and for mass production. Remember this is a “hobby “ it’s not a mass production staff. We need few with quality and pleasure as a good wine. Please… remember. This’ll not be for everyone. Full Stop.
It just doesnt seem very complex to me if said brand already makes amplifiers people buy lots of, to simply redesign the amp PCB and tailor it for active speaker application. Maybe offer a special "space conscious" outboard preamp with all the BT & Streaming crap but keep the speaker itself away from the digital domain so that it can still also work well with legacy gear and anything from other brands. Its the integrating the HDMI inputs and everything else related that kills the practicality of "Audiophile" active speakers. Gimme something thats perfectly powered, that I can crank all the damn way up and know in my bones nothing unholy will happen to any of the voice coils, : D
So true Paul, audiophiles do like to play around with components. Had a few actives that were great, yet still found myself selling to buy new separate playthings. Also, 'Mericans seem to say Melbourne as Mel-born. Genenerally, it's said by aussies as Mel-ben or Mel-bun.
Paul, why do you stipulate that active speakers have to have a streamer built in? Active speakers like the Grimm LSBe (which I own) achieve quite a bit by integrating DAC, amp and speaker in one unit. Of course, it still needs another box as a front end, so it is not quite the ideal that you discuss, but I believe it takes you a long way towards it.
Hi Paul I agree that active speakers would not be a good commercial investment. On a totally different subject if you want to reverse your age do the carnivore diet, I know it sounds crazy, but it worked for me and millions of others ;)
Hi Paul we'll other than the fact you remind me of the president of the United States🤣🤣 half the time I don't think you know what you're saying lol ok bye now .lmfao
For the first time listening to your videos I come away disappointed. I just heard you say that you are letting the perfect get in the way of the possible. Last year I bought pair of Genelec 3 active speakers. They have no streamer or other stuff built in. They sound great and take up little space. A streamer built into a small preamp ( I use the RME, again without a streamer, but one could be added easily) is the only extra pieice you need to get started. With remote control, it could sit next to the speaker, take up little room, and be the focal point for both customer education to the benefits of an active system, and it would also provide a lower cost point of entry for the curios. It would also provide you with an income generating platform that you could continue to develop into the perfect alternative system.
My tower speakers have built in powered subwoofers I love that it gives my towers a small foot print and gives my speakers full range output, never mind it takes most of the duty off my tube amp
Finally, some vindication. I love my Magnavox All In One from Walmart for years and continue to listen to it daily. Turntable, cd, am-fm, cassette and came with two speakers! Well, the cassette broke years ago. But I don't have any cassettes anymore. Wish it had Bluetooth though.
Hey Paul, i have fully active speakers with class A/B amplification and I don’t think I will ever go back to passive. Why not make offer the possibility to swap your passive crossovers for analogue electronic crossovers, so people would get the benefits of active amplification but still be able to swap amps and tinker with cables?
Paul has covered this. Removing the crossover from the tweeters and (to a lesser extent) mid range drivers, and allowing direct connection to a power amp means you're one mistake away from blown drivers. From a warranty standpoint, this is Very Bad News. Adding some basic protection circuit (i.e. a capacitor) removes the direct connection that you're trying to achieve.
I think there is a growing market for active speakers to serve the growing market for tiny homes. Living in Toronto Canada, I see real estate prices that most cannot afford and the trend is to tiny condo spaces. The EU got there long ago. This hobby caters to wealthier people with space for a listening room with speakers dominating the room. It will by definition remain a boutique market while the masses listen to their iPhone on ear buds or active speakers.
Damm good point. Active is less boxes and a smaller space or room. Often active can sound bigger by having up to two amps inside the enclosure. Living spaces are shrinking too.
@@kellymichael9567 Yes. Median condo size in Toronto is 820 sq feet. Not built for a full PS Audio rig. And median detached home price is almost $2m. So the average person is retired before they could afford a a high end system and a house to put it in.
Good synopsis of the Market. Music also is something we all love however that alone does not mean many set aside the cash for a quality purchase. Convenience has replaced the hifi systems many could dream about. Soundbars I phone docks and mass market solutions dominate. They are easy portable and you can move them around the house and workshop. Hey I am starting a studio based around hifi monitors from the late eighties. ProAc studio one and psx power amp by Mission. The Golden age of British hifi. Small near fields. Even Serban mixes on them. Then the bigger monitors are B&W semi matrix with somewhat recessed mids(high/low extension. Music matters right?
Besides being funny, Paul makes a bunch of good points except that KEF seems to have cracked the code. I'm certain the KEF LS 50s and 60s won't pass the audiophile purity test but for the money they're close. Also, Mads Buchardt has a good bead on active speakers as well.
The "easy button" to test the market would be to take the guts of a Sprout and combine them with a lesser version of the FR10 or revive what would have been the Sprout speakers, and sell that for $2K-$2,500. For the streaming part, there is a commercial part that is common in many intergrateds and active speakers that could be added.
I don’t want extra capabilities in my active loudspeaker system, ... that's what dates them and renders them toward obsolescence. Simply stick to; - Active crossover, alignment and contouring in both time and frequency - Amplifier type/class optimized per task - Robust high current, high power, low output impedance directly connected to the driver motors. Plus 𝙎𝙀𝙍𝙑𝙄𝘾𝙀𝘼𝘽𝙄𝙇𝙄𝙏𝙔 (fwiw, ... I own several active mains, monitors, etc. ... from a couple hundred dollars to several thousand dollars)
I agree with you Paul on the age thing. As far as high end audio goes, I appreciate it, but I'd rather buy a nice car with the same money. Trying to keep my 1970's sound system functioning is taking less money to do (As long as my technician stays alive!) and without a room to dedicate for listening, it serves it's purpose. I do like the concept of active speakers though. Less wires and equipment to deal with.
Make every internal module 'modular' IE...build the circuits on a slot in rail system a bit like a audio mixer has separate circuits per input but make the module within a narrow enclosure that slots in at rear. This way any slot rail circuit can be swapped
ATC make excellent active lineups. In Australia VAF Research make an in-house passive line of hi end speakers in particular their Signature Series Speakers with an option upon request to make an active array including front or rear ports. Rolling Stone Magazine a while ago said their Signature i93 speaker had the best bass in the world. VAF Research sell direct to the customer cutting out the middleman and are also about to release a newer version of their Signature Series in July. (P.S I have no affiliation to VAF Research)
Hmm - the reservations put forward is basically a non-issue with some of the best active speakers available. In my experience one can for 5-6000 usd get the performance of a conventional system many times more expensive. I think that we might see legacy high-end companies go out of business because of they were afraid of eliminating their current business. Just like the development we witness in the automotive industry because of reluctancy by legacy companies to embrace the technology disruption happing right now.
Yes to active, I am 63 and know that an active system if made with great amps and processors can kill a passive system. My old Vandersteen 5 ‘s had a 400 watt amp with a 11 band eq. The difference with the eq set to 0 and having it set to the room was HUGE. I have had fully active DIY systems in the past before DSP , it sounded great, but I still needed passive notch filters and a eq for the bass mostly. It was costly, it had five boxes , it was large and messy with a 12 interconnects, and speaker cables. Paul maybe try trickle up, the FR 10 and with just a line in and DSP to control the eq. I was happy to rig myself of boxes and cables which is way I got the Vandys,
At an audio show in the Netherlands ATC demonstrated the active and passive versions of its SCM50 speakers and let the public vote. 60% went for active, 40% for passive. A small sample from the audiophile public but maybe it says there's a market for both
I’d like your ribbon tweeter or ESS Super Tweeter, two mids (one over and one under the tweeter), a subwoofer outlet, use a height adjustable spring style isolation feet, use a Furutech NCF IEC inlet and a simple remote.
For me the fun of this sport is in exploring every detail and understanding how it all affects the result, and this investigation includes everything important, which means everything from the studs in the wall inwards... almost everything DIY... but that's just me.
I have had a great time listening to my U Turn Audio Ethos class A/B powered speakers. It is paired to my U Turn Orbit custom and the system is so clear.
active loudspeakers with zero crossovers and perfectly DSP's amplifiers on each driver is the future of HIFI.,,,I think you will always want a seperate audio interface though, a hub for all the stuff to the TV and computer,..Pre-amps will eventually be the end all be all of audio.
Until all those connections are also wireless. TVs can already connect wirelessly to soundbars, so why not to a pair of active speakers? Just needs the right standards.
@RacingAnt you will need a landline connections to the high speed internet for 8k and all streaming...you will need a connect all BT in out wireless controller. ..a streaming AV interface pre-amp controller.
The best advert for Active loudsoeakers I have heard comes from ATC the ASL300 and the ASL100ASLT. Astonishing is not even close. Pricey yes on the face of it but the Amplification inside these speakers is absolutely top notch and when you factor the price of Great amps in with Great passive, the ATC's represent pretty good value. If it's further down the price class you are looking for, the KEF LS60 offers a really great solution
Im not sure what im about to say would be considered as active sprakers, but what i dream of when it comes to sound systems is something like this: Keep all the descreet components, streamets, cd-players, DACs and amps and pre-amps. Instead of passive crossover networks inside the box, give me a DSP and seperate power amps for every driver in a speaker system, let me mix and match those power amps myself. Want tube amps on the tweeter, A or AB on the mids? Sure go ahead! The DSP would have to have some preset rules like: "tweeter crossover can not be set below some frequency" to protect the speaker just in case someone makes a mistake somewhere
Yes what you described IS an active speaker. In a lot of the comments to this video people are instead describing/wishing for an all in one system. Given PS Audio history for discrete components I would imagine them offering an analogue electronic crossover rather than a DSP.
@@volpedo2000 sure, most people want an easy catch all solution, plug and play stuff. I do not think those are the same people who would buy a truly high end system. Imagine the cost of an active speaker with all the PS audio electronics built in with different inputs and BHK amps, 100k? 150k? I dont think anybody would buy that. I think adding a DSP on the electronics side and a crossover bypass switch on the speakers would let those who wanted to customize their everything to their liking do so, it would also let PS audio sell more amps
@@HanMedSkjegget The issue with DSP is that it has to digitise the signal and I don't think many PS Audio customers would want that after the spend $6K on a Direct Stream Dac. I also think PS Audio wouldn't want customers to be able to change their house sound by tinkering with the DSP settings. You ask how much would a speaker like that cost? Easy, look at Linn's latest Klimax 360, approx $90K
@@volpedo2000 maybe Im in the minority when it comes to playing around with the signal. If the in-room sound is bad, how pure the signal is does not really matter in my opinion
The amplifier circuit in active speakers would literally be bombarded with vibration from within the cabinet. Putting footers under external amplifiers makes a big difference in the sound quality. A whole industry is based on isolation and it works wonders. Amps inside speakers is THE theoretical worst place for an amp to be. I don't understand why some people believe in isolation and yet consider buying powered speakers. Far worse than multi disc cd players, amps with a tuner inside (receivers), and automatic turntables. I don't doubt that there could be some good sounding powered speakers out there. But however good they sound; they'd sound far better with an isolated amolifier not being directly bombarded from within from vibration.
![NOSFERATU - Official Trailer [HD] - Only In Theaters December 25](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nulvWqYUM8k/mqdefault.jpg)
Overthinking it, Paul. I would LOVE you to make an active speaker as well. I don’t necessarily need you to build in a streamer, phono, etc. Ideally I would use it like a studio monitor and connect my preamp to it via XLR. Isn’t that doable?
That's exactly what I would suggest too.
Yea but if you check out reviews of high-end active gear, that's what people expect in an active speaker.
Your likes and dislikes are different from other people's, so I think the problem here is that it now becomes a question of how to build an active speaker for EVERYONE.
It's harder to build an active system for discerning audiophiles, than it is to build a mass market Bluetooth speaker
PS Audio Active speaker would be very heavy with built in BHK 600 amplifier, PS Power Plant 15, DirectStream DAC & optional AirLens. 😂
The biggest pain in the neck with a subwoofer is when a plate amp dies. Especially if it's a high-end subwoofer and they don't make a plate amp to fit that opening. Separate components don't last forever, and when one kicks the bucket it can be replaced with something else. With an active speaker, after 5 years or so if the amplifier dies the whole system is usually worthless. Amplifiers enclosed spaces with little ventilation is never a good idea, even class D. There are plenty of powered bookshelves on Amazon for the millennials. To me they make great garage speakers. But it ends there.
Active speakers for audiophiles would never fly because there wouldn't be a place for the magic speaker cables.
Sonic differences in audio cables can't be measured, but you can hear the magic, (Bascom King said so).
@@Viagra_risk_PERMANENT_insomniait likely can be measured, but we've just not found out what to measure 😊
@@Viagra_risk_PERMANENT_insomnia BHK, at his age, was most certainly suffering from hearing loss, so certainly he could hear what couldn't be measured.
@@peanutbutterjellyjam2179
Sweets, you couldn't ignore me if you tried.
As an audiophile I’m more concerned about rapidly aging DACs in the speakers.
I would certainly have a problem with active speakers. You still need wires , mains cables and bluetooth isn't good enough really. Also how would I plug in my 2 turntables, 2 tape decks, CD player and FM tuner. I can upgrade my amp, loudspeakers etc in stages. I can also stream , choosing various devices. Also if your amp goes down and is beyond cost effective repair, you've no loudspeakers.
I want stereo equipment to look like stuff made in the 1970's. I want chrome. I want wood. I want brushed finishes. I want highly machined knobs. I want real meters. I want a million buttons and switches that I'll never use. I want stuff to look like the high prices that are paid for stuff. I don't like expensive stuff with one button or knob on it and plastic construction. It looks cheap and it looks like something everyone else could build. Retro cars were big about 15 years ago. I think someone needs to start making retro stereo equipment with modern sound. Stuff from the 70's looks way cooler than anything made today.
NAD did for example
@@kristofvadnai7468Yamaha
YES! Agree. Instead of buying a car when I was 15yo in 1973, I bought my first stereo, a Pioneer Int.Amp with a BSR turntable and Pioneer 2way air suspension speakers. I still LOVE the brushed aluminum panel and big toggle switches and big turned knobs. From across the room I could see my amps status. Then this black painted crap where standing 12 inches away I can't see any status of anything. 50 years later we still have this black on black junk that I can't see or read. Since the 70s all my future purchases in stereo were visually boring.
The thing is that the really neat stuff from the '70s were the receivers. And besides all of the knobs, switches and dials they had those big long AM/FM tuner displays that covered a third of the face. Today we have streamers with great displays such as the Eversolo and Hifi Rose units, so if they could make displays in a size to replicate an old receiver I think it would be possible to recreate the look and feel of the vintage pieces. They would probably have to be pretty expensive but I believe they would be popular for a lot of people.
@@funny0000000 Yes, I tend to miss my first receiver I got from my parents at age 9 in the 1970s. It was a Bang & Olufsen BeoMaster 901 and it looked amazing with solid brushed aluminum front and aluminum buttons and sounded awesome. It made me convince myself to take an audio engineering degree a decade later and to take a job at Bang & Olufsen as my first job where engineers had the privilege to join home testing getting everything for free. For example, I got a BeoCenter 9000 receiver with Beolab Penta active speakers system for testing shortly after I started and had that system been launched today, people would think of it as something from the future. Nowadays things look boring.
I've recently got the KEF LS60, which is what Paul is describing and they are great.
Love my active ATC SCM40A's at home. I would never go back!
The pleasure is in the pursuit not necessarily the purchase of a product
I've had both.
Passive crossovers add more distortions, especially temporal distortions, thus tweeters play ahead of bass drivers.
Active crossovers require an amplifier per channel - this requires spending a lot more money on amplifiers or buying multiple cheaper amplifers which lose the musical gusto in good performances.
I'm current passive with 500W monoblocks (which are small boxes, due to the spacial advantages of switch-mode power-supplies) as I prefer these amps to cheaper amps and I don't yet have the money for lots of monoblocks.
Active speakers, while promising, are dumb. A failure of any internal component renders the system useless. You're at the mercy of the manufacturer to maintain inventory of replacement parts. Imagine investing thousands of dollars in a system and having something fail after a number of years, only to find that the manufacturer no longer stocks the parts needed for repair.
the same as a passive system. When your external Amp breaks you also have a useless system and need replacement of the manufacture... This ,guarantee, argument is as always nonsense
Yes, I do want an active streaming speaker. I personally do not think the FR30 or 20 for that matter is not an ideal. My high end listening room has 3-way horn loaded speakers with separate mono amps for every driver and that will not change. That said, I have a very nice system in my study that if I did not already own it, I’d be looking for quality active-streaming speaker. I do have Kef LS60 wireless speakers in our bedroom and they also serve as outdoor speakers when we are entertaining; takes 10 minutes to move them to our back patio and plug into an outdoor 120VAC outlet.
It’s my understanding Kef has done extremely well with their wireless LS speakers. B&W has recently introduced a high end wireless tower. The FR10 would seemingly be an ideal candidate for that market sector.
Active FR20 or even FR10 would be wild
I have no desire in active speakers! That's what those big bluetooth speakers are for... I love amps, the bigger and powerful the better!
Prioritizing all in one solutions over separate's eliminates too many products that are bought, sold and profited from everyday. The business model still needs to make sense. Offering 1 product in your audio component lineup to accommodate those people that prioritize convenience over sound quality is plenty to accommodate the audio buying public at large. Yes Paul's all in one speaker's would rival the best out there, but they would also cost a small fortune. No shade intended. The best doesn't come cheap. Plenty of respectable offerings out there in that category. KEF immediately comes to mind.
For an audiophile it's usually the changing of gear and trying things that allure, so the ultra high end stuff would probably not sell too well. But for those of us who buys a system and don't change things just because it's possible, sure.
It is exciting times to be into DIY audio as well, you can easily remove a zero on the price by building yourself and running it active.
Makes sense for some, I suppose, but not for me.
I think Paul overcomplicated the answer.
Active speakers can and should be driven from a preamp,
which can have all the stuff like streaming built into it, if one so wishes.
I will keep and use my old-fashioned equipment preferentially.
I think that active speakers for the home will not be audiophile. Not because it is not possible, rather because no compromise makes the speakers not competitive. I am also not convinced that it can sound better.
I think you've hit the nail on the head. I'm sure good active systems are possible, but this would involve many compromises. It rules out tubes, class A, and likely most class a/b of any power. No tweaking with cables. No fine tuning with anything basically.
I believe they will surely make active speakers, but audio files will not go for them. Anytime that you have someone else's opinion regarding crucial sub components that will be stuffed in a box, you take away the whole Joy of an audio file choosing their on sound from a specific preamplifier, amplifier, whether or not it uses tubes, what class of amplifier is used, etc etc etc. Just like anything else that is "made", someone will eventually buy it, but just because it is made does not mean it is going to sell enough to stay in business......
Paul, just checking are you a big fish in a small pond or was it the other way around? I’m sure that you’re not referring to the size of your gear.
Excellent question. PS Audio is well equipped to make such speakers considering their in-house engineering competencies on both speaker and electronics side.This video made me just remember my first active speakers from B&O called Beolab Penta that I got in 1988. It's a really amazing active speaker way ahead of its time in a tall pentagon shaped cabinet (to avoid standing waves) and it's quite well engineered acoustically with 9 drivers each side and some very innovative features (e.g. soft clipping). I recently bought a pair of KEF LS60 for my dining room (cost US$5,000). For that particular location, they are just really perfect as I have no desire to create an area with amp and other electronic boxes. This video made me realize that the majority of locations in my house are better suited for active speakers. For example, in my home office I use a pair of KEF LSX II (with Velodyne servo subwoofer). My garage speakers, bedroom speakers and home theatre speakers are also active. So PS Audio is missing out on a lot of potential business of serving more rooms where you don't want the mess of boxes and wires.
If active speakers aren't wired, how do they work ? Is the PS Audio Sprout (only one power cable) so big that it can't fit in a house ?
@@Jorge-Fernandez-Lopez You need a power cable per speaker. Music is streamed through WiFi. That's it. A setup with streamer, DAC, pre-amp and power amp makes no sense in almost any room except my listening room and home theatre room. My office room, dining room, garage, kitchen, bedrooms, master bath room, pool table room and outdoor gazebo just simply aren't places for having some rack system with all the wires and therefore I use active speakers in those places. Also, moving CDs around the house is very annoying thus streaming is the way to do multi room audio nowadays.
@@ThinkingBetter More power cables than a classic setup. I suppose that active speakers with streamer, amplifier and DAC could be practical, or "make more sense", till some random component fail in any module included in these box. Would it be easy to update or repair these costly and heavy speakers in ten or twenty years ? Does it make any sense from an ecological and economic perspective? Some people believe that extremely expensive power cables make a difference? Do they need one more cable now?
Good old Penta's I had the MK3 verision myself, but they was a little " to big for my living room" or wife says haha. So now I have some passiv sonetto III. A big differance, I do perf the sonetto sound and look, but the Pentas was nice that for movies I could just " up the bass with the bass extention " and that made it solid for movies, and then music I could turn it down to 1 again. So yes I agree with you I think active speakers brings ALOT that can help in any room, big as small, and alot more options one can have with actives.
@@Jorge-Fernandez-Lopez Less power cables, no degrading interconnects or speaker cables and everything remote controlled from app giving access to around 100 million music tracks in lossless FLAC CD quality or better at a cost less than a system with discrete components and better performing as everything is optimized for maximum synergy. And there are less chances something will break because you run less power supplies and overall less components. If a speaker breaks concerning the electronics inside, it’s fixable but sending an entire speaker to some repair center if the amp inside is broken is of course less convenient than just sending some amp box. In the other hand, if you someday perhaps a decade or two after purchase want to refresh your system with new capacitors, you only need to do it in two boxes.
I owned a pair of Infinity Prelude P-FR active speakers and this pair is the most transparent full acoustic speakers that I have ever heard!!!
Only the woofer section is active on the P-FR's 😉😎 I own them as well.
ATC has a good success story about their active speakers. Many prefer the active version of the speakers for better overall sound quality and performance compared to passive versions with expensive external amplification. Now PMC started with their active versions with their mid range speakers and my initial listening impression is positive ❤
Someone said that he got some second hand active PMCs for a second system, just plugged his iPod in to try, and it blew his main system into the weeds, so he used them ever since, but what I want to know, is WHY active sound so much better.
@@joejoejoejoejoejoe4391buy mono blocks and put them next to your speakers and find out
@joejoejoejoejoejoe4391 Direct drive of the transducers by the amplifiers.
@@craigellsworth3952 it's more about the active crossovers..
Take the active monitors used by sound engineers. One of the considerations is heat. Class AB produces heat you need heatsinks or the heat will degrade components in less than 10 years.
How about dedicated active amp, xover (etc), module for known (PS) speakers? Maybe something PS could do with a mind to an open standard.
In my other hobby of astronomy, we have some agreed communication standards across all brands (ASCOM, etc), but also proprietary stuff linked to system lock-in via convenience. Of course the night sky is well mapped for centuries so pointing and tracking sky objects has a large commonly agreed objective aspect. 🙃
I genuinely can see the value in the convenience and efficiency of an all-in-one active speaker with streaming built in. However, for me I would miss the modular approach of separates. The possibility of playing with synergy to achieve a certain sound. I don’t think I can forego that part of the hobby.
36 year old cant see the price of an active speakers is the same as a pair of passive + dac/streamer/pre amp + power amp .....
I am all for active speakers. I like listening to some of them, but loathing most of them. When I get to the point where I might buy a pair of actives I’m not excited at all… and let’s face it - if you don’t feel excited for something that you are going to enjoy, it’s not something you’d want to buy - a pair of Aspen speakers and a BHK amp gets me super excited though - is it just me, or do other people also find active speakers rather boring?
No active speakers ever for me…
I'm 36 as well, and i am too choosing active any time over passive and all the separate shenanigans. I'm not only scared of the technicalities of it all, but i also find them ridiculous in price, space requirement and added complexity.
If you don't like the price of separates, that won't change much when all those same components are now in a single box.
@@nodammit Unless those separates are artsy fartsy passion projects with a philosophy behind them (which i suspect is more often than true research and development)... and the integrateds are simply well proven circuitry with components adjusted to different levels of pricing.
@@Gary_Hun It makes no difference. Whether you're comparing "artsy fartsy" separates, or "proven circuitry" separates, the cost of the components will be added to the cost of the speaker when they're combined. So, if you didn't like the cost of your chosen components when they existed as separates, you're not going to like the cost any better when they're combined.
Making their own speakers was probably the first step into eventually moving to active systems. I see the problem though - getting a younger generation into high end audio can secure the future for a hi-fi company - but the younger generation doesn’t have the disposable income for a killer active speaker. The old fuddy-duddy audiophile wants lots of impressive boxes and active speakers wouldn’t fit in that playground. It would be the future of high end audio itself that I’d be more worried about.
Thank you very much for your videos - and especially for this one! 👍
In my opinion active speakers are the future - at least at the upper end. The danger I see is to load too much requirements on such a project. So the suggestion would be - as step one: No streaming, no wireless connections, no "computer" inside ... Just 3 power amplifiers into the box of a 3-way speaker, a bigger one for bass (could be class D), a middle wattage one for the mid range, and a low wattage one for the tweeter. Than the active crossover network and simple analog input terminals to be connected to the output of a preamp (symmetrical or / and unsymmetrical). As simple as possible. It will fill the need of the majority of the audiophile customers.
For those, that want more (the younger ones with DSP, digital / optical input, wireless, streaming ...) additional device(s) can be added outside the loudspeaker. That's step two - on demand and for additional money. Keeping the pure active speaker more affordable (or requiring less compromises to keep a certain price limit) for us "normal" ( = elder 😁) customers.
Best regards from Germany! 🍀
Hail the great Paul admitting this is the future 😂 I’m so happy with my active speakers. Thank you for the honest open information you always provide us 🙏
Thanks Paul. An active “audiophile” loudspeaker would be like a non-iron dress shirt or corrected-grain dress shoes. The people who make them don’t invest in the best quality materials, as the draw is their convenience and lower cost compared to higher end alternatives.
No Paul, instead, let me propose to you a way to go, forget built-in streaming options Tha just makes for a quickly aging product that will stop being useful in a few years. Instead build a lineup of very nice looking, great sounding active speakers with balanced inputs directly to its built-in Amp. Or better yet make the AMP detachable so you can easily upgrade to a better unit down the line, maybe with Ethernet of wifi connections, or just swap it out if it ever stops working. Another option is to also have a DAC built-in and just have digital inputs on the back, maybe with DANTE support.
But the real thing is: either make a separate streamer device that will conect to the speaker via XLR or just partner with a company that already does that and just sell their streamer through your website, that avoids the issue of you having to endlessly support the speaker which is expensive. Instead use a streamer with like, a Linux based software stack or anything that's easy to update and manage that decreases cost to your company and makes for a better product to the consumer.
But I do agree it can't be 20.000,00 RN it would need to come in at a cheaper price. But hey think about not needing to spend on physical crossover parts eh.
I just bought a brand new pair of Meridian DSP5200se and they are amazing. I can't imagine going to back to a passive system. End game.
I think active studio monitors could be a GREAT product category for PS Audio to look into, especially now with Octave Records' good name to put behind them.
Trying to integrate a DAC, streamer and all that though? Probably not worth the trouble, given your current target demographic. Not that they wouldn't sell of course; I'm sure they would. But dropping the cost of an entire system on a single product all at once, whose signal chain you're now rigidly stuck with, kind of defeats the point of the hobby for many enthusiasts; the journey to find "your" system, as it were.
Great video and could not agree more from a business investment. I would say if one could do
I hear and use now for over 10 Years Active Studio Gear at home for listening and i never want to go back to passive stuff. The Acouracy, Detail & Imaging of good Monitors are (in my experience) far better than a passive system for the same price. For me there is only one System Style i choose : Active + Bass / Subwoofer Concept (Double Bass Array) and everything set up & tuned for the personal taste via DSP. No Monoblocks, no passive floorstanders, no cable nonsense - just performance
All over again? We dealing with this same situation back in the 90’s to cut the costs and for mass production. Remember this is a “hobby “ it’s not a mass production staff. We need few with quality and pleasure as a good wine. Please… remember. This’ll not be for everyone. Full Stop.
Something compact and Devialet styled sub 2k I must say would be pretty darn cool
I would buy your active speaker!
maybe incorporate a sprout with some good bookshelf speakers around the $1000 price point!
It just doesnt seem very complex to me if said brand already makes amplifiers people buy lots of, to simply redesign the amp PCB and tailor it for active speaker application. Maybe offer a special "space conscious" outboard preamp with all the BT & Streaming crap but keep the speaker itself away from the digital domain so that it can still also work well with legacy gear and anything from other brands. Its the integrating the HDMI inputs and everything else related that kills the practicality of "Audiophile" active speakers. Gimme something thats perfectly powered, that I can crank all the damn way up and know in my bones nothing unholy will happen to any of the voice coils, : D
So true Paul, audiophiles do like to play around with components. Had a few actives that were great, yet still found myself selling to buy new separate playthings. Also,
'Mericans seem to say Melbourne as Mel-born. Genenerally, it's said by aussies as Mel-ben or Mel-bun.
I’ve thought many times about whether I could sell my N801’s and get Vandersteen 5’s instead with their active bass.
Paul, why do you stipulate that active speakers have to have a streamer built in? Active speakers like the Grimm LSBe (which I own) achieve quite a bit by integrating DAC, amp and speaker in one unit. Of course, it still needs another box as a front end, so it is not quite the ideal that you discuss, but I believe it takes you a long way towards it.
I would love a pair of active FR5s. They would make great studio monitors! I dont think you need a built in streamer either.
best xover.. no xover.
Hi Paul I agree that active speakers would not be a good commercial investment. On a totally different subject if you want to reverse your age do the carnivore diet, I know it sounds crazy, but it worked for me and millions of others ;)
Hi Paul, That is not what I want! I want an active speaker with an XLR analog inputs, and nothing else!
Hi Paul we'll other than the fact you remind me of the president of the United States🤣🤣 half the time I don't think you know what you're saying lol ok bye now .lmfao
Simple answer, separates make you spend more money and that’s how PS Audio grows.
For the first time listening to your videos I come away disappointed. I just heard you say that you are letting the perfect get in the way of the possible. Last year I bought pair of Genelec 3 active speakers. They have no streamer or other stuff built in. They sound great and take up little space. A streamer built into a small preamp ( I use the RME, again without a streamer, but one could be added easily) is the only extra pieice you need to get started. With remote control, it could sit next to the speaker, take up little room, and be the focal point for both customer education to the benefits of an active system, and it would also provide a lower cost point of entry for the curios. It would also provide you with an income generating platform that you could continue to develop into the perfect alternative system.
I used bluetooth speaker 100 watts at work worked for while until distortion destroyed speaker due under power cheap amplifier
Active speakers yes, but no Class D for mids and tweeter..snd therefore is why you don't see them.
Paul, just checking are you a big fish in a small pond or was it the other way around? I’m sure that you’re not referring to the size of your gear.
I don’t want an active speaker that I can stream to. When I think of active I’m thinking more along the lines of ATC
i certainly hope you keep getting older.
I don't want the dac,streamer,photo stage in the speaker.
Just the amp.
My tower speakers have built in powered subwoofers I love that it gives my towers a small foot print and gives my speakers full range output, never mind it takes most of the duty off my tube amp
Strike that comment from the record. To the jury, disregard what you heard.
Finally, some vindication. I love my Magnavox All In One from Walmart for years and continue to listen to it daily. Turntable, cd, am-fm, cassette and came with two speakers! Well, the cassette broke years ago. But I don't have any cassettes anymore. Wish it had Bluetooth though.
Sooner or later you realize,just like real life Dad, Hi-Fi Dad is right.
Hey Paul, i have fully active speakers with class A/B amplification and I don’t think I will ever go back to passive.
Why not make offer the possibility to swap your passive crossovers for analogue electronic crossovers, so people would get the benefits of active amplification but still be able to swap amps and tinker with cables?
Paul has covered this. Removing the crossover from the tweeters and (to a lesser extent) mid range drivers, and allowing direct connection to a power amp means you're one mistake away from blown drivers. From a warranty standpoint, this is Very Bad News. Adding some basic protection circuit (i.e. a capacitor) removes the direct connection that you're trying to achieve.
@@RacingAnt what does any of this have to do with active corssovers?
Legacy audio has dsp and active speakers. Made in usa. Not chinese like ps audio
I love my Meridian active speakers.
no, I want a simple active speaker like what atc offers
I think there is a growing market for active speakers to serve the growing market for tiny homes. Living in Toronto Canada, I see real estate prices that most cannot afford and the trend is to tiny condo spaces. The EU got there long ago.
This hobby caters to wealthier people with space for a listening room with speakers dominating the room. It will by definition remain a boutique market while the masses listen to their iPhone on ear buds or active speakers.
This, so much this...And external streamers arnt that big if needed, imo
I am from T.O Ontario Canada
Damm good point. Active is less boxes and a smaller space or room. Often active can sound bigger by having up to two amps inside the enclosure. Living spaces are shrinking too.
@@kellymichael9567 Yes. Median condo size in Toronto is 820 sq feet. Not built for a full PS Audio rig. And median detached home price is almost $2m. So the average person is retired before they could afford a a high end system and a house to put it in.
Good synopsis of the Market. Music also is something we all love however that alone does not mean many set aside the cash for a quality purchase. Convenience has replaced the hifi systems many could dream about. Soundbars I phone docks and mass market solutions dominate. They are easy portable and you can move them around the house and workshop. Hey I am starting a studio based around hifi monitors from the late eighties. ProAc studio one and psx power amp by Mission. The Golden age of British hifi. Small near fields. Even Serban mixes on them. Then the bigger monitors are B&W semi matrix with somewhat recessed mids(high/low extension. Music matters right?
If it's active it better scale with a better DAC
You said just the oposite 2 years ago..
Besides being funny, Paul makes a bunch of good points except that KEF seems to have cracked the code. I'm certain the KEF LS 50s and 60s won't pass the audiophile purity test but for the money they're close. Also, Mads Buchardt has a good bead on active speakers as well.
I thought the LS60 was amazing and, in my view, would trouble passive systems twice the price. Very impressive indeed
Build it, and they will come!
PS Audio FRAcative. series Perfect in my studio..!
I h%$te active speakers!!! 😤😫
Hi-Fi dad 😄
The "easy button" to test the market would be to take the guts of a Sprout and combine them with a lesser version of the FR10 or revive what would have been the Sprout speakers, and sell that for $2K-$2,500. For the streaming part, there is a commercial part that is common in many intergrateds and active speakers that could be added.
Pricing is over the top.
I don’t want extra capabilities in my active loudspeaker system, ... that's what dates them and renders them toward obsolescence.
Simply stick to;
- Active crossover, alignment and contouring in both time and frequency
- Amplifier type/class optimized per task
- Robust high current, high power, low output impedance directly connected to the driver motors.
Plus 𝙎𝙀𝙍𝙑𝙄𝘾𝙀𝘼𝘽𝙄𝙇𝙄𝙏𝙔
(fwiw, ... I own several active mains, monitors, etc. ... from a couple hundred dollars to several thousand dollars)
I agree with you Paul on the age thing. As far as high end audio goes, I appreciate it, but I'd rather buy a nice car with the same money. Trying to keep my 1970's sound system functioning is taking less money to do (As long as my technician stays alive!) and without a room to dedicate for listening, it serves it's purpose. I do like the concept of active speakers though. Less wires and equipment to deal with.
Make every internal module 'modular' IE...build the circuits on a slot in rail system a bit like a audio mixer has separate circuits per input but make the module within a narrow enclosure that slots in at rear. This way any slot rail circuit can be swapped
ATC make excellent active lineups. In Australia VAF Research make an in-house passive line of hi end speakers in particular their Signature Series Speakers with an option upon request to make an active array including front or rear ports. Rolling Stone Magazine a while ago said their Signature i93 speaker had the best bass in the world. VAF Research sell direct to the customer cutting out the middleman and are also about to release a newer version of their Signature Series in July. (P.S I have no affiliation to VAF Research)
Hmm - the reservations put forward is basically a non-issue with some of the best active speakers available. In my experience one can for 5-6000 usd get the performance of a conventional system many times more expensive. I think that we might see legacy high-end companies go out of business because of they were afraid of eliminating their current business. Just like the development we witness in the automotive industry because of reluctancy by legacy companies to embrace the technology disruption happing right now.
Yes to active, I am 63 and know that an active system if made with great amps and processors can kill a passive system. My old Vandersteen 5 ‘s had a 400 watt amp with a 11 band eq. The difference with the eq set to 0 and having it set to the room was HUGE. I have had fully active DIY systems in the past before DSP , it sounded great, but I still needed passive notch filters and a eq for the bass mostly. It was costly, it had five boxes , it was large and messy with a 12 interconnects, and speaker cables. Paul maybe try trickle up, the FR 10 and with just a line in and DSP to control the eq. I was happy to rig myself of boxes and cables which is way I got the Vandys,
At an audio show in the Netherlands ATC demonstrated the active and passive versions of its SCM50 speakers and let the public vote. 60% went for active, 40% for passive. A small sample from the audiophile public but maybe it says there's a market for both
I’d like your ribbon tweeter or ESS Super Tweeter, two mids (one over and one under the tweeter), a subwoofer outlet, use a height adjustable spring style isolation feet, use a Furutech NCF IEC inlet and a simple remote.
For me the fun of this sport is in exploring every detail and understanding how it all affects the result, and this investigation includes everything important, which means everything from the studs in the wall inwards... almost everything DIY... but that's just me.
Active speakers? Paul, first you tell us it is the future, and then you explain why it is not possible. Isn't that just a utopia?
I have had a great time listening to my U Turn Audio Ethos class A/B powered speakers. It is paired to my U Turn Orbit custom and the system is so clear.
From sound quality point of view, I think active bass and passive mid/high is the best.
Dynaudio Focus 50 active speakers are around 12000 Euro and are said to sound amazing.
PS AUDIO is best choice for every music lovers...
Once I went to a DEQX calibrated active setup there was no going back.
What will happen if we add a soft dom midrange and a soft dom tweeter to your speaker ribbons?
Ha new paul intro "hi its hifi dad hear from ps audio" come on... (Yes i made a dad pun)
B&O have some really nice active speakers
active loudspeakers with zero crossovers and perfectly DSP's amplifiers on each driver is the future of HIFI.,,,I think you will always want a seperate audio interface though, a hub for all the stuff to the TV and computer,..Pre-amps will eventually be the end all be all of audio.
Until all those connections are also wireless. TVs can already connect wirelessly to soundbars, so why not to a pair of active speakers? Just needs the right standards.
@RacingAnt you will need a landline connections to the high speed internet for 8k and all streaming...you will need a connect all BT in out wireless controller. ..a streaming AV interface pre-amp controller.
The best advert for Active loudsoeakers I have heard comes from ATC the ASL300 and the ASL100ASLT. Astonishing is not even close. Pricey yes on the face of it but the Amplification inside these speakers is absolutely top notch and when you factor the price of Great amps in with Great passive, the ATC's represent pretty good value. If it's further down the price class you are looking for, the KEF LS60 offers a really great solution
The active electronics inside those ATCs look like something adcom would build in the 1980s. Not even close to top notch, give me a break.
@@intothevoid9831 and still theyre Studio / Mastering standard speakers. Its not about the look, its about the sound.
Im not sure what im about to say would be considered as active sprakers, but what i dream of when it comes to sound systems is something like this:
Keep all the descreet components, streamets, cd-players, DACs and amps and pre-amps. Instead of passive crossover networks inside the box, give me a DSP and seperate power amps for every driver in a speaker system, let me mix and match those power amps myself. Want tube amps on the tweeter, A or AB on the mids? Sure go ahead!
The DSP would have to have some preset rules like: "tweeter crossover can not be set below some frequency" to protect the speaker just in case someone makes a mistake somewhere
Yes what you described IS an active speaker. In a lot of the comments to this video people are instead describing/wishing for an all in one system. Given PS Audio history for discrete components I would imagine them offering an analogue electronic crossover rather than a DSP.
@@volpedo2000 sure, most people want an easy catch all solution, plug and play stuff. I do not think those are the same people who would buy a truly high end system. Imagine the cost of an active speaker with all the PS audio electronics built in with different inputs and BHK amps, 100k? 150k? I dont think anybody would buy that. I think adding a DSP on the electronics side and a crossover bypass switch on the speakers would let those who wanted to customize their everything to their liking do so, it would also let PS audio sell more amps
@@HanMedSkjegget The issue with DSP is that it has to digitise the signal and I don't think many PS Audio customers would want that after the spend $6K on a Direct Stream Dac. I also think PS Audio wouldn't want customers to be able to change their house sound by tinkering with the DSP settings.
You ask how much would a speaker like that cost? Easy, look at Linn's latest Klimax 360, approx $90K
@@volpedo2000 maybe Im in the minority when it comes to playing around with the signal. If the in-room sound is bad, how pure the signal is does not really matter in my opinion
sympathisch - wie immer...
The amplifier circuit in active speakers would literally be bombarded with vibration from within the cabinet. Putting footers under external amplifiers makes a big difference in the sound quality. A whole industry is based on isolation and it works wonders. Amps inside speakers is THE theoretical worst place for an amp to be. I don't understand why some people believe in isolation and yet consider buying powered speakers.
Far worse than multi disc cd players, amps with a tuner inside (receivers), and automatic turntables. I don't doubt that there could be some good sounding powered speakers out there. But however good they sound; they'd sound far better with an isolated amolifier not being directly bombarded from within from vibration.