Blocked and worn out Swirl flaps
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- Опубликовано: 2 янв 2025
- made this guide several weeks ago, it was supposed to be a part of a full cambelt and manifold removal refit guide. I wasn't happy with the footage so i've pieced this together.
I'm still not happy with it so I will record another once if had another into fix.
Hope this give you a bit of an idea of what goes on inside one of these.
If you Require any part or Quotes for repair work please call 01922 277250
PS this one is for sale.
/ www.italiaautoparts.co.uk
www.italiaautoparts.co.uk
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Is this the problem my 2.4 20v has? Pulsing acceleration.
I really need to get one of those 90deg drills
Hi thanks for sharing such informative video my swirl flap motor is burned is there a way of making like a emulator that can fool the ecu that all is fine
Thanks again
Hi! I would love to see a start to finish swirl flap delete job, showing removal steps on a 1.9jtdm 159/brera. Not much content on the subject so should
do you well on views! Keep up the good content!
Thanks for the idea!
@@ItaliaAutos me too, my son bought a 147 JTDm that had been repaired after ingesting a swirl flap and bending a couple of valves. I couldn't find out if the engine had been de-flapped before he bought it but curiously it has a slightly rough idle and there seems no reason it should be idling roughly. Perhaps it has been de-flapped but I don't want to pull the bastard apart to find out. Is there any other way to find out on these 16-valve flappers?
I have a vauxhall vectra my swirl flap rod keeps popping off and im losing all power i have a replacement on the way do u rekkon it will stay on once the replacement is fitted
Just delete them
@@ItaliaAutos the rod came off so i put it back on and had them deleted but the rod has popped back off again its like the plastic connection is crap like the rods springing back off
If you have had them deleted you don't need the rod
@@ItaliaAutos they have been deleted i have checked they dont move when putting foot on gas but every time the rod comes off i lose power n goes in to limp mode
Thanks for that . My bungs didn’t come with glue , so what glue should I buy ? TIA .
a high temp glue will do.
Hello guys.
Recently been interested in buying the alpha 159.
Found jdtm 2.4 diesel,auto, with around 190k km.
Looks in really good condition, interior aswell.
It has stage 2, swirl flaps off, egr + dpf are off aswell.
Aluminium coolant bleeding valve.
Alternator fixed now and turbo had been repaired a year ago by his words.
The guy has history of treatment claiming he done it every 10k.
He's demanding an high amount than the usual price. Claiming that its because of the time and money spent which is obviously acceptable.
My question is,
What should I check with him about the car and be aware of?
I've read on some forums online that the model had a problem with green and red cooling water,or something like that. And been told to check suspension springs + check for rotten.
aswell with the swirl flaps,egr and dpf, and as I've said he modded it off.
Is this car actually reliable?
Big amount of money to spend as I'm looking forward to keep the car for few good years and who knows maybe forever 🙏
Sorry in advance if there's abit of lack in language, thanks in advance!
Can this be done on a 2008 sprinter dodge van?
How much would this cost in a garage as i would like mine done
Around £600
Buy one in Ebay and blanket yourself, some people do this for £200 and they fit the new one you will spend £324
Hi - great video - thanks. When putting the manifold back together what torque are the bolts tightened to? I know the manifold to block torque but not the torque for putting the two halves of the manifold back together.
Also great video. Where there any changes in engine performance afterwards?
Starts better and revs better.
@@ItaliaAutos Thank you for the quick answer. Do you think it was only because of the clean-up or also because of the extra air?
Because if so... I might look into doing that too, even though I never had problems.
I’m having problems with my swirl flaps and some of my local garages have told me the the engine would need remapped? I thought that they would just disconnect the actuator arm?
Doesn't need remaping. It will be just fine without. Just leave arm off.👍
Italia Autos got the swirl flaps removed and also changed the timing belt and water pump at the same time. Car is driving perfect now.👌
@@andrewbrickstock good stuff, thanks for letting me know.
Hey just seen your video I have done my EGR need to do the throttle body but the manifold is bringing up some codes
Question is do I need to have the flaps deleted off the car will blocking all the holes would it bring up any faults now they have been replaced by caps cheers
Hi mate, one of the swirl flaps was injested, just the one. They're plastic ones by the way, would that destroy the engine as well. I thought of changing the type like you just done. Or is there anyway of fishing it out. The one nearest to the egr valve, far right. Thx
Very interesting video. How do we know ours are on the way out.? Is the a tell tale sound?
Test for bubbles. I did a video on it
Do you not replace the plastic flaps with metal ones?
No you remove the flaps totally to avoid them coming off and going into the engine.
@@ItaliaAutos just out of interest, what's the purpose of the flaps? (I don't do diesel Alfas).
@@greengrass9572 there all about emission controls and reducing toxic gasses. they should be closed up to about 2000rpm so if there leaking they cause start up and idle/smoke problems.
@@gunnarlandin3258 so....which is it? Is it good or bad to remove the flaps and block the holes? Does it idle weird and doesn't have much power on high revs or not when the flaps are like the ones on the video? Because my BMW 230d does exactly that. And can't find something with the diagnostic computer
is it posible to see it if that was done when buying a car ? those plugs is facing up if i understand right?
Yep
Thanks for the video. I have an intermittent fault with the engine warning light coming on. I get that loss of power. A friend lent me his OBD device and it came up with code p2075. Any idea of what you would charge to fix this?
Book it in with me and I'll take a look
I really appreciate that but I'm up in Blackburn. I do get the problem that you can't really diagnose without looking.@@ItaliaAutos
If I blank it would it go In to limp mode and have to be mapped out or will a light just come on thanks
you dont blank the swirl flaps you just remove them and block the hole where they fit into the manifold. no warning light will come on. they will just be a slight low rage power difference. hope this helps. neil
@@ItaliaAutos is it noticeable decrease?
@@owenthomas3 no. But it's worth getting a remap for the extra power you will get
@@ItaliaAutos how much would garage charge to do?
Owen Thomas including a belt change normally around £550
Ive finally got my manifold welded and its way way better but still slow under turbo could that be due to not being mapped
a small amount could be. check for vacuum leaks on the turbo.
@@ItaliaAutos yea mate did say the actuator was leaking do i have to replace the whole turbo🙈
Can you replace just the actuator pal
@@owenthomas3 see if it moves when it's reved.
@@ItaliaAutos ill give it a go when im home but the machanic siad its loosing vaccum from the actuarter
As I heard in restyled Alfas 159 (from 2008/2009 on) e.g. 1.9 JTDm 110 KW, those swirl flaps aren't plastic anymore. Is it true and is there still a possibility for those updated non-plastic (not sure from what material were they made) swirl flaps to cause problems, like breaking off and getting sucked in the engine? Thanks.
Milan Videnović there still crap and block and leak.
There have been flaps on BMW, Audi and others that would break and then fall into the engine and leave ugly marks on the piston and cylinder head. But on this type breaking swirl flaps are not very likely. The most common error, even on the newer generation manifolds, is the swirl operating rod coming off.
Sooner or later they will fall off and damage you engine.
Remove them ASAP.
Thanks for making this video! I've got a question, my intake had a flap missing and its not in the intakeport had it hasnt got a rattle sound, where coult it be gone?
into the exhaust and stopped at the cat
Will you need the locking tool when removing the manifold on the 2.4 jtdm?
Nope
@@ItaliaAutos Okay Thank you sir
@@ItaliaAutos Would a plastic flap cause serious damage inside the engine as the metal ones or would it be less of a mess?
egr is the most catastrophic invention for an engine...
so on an alfa engine you need to remove the cambelt to fix the swirl flap ??
I'm not sure about 2.4, but on 1.9 you can just unhook the actuator. If you know how, it's 10 minutes job. That's for older style manifold
Does the alfa gt ,110kw,1.9jtd,2004 year,has flaps?
No engines from 2006 on
@@ItaliaAutos tnx god :)
Hi, what do you use istead of the ,,gasket"? Silicone?
More Gasket silicone sealant
I need to do this job to my Saab 9-3 any tips on how to to remove the inlet manifold thanks
Can you pull them out with the manifold in situ??
Nope
Q: why would you remove the swirl flaps?
Loss of power. Excessive smoke on start up, poor starting.
Do you ideally need to map them out after blanking them?cheers lad
You don't need to.
Does he terrify you like he does me prying and hammering on cast aluminum lol? Looks like a nice job overall.
never had one break on me yet. but the screws can be a pig sometimes.
I bet they can be! That looks like nasty job, I have no problems with mine yet just getting prepped.
@@cameronmcmillian1519 just take your time and remove all the carbon.
@@ItaliaAutos can u do the swirl flaps without taking the manifold off or do u have to break the old ones to get them out.?
@@johnsmith-nl3js have to take the manifold off, and cambelt / fuel pump aswell.
I hate Swirl flaps! worst than EGR!! if I blocked open all the times would it have a warning light?
Is this similar to GM's Twinport system?
never taken on off sorry
@@ItaliaAutos basically, at low revs a flap shuts in one of the ports to each cylinder, something to do with restricting excessive airflow at low revs to maximise torque. Then above a certain RPM, the flaps open to allow airflow into both ports to each cylinder to maximise power as more air is required... Something like that. I just wonder if these flaps in the Alfa system operates in the same way?
So you dont need te flaps??? Could you explain?
flaps are only to reduce emissions, which is a good thing but they fall off and wreck your engine.
@@ItaliaAutos would this make it an MOT failure then ??
What did you use to clean the carbon and gun?
Carb cleaner and a pressure washer.
@@ItaliaAutos Thanks
Ok, so what do these swirl flaps do, and what engines are they on?
They control air flow into the engine to enable a better fuel mixture and to reduce harmful gasses. Fitted to most diesel engines after 2006.
@@ItaliaAutos They also close when switching the engine off on diesels lowering compression for a smooth switch off
Greetings! Are these engines reliable? What are the most expensive problems with this engine?
This and a clutch change
Fairly reliable yes.
I think you were cleaning the map sensor, not the maf sensor.
Is this the Mercedes OM612 5 cylinder diesel as I would love to delete mine but can't find any delete kits
no its the alfa vauxhaul saab type.
Hi Neil. I have 2.4 just like this one. Are these swirl flaps controlled by vacuum or from the ECU? If I remove them, should I change something in the ECU too? Is welding better or this kit just work fine to block the flaps?
Thank you for the helpful videos.
Nothing else is needed but a remap would help
Which is diameter of bolt? 18 or 22mm?
I need to do the same job to mine 159 2.4, It's long job because you have to take off the timing belt and gasoil high pomp....
id say around 5 hours to do the job.
How much would this cost at a mechanics? Just got a 1.9 jtdm and want this done
£550 inc genuine cambelt kit and waterpump
Thanks for your awesome Videos! A lot of Alfa Owners/Club members from Germany are following your Channel! :)
It is necessary/important to remove the flaps like in the video after i closed/delete the EGR or it doesnt matter ?
They all need removing before or after as they won't last for ever.
@@ItaliaAutos And what do you think about to open it all and block at this position? This is what my tuner wants to do beside deactivate EGR and do an map-optimization. Now im a little bit confused, because you closed and he wants to open it :D
@@marcodefelice200 Leaving the swirl flaps open has the same effect as installing the plugs. But it's a lot easier unless you have the inlet manifold off anyway.
I'd not worry about it and just keep using the swirl flaps unless they really cause problems though. Unless your mechanic/tuner will make the modifications for free ;-)
@@phswirl1167 it doesen't have the same effect.
The amount of carbon deposits restrict airflow so your tuner it's not very wise .
@@giuistefanjr72 You get carbon build up to an extent that causes trouble when the swirl rod comes off and the flaps are permanently closed. But even then, if you fix the swirl rod with a repair solution like mine, the carbon that really blocks air flow will go out the exhaust. The rest just looks a lot worse than it is.
Beyond this, as mentioned in another post, leaving the flaps open or replacing them with plugs is illegal. They are not there for fun, but because they improve combustion and emissions at part load.
By the way, I'm the inventor of the the replacement bushings and rods that you can get as copies on eBay and elsewhere - original is www.swirlrepair.com. So I know a little about the topic ;-)
Hi there, I'm in New Zealand and dont have any Alfa specialists near me. Could you recommend a removal kit that I could buy online to give to my mechanic. Not looking to get a new manifold and im worried the plugs might not fit for my 2.4. Cheers
Best thing is to sort out the exhaust, as long as the DPF prevents proper air travel the engine and front will be blocked,drill DPF with just 1 masonry drill the whole way , the sensors will still work regen normally but no more front manifold and EGR blocked! I too live on a distant place and island with non of the stuff! My 2.4 jtdm is 130 000 km now.i not far from new zealand infact!also use proper engine oil like 5w30 for DPF low ash dont go with manufacturer 5w40 it causes block etc.
I'm guessing these will be on my 2007 147 1.9 jtdm. How much would it cost to have them removed at a garage? Ball park....
Yes it will. I charge £550 Inc a cambelt change.
Might see if I feel confident enough to give it a go myself before going to the garage
Scrap that idea. That looks like a lot of work. Think I'll just save for a few weeks and get it booked in somewhere 😂
What a video Nei'
Absolute pleasure watching your videos mate 🔧👍
Thanks so much 👌💯
Thanks 👍
what engine is this manifold from??? please
Alfa 159 2.4 or 1.9
How did you install the new swirl flaps??
Merlin51h he didn’t
EGR blank and delete stops all this if you do it in time
can i buy replacement swirl flaps ?
michael pearce no just a replacement manifold or the blanking kit
For this particular type of manifold there are no separate swirl flaps available. But you can get a replacement rod to install on the old swirl flaps. swirlrepair.com/wp/swirlrepair-diagnostics/. That solves the biggest issue, i.e. the swirl operating rod coming off. Worn swirl flap bearings/seals can also become a problem at some point, but in most cases it's not that severe.
@@ItaliaAutos Please, see below alternative solution ruclips.net/video/7AT789XgAo8/видео.html
Hello
thank you for this video
Can you please share a link or two to buy this kit
And a 2nd question for a 2.4 200hp whats the diametre. is it the same as 210hp
Ty
You can find it on ebay , diameter is 18.5mm and there are 5 big pieces and one small one
Hi,
can you tell me how exactly the intake manifold come off ,because i try and the injection pressure pump mount
it's bothering.I dont wan't to take off the belt.
Sorry for bad english.My car is Alfa Romeo 147 1,9.
I have a engine light on my 2008 caddy regarding swirl flaps. Any tips on how to fix?
Why remove swirl flaps.....?
Because they can be ingested into the engine wjen they come off.
If you have headphones on this video you can hear it with 3d sound
Hi there, I have a mk5 Astra 1.9cdti sri (150) and mine has these swirl flaps aswell.
What is the purpose of blocking the swirl flaps? I understand its to keep the inlet manifold clean from that black carbon stuff but I mean if it was designed/built like this from factory, and you block the holes/flaps.. doesn't this cause any damage to the engine in another way? 😕
I only ask because I need my timing belt+water pump changed and I'm wondering if its a big thing to do, maybe get this done aswell at the same time if it will stop the flaps from doing any damage to the engine or a "must do" if you know what I mean? 🤦🏻♂️ lol
5:53 MAP not MAF
yep. totally my error been noted before, but thanks for the comment.
If you dont hace or get plugs u can use a soldering iron n carve out the swirl flaps while leaving the middle stem and the outer plug.problem solved
I’m sorry that’s a bad idea as the seals leak as well as the flaps falling off.
3:18 You're welcome.
That wasn't a MAF, but a MAP. I'm sure you know that, but just to let you know!
Yes your right blonde moment wjen editing the video. Lol
@@ItaliaAutos can you tell me what diameter are those plugs for blocking the flaps?
Thanks.
Here is a video explaining the function of swirl flaps: ruclips.net/video/m5AviXgca88/видео.html
The idea is to have better combustion at part load. Whether or not that's noticeable I don't know, but they are there for a reason.
You may also want to mention that removing swirl flaps affects the engine's emissions, so even if it saves some trouble, it's not really legal.
Listen dude if you delete this flaps you loose torque and power below 2500 rpm, refit with new and 10 more years without problem
You will loose some Torque but most people don’t notice.
It's quite noticable, I didn't expect that much. I'm thinking about mapping my car now...
Бить не надо они легко вытаскиваются.
Use oven cleaner
damn thats nasty
buy a petrol problem solved
My conclusion is that unless you have expert knowledge and a fully equipped workshop like yourself, Alfa's are poorly engineered and not worth the trouble despite what Clarkson says.😃
Good channel though.👍
Hi. Strange that the poorly engineered part is German lol 😆 thanks for watching
@@ItaliaAutos need a channel this good about Jaguar Xf,'s unless you fancy working on them.😃
That’s not a repair. You just removed them and blocked the holes. They’re there for a reason,
And they all off and cause major damage to the engine. your choice to keep them if you want to.