I feel like it’s more than a romantic relationship or a friend relationship. It’s a complicated one. Clara changed how the Doctor does his actions and how he feels. The Doctor changed Clara too. I just love how the journey came and ended with the Doctor and Clara from that telephone call to the Doctor’s memory wipe.
It was definitely romantic, even the actors confirm that it was like that. But I see that it was more than that, this was an expression of a high level of love that few understand: Unconditional Love...
I read all over that the Doctor doesn't realize that Clara's "I love you" is intended for him, not Danny, but I disagree. True, the Doctor isn't looking at her, so he doesn't see her looking right at him as she says it, but judging from the soft smile on his face, it registers with him all the same.
Yo creo que si, 12thDoctor es muy imteligente como para no darse cuenta de eso y Clara tambien. Ambos sabian pero no lo decian directamente o se hacian los desentendidos. aunque en un principio no he notado ese detalle que lo pase por alto
He did absolutely just immediately say yes when he thought she was actually asking him to be her boyfriend. No hesitation at all. He was willing to put in research for it.
It's definitely not simply platonic, nor is it father/daughter, but I'm not sure boiling it down to something as simple as "romantic" quite fits either. I think Twelve and Clara are the best the show has ever done at...uh..."accurately" depicting how a relationship would go between a 20-something year old girl and an alien who is hundreds or even thousands of years old with a time traveling space ship. They are smitten with each other, but it's not like they want to go make out or something; it's a special type of true love that transcends just romance I think. As flawed as Moffat's tenure was, the relationship between Twelve and Clara was something truly unique that you'll never find in any other show, and that's when Doctor Who is at its best; when it handles things in ways no other media can it truly stands out. Oh and great editing by the way. You clearly have a talent for this.
Exactly. Cuanta razon y verdad tenes en lo que mencionas. Y es basicamente que llegue a una conclusion de la relacion que hubo entre Twelve y Clara. Esto es Una muestra perfecta de otro nivel mas elevado de amor, y que mucha gente no comprende y no llego a ese nivel de lo que es el AMOR INCOMDICIONAl y lo que significa realmente. Lo mejor de Moffat fue ilustrarnos todo eso como ejemplo y que Twelve/Clara tengan un buen desarrollo evolutivo asi como mostrarnos esa conexion compleja y profunda que muy pocas veces se logra ver a la perfeccion y bien interpretadas en pantalla. Twelve/Clara son la excepcion y ejemplo de ese amor Incondicional...
Brilliantly said. Your line 'it's a special type of true love that transcends just romance'. is perfect and such ‘love’ although very rare exists. Somethings are almost beyond words. Romantic love is sweet, but it is not the ultimate form of connection that two people can have. It is even greater than being prepared to sacrifice your life. In fact, I think very few people would be able to comprehend such a powerful force but Moffatt, Capaldi and Coleman acted it convincingly. Smith did a good got at it, but it almost needed the older looking man to bring home the point it is nothing to do with youthfulness, nor looks, nor romance. For those who have experienced it is both wonderful but also so painful to care that strongly and profoundly for another and it does take a toll. Even Moffat brought that home in his writing. Hell Bent was severely criticised by most DW fans but those moments with the Doctor and Clara were some of the most poignant moments I have ever seen in DW and ones to cherish. I agree the editing was superbly done.
I suppose others like me are not saying there was no romance involved but that it was also so much more than that. So well acted and written it is too difficult to define beyond the words total devotion.@@ChibiHoshiDragon
@@ChibiHoshiDragonAnd I think it was good that he said it even if it was only once. And it is curious that he will start by saying No, but in the end he said the opposite. 
I was never a fan of the Doctor in a romantic relationship with anyone, not even Tenth and Rose. (I didn't hate their relationship but I would have preferred them as platonic). River and the Doctor made a great duo, but she appeared so sporadically I didn't grew as fond of them as a couple. But then Clara appeared and here I am, shipping them like crazy. I ship them in the way you ship old married couples. They were so unconditionally devoted to each other it's hard to deny they saw eachother that way.
Admito que tambien no me agrada Clara con 11th, pero cuando llego 12th inmediatamente la manera de verlos cambió.Que me convenció desde el principio. Su relacion fue autentica y compleja. Lo cual me agrada eso. Von River no fue con convincente nada de eso.
Devoted is a great word for it. Complete devotion to another in all things no matter what. Transcedning all stereotypes of love and romance and being so much more.
"If you love me, you will come back" *Comes back* "Clara I'm not your boyfriend. I never thought you were. I never said it was your mistake" THE WAY HE FELT FLATTERED WHEN HE THOUGHT THAT CLARA WAS DATING A GUY WHO LOOKED LIKE HIS YOUNGER SELF. THE HAND HOLDING, THEY'RE SO ROMANCE-CODED IT'S ACTUALLY HILARIOUS.
They both deserved a better ending. Their love story was absolutely beautiful and heartbreaking. Clara and 11 were all flirty and fancied each other but 12's and Clara's relationship blossomed into true romance. It drives me insane when I see people commenting that their relationship was that of just friends or worse father/daughter. I'm sorry, but what kind of "daughter" would stare at her "father" the way Clara stares at the Doctor as though she wants to jump on him. What kind of just a friend would spend 4 billion years of pure hell trying to get Clara back. I don't watch DW anymore ever since Capaldi left. But I honestly would've ended them both just flying away together. Rose had her bittersweet ending, but it worked. I wish that 12th Doctor and Clara would've ended together somehow.
you know who would live 4 billion years for another. a good father. more so than a lover. and the doctor Is a good man. I dont think he'd do any less. besides Moffett confirmed that they did love each other during 11. but after 12th coming in they decided to be platonic.
@@MelinaVader well each incarnation are super different have very different ways of looking at things. regeneration for example. out of all the doctors only 10 and 12 felt real conflict over having to change. the rest just kind of accepted it. just like how in real life alot of people aren't scared of death. but others are. feelings could change the same way. take one person have them go through life with a significant other. take another person and have them do the same things with the same person. they aren't gonna feel the same even if they went through the same thing. although the doctor is still the doctor. 12 is like if an old man lived through all those experiences. the feelings he has are 11s experiences not his own.
@@alphyishere they are all the same Doctor. 9 is 10 is 11 is 12. It’s tricky when it comes to regeneration because it’s mostly psychological. 9’s regeneration to 10 was because of Rose. 9 fell in love with Rose and that transferred to 10, and he wanted to look younger and more juvenile for Rose. 10’s regeneration as 11 was like a child and overly positive because of what 10 has suffered. 11’s regeneration of 12 being an “old grumpy man” was from the solitude and loss he went through. So 12 kind of shuts those emotions and locks them in the back of his mind. That does not mean that he stopped having feelings for Clara. They are all the dame Doctor, it’s just psychologically is how they readjust with a new face and new body. All their experiences is the same, it’s how they grow and it’s how they become the Doctor.
He loves that woman more than he's ever loved anything in his long and painful life, and not a second of it feels wrong or forced. You see all she does for him, all she's given up, all the times she came through for him. It was like I was right there with him as I was watching the episode, understanding exactly what he felt and why. I've never had an experience like it woth anything I've ever watched. He couldn't bear to lose her and not do the same. She jumped into his time stream to save his life, pulled him from the depths of his darkness after the death of the ponds, gave him the support and reminder he needed on the hardest day of his life in the barn on he day of the time war, comforted him as a boy as he cried in the dark and gave him a lesson that stayed with him his entire life about fear and how it makes companions of us all. Clara was such an impossibly amazing companion and friend, more than that she was the most important person he'd ever known. The story breaks and brightens up my heart every single time. This stuff cuts so deep that I cry. I just can't stop coming back ro this video every couple of months to shed a few more years. The saddest love story of all time, the one that really sticks with me.
Idk about ever but certainly from New Who. Martha is a pretty close second if you ask me, would have much rather seen her return for the 60th over Donna given how her story was post End of Time but oh well
I‘m only at the beginning of season 8 but I’m confused that many people really think they have a normal friendship or a father/daughter relationship. I mean their relationship feels similar to ninerose/Tenrose, except that now the doctor turned older, not younger. They both make each other better, they both clearly have feelings for each other but can’t really say it and then there’s that jealous boyfriend. It’s not a friendship it’s a romance and you can’t change my mind.
Lo mismo pienso. Me es indiferente como la mayoria piensa, sera por sus prejuios, que solo fue una relacion padre/hija,lo cual es descartado poruqe jamas puedes llegar abofetear a tu propio padre ¿no? cuando en los episodios se muestra lo contrario a comoes su relacion solo que no lo admiten con palabras pero lo demuestran con sus acciones, miradas y estar pendiente del uno del otro mutuamente
It's been so long and still there is people who deny their relationship. I honestly got tired of explaining it because as you've shown they just need TO WATCH THE SHOW. Anyway great vid I'm glad to see people still enjoy them. Twelve and clara are really special to me and will be forever.
funny how if they casted someone young for twelve everyone would ship it so much 💀 whouffaldi is more than romantic and platonic, they have something really deep, i love the complication of it all and for me, clara is one of those that he will always remember, he might not picture a face for it, but he knows for sure theres something deep feelings and longing when it comes to clara they are star crossed soulmates
nunca tuve problemas con eso, simplemente me encantan estos dos y la dinamica que formaron a lo largo de la serie es profunda y unica que nunca antes vista y realizada otra vez
I am so glad that other people enjoyed their dynamic as much as I did. For as toxic as it got they were so wonderful together and the way Capaldi and Coleman both brought their characters feelings to life was utterly beautiful to watch. Clara had big shoes to fill in my opinion after coming off of the Amy/Rory/River dynamic but by the time series 9 rolled around I had really grown to love her and her arc and seeing it wrap up is still heartbreaking to watch
This duo was the best Doctor Who ever had. They complimented each other so well. They started off as a flirty couple, like young lovers are, 💏 but then they grew into something deeper and more profound. Clara has been the one Companion who has seen the most iterations of the Doctor, and who has saved many of them as well from the Great Intelligence, and the Doctor has saved her too in different ways on more than one occasion, the most relevant in Face the Raven. They couldn't live without one another, they couldn't live with each other either. But one day I do hope they meet one final time before Clara's final hearbeat and she can put her hand on his cheek one last time knowing he does remember her again before he lays her to rest. It may never happen on screen but I hope at least Big Finish will tell this story. Run together forever, and remember! ❤️❤️🫂
God I hope so. I just finished Series 9 and i'm more heartbroken than ever. I wanted so badly to take this beautiful amazing story that she was absolutely worthy of from her so many times just so they could be together. The end was so bittersweet. It's my favorite story ever told and affected me more than any story ever has, and Clara Oswald is my favorite character in all of fiction. I'm having a tough time continuing on with the show but I know I have to keep watching. If they ever ended Doctor Who, I'd love The Doctor and Clara to meet one more time before he becomes the Great Curator from Day of the Doctor.
Yeah, why did Missy do that exactly? When asked about it, she basically said that she did it just for kicks. Apparently, she had no nefarious scheme and put the Doctor and Clara together just for the hell of it. Other versions of the Master would have had an ulterior motive but then again, Missy's the only incarnation who could make a redemption arc believable. I think this was partially because she's a woman and they can be a bit more, to quote Elastigirl, "flexible". The male Masters were too stubborn and egotistical to change as drastically as Missy did.
@@tomnorton4277 Well, what Missy really said is that she put them together because the Doctor should never be controlled but, Clara was the one who would be able to control him. Basically, she knew that the Doctor would love Clara so much that he would do things for her that he would never do for anyone else (even if they were possibly bad/dangerous ideas). And she was right. That's what made him/them become the hybrid. He couldn't be purely logical with her. And I think Missy just did it for the pure chaos of it all. Basically, she went and found the Doctor's soulmate just to see what would happen when the Doctor 's equilibrium is thrown off-balance by his feelings taking true precedence over his mind. Missy was a bit more of a crazy general chaos worshipper than more traditional versions of the Master so, that logic tracks to me.
May I say, this video is not just a good compilation of “moments”, it’s a story in itself. Also the music brought me to tears by the end of the video so I couldn’t watch it through the tears and now I have to watch it again. Thank you, truly. This relationship with Clara brought some long needed maturity not just between two specific characters but to the vast variety of fictional stories. It’s a great work by both Capaldi and Coleman, and by writers, too. There is always a risk of such a relationship portrayed creepy and thus being misunderstood. But their work is so brilliant, their characters are so tender and caring for one another. I don’t have many otps, but this one is definitely at the top of the list.
I think 11 and Clara were definitely romantic but the Doctor was scared of that, everytime he felt that way he tried to suppress it. It freaked him out because he remembers what happened to Rose and even Amy to an extent. I think when 11 regenerated he knew it was over with Clara because of how old he looked, so 12 deep down still loved her but knew he couldn’t act on those feelings anymore, no more flirting or anything. It’s actually sad.
I've only ever seen one other fictional portrayal of love that is as pure and unconditional as Clara and the Doctor's bond and that is Entrapta and Hordak's relationship in She Ra. Like Clara and the Doctor, who would go to Hell and back for each other even after their rocky relationship in Season 8, Entrapta and Hordak don't place each other on pedestals and they don't expect perfection, they just want each other to be who they are. It's strange that the most genuine portrayals of love rarely feel the need to express it in any traditional way. Entrapta and Hordak never kiss or say "I love you" in She Ra but you can clearly see that they adore each other more than anything. Clara and Doctor are similar because the one time Clara kissed the Doctor in a blatantly romantic way was in The Snowmen, and that was an echo not the real Clara, and even the "I love you" in Mummy on the Orient Express was deliberately meant to imply that she could be talking to the Doctor, Danny or perhaps both.
Yeah idk how people think this is farther/ daughter like or just a friendship. Its basically, like lovers but the man reincarnated into someone too old for her that the romantic feelings have to be suppressed by both of them. Even though their love still lingers silently.
Exactly I agree They both repressed their love but throughout the series they seemed to soften and express love in a unique way that only they both knew and knew.
I feel like people who felt uncomfortable shipping 12 and Clara just because of how old Capaldi was can’t ship 10 and Rose because of the 900+ year age gap
Clara Oswald ! I want her returned , safe , unharmed ! If Clara Oswald is dead then you better be careful how you tell me that ! Who is going to go first ?
Here's an interview with Capaldi where he says the Clara and the Doctor have a romantic relationship. ruclips.net/video/K7i62ERas2s/видео.html Clara and 11 definitely had feelings for each other too, like that early love glow phase. (Matt Smith teasingly called Clara the doctor's girlfriend in an interview) But with 12, feelings got complicated with his change, new personality, and the reality of who he really was. Their feelings didn't go away, but instead got pushed down and hidden, while forming into something very deep. I've always loved seeing Clara and his relationship through both incarnations of the Doctor.
I have saved this for future viewings. A perfect compilation. Exactly what I need. On my sad days, and my happy days. And the rainy days where it feels like the mad man in a box is all alone again. Perfect for those moments and all the more. 2:06 I wish Capaldi will hear his fans pleas.
It's the same thing for me that it is for you, I'm on my first view of it in a little while. My friend and I just watched Time Heist on our watch through the show, he's loved the series so far. Clara and the Doctor is such an amazingly moving story that hasn't left me since I first watched it a few years ago. I absolutely love it to bits and pieces, it's my favorite thing I've ever watched. Capaldi owns the role of the best incarnation of the doctor in the history of the character so far in my opinion and Clara absolutely blows the other companions out of the water. She's my favorite character in anything I have ever watched, read, played, or listened to. I'm crushed that she doesn't have too many appearances outside the show in the Doctor Who expanded media. I'm glad to know someone else loves it as much as I do
What i think is more interesting. The real feelings between Peter Capaldi and Jenna Coleman and how that tension influences there acting. In a real world situations an age difference of almost 3 decades is not healthy. That struggle and tension is interesting to see how they cope with it and how it finds it's way in there acting.
I guess it was a great acting job from their sides as they both are professional actors. No feelings in real life. I guess for P.C. there has always been only one woman to adore, his wife Elaine. He has said it in many interviews, just watch for example Larry King's interview in 2015. Even now, these days, he keeps looking at her as if they have just started to date, but they have spent 30 years together and they are both 66 y.o. At first i also assumed that Peter and Jenna were acting so perfectly because they had real feelings in real life. But later i thought no...they are just great and professional actors who had the script and their lines....))) And i guess, at comic cons they looked at each other " with love" because they had their contracts and their job was to promote the show and be good to the fans...
Me too. I like River, simply because Alex Kingston's one of the very few actresses who can make a Mary Sue likeable, but she was the Doctor's superior, not his equal, and there were parts of her story that really rubbed me the wrong way. Learning to fly the TARDIS on her first try and doing it better than the Doctor does? Give me a break. Plus she could use regeneration, which is a Time Lord's most powerful ability. There's absolutely no chance that somebody with 2 HUMAN parents could have that power, regardless of being conceived while the TARDIS is in the Time Vortex. At most, River would just have a longer lifespan and a more accurate perception of time than the average person, not regeneration powers. I could buy it if the Doctor was River's father, but then he'd have married his own daughter which is all kinds of fucked up. Clara's relationship with the Doctor was perfectly balanced and because of that, it was strong enough to carry 2 entire seasons, as well as the latter portion of Matt Smith's run which included the 50th anniversary special, arguably the most important milestone in Doctor Who's history. Clara and the Doctor were neither superior nor inferior to each other - they each had strengths and weaknesses but they fit together so perfectly that they could cover each others flaws and accentuate each others assets - so if you're looking for a truly equal dynamic between a man and a woman, you'd be hard pressed to find it anywhere else, especially in the current political climate. I feel like Steven Moffat learned from his mistakes with River and it was wise of him to use her sparingly because unlike Clara, she can only carry a couple of episodes at a time.
@@tomnorton4277 Yeah, you sumarized everything that I disliked about River. She is not his equal, but superior for no realistic reasons. Their relationship feels less real and relatable.
I think they have a relationship beyond romantic and platonic. I don't think that those are the only two options for relationships, that they have to be one or the other. I think they're both, or neither. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
This is an example of an advanced level of expressing love, Unconditional Love, that very few reach that level or understand. Because love, more than a feeling, is a promise and commitment to assume all responsibility for being with someone or towards something. And this was what was seen in Twelve/Clara. But in the end this faded and Twelve acted blinded by the pain of losing someone he really cared about.
I love this music and it fits their relationship. Wow a great post!! I like the song The Shepherd's Boy. Man, that was the song when the 12th Doctor changed to the 13th Doctor that was a great scene as well. i can not stop watching this!!!
I love the music score. I don't ship them as romantic but I love how they care about eachother. That they'll die for eachother which made the relationship toxic.Just my opinion don't go hating on me . This was a great collaboration & its very heartfelt. Fantastic ❤
it’s simple 11 had intense emotions for her, but 12 was different he loved her but he knew he couldn’t be with her like that, hence “i didn’t say it was your mistake”
I think so many people or this story is a romance, because of Capaldi's age, which is ridiculous. All of a sudden, these two have become a parent/child relationship because the doctor looks old, which is complete bullshit. There is also the River case. I specify that I ship the doctor with Rose, River, Clara, Yaz, I like all his romantic companions. But to deny that the Doctor was also romantically in love with Clara on the pretext that there was River is a mistake. I don't see why he couldn't have loved them at the same time. Especially since he always knew he would lose River one day. That she won't stay. Whereas with Clara, he had this hope that she really would stay forever. But of course, no companion stays forever. It's gotten to the stage where I also ship the doctor with the master. Let the guy be happy with someone who can always stay. Pity. But honestly, I think Clara was the doctor's kindred spirit, and he'll never find someone like her again. She was like him. She was the doctor too. Also, the fact that she is bi (insinuated with the episode where there is Jane Austen) was also practical since the doctor can also regenerate as a woman. Rose : The lover. River : The wife. Clara : The treasure of a lifetime. Yaz : The one she wants it to last forever with.
I agree that anyone who uses River as a pretext are narrow-minded monogamous-limited thinkers. But I also think that those who call any other romance of the Doctor outside River a "pure" love or "transcending romance" or some such nonsense as if only allosexuals can have "regular" romance and asexuals can't have romantic orientations are just as limited. Yes, ace-aros exist but so do ace-roms, allo-aros, and cross-orientated people. People are closed-minded to those other possibilities. Rose and River and Clara and Yaz are all Romantic Partners. Period. Full Stop. No need to categorize into different boxes.
This topic was questioned so much, I think so, it is a romantic friendship that touches on the codepence between them, but since Peter is quite older they wanted to go the other way, but the chemistry between them was spectacular for me, the best duo since the fourth doctor with Sarah Jane and 10th with Donna, the love they profess for each other goes beyond time and space itself. It is spiritual, the meeting of two rebellious souls who, when they come together, bring out the bad and the good in each other. Jenna shined like never before next to Peter, with 11th it seemed like a teenage relationship except for the end in Trenzalore, I almost didn't like the chemistry between them.
The Doctor literally can't let Clara out of his thoughts for 4 billion years. He was ready to break the entire universe just to bring her back. You, too, have been hammering a wall with your hand for 4 billion years for the sake of your "friends"? The doctor didn’t even remember his wife all this time. How much more proof is needed here that he not only loves her, but is obsessed with her? And although Clara treated him as a friend, she still showed interested attention to him. In the Christmas episode, she said that after Danny there was another worthy man, but a relationship with him, alas, was impossible. She was talking about the Doctor and she clearly loved him
Does anyone know why he has the Gibson SG in this episode rather than his other guitar...is it just because his main guitar was still in his Tardis, which he hadn't yet found, or was there any deeper significance?
My guess is he picked it up while traveling the country. SG's are incredibly divisive, not for everyone, and even a little offputting for their look and feel. But man, do they sing when you play them right. And I think that's perfect for an old-school punk rocker like Twelve -- the kind of man who's not for everyone, but would spend countless lives fighting to save someone he loves.
I always felt 11 and clara we very couple like and they fsncied each other it changed with 12 do it wasnt romantic with him but very soulmate like ... but yeah 11 and clare lowkey in love
Eleven and Clara is clearly Steven Moffat's fantasy of himself being the Doctor, and Clara being the bi-curious school teacher that enables him. Hilarious self-insertion
Possibly, I’ve never thought of that but timeline wise it makes sense given that it was implied that at the end of his run 11 hadn’t seen river in a while and 12 only met her once so the answer is, possibly.
Not true. Only those who are narrowminded and cling to monogamy have a problem here. She had a relationship with Jane while dating Danny too. So why not with 12? I see Danny as a perfect example of Clara loving and accepting every part of the Doctor, including War. Something the Doctor can't even accept of himself. It is why he hated on Danny so much. He was a math teacher/intelligent person and a soldier (both aspects of what she also loved in the Doctor and the doctor tried to deny in himself).
why, if I may ask? I generally find that people have a narrow view of romance and that is why they can't grasp the 12/Clara relationship as romantic. They have a limited idea that only Allosexuals have Romantic attraction and all asexuals are aromantic (Ace-Aro). Have you thought about the existence of ace-roms? What that looks like in practice. Why can't that also apply to 12/Clara?
@@kyeo77 I'm asking for specifics as to why you don't see Clara and 12 as a romantic relationship and only see a father/daughter relationship. I then added that my observations of those who don't see certain relationships as romantic seem to have sex as part of their definition of romance. They therefore limit relationships without sex to platonic or father/daughter. But that viewpoint also excludes asexuals who are romantic. People who hold that sex is part of romance can't grasp the idea of asexuals having romantic relationships. I was hoping to get an answer to what you are or aren't seeing in 12-Clara to cause you to exclude it as romantic/limit it to platonic/familial while at the same time not dismissing romantic relationships of asexuals.
I always considered theirs to be a platonic love rather than a romantic one, I know how much many fans hated in the past that the companions were often seen to be romantically involved with the Doctor (obviously 10 and 11), but I never thought that was the intention between Clara and the Doctor. I prefer it that way.
I like that it can be interpreted either way. Whether Clara and the Doctor's connection is romantic or not, there's only one other fictional relationship between a man and a woman that I can think of that displays love in such a pure and unconditional way. That is Entrapta and Hordak's relationship from She Ra, a relationship that I DO consider romantic.
Why can't it be romantic? I find that people who call the Romance between Clara and the Doctor as Platonic or a "pure" love or "transcending romance" or some such nonsense believe that only allosexuals can have "regular" romance and asexuals can't have romantic orientations. Yes, ace-aros exist but so do ace-roms, allo-aros, and cross-orientated people. Maybe instead of calling it platonic, understand that romance doesn't mean what you think it means.
let's be honest 11and Clara already in a relationship，it‘s just for eleven he is a bit too damaged because he witnessed too many times of Clara’s death so he cared more about protecting it , just no time to slow down. And 12 faced how Clara act when she rejected his new old face, so he backed off with only his “duty of care”, then Clara married herself with Pink, and Romance is no longer an possible option for their relationship, which is why Clara only said something no one else heard but 12th
Wow, monogamy-limited thinking. Marriage doesn't limit Romance. Monogamy isn't the only path. Even if you limit yourself to it, ever heard of Cross-Orientated people? Where a person can have one orientation sexually but never be romantically orientated toward that partner and are only romantically attracted to others?
I will note that in both series she was with the 12th doctor, Clara _had_ an established relationship. First with Danny Pink, then with Jane Austen. (Yes, I know the latter is officially up to interpretation, but how else do you interpret "strictly amongst ourselves, a phenomenal kisser" and "oh, she is the worst, I love her.")
And? Monogamy isn't the only path. There was no, "first/then" with Danny and Jane - it was "and/also". She was literally introduced to Danny in 802. The other teacher flat out said "you haven't met Danny Pink yet, 'newfer', maths" and he introduced Clara to him. So she met and established a relationship with 11 "first". Then went through the transition to 12, before she even met Danny. So, timeline-wise, Danny is the rebound even if you are thinking in the narrow monogamy box.
What is Intimacy to you? Because Asexual Romantics (Ace-Roms) exist you know. Romance isn't just limited to allosexuals and not all Aces are Aros (aromantic)
I just can’t agree that 12 and Clara were romantically attracted to each other. 11 definitely but almost all of the clips in this video I read as platonic.
Why? Romantic attraction can occur in asexuals. What do you think that looks like? Why say it is only a platonic love? This is the same attitude people hold when they deny that asexuals can have romantic attraction too. Not all Aces are Aros!
when he got the job he said there'd be no hanky panky in the Tardis, but then Peter was won over by Jenna, her charm wore him down, and that of his Doctor. his stance clearly softened on that issue. good thing he's married in real life. but he's called it a romance. it's on video.
And I think people deny that Asexuals can have romantic feelings/attractions at all; they are narrow-minded and think all aces are aros. And they can't fathom the concept of Cross-orientated people at all. Allosexuals aren't the only ones who can have romantic feelings, you know? And people can be heterosexual but homoromantic.
I’ve always saw twelve and Clara as a father daughter kind of relationship and the doctor is married to River Song so idk how the love relationship would work and the doctor is super old like over 1000 year old so yeah
If they have a father/daughter relationship, then this video shows how creepy that would be. If a father and daughter acted this way with each other, that would be disturbing. As for the age difference, it's just as much a problem for any Doctor and companion in the show, but most people don't worry about the age difference with Ten/Rose or Eleven/Clara, and Twelve/Clara is no different.
@@trekkiebeth creo que son los prejuicios de la gente cegada por ver "diferencia de edad". Cuando nadie cuesriona la relacion de tenROSE. SI YA SE LLEVAban mas de cientos de años.
Just because the doctor is married to River doesn't mean he can't also have a romantic relationship with Clara. Monogamy isn't the only path; stop limiting the pair with your narrowmindedness.
If Peter was in his 30s, no one would question it
THIS
Oh, come on. He IS hot, even at his 60s
@@tatisparrow8080 I agree with you but sadly not everyone is as enlightened as we are
@@kateglew580 it took some time to realize that Peter's the best. Now and forever 12 is MY Doctor.
12 is the hottest doctor ever and nobody will ever change my mind!!😍🥵😈
I feel like it’s more than a romantic relationship or a friend relationship. It’s a complicated one. Clara changed how the Doctor does his actions and how he feels. The Doctor changed Clara too. I just love how the journey came and ended with the Doctor and Clara from that telephone call to the Doctor’s memory wipe.
Do you know where 0:15 scene is from?
@@whe832kso10 it is from “He said, she said” if I’m not mistaken, a short prequel before their Trenzalore adventure
It was definitely romantic, even the actors confirm that it was like that.
But I see that it was more than that, this was an expression of a high level of love that few understand: Unconditional Love...
I read all over that the Doctor doesn't realize that Clara's "I love you" is intended for him, not Danny, but I disagree. True, the Doctor isn't looking at her, so he doesn't see her looking right at him as she says it, but judging from the soft smile on his face, it registers with him all the same.
Yo creo que si, 12thDoctor es muy imteligente como para no darse cuenta de eso y Clara tambien. Ambos sabian pero no lo decian directamente o se hacian los desentendidos.
aunque en un principio no he notado ese detalle que lo pase por alto
He did absolutely just immediately say yes when he thought she was actually asking him to be her boyfriend. No hesitation at all. He was willing to put in research for it.
"Ding-dong! Okay, brilliant."
It's definitely not simply platonic, nor is it father/daughter, but I'm not sure boiling it down to something as simple as "romantic" quite fits either. I think Twelve and Clara are the best the show has ever done at...uh..."accurately" depicting how a relationship would go between a 20-something year old girl and an alien who is hundreds or even thousands of years old with a time traveling space ship. They are smitten with each other, but it's not like they want to go make out or something; it's a special type of true love that transcends just romance I think.
As flawed as Moffat's tenure was, the relationship between Twelve and Clara was something truly unique that you'll never find in any other show, and that's when Doctor Who is at its best; when it handles things in ways no other media can it truly stands out.
Oh and great editing by the way. You clearly have a talent for this.
Exactly.
Cuanta razon y verdad tenes en lo que mencionas. Y es basicamente que llegue a una conclusion de la relacion que hubo entre Twelve y Clara. Esto es Una muestra perfecta de otro nivel mas elevado de amor, y que mucha gente no comprende y no llego a ese nivel de lo que es el AMOR INCOMDICIONAl y lo que significa realmente.
Lo mejor de Moffat fue ilustrarnos todo eso como ejemplo y que Twelve/Clara tengan un buen desarrollo evolutivo asi como mostrarnos esa conexion compleja y profunda que muy pocas veces se logra ver a la perfeccion y bien interpretadas en pantalla. Twelve/Clara son la excepcion y ejemplo de ese amor Incondicional...
Brilliantly said. Your line 'it's a special type of true love that transcends just romance'. is perfect and such ‘love’ although very rare exists. Somethings are almost beyond words. Romantic love is sweet, but it is not the ultimate form of connection that two people can have. It is even greater than being prepared to sacrifice your life. In fact, I think very few people would be able to comprehend such a powerful force but Moffatt, Capaldi and Coleman acted it convincingly. Smith did a good got at it, but it almost needed the older looking man to bring home the point it is nothing to do with youthfulness, nor looks, nor romance. For those who have experienced it is both wonderful but also so painful to care that strongly and profoundly for another and it does take a toll. Even Moffat brought that home in his writing. Hell Bent was severely criticised by most DW fans but those moments with the Doctor and Clara were some of the most poignant moments I have ever seen in DW and ones to cherish.
I agree the editing was superbly done.
Peter Capaldi said it was truly romantic in an interview with Wil Wheaton.
I suppose others like me are not saying there was no romance involved but that it was also so much more than that. So well acted and written it is too difficult to define beyond the words total devotion.@@ChibiHoshiDragon
@@ChibiHoshiDragonAnd I think it was good that he said it even if it was only once. And it is curious that he will start by saying No, but in the end he said the opposite.

I was never a fan of the Doctor in a romantic relationship with anyone, not even Tenth and Rose. (I didn't hate their relationship but I would have preferred them as platonic). River and the Doctor made a great duo, but she appeared so sporadically I didn't grew as fond of them as a couple. But then Clara appeared and here I am, shipping them like crazy. I ship them in the way you ship old married couples. They were so unconditionally devoted to each other it's hard to deny they saw eachother that way.
The Doctor never loved River. I never saw it. I always wanted him to be ace until Clara.
Admito que tambien no me agrada Clara con 11th, pero cuando llego 12th inmediatamente la manera de verlos cambió.Que me convenció desde el principio. Su relacion fue autentica y compleja. Lo cual me agrada eso.
Von River no fue con convincente nada de eso.
Devoted is a great word for it. Complete devotion to another in all things no matter what. Transcedning all stereotypes of love and romance and being so much more.
I agree with starprincess66 completely. Their chemistry was almost more like school buddies.@@starprincess66
I agree, I didn't like it at first either but it ended up convincing me until now they are my favorite duo and I don't think I will change my mind.
"If you love me, you will come back" *Comes back*
"Clara I'm not your boyfriend. I never thought you were. I never said it was your mistake"
THE WAY HE FELT FLATTERED WHEN HE THOUGHT THAT CLARA WAS DATING A GUY WHO LOOKED LIKE HIS YOUNGER SELF.
THE HAND HOLDING, THEY'RE SO ROMANCE-CODED IT'S ACTUALLY HILARIOUS.
They both deserved a better ending. Their love story was absolutely beautiful and heartbreaking. Clara and 11 were all flirty and fancied each other but 12's and Clara's relationship blossomed into true romance. It drives me insane when I see people commenting that their relationship was that of just friends or worse father/daughter. I'm sorry, but what kind of "daughter" would stare at her "father" the way Clara stares at the Doctor as though she wants to jump on him. What kind of just a friend would spend 4 billion years of pure hell trying to get Clara back. I don't watch DW anymore ever since Capaldi left. But I honestly would've ended them both just flying away together. Rose had her bittersweet ending, but it worked. I wish that 12th Doctor and Clara would've ended together somehow.
you know who would live 4 billion years for another. a good father. more so than a lover. and the doctor Is a good man. I dont think he'd do any less. besides Moffett confirmed that they did love each other during 11. but after 12th coming in they decided to be platonic.
@@alphyishere errr yeah, that’s not a father/daughter relationship. If it is then it is super illegal and troubling.
@@alphyishere and Moffat confirmed that 11’s feelings for Clara transferred onto 12. He still besotted as ever.
@@MelinaVader well each incarnation are super different have very different ways of looking at things. regeneration for example. out of all the doctors only 10 and 12 felt real conflict over having to change. the rest just kind of accepted it. just like how in real life alot of people aren't scared of death. but others are. feelings could change the same way. take one person have them go through life with a significant other. take another person and have them do the same things with the same person. they aren't gonna feel the same even if they went through the same thing. although the doctor is still the doctor. 12 is like if an old man lived through all those experiences. the feelings he has are 11s experiences not his own.
@@alphyishere they are all the same Doctor. 9 is 10 is 11 is 12. It’s tricky when it comes to regeneration because it’s mostly psychological. 9’s regeneration to 10 was because of Rose. 9 fell in love with Rose and that transferred to 10, and he wanted to look younger and more juvenile for Rose. 10’s regeneration as 11 was like a child and overly positive because of what 10 has suffered. 11’s regeneration of 12 being an “old grumpy man” was from the solitude and loss he went through. So 12 kind of shuts those emotions and locks them in the back of his mind. That does not mean that he stopped having feelings for Clara. They are all the dame Doctor, it’s just psychologically is how they readjust with a new face and new body. All their experiences is the same, it’s how they grow and it’s how they become the Doctor.
"Do you think I care for you so little that betraying me would make a difference?"
This. This is more then love. This is unconditionally.
He loves that woman more than he's ever loved anything in his long and painful life, and not a second of it feels wrong or forced. You see all she does for him, all she's given up, all the times she came through for him. It was like I was right there with him as I was watching the episode, understanding exactly what he felt and why. I've never had an experience like it woth anything I've ever watched. He couldn't bear to lose her and not do the same. She jumped into his time stream to save his life, pulled him from the depths of his darkness after the death of the ponds, gave him the support and reminder he needed on the hardest day of his life in the barn on he day of the time war, comforted him as a boy as he cried in the dark and gave him a lesson that stayed with him his entire life about fear and how it makes companions of us all. Clara was such an impossibly amazing companion and friend, more than that she was the most important person he'd ever known. The story breaks and brightens up my heart every single time. This stuff cuts so deep that I cry. I just can't stop coming back ro this video every couple of months to shed a few more years. The saddest love story of all time, the one that really sticks with me.
Thank you for this beautiful comment!
I could feel their romantic feelings in Mummy on the Orient Express especially
Eso fue una clara evidencia sutil que poca gente lo notó
The most under appreciated and under valued companion ever.
Idk about ever but certainly from New Who. Martha is a pretty close second if you ask me, would have much rather seen her return for the 60th over Donna given how her story was post End of Time but oh well
I‘m only at the beginning of season 8 but I’m confused that many people really think they have a normal friendship or a father/daughter relationship. I mean their relationship feels similar to ninerose/Tenrose, except that now the doctor turned older, not younger. They both make each other better, they both clearly have feelings for each other but can’t really say it and then there’s that jealous boyfriend. It’s not a friendship it’s a romance and you can’t change my mind.
Lo mismo pienso.
Me es indiferente como la mayoria piensa, sera por sus prejuios, que solo fue una relacion padre/hija,lo cual es descartado poruqe jamas puedes llegar abofetear a tu propio padre ¿no? cuando en los episodios se muestra lo contrario a comoes su relacion solo que no lo admiten con palabras pero lo demuestran con sus acciones, miradas y estar pendiente del uno del otro mutuamente
It's been so long and still there is people who deny their relationship. I honestly got tired of explaining it because as you've shown they just need TO WATCH THE SHOW.
Anyway great vid I'm glad to see people still enjoy them. Twelve and clara are really special to me and will be forever.
funny how if they casted someone young for twelve everyone would ship it so much 💀
whouffaldi is more than romantic and platonic, they have something really deep, i love the complication of it all
and for me, clara is one of those that he will always remember, he might not picture a face for it, but he knows for sure theres something deep feelings and longing when it comes to clara
they are star crossed soulmates
nunca tuve problemas con eso, simplemente me encantan estos dos y la dinamica que formaron a lo largo de la serie es profunda y unica que nunca antes vista y realizada otra vez
I am so glad that other people enjoyed their dynamic as much as I did. For as toxic as it got they were so wonderful together and the way Capaldi and Coleman both brought their characters feelings to life was utterly beautiful to watch. Clara had big shoes to fill in my opinion after coming off of the Amy/Rory/River dynamic but by the time series 9 rolled around I had really grown to love her and her arc and seeing it wrap up is still heartbreaking to watch
This duo was the best Doctor Who ever had. They complimented each other so well. They started off as a flirty couple, like young lovers are, 💏 but then they grew into something deeper and more profound. Clara has been the one Companion who has seen the most iterations of the Doctor, and who has saved many of them as well from the Great Intelligence, and the Doctor has saved her too in different ways on more than one occasion, the most relevant in Face the Raven. They couldn't live without one another, they couldn't live with each other either. But one day I do hope they meet one final time before Clara's final hearbeat and she can put her hand on his cheek one last time knowing he does remember her again before he lays her to rest. It may never happen on screen but I hope at least Big Finish will tell this story. Run together forever, and remember! ❤️❤️🫂
God I hope so. I just finished Series 9 and i'm more heartbroken than ever. I wanted so badly to take this beautiful amazing story that she was absolutely worthy of from her so many times just so they could be together. The end was so bittersweet. It's my favorite story ever told and affected me more than any story ever has, and Clara Oswald is my favorite character in all of fiction. I'm having a tough time continuing on with the show but I know I have to keep watching. If they ever ended Doctor Who, I'd love The Doctor and Clara to meet one more time before he becomes the Great Curator from Day of the Doctor.
Don’t forget that Missy choose Clara for Doctor.
Missy the Master Matchmaker
Yeah, why did Missy do that exactly? When asked about it, she basically said that she did it just for kicks. Apparently, she had no nefarious scheme and put the Doctor and Clara together just for the hell of it. Other versions of the Master would have had an ulterior motive but then again, Missy's the only incarnation who could make a redemption arc believable. I think this was partially because she's a woman and they can be a bit more, to quote Elastigirl, "flexible". The male Masters were too stubborn and egotistical to change as drastically as Missy did.
@@tomnorton4277 Well, what Missy really said is that she put them together because the Doctor should never be controlled but, Clara was the one who would be able to control him. Basically, she knew that the Doctor would love Clara so much that he would do things for her that he would never do for anyone else (even if they were possibly bad/dangerous ideas). And she was right. That's what made him/them become the hybrid. He couldn't be purely logical with her. And I think Missy just did it for the pure chaos of it all. Basically, she went and found the Doctor's soulmate just to see what would happen when the Doctor 's equilibrium is thrown off-balance by his feelings taking true precedence over his mind. Missy was a bit more of a crazy general chaos worshipper than more traditional versions of the Master so, that logic tracks to me.
May I say, this video is not just a good compilation of “moments”, it’s a story in itself. Also the music brought me to tears by the end of the video so I couldn’t watch it through the tears and now I have to watch it again.
Thank you, truly.
This relationship with Clara brought some long needed maturity not just between two specific characters but to the vast variety of fictional stories. It’s a great work by both Capaldi and Coleman, and by writers, too. There is always a risk of such a relationship portrayed creepy and thus being misunderstood. But their work is so brilliant, their characters are so tender and caring for one another.
I don’t have many otps, but this one is definitely at the top of the list.
I think 11 and Clara were definitely romantic but the Doctor was scared of that, everytime he felt that way he tried to suppress it. It freaked him out because he remembers what happened to Rose and even Amy to an extent. I think when 11 regenerated he knew it was over with Clara because of how old he looked, so 12 deep down still loved her but knew he couldn’t act on those feelings anymore, no more flirting or anything. It’s actually sad.
Es triste y desgarrado al mismo tiempo nunca se dijeron directa!ente que se amaban pero lo demostraban con acciones y miradas
These two are so in love
So true
I enjoy how people are back on this ship again.
I've only ever seen one other fictional portrayal of love that is as pure and unconditional as Clara and the Doctor's bond and that is Entrapta and Hordak's relationship in She Ra. Like Clara and the Doctor, who would go to Hell and back for each other even after their rocky relationship in Season 8, Entrapta and Hordak don't place each other on pedestals and they don't expect perfection, they just want each other to be who they are.
It's strange that the most genuine portrayals of love rarely feel the need to express it in any traditional way. Entrapta and Hordak never kiss or say "I love you" in She Ra but you can clearly see that they adore each other more than anything. Clara and Doctor are similar because the one time Clara kissed the Doctor in a blatantly romantic way was in The Snowmen, and that was an echo not the real Clara, and even the "I love you" in Mummy on the Orient Express was deliberately meant to imply that she could be talking to the Doctor, Danny or perhaps both.
Missy gave him the most perfectly complicated gift ever. And to her. Probably they shared the same pain or buffle of unexpressed words and feelings.
There's so much in how he says his lines
Why does my heart hurt so much
Yeah idk how people think this is farther/ daughter like or just a friendship. Its basically, like lovers but the man reincarnated into someone too old for her that the romantic feelings have to be suppressed by both of them. Even though their love still lingers silently.
Exactly
I agree
They both repressed their love but throughout the series they seemed to soften and express love in a unique way that only they both knew and knew.
0:59 will always be a hilarious clip to me and I don’t know why.
I feel like people who felt uncomfortable shipping 12 and Clara just because of how old Capaldi was can’t ship 10 and Rose because of the 900+ year age gap
The way he smiles after he says …tight omg
This is woooow !!💞💞💞💞 always love 12th and clara together
I was expecting a video essay but- you right, this is much more effective aha
The show speaks for itself!
Clara Oswald ! I want her returned , safe , unharmed ! If Clara Oswald is dead then you better be careful how you tell me that ! Who is going to go first ?
Here's an interview with Capaldi where he says the Clara and the Doctor have a romantic relationship. ruclips.net/video/K7i62ERas2s/видео.html Clara and 11 definitely had feelings for each other too, like that early love glow phase. (Matt Smith teasingly called Clara the doctor's girlfriend in an interview) But with 12, feelings got complicated with his change, new personality, and the reality of who he really was. Their feelings didn't go away, but instead got pushed down and hidden, while forming into something very deep. I've always loved seeing Clara and his relationship through both incarnations of the Doctor.
He literally went to take out out of her timeline,USED A GUN, just to rescue her me. If that isnt love then I dont know what is ♥️
Es un grado elevado de amor, Amor Incondicional es lo que. Es
I have saved this for future viewings. A perfect compilation. Exactly what I need. On my sad days, and my happy days. And the rainy days where it feels like the mad man in a box is all alone again. Perfect for those moments and all the more.
2:06 I wish Capaldi will hear his fans pleas.
It's the same thing for me that it is for you, I'm on my first view of it in a little while. My friend and I just watched Time Heist on our watch through the show, he's loved the series so far. Clara and the Doctor is such an amazingly moving story that hasn't left me since I first watched it a few years ago. I absolutely love it to bits and pieces, it's my favorite thing I've ever watched. Capaldi owns the role of the best incarnation of the doctor in the history of the character so far in my opinion and Clara absolutely blows the other companions out of the water. She's my favorite character in anything I have ever watched, read, played, or listened to. I'm crushed that she doesn't have too many appearances outside the show in the Doctor Who expanded media. I'm glad to know someone else loves it as much as I do
The best duo in shows history.
What i think is more interesting. The real feelings between Peter Capaldi and Jenna Coleman and how that tension influences there acting. In a real world situations an age difference of almost 3 decades is not healthy. That struggle and tension is interesting to see how they cope with it and how it finds it's way in there acting.
This perfect
I guess it was a great acting job from their sides as they both are professional actors. No feelings in real life. I guess for P.C. there has always been only one woman to adore, his wife Elaine. He has said it in many interviews, just watch for example Larry King's interview in 2015. Even now, these days, he keeps looking at her as if they have just started to date, but they have spent 30 years together and they are both 66 y.o. At first i also assumed that Peter and Jenna were acting so perfectly because they had real feelings in real life. But later i thought no...they are just great and professional actors who had the script and their lines....))) And i guess, at comic cons they looked at each other " with love" because they had their contracts and their job was to promote the show and be good to the fans...
I like Clara more than River
Me too. I've always shipped Clara x Eleventh so much.
@@SofiaDarkO agreed
Me too. I like River, simply because Alex Kingston's one of the very few actresses who can make a Mary Sue likeable, but she was the Doctor's superior, not his equal, and there were parts of her story that really rubbed me the wrong way. Learning to fly the TARDIS on her first try and doing it better than the Doctor does? Give me a break. Plus she could use regeneration, which is a Time Lord's most powerful ability. There's absolutely no chance that somebody with 2 HUMAN parents could have that power, regardless of being conceived while the TARDIS is in the Time Vortex. At most, River would just have a longer lifespan and a more accurate perception of time than the average person, not regeneration powers. I could buy it if the Doctor was River's father, but then he'd have married his own daughter which is all kinds of fucked up.
Clara's relationship with the Doctor was perfectly balanced and because of that, it was strong enough to carry 2 entire seasons, as well as the latter portion of Matt Smith's run which included the 50th anniversary special, arguably the most important milestone in Doctor Who's history. Clara and the Doctor were neither superior nor inferior to each other - they each had strengths and weaknesses but they fit together so perfectly that they could cover each others flaws and accentuate each others assets - so if you're looking for a truly equal dynamic between a man and a woman, you'd be hard pressed to find it anywhere else, especially in the current political climate. I feel like Steven Moffat learned from his mistakes with River and it was wise of him to use her sparingly because unlike Clara, she can only carry a couple of episodes at a time.
@@tomnorton4277 Yeah, you sumarized everything that I disliked about River. She is not his equal, but superior for no realistic reasons. Their relationship feels less real and relatable.
I think they have a relationship beyond romantic and platonic. I don't think that those are the only two options for relationships, that they have to be one or the other. I think they're both, or neither. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
That's okay. I didn't need my heart anyway
The healthiest dysfunctional relationship 😂 i love them
This is an example of an advanced level of expressing love, Unconditional Love, that very few reach that level or understand. Because love, more than a feeling, is a promise and commitment to assume all responsibility for being with someone or towards something. And this was what was seen in Twelve/Clara. But in the end this faded and Twelve acted blinded by the pain of losing someone he really cared about.
stop, youre making me cry
I love this music and it fits their relationship. Wow a great post!! I like the song The Shepherd's Boy. Man, that was the song when the 12th Doctor changed to the 13th Doctor that was a great scene as well. i can not stop watching this!!!
Last bit was a nice touch
I have a duty of care 😢
❤ god her eyes are so big she looks like a manga character
he says that to her, "how are you doing that thing with your eyes, are you making them bigger?"
12 WILLINGLY suffered for four and a half billion years just for a chance to save Clara. If that's not love I don't know what is
This being the regeneration soundtrack is goated
Twelves the kind of guy to seem merciful, but when someone messes with his bae he goes full wrath mode
I love the music score. I don't ship them as romantic but I love how they care about eachother. That they'll die for eachother which made the relationship toxic.Just my opinion don't go hating on me . This was a great collaboration & its very heartfelt. Fantastic ❤
12 is my favourite!!😍😍
This question is the reason there are so many of these fan made films exist. I have over 100 on my play list lol
It doesn't matter the age.I love someone older than me.And he is my companion😊❤❤❤
Perfection!
I can barelt see through my tears
I love it!
it’s simple 11 had intense emotions for her, but 12 was different he loved her but he knew he couldn’t be with her like that, hence “i didn’t say it was your mistake”
What an amazing video!!
I think so many people or this story is a romance, because of Capaldi's age, which is ridiculous. All of a sudden, these two have become a parent/child relationship because the doctor looks old, which is complete bullshit. There is also the River case. I specify that I ship the doctor with Rose, River, Clara, Yaz, I like all his romantic companions. But to deny that the Doctor was also romantically in love with Clara on the pretext that there was River is a mistake. I don't see why he couldn't have loved them at the same time. Especially since he always knew he would lose River one day. That she won't stay. Whereas with Clara, he had this hope that she really would stay forever. But of course, no companion stays forever. It's gotten to the stage where I also ship the doctor with the master. Let the guy be happy with someone who can always stay. Pity. But honestly, I think Clara was the doctor's kindred spirit, and he'll never find someone like her again. She was like him. She was the doctor too. Also, the fact that she is bi (insinuated with the episode where there is Jane Austen) was also practical since the doctor can also regenerate as a woman.
Rose : The lover.
River : The wife.
Clara : The treasure of a lifetime.
Yaz : The one she wants it to last forever with.
I agree that anyone who uses River as a pretext are narrow-minded monogamous-limited thinkers.
But I also think that those who call any other romance of the Doctor outside River a "pure" love or "transcending romance" or some such nonsense as if only allosexuals can have "regular" romance and asexuals can't have romantic orientations are just as limited. Yes, ace-aros exist but so do ace-roms, allo-aros, and cross-orientated people. People are closed-minded to those other possibilities.
Rose and River and Clara and Yaz are all Romantic Partners. Period. Full Stop. No need to categorize into different boxes.
This topic was questioned so much, I think so, it is a romantic friendship that touches on the codepence between them, but since Peter is quite older they wanted to go the other way, but the chemistry between them was spectacular for me, the best duo since the fourth doctor with Sarah Jane and 10th with Donna, the love they profess for each other goes beyond time and space itself. It is spiritual, the meeting of two rebellious souls who, when they come together, bring out the bad and the good in each other. Jenna shined like never before next to Peter, with 11th it seemed like a teenage relationship except for the end in Trenzalore, I almost didn't like the chemistry between them.
You would have to be made of stone not to fall in love with Clara (Jenna Coleman)❤
I remember reading somewhere that capaldi didn't want a love interest because of the age gap
Yes, at first but then he said that their relationship was truly romantic.
How does that conclude?
I got confused

Comentarios
The Doctor literally can't let Clara out of his thoughts for 4 billion years. He was ready to break the entire universe just to bring her back. You, too, have been hammering a wall with your hand for 4 billion years for the sake of your "friends"? The doctor didn’t even remember his wife all this time. How much more proof is needed here that he not only loves her, but is obsessed with her? And although Clara treated him as a friend, she still showed interested attention to him. In the Christmas episode, she said that after Danny there was another worthy man, but a relationship with him, alas, was impossible. She was talking about the Doctor and she clearly loved him
It’s deeper than both imo
im soooooo normal about them (being extremely abnormal about them)
Does anyone know why he has the Gibson SG in this episode rather than his other guitar...is it just because his main guitar was still in his Tardis, which he hadn't yet found, or was there any deeper significance?
My guess is he picked it up while traveling the country.
SG's are incredibly divisive, not for everyone, and even a little offputting for their look and feel. But man, do they sing when you play them right. And I think that's perfect for an old-school punk rocker like Twelve -- the kind of man who's not for everyone, but would spend countless lives fighting to save someone he loves.
Don't hate Clara, she is beautiful and I love her
I always felt 11 and clara we very couple like and they fsncied each other it changed with 12 do it wasnt romantic with him but very soulmate like ... but yeah 11 and clare lowkey in love
Yeah I was in love with her too so I don't blame you 12.
Eleven and Clara is clearly Steven Moffat's fantasy of himself being the Doctor, and Clara being the bi-curious school teacher that enables him. Hilarious self-insertion
Crying so good!
6:19 what episode is this?
Last Chrismast.
Okay but 5:26 HAD to have meant something
Is Clara a rebound from River?
Possibly, I’ve never thought of that but timeline wise it makes sense given that it was implied that at the end of his run 11 hadn’t seen river in a while and 12 only met her once so the answer is, possibly.
Where is 0:15 scene from?
It's from "She Said, He Said," which is a prequel to The Name of the Doctor.
💖💖💖💖💖
The Danny Pink sotryline: exists
12 / Clara shippers: *seething*
Not true. Only those who are narrowminded and cling to monogamy have a problem here. She had a relationship with Jane while dating Danny too. So why not with 12?
I see Danny as a perfect example of Clara loving and accepting every part of the Doctor, including War. Something the Doctor can't even accept of himself. It is why he hated on Danny so much. He was a math teacher/intelligent person and a soldier (both aspects of what she also loved in the Doctor and the doctor tried to deny in himself).
12 Never saw her as a young lady that was just her outward appearance. Clara did at first saw 12 outwards apperance. But matured to see past it.
He saw her as his equal, someone he had known all his life.
yeah idk i don't see it between twelve and clara, i feel like it's more of a father/daughter relationship tbh
why, if I may ask?
I generally find that people have a narrow view of romance and that is why they can't grasp the 12/Clara relationship as romantic.
They have a limited idea that only Allosexuals have Romantic attraction and all asexuals are aromantic (Ace-Aro).
Have you thought about the existence of ace-roms? What that looks like in practice. Why can't that also apply to 12/Clara?
@@ChibiHoshiDragon tf are you talking about
@@kyeo77
I'm asking for specifics as to why you don't see Clara and 12 as a romantic relationship and only see a father/daughter relationship.
I then added that my observations of those who don't see certain relationships as romantic seem to have sex as part of their definition of romance. They therefore limit relationships without sex to platonic or father/daughter.
But that viewpoint also excludes asexuals who are romantic. People who hold that sex is part of romance can't grasp the idea of asexuals having romantic relationships.
I was hoping to get an answer to what you are or aren't seeing in 12-Clara to cause you to exclude it as romantic/limit it to platonic/familial while at the same time not dismissing romantic relationships of asexuals.
@@ChibiHoshiDragon lol i ain't readin all that
@@kyeo77 "all that"?
That was short.
I have written much longer diatribes as comments in other shipper threads
I always considered theirs to be a platonic love rather than a romantic one, I know how much many fans hated in the past that the companions were often seen to be romantically involved with the Doctor (obviously 10 and 11), but I never thought that was the intention between Clara and the Doctor. I prefer it that way.
I like that it can be interpreted either way. Whether Clara and the Doctor's connection is romantic or not, there's only one other fictional relationship between a man and a woman that I can think of that displays love in such a pure and unconditional way. That is Entrapta and Hordak's relationship from She Ra, a relationship that I DO consider romantic.
Why can't it be romantic?
I find that people who call the Romance between Clara and the Doctor as Platonic or a "pure" love or "transcending romance" or some such nonsense believe that only allosexuals can have "regular" romance and asexuals can't have romantic orientations. Yes, ace-aros exist but so do ace-roms, allo-aros, and cross-orientated people.
Maybe instead of calling it platonic, understand that romance doesn't mean what you think it means.
💔💔
let's be honest 11and Clara already in a relationship，it‘s just for eleven he is a bit too damaged because he witnessed too many times of Clara’s death so he cared more about protecting it , just no time to slow down. And 12 faced how Clara act when she rejected his new old face, so he backed off with only his “duty of care”, then Clara married herself with Pink, and Romance is no longer an possible option for their relationship, which is why Clara only said something no one else heard but 12th
Wow, monogamy-limited thinking.
Marriage doesn't limit Romance. Monogamy isn't the only path.
Even if you limit yourself to it, ever heard of Cross-Orientated people?
Where a person can have one orientation sexually but never be romantically orientated toward that partner and are only romantically attracted to others?
I will note that in both series she was with the 12th doctor, Clara _had_ an established relationship. First with Danny Pink, then with Jane Austen. (Yes, I know the latter is officially up to interpretation, but how else do you interpret "strictly amongst ourselves, a phenomenal kisser" and "oh, she is the worst, I love her.")
And? Monogamy isn't the only path. There was no, "first/then" with Danny and Jane - it was "and/also".
She was literally introduced to Danny in 802. The other teacher flat out said "you haven't met Danny Pink yet, 'newfer', maths" and he introduced Clara to him. So she met and established a relationship with 11 "first". Then went through the transition to 12, before she even met Danny. So, timeline-wise, Danny is the rebound even if you are thinking in the narrow monogamy box.
Yes but never romantically intimate as far as i know
What is Intimacy to you?
Because Asexual Romantics (Ace-Roms) exist you know.
Romance isn't just limited to allosexuals and not all Aces are Aros (aromantic)
I just can’t agree that 12 and Clara were romantically attracted to each other. 11 definitely but almost all of the clips in this video I read as platonic.
Why?
Romantic attraction can occur in asexuals. What do you think that looks like? Why say it is only a platonic love?
This is the same attitude people hold when they deny that asexuals can have romantic attraction too.
Not all Aces are Aros!
The showrunners wanted a romantic relationship but Capaldi said oh hale no, so there you go. Dear friends.
when he got the job he said there'd be no hanky panky in the Tardis, but then Peter was won over by Jenna, her charm wore him down, and that of his Doctor. his stance clearly softened on that issue. good thing he's married in real life. but he's called it a romance. it's on video.
@@MobiusBandwidth yes true he is married and he adores his wife Elaine
i really think people read romantic feelings into wayyy too many relationships.
Es normal, porque somos humanos con sentimientos.muy amorosos
@@MeridaEdhytSanwheyLosd I don't care of its "normal" to you it's fucking wierd. Platonic shit exists
And I think people deny that Asexuals can have romantic feelings/attractions at all; they are narrow-minded and think all aces are aros. And they can't fathom the concept of Cross-orientated people at all.
Allosexuals aren't the only ones who can have romantic feelings, you know? And people can be heterosexual but homoromantic.
I’ve always saw twelve and Clara as a father daughter kind of relationship and the doctor is married to River Song so idk how the love relationship would work and the doctor is super old like over 1000 year old so yeah
If they have a father/daughter relationship, then this video shows how creepy that would be. If a father and daughter acted this way with each other, that would be disturbing. As for the age difference, it's just as much a problem for any Doctor and companion in the show, but most people don't worry about the age difference with Ten/Rose or Eleven/Clara, and Twelve/Clara is no different.
@@trekkiebeth creo que son los prejuicios de la gente cegada por ver "diferencia de edad". Cuando nadie cuesriona la relacion de tenROSE.
SI YA SE LLEVAban mas de cientos de años.
Eso estaria descartado porque jamas una hija abofetearia a su padre en mas de una ocasion o que le diga que debe hacer en. Concreto
Just because the doctor is married to River doesn't mean he can't also have a romantic relationship with Clara.
Monogamy isn't the only path; stop limiting the pair with your narrowmindedness.