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Hey GN, I'm friends with Brian Redban (the guy who helped Joe Rogan start his Podcast and currently co/host and producer of Kill Tony) and he had a similar situation with a pre-built unit in the same price point. They're making him buy a new CRATE to ship it back for repairs now (5k PC less than a year old).. should I get you guys in contact with one another before he sends it back? Perhaps you guys would be interested in inspecting what they did wrong?
Can you unbox these PCs and show us real time what is wrong instead of messing with it before you tell us what was wrong with it. That way too their is proof of integrity of the review.
Skytech Gaming would like to thank you for the constructive criticism. While painful, we've earned it. This will only further motivate us to improve and better serve our community going forward. While we have not been thorough enough in our training and QC on custom builds, we have taken this feedback to heart, and are diligently working to address these issues. We welcome further feedback and advice as we strive to hold ourselves to a higher standard.
best response to something like this happening but please, don't just fire whoever made the mistake, please think of this in terms of what SOP's you can change in QC to improve how your custom jobs turn out, for example if a test spits out an operating test of 100C, you could put that into an excel spreadsheet and have it check actual temps vs rated temps and turn the cel to red or something
Hopefully not just paying lip service...look forward to seeing these improvements. I can understand mistakes slipping through the cracks but this was a lot of mistakes. (@steve maybe it was bumped so hard in shipping it knocked the bios battery loose and reset the overclocks? /s)
@@gunslingerspartan Nobody is getting let go from this. We are only the ones to blame and as a team we are going to implement new procedures and SOP to make sure we are better moving forward.
Between the comments regarding Skytech's CTO and JonnyGuru from Corsair, why are people immediately jumping on termination? Neither parties resulted to malice with what they did.
It's sad how badly these companies get screwed over by their own employees, but I assume they must not have a very stringent hiring process if systems like this make it out of the door.
Gotta love the total numb brains response. Like, they don't see 100C temps as even being a problem lol. Imagine bringing your car to the dealer after you just bought it because there's smoke coming out of the engine compartment due to a coolant issue and they say "is there anything wrong with the car? It seems to drive fine."
Same. I built my first PC about 2 months ago (Im typing this comment on it rn :)) and I was about to buy a prebuilt because honestly, the thought of building my own scared me. I thought for sure I would break something and waste a ton of money. But after looking around and not being able to decide what prebuilt to get, I saw all the people saying how its better to build your own and how its not hard, so, despite my fears, I decided to do some research and give it a shot. And oh boy Im SO GLAD I did. Not only is it way cheaper for the same or better performance, but the satisfaction of booting it up for the first time and seeing it all work perfectly is unmatched. Seeing something that YOU built actually working as intended is super cool, and it feels way more earned than just buying a prebuilt. And they were right, its not hard. Once you start doing research, you start to notice how all the components fit together in a very specific way, and that you basically cant install something the wrong way. If youre reading this and thinking of buying a prebuilt, I STRONGLY urge you to think about building your own. I know it may seem scary, but trust me, its a lot simpler than it seems and its very much worth it.
Also imagine how sad/disapoining it would be to actually order a prebuilt without any pc knowledge and you get it and it overheats and is really bad and not knowing what was wrong with it. Thats actually what convinced me to build my own is I was going to buy a prebuilt until my friend told me that it would be a rip off and then he walked me through the build process. and helped me pick out parts Now I have 2 awesome rigs for me and my wife to be set this gen and Im so happy with them. But man if I hadnt learned how computers work and just ordered a prebuilt and it came shipped like this I would have felt so ripped off and deflated with the whole thing because Id have no idea what to do. So glad I built my own rigs, saved me thousands of dollars and give me a strange pride of like "yeah i made this"
Skytech offered to replace the PC. It would be educational to see if you got a Monday-with-hangover effort the first time, and the replacement is competently built.
Yes, I feel this is a step GN could have taken in order to test the support further, to see if what they get back is in fact a good and working build. Would be valuable from a consumer pow to see if they manage to fix what's wrong if you as a customer go through their support. Yet again, that email point at fails on several levels so even if they got back a fully function computer, this whole review is a massive fail on Skytechs part.
Good video. Please keep reviewing prebuilts. We desperately need media to keep hammering these companies until they start selling products that aren't terrible.
@GamersNexus do starforge systems next, a new company started by twitch streamers/youtube and looks like some former people from Artesian is working there.
@candyman they haven't fallen apart yet, and they've got the former COO from Artesian Builds, the guy who ran the east branch and pretty much kept the company afloat. So they might actually become something
I bought a Skytech for around $4,400 from Amazon about 6 months ago with a 3090. Immediately got 10+ blue screens per day. I spent around 2 hours on the phone with them, and they were very nice, however, 2 hours of having me install programs to test things and then getting off the phone, only to have it bluescreen again. Repeat and rinse several 2 more times. After that I thought to myself do I really want to spend $4,400 that doesn't properly from day 1? I returned it and went with Digital Storm. I love my Digital Storm. It was a couple of hundred extra dollars but the case is much larger, no heat trouble at all, and not a single problem since day 1.
Not trying to be an asshole or anything but you should really learn how to build a PC yourself. You'd save a lot of money and trouble. As a general rule, pre-built PCs are an expensive lottery. I'm glad your pre-built turned out fine tho and I do understand why people buy pre-built PCs but yeah, try learning
My time is worth more. I have no problem paying someone "x" dollars to do the work. When I was younger and made less money, I would go that route. I have a maid, I have someone who mows the lawn, a mechanic for the car, a roofer, and a furnace and water heater service. Why the concern?@@JohnDarksoul69
@@causticchan4617 I have heard people recommend the pc building guide from The Verge.. i heard its really great :D just remember to screw in with confidence
I was thinking that too, just to get a side by side comparison. But after thinking about it for a while, I can understand GN considering that to be something like an endorsement. Saying "when assembled right, the PC works great" takes a lot of pressure off the company to fix their QC process. Refusing to review the PC proper as it should be, and instead scoring it solely on how they received it, will ultimately serve consumers greatly industry-wide.
I suppose there is something to be said for whether the PC could potentially be viable with simple corrections that a novice should be capable of, though if a novice is capable of fixing the problem that makes it all the more unacceptable for an SI to mess it up.
Yeah it kind of seems like this one is a bit rushed. I was just waiting for him to show that. I’m guessing they probably didn’t have much time with all the recent new product releases
I’d fit the definition of novice when it comes to computer design & I know I would not have realized the fans were wrong. Sure I could have seen the placement but would not have known it was wrong. Watching this I’m like ‘well yeah now I get it’ but would not have occurred to me a expert could get that wrong.
@@petrwad1423 It wasn't rushed at all. It spent like 2 weeks in testing and we waited a few months to even finish it. We just didn't think it was necessary since the end result was "don't buy this computer." There was a lot more wrong than just the fans, like the BIOS.
I decided to overclock my 8700k to 5ghz. My temps were at 100c during gaming. I thought that it was like that because my cpu wasnt delid. But the problem was different, my noctua nh-d15 was falsly installed. it was sucking air from the gpu and blast it to the top. So I changed the paste which was still very good (premium noctua paste) and rearanged the cpu cooler plus I added one more front intake (now 2 total 140mm) and I added 2 outtakes at the top. Now I get 65c while gaming and 75 while stress testing. So guys, if you have problems with temps, its most likely all about cooling and airflow. My case is Fractal Design Meshify C, my case coolers I bought in pack, Arctic 140mm coolers x5 for 30 euro so 6 euro per cooler. Now my PC feels like a completely new one and I feel like I want to push it even further to 5.1 or 5.2 ghz. Currently my FPS in like Escape from Tarkov on for example Reserve raised from 60-70 to 95-120fps at mid-high settings 1440p just by overclocking my old chip.
For those that are curious on prebuilt companies, I recently had a fantastic experience with a purchase of a Digital storm prebuilt pc. Only problem i had upon arrival was a dead case fan, And within a day after contacting them they asked if i wanted to send back in the pc for repairs or if they could send me a replacement fan and i just do it myself. I opted for a new fan and within a few days a new fan was priority shipped to my house. 10/10 I would do business with them again, They also allow you to upgrade your pc with new parts if you choose and still keep your warranty on previous purchased stuff.
great video.I was waiting for a section where you resolved the issues with the fans, etc and show the difference between how it arrived and how it should have ran or performed.
I definitely recommend not ordering with the "airbag" style foam. I had to carefully cut mine out on an IBP build recently. They expand and form fit, which can put tension and strain on everything. No damage for me, but the potential is there.
One of my concerns with Ryzen 7000 and Intel 13th GEN is that if 95 to 100° is now what’s supposed to happen… It’s gonna make it that much harder for average users to tell what’s intentional behavior, and what’s thermal throttling and inappropriately reaching those temperatures too fast.
it's kinda sad how Intel, nVidia and AMD are fighting the e-penis benchmark race with absolutely no regards for power efficiency even if their hardware can pull it off all for the sake of getting 1st spot on specific benchmarks. It comes down to the users who cares to power limit their hardware now, be it CPUs or GPUs the performance loss is minimal for huge drops in both temperatures and power usage. Like the 7950x limited to 65W loses like 5% of performances overall and runs 20+ °C cooler. It's hard for me to wrap my head around how they can have their customers waste that much energy for their ego, let's not talk about the generated heat it's even more infuriating.
@@guillaumebackelandt7381 the problem is a huge portion of their business is decided on spec sheets determined by out of the box function. Many people will buy things based on out of the box specs instead of changing settings in BIOS.
To anyone bashing the response given by Skytech Gaming: There’s only so many ways that a statement can be framed and given when it comes to business. Yes, it’s worded rather similarly to any other apologetic response companies that have made following this scenario. It’s respectful, straightforward, informative, and paints a picture as to they know there is room for improvement and they are working on that for the betterment for all. They have to follow through in order to make their statement something of substance rather than hollow.
I wonder how that cooler performs with the bent heat pipes? I'd like to see a head-to-head thermals test between this damaged cooler and an identical cooler in good condition, with proper fan orientation lol
I suspect as long as pipe isn't burst open OR crushed restricting flow inside, it should be fine. with such bent I'd be more concerned about contact patch with the cpu.
That's what I was thinking originally, too. But then I thought the bends might interfere with the fluid flow inside the pipe. Bends or dents create restrictions for any fluid to flow properly through tubing. Since the liquid coolant is carried back through capillary action by a wick, that shouldn't be affected too much. But the gaseous coolant flows freely inside the tube, powered by the pressure differential between the hot plate and the cooling fins. I figure the bends might restrict the gas flow, which would in turn reduce the liquid flow back to the hot plate since the gas can't reach the fins to condense back into a liquid in the first place.
Either way, I'd love to see a test with a cooler in good condition. Mostly because I fear that even a top air coolergets to 100°C with no-time-constrains 240W 12900k boost ANYWAY in this type of case and fan configuration, so the 100°C test result might be on every QA card with this CPU and cooler, no matter if installed correctly or not.
Would absolutely love to see one of these reviews for Starforge PC's. LTT already did a review but would be interesting to see if they can be the "good" recommendation.
They already said they were not going to review a prebuilt from the Artisan castoffs, so they don’t either flood them with orders they can’t handle if it’s good or ruin them from the start if they’re bad. LTT doesn’t give a fuck about how their coverage affects others.
I got the i7 12700k motherboard ram bundle deal from micro center a few months ago. Paid the $30 for them to install the cpu, dual fan cooler and ram to make sure it goes thru post. And got win 10 on a thumb drive. Swapped out my 2nd gen i7 board in 30min and installed win 10 in 4 minutes on the nvme drive I got. Performs amazing. Temps barely get above 60c on the cpu.
It's humor not passive aggression, being critical with a a good reason in a humorous way is not passive aggressive, this is the sort of thing an employer would tell you, that criticism is being passive agressive
Passive-agression? I missed the "passive" part. Which for me at least is one of the reasons I like GN the most from the most known tech and review channels. I don't know if it comes only from Steve personally, but the fact they won't hold back anything is what makes companies think twice about screwing the customers. Well, unless you're Gigabyte.
My first (and current) desktop is an HP prebuild. It has genuinely taken a significant toll on my mental health, I'm not at all joking. I want to destroy it every single day.
My husband and I love watching your reviews of pre-built PCs. They are so informative (and hilarious!). Would you consider reviewing Linux machines? We gave up on Windows several years ago after being screwed by it multiple times. We both now use Linux PCs (Ubuntu and Mint). My gaming machine is currently a System76 laptop running Linux Mint. 99% of my Steam game library works fine on Linux with Proton. I'm currently having a blast playing Cyberpunk 2077 with no problems. I would be very interested in a review of, for example, a System76 high powered gaming rig or something similar.
@@dukenukeman Worst thing it did to me was screw up the color profile on my monitor when Microsoft published a big Windows update one summer. I was doing art and photography at the time and this destroyed my ability to work. It was unfixable on Windows, so I had to switch to Linux. Fortunately I had a background in using UNIX, so no big deal.
You know the video is going to be good when GN uploads a review with flames in the thumbnail. This one especially with "PURE INCOMPETENCE". Love it. GN, please make a coffee roast. I wanna buy coffee beans from you.
Because of this I went and looked at my skytech tower (when I get a prebuilt I check for obvious signs of incompetence as in fans being backwards, pins for graphics cards not being connected ect.) But sure enough that motherboard connector at the bottom had glue on it and the small connector for power at the bottom of the motherboard was bent and falling out
Damn. My fiancé bought a skytech in earlish pandemic (April 2020?) And it has been great! They're a company I've recommended many times since to friends looking to buy a prebuild if they don't want me building something for them for whatever reason. It sucks to see they've gone way downhill 😞
It's shocking to see it this bad as well. I got one for around 3 grand with an rtx 3090 ti recently sept 28th of this year. Happy to report that it was very professionally built. Everything came intact. No cooling issues. Still, really shocking to see.
I think it's a very rare thing for Skytech. Our company has almost a dozen builds from them, and none are anything other than excellent machines! The weird issues here are almost likely from a new crew in assembly and quality control too perhaps. Cool to see Steve call out the issues and also cool to see him state that it's not the norm for Skytech on a couple occasions. I think you and yer fiance can still be happy with and recommend Skytech though!
5k for a an air cooled cpu! That is absolutely insane. Even if it is installed correctly and the fan curves set right you’re never going to be able to tame a 12900k. It wouldn’t have been to much more expensive to install a double 120mm rad, but I wouldn’t even consider anything less then a triple for any high end cpu. I have a triple 120mm on my 13900k and it thermal throttles with the boost clocks set to “auto”. I set E cores to 4.8 and P cores to 4.0, temps max out at 80c with a cinebench score of 34k.
You don't need managers (I think they are actually always part of the problem), you need a good workflow (you can use 1 manager maybe to do that) and for the rest, enthusiastic workers, that care a bit. Management can't create those and usually create the opposite.
most of the times those kind of jobs pay the absolute minimum - so noone cares. and those enthusiastic about it either left years ago, fell up the stairs to better paying jobs or lost their sense of achievement working on this long ago so they don't care...
last place i worked at had manager that was absolutely clueless about everything, including management, just like politicians pretty much, nobody needs them, but they get paid the most
@@TheSjuris It's $1100. 12900k is $550. mobo is $150. SSD is $100 at most. RAM is $80. cooler is $90. PSU is $100. case is $160. That's $2340 by my count... and that's not bulk pricing like an SI would get on much of this. It's a ripoff.
@@marxman6896 you can’t find the gpu anyplace for $1100. This was also done in April. Gpu prices have gone down. Still haven’t seen any store selling a 3090ti for that low especially not that particular one. You can find that one for $1200 on eBay.
A comparing chart with the CPU cooler (same kind if bent) installed correctly would of been useful as a reference to better understand the heat issue (unless it was included and I missed it); seeing how there is confusion down in the comments with regard to the 13900K (incorrect comparison though).
Yeah, I mean it is possible that someone just made a mistake and other systems have their fans the right way. So a run with the fan going properly (as he said it was installed correctly at some point) would of been useful.
It's not the fan facing backward, but the whole cooler have been place 180 degree backward. It's just a small mistake when mounting the system. but can be huge when you try to find the problem about the heat.
I'm very happy with my P500A, which I chose as a happy medium based on your thermal testing charts. My only issue with it is that I have to mount the Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360 on the top with only four screws as it will not line up properly. Other than that, it's a Phantastik case.
That's kinda weird because I built a PC last year around the P500A and he Liquid Freezer II and I don't recall having too many issues with the AIO mounting screws at the top. (the build was not for me but a family member) The Liquid Freezer II I used is an older unit. What I didn't like is the screws created raised bumps where the magnetic dust cover goes. I was a bit disappointed with it overall because the metal Phanteks used for the P500A is way thinner than the Enthoo Pro.... or my old AF Cooler Master cases.
@@m8x425 Did you mount it push or pull? I feel like that might be making the difference, as I mounted pull. I will admit the metal is a little thin as too much torque on the screws will make it bow, but unscrew an eighth of a turn and it's fine.
Bottom line: Don't buy a pre-built. Just build your own. I built 2 PCs in the last 7 years and they turned out great. No damaged parts, no improper installations, no less-than-ideal components.
Took me about 10 hours to go from knowing absolutely nothing to building my first PC from scratch. It was really fucking cool to see it boot and run games at 2k with buttery a smooth framerate.
Found out the hard way that if you dont connect the additional 4 pin you can have massive stuttering issues. It should be standard to connect both honestly
i bought a skytech in 2020 when my old prebuilt shit out. spent 3k, went from a 970, i5 etc to 2080 ti and i9 9900k, basically i just threw money at someone for a pc. it shit out 2 days after i got it while playing bannerlord...fortunately they gave me a full refund. however, i used 2/3s of that money and built a pc myself, with slightly lower specs but performed like a beast for everything i wanted. still running great to this day, i honestly am not surprised whatsoever at this
3 SIs come to find for 5 grand pre builds. One you can spec out an Aventum from Digital Storm. You can get one of the Masterworks builds from Ironside. Or you can spec custom build from Ironside or Meta.
I swear the best product to buy is from a company that is just hitting traction and has proved themselves to trusted reviewers. Those companies are full of passion and tend to do things the right way. Most companies as they age start to cut corners, especially if they're publicly traded. It's why I never get ppl obsessed with brands. Follow passionate people, not a brand.
Very unfortunate to see. With that said, over the years I've purchased 3 different PC builds from Skytech and all 3 PC builds were built beyond flawless. The 3rd PC build having received it no less than a month ago and couldn't have been more pleased with their end product. It's really great when companies take real feedback/criticism and uphold what they say.
I got my first prebuilt from them a couple years ago, and despite being a novice at the time in terms of pc building I immediately knew there was something wrong with it. The pc wouldn't even power on no matter what I did. I ended up sending it back the same day it arrived and bought a prebuilt from Cyberpower that was much better built, after that I built my own gaming pc.
I will say I used to work at Fedex and I've seen all sorts of TVs.. Computers.. even live animals carelessly thrown onto the ground and everybody laughing about it. People blame retailers when 99% of the time it's the actual courier service that does all of the damage. I remember we had one hot shot ASUS ROG monitor that fell out of a truck and one of the guys said "HAHA Funny thing is they'll blame Walmart for that!".. so sad how true that is lol. That being said I definitely always build my own PCs.
I got a prebuilt at around 2015, after doing a good amount of research on it's components, and it served me well for many years. But it's time for an upgrade, as I'm starting to lower my graphics settings to stay at 1080p. The only problem is... Now I have to upgrade everything :B So, I like watching your videos to get tips and tricks on my first major upgrade.
I bought a cyberpower PC for 2000$ had a R7 7700x with a wraith prism cooler. No upper fans and top panels had no mesh. Could cook an egg on top of it. I replaced it with a icue 100
When this series started, I was expecting maybe 20-30% of the pre-builts to be absolute trash. How is it possible that barely 20% are NOT trash and everything else is?
It's almost as if enthusiast grade pcs should not be shipped completely assembled. Who would have thought a myriad of expensive components with distinct orientations would suffer in shipping?
It's pretty ridiculous that they hire upper management based on management skills and not if they actually understand the product and company they're going to be managing. It's a sign that corporate architecture, the business philosophy needs a change.
@@JosephArata that’s most companies these days. I’ve had multiple managers that couldn’t step into my role, in any capacity, yet were in charge of me and others. Sad.
@@JosephArata I work in IT, I'm a manager and I'm more technically skilled than any other employee in my company. So that's not always a case. On top of that, you don't have to be very technical to know that 100 degrees is BAD for any component lol. This company is a joke.
@@professorofdeath7965 depends on the job. It is okay to have specialists working for you that know about stuff that you don't, and they can do the work, show your the results and explain it. You need to trust them though and show them their worth (mainly via financial compensation, plus of course treating them well and crediting them).
I agree. I'd use it as a follow up after teaching ppl why prebuilts are a no go. I recently had to convince someone not to buy an Alienware desktop. I said it's got poor ventilation they immediately interrupted saying "look that looks like ventilation there.." and I said "Ys it LOOKS like ventilation....but it's not good, the i9 will run like an i7 due to thermal throttling." Then I showed them your channel.
An interesting video idea would be to build what you guys think a $5 000 prebuilt *should* be. Going through the part selection, the build process, and finally the software loading. I'd watch that.
I'd imagine it comes down to: 1. A selection of parts that make sense for the price point they're targetting with good performance optimization 2. Assembling the parts like a competent human being who understands the concept of airflow and securing parts properly 3. Giving a reasonable upcharge for assembly, ideally under 10% the cost of the parts 4. Product arriving good to go with correct BIOS settings and minimal/no bloatware 5. No proprietary parts that prohibit upgrading or repairing it.
Steve sarcasm and comedic timing have always been absolute S tier. (at least since a few years ago when I found GN) he legit makes me laugh more than any other comedic youtuber
@@GamersNexus Steve, I think I can speak for a lot of us with this idea... Hire some ex-Artesian builders (ones that hate Noah get preference), launch your own GN S.I. PC. I'm sure there's some profit margin for all of you between cost and the $5000 these idiots are charging for computer builds that double as heating solutions for your home.
@@MafiaboysWorld zero interest in starting an SI. That's not what we do and it's a massive conflict of interest. We serve the community better this way.
@@KnIf0rTITAN It takes very little effort or knowledge to build a PC like this one. Once you have the parts, it is about a 30 minute process, mainly cable management. Then the install of your OS. But if you have the money, doesn't matter.
To be fair it did work out of the box to the specs listed. The fix to exceed those specs and supposedly lowering the temp (we don't know if the fan direction did lower the temps or not, it wasn't shown) took all of 15 seconds.
@@Watchfulfox no it wasnt. 100 deg means the cpu will cut power and throttle, physically there will be not much difference, besides reduced component life, but performance will suffer, especially when temps were going up to max almost instantly. my guess its either radiator was damaged and cracked somewhere due to improper shipping (bend is visible but there might be an actual crack somewhere) or even incorrectly installed, or the overall airflow of the case was poor. reversed fan wont, by itself ,cause that high temp spike. it could also be a faulty cpu, but those happen rarely.
@@BlackhatAudio my "no, it wasnt" was referring to Watchful Fox(your alt?) comment about "To be fair it did work out of the box to the specs listed". quite contrary, its was a crippled system from the start. messed up bios settings, bend (and possibly even cracked) radiator and cpu trying to double as a firefighter is not a sign of a "working out of the box" build.
Man, I missed these. I love the prebuilt teardowns where Steve just gets more and more amazed as he goes through it If you do another one that's gonna be pricey, go with one of the boutique manufacturers like Digital Storm or Origin PC. I'd be super curious to know how that would go.
My favourite part of this is that, if Steve rips you apart for something, he'll give you 5 different ways to fix the problem. That sort of attitude (especially on RUclips) needs to be celebrated more. Good work on the review, and I hope SkyTech reaches out to you with a humble response.
@@XX-121 Isn't that kind the point ? An average non tech person might not know how to fix these problems, so he/she is getting less performance for the money. And let's assume that the buyer know how to fix it, a brand new 5K dollars PC shouldn't have these issues in the first place. Fixing these problems, and then testing wouldn't give an accurate representation of experince am average buyer may get.
Steve ripping into Asus for their garbage software is something he needs to do more of along with all the other garbage software out of Taiwan and China. They seem to only care about form not function. Make it look fancy then who cares if it’s total buggy bloatware. That’s the Taiwanese software way and they just don’t seem to get it.
Imagine going back in time and telling people that in 10 years, high end consumer graphics cards would be selling on eBay for $2,500 and SI’s would be selling $5,000 PC’s outfitted with a $100 air cooler.
I don't think you'd have to go back 10 years, but I get your point of view. There was a time when $3k was a pretty substantial PC not that long ago and is my typical build sheet, and I'm not running a 3090. I've built my own since the AMD 350mhz was a thing, but even pre-builts from like Falcon Northwest where you (at least used to) get what you paid for was acceptably named a high end build.
@@C-M-E Last time I remember it being good was around the 1000 series launch. I built a good 6600k + 1070 computer for $1300 ($300 was watercooling components, so essentially $1k) And I could have gone cheaper with a less flashy case, and mobo. It's actually my current system. Everything's been so stupid since then that only now am I upgrading it to a 13600k and 6900xt (wasn't planning on such a beefy gpu, but the sale was good)
No cap, I couldn’t keep waiting on normal 4090 prices and collecting all these components to build a water cooled so I got digital storm to make me one. I trust they won’t fail like this based on testimonials.
But yeah everything used to priced much more nicely I remember when u could get like a titan and top of the line i7 for and a water cool loop for like 3-4 grand lol
"In 1994, Best Buy was selling notebook computers for about $2,600 and $3,300 (pictured above), which would be more than $4,000 in today's dollars for the one on the left and more than $5,000 in today's dollars for the one on the right."
@@Klaytoncalix Maybe two people worked on it. One who couldn't do jack 5h!t and didn't care to do better, the another who loved the job, going the extra mile.
wouldn't really get the point across if you go "yeah, it works well after we fixed it". The point of pre-built is that they must work 100% perfect on arrival, not that you have to spend time fixing everything that's wrong with it. May as well built it yourself at that point
@@thesteelrodent1796 Yeah I was in that mindset for a second. But it would be nice to know the thermals when it actually was assembled correctly for an understanding what a valid build looks like. But eh.....I could go either way. I usually would rather go towards the outcome that gives more data vs less.
I would agree as well, should have tested correct config to show comparison. But not for all those who understood already why it was wrong. But if you want to capture your audience to those who ain't as technical but is curious about tech, because I had my girlfriend and friend sitting watching it with me while we just chilling. After the video my friend and girlfriend just said, after all that, talking about the temperature and the effects of it but he never showed the difference or impact it has.
@@thesteelrodent1796 Yeah but it would be a good way to show the difference - they could always put it back to how it was after before shipping it back.
I love that Steve doesn't call the technicians or qc staff stupid but addresses the issue on a company level with "someone has to teach them". GN are just THE best pc hardware reviewer imo! Big ups!
Yea from a consumer perspective it's really only the employee's fault if they're actually being malicious. If the employee doesn't know what they're doing then it's the company's fault for not properly training people. If the employee isn't taking enough time to properly look over their work then the company is at fault for making them feel like they need to rush. The company and its upper management is ultimately responsible for almost every issue and it's great that Steve doesn't play the "blame someone else" game.
@@Glornak Even if the employee knows better and is taught better. It's still on the company. QC is a thing and that should not be checked by the same person that built it. That's why it's always on the company and it's policies set in place.
Yes,... and no. In many cases in there are problems exist at all levels, the company and the employee. Blaming just the employee, or blaming just the higher up company level are probably wrong in this case.
I’m surprised you didn’t include a section where you flipped the fan in the correct orientation to show how such a basic oversight can amount to a huge difference. Skytech definitely needs to address their qc procedures and strive for consistency throughout the company.
With it flipped, it probably still would be at or near throttling. The issue is the cooler - the fins aren't connected (useless fan in the middle design) and they are too closely spaced, resulting in mediocre airflow when put in a high demand situation like this. Tossing a fan on it won't make it move air any faster and you really SHOULD be seeing a water cooler on a beast of a CPU at this price.
@@plektosgaming nh-d15 performs like a top 240mm AIO, it would cool a 12900k without issues in typical loads even with a single fan. to make it throttle you'd have to run aida64 torture test which will hammer all threads.
@@plektosgaming the fins are connected by a heatpipe lol, you're highly misinformed if you think this noctua cooler is inherently bad. It's one of the top air coolers
i feel like this was an essential part of the review that would've highlighted how good the system could've been, and showing the delta between optimal and as-shipped would've been very important.
I would like to see how this system performs if everything was done right. Perhaps Steve & Co. could incorporate something similar, where they're like "Ok, we put the fans on correctly, we tightened everything down, now let's see what happens" and post the results. Plus it'll let viewers see how something that could be considered a minor change could mean major performance increases.
Ya I was disappointed to see that they were actually charging 5k for it to not be quality checked and insured, only to find out that it was just the CPU fan backwards. Yet they kept drilling how that was unforgivable. Strange that the company emailed why it was that high though, they must’ve been clueless about the CPU fan being on backwards. I was really hoping they’d show the temps with the fans on properly to see if that was the mistake. Mistakes happen, but for 5k those mistakes should be minimized if not zero, but I doubt it’s robots making these computers so I’m not surprised some (new?) person messed up while working for 6+ hours building the same thing.
You guys are brutal, and its why I watch your videos. Honesty and transparency are a rare virtue in the tech industry nowadays. You're doing the Lords work fellas.
For transparency they should have sent it back and re reviewed the replacement. They obviously had an axe to grind with this video. Maybe they tried and failed to get a lower price on one and this is their retaliation.
I previously bought the skytech shiva (rtx 2060, ryzen 5 2600) it was advertised to come with a 750w psu and only came with a 500w, the cpu cooler was broken, everything was hot glued and a couple pins on the motherboard were bent.
@@herbertwalter8693 agreed. I considered a prebuilt this upgrade only because it was cheaper than buying the components Even then, I am worried they'll muck it up. Not to mention it's slower waiting for them to build it. If it's even relatively similar in price to buy/build yourself, that's the way to go.
The glue for the aRGB cable imo was about as good as an option as you could use without any serious damage especially with how minimal of an amount they used. 3 and 4 pin aRGB plugs / connections are ALWAYS inconsistent and some are incredibly tight and some are incredibly loose! So it makes sense that they would do that so at least the lighting would always work. And they likely may not do this on every single system just with issues with connectors. Just my two cents.
Dude I often can't get my own rgb cables to stay put. They really do have a shitty design. I use a piece of electrical tape but that stuff never sticks very long. I wish mobo makers would all agree on some standard that includes a clip.
The whole problem is that aRGB cables were never designed to a industry standard. They were designed by vendors (like ASUS) and there is not an industry body, that I am aware of to properly vet the design for consumer use.
tbf I have a P500A myself and the included 3pin aRGB to Motherboard is VERY LOOSE. Just using tape would be less damaging to the components compared to glue though.
"They got a couple loose screws" Yeah, seems to sum it up. I work in QC, for a different industry, but Steve's comments on how to address and fix this issue were spot on. Just throwing someone in a QC role and giving them five minutes of training doesn't cut it. You have to give them the resources to know why they're checking all the things on the list, and then of course have the list itself be complete and well thought out. My company has similar issues. I have a TON of paperwork and various boxes I have to check to do my job, which is fine if there's a point to it and it's not just redundant nonsense. (Guess which way it usually goes). Meanwhile I've been doing the job for over a year and have yet to receive ANY training from the lead QC guy that was promised on day 1. There are still things I'm looking at and checking off that I don't actually know much about. Sadly this is not unusual.
@@cesarpdc This is why its not worth it to buy prebuilts. Not only do most companies (or at least the big, most well known ones) not give a fuck about QC, they are also obscenely expensive at the high end. I bet you could get a build like this in like half the price in the US if you were building it yourself.
@@kaydog890 Less being a pretentious pedantic wannabe professor, more contributive comments or heck, keep the corrections but present them in a friendly and constructive manner. English is not everyone's first language. The comment can be understood, that's enough.
Yes, the first time I built my PC I spent most of the day on it because I was scared of every step, but I did it and it was so satisfying to see the BIOS screen. It was built better than all of the prebuilts showcased here on GN.
@@LiveType As someone who runs a smaller PC building company, scaling isn't really the hard part if you know what you're doing. Now if you scale too quickly or adopt too many options, that's when things can falter. Generally speaking, learning to build and package 1 PC VS 1000 PC''s will yield identical results. On their end, I just think its incompetence. That PC shouldn't have arrived damaged, and its not hard, a large double-corrugated box cost $10 extra, and shipping is $20 extra from a small box at max. Packaging materials is $5 extra. So for $35 extra, you prevent shipping damage. Occasionally we've seen bent CPU coolers, the best way to avoid that (if they're very heavy) is to either package them as they did internally (but failed to do externally) or completely avoid them and go with an AIO instead. At $5000, an AIO should've been used to begin with. Sometimes its not about building a product that will sell, but rather, the best product configuration, that is for specs AND shipping, those 2 have to be heavily considered together, then learning how scale. The fact they have only like 5 case options but have PC's arriving damaged goes to show a failure on their end to address an issue like that. Beyond that, if you can't even hire employees to know that 100C is bad, there is clearly an employee training issue. When we hire employees, one of the first things they're taught is thermal throttling and how to look out for it. Thermal throttling will only occur with installation error (and maybe rarely inventory shipping damage), so its paramount for them to know WHY they're running the test to begin with, its to double-check their work.
Never did a build either. Was cheaper back in 2015 to buy prebuilt from a great SI in my country and its still running 0 issues because I got them to spec it better. But would like to try it sometime. Only part I'm not sure on is cable installation/PSU plugin. That worries me.
perhaps it is not their norm, but I was sitting here throughout the video thinking "just fix the (obvious) mistake and compare." I get that people who have disposable income but are not computer building savvy will fall victim to any sort of mistake like this and it's shameful that a company tested this system and thought "solid!", but how many times have we heard of people building their own computer and only realizing after 2 years that they plugged in their monitor into the motherboard instead of GPU? Mistakes happen; at least they seem to have a great tech support policy.
@@RazorIsEpic well mistakes happen in multi-billion dollar businesses, let alone with 5k products - that's just real life. In reality, you'd return a faulty product and it would hopefully get corrected. Furthermore, I don't see any evidence in this video whether this was a single event mistake, or a whole line was faulty - one computer with a wrongly installed fan is shown, and then tests were run against that. To which I have to posit a question - why? What's the point of 25+ minutes of video of tests for something that clearly had an error in it? Why not either return the product as faulty, or fix the obvious mistake manually, and then test? I guess that wouldn't have made a good video :shrugs:
@@dmberger because they paid 5 thousand dollars for that pc. There is an egregious amount of errors in that pc, the most telling being that the cpu coolers. They tested it, the problem was literally in their face and they still didn't know what was wrong. I've only built one pc so far and I saw that immediately. That's beyond shocking. Do they hire competent people at that company?
Maybe not directly related, but I once, many years ago, didn't bother with no fans in my case because I figured the graphic-cards have it's own, maybe I don't have to mention that it felt like a sauna in there after a while, the whole case became hot (lol), so I installed one fan blowing in at the front, and one blowing out at the back, and it became very cool and stable after that (off-course). But yes, cooling in a correct manner is really important.
I know inflation is rampant, but even so, this thing is not worth 5 grand. And that is _without_ the many mistakes and peculiar build-choices made. Great video as always!
@@MissingNumb The computer was built and shipped out on April 28th, 2022. Says so in the QC letter Steve showed @26:33. GPU prices had already fallen off in February, so not much of an excuse.
Right now a Skytech Prism II with a Ryzen 7950x, a 3090ti, 32gb RAM, 360mm aio, and a 1kw PSU is $3800usd. I guess the prices have come down a little. This is from their non-customizable list.
Using 2-component expanding foam stuff like that can be extremely risky. In this case I think what happened is that the top of the heatpipes pinned itself in the foam while it was still slightly expanding.
@@madatu i dont think you understand. The way those foam packs work is you "activate" them inside of the container they're securing, so they expand in place. It's just expanding foam with a preset volume. So you pop them to activate, put them in, close the case and they expand in place. What @batteryaziz means is it expanded unevenly and put pressure on one side of the heat stack. That's why these can be "risky" because they have the ability to apply pressure.
@@zimmerman1031 it would only bend to one side if it expanded unevenly, or applied uneven pressure. Don't get bogged down in a small detail when the main point is the same.
I am honestly shocked. Not just cause of the high marks Skytech previously received from prior reviews of their systems from you guys. But also that I personally own two of their pre-builts and have never had an issue from a QC to performance issues, aside from a minor one (which was the XMP memory was not default in the BIOS). Way to let the ball drop Skytech and love the straight to the point no sugar coated review from GN
@@super1jose848 dude for 5k you can build this with better components for much cheaper in like every category. you can probably afford a new Iphone with all that you saved.
Air isn't worse, it's different. Depending on your priorities, it may even be better. That air block should absolutely be able to handle that processor.
Rich people like paying wild amounts of money for things. they should make an even more expensive PC as well for the filthy rich. As long as the budget builds are good quality, I don't care.
I have this case and it is a truly outstanding one for airflow and cooling, all temps below 60c, which brings home how truly abominably this pc was built to be hitting 100c on CPU!
Yea unlike LTT i bet GN would roast them,Linus is too scared to talk shit about stuff like starforge since its backed by creators but steve has no censor and its brutally honest
@@promc2890 Linus can be pretty straight forward. The Starforge PC was actually a competent build, unlike some other system integrators have shown in the past like this video
QC was always pretty stringent while I worked with skytech a couple years ago. Really enjoyable job, would do again. Something meditative about assembling computers all day. The glue was always a thing on the RGB headers though lolol. Justification was that the dumb thing would come out in shipping.
It bothers me that these weren't posted. It was a small mistake. It happens. I DOUBT they build them all that way. This one has sensationalization written all over it.
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timezone?
Hey GN, I'm friends with Brian Redban (the guy who helped Joe Rogan start his Podcast and currently co/host and producer of Kill Tony) and he had a similar situation with a pre-built unit in the same price point. They're making him buy a new CRATE to ship it back for repairs now (5k PC less than a year old).. should I get you guys in contact with one another before he sends it back? Perhaps you guys would be interested in inspecting what they did wrong?
130? really? why not 530 or 6 oclock?
What time is it CET?
Can you unbox these PCs and show us real time what is wrong instead of messing with it before you tell us what was wrong with it. That way too their is proof of integrity of the review.
Skytech Gaming would like to thank you for the constructive criticism. While painful, we've earned it. This will only further motivate us to improve and better serve our community going forward. While we have not been thorough enough in our training and QC on custom builds, we have taken this feedback to heart, and are diligently working to address these issues. We welcome further feedback and advice as we strive to hold ourselves to a higher standard.
Steve! Pin this!!
best response to something like this happening
but please, don't just fire whoever made the mistake, please think of this in terms of what SOP's you can change in QC to improve how your custom jobs turn out, for example if a test spits out an operating test of 100C, you could put that into an excel spreadsheet and have it check actual temps vs rated temps and turn the cel to red or something
Hopefully not just paying lip service...look forward to seeing these improvements. I can understand mistakes slipping through the cracks but this was a lot of mistakes. (@steve maybe it was bumped so hard in shipping it knocked the bios battery loose and reset the overclocks? /s)
@@gunslingerspartan Nobody is getting let go from this. We are only the ones to blame and as a team we are going to implement new procedures and SOP to make sure we are better moving forward.
Between the comments regarding Skytech's CTO and JonnyGuru from Corsair, why are people immediately jumping on termination? Neither parties resulted to malice with what they did.
"Is there a problem with the system?"
- Chief Technology Officer
One for the history books 🤦🏻♂️
"Sir, have you tried turning it off and on again? Hold down the power button for 10 seconds."
@@Tyiriel run "sfc scannow" :)
It's sad how badly these companies get screwed over by their own employees, but I assume they must not have a very stringent hiring process if systems like this make it out of the door.
Gotta love the total numb brains response. Like, they don't see 100C temps as even being a problem lol. Imagine bringing your car to the dealer after you just bought it because there's smoke coming out of the engine compartment due to a coolant issue and they say "is there anything wrong with the car? It seems to drive fine."
„Have you tried opening a window while gaming or turning down the ac?
Man I’m glad i learned how to build a pc. The joy of saving money and doing it properly is second to none.
+the joy of putting parts together and working properly is second to none.
Same. I built my first PC about 2 months ago (Im typing this comment on it rn :)) and I was about to buy a prebuilt because honestly, the thought of building my own scared me. I thought for sure I would break something and waste a ton of money. But after looking around and not being able to decide what prebuilt to get, I saw all the people saying how its better to build your own and how its not hard, so, despite my fears, I decided to do some research and give it a shot. And oh boy Im SO GLAD I did. Not only is it way cheaper for the same or better performance, but the satisfaction of booting it up for the first time and seeing it all work perfectly is unmatched. Seeing something that YOU built actually working as intended is super cool, and it feels way more earned than just buying a prebuilt.
And they were right, its not hard. Once you start doing research, you start to notice how all the components fit together in a very specific way, and that you basically cant install something the wrong way. If youre reading this and thinking of buying a prebuilt, I STRONGLY urge you to think about building your own. I know it may seem scary, but trust me, its a lot simpler than it seems and its very much worth it.
@Erisa how do you know?
Adult lego 😁
Also imagine how sad/disapoining it would be to actually order a prebuilt without any pc knowledge and you get it and it overheats and is really bad and not knowing what was wrong with it.
Thats actually what convinced me to build my own is I was going to buy a prebuilt until my friend told me that it would be a rip off and then he walked me through the build process. and helped me pick out parts Now I have 2 awesome rigs for me and my wife to be set this gen and Im so happy with them.
But man if I hadnt learned how computers work and just ordered a prebuilt and it came shipped like this I would have felt so ripped off and deflated with the whole thing because Id have no idea what to do.
So glad I built my own rigs, saved me thousands of dollars and give me a strange pride of like "yeah i made this"
Skytech offered to replace the PC. It would be educational to see if you got a Monday-with-hangover effort the first time, and the replacement is competently built.
Unless he can get the replacement “secret shopper” style, its quality is not going to be representative of what they typically sell.
Yes, I feel this is a step GN could have taken in order to test the support further, to see if what they get back is in fact a good and working build. Would be valuable from a consumer pow to see if they manage to fix what's wrong if you as a customer go through their support.
Yet again, that email point at fails on several levels so even if they got back a fully function computer, this whole review is a massive fail on Skytechs part.
They offered because they knew Steve eye's are on them
Replacements are always going to be better, "uh oh this one's a problem customer, they notice things!"
@@trascendents I don't think so since Steve did say he sent the email anonymously when they offered to replace the PC.
Good video. Please keep reviewing prebuilts.
We desperately need media to keep hammering these companies until they start selling products that aren't terrible.
@GamersNexus do starforge systems next, a new company started by twitch streamers/youtube and looks like some former people from Artesian is working there.
@candyman they haven't fallen apart yet, and they've got the former COO from Artesian Builds, the guy who ran the east branch and pretty much kept the company afloat. So they might actually become something
I hear Dell laughing behind that wall over there.
@@rashidal-suwaidi Oh true.. the one with actual business sense. Could be one to watch!
@@rashidal-suwaidi They tried to scam people with a terribly over priced build tho.
I bought a Skytech for around $4,400 from Amazon about 6 months ago with a 3090. Immediately got 10+ blue screens per day. I spent around 2 hours on the phone with them, and they were very nice, however, 2 hours of having me install programs to test things and then getting off the phone, only to have it bluescreen again. Repeat and rinse several 2 more times. After that I thought to myself do I really want to spend $4,400 that doesn't properly from day 1? I returned it and went with Digital Storm. I love my Digital Storm. It was a couple of hundred extra dollars but the case is much larger, no heat trouble at all, and not a single problem since day 1.
Your expensive as hell, prebuilt pc had issues so u bought a more expensive one as a solution?😭 I mean if it works do ya thang og
Not trying to be an asshole or anything but you should really learn how to build a PC yourself. You'd save a lot of money and trouble. As a general rule, pre-built PCs are an expensive lottery. I'm glad your pre-built turned out fine tho and I do understand why people buy pre-built PCs but yeah, try learning
My time is worth more. I have no problem paying someone "x" dollars to do the work. When I was younger and made less money, I would go that route.
I have a maid, I have someone who mows the lawn, a mechanic for the car, a roofer, and a furnace and water heater service.
Why the concern?@@JohnDarksoul69
@@JohnDarksoul69 There's so many guides on RUclips idk how someone cant just follow one...
@@causticchan4617 I have heard people recommend the pc building guide from The Verge.. i heard its really great :D just remember to screw in with confidence
It would have been good to see the cpu temps with the fans mounted in the correct orientation
I was thinking that too, just to get a side by side comparison. But after thinking about it for a while, I can understand GN considering that to be something like an endorsement. Saying "when assembled right, the PC works great" takes a lot of pressure off the company to fix their QC process. Refusing to review the PC proper as it should be, and instead scoring it solely on how they received it, will ultimately serve consumers greatly industry-wide.
I suppose there is something to be said for whether the PC could potentially be viable with simple corrections that a novice should be capable of, though if a novice is capable of fixing the problem that makes it all the more unacceptable for an SI to mess it up.
Yeah it kind of seems like this one is a bit rushed. I was just waiting for him to show that. I’m guessing they probably didn’t have much time with all the recent new product releases
I’d fit the definition of novice when it comes to computer design & I know I would not have realized the fans were wrong. Sure I could have seen the placement but would not have known it was wrong. Watching this I’m like ‘well yeah now I get it’ but would not have occurred to me a expert could get that wrong.
@@petrwad1423 It wasn't rushed at all. It spent like 2 weeks in testing and we waited a few months to even finish it. We just didn't think it was necessary since the end result was "don't buy this computer." There was a lot more wrong than just the fans, like the BIOS.
I decided to overclock my 8700k to 5ghz. My temps were at 100c during gaming. I thought that it was like that because my cpu wasnt delid. But the problem was different, my noctua nh-d15 was falsly installed. it was sucking air from the gpu and blast it to the top. So I changed the paste which was still very good (premium noctua paste) and rearanged the cpu cooler plus I added one more front intake (now 2 total 140mm) and I added 2 outtakes at the top. Now I get 65c while gaming and 75 while stress testing.
So guys, if you have problems with temps, its most likely all about cooling and airflow. My case is Fractal Design Meshify C, my case coolers I bought in pack, Arctic 140mm coolers x5 for 30 euro so 6 euro per cooler. Now my PC feels like a completely new one and I feel like I want to push it even further to 5.1 or 5.2 ghz. Currently my FPS in like Escape from Tarkov on for example Reserve raised from 60-70 to 95-120fps at mid-high settings 1440p just by overclocking my old chip.
For those that are curious on prebuilt companies, I recently had a fantastic experience with a purchase of a Digital storm prebuilt pc. Only problem i had upon arrival was a dead case fan, And within a day after contacting them they asked if i wanted to send back in the pc for repairs or if they could send me a replacement fan and i just do it myself. I opted for a new fan and within a few days a new fan was priority shipped to my house. 10/10 I would do business with them again, They also allow you to upgrade your pc with new parts if you choose and still keep your warranty on previous purchased stuff.
I would expect some sort of liquid cooling for almost $5k. What the hell?!
No
@@pwrsocket You're my spirit animal XD
@@xxitz_pr0gxx631 Snorlax isnt an animal.
@@pwrsocket Spirit *Pokemon*
My bad.
@@pwrsocket Pick your battles.
great video.I was waiting for a section where you resolved the issues with the fans, etc and show the difference between how it arrived and how it should have ran or performed.
Same here. Do we still see some throttling, or are correctly mounted fans enough (with that cooler) to let it run balls-out forever?
I definitely recommend not ordering with the "airbag" style foam. I had to carefully cut mine out on an IBP build recently. They expand and form fit, which can put tension and strain on everything. No damage for me, but the potential is there.
Got an Omen 40L for 1800 and its working great with no problems. I can't imagine how pissed I'd be if I paid 5000 for that
One of my concerns with Ryzen 7000 and Intel 13th GEN is that if 95 to 100° is now what’s supposed to happen… It’s gonna make it that much harder for average users to tell what’s intentional behavior, and what’s thermal throttling and inappropriately reaching those temperatures too fast.
See rocket lake it really goes almost like a rocket 🤣 intel makes it really powerfull in a wrong way
it's kinda sad how Intel, nVidia and AMD are fighting the e-penis benchmark race with absolutely no regards for power efficiency even if their hardware can pull it off all for the sake of getting 1st spot on specific benchmarks. It comes down to the users who cares to power limit their hardware now, be it CPUs or GPUs the performance loss is minimal for huge drops in both temperatures and power usage. Like the 7950x limited to 65W loses like 5% of performances overall and runs 20+ °C cooler. It's hard for me to wrap my head around how they can have their customers waste that much energy for their ego, let's not talk about the generated heat it's even more infuriating.
@@guillaumebackelandt7381 wow that's a huge difference in temp. That would be a good video to see the power/temp/noise/performance.
Yeap, as Steve said, builders anyways must know to look for thermal throttling, and it will be a lot more important in new gens.
@@guillaumebackelandt7381 the problem is a huge portion of their business is decided on spec sheets determined by out of the box function. Many people will buy things based on out of the box specs instead of changing settings in BIOS.
To anyone bashing the response given by Skytech Gaming: There’s only so many ways that a statement can be framed and given when it comes to business. Yes, it’s worded rather similarly to any other apologetic response companies that have made following this scenario. It’s respectful, straightforward, informative, and paints a picture as to they know there is room for improvement and they are working on that for the betterment for all. They have to follow through in order to make their statement something of substance rather than hollow.
I wonder how that cooler performs with the bent heat pipes? I'd like to see a head-to-head thermals test between this damaged cooler and an identical cooler in good condition, with proper fan orientation lol
I suspect as long as pipe isn't burst open OR crushed restricting flow inside, it should be fine.
with such bent I'd be more concerned about contact patch with the cpu.
That's what I was thinking originally, too. But then I thought the bends might interfere with the fluid flow inside the pipe. Bends or dents create restrictions for any fluid to flow properly through tubing. Since the liquid coolant is carried back through capillary action by a wick, that shouldn't be affected too much. But the gaseous coolant flows freely inside the tube, powered by the pressure differential between the hot plate and the cooling fins. I figure the bends might restrict the gas flow, which would in turn reduce the liquid flow back to the hot plate since the gas can't reach the fins to condense back into a liquid in the first place.
Either way, I'd love to see a test with a cooler in good condition. Mostly because I fear that even a top air coolergets to 100°C with no-time-constrains 240W 12900k boost ANYWAY in this type of case and fan configuration, so the 100°C test result might be on every QA card with this CPU and cooler, no matter if installed correctly or not.
5:25 "or you could just install them pointing opposite directions" was so dry I believed him for a second.
yeah exactly i had to double take ahhaha
Would absolutely love to see one of these reviews for Starforge PC's. LTT already did a review but would be interesting to see if they can be the "good" recommendation.
Oh yeah me too.
Space cuck rocket company ;)
I was going to leave a comment a comment about Starforge as well. I'd like to see GN's experience with them.
They already said they were not going to review a prebuilt from the Artisan castoffs, so they don’t either flood them with orders they can’t handle if it’s good or ruin them from the start if they’re bad. LTT doesn’t give a fuck about how their coverage affects others.
I got the i7 12700k motherboard ram bundle deal from micro center a few months ago. Paid the $30 for them to install the cpu, dual fan cooler and ram to make sure it goes thru post. And got win 10 on a thumb drive. Swapped out my 2nd gen i7 board in 30min and installed win 10 in 4 minutes on the nvme drive I got. Performs amazing. Temps barely get above 60c on the cpu.
I can never get enough of Steve’s sarcasm and passive-aggression 😂
It's humor not passive aggression, being critical with a a good reason in a humorous way is not passive aggressive, this is the sort of thing an employer would tell you, that criticism is being passive agressive
Passive-agression? I missed the "passive" part.
Which for me at least is one of the reasons I like GN the most from the most known tech and review channels. I don't know if it comes only from Steve personally, but the fact they won't hold back anything is what makes companies think twice about screwing the customers. Well, unless you're Gigabyte.
@@michaelandrews4783 and I find it hilarious, hence the laughing face.
I cant believe i actually bought a prebuilt for my first pc. I could never trust anyone but myself to build a pc for me ever again after seeing this.
My first (and current) desktop is an HP prebuild. It has genuinely taken a significant toll on my mental health, I'm not at all joking. I want to destroy it every single day.
15:04 No joke where did the money go?
VRM heatsink is bent as well. Very visible at 13:43
My husband and I love watching your reviews of pre-built PCs. They are so informative (and hilarious!). Would you consider reviewing Linux machines? We gave up on Windows several years ago after being screwed by it multiple times. We both now use Linux PCs (Ubuntu and Mint). My gaming machine is currently a System76 laptop running Linux Mint. 99% of my Steam game library works fine on Linux with Proton. I'm currently having a blast playing Cyberpunk 2077 with no problems. I would be very interested in a review of, for example, a System76 high powered gaming rig or something similar.
yes! Please do a review on pre-built Linux systems, including driver support for Linux, and how well they can wine.
Curious what windows did to you? Lol
@@dukenukeman Worst thing it did to me was screw up the color profile on my monitor when Microsoft published a big Windows update one summer. I was doing art and photography at the time and this destroyed my ability to work. It was unfixable on Windows, so I had to switch to Linux. Fortunately I had a background in using UNIX, so no big deal.
I got a pre-built from skytech back during the lockdown and its still going strong. I wouldn't write them off unless they refuse to fix any of this.
You know the video is going to be good when GN uploads a review with flames in the thumbnail. This one especially with "PURE INCOMPETENCE". Love it.
GN, please make a coffee roast. I wanna buy coffee beans from you.
Because of this I went and looked at my skytech tower (when I get a prebuilt I check for obvious signs of incompetence as in fans being backwards, pins for graphics cards not being connected ect.) But sure enough that motherboard connector at the bottom had glue on it and the small connector for power at the bottom of the motherboard was bent and falling out
if you want a good prebuilt micro center makes rlly good ones highly recommend it
Damn. My fiancé bought a skytech in earlish pandemic (April 2020?) And it has been great! They're a company I've recommended many times since to friends looking to buy a prebuild if they don't want me building something for them for whatever reason. It sucks to see they've gone way downhill 😞
It's shocking to see it this bad as well. I got one for around 3 grand with an rtx 3090 ti recently sept 28th of this year. Happy to report that it was very professionally built. Everything came intact. No cooling issues. Still, really shocking to see.
I think it's a very rare thing for Skytech. Our company has almost a dozen builds from them, and none are anything other than excellent machines! The weird issues here are almost likely from a new crew in assembly and quality control too perhaps. Cool to see Steve call out the issues and also cool to see him state that it's not the norm for Skytech on a couple occasions. I think you and yer fiance can still be happy with and recommend Skytech though!
5k for a an air cooled cpu! That is absolutely insane. Even if it is installed correctly and the fan curves set right you’re never going to be able to tame a 12900k. It wouldn’t have been to much more expensive to install a double 120mm rad, but I wouldn’t even consider anything less then a triple for any high end cpu. I have a triple 120mm on my 13900k and it thermal throttles with the boost clocks set to “auto”. I set E cores to 4.8 and P cores to 4.0, temps max out at 80c with a cinebench score of 34k.
You don't need managers (I think they are actually always part of the problem), you need a good workflow (you can use 1 manager maybe to do that) and for the rest, enthusiastic workers, that care a bit. Management can't create those and usually create the opposite.
most of the times those kind of jobs pay the absolute minimum - so noone cares. and those enthusiastic about it either left years ago, fell up the stairs to better paying jobs or lost their sense of achievement working on this long ago so they don't care...
last place i worked at had manager that was absolutely clueless about everything, including management, just like politicians pretty much, nobody needs them, but they get paid the most
This, THIS, was my experience with Skytech when I bought them.
Even if the damn thing was built properly, $5000 for this system is insane. This is like $2600-2900 in parts.
yeah... but for 5000$ you have a 100deg system!!!
everything has a price.
The 3090ti is still expensive if you can actually find it.
@@TheSjuris It's $1100. 12900k is $550. mobo is $150. SSD is $100 at most. RAM is $80. cooler is $90. PSU is $100. case is $160. That's $2340 by my count... and that's not bulk pricing like an SI would get on much of this.
It's a ripoff.
@@marxman6896 you can’t find the gpu anyplace for $1100. This was also done in April. Gpu prices have gone down. Still haven’t seen any store selling a 3090ti for that low especially not that particular one. You can find that one for $1200 on eBay.
so glad you brought up the "big ass enter key"... i loathe keyboards with that configuration...
A comparing chart with the CPU cooler (same kind if bent) installed correctly would of been useful as a reference to better understand the heat issue (unless it was included and I missed it); seeing how there is confusion down in the comments with regard to the 13900K (incorrect comparison though).
Yeah, I mean it is possible that someone just made a mistake and other systems have their fans the right way. So a run with the fan going properly (as he said it was installed correctly at some point) would of been useful.
It's not the fan facing backward, but the whole cooler have been place 180 degree backward.
It's just a small mistake when mounting the system. but can be huge when you try to find the problem about the heat.
I'm very happy with my P500A, which I chose as a happy medium based on your thermal testing charts. My only issue with it is that I have to mount the Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360 on the top with only four screws as it will not line up properly. Other than that, it's a Phantastik case.
That's kinda weird because I built a PC last year around the P500A and he Liquid Freezer II and I don't recall having too many issues with the AIO mounting screws at the top. (the build was not for me but a family member) The Liquid Freezer II I used is an older unit. What I didn't like is the screws created raised bumps where the magnetic dust cover goes. I was a bit disappointed with it overall because the metal Phanteks used for the P500A is way thinner than the Enthoo Pro.... or my old AF Cooler Master cases.
@@m8x425 Did you mount it push or pull? I feel like that might be making the difference, as I mounted pull.
I will admit the metal is a little thin as too much torque on the screws will make it bow, but unscrew an eighth of a turn and it's fine.
Bottom line: Don't buy a pre-built. Just build your own. I built 2 PCs in the last 7 years and they turned out great. No damaged parts, no improper installations, no less-than-ideal components.
Would have liked to see how it performed with a remount and fan flip even with the bent heatsink, just as a curiosity
Took me about 10 hours to go from knowing absolutely nothing to building my first PC from scratch. It was really fucking cool to see it boot and run games at 2k with buttery a smooth framerate.
Found out the hard way that if you dont connect the additional 4 pin you can have massive stuttering issues. It should be standard to connect both honestly
$5,000 for THAT? No way.
i bought a skytech in 2020 when my old prebuilt shit out. spent 3k, went from a 970, i5 etc to 2080 ti and i9 9900k, basically i just threw money at someone for a pc. it shit out 2 days after i got it while playing bannerlord...fortunately they gave me a full refund. however, i used 2/3s of that money and built a pc myself, with slightly lower specs but performed like a beast for everything i wanted. still running great to this day, i honestly am not surprised whatsoever at this
Man, seeing this video today is nostalgic. Remember when hitting 100°C on an Intel CPU was considered abnormal?
WASD on the arrow keys was the icing on the cake for me
3 SIs come to find for 5 grand pre builds. One you can spec out an Aventum from Digital Storm. You can get one of the Masterworks builds from Ironside. Or you can spec custom build from Ironside or Meta.
I swear the best product to buy is from a company that is just hitting traction and has proved themselves to trusted reviewers. Those companies are full of passion and tend to do things the right way. Most companies as they age start to cut corners, especially if they're publicly traded. It's why I never get ppl obsessed with brands. Follow passionate people, not a brand.
Very unfortunate to see. With that said, over the years I've purchased 3 different PC builds from Skytech and all 3 PC builds were built beyond flawless. The 3rd PC build having received it no less than a month ago and couldn't have been more pleased with their end product. It's really great when companies take real feedback/criticism and uphold what they say.
Instead of glue, I guess a small screw-in for the connector? Kind of like how VGA cables can have screws
that's crazy that they are getting 100C with that massive heatsink.
I got my first prebuilt from them a couple years ago, and despite being a novice at the time in terms of pc building I immediately knew there was something wrong with it. The pc wouldn't even power on no matter what I did. I ended up sending it back the same day it arrived and bought a prebuilt from Cyberpower that was much better built, after that I built my own gaming pc.
"there is inconsistency which isn't a good sign", excellent analysis. Seems like Skytech is missing the very basics of product quality theory.
I will say I used to work at Fedex and I've seen all sorts of TVs.. Computers.. even live animals carelessly thrown onto the ground and everybody laughing about it. People blame retailers when 99% of the time it's the actual courier service that does all of the damage. I remember we had one hot shot ASUS ROG monitor that fell out of a truck and one of the guys said "HAHA Funny thing is they'll blame Walmart for that!".. so sad how true that is lol. That being said I definitely always build my own PCs.
I purchased a Shadow 3.0, she's been great. 3060 variant with the 3600 and a 1tb. Love it so far.
5k no amount of apologizes and "make it right" could ever make me spend my hard earned money with a company like this.
I got a prebuilt at around 2015, after doing a good amount of research on it's components, and it served me well for many years. But it's time for an upgrade, as I'm starting to lower my graphics settings to stay at 1080p. The only problem is... Now I have to upgrade everything :B So, I like watching your videos to get tips and tricks on my first major upgrade.
I bought a cyberpower PC for 2000$ had a R7 7700x with a wraith prism cooler. No upper fans and top panels had no mesh. Could cook an egg on top of it. I replaced it with a icue 100
I just love the fact the 13th series i9 13900kf is just normal to be at 100c when overclocked. Lol.
When this series started, I was expecting maybe 20-30% of the pre-builts to be absolute trash. How is it possible that barely 20% are NOT trash and everything else is?
That no one noticed fans spooling up during the stress test says enough about that company.
It's almost as if enthusiast grade pcs should not be shipped completely assembled. Who would have thought a myriad of expensive components with distinct orientations would suffer in shipping?
Absolutely embarrassing showing, and the email from the "Chief Technology Officer" was the icing on the cake.
It's pretty ridiculous that they hire upper management based on management skills and not if they actually understand the product and company they're going to be managing. It's a sign that corporate architecture, the business philosophy needs a change.
@@JosephArata that’s most companies these days. I’ve had multiple managers that couldn’t step into my role, in any capacity, yet were in charge of me and others. Sad.
@@JosephArata I work in IT, I'm a manager and I'm more technically skilled than any other employee in my company. So that's not always a case. On top of that, you don't have to be very technical to know that 100 degrees is BAD for any component lol. This company is a joke.
@@professorofdeath7965 depends on the job. It is okay to have specialists working for you that know about stuff that you don't, and they can do the work, show your the results and explain it. You need to trust them though and show them their worth (mainly via financial compensation, plus of course treating them well and crediting them).
I agree. I'd use it as a follow up after teaching ppl why prebuilts are a no go. I recently had to convince someone not to buy an Alienware desktop. I said it's got poor ventilation they immediately interrupted saying "look that looks like ventilation there.." and I said "Ys it LOOKS like ventilation....but it's not good, the i9 will run like an i7 due to thermal throttling." Then I showed them your channel.
An interesting video idea would be to build what you guys think a $5 000 prebuilt *should* be. Going through the part selection, the build process, and finally the software loading. I'd watch that.
GN did something similar where they dropped into a microcenter and helped a fan build his system
Either pcs got expensive or this build is a couple grand overpriced like.. I'm going to be building a 4090/7950 and expect change from $4000
Great idea
This is a great idea.
I'd imagine it comes down to:
1. A selection of parts that make sense for the price point they're targetting with good performance optimization
2. Assembling the parts like a competent human being who understands the concept of airflow and securing parts properly
3. Giving a reasonable upcharge for assembly, ideally under 10% the cost of the parts
4. Product arriving good to go with correct BIOS settings and minimal/no bloatware
5. No proprietary parts that prohibit upgrading or repairing it.
Steve is getting very good at his comedic timing. I love these pre-built pc reviews!
Steve sarcasm and comedic timing have always been absolute S tier. (at least since a few years ago when I found GN) he legit makes me laugh more than any other comedic youtuber
Steve has always been very good with timing though
Good ole' "big ass-enter" is my takeaway quote for this video.
He is a joke isn't he.
Finally, we get another installment to the "It's better than Dell" series. 🥳👍
something tells me this fails to get that coveted award
eeeeeeeeeeh.... this one might not be! haha
@@GamersNexus Steve, I think I can speak for a lot of us with this idea...
Hire some ex-Artesian builders (ones that hate Noah get preference), launch your own GN S.I. PC. I'm sure there's some profit margin for all of you between cost and the $5000 these idiots are charging for computer builds that double as heating solutions for your home.
@@MafiaboysWorld zero interest in starting an SI. That's not what we do and it's a massive conflict of interest. We serve the community better this way.
@@GamersNexus very glad you hold this position
i would be pissed if i payed 5000 for a pc and it had damage but at least the company agreed to replace it
I'm so happy I build my own machines. I use to think pre-builds are the way to go.
@@rexyoshimoto4278 You know what you get then and it's cheaper. You also have another relation to the pc when you build it yourself!
@@teeaymusik9811 So true.
@@rexyoshimoto4278 Personally i don't have the time and the knowledge to build my own.... what i do have on the other hand is money.
@@KnIf0rTITAN It takes very little effort or knowledge to build a PC like this one. Once you have the parts, it is about a 30 minute process, mainly cable management. Then the install of your OS. But if you have the money, doesn't matter.
I certainly hope you do a "fixing the Mark 9" video where you can show the delta in performance in an appropriately cooled device.
I imagine vastly diminished returns beyond "facing the fan the correct direction"
Yes! Would love to see you remount the cooler properly, put the fans on correctly and see what kind of temps it can hit
@@douglasmurphy3266 Do not forget the found BIOS settings and low RAM speed...
"RAM is socketed properly"
You know its a mess when you consider this a W on your $5000 computer
Yes, its like they are reviewing monkeys from the zoo that learnt how to build computers.
But it wipes your ass too tho
To be fair it did work out of the box to the specs listed. The fix to exceed those specs and supposedly lowering the temp (we don't know if the fan direction did lower the temps or not, it wasn't shown) took all of 15 seconds.
@@Watchfulfox no it wasnt. 100 deg means the cpu will cut power and throttle, physically there will be not much difference, besides reduced component life, but performance will suffer, especially when temps were going up to max almost instantly. my guess its either radiator was damaged and cracked somewhere due to improper shipping (bend is visible but there might be an actual crack somewhere) or even incorrectly installed, or the overall airflow of the case was poor. reversed fan wont, by itself ,cause that high temp spike. it could also be a faulty cpu, but those happen rarely.
@@BlackhatAudio my "no, it wasnt" was referring to Watchful Fox(your alt?) comment about "To be fair it did work out of the box to the specs listed". quite contrary, its was a crippled system from the start. messed up bios settings, bend (and possibly even cracked) radiator and cpu trying to double as a firefighter is not a sign of a "working out of the box" build.
The kind of incompetence that makes you believe in yourself more.
you will definitely take more care to your pc than any company will ever do
You got that right!😁
Yep, this is exactly what sites like pcpartpicker are for.
Funny but true
@@davisparkour Thats super untrue for most people.
Man, I missed these. I love the prebuilt teardowns where Steve just gets more and more amazed as he goes through it
If you do another one that's gonna be pricey, go with one of the boutique manufacturers like Digital Storm or Origin PC. I'd be super curious to know how that would go.
They did an origin one in the past. It was well built with no significant issues, other than being way overpriced.
@@metzli5797 Origin can be hit or miss, but their prices are unquestionably high.
There's gotta be a german word for spectating a company's spectacular failures at quality control. Schadenfreude doesn't do it justice. Schadenfraud?
My favourite part of this is that, if Steve rips you apart for something, he'll give you 5 different ways to fix the problem. That sort of attitude (especially on RUclips) needs to be celebrated more. Good work on the review, and I hope SkyTech reaches out to you with a humble response.
what do you mean? he didn't even fix the problem and ran the tests as is
@@XX-121 Isn't that kind the point ? An average non tech person might not know how to fix these problems, so he/she is getting less performance for the money. And let's assume that the buyer know how to fix it, a brand new 5K dollars PC shouldn't have these issues in the first place. Fixing these problems, and then testing wouldn't give an accurate representation of experince am average buyer may get.
Provided exactly zero different ways to secure that ARGB connector other than glue despite saying that there are more elegant solutions.
Steve ripping into Asus for their garbage software is something he needs to do more of along with all the other garbage software out of Taiwan and China. They seem to only care about form not function. Make it look fancy then who cares if it’s total buggy bloatware. That’s the Taiwanese software way and they just don’t seem to get it.
@@oleg_aka_djmeg He said "probably"
Imagine going back in time and telling people that in 10 years, high end consumer graphics cards would be selling on eBay for $2,500 and SI’s would be selling $5,000 PC’s outfitted with a $100 air cooler.
I don't think you'd have to go back 10 years, but I get your point of view. There was a time when $3k was a pretty substantial PC not that long ago and is my typical build sheet, and I'm not running a 3090. I've built my own since the AMD 350mhz was a thing, but even pre-builts from like Falcon Northwest where you (at least used to) get what you paid for was acceptably named a high end build.
@@C-M-E Last time I remember it being good was around the 1000 series launch. I built a good 6600k + 1070 computer for $1300 ($300 was watercooling components, so essentially $1k) And I could have gone cheaper with a less flashy case, and mobo. It's actually my current system. Everything's been so stupid since then that only now am I upgrading it to a 13600k and 6900xt (wasn't planning on such a beefy gpu, but the sale was good)
No cap, I couldn’t keep waiting on normal 4090 prices and collecting all these components to build a water cooled so I got digital storm to make me one. I trust they won’t fail like this based on testimonials.
But yeah everything used to priced much more nicely I remember when u could get like a titan and top of the line i7 for and a water cool loop for like 3-4 grand lol
"In 1994, Best Buy was selling notebook computers for about $2,600 and $3,300 (pictured above), which would be more than $4,000 in today's dollars for the one on the left and more than $5,000 in today's dollars for the one on the right."
Seeing their professional cable management has made me feel better about my own 👌🏻
Haw, ha! Me too!
Their cable management isn't as clean as it could have been though, but they did at least put the effort in.
@@Klaytoncalix Maybe two people worked on it. One who couldn't do jack 5h!t and didn't care to do better, the another who loved the job, going the extra mile.
I don't think the cable management is that bad to be honest. It's everything else that's the problem. Talk about nitpicking.
@@NobbsAndVageneyou can do that when you spend 5k on a gaming machine
I wish you had also tested it with the CPU cooler fans mounted correctly for comparison.
wouldn't really get the point across if you go "yeah, it works well after we fixed it". The point of pre-built is that they must work 100% perfect on arrival, not that you have to spend time fixing everything that's wrong with it. May as well built it yourself at that point
@@thesteelrodent1796 Yeah I was in that mindset for a second. But it would be nice to know the thermals when it actually was assembled correctly for an understanding what a valid build looks like. But eh.....I could go either way. I usually would rather go towards the outcome that gives more data vs less.
I would agree as well, should have tested correct config to show comparison. But not for all those who understood already why it was wrong. But if you want to capture your audience to those who ain't as technical but is curious about tech, because I had my girlfriend and friend sitting watching it with me while we just chilling. After the video my friend and girlfriend just said, after all that, talking about the temperature and the effects of it but he never showed the difference or impact it has.
@@thesteelrodent1796 Yeah but it would be a good way to show the difference - they could always put it back to how it was after before shipping it back.
I agree for shitz n Gigs. I have a Skytech PC so yeah lol
For over $5K that's just completely unforgivable.
even if 100% correct this is not 5k . 3k with profit 3.5k overprice profit with in reason still. but 5k is BS
I love that Steve doesn't call the technicians or qc staff stupid but addresses the issue on a company level with "someone has to teach them". GN are just THE best pc hardware reviewer imo! Big ups!
Yea from a consumer perspective it's really only the employee's fault if they're actually being malicious. If the employee doesn't know what they're doing then it's the company's fault for not properly training people. If the employee isn't taking enough time to properly look over their work then the company is at fault for making them feel like they need to rush. The company and its upper management is ultimately responsible for almost every issue and it's great that Steve doesn't play the "blame someone else" game.
@@Glornak Even if the employee knows better and is taught better. It's still on the company. QC is a thing and that should not be checked by the same person that built it. That's why it's always on the company and it's policies set in place.
@@psedog Uhm..... yea? That's what I said.
He technically did with the certifies incompetence. But call it as it is.....100C within 30 sec should set of alarm bells in anyone doing benchmarks.
Yes,... and no. In many cases in there are problems exist at all levels, the company and the employee. Blaming just the employee, or blaming just the higher up company level are probably wrong in this case.
I get excited every time GN uploads a pre-built review.
I’m surprised you didn’t include a section where you flipped the fan in the correct orientation to show how such a basic oversight can amount to a huge difference. Skytech definitely needs to address their qc procedures and strive for consistency throughout the company.
Yes I don’t know what to expect for performance I would like to see what the difference is and not just be told it takes a massive hit.
With it flipped, it probably still would be at or near throttling. The issue is the cooler - the fins aren't connected (useless fan in the middle design) and they are too closely spaced, resulting in mediocre airflow when put in a high demand situation like this. Tossing a fan on it won't make it move air any faster and you really SHOULD be seeing a water cooler on a beast of a CPU at this price.
@@plektosgaming nh-d15 performs like a top 240mm AIO, it would cool a 12900k without issues in typical loads even with a single fan. to make it throttle you'd have to run aida64 torture test which will hammer all threads.
The fan corrected and the xmp setup correctly as well!
@@plektosgaming the fins are connected by a heatpipe lol, you're highly misinformed if you think this noctua cooler is inherently bad. It's one of the top air coolers
I would have been curious to see if you fixed the cpu fans what the thermals were like.
it seems the bend heatsink might be a problem as well
Bent is nothing, it can still work well.
i feel like this was an essential part of the review that would've highlighted how good the system could've been, and showing the delta between optimal and as-shipped would've been very important.
Yeah I was kind of surprised they didn' flip the fan and see the difference in temp
Yes please do a short review after the fan problem is fixed. Thx
I would like to see how this system performs if everything was done right. Perhaps Steve & Co. could incorporate something similar, where they're like "Ok, we put the fans on correctly, we tightened everything down, now let's see what happens" and post the results. Plus it'll let viewers see how something that could be considered a minor change could mean major performance increases.
I was really hoping to see that too, kinda disappointing.
I doubt it would have mattered - that Noctua cooler is way undersized for the CPU its sitting on.
@@3rdPartyIntervener hope youre sarcastic xxD
Yeah I was really expecting them to run the performance checks after fixing the cpu fan orientation
Ya I was disappointed to see that they were actually charging 5k for it to not be quality checked and insured, only to find out that it was just the CPU fan backwards. Yet they kept drilling how that was unforgivable. Strange that the company emailed why it was that high though, they must’ve been clueless about the CPU fan being on backwards.
I was really hoping they’d show the temps with the fans on properly to see if that was the mistake. Mistakes happen, but for 5k those mistakes should be minimized if not zero, but I doubt it’s robots making these computers so I’m not surprised some (new?) person messed up while working for 6+ hours building the same thing.
You guys are brutal, and its why I watch your videos. Honesty and transparency are a rare virtue in the tech industry nowadays. You're doing the Lords work fellas.
I couldn't agree more !!!
Not just the tech industry, any industry
@@Optim121 these days it seems like every industry …
For transparency they should have sent it back and re reviewed the replacement. They obviously had an axe to grind with this video. Maybe they tried and failed to get a lower price on one and this is their retaliation.
@@Watchfulfox, they obviously say on the video that they weren't trying to get a bargain on it.
I previously bought the skytech shiva (rtx 2060, ryzen 5 2600) it was advertised to come with a 750w psu and only came with a 500w, the cpu cooler was broken, everything was hot glued and a couple pins on the motherboard were bent.
😬
just buy the components and build one yourself. it's not rocket science trust me
@@herbertwalter8693 It's not, but if you are a clumsy bugger and have arthritis then you hope the "pro's" can help
@@herbertwalter8693 agreed. I considered a prebuilt this upgrade only because it was cheaper than buying the components
Even then, I am worried they'll muck it up. Not to mention it's slower waiting for them to build it. If it's even relatively similar in price to buy/build yourself, that's the way to go.
@@herbertwalter8693 seriously, my first build was 90 percent just screwing stuff in and being careful it is not as hard as it seems lmao
The glue for the aRGB cable imo was about as good as an option as you could use without any serious damage especially with how minimal of an amount they used. 3 and 4 pin aRGB plugs / connections are ALWAYS inconsistent and some are incredibly tight and some are incredibly loose! So it makes sense that they would do that so at least the lighting would always work. And they likely may not do this on every single system just with issues with connectors. Just my two cents.
Dude I often can't get my own rgb cables to stay put. They really do have a shitty design. I use a piece of electrical tape but that stuff never sticks very long.
I wish mobo makers would all agree on some standard that includes a clip.
The whole problem is that aRGB cables were never designed to a industry standard. They were designed by vendors (like ASUS) and there is not an industry body, that I am aware of to properly vet the design for consumer use.
Using duct tape would have been better tho
tbf I have a P500A myself and the included 3pin aRGB to Motherboard is VERY LOOSE.
Just using tape would be less damaging to the components compared to glue though.
@@drinkingguy3168 duct tape will just get gooey, fall off and leave residue.
"They got a couple loose screws"
Yeah, seems to sum it up.
I work in QC, for a different industry, but Steve's comments on how to address and fix this issue were spot on. Just throwing someone in a QC role and giving them five minutes of training doesn't cut it. You have to give them the resources to know why they're checking all the things on the list, and then of course have the list itself be complete and well thought out. My company has similar issues. I have a TON of paperwork and various boxes I have to check to do my job, which is fine if there's a point to it and it's not just redundant nonsense. (Guess which way it usually goes). Meanwhile I've been doing the job for over a year and have yet to receive ANY training from the lead QC guy that was promised on day 1. There are still things I'm looking at and checking off that I don't actually know much about. Sadly this is not unusual.
Here in the comment sections late expecting to find someone already writing this quote, and upvoting it.
Crazy that this stuff happened on such a high end build.
5k for this build is absolutely insane lol
5k$ for a computer that doesn't even work properly is absolutely terrifying
@@cesarpdc This is why its not worth it to buy prebuilts. Not only do most companies (or at least the big, most well known ones) not give a fuck about QC, they are also obscenely expensive at the high end. I bet you could get a build like this in like half the price in the US if you were building it yourself.
I build a PC for myself for the first time a few days ago. Kinda makes you feel good about yourself when you do a better job then a company.
@@kaydog890 Less being a pretentious pedantic wannabe professor, more contributive comments or heck, keep the corrections but present them in a friendly and constructive manner. English is not everyone's first language. The comment can be understood, that's enough.
Yes, the first time I built my PC I spent most of the day on it because I was scared of every step, but I did it and it was so satisfying to see the BIOS screen. It was built better than all of the prebuilts showcased here on GN.
@@kaydog890 Congrats on deleting your original comment, do better next time ;)
@@LiveType As someone who runs a smaller PC building company, scaling isn't really the hard part if you know what you're doing.
Now if you scale too quickly or adopt too many options, that's when things can falter.
Generally speaking, learning to build and package 1 PC VS 1000 PC''s will yield identical results.
On their end, I just think its incompetence.
That PC shouldn't have arrived damaged, and its not hard, a large double-corrugated box cost $10 extra, and shipping is $20 extra from a small box at max.
Packaging materials is $5 extra.
So for $35 extra, you prevent shipping damage.
Occasionally we've seen bent CPU coolers, the best way to avoid that (if they're very heavy) is to either package them as they did internally (but failed to do externally) or completely avoid them and go with an AIO instead.
At $5000, an AIO should've been used to begin with.
Sometimes its not about building a product that will sell, but rather, the best product configuration, that is for specs AND shipping, those 2 have to be heavily considered together, then learning how scale.
The fact they have only like 5 case options but have PC's arriving damaged goes to show a failure on their end to address an issue like that.
Beyond that, if you can't even hire employees to know that 100C is bad, there is clearly an employee training issue.
When we hire employees, one of the first things they're taught is thermal throttling and how to look out for it.
Thermal throttling will only occur with installation error (and maybe rarely inventory shipping damage), so its paramount for them to know WHY they're running the test to begin with, its to double-check their work.
Never did a build either. Was cheaper back in 2015 to buy prebuilt from a great SI in my country and its still running 0 issues because I got them to spec it better. But would like to try it sometime. Only part I'm not sure on is cable installation/PSU plugin. That worries me.
I would have loved it if you had reinstalled the cpu cooler correctly, to show how easy it is to correct the mistake, and the performance difference
perhaps it is not their norm, but I was sitting here throughout the video thinking "just fix the (obvious) mistake and compare." I get that people who have disposable income but are not computer building savvy will fall victim to any sort of mistake like this and it's shameful that a company tested this system and thought "solid!", but how many times have we heard of people building their own computer and only realizing after 2 years that they plugged in their monitor into the motherboard instead of GPU? Mistakes happen; at least they seem to have a great tech support policy.
If they charge 5k it better not have any faults lol.
@@RazorIsEpic well mistakes happen in multi-billion dollar businesses, let alone with 5k products - that's just real life. In reality, you'd return a faulty product and it would hopefully get corrected. Furthermore, I don't see any evidence in this video whether this was a single event mistake, or a whole line was faulty - one computer with a wrongly installed fan is shown, and then tests were run against that. To which I have to posit a question - why? What's the point of 25+ minutes of video of tests for something that clearly had an error in it? Why not either return the product as faulty, or fix the obvious mistake manually, and then test? I guess that wouldn't have made a good video :shrugs:
@@dmberger because they paid 5 thousand dollars for that pc. There is an egregious amount of errors in that pc, the most telling being that the cpu coolers. They tested it, the problem was literally in their face and they still didn't know what was wrong. I've only built one pc so far and I saw that immediately. That's beyond shocking. Do they hire competent people at that company?
Maybe not directly related, but I once, many years ago, didn't bother with no fans in my case because I figured the graphic-cards have it's own, maybe I don't have to mention that it felt like a sauna in there after a while, the whole case became hot (lol), so I installed one fan blowing in at the front, and one blowing out at the back, and it became very cool and stable after that (off-course). But yes, cooling in a correct manner is really important.
I know inflation is rampant,
but even so, this thing is not worth 5 grand.
And that is _without_ the many mistakes and peculiar build-choices made.
Great video as always!
4090/7000 Ryzen sitting around $4k prebuilt ATM... This is definitely some holiday season 2021 pricing...
@@MissingNumb The computer was built and shipped out on April 28th, 2022. Says so in the QC letter Steve showed @26:33. GPU prices had already fallen off in February, so not much of an excuse.
Right now a Skytech Prism II with a Ryzen 7950x, a 3090ti, 32gb RAM, 360mm aio, and a 1kw PSU is $3800usd. I guess the prices have come down a little. This is from their non-customizable list.
Inflation is rampant because of corporate greed.
Blaming corporate greed on corporate greed is circular logic.
You could build this PC yourself for like $3000 at most.
I’m just gonna start my own company and scale horribly just to make it on GN and get a “at least is starts” as the badge of approval 😂
Sadly, just working out of the box appears to be high praise.
You want to shoot for "Better than Dell!"
Using 2-component expanding foam stuff like that can be extremely risky. In this case I think what happened is that the top of the heatpipes pinned itself in the foam while it was still slightly expanding.
So, do you think the foam was put in before the testing was done?
@@madatu judging by the other issues we can't rule out this possibility either
@@madatu i dont think you understand. The way those foam packs work is you "activate" them inside of the container they're securing, so they expand in place. It's just expanding foam with a preset volume. So you pop them to activate, put them in, close the case and they expand in place. What @batteryaziz means is it expanded unevenly and put pressure on one side of the heat stack. That's why these can be "risky" because they have the ability to apply pressure.
@@CRneu No he didn't say it expanded unevenly, he said the heatpipes were pinned in the foam while it was expanding.
@@zimmerman1031 it would only bend to one side if it expanded unevenly, or applied uneven pressure. Don't get bogged down in a small detail when the main point is the same.
Would have liked to see a quick chart of how great the difference would be in terms of temp of flipping that single fan.
my computer does not run more then 66 degrees Celsius and it does not use hot glue to hold anything together🤣
I am honestly shocked. Not just cause of the high marks Skytech previously received from prior reviews of their systems from you guys. But also that I personally own two of their pre-builts and have never had an issue from a QC to performance issues, aside from a minor one (which was the XMP memory was not default in the BIOS). Way to let the ball drop Skytech and love the straight to the point no sugar coated review from GN
Skytech rep after watching this video: "oh fuck,100c not 100f. oopsies."
Would like to see what this system can do if the fans are moved to their proper orientation
I'm thinking that 12900 would still hit 100C on air, just do it slower.
For 5000 you can watercool the same system all by yourself with better components
Yea, I think air cooler is not enough for 12900k.
@@Anderson_LS @Spladam that cooler can handle 250W
@@super1jose848 dude for 5k you can build this with better components for much cheaper in like every category.
you can probably afford a new Iphone with all that you saved.
ignoring literally all of the problems with this PC, paying $5k for an AIR COOLED 12900k is absolutely wild.
Was thinking the same...
they payed a middleschooler $2,200 to punt the air cooler and ding up the front panel with a baseball bat.
Air isn't worse, it's different. Depending on your priorities, it may even be better. That air block should absolutely be able to handle that processor.
DH-15 can handle the CPU, provided the fans are actually mounted the right way lol
Rich people like paying wild amounts of money for things. they should make an even more expensive PC as well for the filthy rich. As long as the budget builds are good quality, I don't care.
I have this case and it is a truly outstanding one for airflow and cooling, all temps below 60c, which brings home how truly abominably this pc was built to be hitting 100c on CPU!
What case is it?
@@thebiggestReeinthebusiness phanteks p500a
Would love a Starforged systems review. Great job as always Steve :)
Yea unlike LTT i bet GN would roast them,Linus is too scared to talk shit about stuff like starforge since its backed by creators but steve has no censor and its brutally honest
@@promc2890 well Linus didn’t do a bad job though he doesn’t need to flame them to fix issues
@@promc2890 Linus can be pretty straight forward. The Starforge PC was actually a competent build, unlike some other system integrators have shown in the past like this video
@@promc2890 linus did a perfect review, u dont need more than that to know that they are the same crap shiet that all the pc building companies.
@@promc2890 LTT is scared to talk shit about random twitter people? nonsense.
QC was always pretty stringent while I worked with skytech a couple years ago. Really enjoyable job, would do again. Something meditative about assembling computers all day. The glue was always a thing on the RGB headers though lolol. Justification was that the dumb thing would come out in shipping.
That RGB conn is a bad design, so I do understand.
I would have liked to see the temp with the fan installed correctly.
still dog, who the fk uses non water cooling cpu coolers???? esp for 5k computer?????????
It bothers me that these weren't posted. It was a small mistake. It happens. I DOUBT they build them all that way. This one has sensationalization written all over it.