Pronouncing pictures! - History of Writing Systems #4 (Rebus writing)
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- Опубликовано: 3 сен 2015
- Watch ancient Sumerians figure out how to use pictures to write sounds for the first time in history. See why the Egyptians disagree with their approach.
Meaning writing (logographs) let early writers get civilized and document their thoughts. But what if you don't have a symbol for a word in your language? Just use the sound-alike rebus principle to invent one!
Exit the cave of pictographs and journey to Sumer, Egypt and Tenochtitlán! Marvel as ancient cultures use logographs to start writing not just meaning words, but sound words. Watch as Sumerian writers press a stylus into wet clay to make wedge shapes - cuneiform!
Ponder the tension this brings up: is writing phonetic or is it semantic? What will future scribes do to balance this tension between meaning and sound? Next time, travel East to find out how one early calligrapher balances that tension.
The whole history of writing:
• Thoth's Pill: an Anima...
Who created this?
Art, animation and music by NativLang
CC-BY and public domain credits:
docs.google.com/document/d/1z...
This series seriously deserves waaaay more views. Really good work!
+Cozy Fallout Thank you!! I don't think I know how to get more views. But I think I'm learning to do better work.
+NativLang Keep the good work, we like what you're doing don't worry about the views. You never know when it'll suddenly increase. :))
Am I right in assuming the ankle/uncle example was an analogy? It would be very odd if the ancient language had words for ankle and uncle which sounded the same!
+Michael Turvey Wait... didn't you know that you actually speak Sumerian? ;)
It's an analogy, I think.
the narrator has the cutest rolled R I've ever heard
She could be a Portuguese language queen, because her R pronunciation is just the way we pronounce it in Brazilian Portuguese
Not only the narrator lady has a silk voice, but she pronounce the "r" in the Egyptian symbols the same way Czech language uses it, which is quite hard if you are not used to. I am impressed!
it's called a trill.
It's common in many languages not just czech
Ahhhh! The ever-dreaded cliff-hanger returns!
This really reminds me of onyomi and kunyomi in Japanese, which are also based on a borrowed writing system.
We use a lot of logography in medicine and in science.
GregTom2 How about TRUTH about the industry/biz then?
You guys have an amazing channel, I'm learning a lot. Shame my language isn't cool enough to be covered in your vidoes (Farsi)
Mehrdad Dastgir man ... make request dude! ;)
Mehrdad Dastgir
Say Persian! Farsi is the Endonym!!!
GREAT WORK.
Love it!! I hope you do not mind I shared on my FB and shout out to you! *all giddy fron ancient lingos*
This gets more interesting!!
The glyph for the city of Tenochtitlan was literal. It wasn't indirectly representing a sound, it was exactly what was meant. Tenchotitlan meant "Place of the Cactus Rock" because the city's mythology says it was founded at a place where an eagle ate a snake atop a cactus in the middle of a lake.
Gold! I'm rich!! This is amazing. Thank you.
I still write in english using rebus unintentionally. i just write down words that sound what i can remember and that means misspelling
I always die laughing with the... "MAJOR MOMENTS IN THE HISTORY OF WRITING!"
Anyone recommend courses on, Omotic, Egyptian languages for people who want to learn more on ancient languages...
The little diacritic mark below is a tense meaning for semantic purpose! 16 tenses 8 to each side 4 up 4 down up ongoing down means completed the diacritics for short and long syllables also are short/long up/down above/below to indicate the enunciation of the words to show what register and tone and melodic prosody one uses when pronouncing them!
There are different pronunciations for nouns and verbs! Inflecting each gives semantic meaning. in the ancient pictographs, logographs the cuneiforms and other writing in each box or segment of the box has semantic writing syntax and meaning so altering each portion of the box also modifies it like adjectives and adjuncts adverbs, and so there is basic letters and each is then modified for its segment to give added meaning so read it that way, the syllables for each phonetically are using diacritic marks for prosody.
me in awe
Don't call it a comeback, they've been here for years!
Slavezero9 The narrator meant that the Logographs are about to make a comeback after Rebus, not modern day!
Whoosh
Actually, the Mexican flag has way more meaning in it's shield, the legend says some people were travelling the area looking for a place to live when a voice told them to look for a lake, where an eagle will be eating a snake on top of a nopal, they found it and founded Tenochtitlan there, the Mexican flag tells that story, well that's at least how I remember the story. 🇲🇽
eye bee leaf ant flower can well bear chisel four lamb.
i don't get it.
I believe a flower can ... and then I am lost as well =(
eye bee leaf i think that is i bealive?
believe*
Eye bee leaf ant rose can well bear awl four ewe ? I believe aunt rose can well bear all for you?
I believe aunt Violet can well bear all for you.
(Eye bee leaf ant violet (flower) can well bear awl four ewe)
the rolled R sounded like perry the platipus. LOL
Aren't emojis pretty much logographs?
Unpopular Opinion ALL DAY
@Զ probably because there are not enough to write basic ideas.
So what you're saying is that puns are a fundamental part of our linguistic development and are therefor acceptable?
I believe...
antflower can wellbear needle four sheep?
Yes.
very nit picky and 2 years late but saguaro cacti don't grow in the part of Mexico near Mexico City (which is what Tenochtitlan became) and the picture shows a saguaro off to the right of Tenochtitlan. BTW nōchtli means the fruit of the paddle cactus in Nahuatl, it's not just cactus. It's pretty specific.
dun, dun, dun. . . im so excited. whats next?! ooh, ooh, lemme guess. . . umm, the Rorschach test is born.
Here is the link for my language on twitter twitter.com/waxezizo
Her Pr sounded cool :P
3:10 it's my boi Sargon
1:10
I believe aunt flower can well bear pin 4 lamb
Since written Cantonese isn't standardized , so we use rebus everyday, sometimes we do brought some jokes out.
Mirenuon fidhéo bawath aplabœter Ansestríœnlinnwhá! Respect from Halmé Dogyriænś
eye bee leaf ant flower can well bear pick four lamb?
I believe a flower can well be a pick for lamb...? :-/ I'm lost...
+Willem van de Beek Soooo close. Your first line is off by 3.
lamb -> sheep -> cheap; would be 1 that would make sense... still trying to figure out the other 2... must be the flower and pick... could also be the bear and ant, hmmmm....
You're right about the flower and pick. The final one is read directly, but not as 'lamb'.
maybe the last one is read goat? so the last 2 pictures would be "forgot"??
but that still doesn't make sense LOL
+Willem van de Beek - check this out . . .
I believe my Aunt Violet can well bear a prick, for sure.
I seriously don't know how to solve that puzzle though
3:30 *purrs*
eye bee leaf ant flower can weLL BEAR NEEDLE FOUR LAMB WHAT DOES IT MEAAAAAAN
不是很懂Rebus书写法...看完语言研究小红书上那本解释也是似懂非懂
rebus就是 假借字
cite your Derrida.
Logographs. Word.
I believe aunt virginia can well be a pick for mutton (virginia is the name of the flower)
It was confirmed by the channel (in the comments below) to be “I believe aunt rose can well bear all for you.”
(Eye bee leaf ant rose can bear awl four ewe)
Kind of old school sounding grammar though
I believe Aunt Rose can well bear all for you? i wouldn't have got that in a million years
I got everything except "Aunt Rose". I was stuck at "ant flower". [grin]
About to come back? Do you mean emojis?
BookFreakyTube ¥√
+Ryan Edwards >Doing it wrong
Rebuses (rebi?) in Polish are so lame I don't even know why they make them. I suppose in English you're supposed to guess words that sound similar and guess sentences? In Polish you have something like this: *Picture of the Sun* - ce = ? - Słońce - ce = słoń, elephant.
As helpful and informative this video is, I can not help but be distracted by how adorable that trilled "R" sounded.
What is in the child's game paper? "I believe ANT FLOWER? can POOL? BEAR STICK?/NAIL?/DART?/PIN? for SHEEP" ??
0:33
Extremely misleading statement with respect to kanji. It's not a symbol for every word, it's a symbol for every morpheme, which are compounded to form tons and tons of words.
I believe Aunt Lilly can well bare all for you. (eye bee leaf ant lily can well bear awl 4 ewe)
that's not a lilly though
It could be a violet:
I believe aunt Violet can well bare all for you (eye bee leaf ant violet can well bear awl four ewe).
Umm... Native Lang has... 666k subs
20 clones of Thamus have been disliking this series.
eye bee leaf ant flower can well bear scratch awl four sheep.
I believe ant flower can well bear scratched all four sheep. ?.?
10 sheep (ankle/uncle)
To me that problem is pretty obvious. Well if I'm thinking about the right thing at least.
if I were to type "I hate you". How would you read it?
But if I were to write "I hate you :p", or "I hate you xD", or "I hate you >:(", then you'd probably read it pretty much the way I intended.
趣
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Rebus' writing is the best writing.
Source: Me
Eye bee leaf ant rose can well bear awl four ewe......I believe Aunt Rose can well bear all for you.
👁 ❌ ☕️🎩 u r 3️⃣ing 2️⃣ 🗣 ☕️his
“I ??? that you are trying to say this.”
@@xxXthekevXxx I know that you are trying to say this
i believe aunt violet and Wilbur pick for sheep
i believe aunt violet and will are pricks for shame
maybe elephant
eye (my) bee.. maybe
idk
+ross boss The awl and the female of the species stump people. Plus, it's an old school rebus.
I liked your 'well bear' == 'Wilbur' tho!
-- SPOILER ALERT --
eye bee leaf ant rose can well bear awl four ewe
I just don't understand what "well bear" is supposed to mean, that part of the sentence doesn't make sense. "I believe my aunt violet can 'well bear' all for you." What does that mean? How do you "well bear" for someone?
Rrrr
so...the cactus thing... No
it is more... mythic
as to tenochtitlan's name: it isn't a rebus, the name IS city in of the prickly pear among the rocks
because of the mythic origin of the city...
so rebus doesn't apply
That etymology is definitely controversial - may or may not be correct. The glyphs are treated as phonetic by some academics and pictographic by others. It's interesting that the same two glyphs were used post-contact for remembering "pate nochte" (pater noster).
What I know about Tenochtitlán is the fact that "the place of the prickly pear among the rocks" is really "the place of the fruit filled with stones" for the prickly pear has a great amount of little seeds(are they seeds?) that were referred to as stones.
it seems that this system has multiple meanings.
Guillermo Garcia Viesca
It is different
It is not
te-nochti-tlan
it is
tenoch- titlan
tenoch = señor (in spanish) or mister (not any man, but the great one)
tlan is a locative
tenochtlitlan means City of the Great Signor
I have ||||🐑
WRONG! It is not a mistake, could people please stop thinking that grammar and syntax was not sophisticated back then. The pictographs have the same syntax and grammar systems that we have today. The ancient writing went left to right, the subject, the ankle, which is the ancient way of marking sin, the jews wore red around the ankles and wrists, to symbolize the one who would be crucified and pay the sin debt, the lamb and the 10 sheep go as tithe to the priest-the levite- as payment for the sin debt as sacrifice,the red ribbon tied around the temple turns white in the sun when the sin is taken away, so the sheep are not going to an uncle, unless the uncle is a levitical priest who is taking the sheep to the temple as payment for the family debt of sin at the 3 main festivals. Ankle and 10 sheep means offering, the left to right reading is the SUBJECT the ANKLE is NOT a mistake, it is the TOPICALIZATION, the thetan, the facts ,the element of the CAUSE of action, and the results causing all else that occurs in the sentence, so the 10 sheep are the cause of what transpired due to the ankle, the need to pay the sin debt! SO semantically READ IT as IN CONTEXT OF THE TIME ERA AND PEOPLES to INTERPRET MEANING! ;) The ankle is the focus and the point of the sentence, to pay ten sheep for the ankle, sin debt is like paying tithe, sin offering, so they recorded that they paid their tithe, to the priest, and that also infers they have 100 sheep as 10 tithe is their offering.
This particular female narrator is distracting and not that good to be honest
Chris_0803 I don’t think she appears in newer videos.