TDR (distance to fault) is really easy on the NanoVNA, just play with it using a piece of coax, you will figure it out in 5 minutes and get that plumbers silicone tape, it wont bite I promise ;) BTW it might be a good idea to put some corrugated hose in the ground and pull the coax trough it. Saves some trouble when you have to replace the coax.
Hi Cal, the best thing I find for outdoor coax cables and connectors is self- vulcanizing tape and the red boots that are used over fire alarm solid cable over the top of the tape, I have used this method for years and never had a problem, well done anyway.
What I like about your channel is that you show your whole process to solve the problem. Some channels bypass the entire finding the problem phase and go right to the fix.
Your turf is very healthy, eating cables like that! Speaking of eating... those sheep... "they taste bloomin' nice, as well".... I was just thinking the same thing! Great job with your process of working through one step at a time. Of course, I usually change five things at once, then when the problem is fixed I have no idea what actually fixed it, then I don't trust the five things I replaced!
For connections that are exposed or have an exposed connector like on this antenna, I use 3meters of flooded coax to keep water out of the main feedline. ex. LMR-400-DB
Hi Cal, Congrats to Loki for passing the exam. You can put a piece of heat shrink over the coax connector until you get some self amalgamating tape for a proper waterproofing job. 73 WJ3U
Hi Callum, I suggest you use self-vulcanizing tape on the pl , vy simple also to pull out when you must disconnect the cable. Vy water proof. Always a pleasure to watch your videos. 73, mauri
Went to the trouble testing and digging it all up and working out the fault and not spending another 10 minutes to do the job properly. You know that's not going anywhere now till it fails again hey.
You must have a few lengths of angle iron in the shop... Cut off a 30cm lengh and in the middle(ish) CAREFULLY cut an 18mm slot. That will make a perfectly acceptable spanner for the connectors, and it will clamp in the vice easily. Another option, I used to have a couple of home made spanners made from gauge plate one end was for N and the other for BNC I think they were "borrowed" and never came back. Not a big deal as they only take a few mins to make. I might even harden them this time 🙂
You think about it..SDR will kill all Ham audio companies that stay with traditional dedicated radios… What do mean? Well, since we already have SDR technology, we can make a computer board and include a linear amp separately, make an in-n-output for an antenna connection…. Eventually, PCs will be our new ham radios with unlimited capabilities with software updates. I’m sure manufacturers are working on this concept and getting patents on it, knowing this is the future. Add remote control that can interface with your iPhone shines the light on our future. Eventually, we will be able to adjust our antenna’s SWR via PC and deliver 100% efficacy as well. What are your thoughts?
Great video. LokI and Wendy and the 2 dogs are super ! Glaid you got it fixed for now. Yes the VNA can be used to find fault. Has a TDR feature that gives a distance to fault. Lots of tricks VNA does. Mike can help your threw that . will make a great video. Great Loki got his call ! The test is quite easy even hear in the US . Cheers from NY !
I’ve been subscribed to Calum for 2 years now I think, and I still can’t definitively explain what he means when he says, “In the main.” Haha can anybody tell me what this term of his means?! Lol love the content as always M0MCX! Godspeed and 73’s everybody
Is this the last time we see Vasso used as a sealant? he he.... Serious hat on now...... Grab (whatever brand you guys have over there) of sparky Insulation Tape with a little bit of stretch. Some of the cheaper ones don't like it. Here Nitto is the prefered tape. As you tape it pull just a bit to see the nurl come through.... IF this is truly temporary this will do for months. Almagamation tape is just the ultimate hands down for long term. Cheers from VK land buddy!
Found it to work for stress release. I roll the wire up a couple of times, before making the plugs. it works : speciel greese to avoid moist is a deal breaker to
Hello Callum I hope that all is well & good . When you replace the coaxial cable I was wondering if you would like to place the coaxial cable within a metallic tubing underground between the external enclosures & the antenna ? , you could use electrical metal conduit with threaded connectors , it would be an ideal opportunity & the cable would be screen protected against (EMF ) effect , the cable would also perform better in terms of even lower loss then the manufactures specifications rest assured . I can appreciate that it will be more expense , I completely understand , if it's any consolation you could pull up the tubing if you need to move , you'll just need to use galvanized tube , dielectric grease & self amalgamating tape on the threaded tube joints , think of the tubing as part of the cable , you can also mouse a replacement cable through the tubing if required , just keep a mouse line within the tubing . Metal tubing recommended size 30mm. The secret of the tubing is that the really expensive coaxial cable is not really required , hence the tube will contain any loss & screen any external effects , there's a lot of people that won't like that , especially the coaxial cable manufactures . Kind regards Julian.
I have been using N connectors for over 40 years. Thank God I can say I am glad I have never had this type of fault. I dare say that UHF (PL259) connectors are 'unusable for high frequencies'. 😞
For HF 0-50Mhz or so the type of connector does not really make any difference, the the length of the connector is so short compared to the wavelength that you will not see any matching issues. What does matter is the quality of the physical connection. The PL 259 only makes the earth connection on the serrated end of the socket, So that needs to be a clean connection. I would NEVER use Vaseline on that as that is an insulator and if that gets into the serrations it might degrade the earth connection a bit. Old 259's where you solder the braid to the plug are usually difficult to make well, but the compression style connections have made that situation a lot better. However they still need to be made up correctly. The powder is water ingress, and has probably wicked quite a distance down the coax and may have ruined it. When you get some time with the VNA do a cable loss measurement and see if that shows up anything, if you are lucky you might have got away with it and the cable will still be usable. For waterproofing Self amalgamating tape is really all you need. Put on a couple of layers and it will last decades.
Like K above I've always used N types where possible because they are so much better made. Do watch out if you use a valve high power linear > 1KW or thereabouts. N types are rated at up to 4KW, BUT their voltage breakdown is quite low some state 500V others 1000V. Valve output stages run at very high voltages. In this respect because the 259 has a greater centre to outer distance it can take a higher voltage. If you ever do run very high power you should be looking at different connectors anyway... Andy
too many pieces and too many pit falls with those connectors.....simple crimp PL-259 with the glue lined heat shrink and maybe the Vaseline (I like DC-4 myself) done with the right tools is a far better solution.....IMO anyway.......cheers from Boston......73 Mike, K1FNX
Hot tip cal, denso tape all your outdoor connectors it works a treat mate. basically, it's waxed cotton tape and reusable. I'm sure it Aussie made I do all my connectors and never have an issue with water ingress or corrosion
I don't know about Australian made, but it is the best thing to use in that situation. It is used extensively in the underground mining industry here in the Goldfields and is the only protection that works and withstands the extreme salty conditions.
@@ScatManAust G'day mate, the first time i used it was 30 years ago when i worked at Mack Trucks we used it on trucks used at salt mines, and yes mining we used it when i worked underground and nods fast gold fields excellent stuff
Actually dantheman, its Denzel or Densel tape. Don't know where and when Denso tape come about but I've known it and called it Denso tape too for nearly 50 years.
@@ScatManAust mate the brand name is "Denso" and the tape is called 'DENSYL, Denzel is a bush slang name, how i know i just looked at the name on the tape bag its in lol if you let the internet be your friend and searched Denso" its there
Maybe you already did this, but I'd swap the cable around. So the end that's been in the box is outside now, and the busted end is protected in the box.
I've been a subscriber for years. I'll bet that O-ring has been missing since first install. The effects of water in the coax can include all kinds of symptoms. Maybe someone should buy you an 18mm open end wrench (spanner).
Would a hood type cover fit over the connector attached to the pl ground plate keep the weather off it since since you you keep dismantling and reassembling it ?
Oh, and the other thing that irritates me about the M&P connectors is the flats for tightening are both the same size! It's okay for me, mechanic by trade so I have spanners coming out of my ears but why o why didn't they just make them different sizes so you only need one set of spanners!
Hi, I have a question about the signature 9 very impressed so far, the 30m element is not used, can I make it a dedicated 15m radial by cutting the wire, also on 15m the swr is over 4.1 and maybe 1 element for 40m and a separate element for 15m may help, what do you think,,think, kind regards Bernard, PA1-LEG.
Hi Callum could you do a video on how to put a pl259/so239 on Coax pls as when I did the training for my foundation license I didn’t do any practicals so I always end up pestering other Hams to do it for me, Tia M7EOM Matt
Cal, I really like those coax connectors you're using. I stopped by DXE on my way to Hamvention and they don't seem to carry anything like that here in the states. Is there a place I can order some from over across the pond?
Those are Messi and Paoloni connectors (you can hear him saying it at 17:23). The broken one is their newest version, called UHF Male PL259 EVO, and they make them for 7, 10, and 13 mm cables. They also have a different, thinner, version with the same name for 5 mm, 5.4 mm, and 6 mm cables too. The connector on the other side is also Messi and Paoloni, but it's the older discontinued version. On the new version, you get a ready-made pin that you solder the center conductor to (the 13 mm ones are also advertised as solderless), and with the older version, there was a more traditional cylinder in the center, and you had to solder the the center conductor to the cylinder, and then make sure that none of the solder leaks out to the outside of the cylinder. Gigaparts is the US distributor for M&P, but the coax connector prices there are twice what we have here in Europe (including our taxes!), so if you want to buy larger amount of connectors, it might be a good idea to compare prices of getting them locally or directly from the manufacturer.
Hi there… I agree with AndrejaKostic… the smaller M&P 5mm thereabouts are a right fiddle of a job I found but the pl connectors are superb engineering they are like jewellery. If you decide to buy them in Europe you could get your mates together and get a decent order between you especially if you’re in a club. The coax cables are equally impressive. There are several RUclips vids by Martin Lynch & Sons ( ML&S channel ) and their engineers do demos making up connectors as do Messi & Paoloni do themselves ( demos ) Recommend you have a good look at the video channels. 73. 💙 Best wishes. G0UVL
Lord Callum… I enjoyed watching your troubleshooting methods! Keep the content straight and no exaggerated clickbait! Your ethics are spot-on! 73 de KD6UYK (Tim).
Congrats to Loki for passing the test and getting his callsign!! Well done!! 👍
Yes, thank you!
TDR (distance to fault) is really easy on the NanoVNA, just play with it using a piece of coax, you will figure it out in 5 minutes and get that plumbers silicone tape, it wont bite I promise ;) BTW it might be a good idea to put some corrugated hose in the ground and pull the coax trough it. Saves some trouble when you have to replace the coax.
For the price of coax, One tends to want to repair rather than replace! Awesome Callum!
👍👍👍
Very true!
Great troubleshooting Callum! - You know where the solution lies. - Cheers!
Hi Cal, the best thing I find for outdoor coax cables and connectors is self- vulcanizing tape and the red boots that are used over fire alarm solid cable over the top of the tape, I have used this method for years and never had a problem, well done anyway.
What I like about your channel is that you show your whole process to solve the problem. Some channels bypass the entire finding the problem phase and go right to the fix.
It was never supossed to be a long video.. But the story unfolded and I filmed it :)
Your turf is very healthy, eating cables like that! Speaking of eating... those sheep... "they taste bloomin' nice, as well".... I was just thinking the same thing! Great job with your process of working through one step at a time. Of course, I usually change five things at once, then when the problem is fixed I have no idea what actually fixed it, then I don't trust the five things I replaced!
HAHA.. Yeah..!!
Been a subscriber from your old channel days, great work Cal.
Legend!
CALLUM: Let's fix this patch cable issue once and for all!
ALSO CALLUM: Why would the sheep be so yellow?
:D
For connections that are exposed or have an exposed connector like on this antenna, I use 3meters of flooded coax to keep water out of the main feedline. ex. LMR-400-DB
Toldja already, Callum... lots of dielectric grease. If there's is no space for water, it can't get in there. 😁
Hi Cal,
Congrats to Loki for passing the exam. You can put a piece of heat shrink over the coax connector until you get some self amalgamating tape for a proper waterproofing job. 73 WJ3U
Hi Callum, I suggest you use self-vulcanizing tape on the pl , vy simple also to pull out when you must disconnect the cable. Vy water proof.
Always a pleasure to watch your videos.
73, mauri
Oh you can’t beat a bit of white Rust. The VNA has a learning curve but what a superb tool once you get used to it.
Went to the trouble testing and digging it all up and working out the fault and not spending another 10 minutes to do the job properly.
You know that's not going anywhere now till it fails again hey.
You must have a few lengths of angle iron in the shop... Cut off a 30cm lengh and in the middle(ish) CAREFULLY cut an 18mm slot. That will make a perfectly acceptable spanner for the connectors, and it will clamp in the vice easily.
Another option, I used to have a couple of home made spanners made from gauge plate one end was for N and the other for BNC I think they were "borrowed" and never came back. Not a big deal as they only take a few mins to make. I might even harden them this time 🙂
Shorts are better to troubleshoot than Noisy going open! A TDR finds those well and the shorts. Good Work. THanks for the video.
Thanks for the tip!
Can’t a nanovna be used as a tdr? Use it to figure out which end is shorted out before disassembling anything.
Ah you said at the end of the vid about using vna.
You think about it..SDR will kill all Ham audio companies that stay with traditional dedicated radios… What do mean? Well, since we already have SDR technology, we can make a computer board and include a linear amp separately, make an in-n-output for an antenna connection…. Eventually, PCs will be our new ham radios with unlimited capabilities with software updates. I’m sure manufacturers are working on this concept and getting patents on it, knowing this is the future. Add remote control that can interface with your iPhone shines the light on our future. Eventually, we will be able to adjust our antenna’s SWR via PC and deliver 100% efficacy as well. What are your thoughts?
Great video. LokI and Wendy and the 2 dogs are super ! Glaid you got it fixed for now. Yes the VNA can be used to find fault. Has a TDR feature that gives a distance to fault. Lots of tricks VNA does. Mike can help your threw that . will make a great video. Great Loki got his call ! The test is quite easy even hear in the US . Cheers from NY !
Yes! Thank you!
I’ve been subscribed to Calum for 2 years now I think, and I still can’t definitively explain what he means when he says, “In the main.” Haha can anybody tell me what this term of his means?! Lol love the content as always M0MCX! Godspeed and 73’s everybody
Is this the last time we see Vasso used as a sealant? he he....
Serious hat on now...... Grab (whatever brand you guys have over there) of sparky Insulation Tape with a little bit of stretch. Some of the cheaper ones don't like it. Here Nitto is the prefered tape. As you tape it pull just a bit to see the nurl come through.... IF this is truly temporary this will do for months. Almagamation tape is just the ultimate hands down for long term.
Cheers from VK land buddy!
Maybe a little bit of Denso tape on the exposed end would totally keep the weather out. 73’s John GM0MST
Found it to work for stress release. I roll the wire up a couple of times, before making the plugs. it works : speciel greese to avoid moist is a deal breaker to
Hello Callum
I hope that all is well & good .
When you replace the coaxial cable I was wondering if you would like to place the coaxial cable within a metallic tubing underground between the external enclosures & the antenna ? , you could use electrical metal conduit with threaded connectors , it would be an ideal opportunity & the cable would be screen protected against (EMF ) effect , the cable would also perform better in terms of even lower loss then the manufactures specifications rest assured .
I can appreciate that it will be more expense , I completely understand , if it's any consolation you could pull up the tubing if you need to move , you'll just need to use galvanized tube , dielectric grease & self amalgamating tape on the threaded tube joints , think of the tubing as part of the cable , you can also mouse a replacement cable through the tubing if required , just keep a mouse line within the tubing .
Metal tubing recommended size 30mm.
The secret of the tubing is that the really expensive coaxial cable is not really required , hence the tube will contain any loss & screen any external effects , there's a lot of people that won't like that , especially the coaxial cable manufactures .
Kind regards
Julian.
An idea.. BUT it's hassle and nothing is ever permanent in my world.
There was something insanely pleasing when you were pulling up that coax.
HAHA
Good video 👍very honest 👌I always blame my self 🤣just past my foundation license 🎉 cheers from down under 🇦🇺
Thanks for watching!
I have been using N connectors for over 40 years. Thank God I can say I am glad I have never had this type of fault. I dare say that UHF (PL259) connectors are 'unusable for high frequencies'. 😞
You would be surprised. Have you physically done any loss tests yourself? No need to comment! LOL
For HF 0-50Mhz or so the type of connector does not really make any difference, the the length of the connector is so short compared to the wavelength that you will not see any matching issues.
What does matter is the quality of the physical connection. The PL 259 only makes the earth connection on the serrated end of the socket, So that needs to be a clean connection. I would NEVER use Vaseline on that as that is an insulator and if that gets into the serrations it might degrade the earth connection a bit.
Old 259's where you solder the braid to the plug are usually difficult to make well, but the compression style connections have made that situation a lot better. However they still need to be made up correctly.
The powder is water ingress, and has probably wicked quite a distance down the coax and may have ruined it. When you get some time with the VNA do a cable loss measurement and see if that shows up anything, if you are lucky you might have got away with it and the cable will still be usable.
For waterproofing Self amalgamating tape is really all you need. Put on a couple of layers and it will last decades.
Like K above I've always used N types where possible because they are so much better made. Do watch out if you use a valve high power linear > 1KW or thereabouts. N types are rated at up to 4KW, BUT their voltage breakdown is quite low some state 500V others 1000V. Valve output stages run at very high voltages. In this respect because the 259 has a greater centre to outer distance it can take a higher voltage. If you ever do run very high power you should be looking at different connectors anyway...
Andy
@@andye2005 If I have 1 kW or a little bit more of power available, I use the 7/16 standard.
@@DXCommanderHQIt's not the loss that matters - it's the watertightness and security of the connection over the long term.
Swap the coax around, put the bad end into the cabinet, and the good end out at the antenna,
Put some self amalgamating tape around the outside connector with the rain
It helps with it a lot tbh
lol I just noticed you mentioned it at 19:15 haha
I just wouldnt use those connectors. Too much to fiddle with. Good you found it though
I think the problem here is a high SWR (Sheep Watching Ratio). Excellent troubleshooting example :) Thanks and thumbs up to the channel. Ed KO6BLM
Sheep Watching Ratio.. Oh yes!
I have multimeter envy 😂
I have a spare Stu.. I can send you.
Good Job Cal. Happy Weekend 💯👍🙋♂
@ 12.20, i bought a cheap adjustable spanner and ground the jaws slim.
Now found a set on Amazon. £8.
too many pieces and too many pit falls with those connectors.....simple crimp PL-259 with the glue lined heat shrink and maybe the Vaseline (I like DC-4 myself) done with the right tools is a far better solution.....IMO anyway.......cheers from Boston......73 Mike, K1FNX
I have stopped using the M&P. I'm very impressed with the SSB Electronics PL259 version for Ecoflex 15, easier to fit and excellent quality.
Yes, SSB also excellent.
NanoVNA Saver software has the TDR function in it, Callum.
Tnx!
Hot tip cal, denso tape all your outdoor connectors it works a treat mate.
basically, it's waxed cotton tape and reusable.
I'm sure it Aussie made
I do all my connectors and never have an issue with water ingress or corrosion
I don't know about Australian made, but it is the best thing to use in that situation.
It is used extensively in the underground mining industry here in the Goldfields and is the only protection that works and withstands the extreme salty conditions.
@@ScatManAust G'day mate, the first time i used it was 30 years ago when i worked at Mack Trucks we used it on trucks used at salt mines, and yes mining we used it when i worked underground and nods fast gold fields excellent stuff
Actually dantheman, its Denzel or Densel tape.
Don't know where and when Denso tape come about but I've known it and called it Denso tape too for nearly 50 years.
@@ScatManAust mate the brand name is "Denso" and the tape is called 'DENSYL, Denzel is a bush slang name, how i know i just looked at the name on the tape bag its in lol if you let the internet be your friend and searched Denso" its there
Silicone tape, try it.
Maybe you already did this, but I'd swap the cable around. So the end that's been in the box is outside now, and the busted end is protected in the box.
Or replace it!
And That's why I prefer Old School solder on PL's.
73 mike 🍺🍻
Check your galvanic corrosion chart for copper vs stainless steel , maybe pack the connector with petroleum jelly to keep water out.
Congrats to Loki, from a fellow M7. 🙂
Hey, thanks!
Moral o fthe story CAl is "use the side cutters first time ....."
All I am thinking now is of a nice mutton chop!
Oh yes!
4k commander!
I've been a subscriber for years.
I'll bet that O-ring has been missing since first install. The effects of water in the coax can include all kinds of symptoms.
Maybe someone should buy you an 18mm open end wrench (spanner).
Actually, I think it's possibly over-tightened at the beginning of this saga else water should not have got in. The threads were always greased up.
OK you got a shorted end. But those sheep are yellow. lol amps always find the gremlins within our world of wire for sure.
HAHA
Would a hood type cover fit over the connector attached to the pl ground plate keep the weather off it since since you you keep dismantling and reassembling it ?
Use some silicone grease on the O-ring, makes assembly easier, had the same problems with the M&P connectors, just tend to use M0MAT stuff instead.
Mat's gear is always fine.
Oh, and the other thing that irritates me about the M&P connectors is the flats for tightening are both the same size! It's okay for me, mechanic by trade so I have spanners coming out of my ears but why o why didn't they just make them different sizes so you only need one set of spanners!
Temporary fixes never end up being temporary. 😁
Oh yes!!
Silicone works too.
I have used a vna to tell me how far the short was along in the coax
I can't wait to work this out myself!
I would have a duct for the cable vs it being covered
Good for you :)
Did you build that Nixie tube clock?
How much RF do you need to be able to turn a sheep yellow??? Does the takeoff angle matter, I don't want mine going pink instead....
Up to 2kW, they stay yellow.. Then move to pink!
Hi, I have a question about the signature 9 very impressed so far, the 30m element is not used, can I make it a dedicated 15m radial by cutting the wire, also on 15m the swr is over 4.1 and maybe 1 element for 40m and a separate element for 15m may help, what do you think,,think, kind regards Bernard, PA1-LEG.
Yes you can - save mucking with the adjustment coil..
@@DXCommanderHQ I will try it out, 73s 🙏
the old amphenol much better😂
Hi Callum could you do a video on how to put a pl259/so239 on Coax pls as when I did the training for my foundation license I didn’t do any practicals so I always end up pestering other Hams to do it for me,
Tia
M7EOM Matt
Check our Messi & Paoloni's videos.
Bodge commander LOL.
Funny.. when it's mine, I chuck it together..!
Having one coax going too a few resonant ants, it's been under cover for 10 yrs now. How the grass takes over, great for radials eh.
What size mast are you planning to put up in the field?
12m.
which connectors are these?
Cal, I really like those coax connectors you're using. I stopped by DXE on my way to Hamvention and they don't seem to carry anything like that here in the states. Is there a place I can order some from over across the pond?
Those are Messi and Paoloni connectors (you can hear him saying it at 17:23). The broken one is their newest version, called UHF Male PL259 EVO, and they make them for 7, 10, and 13 mm cables. They also have a different, thinner, version with the same name for 5 mm, 5.4 mm, and 6 mm cables too.
The connector on the other side is also Messi and Paoloni, but it's the older discontinued version. On the new version, you get a ready-made pin that you solder the center conductor to (the 13 mm ones are also advertised as solderless), and with the older version, there was a more traditional cylinder in the center, and you had to solder the the center conductor to the cylinder, and then make sure that none of the solder leaks out to the outside of the cylinder.
Gigaparts is the US distributor for M&P, but the coax connector prices there are twice what we have here in Europe (including our taxes!), so if you want to buy larger amount of connectors, it might be a good idea to compare prices of getting them locally or directly from the manufacturer.
Just search for clamp UHF connector.
Hi there… I agree with AndrejaKostic… the smaller M&P 5mm thereabouts are a right fiddle of a job I found but the pl connectors are superb engineering they are like jewellery. If you decide to buy them in Europe you could get your mates together and get a decent order between you especially if you’re in a club. The coax cables are equally impressive. There are several RUclips vids by Martin Lynch & Sons ( ML&S channel ) and their engineers do demos making up connectors as do Messi & Paoloni do themselves ( demos )
Recommend you have a good look at the video channels.
73. 💙 Best wishes. G0UVL
Roger.. Check Messi and Paoloni.
18mm or 11/16 inch?
Where's the Vaseline when you need it ?
( You normally have a tub on top of the cabinet ! )
I found it yesterday.. INSIDE!
50k by Xmas😁
HAHA.. I don't think so :)
Lord Callum… I enjoyed watching your troubleshooting methods! Keep the content straight and no exaggerated clickbait! Your ethics are spot-on! 73 de KD6UYK (Tim).
Hey thanks!