TheGameCreators vs The Fans | DarkBASIC, FPS Creator, GameGuru and the future of GameGuru MAX

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  • Опубликовано: 24 дек 2024

Комментарии • 158

  • @Anonymous-cn6zl
    @Anonymous-cn6zl 4 месяца назад +5

    I'll never forget the FPS creator. Made my little brother cry because I put a floating skull in a room and it chased him as he opened the door. Good old times.

  • @Leadwerks
    @Leadwerks Год назад +26

    As an engine developer, I can say that customers request features with no regard to the amount of work each entails, and no overall picture of how all the parts work together. Once you get into the situation where you are simply trying to fulfill random feature requests, it's usually a bad situation, even if you are successfully checking items off the list. You need to start with the total scope of what the software should be capable of, design a foundation that takes all that functionality into consideration, and then fill in the details over several releases, prioritizing the most critical functionality first. There has to be a grand unifying vision. I think Apple products are a good comparison. Whether you like them or not, you must admit their products have a cohesive vision other companies lack.

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +6

      Totally agree! Now, in your opinion, has TGC done this with their software? Because changing the entire scope of your game engine from "make outdoor shooters" to "make any type of game" smacks of a lack of vision and direction on their part, and resulted in many unfinished, underdeveloped features. Even MAX had to be completely rescoped after the original vision was deemed too underwhelming.

    • @Mentally_Ill_Simp
      @Mentally_Ill_Simp Год назад

      I don't think implementing DoF is asking too much.

    • @StevenJShow
      @StevenJShow 9 месяцев назад

      @@Mentally_Ill_Simp That depends on a lot of things.
      You might think "Oh that's not a big deal."
      Then you dig into how the engine was programmed.

    • @fearlesswee5036
      @fearlesswee5036 6 месяцев назад +1

      ​@@StevenJShow I haven't looked at GameGuru's source code myself, but a member of the GG community who programs air traffic control software for a living has, and he described it with some...colorful words. It would explain why GameGuru is so buggy, and why so many seemingly simple features take years to implement; it's built on decades of legacy code which was never in the best state to begin with, and hasn't been majorly refactored. (We have some of the same bugs from FPSC, kinda like how Bethesda's creation engine has ancient roots, and thus Starfield has bugs dating back to Morrowind!)
      It may have been wiser for GGM to start fresh, or perhaps be built upon Godot like how "RPG In A Box" was. But, as they say hindsight is 20/20, so we can only wish Lee/TGC the best and hope MAX can do well. Lee seems to be a genuinely good guy with his heart in the right place, but he may not have the *best* business sense.

    • @Trinitron404
      @Trinitron404 Месяц назад

      Hi Leadwerks, I remember first discovering your engine through TGC's site. Good to see you here!
      Lot of channels in this comments section I used to watch when I was growing up interested in making games. Though I'm working on my solo project in Godot, I like to come back and watch old TGC videos. I can't find the About TGC video that was on their front page in 2010-2011 and the wayback link does not work, the video no longer exists.
      I've found old Leadwerks videos, the FPSC X10 trailer, a lot of classics. Can't find a single video of X-Quad Engine even being used, or any of the Alienware competition games. Those were really fun, especially the one in a living room where you fly toy saucers around in dogfights.
      TGC should have a video archive, golden era of aspiring, up-and-coming developers.

  • @Leadwerks
    @Leadwerks Год назад +12

    DarkBASIC was my first programming language. Thanks Lee!

  • @bond1_mjblosser
    @bond1_mjblosser Год назад +47

    I learned some things I didn't know before about TGC and their history, and it was a great trip down memory lane. A well balanced and fair documentary. Never a boring minute - I'll be watching this again!

  • @pixel7071
    @pixel7071 11 месяцев назад +12

    this quality is something I'd expect from a 7.3M views video, not 7.3K

  • @GatorMilk
    @GatorMilk 9 месяцев назад +6

    Brigand Oaxaca gang, rise UP!

  • @agentomat
    @agentomat 2 месяца назад +2

    Very nice documentary! I'm glad to hear to be not the only one who has problems to start with such game makers.
    I was a professional C# programmer, but I started programming with C64, QBasic, Turbo Pascal and there were only a few options to make performant graphics as a person who didn't understand C++ and DirectX in windows: Darkbasic, BlitzBasic and Purebasic. I bought PureBasic, because there was a live time update licence, multiplattform, not too much focus on games.
    I don't need 3D, because I love arcade and puzzle games. Now everyone uses Unity or Godot. I bought AGK, because it was cheap and I love the snake example and liked the possibility to export to Android. Now the support for AGK ended and it feels a bit I am forced to learn these 3D editors.
    Offtopic: I never understood, why the naming of these tools are always confusing: BlitzBasic had different versions, AGK has Classic and Studio and in Classic the manual differentiates between Tier 1 and 2(?). And which can export to Android? Why are the games from the Classic Game Pack not in Studio included? It is confusing...

  • @DK_Productions_Dev
    @DK_Productions_Dev Год назад +37

    That was so fantastic to watch, the time went by very fast and almost made me want that 3 hour version of the documentary 🤣But seriously, this is so well put together and I am happy that I got to be a part of it. The Editing and pacing is spot on. Thanks very much for this masterpiece of a documentary! Very well researched as well!

    • @VNVisuals
      @VNVisuals Год назад +4

      as an AGK user, your comments said it all for the lot of us, felix: 1:16:23 . well said. yet, and still, here we are :)

    • @bobhumid
      @bobhumid Год назад +3

      Actually, I think ... Lee should license this documentary and fire it up each time an unexpected bug closes down a game-making-session! :D OR EVEN BETTER: If the "unchanged" asset-threshold is higher than 75% the game should start the video in full screen, but only in the baked game... Hehehehe...

    • @DK_Productions_Dev
      @DK_Productions_Dev Год назад

      @@VNVisuals 😁

  • @blxxdbvrn
    @blxxdbvrn Год назад +4

    One thing I’d love to give Lee Bamber credit is how he tries his absolute best to make his tools accessible to novice game creators who don’t have much experience in coding.

  • @CuriousJourn
    @CuriousJourn Год назад +6

    Lee is a geniunely good guy, absolutely has his heart in the right place and does everything he can.

  • @ddabrahim
    @ddabrahim Год назад +8

    Let me say it was an extremely good documentary. Lot of nostalgia and lot of respect for Lee and the team creating these tools. I started with DarkBasic Pro but at the time coding was way too difficult for me but I was able to sort of copy and paste code, play around. FPS Creator was the big break through for me. Lots of nice memories and probably the only reason I was able to get in to game development. However, to cut long story short, I think TGC made a huge mistake with Max targeting AAA game making and VR. It is going to take me years to get a PC capable to run Max, so for me this is the end of the road. I wish Lee did listen to me all those years ago when all I was asking for is something like Cube2. Even today at this very moment, I would be more than happy with the graphics of Cube2. 1000FPS with a GTX750, cross-platform support. It would have been so amazing. Old maybe even ugly but let's call it Retro and people would produce finished games more likely that runs everywhere even on a toaster.

    • @GameBoyyearsago
      @GameBoyyearsago Год назад +2

      I really hope lee will make this as a optional plugin so you can use and run it as butter as smoothly 😊😊😊😊

    • @OverwatchUnit
      @OverwatchUnit Год назад

      By Cube2, are you referring to Cube Engine?

    • @ddabrahim
      @ddabrahim Год назад

      @@OverwatchUnit Yes but I was talking about specifically Cube2:Sauerbraten the game, it does include an editor so you can create levels, mods. I think it has more features and better textures packed in the editor than Cube.

    • @OverwatchUnit
      @OverwatchUnit Год назад

      @@ddabrahim Interesting. Care to share some of your creations? Would love to give it a try.

  • @cashcurtis
    @cashcurtis 9 месяцев назад +2

    The community was always my favorite part of TGC, such a talented group of people always willing to help.

  • @vrgamestudio294
    @vrgamestudio294 Год назад +4

    Only 10 minutes in but this is brilliant, so very well done and huge congratulations to you!
    I clicked the link in the newsletter as I didn't know this existed.
    I also had no idea Lee did everything to start with in 1999, selling 2 copies a week and that wasn't long before I started using it. I recall that "Victory Road" took 3 years to make, released July 4th 2003 and what a journey it was. Great times and fond memories. I used to love visiting the dark basic forums, it was like a second home with a great bunch.

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +1

      Thanks for watching and for your kind words! I agree, the community surrounding TGC products was always very supportive and knowledgeable.

  • @georgepatterson3571
    @georgepatterson3571 Год назад +6

    Very much a blast from the past -D13

  • @travisgatlin536
    @travisgatlin536 Год назад +2

    I was in this community back in 2009-2010, so crazy seeing people I talked to on the forums back then again. Blast of nostalgia.

  • @DarkDFlame
    @DarkDFlame 4 месяца назад +1

    I was one of the artists featured in the game creator store. My username is in the list 31:43 . Unfortunately I never got paid my share. Anyways. Thank you for the nostalgic video!

  • @arhgames
    @arhgames Год назад +1

    Very well made documentary!
    A definite trip through memory lane.
    It was quite a surprise and an honor to see Acrogorpon on there. ( 17:05 )
    Thank you!

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад

      Thanks for watching! It's wonderful seeing the variety of projects people made in the old TGC products :)

  • @hullmining6903
    @hullmining6903 Год назад +6

    So much memories, i started in the early 2000s as a kid fiddling with DarkBasic, BlitzBasic, and that wierd german game engine called Acknex(3D Game Studio).
    Currently in AAA

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +1

      Great to hear you've graduated from little indie engines like DarkBasic to the AAA scene - congratulations!

  • @SAYHI2JAMMY
    @SAYHI2JAMMY Год назад +2

    i really really loved this documentary.
    As someone who just got into fpsc recently, it's been a fun experience digging through forums, videos and old websites to learn about the engine's history. This video taught me a lot of stuff i didn't know, what a great watch.
    good job ♥

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +1

      Glad you enjoyed it, thanks for watching ☺️

    • @SAYHI2JAMMY
      @SAYHI2JAMMY Год назад

      @@TannerProductions thank you for creating!

  • @Ched80
    @Ched80 Год назад +4

    FPSC was the tool that threw me back in to game development. Tool was fun to use and the community and the competitions were fantastic. I move to AGK and still use Studio for various tools and small games.

  • @SwegySonic
    @SwegySonic Год назад +7

    One of the best documentaries I've every saw!

  • @MattPilz
    @MattPilz Год назад +1

    I am late to discover this and am only starting to watch it, but wanted to say amazing job! TGC holds a special place in my heart as the first 3D-capable development platform I ever used. This was back with DB 1.x in the 1990s and my Voodoo 3 video card. I still remember the included demos blowing my mind, as a seemingly impossible leap forward from QBASIC. I used it and its successor AGK over many years for different prototypes and games, won grand prizes with some of the apps I made, and essentially just had all around fun working with these programs. And still pick them back up from time-to-time for quick prototyping. Met Lee at an Intel event some years back, a genius and remarkable person! Glad you captured these stories in such a polished video. Thank you!

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад

      Thanks for watching! Hope you enjoy watching it. I'll admit my film focuses more on their products for non-coders, but they do seem to have a much better track record at tools for coders like DB and AGK.

  • @truckerjohn1957
    @truckerjohn1957 Год назад +5

    Thank you Scott.
    I am just a retired truck driver, using FPSC and having a blast at it. I am what You would call a recreational game maker. Unity would be too hard for me. FPSC is just right.
    I am sure there are lots of us tinkerers out there. I have used Game Guru made a zombie game with it, and was quite happy with the results. I can relate to Lee Bamber, he is a down to earth guy, not the stuffy exec. Type.
    To me it's more about having fun, and doing something interesting, than having to have the best graphics.

  • @mykeprice404
    @mykeprice404 Год назад +6

    What a great production. I remember a lot of this in my 13 years with this community. A very fair and well thought out production. The concept around the software has kept me interested, Let my art side take precedence over what I can do, instead of having to do lots of learning to code.
    Thank you for making this.

  • @Anonymous-cn6zl
    @Anonymous-cn6zl 4 месяца назад +3

    This is such a well-made and unbiased documentary. Probably the first one again that I watched from start to finish. 👏👏👏

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  4 месяца назад +1

      @@Anonymous-cn6zl thanks for watching, glad you enjoyed it!

  • @PeterMcArrow
    @PeterMcArrow Год назад +7

    Thanks for the movie, man! Its great that someone created such retrospect example of TGC community.

  • @Kitakazi
    @Kitakazi Год назад +6

    Awesome video. I found a hardcopy of FPSC when I was like 14 in a Best Buy. I wasn't very active in the community back then as I didn't feel I had anything to add to discussions because I had no idea what I was doing. But I was always lurking the forums. Well I still don't really know what I'm doing. Cheers.

  • @onlywithbuts1781
    @onlywithbuts1781 Год назад +6

    Wonderful work on this documentary.
    Yea judging from the fact GG Max made me interested in delving deeper once again i do have hopes for it, it became much more easier and fluid software to work with compared to Classic and seeing it grow, slowly getting to a point of release is quite something. Not to mention that it is by far the one tool anyone can use to instantly jump in and brainstorm ideas in, without the worry of coding, without the worry of necessarily spending years on learning ins and outs.
    A lot of people rightfully want an easy way to be allowed to be artistic if they have it in them. Problem with the big market engines is exactly that - You need all the skills or otherwise have the people to do it for you in order to do that one thing you are good at.
    But a lot of artists naturally do not need coding to bring their art to the light, whether it is through environmental design, lighting, sound, music, animation, you name it. They all can use so many other options and this one is just one of them, so yea i am curious where the guys will take it and if it will be success in the end.
    So far it certainly makes people talk about it.
    Also, i find it funny how tons of people can easily bash it not realizing that the same garbage with asset flips and cheap shots at cash grab happen even on Unreal or Unity. I have seen someone literally take a template provided for free by Epic that was being sold as a game... so before these people go on about how it is only GG that has that stigma, i suggest checking the other sources too x D
    Again, fantastic job and thanks for making it. Take care!

    • @truckerjohn1957
      @truckerjohn1957 Год назад +1

      Well said. TGC are genuinely good folks, and don't deserve the bad rap so many give them.

    • @Zodiacman16
      @Zodiacman16 Год назад +1

      I think Unity and Unreal are well received because there are tons of exceptional games made with them, alongside all the bad ones. According to this documentary, it seems GameGuru had far more bad games than there were exceptional ones. I hope MAX provides the tools people need to make more exceptional titles.

    • @fearlesswee5036
      @fearlesswee5036 6 месяцев назад

      @@Zodiacman16 Well said. A lot of people will seemingly miss this when discussing TGC products; yes every engine has asset flips, but it would seem only GGC/GGM have *nothing but* asset flips. Unreal has incredible high-grade AAA games, many great indie projects, and some junk. Unity has incredible high-grade AAA games, countless indie projects, and a good amount of junk. Even other "no coding game maker" type software, like RPGMaker, have plenty of amazing high-profile indie projects made with them, alongside the typical "asset flip" type junk that's literally a-dime-a-dozen on itchio and Steam and stuff.
      GameGuru has maybe one or two okay-at-best indie projects, and a swath of junk. One of the most promising GGC games, called "Space Losers", was cancelled because the developer found GameGuru's bugs and limitations too restrictive and cumbersome. And I think that's the issue, GameGuru is really easy to piece together a basic barebones "game" with, but the moment you try to do anything serious it falls apart from bugs and hardcoded limitations, poor performance, missing features, etc.
      I'm no "hater" or whatever, I have hundreds of hours logged in both GGC and GGM, and I even pre-ordered GGM. I want TGC to succeed, but I'm just being realistic here. Maybe I'm just a bit jaded atm lol

  • @jcenawl
    @jcenawl Год назад +1

    No mention of the lovely RPG World (MyWorld). This product had amazing potential, but was left in oblivion... Great documentary by the way!

  • @LorettaM
    @LorettaM Год назад +9

    Loved it! It's great to see how it all started. I've been a TGC fan since 2015... thanks!

  • @emcave
    @emcave Год назад +6

    Uh that brings back memories. I created the first ever mod for the old FPS creator which actually didn't have a name but was often referred to as Empty's Mod. It introduced allies, variables and other script engine stuff. Many others improved on it very soon after, but still :).
    For the open source release they put the entire dbpro code into one huge file which was quite a bit cumbersome to work with :D
    It's a nice documentary. I had a look at Max the other day and I kind of liked it. The wicked engine looks cool and the editor seems very intuitive. I like the RPG features as that's my favourite game genre, so I'm looking forward to what Max future will bring. And apparently it's time to upgrade my computer 😂

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +1

      I remember seeing Empty's mod back in the day! Thanks for watching ☺️

  • @Mriganka2S
    @Mriganka2S Год назад +6

    Amazing work on the video! I watched it at work with the rest of the people here 😂
    Since you've done the history of TGC, I would suggest making one that involves entirely the veterans of the community. I think we would all appreciate words from various people and how they felt being part of the community!

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +4

      Great idea! I'm also interested in finding out what people have gone on to do AFTER using TGC products. I'd love to chat to some of the old veterans who are now making stuff in other engines, or professionally within the industry.

  • @thelukeaaron
    @thelukeaaron Год назад +2

    Brilliant video! DBC was my intro to programming and I've been coding professionally for the last 15 years now. The TGC community was (I'm not really active anymore) amazing to be a part of. Just checked, I joined it in 2004! I still speak to friends I made from then every few days.
    "Maybe The Real Treasure Was the Friends We Made Along the Way" 😁
    -- edit:
    I'm still sore that my 20 line challenge that I spent weeks working on only had like 3 comments!

  • @PlayBASIC-Developer
    @PlayBASIC-Developer Год назад +5

    Excellent production ! It's pretty amazing looking back on what TGC have created over the past 25 years ! So we'll always have a soft spot for them from those good old DarkBASIC and DarkBASIC PRO days!
    Lee's "good enough" line become obvious to me during the pre-DB pro beta testing phases that morphed into the paid DB developer network which allowed early access to DBpro.. The idea was good, allow early access more interactions with the closed community, but it just broke down. In retrospect; they probably should have just tackled either the language or the engine and not both at once. But everything is easy with hindsight !
    While I've little experience with FPSC / GameGuru the tone of the documentary feels about on par with the community sentiments. The critic is obviously coming a place of passion, largely from users wanting to realize their visions better. Which is frustrating for everybody; but the better user(s) can articulate their ideas / solutions to developers is generally how things improve.

  • @Duchenkuke_DV
    @Duchenkuke_DV Год назад +8

    You created a timeless masterpiece. Just rewatched it, amazing work Scott

  • @gunman1299
    @gunman1299 Год назад +5

    A fantastic documentary! Although, while I know this documentary (and by extension your channel) is more towards documenting TGC's non-coder oriented game engines, I would've really liked to see a more in-depth history on TGC's coder oriented game engines. DarkBASIC Professional and AppGameKit Studio are (in my opinion) some of the best software the company has produced, with the engines being more powerful and more flexible (hell, if you had the expertise, you can still make a pretty good looking game with DB, and a gorgeous looking game AGK). With DarkBASIC having an especially long history that I would have like to have seen documented in the way you just did FPCC and Gameguru.

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +2

      Yes I would have liked that too but sadly I'm less familiar with that software and that area of the community so I didn't feel I could talk about DarkBASIC or AGK with any authority. And the documentary was already getting pretty long! I will say, I agree with you that TGC's engines for coders seem to hit the mark more frequently than their engines for non-coders. Sometimes I wonder if they should just stick to tools for coders.

  • @Peace_studio
    @Peace_studio Год назад +2

    Nostalgic video. Good work, also I was glad to see here all those who helped people on the forum. I remember all your nicknames, now I know what you look like)

  • @pdkmusic
    @pdkmusic Год назад +1

    Amazing documentary! Brings back so much memories. Dark Basic and Fps Creator! They are the reason I decided to work on video games professionally.

  • @JohnnyDangerIGD
    @JohnnyDangerIGD Год назад +5

    That was an awesome watch! I've owned Max for months now and have yet to give it a serious try. Your doc certainly gave me the motivation to do so! Good luck with your next project!

  • @OverwatchUnit
    @OverwatchUnit Год назад +3

    Thank you for making this video. I can see that it is a product of passion.

  • @refure
    @refure Год назад +5

    Fantastic documentary, amazing camera & editing work!

  • @AngelloProduct
    @AngelloProduct Год назад +2

    so that' s where the freeware/abandonedware games come from. I recognized some game in there.

  • @kunglao4800
    @kunglao4800 Год назад +2

    Wow, just found this now. GREAT documentary, thank you!

  • @yourcommander3412
    @yourcommander3412 Месяц назад +1

    Great, really enjoyed this.

  • @rvanner
    @rvanner Год назад +5

    Great video Scott, you've done an amazing job! We have certainly walked a winding path these past 23 years. Hindsight is a terrible thing! :-) As a small company with no external funding I think we have done the best we could. We have taken on some crazy sized projects that even large companies would have trouble finishing. We can only move forward and learn from the past. MAX has taken a lot longer than any of us expected but we're always in it for the long term and we keep on moving forward. It's so nice to see some of the community in the video and to hear about their experiences.

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +2

      Thanks for your comments, Rick! My intention was always to give a balanced portrayal and whilst TGC has met some - rightly deserved - criticism over the years, you guys also need to be praised for helping so many developers take their first steps.
      I do wonder if maybe TGC keeps biting off more than they can chew with their products, wouldn't it be better to focus on being really good at one or two things rather than substandard at many? Also, I'd love to see TGC try to create a game using their engines, and not just a series of one level demos but an actual game with multiple levels and a storyline. I get from a financial perspective it might seem like a waste of resources, but I genuinely think it would help you guys understand the flaws in your software better. Either that or partner with a developer to create a game as a co-production. You might think this would lead to an engine only capable of making that particular game rather than a multitude of games, but with the right developer at the helm, it could lead to a really serious set of sustainable features everyone would benefit from.
      Anyway, thanks for watching and best of luck with MAX!

  • @RetroBreak
    @RetroBreak 3 месяца назад

    Brilliant video! I only knew them from 3D Game Maker and Dark Basic, so cool to see them still at it, despite the questionable quality and roadmap… Hope you can make an update in a few years time and see what path they ended up taking!

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  3 месяца назад +1

      Glad you enjoyed it! And yes, maybe one day I'll make a follow up.

  • @beardalaxy
    @beardalaxy Год назад +1

    this is exactly what i was looking for and it turns out it was made only two weeks ago! great stuff.
    it's cool to know that there are still people out there doing work on fps creator. it does have a certain charm to it that places it somewhere between goldsrc and source.

  • @SlipgateToPhobos
    @SlipgateToPhobos 11 месяцев назад

    Wow, amazing production value in this video. You definitely deserve tons of views!

  • @garland336
    @garland336 Год назад +3

    Really well made and professionally done.

  • @CollateralMusicOfficial
    @CollateralMusicOfficial Год назад +2

    Lol. I saw Bugsy. Great production! Watching this at work passing the time!

  • @ToastedHeadcrab
    @ToastedHeadcrab 10 месяцев назад +1

    This video was phenomenal I really enjoyed it

  • @1183newman
    @1183newman Год назад +2

    I owned a boxed copy of dark basic back in the day.

    • @dietrichdietrich7763
      @dietrichdietrich7763 11 месяцев назад +1

      still got my original burn CD copy bought from online download shop.

  • @xxsemb
    @xxsemb Год назад

    I started out picking up a Dark Basic demo from a PC magazine CD back in the late 90s, I now head up development in a games studio and have a good career of it. It was a good introduction to programming at a time there was really no RUclips to look at or Google. Obviously outgrew it and these days I would unless creating a custom engine use UE or Unity but DB was good fun.

  • @mk83_Daniel_Williams
    @mk83_Daniel_Williams Год назад +3

    I'm mk83 from the forum, great documentary. Loved it. What about RPG Maker? (My World) Why was that not mentioned?

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +4

      Thanks MK83. So, RPG Maker is a bit of an oddity in that (as I understand it) it was developed by a member of TGC but initially as a side-project. Then TGC adopted it fully and helped publish it. Then they dropped it after a couple of years, handing full creative control back to its creator, Dave Milton. As such, I'm not sure I can consider it a "full" TGC product in the same vein as DarkBASIC or FPSC. Also, with the documentary weighing in at well over an hour, I decided it wasn't relevant to the main focus of the film, which is the lineage of GameGuru MAX, It is an interesting tangent though, so possibly could be the subject of its own video in the future.

  • @AlexDiru
    @AlexDiru Год назад +3

    Just started watching this, I've been thinking about my past a lot tonight and this happened to pop up. Looks like a trip down memory lane 👴 I'm sure this is going to be excellent :)

    • @AlexDiru
      @AlexDiru Год назад

      Yeah, this was amazing. I left TGC tools around the release of FPSC X10. My favourite was DarkGDK (DBP functionality in a C++ library), I remember someone writing a paid plugin to convert the procedural functions of the DarkGDK into classes to actually benefit from OOP - sadly it had a cost, and that felt rough because without it I found myself having to write lots of boilerplate code to manage things efficiently. And I was like 14 or 15 at the time so it was harder
      Was nice to see what's happened since I've left. Wonder if TGC are better served by focusing on a game creator for a smaller niche, like FPSC (but hopefully without the performance issues). I feel trying to create an open ended no-code game engine (especially with a small team), is just impossible. They are up against titans and you could argue UE makes coding unnecessary with Blueprint

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад

      Hope you enjoyed it!

  • @pv8685
    @pv8685 9 месяцев назад +2

    its save to say that lee bamber is indie devs john carmack!

  • @neotracer075
    @neotracer075 Год назад +1

    I'd be down for the 3 hour directors cut version! ❤

  • @princeofmars6296
    @princeofmars6296 10 месяцев назад +1

    you make the best videos tanner

  • @thewholeworldblurred
    @thewholeworldblurred 9 месяцев назад +1

    god, I remember fpsc... good times

  • @HitsLoveRadio
    @HitsLoveRadio 3 месяца назад

    I bought both versions of GameGuru, CLASSIC and MAX, and I’m very satisfied with them. However, I still prefer programming my own games. That’s why I got App Game Kit Studio, and I’m really glad I did.

  • @Lahirushub
    @Lahirushub Год назад +3

    Great documentary, i inspired lot 🏆️

  • @burner9147
    @burner9147 Год назад +2

    I got into fpsc early as soon as it came out.
    I was small fish (I made the principality of Mars and tales of cthulhu) and I remember getting very annoyed because the AI would just stop working and they would just stand there.
    Or there was one bug where the enemies would play all their animations one after the other and it took them forever for them to fix it but instead of focusing on bug fixing they released model pack after model pack.

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +1

      Oh man, the bug where characters would just cycle through all their animations...now that takes me back XD

    • @Serygalacaffeine
      @Serygalacaffeine Год назад

      To be fair, TGC themselves did not make the model packs so there was no time investment.
      But its true that FPSC only started to take off once the first community made features where integrated.

  • @dietrichdietrich7763
    @dietrichdietrich7763 11 месяцев назад

    Awesome documentary. I really liked this.

  • @graig5600
    @graig5600 Год назад +3

    Bel documentario, italiani ne siamo in pochi a seguire fps creator, ma ricordiamo i bei tempi quando esisteva un forum italiano. Ormai tutto morto. Chissa, se prendo pc buono e soldi da parte acquistwro il max

  • @Fransadiwinata
    @Fransadiwinata Год назад

    thank you for finishing the documentary

  • @StevenJShow
    @StevenJShow 9 месяцев назад +2

    1:10:40 Okay? And being a good chef isn't easy, either. You don't get to say "Oh, well it's hard, therefore it's going to be crap!" Like... No. I don't know what that argument even is.
    It's up tot he team to keep their scope in check an dnot be pressured to add in excessive features that ultimately clutter the engine and choke the performance. The goal is an easy to use game creation kit. OKay. Stick to that.

  • @mattkaustik1324
    @mattkaustik1324 Год назад +1

    I still have my physical copy of FPSC from like 2005 or something lol

  • @bobhumid
    @bobhumid Год назад +2

    What a fantastically loveful and equally honest way of talking it out ... I must admit I am often watching my FPSX10-Package sitting there on my book-shelf. /.-)

  • @burner9147
    @burner9147 Год назад

    The thing is still really REALLY want a version of fpsc which is just you know good.

  • @goldenwolfe5085
    @goldenwolfe5085 Год назад +4

    My probable recommendation to the future of game guru is probably open sourcing everything.

  • @Kdkikos
    @Kdkikos Год назад +2

    Hi, I bought both game guru classic and Max and hoping to use both a lot I got no experience not a lot amount of time but got lots of ideas and I'm not haste to make mistakes as I saw around. Dunno tho if I can make something worthwhile for everyone but what I would like is to make games and put them on Steam for free and see how it's going to roll cause In the video I saw that scalpers did their part even in this platform selling a ready demo of the developers. awesome. so yea it's the US making it wrong so we need to make it right. The bottom line is that the game guru classic and Max are good and need to use wisely.

    • @GameBoyyearsago
      @GameBoyyearsago Год назад +1

      Finally a commonsens le person who understand that its not the dev but also upto us to try and make something useful from it abd be creative 😊😊😊😊

  • @iamfromthewild
    @iamfromthewild 9 дней назад

    Just starting this is forgot about game creator! I loooooved this as a kid!

  • @pushingpandas6479
    @pushingpandas6479 4 месяца назад +1

    Game Guru Max in 2024 looks like from the 90ties. Why not use Unity or Unreal with visual programming? Its easy and state of the art graphics

    • @Anonymous-cn6zl
      @Anonymous-cn6zl 4 месяца назад

      Some game developers and players aren't fans of hyper-realistic graphics. Puppet Combo, for example, creates 3D horror games with low-resolution graphics, which is exactly what gives their games their unique charm.

  • @Axcellaful
    @Axcellaful Год назад

    Been following TGC since darkbasic. Awesome documentary!

  • @HansjuergWuethrich
    @HansjuergWuethrich Год назад +1

    Great documentary!! I know TGC since the good old Darkbasic time. In my personal opinion, all the Game Guru stuff is crap. They better should focus onto the App Game Kit Engine. Because THIS is the way better Product. But they give no love to App Game Kit 😢. The update cycle is a shame. Since Dark Basic we (The community) want to have a 3D Editor, but even AGK Studio does not have it! The Product is great with a lot of opportunities. But TGC has no vision for it 😢

  • @donelkingii3738
    @donelkingii3738 Год назад +1

    Love this guy!

  • @MaiaCoimbra
    @MaiaCoimbra Год назад +5

    I am a fan

  • @TopherBlairMusic
    @TopherBlairMusic Год назад

    I owe my current career to DBPro. I remember when my mom bought me the boxed copy like 20 years ago.

  • @idli3D
    @idli3D Год назад +1

    thank you for this great documentary!

  • @gabrielmarquesgamerjogador3460
    @gabrielmarquesgamerjogador3460 Год назад +3

    Esse parte aqui 53:44 curti demais esse jogo 🎮 😊👍🏻.

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +2

      Dark Skies is well worth checking out on Steam!

    • @gabrielmarquesgamerjogador3460
      @gabrielmarquesgamerjogador3460 Год назад +2

      ​@@TannerProductions Yes friend, I'll check out the game and it's really cool 😊👍🏻 for fans of stalker in Chernobylite.

  • @StigDesign
    @StigDesign 11 месяцев назад

    This is so Nostalgia and retro to watch :D DarkBasic DarkBasicPro FPScreator :D am not sure how old my useer acount is but i think its 2004 perhaps, i was/is StigDesign there too :D

  • @c.joystuck8353
    @c.joystuck8353 Год назад +1

    In my opinion something they should definitely be working on is weapon customization. A big problem for FPSC and GG Classic (according to me at least) was the fact that the way a gun functioned was controlled by a gunspec.txt file in wich you would put some pre-defined commands that
    would dictate how your gun should work (what was the ammo type, if it had a sprint animation or not, if it was
    semi-auto or full-auto ecc. ) But if you wanted to add some more features to
    it (custom ones for instance, like gun inspection, custom procedural weapon swaying and movement, or maybe a smooth interpolation between sprinting and aiming positions) you just couldn't. You could only work with what you had.
    Guns in GameGuru Classic weren't classified as "entities", in the sense that you couldn't attach a .lua script to them. By having a .lua file attached to an entity in the game world you could make it perform any action you wrote in the script. I think they should add a similar system for first person guns aswell: they could keep the gunspec.txt file for general settings and initialization of the gun but then also allow us to attach a script to the gunspec file in order to make the view model perform certain actions that it couldn't perform otherwise. It's just a suggestion, that's all.
    Great video by the way.

  • @maximum197
    @maximum197 Год назад +1

    Part 2 when

  • @Brian-vs9sd
    @Brian-vs9sd Год назад

    Excellent video. Well done.

  • @Squatrix_algeria
    @Squatrix_algeria Год назад +5

    The game creators always wanted the latest and the greatest technologies but always forgetting the sucks optimization

  • @jbirdmax
    @jbirdmax Год назад +2

    I usually don’t watch livestreams after they’ve ended and put available after. I couldn’t turn away!
    Amazing documentary type video done right.
    Also anyone still stuck on GG, after using MAX I go back to GG and it honestly feels primitive in comparison. Also you will be able to convert GG levels and assets to Max as far as I’m aware.

    • @Serygalacaffeine
      @Serygalacaffeine Год назад +2

      Backwards compatibility for levels is extremely unlikely but sure, you can import your assets fairly easily into max. GGC still has a bunch of pros and features that max does not have but max is also still in development.

  • @fiveanother7992
    @fiveanother7992 2 месяца назад +1

    it is good

  • @BerntSunde
    @BerntSunde 11 дней назад

    Liked and subscribed

  • @FactsNoFeels
    @FactsNoFeels Год назад

    Merci pour cette vidéo

  • @bobfromsoireegames4309
    @bobfromsoireegames4309 Год назад

    Great documentary. 5/5

  • @Squatrix_algeria
    @Squatrix_algeria Год назад +4

    The game creators was falling down since the release of the X10 version of FPSC since then they were leasing a bad quality products with a lot of optimization issues

    • @TannerProductions
      @TannerProductions  Год назад +1

      That's probably my main complaint about TGC engines, the optimisation often sucks.

    • @Squatrix_algeria
      @Squatrix_algeria Год назад +1

      @@TannerProductions I didn't have any problems with the classic version of the FPSC, I have tried to run FPS Creator on a Pentium 4 machine with 1 gig of ram and 128 MB embedded graphics chipset, And I got fairly acceptable results , now, let's get to the x10 version 8 gigs of RAM and Intel core i3 gen 3 with G-Force GTX620M
      2GB graphics card I know I was getting framerates over 60But I was not spared from mistakes Overlapping textures, random colors and more, oh, and let's not forget the unreasonable crashes

  • @UKvita
    @UKvita Год назад

    That was an interesting documentary.

  • @florianh.1658
    @florianh.1658 Год назад

    Nice!

  • @doctorfinemind9175
    @doctorfinemind9175 Год назад +1

    I think it's mainly peoples lack of ingenuity if they truly can't produce a decent game with this engine, and a part of why I say that is cause it seems as though that with enough planning then one could utilize this engine to create a pretty wide variety of games, even including ones that are not very dissimilar to the ever popular 'skyrim'

  • @Anonymous-cn6zl
    @Anonymous-cn6zl 4 месяца назад

    Hi everyone. Is it still possible to make games using Darkbasic in 2024? I plan to create a low poly 3d game, same with The Babysitter Bloodbath and Resident Evil 1 in 1995

  • @burner9147
    @burner9147 Год назад

    Something I wish they had done I think they should of made the enemies 2d sprites like doom and let people easily change the sprites.

    • @Serygalacaffeine
      @Serygalacaffeine Год назад

      Check out "easy fps editor", its an easy to use tool for sprite based shooters. Perhaps up your alley.

  • @3ofSpades
    @3ofSpades 4 месяца назад

    I think this is a good video, tanner. I’m glad you also mentioned the bribery and also were able to actually elaborate on even before dark basic. I hope that interview of mine helped you. Despite what this community might think of me, I hope my actions and input helped. I wanted what was best for this engine for years. But the damage is done. Gameguru community, leave me alone. You people have only creeped me out and made me feel incredibly uncomfortable and unwanted. Consider this my last word concerning your engine’s tech and developers. I’ll make my game and leave. I don’t want my steam points anymore. Please go away.

  • @jenkims1953
    @jenkims1953 10 месяцев назад

    game guru is the cash grab pyramid scheme of game engines

  • @3ofSpades
    @3ofSpades 4 месяца назад

    The biggest problem I had aside from being cyber bullied, and which hunted for the past seven years while using your engine, Lee was the fact that I paid for things that you never gave in gameguru classic. Like multiplayer standalone games, inventory management, and vr. And then you just hand waved them away and laughed it off like this video while offering no recourse or compensation. Then you proceeded to charge $80 for an engine that instead of looking like it came out in the early 90s now looks like it came out in 2001. The problem was a huge lack of accountability, your ego, your borderline psychotic conspiracy theorist moderators censoring any and all criticism, your refusal to do anything to stop the likes of people using the gameguru engine to make these games that scam people out of their money, and on top of all of it having the gall to not allow other people to fix the mess if they had wanted to with a source code release and basic common sense and courtesy. Not once did I get an apology or an explanation for why I was hunted down by your “community” of goons who acted incredibly anti intellectual and very much akin to that of a digital fascist dictatorship where you may not speak unless it is blind praise and all while tons of features and issues get thrown away and ignored. As somebody who is making a game on this engine, despite all of the crap that I’ve gotten for it from your community, and despite your incredibly defeatist attitude more akin to the fox and the grapes, I want it to be known that the reason why people were so critical was because they cared. People do not care about this engine anymore because of the aforementioned problems above alongside the amount of time it has taken to perform basic functions that are easier in other engines like unreal, the few people who do get shown such as wolf and dk productions are incredibly racist, xenophobic, and above all else very ablest and unwelcoming to anyone else in this community- I mean, cult for an engine that is marketed as game making for everyone. Lee, you have a cult full of people who have some arbitrary set of standards that completely go against the marketing of the engine where coding isn’t required, and who do not get punished for any reason, despite causing all of these issues and enabling them to only get worse with their one sided witch hunts. The problem with this mentality is that you never encourage people to be better by showing them things and examples they could look at things they could see to improve their games, and on the rare chance anyone does, it’s usually in some kind of foreign language on some random RUclips channel as opposed to the official channel, meaning that this primarily English based and advertised piece of software is only really usable if you go through a maze of hidden and hard to find RUclips channels and broken links with wayback machine and decode other languages you may not be able to speak or read. If that is easy, then you have never understood the definition of that word for once in your life. You simply cannot understand, nor care to understand, and you only have yourself to blame for it. The truth of the matter when people make those 15 minute scam games that they just take a default asset or level from because they do it simply out of spite, and it is the only viable means of making money from this because you refuse to cooperate or elaborate on what it is you think is a good game, but you’re always more than willing to bash anyone and everyone who makes a game that is not DK productions or wolf and for no good reason other than to cause them harm and distress like a common bully threatening them for their lunch money. This was about learning and growth, Lee. You failed both. I have to say it takes a strong man to deny the truth that’s right in front of him, and if the truth is undeniable, you just create your own. That is why you fail, and are gonna continue to do so as long as you go down that path. All anyone’s gonna remember is that brief time on steam in 2016 when your games were barraging the steam store with a poor standard of quality all because you laughed it off and refused to do anything about it. People are smarter than you think. Your attitude is the issue no matter what you call your busted products. Attitude reflects leadership. And as a result, you’ll never be free of this. The damage is done. Far as I’m concerned, take this advice if you’re not going to do anything else. Make these engines open source. All of them. And make them free. Refund everyone, and do something else. With your money, I’m sure you could actually make a decent video editing program. You want to help people? There’s no good and well known video editors like adobe and Vegas. Try that. Maybe you’ll learn a thing or two. Or not. After all, you think I hate you and I can’t change your mind no matter what I do.

  • @thedude8747
    @thedude8747 Год назад

    Been using TGC software for years and GameGuru Max is evolving wonderfully!! I was a total amateur and gained a fair amount of programming, modeling and design knowledge since starting with GameGuru Classic in 2017!! 💯