I’d like to post a comment to say, I’m a monarchist, but I don’t care if you hold favourable opinions about the commonwealth or Cromwell, just don’t waffle about incorrect statements or call for regicide and sorts.
I personally am ambivalent. I believe Charles had what was coming to him and believe that Cromwell was a better leader than Charles’ 1 and 2, but I believe that King William III was much better than Cromwell. I also disagree with a lot of Cromwell’s policies, such as the destruction of the Crown Jewels and the banning of Christmas. But Cromwell’s policies were necessary in some way, the country was literally destroying itself, and Ireland was a mess. Whether it was Cromwell or a distant Stuart relative, Charles would’ve been deposed anyways.
@@TheOldSalt Cromwell's banning of Christmas is consistent with Puritan policy of separation from Rome. Rome holds Christmas to be one of its highest holidays, and its celebration is a display of the spiritual power it has in any country by way of a temporal celebration. The Puritans unlike the earlier Reformers rejected all the holidays of Rome, while the early Reformers rejected the free will theology of Rome but kept her holidays; which, unfortunately, proved the very means whereby the Reformation was undone in the 1800s. As for the destruction of the Crown Jewels, they were regarded as a form of absolutist idolatry, so like any images they had to go.
after Cromwell became Lord Protector he had an ‘Investiture’ in Westminster Abbey. He just stole a lot of monarchist ceremonies and duties and named it differently, a website about the history of Stuart Britain explains it better than I could ‘Despite the title, Cromwell was king in all but name. He resided at Whitehall and Hampton Court. His daughters took the title of ‘princess’. By 1656 he was dubbing knights. In 1657, when the constitution required his second investiture as Lord Protector, he sat in the coronation chair used since 1308. The ceremony moved to Westminster Abbey, and adopted aspects of the coronation ceremony.’
Question: Was this song made in Cromwell's own time? Some of the language doesn't sound like early modern English, but just modern English period. John Milton, a contemporary of Cromwell's, wrote in a highly ornate manner (moreso than Shakespeare, even!), but did normal folk back then speak more like us than I think?
I’m not exactly sure, this specific recording has been floating around on RUclips since 2015, and the original video doesn’t mention anything about its origins or band. I have seen a few historical songs that have had their lyrics ‘updated’ to more modern English, if you look up the English songs ‘Agincourt Carol’ and ‘Pastime with Good Company’ you will see vaguely two versions, one in the original English, Middle English, and one with modern English, it could be that this song is from 1650 something and the audio is just with modernised spellings and lyrics, or it could’ve just been made in 1884 or something, a lot of English music about wars and such in the 17th and 18th centuries was actually made in the 1800s, most all Jacobite songs are.
But such is the complexity of Irish history that it doesn't always fit easily into the modern mould its poured in. For example the man who was the fist to fly the green flag was for a time allied with the Roundheads. That was Owen Roe O'Neil who came to the aid of Roundhead garrison of Londonderry which was besieged by Royalist forces.
“Irish” bootlickers that’s how. Spent their lives licking the boots of the British establishment trying to curry favour and hoping some crumbs fall from the table😂
@@swaythegod5812 No he wasn't. Cromwell was barely part of the talks of Readmission, synagogues were not built during his rule, and Jews did not return in any legal capacity to England - Cromwell once spoke of them, in relation to mercantilism: "Do you think, that these ragged peoples would ever outpace the English merchant?". Jews came back to England in 1664, four years after the advent of King Charles the Second.
He had lots of flaws, genocide among them, but the truth is that that sort of thing was ubiquitous at the time. Doesn’t make it right by any means, but in the context of the time, I think he was justified in the eyes of many contemporary Englishmen.
@@williamhicks4699 history is a different country, he did atrocites even bad for the time but it was normal back then, same.with Portadown, doesnt make it good
I don’t really like Cromwell since he did cause a genocide of the Irish people but weren’t many Parliamentarians monarchists? Just that they were constitutional monarchists. But the royalists were absolutarian monarchists.
From my understanding, there were constitutionalists on both sides, abolitionist radicals on Parliament's side and absolutist radicals on Charles's side. The New Model Army became radicalised into abolitionists, performed a purge of Parliament, and the newly-formed Rump Parliament performed the Trial and Execution of Charles I. Many Englishmen did not want the execution of their King, and no one really had a plan for what politics should look like following the abolition, which necessitated the installment of Cromwell's military government/dictatorship. Very surface-level and largely informed by what I've read in Blair Worden's 'The English Civil War', which itself is an introductory book.
As an Irish Catholic I won't even criticize the notion that Cromwell was somehow a good person despite causing mass genocide in Ireland, this song just isn't very good
@@olekcholewa8171the song is rip off ironically of an Irish song originally looks like some loyalist are just trying to pretend they have a culture lol
After the execution of Charles I, Munro commander of Scots Coventeers in 1649 in Ulster, joined with the Royalists in Ulster under Stewert, Irish Catholic Conferderates and Royalists in a grand Alliance against Cromwell. It was the Parlimentarians in Dublin who paved the way for Cromwell to land. You are mixing up 1642 with 1649 two different Irelands. Read your damn history at least for gods sake.
@@fyrdman2185 Uhhhh….no. In terms of international policies Cromwell, besides joining France in the bullying of Spain and trigerring a war with the Netherlands did basically. His reign was simply too short for him to achieve anything significant. British Empire ows its existence to rapid colonial expansion under George II and George III and their prime ministers in the XVIII century
@@olekcholewa8171 He got lots of colonial lands, restored order to the country after the civil war, was the first man to united the British Isles under English rule and solidified English rule over Ireland. Also the British army of the Empire was modelled after Cromwell's New Model Army, he was the one who built the navy that would later conquer most of the world so his legacy is that of the British Empire.
I’d like to post a comment to say, I’m a monarchist, but I don’t care if you hold favourable opinions about the commonwealth or Cromwell, just don’t waffle about incorrect statements or call for regicide and sorts.
I personally am ambivalent. I believe Charles had what was coming to him and believe that Cromwell was a better leader than Charles’ 1 and 2, but I believe that King William III was much better than Cromwell. I also disagree with a lot of Cromwell’s policies, such as the destruction of the Crown Jewels and the banning of Christmas. But Cromwell’s policies were necessary in some way, the country was literally destroying itself, and Ireland was a mess. Whether it was Cromwell or a distant Stuart relative, Charles would’ve been deposed anyways.
@@TheOldSalt Cromwell's banning of Christmas is consistent with Puritan policy of separation from Rome.
Rome holds Christmas to be one of its highest holidays, and its celebration is a display of the spiritual power it has in any country by way of a temporal celebration.
The Puritans unlike the earlier Reformers rejected all the holidays of Rome, while the early Reformers rejected the free will theology of Rome but kept her holidays; which, unfortunately, proved the very means whereby the Reformation was undone in the 1800s.
As for the destruction of the Crown Jewels, they were regarded as a form of absolutist idolatry, so like any images they had to go.
@@TheOldSalt Cromwell did not ban Christmas. You owe Cromwell for the British Empire btw, he was the greatest Englishman to have ever lived.
As an Oliver, great song
I've always liked the beat and instrumental to this song. Very catchy.
I gotta say, I love the lyrics! They're accurate and brilliant. Thank you lad! Another day, another great song!
Love this song.
I knew that they had wanted to crown Cromwell, but he refused the crown. Why in the video do we see a clergyman passing out regalia?
after Cromwell became Lord Protector he had an ‘Investiture’ in Westminster Abbey. He just stole a lot of monarchist ceremonies and duties and named it differently, a website about the history of Stuart Britain explains it better than I could ‘Despite the title, Cromwell was king in all but name. He resided at Whitehall and Hampton Court. His daughters took the title of ‘princess’. By 1656 he was dubbing knights. In 1657, when the constitution required his second investiture as Lord Protector, he sat in the coronation chair used since 1308. The ceremony moved to Westminster Abbey, and adopted aspects of the coronation ceremony.’
@@Imperial_Britannia'Democracy' he said
Question: Was this song made in Cromwell's own time? Some of the language doesn't sound like early modern English, but just modern English period. John Milton, a contemporary of Cromwell's, wrote in a highly ornate manner (moreso than Shakespeare, even!), but did normal folk back then speak more like us than I think?
I’m not exactly sure, this specific recording has been floating around on RUclips since 2015, and the original video doesn’t mention anything about its origins or band. I have seen a few historical songs that have had their lyrics ‘updated’ to more modern English, if you look up the English songs ‘Agincourt Carol’ and ‘Pastime with Good Company’ you will see vaguely two versions, one in the original English, Middle English, and one with modern English, it could be that this song is from 1650 something and the audio is just with modernised spellings and lyrics, or it could’ve just been made in 1884 or something, a lot of English music about wars and such in the 17th and 18th centuries was actually made in the 1800s, most all Jacobite songs are.
No it’s a cover of an Irish song
made by Ulster loyalists Protestants
Who themselves don’t consider themselves Irish
Pro Cromwell and Irish shouldn't be in the same sentence
But such is the complexity of Irish history that it doesn't always fit easily into the modern mould its poured in.
For example the man who was the fist to fly the green flag was for a time allied with the Roundheads. That was Owen Roe O'Neil who came to the aid of Roundhead garrison of Londonderry which was besieged by Royalist forces.
It was written by protestant so it shouldn't be surprise.
Well, Irish Protestants exist
“Irish” bootlickers that’s how. Spent their lives licking the boots of the British establishment trying to curry favour and hoping some crumbs fall from the table😂
Do you realize that Northern Ireland and Ireland are different? Lol
Funny thing is, the tune is taken from a traditional Irish song, 'Eileen Óg'. 😂
So what? Plenty of English tunes the Irish stole from.
@@fyrdman2185 we don't boast of our superiority and civility and prize flute bands as the central pillar of our culture.
@@fyrdman2185name one without using google or search engine you just can’t
@@swaythegod5812 Johnny I Hardly Knew Ye is one famous example.
@@fyrdman2185 4 years later than the original
For Ulster, this is definitely a 'feel-good' song.
No matter what anyone says, Oliver Cromwell is one of the greatest people in the history of England.
Was the first true Zionist tho
@@swaythegod5812 No he wasn't. Cromwell was barely part of the talks of Readmission, synagogues were not built during his rule, and Jews did not return in any legal capacity to England - Cromwell once spoke of them, in relation to mercantilism: "Do you think, that these ragged peoples would ever outpace the English merchant?".
Jews came back to England in 1664, four years after the advent of King Charles the Second.
You support a butcherer? Next your gonna say Hitler was one of the greatest people in history
He had lots of flaws, genocide among them, but the truth is that that sort of thing was ubiquitous at the time.
Doesn’t make it right by any means, but in the context of the time, I think he was justified in the eyes of many contemporary Englishmen.
@@williamhicks4699 history is a different country, he did atrocites even bad for the time but it was normal back then, same.with Portadown, doesnt make it good
7/8 of my great grandparents were born and raised Catholic and even I can appreciate this one ☝🏻 😅
An Irish song pro-Cromwell is the same as Nazis starting to sing Hava Nagila.😆
It was the Protestant Irish who sang this
Protestant Irish people exist
@@Hibernica1641 Protestant Irish republicans even do, one of my favourite republican songs.
@@jacobite2353 I mean they were Scottish settlers really, not really Irish. They wouldve recognised an ethnic distinction.
@@repippeas They literally formed the United Irishmen, Protestant and Catholic Irishmen united to fight England
Well that was different , a bit controversial but good!
Remember the murdered civilians at the Wexford and Drogheda massacres committed by the usurper Cromwell!
As an English royalist. I think we’re as bad as each other
It feels odd yet interesting that even England got to have its own dictator
Cromwell isn't even the most interesting one. Look up Roger Mortimer, his story is like something out of a Hollywood movie.
I don’t really like Cromwell since he did cause a genocide of the Irish people but weren’t many Parliamentarians monarchists? Just that they were constitutional monarchists. But the royalists were absolutarian monarchists.
From my understanding, there were constitutionalists on both sides, abolitionist radicals on Parliament's side and absolutist radicals on Charles's side. The New Model Army became radicalised into abolitionists, performed a purge of Parliament, and the newly-formed Rump Parliament performed the Trial and Execution of Charles I. Many Englishmen did not want the execution of their King, and no one really had a plan for what politics should look like following the abolition, which necessitated the installment of Cromwell's military government/dictatorship.
Very surface-level and largely informed by what I've read in Blair Worden's 'The English Civil War', which itself is an introductory book.
Alfred the great was catholic, i mean, he is like the Charlemagne of england.
Ulster shall never surrender to the Irish Yoke
Northern Ireland is not Ulster
@@swaythegod5812most of Ulster is Northern Ireland.
@@ImperialFederationGB it’s not same thing
Also let us not forget Louth witch is in Leinster today but was apart of Ulster historically
@@swaythegod5812 I never said they were entirely the same thing.
Team Charles i
Haha😂
AA
This is an Ulster Protestant song not Irish.
Is Ulster not a province of Ireland?
@@Imperial_Britannia Well the Protestants in Ulster who wrote the song are not Irish nor do they identify as Irish. They're Ulster-Scots.
Many loyalists identify as Irish too. Iain Paisley did!@@fyrdman2185
@@Imperial_Britannia You'll get a broken jaw talking like that in the wrong company
@@Imperial_Britanniaulster is irish
These are planters not native to ireland
As an Irish Catholic I won't even criticize the notion that Cromwell was somehow a good person despite causing mass genocide in Ireland, this song just isn't very good
The song is actually, very good, Cromwell however was terrible.
@@olekcholewa8171the song is rip off ironically of an Irish song originally looks like some loyalist are just trying to pretend they have a culture lol
@@swaythegod5812 On which song is this based on?
🙄
Its actually an Anti Irish papist song. Btw the Ulster Protestants opposed Cromwell and fought with Irish Catholic Royalists.
No they didn't. ( ulster protestants are the ones who called him over O Neill had enough of them and wanted them dead they ran to Cromwell for help)
No they didn't lmfao
After the execution of Charles I, Munro commander of Scots Coventeers in 1649 in Ulster, joined with the Royalists in Ulster under Stewert, Irish Catholic Conferderates and Royalists in a grand Alliance against Cromwell. It was the Parlimentarians in Dublin who paved the way for Cromwell to land. You are mixing up 1642 with 1649 two different Irelands. Read your damn history at least for gods sake.
Imagine simping for a dogshit Protectorate that lasted 6 years and fell apart after the death of it's first and only leader.
Good song tho.
It was a pretty great regime that made England great and turned it into a power house in Europe, the British Empire owes its existence to Cromwell.
@@fyrdman2185 Uhhhh….no.
In terms of international policies Cromwell, besides joining France in the bullying of Spain and trigerring a war with the Netherlands did basically. His reign was simply too short for him to achieve anything significant. British Empire ows its existence to rapid colonial expansion under George II and George III and their prime ministers in the XVIII century
@@olekcholewa8171 He got lots of colonial lands, restored order to the country after the civil war, was the first man to united the British Isles under English rule and solidified English rule over Ireland. Also the British army of the Empire was modelled after Cromwell's New Model Army, he was the one who built the navy that would later conquer most of the world so his legacy is that of the British Empire.