A Good Ecumenism
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- Опубликовано: 15 окт 2024
- Bishop Irenei of London & Western Europe (ROCOR)
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meh. voodoo and human sacrifice cults are not for me.
What do you think of the microphone and video quality upgrade on Bishop Irenei's videos?
It sounds and looks good to me!
Excellent quality upgrades! God bless.
It is perfect, Thank You!
It is great!
Looks professionally done to me.
Vladyka, please pray for us here on Oklahoma in the "Bible belt". We are surrounded by many Protestant groups. I thank God for my Protestant background, through which He led me to Himself in Orthodoxy.
. . . Amen. I used to be Baptist and went through a short Lutheran phase as I was in the beginning phases of discovering Orthodoxy (and in a sense I still am and in Orthodox fashion may always be in this journey of growing since I had a totally different viewpoint of the Church before this eye-opening video) and... I'm grateful that God let my roots grow in those places so that I could be ready for the fullfilling food of Orthodoxy. I pray for my fellow Protestant friends too that they may join us and become brothers and sisters in the Body of Christ, and I humbly plead that you all have the grace in your heart to join me a sinner aswell. I still wrestle with these ideas as I confess they are a bit foreign tasting to me but God has clearly shown me that this is the truth... May I decrease and the Lord increase, may my knowledge diminish in the infinite wisdom of The Lord. God bless you all, in Jesus name, Amen.
The Orthodox unwavering stance is what brought me here.
It is one of the only things that proves to me the legitimacy,
mainly because it actually can be dangerous NOT to change for the world.
And if the christians of a church is ok with all kinds of suffering dou to NOT changing.
Then that points to THE church.
Filled with unwavering Faith, and the Lords people. Who are as Bold as lions.
Praise be to The Lord for guiding me true.
Old folks said that the church needed to modernize, to liberalize, to keep with the times, to be "hip" at all costs. The old modernizers called their opponents reactionaries, fundamentalists, and "squares". The costs of the old folk's "modernizing" actions in the 20th century have made themselves manifest for all to see; As it turns out (to the shock of no one paying attention to the scriptures, especially the Old Testament which constantly narrates the cyclical repentance and apostasy of Israel), stooping to the level of the world did not convert the world to Christ, but rather converted much of Christ's Church to the world. As for the young folks of the 21st century... We're re-discovering that it's hip to be square. ☦
Im so happy to see our dear Bishop again!
Bishop Irenei. Thank you for speaking TRUTH !
Axios Bishop Irenei!! I am so glad to hear your stance and I totally agree with you!!
May God have mercy on us!!🙏✝️♥️
Excellent.
This is the best teaching I’ve heard on how to talk to other Christians who are passionately following Christ in the best way they know how while still holding to truth. Thank you so much for this wisdom. May God the father, Jesus the Christ, and the Holy Spirit be with all of you.
I'm glad that Orthodoxy is good about speaking against Ecumenism, no other "church" speaks out against it. Orientals and Catholicism have accepted Ecumenism and branch theory
As an OO. No we dont. Branch theory happens when you divide Christ...like you guys did in Chalcedon...😂
@ACReji how do you know which doctrines are true and which are false?
@@EpistemicAnthony Me personally?
Analysis of history....reading of Scriptures...reading of the Holy Fathers...and then seeing who isnt contradicting them and is more consistent with them...all under faith of the guidance of the Spirit.
@@ACReji Interesting, so OOs think Judaism, Islam, and Christianity are from the same source? I'm assuming that because of your view on branch theory.
@@ACRejiby not accepting Chalcedon you have seperated yourselves from the true Church.
This is, after our (sadly, now former) Bishop Andrej (of Austria), my favourite Bishop.
Thank you Bishop Irenei for your wise words and teaching echoing down the centuries from the Fathers and Saints of the one Church
Blessings from our Lord, God and Savior Jesus Christ be upon your Eminence. 🙏
Great information you have provided for us Bishop Irene!
A beautiful message from bishop Irenei. Lord have mercy on us all
Beautifully expressed and explained! Thank you B. Irenei! I hope many will hear and heed this excellent counsel! God bless you!
"The Church must be one, it cannot be divided into parts that are in conflict with each other."
Well said, your excellency.
If only it were so...
Most Holy Virgin Mary, the God-Bearer, Mother of the Church, pray for the broken Bride of your divine Son!
This is truly inspired by 'The Holy Spirit'!.
As a Catholic growing up in Ireland in the 1960's this is what the Church always taught in the schools and from the pulpits.
The 'Creed' which you mentioned in your very opening lines, concretes this for all time.
Any other ideology outside of this is heresy and apostasy from The Truth.
If you couple this with Jesus's own command to The Apostles, " Go out and baptise all nations in 'The Name of The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit', and teach them all I have taught You"! Then there is no room for Eccumenism with other factions who are not baptised into the Catholic Church and who do not profess 'The Apostles Creed's!
This podcast needs to be sent and shown directly to The Pope and all The Hierarchy of The Catholic Church, to remind them of The True Mission of The Church, which is set for all time in these beliefs of our faith.
THE ONE TRUE CHURCH ... LOUD & CLEAR - THANK YOU
Thank You Father!
Thank you for such a clear, honest view, expressed in a Christian manner
Fantastic message!!! TRUTH spoken so clearly in LOVE. Glory to God!!!
The title caught me off guard for a second
Me too! Especially coming from this channel.
Same bro 😂 my God father send me this I was like wait hold up
Such a good word. May God help us to practice it.
This was so uplifting. It feels like there can be two extremes today in the teaching of Ecumanism, which can be hard to parse through as a newer convert. But this video puts the delicate balance, that our faith is as a whole anyway, into a clear and concise picture. Thank you your Grace!
Oh, so you like the watered down version? Or do you prefer to know the truth about how the Church has been infiltrated by traitors a long time ago.
Beautifully argued and presented.
Thank you. This is Christ's way.
Thank you 🙏🏼
Thank you, your Grace. A very pertinent topic in our time.
I loved this explanation, so to the point! Thank you Bishop Irenei, once again a great posting.🙏
I can't thank you enough, dear Father, for this video! Such an important topic.
Thank you! As a new catachumen coming from an evangelical background, I've been wondering about this question.
“One who believes may not be presumptuous; on the contrary, truth leads to humility, since believers know that, rather than ourselves possessing truth, it is truth which embraces and possesses us. Far from making us inflexible, the security of faith sets us on a journey; it enables witness and dialogue with all” - Pope Francis
It's worth remembering that the strength of our claims should be matched by the strength of our standards; we cannot simultaneously claim "We are the One True Church with access to the Grace of God" that other so-called "churches" don't have, but also, "Sure, there are scandals; we're all in a fallen world." If the Orthodox Church has a unique/direct line to God, there should be less scandals. There should be more holiness. Anything more or less than this is special pleading.
Totally agree! However the scandals doesn’t diminish the holiness in the church as individuals following the “path” we have inherited, but I certainly take your point when it comes to the organisation of the church. My personal opinion is that the division we are experiencing in the Orthodox Church today can be attributed to the other extreme opposing any type of ecumenical approach, and known by the name of “Philetism or tribalism”
May God preserve His Orthodox Church unharmed and heal Her wounds!
I also wish illumination and soothing comfort to all Roman Catholics now in pain over the excommunication of Archbishop Vigano that took me by surprise a lot! I didn't think Pope Francis would go that far and not see that this is a turning point for the Church of Rome. He is burning bridges now, he's no longer true to his words of unity and all that.
I even dedicated him and Pope Francis a Paraklesis (to the greatmother of God, Saint Mary). Whatever Christ wants done there may it be done. 🙏
I don't understand your surprise at Viganó, I think it was very clear he should be excommunicated, ta least in the sense of what communion is and thus also excommunion. Communion is sharing in the same faith and the same sacraments. Viganó said that Francis is an anti Pope, while Francis (and me too) claims that he is the true Pope, so at least those two men cannot be in communion. Francis didn't burn the bridge, he just affirmed that Viganó had burned it. I understand that for you orthodox denying a Pope might not be so important, but the authority of the Pope is what sets the Catholic Church apart from other denominations. If it's just about following the authority of the bishops you could be old Catholic, Eastern orthodox, Anglican or any other church with an episcopal structure (a number of which are also sedevacantist), so you have to recognise the authority of the Pope recognised by the Catholic Church to be part of that Catholic Church. If Viganó thinks Francis is illegitimate then we Catholics who follow him are no longer Catholic, so he shouldn't want to be part of this structure anyway
Pope Francis did not excommunicate Vigano. The penalty for the sin of schism is latae sententiae excommunication, which means automatic by virtue of the said crime. The Vatican merely "declared" the excommunication, which Vigano automatically incurred, rather than imposed an excommunication.
I left Protestantism many years ago and consider myself Orthodox although I have never been catechised as there are no parishes where I live. While I agree there is one Apostolic successive Church and I believe in the doctrine of oneness, I also believe our understanding of this should be more expansive. In the book of Acts, many came into the faith by conversion through baptism without a physical church structure of any kind. There are those who become converts through missions in remote areas but never have a parish to attend. These discussions would do well to recognize those who have no access to the Church physically but whose faith in Christ remains strong.
Youre not Orthodox. You must be received to partake in the sacraments and be joined into the Body. You can’t intellectually be Orthodox. Sorry. Go to a local parish in communion and seek the catechumenate.
do you believe in oneness as in the oneness heresy about the Trinity, or do you believe that the Church is one? i’m confused what you mean by oneness
There was the Church in the book of acts. In fact the first thing you read about is the ordination of St. Matthias to take the office of Judas
“Doctrine of openness”? Anyway, God bless your journey of faith. But one can’t just simply adopt the mantle of “orthodoxy” then espouse non-orthodox teaching. An Orthodox person is taught by his or her priest & bishop. May God guide you to an Orthodox community.
@@PETERJOHN101 you should try to get to a parish and get catechized in the faith. We do not try to change what the Church teaches us.
Peter and Paul were once in disagreement with one another just like our modern day denominations. Yet they were still both members of the body of Christ and were able to reconcile their differences.
The difference is that they reconciled and came to an agreement. Are you seriously telling me that the Anglicans, Lutherans, Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, etc. are in agreement with the Orthodox Church? They all believe different things than we do and we cannot just say they are also correct because that would be a lie. Contradictory statements can't both be true. Baptismal regeneration can't be both true and false. The real presence can't be both true and false. The filioque can't be both true and false.
Could you give a talk about free masonry and its effects on the Orthodox Church.. I’m Catholic and I thought we were the only ones in the cross hairs of the masons. I just saw a video from an orthodox bishop about the masons sinking their claws sinking into the Orthodox Church… (bad) ecumenism being their cover.
Thank you for differentiating between Anglicans and the other Protestants. Every time I see or hear Catholics and Orthodox complaining about Protestantism, their complaints never seem to apply to us.
The Anglican Church exists as a body separated from Rome. Whom is also a separated body. Little point in infighting among the derivatives of the Catholic Church. I pray that all of those derivatives can return to the true body.
@@CenturionTheodore The two of you excommunicated each other. Do not lecture me on who is the true Church. Neither of you have that right.
@@WilliamSwartzendruber respectfully, based on what exactly? it's not about rights, its about truth.
@@WilliamSwartzendruberwe do though because the Orthodox Church is the church of the 1st milennia. Rome deviated and every protestant body inherited many of these deviations like the filioque.
There was the good type of ecumenical dialogue Bishop Irenei speaks on between the Orthdox and Anglicans and that was ended forever by the anglicans ordaining of women. That practice is yet again a deviation from "holding fast to the truths delivered whether by word or epistle."
After trying for years to make sense of western heterodoxy diving into Orthodoxy makes the entirety of western christendom feel like just scratches at the surface of the deep truths of His Church.
@@WilliamSwartzendruber How do you know which doctrines are true vs false?
God have mercy on bishop kalistos were. Truly a holy man
This video definitely helped begin to clear this up for me, but as a Catholic to Orthodox convert I still struggle to understand this.
Not related to the video but I love that writing desk
As a Catholic I totally agree, Truth is one and resides to its fullness in the (Catholic as far as I'm concerned) Church and doctrine. This doesn't mean that parts of truth cannot be found and appreciated elsewhere. The real spirit of "modern ecumenism" the way the Church is been doing since Vatican II is not relativism but rather to bring whoever already holds to parts of truth to the fullness of it wich lies within the Church.
That’s a good way to put it. The docs of VII actually helped me find Orthodoxy!
@@traceyedson9652Hmm, that is rather ironic given that it was in essence a pastoral council aiming to evangelize and unite the church.
What helped me to become Catholic last year from Lutheranism was reading the many Encyclicas of venerable Pius XII and of Pope Paul VI. on contraception (Humana Vitae).
The church has been and continues to be a clear voice on these key moral questions.
The Pope is the custodian of this truth of what the tradition of the Church always taught, this is essentially the necessarily living magisterium of the church, as nothing human is alien to the church.
@@traceyedson9652 wdym?
@@albertobenagli7622 ooo way too complicated - and easily misunderstood - for an online post. But a collection of influences helped me be convinced of apostolic Christianity and opened me to it. VII was one. Scott Hahn & PJPII were others. But I was EO that sealed the deal.
Reverent Bishop Irenee,
What you described Ecumenism is far from what most of us understand it to mean.
For most of us it means to open a dialogue between ourselves and other faiths, first to emphasize we were created in the image of God. God lives in each one of us and He loves us, and therefore we need to acknowledge the brotherhood that exists amongst us, since God is our Eternal Father.
When Jesus went to Samaria He preached about God’s love to those who followed the Law of Moses and those who were pagans, Greeks, Romans, Persians, Egyptians, etc.
Most of them didn’t even know that there was one God. They didn’t know that they should live a chaste life. Not to kill your brother or steal from your brother. Jesus gave them new concepts to think about. He showed them respect and love. He mingled among them who had different beliefs, nationalities and customs.
When we go to the University, we are exposed to so many ways of approaching a subject. Why can’t we do this with different faiths, so that we can bring the truth of Christ as He did with the people of His time.
Jesus transformed pagans to believe in one God, because He spoke to their heart with love. Why can’t we do the same with God’s Grace?
Jesus is wounded because of our disunity. He sent His Apostles to preach the love God has for His people and united heathens under His Holy Name. Now His body is dismembered into splinters.
The hierarchy has given a different meaning to ecumenism, whereas the people see it as a dialogue between brothers expressing God’s love for everyone and the opportunity to unite our hearts to understand what each of us need to do to show our love to the Creator of the universe.
Jesus is the Elixir of Love and He wants us to go and communicate this love with those who don’t know Him, through a dialogue of the hearts.
Many ortho bros need to hear this
The microphone and video quality is very good, just as it has been previously!!!
Could you comment on the temporary period of time in which the ROCOR was considered to be outside of the Church when in fact it never was?
Bravo! Audio and video sounds /look great.
Please read the reviews for the app a lot of people are experiencing issues!
The New app is fine aesthetically but there are quite a few bugs especially for the saint of the day portion.
1. It does not automatically update so you have to scroll all the way from jesus's circumcision to the day that you are at, I don't know if this issue has been fixed but it is reoccurring.
2. When you click play all it in fact does not play all the saints of the day but you instead have to manually go in and select each individual saint after the previous one stops, which is quite annoying for those of us who are just trying to listen to them all at one time while at work or driving.
3. Occasionally there is a blank space where typically there would be a saint, I know they have saints for all 365 days of the year but sometimes they are not shown.
These are just a few errors that I have discovered. Otherwise the new app looks great I wish it just functioned a little better.
The time has come to uphold the 15 canon of the second synod of Saint Fotios the great
Amen!
My mother who has started churches and gone to the Divine liturgy every Sunday of her life, is near shunning me for living ascetical- like. But what he says is True the Path of Christ is ascetical, it's not about having a good job, a good reputation, lots of money and a big house. When Jesus sees that He commands Sell Everything and Give Alms to The Poor! How many socalled Orthodox have gotten past the deception of the Enemy? Paul commands us not to schism. Everyone is too quick to call each other a HERETIC... LOVE is the way of a True Christian, not being correct on paper.
This title scared me into thinking that ecumenism is good(the heresy kind). Lord have mercy on me a sinner
I'm greatly relieved having watched this clip, the thumbnail had me worried. The eternal truth of holy Orthodoxy beautifully expressed by his eminence. Glory to God! 🙏☦️
I met him yesterday
this doesnt actually address one of the main questions people have regarding ecumenism: what about Rome? if the church 'cannot be divided', then does rome not have a valid hierarchy? are rome or the oriental orthodox just as much 'not in the church' as protestants?
There is theo-logical problem right from the start. It is true that Christ cannot be divided as He is perfect God and Perfect Man. But Church is organism of perfect Divinity and perfect-able Humanity. Therefore, for me as an Orthodox I can only humbly admit (together with Metropolitan Kalistos of the blessed memory) that I know where the Church is but I don't know where it isn't. Another error in the video was giving name to ecumenism what should properly be called mission. So, bishop was talking about pan-orthodoxy as a way of being ecumenical - but that is understood without explanation if you are truly Orthodox (or perhaps it isn't anymore?).
Amen!
Unfortunately, you (as well as Metropolitan Kallistos Ware), are missing the mark with the erroneous statement that supposedly: "we don't know where the church isn't." This is a "theology" of the mind that comes from not wanting to sound harsh towards heterodox groups. It's extremely important only to speak the mind of the Holy Fathers, those deified vessels of the Holy Spirit who all speak in one accord on this matter, especially our dear contemporary saints like St. Iakovos of Evia, St. Paisios, St. Nektarios, St. Kosmas Aitolos... it's very clear if you read their teachings that we know precisely where the Church isn't. What you have adopted is a soft form of ecumenism, but ecumenism nonetheless and cannot possibly lead anyone to salvation. The very basic essence of your statement leads a heterodox person (who may assume extremely erroneous positions on the Trinity, sacrements, the ever-virgin Theotokos, etc.) to believe that he has no need to change and can be saved through teachings that are totally incompatible with truth.
Please do some homework and be careful not to share your opinions or those of a single bishop on these extremely delicate matters of faith.
I admit the title of this video scared me a little bit. Heterodox do not seem to understand that there is only one Church "and you ain't in it" (to borrow from George Carlin)
The problem is that Protestants redefined the term "one holy Catholic and apostolic church" to mean all their separate sects. So when they recite the Nicene Creed they don't believe in it the same way we do. It's really just a rationalization.
"Redefined"; A common practice amongst protestants, communist, fascist, and the far left. 🤔
Well I certainly don't understand it. From what I can see, the rising hubris of the East and the West finally collided in 1054 AD to split the body of Christ right in two. You *were* one church, but then you excommunicated them and they excommunicated you.
* golf clap *
So yes, I absolutely have trouble understanding why the Eastern Orthodox have exclusive rights to being the "one true Church."
@@WilliamSwartzendruber because we trace lineage in a straight line to Christ Himself. no detours to Humbert, Calvin, Luther or any of the myriad of American 19th century heretics.
@@BaikalTii What in blazes do the Protestant reformers have to do with anything when I am talking about the Great Schism?
I love my Orthodox brothers and sisters. I love icons. I am not Orthodox.
You may be, in your heart! ❤
So, in the light of what you have said, could you explain the involvement of the Orthodox Church in the World Council of churches? Also, could not good ecumenism be that through dialogue we might find out that at least in some of the contentious areas we may be saying the same thing but using different language not readily understood by the "other?
You mean like how the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and *through* the Son? I can't believe the East and West haven't come together to agree on that after nearly a thousand years. Especially since most people in the Vatican seem to say that's what they really mean.
EDIT: The Anglican Church in North America has the *filioque* in brackets because these two haven't figured this out yet.
I think that would only apply to the nature of Christ dispute between eastern and oriental orthodox. There, it could be only a semantics issue.
@@WilliamSwartzendruber This was probably lurking in the back of my mind. More prominent was the miaphisyte, monophisyte, controversy that exists between the Orthodox and the oriental churches. Often even in non religious"family " fights what is said and what is really meant can be different in very subtle ways. My other observation is right now the Moscow patriarchate and the patriarchate of Constantinople are in "schism" from each other over procedural and authority issues so even agreement on theological issues is no guarantee of unity.
Has there ever been one actual good thing to ever come about from official talks with those groups outside the Church? Can't think of one.
Lots of free food maybe.
That is correct!!!😊
Can somebody tell me why Orthodox hierarchs, clergy and laity do not speak out against Patriarch Kirill supporting the war in Ukraine and ArchBishop Elpidophoros clear heresy?
Perhaps because Ukraine has been bombing and shelling its own citizens since 2014 and the UOC is under persecution by the state and the OCU. For many years, Ukraine was considered a global training center for neo na2is according to votes in the UN, Democrat Ro Kahanna, Chris Wray and others.
Sad situation that no one mentions the Minsk accords or that nothing was done on the lead up to 2022 by any global leader, but it gives $$$ for arms sales and is decimating the population of Ukraine.😢
I will not attempt to speak for “them.” (There is no “them.”) But first there have been. And second, you don’t hear Orthodox hierarchs often “speaking out” publicly on such things. Rest assured, letters have no doubt been sent. Expecting them to act like activists & such…well, it’s a category mistake. I’m making no accusation or defense. Just supplying my thoughts.
Because American Freemasons provoked him for years right next to the Russian border and then pointed the finger at him when he couldn't take their shenanigans anymore. Kyrill is a good Patriarch.
@@hutdweller7430 Freemasons in America are mostly old men. I’m not a defender, just want your energies to be rightly spent.
@@traceyedson9652However they are very powerful. Don’t underestimate them. Their tentacles have completely spread in every aspect of our life. In Schools, Churches and Governments of the world.
Isnt the top leader of the greek orthodox church in support of the bad ecunemism youre talking about?
Thanks but why is Rocor still in communion with MP Krill and still commemorating him if he is a full blown ecumenist?
Where's the proof of that allegation?
@@markeedeepruclips.net/video/JUFYnwAZg5w/видео.html
@markeedeep He signed the Havana declaration, which contained a paragraph where the MP and Rome mutually recognised each other's ordinations and legitimacy. You can find it yourself online. Moscow is also a member of the world Council of churches which puts them under the 1983 anathema against ecumenism.
@@aaronc44852 Recognising the existence of the Roman Catholic church makes sense, when you think about it. You cannot pretend that it does not exist, can you now?
@@markeedeep
This makes me so scared like im Catholic, Im scared I wont go to heaven for being in the wrong church idk im terrified
God is merciful above all else. I think the Orthodox Church is the true Church, but I hope that if I'm wrong and it was actually the Oriental Orthodox Church for some reason, that I can throw myself on the mercy of God for not knowing such a detail, as well as having no way to attend an Oriental Orthodox Church at all. We can only do what we can with the knowledge given to us. God knows that and no one is damned on a technicality. Everyone who is separated from the Body of Christ is so because they wanted to be separated.
Think of all the people in the middle ages post-schism who had no choice but to attend the Church they were near, whether Latin or Byzantine. Many people don't get a choice. Were the people in the Latin Church all damned because their leaders decided to schism? Or likewise for the Eastern Church, if the Latin Church is the True Church?
Now I don't want to give the impression that I don't think it matters or that truth is subjective. But all we can do is the best we can with the knowledge we have available. We ask God to have mercy on us. My hope is in the mercy of God, not on my own human reasoning to lead me to being "right".
begome
Thank you for this video Bishop, but in my potential hopeful naivety please hear me out:
Historically, relation with the Western Catholic church would make sense because pre-schism Roman practices are not too drastically varying from post schism - and developed naturally as did the Eastern practices. This is where there is a uniqueness to Eastern-Western Apostolic dialogue, so I don't know if we can clump all ecumenism eg. with the protestants as the same as with Apostolic churches that has prevailed from the beginning together (Romans, Assyrians, Greeks, Orientals). Additionally Eastern Rite Catholicism or Western Rite Orthodoxy where no unique liturgical or theological tradition is sacrificed for union, and the only honest qualms is Political not Theological- is a good sign that Apostolic Christianity is, as expected, compatible; if humility presents itself above the political desire for power
How can we deny the claim of any Apostolic church if they developed separately around the world, led by the Spirit of God to minister to the unique culture, language, and context of each region- with no serious theological dispute that cannot be solved with bishops sitting together and discussing the misunderstandings that led to imperfect communion in the first place. Is it not the prudential move then to bring together these bishops for clarification now that the political tensions have somewhat lessened? (except maybe in the Russian and Ukrainian churches)
The Roman Church invented many beliefs they call dogmas over the last 1000ish years, many seem related to the scholasticism which was developed in the west. These do not fit in with Orthodox beliefs, imho. Love ❤❤❤
@noway165 For you particularly- can you tell me what seems like an insolvable belief of the west? Because if we see how the Eastern Rite churches have been in communion with Rome- they didn't change their Orthodox or Eastern Theology to fit the western understanding (e.g. Eastern Catholics don't say the filioque in the creed, the use of leavened bread is continued, liturgy is continued, western Mariology and Purgatory is not something that's incompatible with our Eastern understanding either. A lot of the tension seems to be levering of politics in my opinion.
Seeing a church like the Melkites who are in common communion without sacrificing their unique tradition- shows me that the East and West can infact come together with a bit of humility on both sides
☦️☦️☦️
So are all Catholic and apostolic churches The Body of Christ? Or do you believe only your church is The Body?
Only Orthodoxy is the body of Christ. So no Catholics and protestants and even Orientals are not part of the Body of Christ. We don't believe in branch theory
Only the Eastern Orthodox Church communion.
@@nuns8126 NO sister you CAN NEVER SAY THAT
THAT IS ABSOLUTELY BLASPHEMOUS!!
LOOK AT INDIVIDUAL PEOPLE WE ATE AAAAALLLL SAVED BY JESUS CHRIST!!!!
Only Orthodoxy is The Body of Christ and his Church, and it is the only Catholic and Apostolic Church, those who apostatize from Orthodoxy forfeit the ability to be apostolic
@carlafowler6607 The truth hurts, doesn't it.
Okay, I get where you are coming from father but I have a serious question.
Some context first: There is this other bishop from an old (ie. pre-1917) Russian Orthodox Church whose church has now assumed the name "Genuine Orthodox Church". But comments are closed on his channel.
The church is somewhere in Colorado, iirc. So my question is: _If for any number of reasons I cannot visit Colorado, USA whether as permanent resident or simply on tourist visa, how in the world am I to be saved according to the canons of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church?_
Jesus is God, God is omnipotent and omnipresent, surely there must be some other way?
Our Lord had TWELVE Apostles, who journeyed to diverse places, planted churches and appointed bishops. Please, show me a way that is acceptable to your/GOC's narrow canon.
GOC is a fringe group and not the only possessors of grace on earth. Find a ROCOR church, or one they are in communion with, pray, and God will bring you wherever he needs you to be. Have faith 🙏
@@thehouseofcrumblingidols2694 Greek is _hard_ to learn, brother. Russian is a close second. 😑
I trust the God-given miracle of the incorruptible saints.
@@thehouseofcrumblingidols2694 Oh btw, to prevent any confusion:
Some pagan 'religions' eg. buddhism also lay claim to incorruptibility; perhaps God did work such a miracle to give them an example, or perhaps not (dangerous to speculate).
However, what we can say for certain is there exists the One True God, who lives forever and ever, and He commanded the Apostles to hear His Son, and the Son declared that He alone is the path to eternal life for mankind (Jn. 14:6).
Therefore as St. Paul taught, to those pagans who point to incorruptible signs of their false religions, we pronounce to them the name of the Son of the Living God, Jesus Christ, who was crucified for our sins and rose again from the dead. ✝️
With love, I feel Bishop Irenei is dealing with a strawman of sorts, in at least his suggestion that what can be called "ecumenism" is ipso facto an endeavor in compromise, sacrificing how we understand and are a part of the Church, and so on. For those who do that, then shame on them. My impression, however, is that among Orthodox, ecumenism relates to a witnessing of the true Church to others and nothing more. This witnessing may seem odd somehow when it's an Orthodox bishop and a Catholic bishop meeting to discuss Christianity, but how different is that from me speaking with a Catholic friend of mine about the truth of Orthodoxy, and not budging an inch? If I/we are instead dialoging with fellow Christians with an openness to compromise, then this isn't ecumenism, but sin.
He is using the phrase the way the saints use it, which is exactly what we want to see with our bishops! Using language the way saints do. See St Justin Popovich, St Paisios, St Iakovos, etc.
The problem is that ecumenism in the sense of compromise is exactly how it has been instantiated in history for the last century. While well-meaning Christians might use the terms innocuously to refer to friendly dialogue in order to understand similarities and differences between faiths, this isn't how it actually plays out at the cultural and institutional levels. Exhibit A is the Vatican II subversion of Roman Catholicism and the acceptance/promotion of indifferentism, which their Popes vociferously condemned prior to the 20th century.
At that levels it tends to subvert and destabilize institutions, usually as a means of furthering secular socio-political ends. Basically, ecumenism in the good sense essentially just reduces to apologetics, witnessing, having good-natured arguments, discussion etc; I don't see why we should tie ourselves to a notion that, outside of the context of private individuals trying to understand one another, has tended to do far more harm than good.
In my understanding, ecumenism is reached when the Sacraments are made equal for the various religions, and I agree, this is sin, because they cannot mean the same if the faith to support them is different. Catholics and protestants are ecumenical and Bautism and Marriage are accepted as equal. We needed to remarry after converting to Orthodoxy.
@@leopistis3560 That's fine, but context does matter. If people can't agree on a definition of terms, then strong arming a definition and ignoring how others are using words isn't helpful.
did you watch the video?
Throughout the world, only theTrue Greek Old Calender has preserved this Position,o other so called Orthodox Church do not honour the oneness of Christ and Church and instead adopt protestant branch theories in ecumenical meetings located in the Heathenistic nation Of Switzerland...
Can someone explain why would any Christian’s want separation between them? sounds like he’s saying that Orthodox are incapable of being wrong. And everyone must submit to them
Not trying to be a dick just genuinely asking
Well they can't all be right. There must be one truth, and there is only one Body of Christ. The Bible also says that the Holy Spirit will guide the Church into all truth. Someone has to have the truth, although others may have fragments of it. All truth is God's truth.
Jesus Christ is not orthodox , protestant or catholic . He is the almighty God , He will have mercy on whom he will have mercy+
Mercy for Orthodox is being united to the Church. This can be done in an extra normative way i.e. God’s will.
Let's not bicker between us and try to save the Jesus Hating Jews instead and maybe some Muslims also, they might be easier since they love Jesus as a prophet and do not think he was a Magician Con man who is boiling in a vat of feces and was never crucified and lets not even go to their (Jews) thoughts on Mary. As a Christian I am more concerned about their souls not the protestants or Catholics. Besides they would LOVE to divide us and destroy Christianity and they have been working on it. Check out Vatican 2 and their imput/demand on the changes and the Muslim response against the changes
You are absolutely correct. He is the Almighty God!
He only knows the hearts of men. However, He left us His Holy Word to follow.
He says: “He who loves Me follows My Word and its precepts.” And I will abide in Him.”
We must follow His Word to the fullest.
If we don’t confess, and don’t receive Him in Holy Communion and don’t love our neighbor, we don’t love Him. He also wants us to love His Holy Mother the Virgin Mary, and to honor His Saints.
5:42 I wonder why he stuck his hand under his shirt like that.
Ecumenism is maybe possible with Roman Catholic, but not with protestantism.
I'd disagree. Both are unapproachable for Orthodoxy.
They need to return on their own.
John 3:14 KJV "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the SON OF MAN (CHRIST) be lifted up:
15 That whosoever believes in HIM should not perish but have eternal life.
16 For GOD so loved the world, that HE gave HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON, that whosoever believes in HIM should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For GOD sent not HIS SON into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through HIM might be saved.
18 He that believes on HIM is not condemned: but he that believes not is condemned already, because he has not believed in the NAME of the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD."
36 He that believes on the SON has everlasting life: and he that believes not the SON shall not see life; but the wrath of GOD abides on him.
John 5:23 KJV “.......................... He that honors not the SON honors not the FATHER which has sent HIM. 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that hears MYWORD, and believes on HIM that sent ME, has everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Romans 8:1 KJV “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in CHRIST JESUS, who walk not after the flesh (works), but after the Spirit (grace).
Note: A true Christian is not condemned but has everlasting life therefore if you do not know where you will immediately go when you die then you deny what CHRIST said therefore you deny CHRIST.
The First and Only Trueth Christian faith and religion of the world is Greek Eastern Orthodox. Hallelujah and Amen. The Alpha and The Omega. O Xristos Nika.
GREEK EASTERN ORTHODOX "NOT" CATHOLIC. Thank you😊
☦️💒🙏✝️🇬🇷
Look at nicea. It states "catholic" church. We orthodox are truly catholic. We shouldn't reject that word
@@skeletalforce9673 I was born and baptised as a Greek Eastern Orthodox.
I am a practising Greek Orthodox.
NOT a practising Catholic.
GREEK.
GREEK ORTHODOX HAS 'NOTHING' TO DO WITH CATHOLIC. THEY ARE TWO VERY DIFFERENT FAITHS OF RELIGION THAT CARRY DIFFERENT BELIEFS WITH DIFFERENT PRACTICES.
Thank you.
Short answer: NO
The Catholic Church is also one holy Catholic and apostolic
Sorry, but there is only one.
@@panperl1212 yes, there is one but now they are two, remember that the first seven councils reached that the Church of Rome could not err, they relied on the church of Rome to teach the truth when the others were teaching heresy (Arianism, Nestorianism, Monotheletism, Iconoclasm)
@@andresmaynez3060 This is total BS. Take the First Council of Constantinople (second ecumenical council), where there was absolutely no papal representation. It seems the people did not believe that "the Church of Rome" could not err and was the measure of truth. How about pope Honorius? Why wouldn't this supposed papal infallibility, by the way, be one of the first things to be declared at an ecumenical council, if it were true and believed by the early Church? Wouldn't this save the Church a lot of disputes, settle so many debates with heretics and save so many souls? How about the admittedly faked papal documents regarding the eastern Church? How could there be two "One, true, holy, catholic and apostolic" Churches anyway? Do you imply Christ's body is divided? How would Peter being the rock mentioned by Christ lead to all the doctrines on papism anyway? How about Peter being rebuked by Paul at the Council of Jerusalem? Those are not even the theological disputes. We could go into the doctrine of Filioque, Absolute Divine Simplicity, the weird western 'saints' (explicitly the ones with sexual 'visions' of Christ), the contradictions between Vatican 1 and Vatican 2, the changing (and contradicting) political stances (for example in regards to the death penalty, or the modernist stances), the weird church practices (for example the clown mass) or ecumenism. Not saying that orthodox bishops or clergy in general is perfect, because they are surely not, but we do not claim they are infallible, nor do we rely on them being so, just as the pope once was a member of the orthodox Church until he fell off (for mostly political reasons).
Because I Do Believe In One, Holy, Eastern Orthodox Catholic and Apostolic Church, Established AD 33 By Our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, I Cannot Subscribe to A " Good Ecumenicalism." AXIOS ☦️ 🕊 🕯 🙏 📿 ☦️ ⛪️‼️
Did you watch the video?
@feeble-stirrings : Absolutely. I Post My Comment Exactly After Watching The Entire Video and I Still Don't Subscribe to Such Fantasy As A " Good Ecumenicalism." Good Night From Anderson ( Anderson County), South Carolina, The United States of America ( USA).
@@MartyRodriguezOrthodoxMarine
In this one sense ecumenism means for the Orthodox only missionary witnessing. Proselytizing is not the purpose. We witness to the FULLNESS of the Orthodox church.
@nuns8126 : I'm Going To Have To Let You Please Explain The Reasoning of Your Comment As There's A Bit of Confusion Regarding Your Uses of The Terms " Missionary " and " Proselytizing."
If you can’t subscribe to what he said about good ecumenism, then you’re not subscribing to St. Justin Popovich’s own views about ecumenism. He says the same things if you read through his book Notes on Ecumenism. Ecumenism, as defined by a saint, is good if what is meant is that we go work to bring other Christians to unity in the one Church. You
might want to quibble with “why use this word then?” but you’d have to ask St. Justin and others that.
It doesn't exist.
Greetings 🙏🏻
However this doesn't justify your common prayers with ecumenists. Your participation at the world council of Churches is rebuked in the cannons of the Churh. Not to mention the way you entered the Moscow Patriarcate was not that demanded by Saint Philaret and the others Rocor authorities.
The Church of Christ is One yes but in truth and in love. Not in communion with heresy. +++
Submit to Rome ❤
Amen. Without the Bishop of Rome, you lack the Rock of the Church
Submit to Christ.
We do, you have separated yourself from the bride of Christ. Return to to communion with God's Church. Submit to Rome
That was tactful. NOT. Until Rome goes back to our mutual Traditions and stops dropping Jesus body on the floor at communion all the time, that will be tough but I do pray that God finds a way to Unite us again. The Lord has commanded the Bishops to pick ONE date for the Paschal Celebration, but they won't do it until Rome's act is together together.
Your patriarchs keep breaking communion with each other, and our act isn't together? We are the unified ones, with clear hierarchy and authority.
No.
Respectfully, I love the Orthodox church and my brothers there in. However Imagine standing in front of Christ and denying to him which he greatly desires his bride which much IS simply his believers. The work of the Holy Spirit is not just tradition but the work of the Holy Spirit IS the Holy Spirit. And there is great evidence of the holy port moving radically in the Protestants church just as much as the Orthodox Church because it turns out. Christ comes where he’s wanted not where there is prefect theology.
This a false gospel video and has NOTHIng To do with the gospel and the early church respectfully and lovingly.
God calls each of us to the truth in unique ways. I can say that there is grace to be found in the Orthodox Church. The Orthodox Church truly is living and timeless. As evident by the church fathers of yesterday and today. And tomorrow there will be a new generation. The Protestant church branch (catholic) exists as a body separated. As do all of the derivatives which never came back to the church of the first 1000 years. During the first 1000 years there was only one church. One was either a part of it or not as a Christian. Anyways God calls each of us to the truth. And there are good people in the west whom are a part of separated bodies as father confirms here. But they are missing the wholeness of the Orthodox Church as father states. As a convert myself, I can attest that it was the single best decision in my life converting in 20s. I pray for your journey and that you can find the truth mate.
Life and history of Orthodox Church is proof that Orthodox church is the Church.
Untouched and unspoiled teaching and not just teaching, but the power of faith.
Orthodox church have millions martyrs, saints, and other heroes of Holy Spirit.
Complete grace, thuth, wisdom, experience of Apostles, Holy Fathers of Church, asceticism of Desert Fathers are within Orthodoxy.
Roman Catholicism had everything of that until Roman Pontifex decide to rule alone with Church, above other Patriarchates.
Martin Luther has been notice corruption of Rome and decide to abandon that heresy, but he went in wrong direction.
Religious leaders and their funny hats, what's with that 🤷
We dont innovate, not even with hats. Personally I think the hats are awesome.
@haydeen6535 I know you don't innovate , one of the reasons I walked away from the faith many years ago, but the hats whilst I guess I can see design, possibly some kinda odd sense of style but I don't get their worth, they're generally not very sun smart or overly warming, so I'm kinda stuck on their purpose, like jesus has never been depicted wearing a hat and he didn't have a comfy church to protect him from the elements, he apparently preached outside with no hat 🤷
Tradition and there's nothing wrong with it.
@WilliamSwartzendruber nothing wrong I guess it just looks a bit silly 🤷
I would ask God why he instructed the Jewish priests to wear specific clothing, including unique hats alongside a specific way to worship. This can also be found in the Old Testament.
God bless you forever
CHRIST IS KING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thank you!