What If Everything Went PERFECT for the Habsburgs
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- Опубликовано: 2 июн 2024
- #possiblehistory #ph
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I’ve said this before but I think he should make a “What if Everything went wrong for *Insert Country*” basically a reverse of Perfect Countries
That's a pretty good idea
Poland: Get’s invaded by the Nazis and get wiped out. Russia: Get’s wiped out by the Nazis and Japanese. USA: never exists.
thats a good idea👍
What if everything went wrong for the United States of fucking America
Literally me
The true irony of the Hohenzollern and Habsburg rivalry is that when the two were minor swabian lords, it was the Hohenzollerns who pushed for Habsburg control of the HRE and helped put them in Austria. Later, it was the Habsburgs who put the Hohenzollerns in Brandenburg.
Just imagine the two houses remaining friends despite the Reformation.
Also, their empires ended together, in ww1
@@gustavotreze3193 technically the Habsburg were already exinct by then, and their states and titles were inherited by the House of Lorraine.
@@barrankobama4840 yes, i know, but the house of Lorraine (or Habsburg-Lorraine) is a branch of the house of habsburg, so for me is a continuation. For me
@@gustavotreze3193 But strictly technically Habsburg-Lorraine is a branch (and the only now surviving) of the House of Lorraine, not the House of Habsburg, since they descend from Francis of Lorraine and Maria Theresa of Habsburg. For Salic law, used by nobility in the HRE, the House is defined by male-line only.
Another curiosity is that the current King of the UK, Charles III, would be technically be part of the House of Oldenburg, not Saxe-Coburg-Gotha nor Mountbatten/Battenberg (but this does not matter anymore, since George the V renounced any title of German origin).
This would be an interesting althistory scenerio, What if the Hohenzollern and Habsburgs united?
This is a really interesting concept because you could say that some of this might've happened realistically
I guess you could say it’s possible history
@@profilepicture828HE SAID THE THING
@@profilepicture828 roll credits
4:08 This is FALSE, Spain never had this social pyramid
@@user-zn2gb4uh1hthey did have it in the new world colonies, and it actually was way more complex than what is presented, with all the different "casts"
I would add the French throne to the Habsburgs. Charles V. with HRE and Spain surrounded France, and he claimed the French throne.
In our timeline, the nobles gave the crown to Henric IV because they were afraid of Charles. If we are talking about the perfect Habsburg timeline, we should consider this option
Not to mention Mary I of England still officially claimed the French throne.
4:08 This is FALSE, Spain never had this social pyramid
@@user-zn2gb4uh1h Spain itself did not. However thee colonies in America (mostly) did there is alot of proof.
This wont decide feudalism problem. If current king dies, would the French nobles give the crown to next Habsburg?
@@alexzero3736 Probabaly no since...it would give them more power and also.
Perfect Habsburgs = No imbreeding
Really?
Be honest, no you aren’t.
Incest is wincest
You can’t have one without the other
Can’t hate what you haven’t tried bro
Alternate title: average EU4 austrian game
*Spain
3:38 Hardly.
If that were true, Peninsular Spain would've taken much more resources from their viceroyalties, when in reality, they only took around 20% (known as the Royal Fifth tax)
80% of the wealth extracted from the Americas stayed here to develop the viceroyalties. That's why we see the creation of many universities, hospitals, churches, etc. In fact, the whole reason they're called "viceroyalties" is because they have the same status as any other province in Peninsular Spain.
Thank God I'm not the only one talking about this topic in the comments
@@mqdboy9278Es una suerte que la información cada día más sea más accesible y que mucha más gente la conozca
That was the tax for private mines, the most productive mines were exclusive for the crown (see Potosí), moreover there were much more taxes than just those applied to mining. Si nuestros virreinatos tuviesen el mismo estatus que la España peninsular, no habría una diferencia entre criollos y peninsulares.
Based
@@mojave3571So, you're saying that everything extracted from the Potosí mines was transported to Peninsular Spain? Can you show a source for that? Because I didn't find any.
Also, the status of the different subdivisions has little to do with political privileges in the empire. Blacks in southern USA were still slaves despite Texas being as much of a state as New Jersey.
0:12 he really named ottomans fake-Rome💀💀💀
Its what they were
As an English person, having a potential hapsburg monarch is really weird to me. I love Habsburg Austria.
Why do you spell it with a P? I thought that was American
@@42carlos its habsburg regardless of dialect
Just corrected it, but I always heard it with a P.
@@solelak the b is pronounce hard, probably because there is an s afterwards
@@trollinape2697There are old spellings with a p, but yes it should be with a b now.
Something I should add is that the caste system was not implemented at the time of the Habsburgs, the Spanish population in the Americas was so small that implementing that would be suicide.
During that time, mainly in the territory of New Spain and Peru, there were a large number of indigenous nobles and then mestizos since they were the ones who could effectively maintain Spanish control.
Of course, the different races were separated into natives, Spanish or mestizos, but that classification was because the indigenous could not be judged by the inquisition.
It was not until the Bourbon reforms where peninsular Spanish began to gain more power in the viceroyalties in the context of the Bourbon reforms in order to centralize the power of the viceroyalties and make the exploitation of resources more efficient, that is when there was a real separation of power with the peninsulars and Creoles and mestizos.
Interesting. Why couldn't an indigenous individual be tried by the inquisition? Did it have to do with the fact that the inquisition was mainly run by Dominicans while the natives were evangelized primarily by the (highly autonomous, answering only to the superior general and the Pope) Jesuits?
@@-Justinus- The inquisition was created to deal primarily with heresies such as Protestantism and false converts. The indigenous peoples were classified as pagans who must be evangelized and taught about the teachings of Jesus, so the inquisition had no jurisdiction over them, much more so when indigenous beliefs were not a threat to the beliefs of Catholicism. For example, there was a fear that Protestantism would expand in Spain, but there was no such fear with indigenous religions because it was impossible for them to expand their religion among the Christian population of Europe.
FR I was about to say this, cant believe what the Dutch did to the reputation of a great empire.
@@Karlos-if9dd as a spanniard myself i appreciate your words pal 🗿🗿🗿🗿
Video idea: What if everything went perfect for the Commonwealth (Poland)
Whenever I think of it, I come to the conclusion that... there would be no Commonwealth. It came out of a personal union with Lithuania, and that from having a Lithuanian grand duke marry the then ruling queen (formally king) of Poland, which was the indirect result of Casimir the Great having no legitimate heirs. That's the primordial root of the Commonwealth and... the issues that were its ultimate downfall, that being the near omnipotence of the nobility and the unstable political system prone to outside influence. See, to be crowned as rulers of Poland all the kings (and queens) after Casimir the Great had to convince the nobility - as they were no longer of the original Piast dynasty (I feel like this was just an excuse for the nobility to push for power) - and that convincing usually came down to giving more and more privileges, to the point at which the king was just a little bit more than a figurehead and the parliament could be paralysed by just ONE random noble.
russia and germany would be gone
I think best thing Comonwealth could do was even earlier democratization, so Comonwelth would be first nation with Constitution, as early as first half of XVIII century that asort Monarchist Comonwelth tradition in futher democratic states, like freedom of religion, culture acceptance and voting system created for nobles titled, that could be every rich person. Farmers under Nobility should be realeased from slavery work, Citizen would grow in importance. This fiew changes would create better Poland than between world wars already, but that's not enought.
Poland was very poor diplomatically and military, so main goals would be funding military based on constitution not feudalism and stick with Alliance with Habsburg Austria that share many enemies with.
This is important to prevent partition of Poland in XVIII century, allowing Comonwealth to step into Industralization Wit other west European powers in futher.
And most important period. Semi democratic-Semi Monarchist Comonwealth would had great chances siding with French in Napoleonic wars, but only after Austria surendered and allied France, then Poland would keep up in Team with Austria without standing aside France.
Next Poland would be more than eager to help France in Russian campaign on Moskva and Petersburg efectively giving win to French Empire.
I don't know what would happen next but Poland would be strong member of new huge European Alliance with repeared most of they're issues, promising futher within industralization age and building base for democratic state that would probably acure in 1848/9.
Bro stop forgeting Lithuanna
What about Margaret of Austria, the daughter of Maxmillian 2. She was engaged to the French king before the engagement was annulled for a France- Brittany union. She also ruled the Netherlands on her father’s , and later her brother’s (Charles) behalf, she was incredibly successful and is probably one of the main reasons for the Dutch patrotism in wanting independence from the Habsburgs.
Also what if Henry the 8 wasn’t able to divorce Catherine, meaning the England would remain Catholic.
Her brother was Phillip the Handsome. That was her nephew you're talking about.
This video is great! But there is something I wanted to point out:
It is highly contested that there was a cast system in the Spanish colonies in the americas.
Obiously the system was far from being a multicultural paradise, and the etnicities weren't exactly equal, but a cast system is where someone born in a specific cast can't ever move from that cast, he can only have jobs and marry people in that exact cast.
This wasn't the case in the spanish colonies, since anyone could marry and have childs with any other ernicity, which is the case form mestizos (spanish+natives) and Mulatos (spanish+africans) and natives+africans as well, and all of them could set their life goals independently of their origin (another question would be how succesful they would be).
So basically the spanish barely segregated anyone for etnicity, the only question was on being catholic, where the spanish were highly strict on that. I really don't know where that pyramid was taken from.
Yo creo que la pirámide más bien representa la posibilidad de obtener poder político, pero si no es eso, la pirámide se convierte en básicamente una mentira historia :/
@Ajolote_comunista I think this is accurate, because I've been taught this as well since the colonial period is an important part of our history. The pyramid clearly points to something being true, especially since one of the broader contexts of that pyramid being that the Spanish born got to rule, but no mention of social mobility or economic outcomes really were discussed.
@@buddermonger2000 you are not wrong that the pyramid points to something true.
The vice kings of the spanish colonies were appointed by the king of Spain, and they were people from noble peninsular families close to the crown.
Even thought the different etnicities in the spanish americas weren't economically equal, there are cases of mestizos, natives and some blacks becoming richer than a lot of whites, the pyramid could probably be an average of those etnicities, but never a segregation by law.
@@goosermr6036 Perhaps segregation by political power, even if not economic power
The pyramid is a weird mix of social class and caste that existed in the Americas, for example there were native and black landlords, nobles and in the urban middle classes you could find people of all different castes. As castes were not considered a way to classify people in the social pyramid but as a way of racial categorization.
Another point to make is that the distinction between the peninsulares and criollos didnt became a thing till the Bourbons reforms.
Thank you PB! There's a really interesting history series about the Austrian Habsburgs that Schwerpunkt just begun I'm sure many of you guys may be interested in
*PH
0:11 bro has beef with the ottomans 😂
4:25 this is totally wrong. No criollo, mestizo or native wanted to get out of the Empire until the military juntas made to assist Fernando VII decided to change course.
Natives, mestizos, Criollos and chapetones (Spanish) had all same rights, of course you'll see politicians are mostly Criollos and Spanish, but in question if rights all same, and in terms of money, natives could reach the same as Criollos. Native nobility was even more prestigious than the Spanish, as Panacas and chiefs played THE role in setting up the governance of the empire.
🧐👍
I want to point out that normally viceroys were white because they were people the king trusted, and the king was not in America, so the people he trusted were not from there because he did not personally know the people of america
Fun Fact: the very pronounced Habsburg chin was not a result of inbreeding, it apparently comes from a great grandmother of Charles V, long before the severe inbreeding started. It was simply an actual feature of a person that was heritable, and the inbreeding simply made it far more extreme.
Thank you for the fun fact Demiurge.
that's exactly how inbreeding works. it's not that weird genes suddenly appear, it's that present genes have more possibilities of showing when both parents are related
@@diprogamer3294it becomes more blatant that the individual is lacking a few chromosomes
@@screamingseal4805turner syndrome looks pretty normal ngl
@@screamingseal4805turner syndrome looks pretty normal ngl
The Ending of this Perfect Habsburg run turns out to be one perfect recipe for Dynastic Disasters, unless the family will eventually negotiate their way around to form a Balance of Habsburgs and solve these dynastic disputes.
Similar as when Louis XIV had to haggle with William of Orange for the fate of Spain, and thus the Balance of European Powers as a whole, but at the demise of envious Habsburg rival houses
just mandate every habsburg have 12+ children, can't have sucession disputes if there is a clear line of succession.
6:16 showing ur next planned videos (and them being interesting too) is a rly good argument to convince one to subscribe. smart. if u came up w/ this, hats off.
Finally! As an Austrian, I've been waiting so long for this video! AEIOU!
After Charles V things were still fine for Habsburgs. What really ended their power was the Thirty Years War.
If the threat of infighting between the different empires was that real, inbreeding was no stranger to this dynasty.
I’d love to see a what if everything went perfect for Sweden or Denmark. Both had maximum expansions (Baltics, Britain, etc) that were unrealistic for them to hold, so I’d be interested to see how they either figure out how to keep them or get the best deal out of losing them.
What if Spain never declined as a superpower
This is kind of that
@@tsaralexis9459kind of, but not really that though, that would be a continuation of this, since it is, never declined, and specifically Spain.
Not really possible, they didn’t have the population or industrial capacity to compete with the French, British, and Germans.
@@sct1718 yes but it would feel kind of repetitive
@@tsaralexis9459 wrong
As a Dutchman I'd always like to imagine we wouldn't have revolted, or at least to a lesser extend, if we stayed with the Austrian Habsburgs instead of Spanish Habsburgs, I always found it strange that we're not a part of Germany, or an alternate Austrian Germany
The spanish heritage of lowlands was the worst idea of Carlos V, just doesn't make sense that territory, Philip II should only kept spain and Italy claims.
You don't know how much i've been waiting for this one.
Correction: Spain didn't have colonies. They extracted resources from America of course, but it wasn't an old fashion colonial empire like the English, French, Dutch, Portuguese, etc. Spanish America was a continuation of Spain, just in another continent. Most wealth that Spain had gotten wasn't from extraction but from taxes and trade with the Chinese; the Spanish Real de a ocho was the first global currency and because it was made from silver (something Spain extracted a lot), Spain had basically a monopoly on China.
technically speaking that is what an old fashioned colonial empire is (and what the English colonies were orginally too). colonies not being extensions of the home country in a new location is a newer form of colonialism.
Yeah I completely agree, English speaking history videos should give more research to Hispanic historians
@@matthiuskoenig3378well more even technically speaking these first “colonial empire” wasn’t really a colonial empire so the future ways of colonialism that the Uk, the Dutch, the French and Germans brought, for today are old-fashion, so that’s what I think he is referring.
@@matthiuskoenig3378also the first English colonies weren’t nothing like the Spanish/Castilian ones, because they were mostly just companies that extracted resources.
@@matthiuskoenig3378 Yeah but that really isn't considered colonialism, it's more like integration/expansion
Yay 😁
I’ve been eagerly waiting for this one
PH, in my opinion, this video is way too short.
Given the Habsburgs had such a massive (even recognized by you) potential, I think there could be more nuance as in previous videos you've made. In this new video, you could expand on relationships within the mentioned possible Habsburg Federation, and its neighbors, and also implications for what a lasting HF would mean for the rest of the world.
That said, I did enjoy your video, and thank you for it.
Yeah I think he should have shown multiple timelines, showing how different marriages and wars could lead to completely separate outcomes.
I was thinking of this alt history for a while so I'm happy you made it.
"What if everything went perfect for the Jagielons"
YESS can you plz more of these videos? They are really entertaining
Would love to see another vid on this scenario about a future Habsburg Civil War/Succession Crisis
A small addition to the caste pyramid of the viceroyalties of Spain, the caste system was implemented for legal uses, but even so it was very possible to rise in social class, if a mestizo married a Creole or Spanish woman, he rose in rank. pyramid and was considered peninsular or Spanish. It was not a perse caste system like in India.
What if the Arab Invasions never happened.
Thanks for another great video your quality gets better every video!❤
Small error, but the counterreformation was a lot more than “an attempt”. It was a largely successful effort to stop protestant expansion and turn the tides. Before the counterreformation, almost all of germany, france and hungary, all of bohemia, and a good chunk of the Austria and the lowlands were all some branch of protestant. Directly after, France, Hungary, Austria and Bohemia were almost completely brought back into the fold, along with ~half of germany and the lowlands.
Starting at an earlier point would have allowed for the mariage between Anne of Britanny and the hasburgs, which was envisioned at the time, and would add britanny to the hasburg realm, thus thightening the noose around France further
Please, oh Please make a part 2! This scenario is just too good!
Yes
Thank you so much. Finally.
YES! Been waiting and asking for this one for so long! Thanks man! AEIOU!🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
FINALLY thank you man🎉
This guy is one my new favourite RUclipsrs.
The Habsburgs would definitely need to not be in massive debt
This video actually changed my life for the better
This cuold be the best video of this Series
What if everything went perfect for Poland
I like the guitars kicking up :) and it is wear hearing about a European dynasty since I haven't heard of it in recent years, only a Chinese one. But it is very interesting.... :)
And I do like the Idea of Spain taking north africa/Italy....... :)
Great Poland, great video.
THANK YOU
Another great video!
You should do a "what if everything went perfect for hungary" since they lost almost all major wars they were in IRL
I actually love this
I have been asking since the beginning of the series, can you please make a perfect modern Greece video. 🙏
I was waiting for this one, its gonna be 🔥 🔥 🔥
8:20 Now I want to see “What if everything went perfect for Poland” video.
Love this video! Have been wanting this one for a long time. Quick idea, though, could you do a, What If Everything went perfect for France. You don’t have to do it, just a suggestion.
seeing a habsburg family feud turn into this worlds "ww0" like our worlds 7 years war is a cool idea
I SUBSCRIBED
Very cool video, I like it, and avocado
The best part was the Smash Music in the background
You should make a continuation video that focuses around a few of the potential habsburg wars
Please make a perfect Italy 🇮🇹 Also, amazing video btw!
The spanish armada didn't sank only a few ships did, they had to retreat due to severe weather conditions, not a minor difference.
Having the english throne secured, France could be defeated easy with a three front war against major powers, and then splitted totally.
Austria only had to hold the ground until france disappeared and then it was all united europe against ottomans, they could be defeated with not so many complications in the balkans, and at minimum be pushed into anatolia, recovering constantinople.
At this point, the only expansion ways were the east med, probably best the approach would be splitting half south west med (mauritania and tunis) for spain, and eastern (egypt, syria and anatolia) for a new family kindom based at constantinople.
Once stable, the whole world would be at their reach to take.
The Super Smash Bros Brawl music toward the end is absolutely perfect *chef's kiss*
"habsburg circlejerk" is two words i never wanted to hear together, but here they are
Nice video idea, now make perfect Jagiellons
The Berlin conference went so badly he just decided not to make a vid bout that 😭💀
I know this has nothing to do with the vid but,; when are u gonna make that alt Berlin conference vid? It’s been a while and we haven’t gotten any updates on it.
Do “what if everything went perfect for the Byzantine Empire.”
The perfect timeline
I'd love a video something like "What if everything went PERFECT for the Native Americans"
I wonder if it'd be possible for a few nations there to remain for a long time
What does it mean “native americans”? You’re saying it as if there weren’t thousands of diferent peoples with different cultures and many times fighting between each other. The only way they were united under a single throne was via spanish goverment.
@@arriba_teruel No, i know that.
I meant for all the larger native american nations to do as well as they could have, maybe having a few of them even survive to the modern day
Black legend, spanish America was even more developed than the península itself
the faint smash bros music in the background is too well fitting lmao
I’d like to see a part 2 to this where the Habsburgs fall.
I like how he referred the ottomans as fake Rome
What if Austria wasn't chocolate?
The Oñate treaty was not mentioned once and I was left somehow disappointed. That thing menaced to tear apart the Habsburgs even before the Thirty Years' War.
Please, PLEASE do a "What if everything went perfect for Japan" one next
Family Fued: Ultimate Edition
Big Poland! After that, the Polish attack the Habsburgs to form Zapadoslavia! Venice would form Yugoslavia. The Ottoman Empire would form Vostokoslavia! Least cursed timeline! 😂
Great video btw!
I'm still waiting for that What if Germany Never United? video.
Very good video. Can you do a what if everything went perfect for the ottomans.
0:20 their mommy says its a strong chin for strong boys!
Oversimplified Reference
Can you do perfect for scotland next?
If we're talking about perfect timeline Habsburgs should split France north south, Spanish annexing south, anglo-dutch north, Poles talking Pomerania and Neumark, while Austria annexes Venice and occupies Romania and Balkans.
Nice
Love this, As the Hasburg are large, they are still not secure after all of this time. On top... For now...
You should do a video about Hungary next in the series.
Pls make a Venice one
what if the habsburgs had a normal chin?
🤔
We need an Ottoman one now
What is all that " giving the Netherlands to a Habsburg England " about ? Where I can get information avout that ?
The Habsburgs would never countenance conversion to orthodoxy but reunion maybe.
11:50 Nahh, nothing bad ever happens to the Habsburgs
Habsburg england sounds like a fever dream
Please do one of these for the British Empire x
Awesome video.
Where do you find all of these maps I look for one by 1789 but there’s nothing
One thing you could do is expand the Hasburgs into France. The Kings of England maintained a claim to the French throne till 1800. In this TL Mary I and her Habsburg children would inherit that claim so during the War a Hasburg claimant from the English line could be installed in France.
I understand that may be unrealistic but after that war who’s going to stop them ?
As a Spaniard I must say that the perspective of the Spanish hasburg part of the realm is quite wrong.
Not only the territories in America WEREN’T colonies because they WEREN’T treat as a “resource extractor territory”, but they languages, traditions and cultures were taken highly in consideration by building schools, universities, cities…etc.
Besides, the idea that the viceroyalties had a “caste system” is simply an erroneous lie created by the precursors of the Black legend.
PD: I love your content pls don’t say again those lies pls give it a little bit of research to Hispanic historians.
Algo que agregar que los virreinatos eran bastante comunes en España, ya que también existían virreinatos en la España peninsular, lo que provoca que los territorios españoles en América no sean colonias sino provincias de ultramar
@@Ajolote_comunista por no mencionar que las dinastías Maya e Inca no se consideraron extintas ni reemplazadas sino continuadas por los consecuentes reyes del imperio. Mostrando una verdadera y pura intención de fusión de las sociedades.
Not to mention that the Mayan and Inca dynasties were not considered extinct or replaced but continued by the subsequent kings of the empire. Showing a true and pure intention to merge the societies.