Lucky Gunner has consistently had some of the most thoughtful video and online articles. Even before Chris and their specific RUclips channel, they had Andrew Tuohy (Vurwappen Blog) and others doing great writing and testing.
Btw, I'd like to praise the consistency of the shooting between firearms. Those comparative double taps between the Beretta 80X and the P365XL were so consistent that they had almost identical split times. It was truly a genuine and consistent comparison, and I'll say it, exceptionally beautiful cinematography.
Would be cool to see some comparison between the Browning/1911 tilting barrel, Walther P38/Beretta 92 falling locking block, and Beretta PX4 rotating barrel systems!
For as much praise as it gets, I'm not impressed with the Beretta 92's locking system. It feels snappy to me. It doesn't help that I don't really like the grip.
That is a great idea. I regretted not filming the PX4 as soon as we wrapped up. I also have several other pistols already filmed that were not used in this video. I'm not sure if there's enough to discuss for a full video, so I might release them as Shorts
An important difference missed here between the blowback operation and locked-block operation in terms of felt-recoil, muzzle-rise and impulse is the direction of force vectors. In the blowback design, the force vector remains equal and opposite of projectile launch until the very end of slide-travel, at which point the force is transferred to the frame, which held by a secure grip, results in the pronounced "snappy" recoil impulse because all that force acts at (for the sake of argument) "90 degrees" to your grip and at the last minute. Contrasted with the locked block design, not only is the slide slowed by the unlocking of the barrel (the "push" feeling) when the barrel first unlocks, it drops (for the sake of argument) "30 degrees," it then continues in rear/downward motion alongside the slide for a period of time till stopped by the locking block. This force, enacted earlier in the sequence than the blowback design, is delivering a recoil force vector at (for the sake of argument) "120 degrees" aka diagonally towards your wrist, more "inline" with your body structure. The remaining force (less now, because of EQUAL and opposite) is then delivered similar to the blowback at "90 degrees" (with say a 1in moment arm, or whatever bore over grip measurement of your gun) and results in less "snappy" muzzle flip. All that to say more concisely, a force vector is applied earlier in the sequence that is more inline with your grip causing less of a moment (rotational force) when the barrel stops. That results in less of an opposite projectile force vector, which results in less of a moment at slide-stop.
I know I'm splitting hairs here, but I think it's fun and educational and thus fits the purpose of your channel. Re-watching your comments on the topic, you pretty much covered it with your statement that the locked-block cycle "spreads the recoil over a period of time" rather than the "all at once" experience of the blowback design. However earlier in your description of the locked-block you described the slowing of the slide speed in the unlocking process resulting in "less force," which isn't quite true as Newton's "equal and opposite" law mandates that the recoil "force" experienced between the two pistols is the same (as long as it's the same ammo and same barrel length, which they are). It's instead that the recoil force is delivered incrementally to the shooter in approximately 3 semi-distinct points "spread out over a period of time:" 1) the "push" of the initially locked-breech, 2) the rear/rotational stop of the barrel by the locking block and 3) the "snap" of slide-stop. Same force, just delivered in smaller portions incrementally over time. Awesome thought experiment, awesome video, ton of fun thinking about the subject! Cheers!
I think I could watch slow motion videos of auto pistols in action till the cows come home. Being able to see how the mechanics work is mesmerizing to me. Hopefully, you can share different firearms and how they work in the future! The only thing better than the content is the way their shipping/handling works when ordering products. Much better than the competition!
Great video, love the high speed footage! For anyone interested, in a lot of these comparisons, the relevant physics concept is called impulse. For two guns imparting the same amount of energy on the hand gripping it, the gun that does it in a lower amount of time, i.e. faster, is said to have a lower impulse, and will be felt as snappier recoil.
The high-speed camera is a great tool. Watching the guns in recoil, the little quirk differences between guns is explained. Some guns feel better than others and the .380 is almost nobodies first choice. Would be fascinating to see video comparing the 9x17 (.380) versus a 9x18 Makarov in blow back pistols. Have heard more than one shooter say the Makarov is downright hard to shoot well, and I agree.
@@Gieszkanne No they don’t. Over penetration is sort of a meme anyways. It makes headlines in low income areas inhabited by people with no self control and 50 round drums. Civilized men don’t spray and pray.
@@Gieszkanne Power is not the issue. Bare minimum for “one shot power” is duty grade ammo in duty sized 9mm or greater. For everything else, landing two shots is recommended. Therefore, as long as it penetrates enough, it’s fair game to use it.
Cool videos. The main difference between the locked system and the blowback is that the recoil impulse on the former is spread over two impulses. It unlocks when the barrel strikes the retention pin unlocking it which transfers some of the momentum to the shooter's grip with the remainder being delivered when the hits the slide stop. With a blowback all of the momentum is transferred with one bigger impulse at the end of the slide travel. Since the slide of the blowback has more momentum on the way back, it bounces faster and closes sooner. Note also that a locked pistol starts rising sooner because of that first barrel impulse. Also interesting in watching the blowback how the force from the recoil spring has negligible effect in inducing muzzle climb. One wonders if a stiffer spring would be better in terms of reducing felt recoil, though maybe that would negatively affect the reliability of the gun.
Maybe, but I think Beretta went as light as they could on the spring to allow their intended target consumers - women and the recoil sensitive- to still be able to rack the slide. I'm neither but I love that little gun.
This video is the most interesting of all the RUclips videos out there. Nobody but Lucky Gunner is making a video like this. Chris has made it so interesting with the slow mo video. That I'm starting to geek out. Now I'm totally into this. I own lock up and blow back and now I'm indurstanding the difference. Thanks Chris for being so different in a good way😊
I have always appreciated the subject matter, content quality and of course the knowledgeable information on Chris's presentations. High quality slo-mo camera work is an added plus. Always look forward to your videos. Thanks.
Great to see the P365 380 back on the channel for analysis. Would love to hear an updated review! With comparison to Ruger Security 380 would be even better.
Here's yet another informative, interesting, and well produced video from Lucky Gunner! As the video wonderfully illustrates, there are reasons for different recoil impulses based on physics. However, I suspect that individual preferences are still fairly subjective. For example, I don't believe bore axis as a single determinant makes as big of a difference as some people imagine. Also, while impossible to quantify on high-speed cameras, sociological factors such as brand loyalty, cachet of ownership, historical reputation, and marketing may play a role in perceived shootability of a specific firearm. It's a fascinating subject and underscores the idea that firearms evoke unique characteristics of consumer behavior compared to other durable goods.
Yeah, bore axis is heavily over-rated as a factor in determining a gun's "shootability." It does help to explain the revolver-semi-auto recoil disparity, but from one auto to another, it's close to the bottom of the list of variables that matter.
Excellent video. I’m reminded of my favorite quote regarding recoil management from Aaron Cowan: “Yes, I’m going to put a compensator on a 9mm pistol. Why? Because recoil is stupid, and we shouldn’t do it anymore.” For practical use/self defense pistols, anything that gets as close to eliminating the recoil and muzzle flip of the pistol entirely is desirable to me
As always, the clearest, most concise, readily understandable information. I had been looking for some time for a piece on recoil that puts it alotogether. This is that piece. There should be a Lucky Gunner library.👍👍👍
Nice analisis! I am a mechanical engineer an gun nut, but this video showed me a thing I didnt realized until now that I ve seen it: the role of the barrell hitting the slide during recoil. Thank you for that.
Great video, I was really hoping to see the PX4 out again and see how different it responded to recoil and muzzle flip with the rotating barrel. Maybe next time
Honestly this explained a ton to me, and why I like revolvers. I think maybe I’m just over correcting when I try to shoot some semi autos fast and I tend to hit lower on the target, where I can shoot revolvers more accurately relatively quickly, even though I’m well aware of the increased felt recoil and muzzle rise. Think I need to practice letting the slide returning and my grip do the work a bit more vs “pushing” like I instinctively do with a revolver to get faster followups
Very interesting! I missed the rotationg barrel. Nowadays people want flat shooting pistols. But if the pistols shoots flatter the energy goes more stright in the hand. And there if the grip ergos dont suit your hand, this could get even very uncomfortable. I think the H&K P7 has the flattest bore axis and is the most flat shooting pistol but the grip ergos are bad for my hand. Even so its only 9mm it was the most unpleadand handgun I have ever shot. And I even expierenced 44 Mag and 50AE.
Chris, I really would’ve loved to see this with a G19, G17, and G34. I’ve recently realized the 19 tracks noticeably better for me. The odd thing is the G34 seems to track better than the G17, but to a lesser extent. I assume it’s most likely a balance issue with the G17 dip more in recoil than a G19.
Even when you know this. It’s a lot of fun to watch good film and chat it over with someone else who likes to make observations. Thanks Very entertaining. I enjoy your investigations, and the open minded way you evaluate.
Interesting to see on slow motion. Still, I have some fixed barrel guns like my CZ-82 in 9mm Makarov that seems like a softer shooter than any of my locked breach 9mms or 380's. I think maybe it is the size of the grip that makes the difference in some cases.
My Bersa 380 Thunder Plus is the handgun that I can shoot fastest and still make good hits. Blowback gun with a big fat grippy grip and just a quick little snap of recoil.
Thanks for the info. I did notice one factor of recoil is velocity. How much does a gun weigh, what cartridge, and with a semi-auto what is the slide velocity. All blow back actions will have a more snappy recoil compared to lock breech weapons. Simply put, the blow back has a faster slide velocity than a lock breech weapon. Revolvers are a straight up mass vs pressures and bullet weight problem.
I have the 80x and 80FS and found them to be quicker to get on target than my 365 even though the 365 'feels' like less recoil. This video definitely does give some interesting insights into my experiences.
When you push the back part of your 80x extractor (where the spring would be) and make the loaded indicator show on an empty chamber does it stay there till u push it back in or pull back on the slide a little? Mine does that but ive put 400 rounds thru it with not one issue. Thanks
Great video demo! I found that going with a higher grip on the revolver, similar to the Glock, lowering the bore axis, takes some of the bite out the recoil.
Thanks. This explains why I generally shoot compacts a little faster on my local pistol bay compared to full size pistols. I hate that extra nose wobble on the long slides, takes longer to get back on target accurately. But why then are fullsize preferred for competition shooting? And don't say capacity because that is what extended mags are for...
In my experience, it's two things: 1) increased sight radius if shooting irons, and 2) longer barrels allow for lower powder charges that will still cycle the gun, giving the competitor an advantage of getting back on target faster.
The muzzle bounce can be mitigated somewhat with technique. Competitors also do things like change the recoil spring weight or the mass of the guide rod to help with this. Even with the bounce, it's easier to maintain a consistent grip with a larger gun, and there's less muzzle rise. Maybe longer sight radius. That's just speculation -- the reasons high level competitors choose the guns they do is way out of my lane. That said, I know some extremely accomplished shooters who prefer a full size frame with a compact slide for that reason (ie, Glock 45 or even Glock 17 over Glock 34. Commander 1911 over full size, Beretta 92 Centurion over standard 92). In my experience, the vanilla, off-the-shelf (not set up for competition) full size 9mm 1911s have more dramatic muzzle bounce than a lot of other full size guns, which is why I chose to use it as an example.
Competition guns often have cutouts in the slide for faster recoil. The Glock 34 slide has these also so that the slide has the same weight as a G17 slide.
@@LuckyGunner Thank you *all* for the insight. Everything stated makes 100% sense and I had not previously considered these attributes. That is why I asked! So thank you all...
without such high-speed analysis its yet more astounding how JM Browning came up w/ the locked-breech/tilt-barrel system at the dawn of autoloaders still dominant 110+ yrs later
I rented a Springfield XD Service .45acp the other day and shot it side by side with my own XD Service 9mm. Was impressed with how mellow the 45 version of that gun was compared to the 9mm. Got me wanting to buy the .45 Tactical version now because that things gotta be even better with a 5 inch barrel.
Dang - great video! Love the high speed camera footage. Funny, I just purchased a Beretta 80X that's due for delivery in a few days. I'll be comparing it to my P365 380, Beretta 92X compact, and my Gen 4 Glock 19.
I'm lucky enough to have a personal range, where I shoot at least a couple hundred rounds a week. I have a lot of handguns, and a lot of friends that like to shoot them. One surprising observation that I've made is how differently individuals perceive recoil. I have an SA-35 that I like to use with recoil-sensitive shooters, because it's big, heavy, has a locked breech and G10 grips, all of which work to mitigate recoil. My uncle, however, always complains about the "kick", and much prefers a S&W Model 64. My favorite shooter is a Sig P365X. It's the most comfortable 9mm I've ever shot, and I can get rapid follow-up shots almost effortlessly. Literally no one agrees with me on this, and folks regularly complain about it's "snappiness". I think a large portion of perceived recoil comes down to how individual surfaces contact individual hands, which, of course, is unmeasurable. Great video, as always. Thanks!
Thanks, Chris. How about a comparison of standard versus light-rack recoil semi autos? I posit that the lighter recoil springs are going to lead to higher recoil impulse and muzzle rise because the spring isn't taking up the forces generated as well as a heavier spring.
Great video, Chris! Speaking of the 80X, I'd love to see this same type of format comparing it to a Beretta 84. Or a Beretta 84 vs. some of the Com bloc guns, like a Radom P-64 or an FEG PA-63 or a PM (to see in slow motion if that 1mm more case size 19x18 Makarov has really makes any difference in perceived or recorded recoil compared to .380 ACP).
Keep in mind that semi-auto pistols exert rearward pressure on the grip while the slide is compressing the recoil spring. When the slide hits the rear most position, it is not just the slide hitting the frame, it is also recoil spring max compressed. In case of revolver all recoil is concentrated at the moment of fire until the bullet exist the barrel.
Grip and Grip strength are really the key. Rob leatham did a demonstration with 9mm and 45acp and proved he can shoot slow fire and rapid fire without changing the attitude of the gun, very minimal movement. Problem is, we all can't be him.
Lucky Gunner crams more precise info into a 10 minute video than you’ll find in hours of other gun channels
yeah but you need to go to the other gun channels to get all the dog-whistle white-supremacist stuff
Chris is an excellent speaker, very succinct, efficient, and smooth.
One of my go-to’s 👍
Between this chan and gunjesus i learn sooo much i didnt know i needed to know.
Even Paul Harrell watches lucky gunner.
It's wild to believe these videos are made by an ammunition vendor. This is extremely premium content. Well done.
Lucky Gunner has consistently had some of the most thoughtful video and online articles. Even before Chris and their specific RUclips channel, they had Andrew Tuohy (Vurwappen Blog) and others doing great writing and testing.
Btw, I'd like to praise the consistency of the shooting between firearms. Those comparative double taps between the Beretta 80X and the P365XL were so consistent that they had almost identical split times. It was truly a genuine and consistent comparison, and I'll say it, exceptionally beautiful cinematography.
Thanks!
Always a good day when a Lucky Gunner video drops
Thanks, Jeff!
Would be cool to see some comparison between the Browning/1911 tilting barrel, Walther P38/Beretta 92 falling locking block, and Beretta PX4 rotating barrel systems!
Px4 for the win in recoil wars
For as much praise as it gets, I'm not impressed with the Beretta 92's locking system. It feels snappy to me. It doesn't help that I don't really like the grip.
That is a great idea. I regretted not filming the PX4 as soon as we wrapped up. I also have several other pistols already filmed that were not used in this video. I'm not sure if there's enough to discuss for a full video, so I might release them as Shorts
Shoot, throw a luger in the mix just for the toggle link and the fact I am curious. What else could we throw in to see a difference?
How about a CZ75 variant with its internal slide rails?
Thank you for consistently creating amazing and educational content!
Glad you like them!
Perfect title. I always recoil when someone wants to talk about feelings.
An important difference missed here between the blowback operation and locked-block operation in terms of felt-recoil, muzzle-rise and impulse is the direction of force vectors. In the blowback design, the force vector remains equal and opposite of projectile launch until the very end of slide-travel, at which point the force is transferred to the frame, which held by a secure grip, results in the pronounced "snappy" recoil impulse because all that force acts at (for the sake of argument) "90 degrees" to your grip and at the last minute. Contrasted with the locked block design, not only is the slide slowed by the unlocking of the barrel (the "push" feeling) when the barrel first unlocks, it drops (for the sake of argument) "30 degrees," it then continues in rear/downward motion alongside the slide for a period of time till stopped by the locking block. This force, enacted earlier in the sequence than the blowback design, is delivering a recoil force vector at (for the sake of argument) "120 degrees" aka diagonally towards your wrist, more "inline" with your body structure. The remaining force (less now, because of EQUAL and opposite) is then delivered similar to the blowback at "90 degrees" (with say a 1in moment arm, or whatever bore over grip measurement of your gun) and results in less "snappy" muzzle flip. All that to say more concisely, a force vector is applied earlier in the sequence that is more inline with your grip causing less of a moment (rotational force) when the barrel stops. That results in less of an opposite projectile force vector, which results in less of a moment at slide-stop.
I know I'm splitting hairs here, but I think it's fun and educational and thus fits the purpose of your channel. Re-watching your comments on the topic, you pretty much covered it with your statement that the locked-block cycle "spreads the recoil over a period of time" rather than the "all at once" experience of the blowback design. However earlier in your description of the locked-block you described the slowing of the slide speed in the unlocking process resulting in "less force," which isn't quite true as Newton's "equal and opposite" law mandates that the recoil "force" experienced between the two pistols is the same (as long as it's the same ammo and same barrel length, which they are). It's instead that the recoil force is delivered incrementally to the shooter in approximately 3 semi-distinct points "spread out over a period of time:" 1) the "push" of the initially locked-breech, 2) the rear/rotational stop of the barrel by the locking block and 3) the "snap" of slide-stop. Same force, just delivered in smaller portions incrementally over time.
Awesome thought experiment, awesome video, ton of fun thinking about the subject! Cheers!
This was a great video. I've been shooting handguns for over 50 years and this explains recoil better than I've ever seen.
I agree
I think I could watch slow motion videos of auto pistols in action till the cows come home. Being able to see how the mechanics work is mesmerizing to me. Hopefully, you can share different firearms and how they work in the future!
The only thing better than the content is the way their shipping/handling works when ordering products. Much better than the competition!
Would love to see "snappy" calibers like 40sw, 357 sig and 10mm. Also, a video on how comps can effect recoil would be great.
It would be interesting to see a glock 20 vs a 1911 10mm. There is such a difference in weight
The quality of these videos is unmatched
Great video, love the high speed footage! For anyone interested, in a lot of these comparisons, the relevant physics concept is called impulse. For two guns imparting the same amount of energy on the hand gripping it, the gun that does it in a lower amount of time, i.e. faster, is said to have a lower impulse, and will be felt as snappier recoil.
And by the same relationship, the shorter time-in-recoil gun transfers less linear momentum. It can tend to respond quicker to recovery.
It'd be interesting to see a comparison between the tilting barrel type locking systems and the rotating barrel or falling block style systems.
Incredible insight here. Thanks!
Watching the movement in the flesh of the hands during a shot is all new for me.
Love seeing the nuances that you can only catch with the high speed camera. Positively fascinating!
The high-speed camera is a great tool. Watching the guns in recoil, the little quirk differences between guns is explained. Some guns feel better than others and the .380 is almost nobodies first choice. Would be fascinating to see video comparing the 9x17 (.380) versus a 9x18 Makarov in blow back pistols. Have heard more than one shooter say the Makarov is downright hard to shoot well, and I agree.
.380 is my first choice. Ball ammo penetrates adequately and is much easier to find than the Goldilocks 9mm defensive ammos that perform in a micro 9.
@@macriggland6526 .380 fmj Deveno overpenetrate. There are good .380 hp loads that expand and penetrate!
Modern 9x17 has the same power than 9x18.
@@Gieszkanne No they don’t. Over penetration is sort of a meme anyways. It makes headlines in low income areas inhabited by people with no self control and 50 round drums.
Civilized men don’t spray and pray.
@@Gieszkanne Power is not the issue. Bare minimum for “one shot power” is duty grade ammo in duty sized 9mm or greater. For everything else, landing two shots is recommended. Therefore, as long as it penetrates enough, it’s fair game to use it.
My goodness Chris, that is some of the best side-by-side shots I’ve seen! This video needs to be saved!
Cool videos. The main difference between the locked system and the blowback is that the recoil impulse on the former is spread over two impulses. It unlocks when the barrel strikes the retention pin unlocking it which transfers some of the momentum to the shooter's grip with the remainder being delivered when the hits the slide stop. With a blowback all of the momentum is transferred with one bigger impulse at the end of the slide travel. Since the slide of the blowback has more momentum on the way back, it bounces faster and closes sooner. Note also that a locked pistol starts rising sooner because of that first barrel impulse. Also interesting in watching the blowback how the force from the recoil spring has negligible effect in inducing muzzle climb. One wonders if a stiffer spring would be better in terms of reducing felt recoil, though maybe that would negatively affect the reliability of the gun.
Great comment👍
Maybe, but I think Beretta went as light as they could on the spring to allow their intended target consumers - women and the recoil sensitive- to still be able to rack the slide.
I'm neither but I love that little gun.
Love your science-based approach to gun shot data analysis. Just a great video packed with interesting insights!
There was a surprising amount of information in this video! The visualization was top notch and the guy is an amazing presenter!
Great content!
This video is the most interesting of all the RUclips videos out there. Nobody but Lucky Gunner is making a video like this. Chris has made it so interesting with the slow mo video. That I'm starting to geek out. Now I'm totally into this. I own lock up and blow back and now I'm indurstanding the difference. Thanks Chris for being so different in a good way😊
Amazing presentation as always.
There’s another comparison I would like to see one day: rotating barrel vs browning action.
I have always appreciated the subject matter, content quality and of course the knowledgeable information on Chris's presentations. High quality slo-mo camera work is an added plus. Always look forward to your videos. Thanks.
Awesome video. I was really hoping to see the PX4 storm's rotating barrel in the high speed footage/comparison, but amazing analysis nonetheless!!!
Great to see the P365 380 back on the channel for analysis. Would love to hear an updated review! With comparison to Ruger Security 380 would be even better.
Same design, probably run at about the same speed.
This channel is GOLD
Gold, Jerry! Gold!!
Best youtube channel, it's hard to wait for new video's to be released but the quality is always excellent.
That was cool to watch all the slow motion clips. Nice job explaining recoil from different types of handguns 👍🏻👍🏻
Chris, as always, these videos are gold. Just fantastic all 'round data with awesome visuals. Outstanding.
Here's yet another informative, interesting, and well produced video from Lucky Gunner! As the video wonderfully illustrates, there are reasons for different recoil impulses based on physics. However, I suspect that individual preferences are still fairly subjective. For example, I don't believe bore axis as a single determinant makes as big of a difference as some people imagine. Also, while impossible to quantify on high-speed cameras, sociological factors such as brand loyalty, cachet of ownership, historical reputation, and marketing may play a role in perceived shootability of a specific firearm. It's a fascinating subject and underscores the idea that firearms evoke unique characteristics of consumer behavior compared to other durable goods.
Yeah, bore axis is heavily over-rated as a factor in determining a gun's "shootability." It does help to explain the revolver-semi-auto recoil disparity, but from one auto to another, it's close to the bottom of the list of variables that matter.
Oh, right in the feels.
This is an excellent comparison and description of felt recoil. I intend to watch this one repeatedly to "lock it in". Thank you for all you do!
Excellent video. I’m reminded of my favorite quote regarding recoil management from Aaron Cowan: “Yes, I’m going to put a compensator on a 9mm pistol. Why? Because recoil is stupid, and we shouldn’t do it anymore.” For practical use/self defense pistols, anything that gets as close to eliminating the recoil and muzzle flip of the pistol entirely is desirable to me
As always, the clearest, most concise, readily understandable information. I had been looking for some time for a piece on recoil that puts it alotogether. This is that piece. There should be a Lucky Gunner library.👍👍👍
I love talking about my feelings with Lucky gunner
The most perceptive and most articulate reviewer out there!😁
Thanks for the very interesting recoil comparisons in slo-mo, and articulate explanations.
Nice analisis! I am a mechanical engineer an gun nut, but this video showed me a thing I didnt realized until now that I ve seen it: the role of the barrell hitting the slide during recoil. Thank you for that.
Really interesting. I watched the blow back vs recoil vid you mentioned. Great stuff, made me learn-ed.
Very interesting! Thanks for doing this video!
Thanks Chris. Very professionally done, as usual.
Great video, super informative!
I would love to see a review of the new S&W Equalizer as it seems to be the successor to the Shield EZ
Really like your analytical approach to shooting.
Great video, I was really hoping to see the PX4 out again and see how different it responded to recoil and muzzle flip with the rotating barrel. Maybe next time
Incredibly professional and informative. Definitely earned my subscription
Very interesting information. Personally I am more concerned with blast than recoil though as arthritis increases that may change. 😊
Recoil is a subject that I am very interested in. Thanks for making this video.
I loved seeing the cz shadow. Great video, as always. Thanks.
This is the most mature, least tacticool gun channel on the interwebs.
thanks very much for the time and energy it took to make this..solid content, well delivered; grateful
Another great Chris Baker video. Thanks
High speed video is so great for making a point. Well done 🇺🇸
Honestly this explained a ton to me, and why I like revolvers. I think maybe I’m just over correcting when I try to shoot some semi autos fast and I tend to hit lower on the target, where I can shoot revolvers more accurately relatively quickly, even though I’m well aware of the increased felt recoil and muzzle rise. Think I need to practice letting the slide returning and my grip do the work a bit more vs “pushing” like I instinctively do with a revolver to get faster followups
You're doing great work on the aspects of shooting.
Best info vids on the web Another great job, Chris
Very interesting! I missed the rotationg barrel. Nowadays people want flat shooting pistols. But if the pistols shoots flatter the energy goes more stright in the hand. And there if the grip ergos dont suit your hand, this could get even very uncomfortable. I think the H&K P7 has the flattest bore axis and is the most flat shooting pistol but the grip ergos are bad for my hand. Even so its only 9mm it was the most unpleadand handgun I have ever shot. And I even expierenced 44 Mag and 50AE.
Great video. The slo-mo is a great learning tool.
Chris, I really would’ve loved to see this with a G19, G17, and G34. I’ve recently realized the 19 tracks noticeably better for me. The odd thing is the G34 seems to track better than the G17, but to a lesser extent.
I assume it’s most likely a balance issue with the G17 dip more in recoil than a G19.
Even when you know this. It’s a lot of fun to watch good film and chat it over with someone else who likes to make observations. Thanks Very entertaining. I enjoy your investigations, and the open minded way you evaluate.
Interesting to see on slow motion. Still, I have some fixed barrel guns like my CZ-82 in 9mm Makarov that seems like a softer shooter than any of my locked breach 9mms or 380's. I think maybe it is the size of the grip that makes the difference in some cases.
Love geeking out on this stuff. Not getting hung up on it, but yeah shooting is fun, high speed is fun and very revealing.
Please Do an in-depth comparison of 5.7 vs 9mm and others. Short barrels and long barrels.
We are planning on it!
Chris is my favorite bearded GunTuber.
Great information I would love to see how a rotating barrel would look like
SLOW
My Bersa 380 Thunder Plus is the handgun that I can shoot fastest and still make good hits. Blowback gun with a big fat grippy grip and just a quick little snap of recoil.
Throw a 16 or 17 pound Walther PP spring in it. Whatever “snappiness” was there melts away
Thanks for the info.
I did notice one factor of recoil is velocity. How much does a gun weigh, what cartridge, and with a semi-auto what is the slide velocity.
All blow back actions will have a more snappy recoil compared to lock breech weapons. Simply put, the blow back has a faster slide velocity than a lock breech weapon.
Revolvers are a straight up mass vs pressures and bullet weight problem.
Excellent presentation! Learned a lot from this video!
I have the 80x and 80FS and found them to be quicker to get on target than my 365 even though the 365 'feels' like less recoil. This video definitely does give some interesting insights into my experiences.
When you push the back part of your 80x extractor (where the spring would be) and make the loaded indicator show on an empty chamber does it stay there till u push it back in or pull back on the slide a little? Mine does that but ive put 400 rounds thru it with not one issue. Thanks
@@FirstLast-ff7qx I checked and no, it seems rigid and won't push in when empty.
@@DapperProf thanks for checkin. How bout when you give it a good rack on an empty chamber? If i do that it will show loaded chamber. Thanks again
@@FirstLast-ff7qx no mine doesn't do that it's flush with the barrel. I might talk to Beretta about it maybe a warranty claim?
@@DapperProf man i talked to like 3 different people at beretta they said it was part of the design which i found odd
Ruger security 380 is one of my favorites, super low recall and 3vinch groupings at 15-25 yards
Great video demo! I found that going with a higher grip on the revolver, similar to the Glock, lowering the bore axis, takes some of the bite out the recoil.
key point you made (imho) is that regardless of make or model or even caliber, with practice we learn and adapt to shoot better
Another awesome video. Thanks, Chris.
High quality content and to the point. As usual!
I love it thank you, guys they really do have very fast shipping when you buy their ammo.
Thanks. This explains why I generally shoot compacts a little faster on my local pistol bay compared to full size pistols. I hate that extra nose wobble on the long slides, takes longer to get back on target accurately. But why then are fullsize preferred for competition shooting? And don't say capacity because that is what extended mags are for...
In my experience, it's two things: 1) increased sight radius if shooting irons, and 2) longer barrels allow for lower powder charges that will still cycle the gun, giving the competitor an advantage of getting back on target faster.
The muzzle bounce can be mitigated somewhat with technique. Competitors also do things like change the recoil spring weight or the mass of the guide rod to help with this. Even with the bounce, it's easier to maintain a consistent grip with a larger gun, and there's less muzzle rise. Maybe longer sight radius. That's just speculation -- the reasons high level competitors choose the guns they do is way out of my lane. That said, I know some extremely accomplished shooters who prefer a full size frame with a compact slide for that reason (ie, Glock 45 or even Glock 17 over Glock 34. Commander 1911 over full size, Beretta 92 Centurion over standard 92). In my experience, the vanilla, off-the-shelf (not set up for competition) full size 9mm 1911s have more dramatic muzzle bounce than a lot of other full size guns, which is why I chose to use it as an example.
Competition guns often have cutouts in the slide for faster recoil. The Glock 34 slide has these also so that the slide has the same weight as a G17 slide.
@@LuckyGunner Thank you *all* for the insight. Everything stated makes 100% sense and I had not previously considered these attributes. That is why I asked! So thank you all...
Love your videos and analysis!
without such high-speed analysis
its yet more astounding how JM Browning
came up w/ the locked-breech/tilt-barrel
system at the dawn of autoloaders
still dominant 110+ yrs later
That was very easy to understand. Thank you!!
Thanks for sharing interesting slow motion
This video is Pewtubing PERFECTION. Thanks, Chris.
What an awesome video! I have that P365-380 and it is a joy to shoot and carry.
I rented a Springfield XD Service .45acp the other day and shot it side by side with my own XD Service 9mm.
Was impressed with how mellow the 45 version of that gun was compared to the 9mm.
Got me wanting to buy the .45 Tactical version now because that things gotta be even better with a 5 inch barrel.
Great video! Would love to see the PX4 Storm under this microscope
And a Grand Power P11 Mk 12 or K100!
Thanks Chris. I wish lucky gunner operated in my country!
Dang - great video! Love the high speed camera footage. Funny, I just purchased a Beretta 80X that's due for delivery in a few days. I'll be comparing it to my P365 380, Beretta 92X compact, and my Gen 4 Glock 19.
I'm lucky enough to have a personal range, where I shoot at least a couple hundred rounds a week. I have a lot of handguns, and a lot of friends that like to shoot them. One surprising observation that I've made is how differently individuals perceive recoil.
I have an SA-35 that I like to use with recoil-sensitive shooters, because it's big, heavy, has a locked breech and G10 grips, all of which work to mitigate recoil. My uncle, however, always complains about the "kick", and much prefers a S&W Model 64.
My favorite shooter is a Sig P365X. It's the most comfortable 9mm I've ever shot, and I can get rapid follow-up shots almost effortlessly. Literally no one agrees with me on this, and folks regularly complain about it's "snappiness".
I think a large portion of perceived recoil comes down to how individual surfaces contact individual hands, which, of course, is unmeasurable.
Great video, as always. Thanks!
Great video, and great channel
Wonderful analysis as always!
Another excellent video
Good video and explanations. Thank you!
Excellent video! Did you see the cylinder of the LCR dancing around inside the frame?
327 Magnum is the Best Magnum. Everything from 22LR recoil up to 9mm +P Recoil
Thanks, Chris. How about a comparison of standard versus light-rack recoil semi autos?
I posit that the lighter recoil springs are going to lead to higher recoil impulse and muzzle rise because the spring isn't taking up the forces generated as well as a heavier spring.
Great video, Chris! Speaking of the 80X, I'd love to see this same type of format comparing it to a Beretta 84. Or a Beretta 84 vs. some of the Com bloc guns, like a Radom P-64 or an FEG PA-63 or a PM (to see in slow motion if that 1mm more case size 19x18 Makarov has really makes any difference in perceived or recorded recoil compared to .380 ACP).
I'm sure the 80X is identical to the 84
Keep in mind that semi-auto pistols exert rearward pressure on the grip while the slide is compressing the recoil spring. When the slide hits the rear most position, it is not just the slide hitting the frame, it is also recoil spring max compressed. In case of revolver all recoil is concentrated at the moment of fire until the bullet exist the barrel.
Great video! Couldn't have explained it better. I'm going to pin this as a great reference in my recoil test videos.
Great presentation
Grip and Grip strength are really the key. Rob leatham did a demonstration with 9mm and 45acp and proved he can shoot slow fire and rapid fire without changing the attitude of the gun, very minimal movement. Problem is, we all can't be him.
Great video as always.