I have an issue with Simon Koehler announcing that Hornby models are for life... They stock hardly any spare parts so when it goes wrong, it's not for life.
@@alanrobertson9790 My Class 31 in 'Dutch' Civil engineers livery, dropped to bits some time ago. But years after getting it. The stupid opening louvered radiator shutters on one side of my large logo class 50 dropped to bits. As did the replacement ones from Peter’s spares.
@@alanrobertson9790 I was fortunate enough that a local model railway shop near me (Smith's in Sheringham, Norfolk) has the services of an old chap who was able to locate the issue. His solution was to have a couple of 3D printed frames to replace the rotten metal ones. I still have a black 9F outstanding at my Brother's that I will need to get from the storage box and get the same work done on it. The results are that I will seriously reconsider ever buying anything new from Hornby, as I jettisoned a notorious Class 31 loco that had a reputation for suffering with similar mazak issues. So frustrating to find out this when we are all careful owners that look after our stock.
For models that are, quite frankly, made on the cheap in China, there is simply no excuse for them to be as expensive as they are. However, there is one simple way to affect change in a positive direction; simply do not buy these overpriced models. Vote with your wallet.
Only good thing they have done recently is railroad plus but the name is not good, I hope they focus more on railroad plus that way they can stay in business and every one gets what they want.
Don't forget the chip shortage which was bound to increase the price of locomotives that have stuff like DC and DCC decoders, and all the stuff going on with china with many businesses leaving china in recent times
Things like shipping and the chips being more expensive of course is a convenient way to justify prices going up; however we must not forget that these models were significantly overpriced even before the pandemic..
My husband said to me after seeing the massive price increases , that was the end of Hornby for him , he says they are greedy and pricing themselves out of business
All modeling companies have been doing this not just Hornby. This is the reason why the model RR industry is dying, the prices become so high you'd need to remortgage your house to buy a 4-6-2 that makes a noise or a diesel modeled inaccurately that sounds like a vacuum cleaner (Looking at you Lionel!) add to that online train simulators, greedy old farts in shops, and of course tax increases especially here in America thanks to a certain old man and yeah this hobby is not gonna last long. Thankfully some model train vendors at train shows tend to be a little more relaxed on the prices namely for the old stuff but regardless it infuriates me how insane the prices have become especially when the models that cost as much as a Dyson hoover are built real cheap and fall apart compared to models that are older than me but only costing 75% less.
I have been a Hornby fan since the early 1950's, but their recent exploits have left me rather cold. Your video sums up my feelings admirably. Thank you.
Good news: With the growing popularity of 3D Printing, it will soon be possible to get around this issue, which should force model train corporations to lower their prices.
As a broke ass student also in the Netherlands I know the feeling al to well but wow this is so ridiculous I can't put it into words I mean 20% that's like if I spend an entire tear to save up for a model I now need to wait 438 instead of 365 day's I might as well quit the hobby since it almost lookslike I won't be able to buy any models for a good while all because hornby wants more profit
@Aussie Pom I am not prepared to pay the new stupidly high prices. My patience with Hornby has ran out! Especially with the ridiculous light bleed on the Class 60, DVT and the LNER Hitachi train. High prices for trash!
Its bad enough that HORNBY are pricing their models out of reach for the average hobbyist, but the quality and running issues are a disgrace for what you pay. Most of their range are only suitable for static display.
Hi. You are spot on. I used to buy a lot of stock but not now. The move to pre ordering stock was for me the last straw. I will now just use my existing stock. New starters to the hobby have no chance unless they have extremely large disposable incomes.
A Yankee here. It is model railroad manufactuers across the board that are doing things like this. Lionel, the number 1 O Gauge manufactuer in the States (probably control 80% of the market) have jacked their prices up 20% too for toolings over 20 years old. It is really just a shame.
This is the down side of share holders. They have no feeling for the company, draw as much money out of the company as they can, suck it empty and let it go bankrupt. With the multiple millions they made, they jump over to the next company and do the same. They only care about money. This very same people are also responsible for the world wide drama we live in today.
Haven't come across your videos before. Where have I been? Great work. I'll be pleased if Rapido push the copyright issue through the courts. Time for Hornby to get a wake-up call.
I’ve preordered Lion from Rapido and cancelled the Hornby one from my local shop. I enquired vaguely about them getting Rapido and Accurascale and they mentioned obliquely that Hornby would get upset if they stocked competitor’s models.
Great video. The 'golden age' of Hornby OO was around 2000-2005 when we had quality items from China at fair prices. In recent years the prices have gone through the roof, quality control is poor and the locomotives in particular are too fragile to be used by real modellers. The price of that SE & CR 'Thomas' is a joke, it should be £40 tops. Even basic Railroad range locomotives are no longer affordable. Hornby are trying to control the market by squeezing out the retailers and forcing you to pre-order direct from them at RRP, which I refuse to do. This is clearly a marketing gimmick. Small model shops are going to really struggle as they will be receiving very little new stock to sell. Hornby, you should be ashamed of yourselves.
Its a shame that a hornby 0-4-0 (that originally came out in the 60s) is nearly 80.00 us when you can get a Piko 0-4-0 (that originally was launched in the 50s) for 30.00 that run the same, and has spare parts available from a retailer or factory to order so you can repair the loco yourself.
I get really annoyed any time I hear about Hornby playtrains because it is such an obvious cheaper copy of märklin my world I have huge respect for märklin for their dedication to quality and listening to their costumes and seeing another company copy them so obviously makes me really annoyed Also I get that the high price for the fleischmann/roco br 80 is wrong but we should not compare them to hornby as they actually make some really great quality models for a reasonable price and are very nice people :)
Hornby Playtrains annoy me because that's the price point the Railroad models were when they started the range :( seriously Hornby there are plenty of toy trains out there, give us some truly affordable MODELS
How true it is with the ever increasing prices of our great hobby. There are several issues that arise from the price increase. Firstly Hornby have difficulty in maintaining profitability and have done for several years. By moving there production to China there was a hope that this would solve the problem. It hasn't. The Chinese government demand those companies that now rely on Chinese production to raise the wages so that they align with western pay. No savings there! We are seeing poor quality locos? Why? Because the production line only random checks the product. So you might be the unlucky one to get a duff unit! Plus there is no real competion in the UK. Dapol are in the same boat. So now we have gone back to the 1940s onwards where the hobby was the prerogative of the wealthier classes that was until Triang broke the mold. If you want a bargain don't buy new Hornby or Dapol, seek out the pre-owned market where there are bargains galore to be had. Finally I'm a great believer in bringing production back to the UK because all we are doing is enriching China at our expense.
When they ask UK prices for made in China garbage, they might as well pull it back. China got a way to loud political mouth lately as well, so again a good reason.
I think they have trapped themselves in targeting the retired "baby Boomers" with loads of cash. This demographic sadly is dying out. What are they going to do when they all have gone to the great layout in the sky? What about the 30 - 50 year olds on a budget? £250 and up for a loco? Build quality is also poor, they are very fragile. If you drop one one on the floor, its a right off!
Feel rather frustrated. I asked for a Hornby L&Y Class 21 Pug for my birthday, which my parents had to purchase direct from Hornby for nearly £90. The tooling turns out to be from the 1980s bought from bloody Dapol. We need a newly-tooled pug, as the one I have runs terribly after owning it for only 4 months, really frustrating. Lastly, the basic 0-4-0 starter locomotives, y'know, the one I and most people started with, ARE NOW NEARLY COSTING £60! When I was younger, you could purchase a decent, non-railroad model for under £80. Remember the whole thing with the B12s? So many returned with dodgy motors, missing roofs and chipped paint. Thank god that the new Dapol Hawthorn Leslie us under £100 (just) as it looks a terrific model. Terrific video too.
Commercially, they're going for low volume and high prices now. It's a valid policy, but not one that will be sustainable. Stack 'em high, sell 'em low (works for Tesco). Getting the specialist products out in volume, recovering investment costs fast, generating high cash flow, then playing with 'limited issues' for extra profit. The company was in trouble a few years ago . . . . watch this space!
I’m more a Bachmann fan when it comes to HO/OO scale trains. I love the fact that people are customizing the Bachmann Skarloey into the character’s basis.
Couldn't agree more, I've never had model trains but my son is very keen - but the prices are ridiculous, locomotives are too expensive for him to play with. The Budget Model Railways channel covered this as well. Making the point that younger newcomers to the hobby will be put off by the prices, and that it'll only be affordable by well off older generations - causing the hobby to decline. I recommend their channel as they offer good advice on cost effective ways to build track layouts, find locomotives and carriages/wagons.
The real problem this creates is that the barrier to entry into model trains is extremely high. If you want a train on a loop to go around your Christmas tree, the simplest of tracks, you're looking at hundreds of pounds in costs. Let alone an actual layout or god forbid DCC. The industry needs a revolution! We all love trains yet we accept prices that alienate most people from what we love. It's very sad.
Railroad 0-4-0s were 25 Pounds RRP in 2019. Now it's 50. Blaming reviewers for that is a bit rich. Some models, the ones that have paid for themselves tenfold, ought not to suffer from a jack that has nil to do with inflation. Newly produced stuff ought to. If your argument had any layer of truth to it that would mean Hatton's Warwells and Barclays, or Kernow's S100s would have also gotten more expensive over time. Yet they didn't.
We've reached the ridiculous point where you can buy vintage Japanese brass locos on ebay for less than a new Hornby model, and they won't fall apart or 'cease to proceed'. Their reliability has been going down as fast as their prices go up - the models look lovely, but are of questionable durability and, in the case of one dud I had, made in such a way they cannot be taken apart to repair. Spare parts almost unobtainable - and most of my local shops don't carry them any longer because of their price fixing antics. Somebody needs to sit down have think very, VERY hard about where they're going - Carey Street is odds on favourite.
It is rather heart breaking that they are doing this considering that a third of my collection is Hornby and 90% of my wish list and they are the brand that got me into model railways to begin with. But I’ve had problems with 2 2017 models myself recently with a black 5 which cost me £150 second hand could only pull half as much as my Bachmann 4f and my S15 which cost me £85 second hand (bargin) could barely pull 20 wagons (however I added weight which makes it decent now) and still has the motor problem that I’d seen on RUclips. However bachmann is guilty as well of the old tooling problem which Sam’s trains showed with the hall class but also I have a jinty from 2005 for £50 which bachmann is still selling at £110!
I'm totally with you there mate. I'm more disappointed with Hornby rather than being angry (as some people are). I want them to thrive but I don't see them doing well in the next few years and with their relationship with retailers at an all-time low, I don't see how they can repair them once the executives at Hornby finally get their act together and realise what they are doing is not good for the company or the hobby. (I'd have thought they would have learnt their lessons by now after nearly going bankrupt, guess some of them haven't).
Spot on mate. Simon proclaims that “it’s not a toy, it’s for keeps…” when actually, it’s not a toy because you keeps (sic) on having to fork out a poxy fortune! 🤬 And frankly, I now feel like it is one bridge of “mugged off” too far. I pre-ordered a BR late livery HushHush from Colletts in Devon (every good model shop deserves a shout out) and poor Leigh, the owner, contacted me to make sure I still wanted to buy it because the price had gone up again before they had even sent the model out! He’s barely making any dosh now because he’s refusing to charge me full wallop, even though I’ve said I don’t mind as it’s not his fault🙄 Like you say, they aren’t targeting kids now, they are targeting deep pockets, which is fine except it is taking the fun out of it and turning it into an elitist hobby, which is terrible 😞 There is definitely a psychological element to this too. Railroad is branded almost to make you think “oh it must be crap then” when actually as some reviews have shown, it is often the opposite case, and there are plenty of crap expensive models too! 🤔 The L&M debacle is a classic example of hanging your self when given enough rope. I suspect most won’t care about the exact accuracy, but when it is top dollar, you expect something better than that! 🤷🏻♂️ By the way you’re not a grumpy wotsit. You’re just not a mug. Cheers fella, love this video 👍🍀😎
Let us not forget that Hornby was brought by an investment company and has been loosing money at least until 2020. With a boom in the hobby especially with the pandemic they took the opportunity to raise the prices. I don't agree the way they went about it and can see the reasons. My issue with Hornby is that they think they are top quality model makers and pricing themselves for that except they are not: their quality is variable, they are living off the heritage name and that is not good enough.
The insane price jacking (from several brands, not just Hornby) is what will inevitably kill this hobby if it keeps happening. The old crusty men that these brands try to cater to are slowly dying out, and the hobby is far too expensive for many of the younger generation who already have to deal with the expenses of school, food, housing, probably a car, and maybe even a family.
From a business point of view Hornby is fascinating and maybe best described as "Market leaders in miss-reading the market". The fact they are still in business is remarkable, I've followed the story since the early 90s when it was used as a case study in university about how not to run a legacy business.
So to give some info about the Fleischmann BR 80. Fleischmann does not Produce H0 models anymore, only gauge N. What ended up appearing was a Roco BR 80 with a newer body
The only quality loco Hornby produced in 2021, off the top of my head, was the Merchant Navy. I would absolutely LOVE a Turbomotive, but over £250 for a 'model' that probably won't run properly a month! No chance! I'll juet copy Sam'sTrains, buy a Tri-Ang Princess, and convert that into 6202 for a fraction of the cost!
i do agree there scott, hornby has overprised everything. when i was 7 i got a flying scotsman train set which i still have to this day, and it had a price around 160 pounds. NOW IT COSTS 219.99 pounds. its discusting. superb video btw.
They make "models" not "toys" but none of their pacific locos have working rear pony trucks, they just have fixed flangeless wheels that drop inside the track on curves. But they are apparently worth £260 🤯
@@FlyingScott Nah, not at all, I have real sympathy for modellers starting out! But Hornby are even pricing me out of their market. They clearly don't listen when sites like "Sam's Trains" label them "rip off". Anyone on a budget (and that doesn't include Hornby's Simon you will notice!) can no longer acquire a collection of models needed to model railways. BTW BRM magazine had a comment section years ago pointing out the then new policy of Hornby withdrawing retailer support and selling direct. It was a board and financial backer decision which clearly now holds sway in the company. My guess, either Bachmann don't follow suit and Hornby expires, or Bachmann do follow, and they both expire, 'cos no-one normal can afford to play this game any more. We need the Model Railway press to desist in massaging the major UK manufacturers and tell them some home truths, like don't detail with flimsy plastic, make sure their mechanisms are workable and robust and design to a price their market can afford while realising they could kill the goose that is laying their golden handshakes.. Good luck with the channel - keep on moaning please!
As a young man in my 20s who recently got into model kits, I wanted to get back into model railways. I had a few of the Thomas the Tank Engine electric trains when I was younger and could remember being able to save up pocket money for them. I also inherited a lot of my realistic models from my family, so I could run those on a train set I got for Christmas. All of them were Hornby, so I naturally looked at them first. I was absolutely horrified to see I would be paying £100+ for a basic engine, especially ones that a lot of folks were calling unreliable. It was going to cost a lot more to replace my admittedly knackered rolling stock. How Hornby expects to draw in new hobbyists and please regulars when they're charging £40+ for a pocket rocket that might break is honestly beyond me. Looks like I'll be running my 30+ years old King George V engine for quite a while now.
If anyone’s looking for a more sensible reason for why the prices are jacked so high, here is why Most MR manufacturers outsource production of their products to China due to its cheap workforce. The problem, is that the cheap workforce is not that cheap anymore and labor costs in China are rising significantly. This is a major problem for modeling as a whole and we need to figure out a solution fast. Our hobby is already shrinking and as long as companies jack up the price to compensate for lost revenue it will only get worse. We will lose our best hope for the hobby, broke college students. I KNOW IT SOUNDS STUPID but the older elitist snobs who care more about detail than cost will not last forever.
I have been saying this for years, I have sent Hornby many emails about their models, quality, price, customer care and they never reply. I don`t want Hornby to fade away, I want them to talk to customers.
Stop buying Hornby stuff and they'll either get the message or go broke. I don't like being ripped off by the Chinese, like so many former British products, Hornby is no longer made here.
Good to hear your sound opinions. Re poor Hornby quality you’re right. I currently have gripes like the atrocious Railroad Flying Scotsman. The recent 4 & 6 wheeler coaches that they rushed to beat Hutton’s. The 4 wheelers had dodgy mag lights and light showing through the plastic.
For all the people complaining about the price rises... note that they have not made very good profits in recent years. Yes, they did make a profit with the virus helping them but not a big one. The cost of things from China has gone mad with shipping increases, problems in China etc. It could be they are inefficent in other ways etc but plenty of other Made in China things are increasing in price a LOT. And yes, this includes some other brands of trains. Also some have made the (sensible in my mind) move to take some production out of China (eg Dapol).
Interesting points, especially with the Rocket mineral "wagons", I'd honestly never noticed that before... What I think needs to be understood as well, is that the whole Lion issue isn't the first time Hornby have done this; there's several locos inc Terriers, 66's, the B1 to name a few where Hornby have competed directly with competition on the same model. In a let's be honest, quire a small market, the only thing this direct competition will do is push smaller producers out of the market, & the only people that benefits are Hornby. Hornby are in this to "win" and actively want to subvert the competition, its this aggressive capitalism which I think could seriously backfire in such a small market & its not what I believe Hornby should be doing.
As a fellow member of the "Priced Out of the Hobby" club, I'm going to remark that if Hornby wants to make money again, they need to drop the "superfine detail" nonsense. Produce old tooled things, and sell them cheap. Toolings from 20-40 years ago that still work and more importantly made back their money ages ago. Get more people to buy cheaper products, and it'll be better for Hornby than selling only a few expensive models to a literally dying consumer base. They could even go into 3D printed kits like Dapol's ex-airfix stuff. Use those to try encouraging younger modellers to "do it themselves" and buy Humbrol paints.
I find some irony in your statement. I have two Flying Scotsmans. One is from the early 2000 and the other is about the same age as James May's one so 80s I think. The older one actually looks nicer over all than it's early 2000s variant.
Am really at the point in giving up on the hobby not just the out of controled price increase but also the bad condition some off these new model are getting too 😔
@@chicagolandrailroader That what am doing at the moment but still learning and price for none working models are going up too I wouldn't be surprised if they became to much money as well
As a fellow dutchman i got the same problem. Together with things like brexit the prices of the more expensive models have started to come near brands like roco and i won’t be suprised that the prices will be up to the same level by next year.
They are targeting the middle aged bloke with diisposable income trying the milk off the nastalgia. My issue with that is that it is zero investment for younger generation who can not afford to enter the hobby. I liked Hornby because they use to cover the this segment of the market. As for quality, they are too variable and still their best products are no Roco /Fleischman.
I mentioned the exact same thing on the actual video of the 2022! Strangely, StudioCanal already know that Hornby might make the Titfield Thunderbolt because they're making the 4F from The Railway Children Return, which is another film by StudioCanal! Also, the price increase for the BR/DR/DRG/DB (whatever, It's German) 80, it's the same class but has been given a facelift by being made from completely new tooling (the tooling for yours had actually been retired years ago) but the price increases are just stupid. Most of costs appear more centralised on the UK but forget about the currency of other countries (I live in Australia, born and bred, and naturally, I was stocked to see the A4 with my home nation's name in the range. The problem is the price, of which UK£217.99 is AU$413.29 and not everyone has that money, but I'm still going after that A4).
I gave up 4mm electric mice a la Hornby a few years ago- now I have 16mm narrow gauge in the garden. I built a 16mm (O gauge) coal fired loco from a kit of (British!) parts for £1500, which when you consider that Hornby charge £250 for a locomotive that doesn't work, seems rather good value.
First video I've seen of your channel, very entertaining! I have all sorts of locos; I think the triang hornby / hornby range from late 60s - early 90s are the best for quality and value for money, as well as being easy to repair /rebuild. Lima models are underratted I think too; some are noisy but run forever with minimal maintenance, and are a touch too light but very robust.
Wait you're Dutch? All this while I thought you were Scottish! Great video mate, I agree with everything you said! Maybe if they found a way to up the quality and drop the prices, they'd lose that outdated image and start drawing in younger blood into the hobby! Awesome content as usual mate! Cheers!
When I started model railway I brought a railroad 9f, setting me back £80, there finally updated the 9f but for £250 that is just dcc ready is getting beyond a joke.
I personally have gotten to the point where I have just bought motor chassis and started to 3d print my own bodies and rolling stock. Sure, they are not as pretty as the $200 models, but for that price I can have a loco and a rake of rolling stock so long it is impractical for my layout.
I used to think european mainland models were way too expensive, then brexit happened and suddenly I'm slapped with 24% tax on everything I buy from the UK. This combined with Hornbys price hikes makes it so mainland models are once again cheaper for me... 😂
I still have an early 1970s Hornby Catalogue, in there are their switches, Points - On-Off - On-On. They were £1.95 each. Now they're almost £20. That's a 50 year old product that hasn't changed on iota. I thought the ideal of switching production to China was to keep prices low........ Just how much would they be if production was still in England !
I'm an American, I want to model British, and as overpriced as American models are, Hornby are really pushing me to just, not model British after all, despite how much I love the aesthetics of the early BR era. It's kind of sad that Hornby's predatory marketeering and pricing structure is turning me away from something I love, and if it's turning me away, I -can't- be the only one, aye? Sorry for being negative with you, but I never get tired of your videos, stay awesome!
My suggestion for if you do want to continue with British-outline modelling is to go second-hand. You can get older hornby (1970s to early 2000s), lima, triang, mainline, etc models for really low prices with the likes of ebay, and while they aren't the most detailed models they do run fairly well even after so many years.
They are re-releasing some Tri-ang stuff. Better have got in line though, they're only making 500! Seriously. Hornby is producing an entire product line for international sale in the same numbers that Lima would for number variants like 60003 "Christopher Wren", commissioned as a retailer-exclusive by a single model shop.
@@FlyingScott hope they don't get wind of it and ask (or rather, instruct) you to pull it. It's a hot topic on RMweb, if you didn't already know (but I'm sure you do...).
Lots of people saying buy second hand instead, however this has caused another problem in that second hand prices have rocketed in response to the new prices, even on really old stock. I remember when (not so long back) £30 was pretty much the top you would pay for a s/h Lima diesel - now the decent examples START at £30 and go up in price! Also this combined with the misconception that all model trains are valuable antiques has almost ended the golden era of eBay bargains.
Hornby needs to take a look at the company's financial history and make sure it doesn't repeat the many mistakes of its past (and also not invent new ones). My father resurrected the company from the ashes back in the 1980s and I would be unhappy to see it back in the situation he sorted out all those years ago.
Good on you. I think it is disgusting the way they are carrying on. I dropped £3000 of orders with them last year and it will be similar this year. Who the hell is buying some of these products?. Who is paying £185 for a shunter and thinking that was a good idea!?.
7:44 Hatton's: **announces their Genesis line of pre-grouping coaches** Hornby: **Shamelessly imitates that idea, with the knowledge that their product will be more popular because it has a famous brand attached to it..**
This hobbies gone mad ebay seller's are offering broken models with parts missing ( detail packs etc )for the same price of a highly inflated new Hornby product, then selling the detail pack for another £18.00 plus postage wow
I remember 20 years ago (exactly) I acquired brand new a train set containing a Duchess pacific, 3 coaches, controller, track etc for the princely sum of £69. The dealer made a profit on this too. Thank the Lord that Hornby don't make bread, otherwise it would cost 20 quid a loaf!!
Neatly illustrating your point, I pre-ordered 91111 when it was announced in 2020 for 174.99, then GNER 91117 in 2021 for 194.99, just went to have a look at adding LNER 91101 which was added this year and they want 216.99 for it! An increase of essentially 25% in 2 years for the same model.
I'm sorry to break it to you, but this behaviour has been happening for many years and is certainly not just confined to Hornby. If you take a look at Bachmann's catalogue and pricing, you'll note very similar trends and behaviour with regard to price structuring. To use a famous Die Hard quote - ''welcome to the party, pal''. I've since moved away from OO and focussed on something much cheaper and far more durable and reliable - G Scale. And yes, cheaper. When you can get bogie coaches four times the size of OO versions for circa £30 with flush glazing and bags of potential and tank engines that'll survive all weather's for easily under £100, there is no going back. Just takes you back to the essence of what model railways is really all about - modelling. None of these overblown sounds, flashy lights and exact number of rivets. Who cares when the train is actually terrorised by your neighbours cat.
I'm another totally disillusioned with Hornby and its current management who operate, in my view, very underhand business practices. Having bought my first Triang Railways catalogue some 60 years ago and a Hornby/Triang one every year since I have decided to buy no more Hornby related stuff until things change, if they ever do.
im 29... when I was a kid in late 90s early 00s the HST cost 30 pounds (too expensive to have) as of 2023 its 157.99 for the modern set version if you want the different colours and such... 300 to 400 pounds just for the locomotives with the carriages being 45 pounds each just 10 years ago I could pick up second hand hornby sets and lima sets for 20 pounds for 1 powercar and 10 for 1 carriage the hornby company are massively ripping off the enthusiasts and pushing the kids entirely out of the market. these model rail sets were aimed originally at both kids and pensioners alike. it makes me so angry because my parents couldnt afford them when I was a kid 20 years ago and now I cant really even afford them as an adult without alot of saving and heafty sacrifices. milk, milk lemonade round the corner fudge is made
From Cityam - Model railway company Hornby has returned to a profit for the first time in nearly a decade after an upsurge in interest for its products during lockdown. The group reported a 33 per cent increase in revenue to £21.1m in the first half of the year, up from £15.9m in 2019.
I first wanted to get into model trains in like 2017ish kind of times. Then I stopped for a few years for other hobbies, now I want to get back into trains and I'm greeted with this. That's very fun. * dies *
Really enjoyed that and was surprised by the era 1 wagons being the Rocket tender! From...(compared to you anyway) a crusty old man who hides his purchases from his wife - and has never paid more than £120 for a loco 😂
What’s worse, young buyers don’t know any better. About 10 years ago we bought a Bachmann switcher for ~$100 because, well, isn’t that what it costs? You see a scale model ages 14 and up and you forget that it’s a metal shell in a motor.
Very interesting. I have recently returned to the hobby. All be in now in N gauge. However I watched the 2022 hornby release video and was shocked at some of the prices. Remember buying little plank wagons from the local model shop as a kid in the 90s for about a fiver with my pocket money. Now all wagons seem to be at least £20. And appear to be roughly the same! The other thing that this means is the supply and price of second hand items will also increase to align with the new prices and demand. Shame as I feel the hobby could be even more popular if more attainable
When I got into the hobby, a new Hornby open wagon was 25p. (!) My pocket money bought me two more wagons. Kids these days must need an awful lot of pocket money!
I remember saving up for an M7. It was just pre-decimalisation, and cost a couple of shillings over £3. So a loco cost around the same as 12 wagons. I suppose a similar ratio still applies.
… Why. Hornby is one of my favourite companies ever, its the only company i have consistently bought from and they make some great models! I really hate they choose this as this will ruin them, either the company falls or they will give in, i personally hate hornby for doing this because they wont make it out of this. They dug their own grave at this point and they cant save themselves
I gave up on this hobby recently. To expensive and the models are to fragile and track cleaning is annoying. Plus fixing and maintaining them and the track. I now build and run British LEGO diesel and steam trains.
As someone who is TRYING to get into model railways, this is especially annoying. There’s a reason why I pretty much only buy the cheap second hand models off of Hattons. If I want to buy something off of hornby’s website, I pretty much need to sell a kidney. Not to mention, when I got my first controller, IT WAS BROKEN OUT OF THE BOX. Hornby really need to step up there game.
My 40th is fast on approach. Friends and family have asked if I'd like anything special and, I'd like something I will keep for many years, maybe all time. So, growing up with Hornby, I thought Yeah, that'll do a treat. I love the Mallard and know there's a record breaker set. Looked it up, found it and thought that looks great. Until something caught my eye. 60022. Huh. Curious. I have a painting of the Mallard on my wall. Its number is 4468. What the deuce?! So, I did a bit of homework and lo and behold it was 4468 that broke the record in 1938. 60022 didn't come in until 11 years later under BR. This has yo be the most basic yet egregious oversight I've ever seen. So, I do some more research. Each set comes with a track mat. That's folded up in the box and crushed down to fit. Making huge creases making track unable to sit on it correctly. Further research. Customer service is awful. So, suffice to say, I'm not going ahead with these sets. Throwing my money away, I'm not thrilled about. Throwing away other people's money? Not a chance!!!
its exactly as thought concerning Hornby.. if I can't buy what I need off ebay then I look at another manufacturer I will not pay top price for old mouldings .
Ah yes, Hornby, the Apple of the model railway world... They can't even do proper research to save their lives. The liveries for their 'Class 57' (lazy rehash of a Lima 47 into a 57/0) are actually from the 57/3. Which not only is completely wrong, but just completely odd aesthetics wise.
Fully agree Hornby have been going back to 970's quality for years, the W1 typically is a total waste of space and is worth no more that half the catalogue price.
New locos now are now a thing of the past, only go on eBay now for my models, as most are within my price range and the older products are better than of today, would love the new Hornby BR Standard class 2 Mt, but at near £200 mark, NO way !!! going to convert and older Bachmann Ivatt...
Amazing video, loved it 😂
Very good points, made extremely well!!
Eyy Sam! I did not knew you watched him as well!
Hi Sam!
Thought both your videos were very similar, hope nobody has the exclusive rights
@@trafficface Uh-oh, not another channel strike!
Yep! XD
It is the "hobby of a lifetime"
Because thats how long it will take you too afford one of their products!
Couldn't of said that better
Try being a Japanese model train fan! At least you don't have to pay import tax or the exorbitant Parcel Force handling fee with Hornby!
I couldn't have worded it better myself.
If you think this is bad, have you seen the prices for Lionel's trains these days? Yeesh!
I agree
I have an issue with Simon Koehler announcing that Hornby models are for life... They stock hardly any spare parts so when it goes wrong, it's not for life.
Today my Hornby Class 58 burnt out with no spare motors on Peters Spares either, so have to agree.
Totally agree.....
Their Railroad range black 9F (R2880) with its mazak rot and the tender chassis starts to change shape, THEN needs to be repaired
@@andrewphippsphillips1455 My Hornby Eurostar had mazak rot. Apart from epoxy resin and UV resin probably doomed. Never managed a repair on mine.
@@alanrobertson9790 My Class 31 in 'Dutch' Civil engineers livery, dropped to bits some time ago. But years after getting it. The stupid opening louvered radiator shutters on one side of my large logo class 50 dropped to bits. As did the replacement ones from Peter’s spares.
@@alanrobertson9790 I was fortunate enough that a local model railway shop near me (Smith's in Sheringham, Norfolk) has the services of an old chap who was able to locate the issue. His solution was to have a couple of 3D printed frames to replace the rotten metal ones.
I still have a black 9F outstanding at my Brother's that I will need to get from the storage box and get the same work done on it.
The results are that I will seriously reconsider ever buying anything new from Hornby, as I jettisoned a notorious Class 31 loco that had a reputation for suffering with similar mazak issues.
So frustrating to find out this when we are all careful owners that look after our stock.
For models that are, quite frankly, made on the cheap in China, there is simply no excuse for them to be as expensive as they are. However, there is one simple way to affect change in a positive direction; simply do not buy these overpriced models. Vote with your wallet.
Horn by are a disgrace with hiking prices
Only good thing they have done recently is railroad plus but the name is not good, I hope they focus more on railroad plus that way they can stay in business and every one gets what they want.
Well, Covid has increased container shipping costs by over ten-fold, so that should have increased their costs by a pound or two per loco.
Don't forget the chip shortage which was bound to increase the price of locomotives that have stuff like DC and DCC decoders, and all the stuff going on with china with many businesses leaving china in recent times
Things like shipping and the chips being more expensive of course is a convenient way to justify prices going up; however we must not forget that these models were significantly overpriced even before the pandemic..
My husband said to me after seeing the massive price increases , that was the end of Hornby for him , he says they are greedy and pricing themselves out of business
Pricing new younger people out of the hobby.
@barnabyjoy if you say so ,
All modeling companies have been doing this not just Hornby. This is the reason why the model RR industry is dying, the prices become so high you'd need to remortgage your house to buy a 4-6-2 that makes a noise or a diesel modeled inaccurately that sounds like a vacuum cleaner (Looking at you Lionel!) add to that online train simulators, greedy old farts in shops, and of course tax increases especially here in America thanks to a certain old man and yeah this hobby is not gonna last long. Thankfully some model train vendors at train shows tend to be a little more relaxed on the prices namely for the old stuff but regardless it infuriates me how insane the prices have become especially when the models that cost as much as a Dyson hoover are built real cheap and fall apart compared to models that are older than me but only costing 75% less.
I have been a Hornby fan since the early 1950's, but their recent exploits have left me rather cold. Your video sums up my feelings admirably. Thank you.
Good news: With the growing popularity of 3D Printing, it will soon be possible to get around this issue, which should force model train corporations to lower their prices.
As a broke ass student also in the Netherlands I know the feeling al to well but wow this is so ridiculous I can't put it into words I mean 20% that's like if I spend an entire tear to save up for a model I now need to wait 438 instead of 365 day's I might as well quit the hobby since it almost lookslike I won't be able to buy any models for a good while all because hornby wants more profit
Hornby are about to get what coming to them with the Titfield Thunderbolt set, and I can't wait for the day that happens.
@Aussie Pom I am not prepared to pay the new stupidly high prices. My patience with Hornby has ran out! Especially with the ridiculous light bleed on the Class 60, DVT and the LNER Hitachi train. High prices for trash!
Its bad enough that HORNBY are pricing their models out of reach for the average hobbyist, but the quality and running issues are a disgrace for what you pay. Most of their range are only suitable for static display.
Hi. You are spot on. I used to buy a lot of stock but not now. The move to pre ordering stock was for me the last straw. I will now just use my existing stock. New starters to the hobby have no chance unless they have extremely large disposable incomes.
A Yankee here. It is model railroad manufactuers across the board that are doing things like this. Lionel, the number 1 O Gauge manufactuer in the States (probably control 80% of the market) have jacked their prices up 20% too for toolings over 20 years old. It is really just a shame.
For goodness sake, a simple dock 0-6-0 costs over $100 bucks. Not to mention the price for just the rolling stock.
This is the down side of share holders. They have no feeling for the company, draw as much money out of the company as they can, suck it empty and let it go bankrupt. With the multiple millions they made, they jump over to the next company and do the same. They only care about money. This very same people are also responsible for the world wide drama we live in today.
Haven't come across your videos before. Where have I been? Great work. I'll be pleased if Rapido push the copyright issue through the courts. Time for Hornby to get a wake-up call.
I’ve preordered Lion from Rapido and cancelled the Hornby one from my local shop. I enquired vaguely about them getting Rapido and Accurascale and they mentioned obliquely that Hornby would get upset if they stocked competitor’s models.
Great video. The 'golden age' of Hornby OO was around 2000-2005 when we had quality items from China at fair prices. In recent years the prices have gone through the roof, quality control is poor and the locomotives in particular are too fragile to be used by real modellers. The price of that SE & CR 'Thomas' is a joke, it should be £40 tops. Even basic Railroad range locomotives are no longer affordable. Hornby are trying to control the market by squeezing out the retailers and forcing you to pre-order direct from them at RRP, which I refuse to do. This is clearly a marketing gimmick. Small model shops are going to really struggle as they will be receiving very little new stock to sell. Hornby, you should be ashamed of yourselves.
Its a shame that a hornby 0-4-0 (that originally came out in the 60s) is nearly 80.00 us when you can get a Piko 0-4-0 (that originally was launched in the 50s) for 30.00 that run the same, and has spare parts available from a retailer or factory to order so you can repair the loco yourself.
@@raymondleggs5508 Run the piko on your oo layout
The old Lima, Liliput and Wrenn/mainline models are looking better and better
Dude I love this format, all your videos are great but if you made more like this I wouldn’t mind in the slightest
Hobby of a lifetime ? Yes.. It's how long you have to work to afford a locomotive in OO.
Buy used, you're saving money and not funding China!
I get really annoyed any time I hear about Hornby playtrains because it is such an obvious cheaper copy of märklin my world
I have huge respect for märklin for their dedication to quality and listening to their costumes and seeing another company copy them so obviously makes me really annoyed
Also I get that the high price for the fleischmann/roco br 80 is wrong but we should not compare them to hornby as they actually make some really great quality models for a reasonable price and are very nice people :)
Hornby Playtrains annoy me because that's the price point the Railroad models were when they started the range :( seriously Hornby there are plenty of toy trains out there, give us some truly affordable MODELS
How true it is with the ever increasing prices of our great hobby. There are several issues that arise from the price increase. Firstly Hornby have difficulty in maintaining profitability and have done for several years. By moving there production to China there was a hope that this would solve the problem. It hasn't. The Chinese government demand those companies that now rely on Chinese production to raise the wages so that they align with western pay. No savings there!
We are seeing poor quality locos? Why? Because the production line only random checks the product. So you might be the unlucky one to get a duff unit! Plus there is no real competion in the UK. Dapol are in the same boat. So now we have gone back to the 1940s onwards where the hobby was the prerogative of the wealthier classes that was until Triang broke the mold. If you want a bargain don't buy new Hornby or Dapol, seek out the pre-owned market where there are bargains galore to be had. Finally I'm a great believer in bringing production back to the UK because all we are doing is enriching China at our expense.
When they ask UK prices for made in China garbage, they might as well pull it back. China got a way to loud political mouth lately as well, so again a good reason.
I think they have trapped themselves in targeting the retired "baby Boomers" with loads of cash. This demographic sadly is dying out. What are they going to do when they all have gone to the great layout in the sky? What about the 30 - 50 year olds on a budget? £250 and up for a loco? Build quality is also poor, they are very fragile. If you drop one one on the floor, its a right off!
Feel rather frustrated. I asked for a Hornby L&Y Class 21 Pug for my birthday, which my parents had to purchase direct from Hornby for nearly £90. The tooling turns out to be from the 1980s bought from bloody Dapol. We need a newly-tooled pug, as the one I have runs terribly after owning it for only 4 months, really frustrating. Lastly, the basic 0-4-0 starter locomotives, y'know, the one I and most people started with, ARE NOW NEARLY COSTING £60! When I was younger, you could purchase a decent, non-railroad model for under £80. Remember the whole thing with the B12s? So many returned with dodgy motors, missing roofs and chipped paint. Thank god that the new Dapol Hawthorn Leslie us under £100 (just) as it looks a terrific model. Terrific video too.
Same with the US and Lionel. Lionel is one of the most popular companies for US o gauge, but it's quality control problems are very evident.
Commercially, they're going for low volume and high prices now. It's a valid policy, but not one that will be sustainable. Stack 'em high, sell 'em low (works for Tesco).
Getting the specialist products out in volume, recovering investment costs fast, generating high cash flow, then playing with 'limited issues' for extra profit.
The company was in trouble a few years ago . . . . watch this space!
I’m more a Bachmann fan when it comes to HO/OO scale trains. I love the fact that people are customizing the Bachmann Skarloey into the character’s basis.
Couldn't agree more, I've never had model trains but my son is very keen - but the prices are ridiculous, locomotives are too expensive for him to play with. The Budget Model Railways channel covered this as well. Making the point that younger newcomers to the hobby will be put off by the prices, and that it'll only be affordable by well off older generations - causing the hobby to decline.
I recommend their channel as they offer good advice on cost effective ways to build track layouts, find locomotives and carriages/wagons.
The real problem this creates is that the barrier to entry into model trains is extremely high. If you want a train on a loop to go around your Christmas tree, the simplest of tracks, you're looking at hundreds of pounds in costs. Let alone an actual layout or god forbid DCC. The industry needs a revolution! We all love trains yet we accept prices that alienate most people from what we love. It's very sad.
Railroad 0-4-0s were 25 Pounds RRP in 2019. Now it's 50. Blaming reviewers for that is a bit rich. Some models, the ones that have paid for themselves tenfold, ought not to suffer from a jack that has nil to do with inflation. Newly produced stuff ought to. If your argument had any layer of truth to it that would mean Hatton's Warwells and Barclays, or Kernow's S100s would have also gotten more expensive over time. Yet they didn't.
We've reached the ridiculous point where you can buy vintage Japanese brass locos on ebay for less than a new Hornby model, and they won't fall apart or 'cease to proceed'. Their reliability has been going down as fast as their prices go up - the models look lovely, but are of questionable durability and, in the case of one dud I had, made in such a way they cannot be taken apart to repair. Spare parts almost unobtainable - and most of my local shops don't carry them any longer because of their price fixing antics. Somebody needs to sit down have think very, VERY hard about where they're going - Carey Street is odds on favourite.
It is rather heart breaking that they are doing this considering that a third of my collection is Hornby and 90% of my wish list and they are the brand that got me into model railways to begin with. But I’ve had problems with 2 2017 models myself recently with a black 5 which cost me £150 second hand could only pull half as much as my Bachmann 4f and my S15 which cost me £85 second hand (bargin) could barely pull 20 wagons (however I added weight which makes it decent now) and still has the motor problem that I’d seen on RUclips. However bachmann is guilty as well of the old tooling problem which Sam’s trains showed with the hall class but also I have a jinty from 2005 for £50 which bachmann is still selling at £110!
I'm totally with you there mate. I'm more disappointed with Hornby rather than being angry (as some people are). I want them to thrive but I don't see them doing well in the next few years and with their relationship with retailers at an all-time low, I don't see how they can repair them once the executives at Hornby finally get their act together and realise what they are doing is not good for the company or the hobby. (I'd have thought they would have learnt their lessons by now after nearly going bankrupt, guess some of them haven't).
Spot on mate. Simon proclaims that “it’s not a toy, it’s for keeps…” when actually, it’s not a toy because you keeps (sic) on having to fork out a poxy fortune! 🤬 And frankly, I now feel like it is one bridge of “mugged off” too far. I pre-ordered a BR late livery HushHush from Colletts in Devon (every good model shop deserves a shout out) and poor Leigh, the owner, contacted me to make sure I still wanted to buy it because the price had gone up again before they had even sent the model out! He’s barely making any dosh now because he’s refusing to charge me full wallop, even though I’ve said I don’t mind as it’s not his fault🙄
Like you say, they aren’t targeting kids now, they are targeting deep pockets, which is fine except it is taking the fun out of it and turning it into an elitist hobby, which is terrible 😞 There is definitely a psychological element to this too. Railroad is branded almost to make you think “oh it must be crap then” when actually as some reviews have shown, it is often the opposite case, and there are plenty of crap expensive models too! 🤔
The L&M debacle is a classic example of hanging your self when given enough rope. I suspect most won’t care about the exact accuracy, but when it is top dollar, you expect something better than that! 🤷🏻♂️
By the way you’re not a grumpy wotsit. You’re just not a mug. Cheers fella, love this video 👍🍀😎
Let us not forget that Hornby was brought by an investment company and has been loosing money at least until 2020. With a boom in the hobby especially with the pandemic they took the opportunity to raise the prices. I don't agree the way they went about it and can see the reasons. My issue with Hornby is that they think they are top quality model makers and pricing themselves for that except they are not: their quality is variable, they are living off the heritage name and that is not good enough.
This is a really good video about this issue!
The insane price jacking (from several brands, not just Hornby) is what will inevitably kill this hobby if it keeps happening. The old crusty men that these brands try to cater to are slowly dying out, and the hobby is far too expensive for many of the younger generation who already have to deal with the expenses of school, food, housing, probably a car, and maybe even a family.
From a business point of view Hornby is fascinating and maybe best described as "Market leaders in miss-reading the market". The fact they are still in business is remarkable, I've followed the story since the early 90s when it was used as a case study in university about how not to run a legacy business.
So to give some info about the Fleischmann BR 80. Fleischmann does not Produce H0 models anymore, only gauge N.
What ended up appearing was a Roco BR 80 with a newer body
The only quality loco Hornby produced in 2021, off the top of my head, was the Merchant Navy. I would absolutely LOVE a Turbomotive, but over £250 for a 'model' that probably won't run properly a month! No chance! I'll juet copy Sam'sTrains, buy a Tri-Ang Princess, and convert that into 6202 for a fraction of the cost!
i do agree there scott, hornby has overprised everything. when i was 7 i got a flying scotsman train set which i still have to this day, and it had a price around 160 pounds. NOW IT COSTS 219.99 pounds. its discusting. superb video btw.
They make "models" not "toys" but none of their pacific locos have working rear pony trucks, they just have fixed flangeless wheels that drop inside the track on curves. But they are apparently worth £260 🤯
Advantages of the internet:
Participate in the UK rail hobby as an American.
Listen to a wide variety of English Dialects.
An update, Hornby have removed all traces of both sets and clip seen at the start from website and RUclips announcement.
Well said 👏 im with you all the way hornby has gone down the toilet 🤨
Agreeee! I'm a crusty man and I'm fed up with them, so it's back to kits for me. Don't even ask me about my Hush Hush. Byeee Hornby!
No crusty men were insulted in the making of this video. I hope.
@@FlyingScott Nah, not at all, I have real sympathy for modellers starting out! But Hornby are even pricing me out of their market. They clearly don't listen when sites like "Sam's Trains" label them "rip off". Anyone on a budget (and that doesn't include Hornby's Simon you will notice!) can no longer acquire a collection of models needed to model railways. BTW BRM magazine had a comment section years ago pointing out the then new policy of Hornby withdrawing retailer support and selling direct. It was a board and financial backer decision which clearly now holds sway in the company. My guess, either Bachmann don't follow suit and Hornby expires, or Bachmann do follow, and they both expire, 'cos no-one normal can afford to play this game any more. We need the Model Railway press to desist in massaging the major UK manufacturers and tell them some home truths, like don't detail with flimsy plastic, make sure their mechanisms are workable and robust and design to a price their market can afford while realising they could kill the goose that is laying their golden handshakes..
Good luck with the channel - keep on moaning please!
well said that man, I got a load of stick for saying the same things from Hornby fanboys, hopefully some of those fanboys are watching this
As a young man in my 20s who recently got into model kits, I wanted to get back into model railways. I had a few of the Thomas the Tank Engine electric trains when I was younger and could remember being able to save up pocket money for them. I also inherited a lot of my realistic models from my family, so I could run those on a train set I got for Christmas. All of them were Hornby, so I naturally looked at them first. I was absolutely horrified to see I would be paying £100+ for a basic engine, especially ones that a lot of folks were calling unreliable. It was going to cost a lot more to replace my admittedly knackered rolling stock. How Hornby expects to draw in new hobbyists and please regulars when they're charging £40+ for a pocket rocket that might break is honestly beyond me. Looks like I'll be running my 30+ years old King George V engine for quite a while now.
Even with the ridiculous prices, you can still build a model railway on the cheap. I recommend checking out Budget Model Railways here on RUclips
If anyone’s looking for a more sensible reason for why the prices are jacked so high, here is why
Most MR manufacturers outsource production of their products to China due to its cheap workforce.
The problem, is that the cheap workforce is not that cheap anymore and labor costs in China are rising significantly.
This is a major problem for modeling as a whole and we need to figure out a solution fast.
Our hobby is already shrinking and as long as companies jack up the price to compensate for lost revenue it will only get worse. We will lose our best hope for the hobby, broke college students. I KNOW IT SOUNDS STUPID but the older elitist snobs who care more about detail than cost will not last forever.
I have been saying this for years, I have sent Hornby many emails about their models, quality, price, customer care and they never reply. I don`t want Hornby to fade away, I want them to talk to customers.
Stop buying Hornby stuff and they'll either get the message or go broke. I don't like being ripped off by the Chinese, like so many former British products, Hornby is no longer made here.
Good to hear your sound opinions. Re poor Hornby quality you’re right. I currently have gripes like the atrocious Railroad Flying Scotsman. The recent 4 & 6 wheeler coaches that they rushed to beat Hutton’s. The 4 wheelers had dodgy mag lights and light showing through the plastic.
For all the people complaining about the price rises... note that they have not made very good profits in recent years. Yes, they did make a profit with the virus helping them but not a big one. The cost of things from China has gone mad with shipping increases, problems in China etc. It could be they are inefficent in other ways etc but plenty of other Made in China things are increasing in price a LOT. And yes, this includes some other brands of trains. Also some have made the (sensible in my mind) move to take some production out of China (eg Dapol).
Interesting points, especially with the Rocket mineral "wagons", I'd honestly never noticed that before... What I think needs to be understood as well, is that the whole Lion issue isn't the first time Hornby have done this; there's several locos inc Terriers, 66's, the B1 to name a few where Hornby have competed directly with competition on the same model. In a let's be honest, quire a small market, the only thing this direct competition will do is push smaller producers out of the market, & the only people that benefits are Hornby. Hornby are in this to "win" and actively want to subvert the competition, its this aggressive capitalism which I think could seriously backfire in such a small market & its not what I believe Hornby should be doing.
As a fellow member of the "Priced Out of the Hobby" club, I'm going to remark that if Hornby wants to make money again, they need to drop the "superfine detail" nonsense.
Produce old tooled things, and sell them cheap. Toolings from 20-40 years ago that still work and more importantly made back their money ages ago. Get more people to buy cheaper products, and it'll be better for Hornby than selling only a few expensive models to a literally dying consumer base.
They could even go into 3D printed kits like Dapol's ex-airfix stuff. Use those to try encouraging younger modellers to "do it themselves" and buy Humbrol paints.
I find some irony in your statement. I have two Flying Scotsmans. One is from the early 2000 and the other is about the same age as James May's one so 80s I think. The older one actually looks nicer over all than it's early 2000s variant.
Am really at the point in giving up on the hobby not just the out of controled price increase but also the bad condition some off these new model are getting too 😔
Maybe get into restoring old engines? That might spark a new side of the hobby for you.
@@chicagolandrailroader That what am doing at the moment but still learning and price for none working models are going up too I wouldn't be surprised if they became to much money as well
As a fellow dutchman i got the same problem. Together with things like brexit the prices of the more expensive models have started to come near brands like roco and i won’t be suprised that the prices will be up to the same level by next year.
who the hell is hornbys target consumer? sure as hell isnt the average guy anymore... my kids will play with preowned models now XD
They are targeting the middle aged bloke with diisposable income trying the milk off the nastalgia. My issue with that is that it is zero investment for younger generation who can not afford to enter the hobby. I liked Hornby because they use to cover the this segment of the market. As for quality, they are too variable and still their best products are no Roco /Fleischman.
@@cotochris Not even middle aged, they're targeting OAPs now.
I mentioned the exact same thing on the actual video of the 2022! Strangely, StudioCanal already know that Hornby might make the Titfield Thunderbolt because they're making the 4F from The Railway Children Return, which is another film by StudioCanal!
Also, the price increase for the BR/DR/DRG/DB (whatever, It's German) 80, it's the same class but has been given a facelift by being made from completely new tooling (the tooling for yours had actually been retired years ago) but the price increases are just stupid. Most of costs appear more centralised on the UK but forget about the currency of other countries (I live in Australia, born and bred, and naturally, I was stocked to see the A4 with my home nation's name in the range. The problem is the price, of which UK£217.99 is AU$413.29 and not everyone has that money, but I'm still going after that A4).
I gave up 4mm electric mice a la Hornby a few years ago- now I have 16mm narrow gauge in the garden. I built a 16mm (O gauge) coal fired loco from a kit of (British!) parts for £1500, which when you consider that Hornby charge £250 for a locomotive that doesn't work, seems rather good value.
First video I've seen of your channel, very entertaining! I have all sorts of locos; I think the triang hornby / hornby range from late 60s - early 90s are the best for quality and value for money, as well as being easy to repair /rebuild. Lima models are underratted I think too; some are noisy but run forever with minimal maintenance, and are a touch too light but very robust.
The noise adds character
Wait you're Dutch? All this while I thought you were Scottish! Great video mate, I agree with everything you said! Maybe if they found a way to up the quality and drop the prices, they'd lose that outdated image and start drawing in younger blood into the hobby! Awesome content as usual mate! Cheers!
Well, I am Scottish. You can make sushi in Belgium but that doesn't make it a Belgian dish either.
@@FlyingScott I see! Thanks for clearing things up, laddie!
When I started model railway I brought a railroad 9f, setting me back £80, there finally updated the 9f but for £250 that is just dcc ready is getting beyond a joke.
I personally have gotten to the point where I have just bought motor chassis and started to 3d print my own bodies and rolling stock. Sure, they are not as pretty as the $200 models, but for that price I can have a loco and a rake of rolling stock so long it is impractical for my layout.
I used to think european mainland models were way too expensive, then brexit happened and suddenly I'm slapped with 24% tax on everything I buy from the UK.
This combined with Hornbys price hikes makes it so mainland models are once again cheaper for me... 😂
8:52 I appreciate the honesty.
I still have an early 1970s Hornby Catalogue, in there are their switches, Points - On-Off - On-On. They were £1.95 each. Now they're almost £20. That's a 50 year old product that hasn't changed on iota. I thought the ideal of switching production to China was to keep prices low........ Just how much would they be if production was still in England !
I'm an American, I want to model British, and as overpriced as American models are, Hornby are really pushing me to just, not model British after all, despite how much I love the aesthetics of the early BR era. It's kind of sad that Hornby's predatory marketeering and pricing structure is turning me away from something I love, and if it's turning me away, I -can't- be the only one, aye?
Sorry for being negative with you, but I never get tired of your videos, stay awesome!
My suggestion for if you do want to continue with British-outline modelling is to go second-hand. You can get older hornby (1970s to early 2000s), lima, triang, mainline, etc models for really low prices with the likes of ebay, and while they aren't the most detailed models they do run fairly well even after so many years.
Well I do want Hornby to re-release many of their old products including Triang. the main thing I want them to re-release is the Hornby Eurostar.
they have the newer generation of the eurostar but i know what you mean the original one i think looks timeless but it is due a upgrade
They are re-releasing some Tri-ang stuff. Better have got in line though, they're only making 500!
Seriously. Hornby is producing an entire product line for international sale in the same numbers that Lima would for number variants like 60003 "Christopher Wren", commissioned as a retailer-exclusive by a single model shop.
Well done on 'borrowing' the Titfield and Lion clips from Hornby's 2022 Range video - Hornby have now edited them out of theirs!
I have illegal footage on my hands lads!
@@FlyingScott hope they don't get wind of it and ask (or rather, instruct) you to pull it. It's a hot topic on RMweb, if you didn't already know (but I'm sure you do...).
Lots of people saying buy second hand instead, however this has caused another problem in that second hand prices have rocketed in response to the new prices, even on really old stock. I remember when (not so long back) £30 was pretty much the top you would pay for a s/h Lima diesel - now the decent examples START at £30 and go up in price! Also this combined with the misconception that all model trains are valuable antiques has almost ended the golden era of eBay bargains.
Hornby needs to take a look at the company's financial history and make sure it doesn't repeat the many mistakes of its past (and also not invent new ones). My father resurrected the company from the ashes back in the 1980s and I would be unhappy to see it back in the situation he sorted out all those years ago.
It's not only Hornby that's increasing they're prices like crazy. IT'S ALSO EVERY OTHER GODDAMN MANUFACTURER IN EUROPE 😩
First time I've come across your channel mate.Brilliant !! Very funny with plenty of sarcastic content.👍
Good on you. I think it is disgusting the way they are carrying on. I dropped £3000 of orders with them last year and it will be similar this year. Who the hell is buying some of these products?. Who is paying £185 for a shunter and thinking that was a good idea!?.
this is the 1st of your videos ive ever watched, and im subscribed, absolutely brilliant video, well done!
Oh but disappointment always await those who climb aboard this wild ride ;)
@@FlyingScott im watching some of your other videos to, i think this ride suits me fine lol!
I have a 30 year old Fleischmann "Karl" and still runs perfectly. Pure quality.
7:44 Hatton's: **announces their Genesis line of pre-grouping coaches**
Hornby: **Shamelessly imitates that idea, with the knowledge that their product will be more popular because it has a famous brand attached to it..**
This hobbies gone mad ebay seller's are offering broken models with parts missing ( detail packs etc )for the same price of a highly inflated new Hornby product, then selling the detail pack for another £18.00 plus postage wow
Now I'm wondering how James May will react to this.
He'd chuck the boxes in the bin for starters! (I wonder though, did he really do that? 🤔)
I remember 20 years ago (exactly) I acquired brand new a train set containing a Duchess pacific, 3 coaches, controller, track etc for the princely sum of £69. The dealer made a profit on this too.
Thank the Lord that Hornby don't make bread, otherwise it would cost 20 quid a loaf!!
Neatly illustrating your point, I pre-ordered 91111 when it was announced in 2020 for 174.99, then GNER 91117 in 2021 for 194.99, just went to have a look at adding LNER 91101 which was added this year and they want 216.99 for it! An increase of essentially 25% in 2 years for the same model.
I'm sorry to break it to you, but this behaviour has been happening for many years and is certainly not just confined to Hornby. If you take a look at Bachmann's catalogue and pricing, you'll note very similar trends and behaviour with regard to price structuring. To use a famous Die Hard quote - ''welcome to the party, pal''. I've since moved away from OO and focussed on something much cheaper and far more durable and reliable - G Scale. And yes, cheaper. When you can get bogie coaches four times the size of OO versions for circa £30 with flush glazing and bags of potential and tank engines that'll survive all weather's for easily under £100, there is no going back. Just takes you back to the essence of what model railways is really all about - modelling. None of these overblown sounds, flashy lights and exact number of rivets. Who cares when the train is actually terrorised by your neighbours cat.
Was your shop in Polwarth? I remember there was a shop that had a little layout.
No that can't have been us, I'm afraid.
$50 for a £10 turnout. $700-1200 for £180-250 loco . Poms been ripping us off for years . You got no complaints .
I'm another totally disillusioned with Hornby and its current management who operate, in my view, very underhand business practices. Having bought my first Triang Railways catalogue some 60 years ago and a Hornby/Triang one every year since I have decided to buy no more Hornby related stuff until things change, if they ever do.
Literally I bought 5 years ago I bought a complete flying Scot’s man set for 120 and now you would lucky to get one
im 29...
when I was a kid in late 90s early 00s the HST cost 30 pounds (too expensive to have)
as of 2023 its 157.99 for the modern set version
if you want the different colours and such... 300 to 400 pounds just for the locomotives with the carriages being 45 pounds each
just 10 years ago I could pick up second hand hornby sets and lima sets for 20 pounds for 1 powercar and 10 for 1 carriage
the hornby company are massively ripping off the enthusiasts and pushing the kids entirely out of the market. these model rail sets were aimed originally at both kids and pensioners alike.
it makes me so angry because my parents couldnt afford them when I was a kid 20 years ago and now I cant really even afford them as an adult without alot of saving and heafty sacrifices.
milk, milk
lemonade
round the corner fudge is made
I saw a hornby Thomas engine for £200+ and i was amazed by how much they go for now
I feel bad for all of this. Hopefully after this pandemic, Hornby will get back on track and prices will be lowered.
From Cityam - Model railway company Hornby has returned to a profit for the first time in nearly a decade after an upsurge in interest for its products during lockdown. The group reported a 33 per cent increase in revenue to £21.1m in the first half of the year, up from £15.9m in 2019.
I remember when Hornby moved to China to keep costs down , well that didn't work out !
I first wanted to get into model trains in like 2017ish kind of times. Then I stopped for a few years for other hobbies, now I want to get back into trains and I'm greeted with this. That's very fun.
* dies *
Really enjoyed that and was surprised by the era 1 wagons being the Rocket tender! From...(compared to you anyway) a crusty old man who hides his purchases from his wife - and has never paid more than £120 for a loco 😂
What’s worse, young buyers don’t know any better. About 10 years ago we bought a Bachmann switcher for ~$100 because, well, isn’t that what it costs?
You see a scale model ages 14 and up and you forget that it’s a metal shell in a motor.
Very interesting. I have recently returned to the hobby. All be in now in N gauge. However I watched the 2022 hornby release video and was shocked at some of the prices. Remember buying little plank wagons from the local model shop as a kid in the 90s for about a fiver with my pocket money. Now all wagons seem to be at least £20. And appear to be roughly the same!
The other thing that this means is the supply and price of second hand items will also increase to align with the new prices and demand.
Shame as I feel the hobby could be even more popular if more attainable
When I got into the hobby, a new Hornby open wagon was 25p. (!) My pocket money bought me two more wagons. Kids these days must need an awful lot of pocket money!
I remember saving up for an M7. It was just pre-decimalisation, and cost a couple of shillings over £3. So a loco cost around the same as 12 wagons. I suppose a similar ratio still applies.
…
Why.
Hornby is one of my favourite companies ever, its the only company i have consistently bought from and they make some great models! I really hate they choose this as this will ruin them, either the company falls or they will give in, i personally hate hornby for doing this because they wont make it out of this. They dug their own grave at this point and they cant save themselves
insane prices!!
I gave up on this hobby recently.
To expensive and the models are to fragile and track cleaning is annoying. Plus fixing and maintaining them and the track.
I now build and run British LEGO diesel and steam trains.
As someone who is TRYING to get into model railways, this is especially annoying. There’s a reason why I pretty much only buy the cheap second hand models off of Hattons. If I want to buy something off of hornby’s website, I pretty much need to sell a kidney. Not to mention, when I got my first controller, IT WAS BROKEN OUT OF THE BOX. Hornby really need to step up there game.
My 40th is fast on approach. Friends and family have asked if I'd like anything special and, I'd like something I will keep for many years, maybe all time. So, growing up with Hornby, I thought Yeah, that'll do a treat. I love the Mallard and know there's a record breaker set. Looked it up, found it and thought that looks great. Until something caught my eye. 60022. Huh. Curious. I have a painting of the Mallard on my wall. Its number is 4468. What the deuce?! So, I did a bit of homework and lo and behold it was 4468 that broke the record in 1938. 60022 didn't come in until 11 years later under BR. This has yo be the most basic yet egregious oversight I've ever seen.
So, I do some more research. Each set comes with a track mat. That's folded up in the box and crushed down to fit. Making huge creases making track unable to sit on it correctly.
Further research. Customer service is awful.
So, suffice to say, I'm not going ahead with these sets. Throwing my money away, I'm not thrilled about. Throwing away other people's money? Not a chance!!!
The writing is on the wall for Hornby
its exactly as thought concerning Hornby.. if I can't buy what I need off ebay then I look at another manufacturer I will not pay top price for old mouldings .
Ah yes, Hornby, the Apple of the model railway world...
They can't even do proper research to save their lives. The liveries for their 'Class 57' (lazy rehash of a Lima 47 into a 57/0) are actually from the 57/3. Which not only is completely wrong, but just completely odd aesthetics wise.
Fully agree Hornby have been going back to 970's quality for years, the W1 typically is a total waste of space and is worth no more that half the catalogue price.
Many good points raised here lad, of which some I had myself come to the realisation of...
New locos now are now a thing of the past, only go on eBay now for my models, as most are within my price range and the older products are better than of today, would love the new Hornby BR Standard class 2 Mt, but at near £200 mark, NO way !!! going to convert and older Bachmann Ivatt...