Lightweight Wheels vs Heavy Wheels Acceleration Test | Are Light Wheels Worth It? Real World Results
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
- Shop Unique Car Apparel & Accessories: drivendistrict...
Dragy Performance Meter: amzn.to/3f88bs6
GoPro Hero 7 Black: amzn.to/318KDuZ
Does wheel weight matter? What does 1lb of unsprung weight equal to? Do lightweight wheels affect acceleration performance? In this video I cover my own personal results from dropping 6lbs per wheel, and how it effected acceleration, and if light wheels make your car faster.
I tried my best to limit any variables, and I used a few different methods to come to my conclusions in this test. All data that I was able to track is taken into consideration. There are always variables in these types of lightweight wheel testing scenarios, but hopefully this brings another angle to the debate of light wheels and performance gains.
Ragazzon Exhaust & Abarth Products: www.abarthtuni...
Use code DRIVENDISTRICT to Save 5% Off your order at abarthtuning.com
Have you upgraded to lightweight wheels, and have you seen a benefit from it? Or are you considering lightweight wheels now? Drop a comment below and let me know!
This is tested really well, the community appreciates you sir!
A huge advantage of the lightweight wheels come from handling and corning. With a brake kit, and wheels I shave ~15 unsprung per corner. And the difference in handling was insane. The car felt quicker in a straight line and more responsive as well, but by far the biggest changes were in handling.
I 100% agree with you. I don’t have as much experience in that field but I know those would be impacted greatly as well as most folks mention that.
I just really wanted to do a test based on acceleration since I haven’t seen much on that. The difference is not huge, but it’s definitely noticeable and helps. I know a lot of people only focus on the “looks” of the wheel and don’t take weight into consideration so maybe this could help people make a better decision when choosing wheels 😃
Hopefully this year I can get the car on the track and start to get a better feel for those other aspects! 👍
15lbs per corner! Holey smokes, that's like 700+lbs shaved...christ almighty :-)
@@MegaHollywood1971how's that 700pd?
@@curtisjonesiii1600 broscience xD 50% facts, 50% magic, 100% results
@@DrivenDistrictthe diff opens bettah
Save yourself ten minutes and start watching at 9:48 for the useful info.
This and the fact that unsprung weight really effects responsiveness in the handling department makes a strong case for lighter wheels. Thanks --will use this info for my R53 Mini JCW.
Exactly! Lot's of other benefits as well besides the acceleration testing I did :)
and here i am a year later finding this because i want to lighten up an F56 JCW :) Loved my R53!
Great test, with actual live data!
Thank you! Yea, online there are so many theories on unsprung vs sprung weight....so decided to put my own twist on that debate with some real world data.
You were very well spoken, informative, and shared all the data. Good job, I wanted to test this on my channel too but had some issues. So I did research and found all the same arguments like you. Thanks for this. This was super informative.
Thanks! 🙏 Really appreciate it! Glad you enjoyed it.
Thank you for providing this test. The only thing not shown that could impact the test is wind/direction.
But, you did a good job of limiting the variables you could control
Thanks. And yea these variables are not the easiest to control lol For what it’s worth, I just checked the statical weather data:
Stock = 5mph wind S
OZ Wheels = 9mph wind WSW
According to Google WSW is a “West Southwest” wind that is slightly angled to the South, but emphasized more on the West.
I checked on Google Maps and the direction I was traveling during my tests was almost directly East (just a hair South)
So both winds have a slight angle to South, but with the OZ Wheels that wind is emphasized more on the West and I was going more East.
So might have been negatively impacting the OZ Wheel run a bit more, but probably by a very very small amount. Always good to add these little things into the mix though!
its great to see this kind of testing being done so thoroughly, great job! another thing to consider- wouldn’t reducing the weight of the wheel have greater effect from a standstll due to newton’s first law? or would it be the same overall
it will have the same effect from a standstill as it will from a rolling pull. it's interesting to see as it's not only the rotational force of a wheel, it's also the vertical travel of the suspension which is affected by the mass of a wheel, lighter the wheel, the easier it will travel up and down thus resulting in a more comfortable ride.
This was a very interesting test of the effect of lower rotational mass on acceleration.
I have a 370Z sport 6MT and replaced the OEM Bridgestone tires with some Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 tires that are about 3 to 4 lbs lighter per tire than the stock tires. I have just ordered some Litespeed forged magnesium wheels that will weigh about 8 to 9 lbs less per wheel. In about 6 months I'm going to have a brake job done and will replace the all steel stock rotors with some two-piece aluminum hat ones that will weigh about 5 to 10 lbs less over stock. Finally, I'm going to replace the steel wheel studs and lug nuts with titanium ones. The end result over stock should be about an average 22 lb reduction in corner weight. My fitment has larger front wheels with larger brakes, hence the increased weight savings on the front wheels, as compared to the rears.
I have already had exhaust and intake bolt ons done with a good dyno tune and got about a 50 hp increase in crank peak hp, estimated.
I’m so jealous of the wheels you ordered. I’ve been drooling over those. Just about the lightest wheels you can get.
@@RB-xv4si They are, close to the weight of the carbon fiber wheels - minus the insane cost and increased fragility. Reduced weight, within limits, is one of the best ways to achieve higher performance, as it benefits all aspects of performance.
U need light weight suspension to be safer
I lost 80lbs of my own body weight and that will also make a difference too lol
@@jaygarcia6388 I'm working on that😀
Great video... This is pretty spot on as far as testing goes.
I watched another one yesterday where a guy added 160 lbs total in wheels and tires to his pickup truck, and it only lost 0.06 seconds in the 1/4 mile.
As a motorcycle drag racer, I know very little weight difference changes a lot on bikes. And from his video, a lot of rotating mass changed very little on his heavy pickup. So it makes sense that your lightweight, low torque car would have moderate differences with just 24 lbs of rotating mass..
Would have been interesting to see the fuel mileage effects as well, but I'm sure that's a little too late now a few years later. Lol
I drive an underpowered 2019 Mazda3 awd hatchback 186/186 hp-tq. Guessing it weighs under 3200lbs base model (premium 3255lbs with subwoofers, power seats, moonroof, etc). I weighed my wheels and tires and they came in at 50lbs each with Pirelli P Zero at 19.2lbs. The OEM tire is 23lbs. That's almost 31lbs per wheel. It's not helping performance one bit. Shedding almost 4lbs from the tires and a drop in K&N, I do notice the car is quicker, not by a lot but better than before.
Not much you can do for a Skyactiv G engine at 13:1cr on 87 octane. Started pumping 93 due to pulled timing at high RPM on 87, and that seems to be a nice improvement. Someone dyno'd their Mazda after 4000 miles of 91 octane and gained a good amount of power. He was trying to prove Mazda's Skyactiv has a self learning ECU. Now I'm in the market for some forged wheels so I can get this underpowered car moving. Too many soccer moms with turbo CUV to compete with on the road.
I've had lightweight aftermarket 16s in my 2014 Mazda 3 for 7 years now. They were lighter than the stock 16s by 4-6lbs each or so.
Car accelerates, brakes, rides better and get much higher MPGs. 16" wheels are the way to go.
Each wheel w/ tire was like 34lbs if I remember correctly.
Fact, my 2012 Prius V came with stock 17 inch alloys total weight with tire is 45 lbs. I replaced them with 17 Konig Feathers, 16 lb wheel with yokohama avid ascend 215/50/17 tire it came in at 39 lbs. My gas mileage went from 39mpg to 45 mpg average with city and hwy driving for 800 miles so far , those are just the facts.
@brucewayne2773 - going by your details it is impossible result as slight decrease in moment of inertia of your tyres cannot correspond with 6 mpg improvement - I suggest you have fudged your results or simply driving more sensibly with the new tyres
@@majorrgeek I’ve done many tests with heavy stock wheels vs forged wheels. My tests are accurate. Mind you highway miles vary very little vs city mileage. I’ve noticed a huge difference in city mileage
@@brucewayne2773 - may be so, but your gas mileage improvements have nil to do with the rotational moment of inertia of your rims and tyres -
GT350 vs GT350R. GT350R Carbon Fiber wheels are supposed to weigh about 18 lbs each or 72 lbs a set.
GT350 AL wheels could weigh an average of 29 lbs each or 116 lbs a set. From magazine articles it seems to be .2 or .3 seconds faster 0-60. Driving both cars, the GT350R does seem a bit sharper in handling. And I think some of the feel is the lighter wheels.
Absolutely. Unfortunately the 350R carbon wheels are $7k EACH because they are so light...but you can get a set of custom Magnesium wheels from Litespeed Racing at 19lbs each for a fraction of the price. Just a protip if you want to upgrade your 350.
@@slothfish I will be buying something lighter than stock. Used Carbon sets sometimes sell for $6k to $9k for all four if you are lucky and ready to buy
Agreed. There is a marginal increase in acceleration benefit with lighter wheels. The biggest improvement is lateral handling/steering + braking. The suspension responds faster bottom line. Of course, a decent tire needs to come into play.
I will add, that as speed increases the lower weight plays a much larger role in continuation.
Good enough test for the "layman"!
6lbs per corner (given the tires weighed the same as the previous) would equal approx 280lbs(+/-) of weight savings by the look at your draggy / BUT not "dead" weight, just the rotating mass.
You can take more advantage of the low weight wheels saving fuel taking the gears more early. Results may be more noticeable in low rpm because of the low torque delivered.
From my opinion the improved handling is resulting from the reduced inertia of the lighter wheels (the can react to the uneveness of the road surface much faster than a heavier wheel). Comfort should also improve compared to heavier wheel.
This is a detailed, and real world test. Very good indeed, thank you.
Well done! Helped me justify buying the expensive lightweight wheels lol
Thanks! lol Better than spending money on expensive heavy wheels 😂
How about the handing? Was is any better?
Any update on if you actually got better gas mileage with the lighter wheels?
Tenths of a second. Useful on the street, debatable. The big advantage/feel will be in the suspension (feel) as it has 6 less pounds to control movement of. Maybe better fuel mileage, but again, tenths of a mpg. Yes, over time the "savings" add up, but it will take awhile. Suspension response and looks are the improved areas. 👍🏁
Mine stock with extreme contact sports are 68lbs with my American racing wheels and same tires it’s only 44-45lbs. Sad I can tell how it feels tho🥲
Love the video. I don’t know if I’ll rush out to buy new light weight wheels, but would consider doing so if a stock one gets damaged. Looking forward to your EC tune video. I just put on in my 124. It feels faster but hard to tell.
Thanks, appreciate it! And yea I definitely feel the difference with the Phase 1 tune, data shows it as well ;) I'll put that video together in the next week or so. Keep in mind Phase 1 can also be very different feeling depending on what mods you have. Some people have Phase 1 on a completely stock car, and then myself I have Phase 1 with a lot of bolt-ons which will allow for a slightly more aggressive Phase 1 tune. So although it's still "Phase 1", they will be different in a way since Eurocompulsion takes into consideration what mods you have when dialing in your tune. I'll cover some of that in my video as well. Thanks again for the support!
There is a common misconception mentioned at 11:18. Although any improvement is surely cool (and decreasing weight is my favourite thing to do with my cars - took ~600 lbs 😯 off my Toyota Previa MkI in 2015, turning it into a COMPLETELY different animal), accelerating from 35 mph to 70 mph a tenth of a second earlier does NOT shave off a tenth of a second in terms of lap time. Even if you accelerate from 35 mph to 70 mph a full second quicker, the lap time difference coming purely from that single acceleration is very small (much smaller than 1 second). In more specific terms (with linear acceleration for simplification but it would also work with real acceleration that decreases with speed), accelerating from 35 to 70 means an average speed of 52.5 mph. If you do that in 5.72 s, you cover a distance of ~134.246 metres while doing the same in 5.84 s means covering ~137.062 metres. As you can see, the stock car reaches 70 mph a bit later BUT also covers a bigger distance! If we consider that the lighter car covered 134.246 metres at an exit speed of 70 mph and presume it keeps accelerating at the same rate of ~2.735 m/s^2, it will cover the remaining ~2.816 metres in ~0.09 s. *That means you shaved off just ~0.03 s!* Still, every millisecond IS good, of course. 🙂
Fun fact, the stock Lusso wheels and Classica wheels are about 2Kg lighter (per wheel) than the Abarth wheels.
Lol
Lol go figure! Nice job Abarth lol
I’ve got an Abarth and feel the wheels look heavy and clunky.
@@peteflynn3923 And they are.
Why? Who knows.
This was very well presented and I love that you controlled for virtually every variable. One change I would make with any further testing is to add an ECU scanner of some sort to get digital speedometer readouts to compare with the GPS data
This shows a much bigger difference than I suspected!
Great experiment. Combine the lightweight wheels with high performance tires and the results greatly improve.
Thanks! And yup! Currently on the factory rubber but after winter I plan to add some more power to the car and will upgrade the tires as well.
What a great video. Thank you. I am actually going slightly opposite direction with my NC Miata. Stock wheels are 17.7lbs and the wheels I am replacing them with are, by best account, around 20lbs. The acceleration speeds aren't as important to me. But the overall manners of the car are. But I almost feel like if you're Fiata came with wheels that are about what I am going to, then it may not be terrible? Ands just me using my hope logic. =)
Wow, this was an automotive engineering college level class and lecture. Yes, I definitely will always want lightweight wheels over stock wheels. I have a 2007 Hyundai Elantra. Back in 2009, I purchased some wheels that looked great on my car. But they were much heavier. I had those heavier wheels on my car for 5-years. I noticed 2-negative effects about the heavy wheels. 1) My gas mileage went down, and 2) my brakes wore down sooner. All this is what I noticed in the five year time span. I eventually went back to the lighter stock wheels to save my gasoline. And my wear and tear on the brakes. Lighter weight wheels are definitely an advantage on gas mileage and your brakes longevity. It was a slap in the face reality check that I went through.
Wow! Such dedication! But my man, do you feel anything? Everyday use? The consumption is the same?
I mean there are positive numbers, yet 0.x you know but I really wonder if you feel the difference, consumption and all that.
amazing video man
wider tires make a huge difference in acceleration.
I've upgraded from stock 205 tires to 235 and the car is from now on so much slower..
I was not expecting this
But you gain more grip mate. If you don't have the power ofc it's slower. Keep in mind that a car is made and calculated by engineers hehe every centimeter and every gram of the car to aerodynamics and so on.
Yea in this video I have the same factory tires. Since this video I have upgraded my tires from 205 to 215, but my 215 tires weigh the same as my 205's so I didn't add any extra weight. You probably added a good amount of weight going from 205 to 235 which slowed the car down. A lot of people over look weight when it comes to wheel and tires but I always take weight into consideration when choosing wheels/tires.
@@DrivenDistrict how do u know how much a tire weights before buying em
I purchased mine from Tire Rack which listed the weight. Some sites don’t and I’ll have to further research until I can find the weight.
Then reduce to a 225 or 215 tire (w/appropriate aspect ratio)...that's my fear going from a 235/45/17 to a 265/35/18 on my WRX. Wider tire(s), more grip, but more weight (and rolling resistance)...
Lightweight if u only track the car and few other things. Stock or heavier wheels for everything else. I have to take my light weights off when it snows and or if the roads are bad. I use the heavy wheels and i get better traction in those conditions. Track days i use the light boys but my car dosnt really chamge too much but my suspension likes the shedded pounds.
Excellent point! Lighter wheels actually reduce traction. There is a very old UK magazine test, where a Ford Fiesta ST was faster 0-60mph in the dry with lighter wheels but actually slower in the wet with lighter wheels.
Excellent video. confirmed why I always run lightweight wheels on all my vehicles.👍
Should make more of a difference in a car with more power just got 35 lighter wheels for my 550whp 335i can't wait
I know for a fact when I upgraded my 2012 Chevrolet Camaro LS's steel wheels (heritage black 18x7.5") to aftermarket Konig's that it sure felt not only faster but more responsive in the turns. Each heritage black OEM wheel weighed 32 pounds!
Damn that's heavy! lol Konig's are usually fairly light, how much did they weight compared to the 32lbs wheels?
@@DrivenDistrict The Konigs were 21.5 pounds each. From what I remember back in 2013.
Oh wow, what's a HUGE difference! A lot of people don't take wheel weight into consideration and just go for looks. I know when I was younger I kind of fell into that area. But now they need to both look good, and be light weight!
I just swapped my NNBS RCSB Silverado's 20 inchers (80 lb per corner with tire) to lightweight 17 X 9 (52 lb per corner with tire). Not only 112 lb lighter but about 10% smaller diameter, effectively reducing the gear ratio. While calling it a "Sport Truck" is still a bit of a stretch, the improvement is impressive. The big wheels look great but that's about the end of the good news.
Eibach springs didn't make a difference because you are doing rolling starts... This test would be different from a stand still but that's a different story...
Been waiting for this video for years
I appreciate the effort to take into consideration as many variables as you can in your "home made" environment and make comparison as fair as possible, thank you for the video.
Any idea on light weight tyres? I have been trying to gather information but it is not easy. I am interested in a set of 235-35-19" by Goodyear or Michelin whichever are lighter.
Tire Rack usually does a good job of posting tire weight, I would compare on there. I now upgraded my tires too. I went from the factory Bridgestones which are a skinny 205/45/17 to a slightly wider 215/45/17 Continental Extreme Contact Sport and they weighted identical according to Tire Rack. So I was able to keep the weigh off that I saved from the lighter wheels, and also go to a slightly wider and stickier tire without adding any additional weight.
´good job, very informative!!! i was looking for that so long. so its about 5% when you accelerate and everytime you brake even more
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it! It was definitely a fun test to do as I was also curious myself on the effect of lightweight wheels on acceleration.
You notice lightweight wheels at takeoff and low cruising speeds. Just like lightweight crank pulley
You did a good job and made me want to watch all the way through. Can't wait for more videos.
Thank you! 🙌 Glad you enjoyed it and appreciate the support! Looking forward to making new videos...if you have any specific ideas or things you're interested in let me know 👍
Lowering the car also has an impact. I wonder what the difference is if you were factory hight
Very well conducted experiment! Thank you.
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!
22lb per wheel is really heavy lol? For a 19/20” wheel that is the lightest wheel made almost lol. These wheels must be tiny? Weld drag rears 17x10 are 24-25lbs lol.. the biggest question is: is this car supposed to be fast 😮.. it sounded like you were 1/2 throttle lol. Forget the wheels, buy a new faster car lol.. 😂
thanks for the vid man…Im about to lose 1” in diameter and an average of 14 pounds on each corner of my M340i…should see a huge improvement on my 60-130
Im gonna say saving about 7Lbs per drive wheel matters a whole lot more on a 2500lb Miata with 220 Hp than it does say on a 3900lb mustang with 400 Hp.
it might even be a even amt of weightloss and Hp gain, on two said cars BUT proportionally 7 lbs makes more difference to the lighter weaker car.
FURTHERMORE it may NOT be worth it to 99% of people, including myself, to pay EXTRA, sometimes double for lightweight wheels for very modest gains
BUT what you sure DONT WANT to do, me especially, is add weight to your unsprung car weight[wheels] just for looks of buying nicer wheels
Based on my experience with my E36. When i shifted from a bmw cast wheel to a Volk Racing RE30 18x8 forged wheel I immediately felt the acceleration difference. The bmw wheel was almost 33lbs per wheel and the RE30s were 17lbs per wheel. It felt a lot quicker and nimble at the corners.
0.3 seconds in real world has no reason to upgrate only if you are on a track and a sport racing team player
Hell yeah that makes a difference in the real world. I have fewer close calls from accidents becuz of that lol
Braking will be drastically different with lighter weight wheels. You’ll stop much faster. That’s a plus, which means you can go faster because you don’t have to brake earlier. Which’s means you can slow down later 😎
i wonder how much difference a aluminum driveshaft AND lightweight wheels would make on my car being its a 2015 camaro and winter steel wheels and tires are 61lbs each plus the big 2 piece driveshaft
summer wheels are alot better at around 53 ish but still very heavy with about 6lbs per tire/wheel combo of improvement aatainable plus maybe 25 lbs from the aluminum driveshaft for a total of about 50 lbs less rotational mass.
Dude I soo geeked up. My stock wheels are 36 pounds a piece, going to wheels that are 22 pounds...It's going to be epic
Might have been interesting if you added 24lbs of weight to the car with the light wheels. If there’s any difference in acceleration, you’re seeing the value of unsprung weight. I love your test but it could just be from the car being lighter.
what is the affordable lightest metal for wheels? & in which brands?
The Enkei RPF1 is usually one of the cheapest if you buying brand new. But sometimes good deals can be had used. The only thing to be careful of is that the forging process (where applicable) or flow forming is used to minimise weight not to make the wheels stronger than normal, so it is relatively easy to bend lightweight 19" or 20" wheels on potholes if you have very low profile tyres (e.g., hot hatch etc). The Volkswagen Golf R Pretoria wheels are notorious for this...
Thanks for making the video, this seems like a very good effort at making an accurate, scientific comparison between lightweight wheels and heavier ones. I can't wait to replace my 18lb steelies on my Fit with 11lb wheels :)
Well done. The only video I've been able to find with legit data. Typical road course, this could easily be over a second a lap, which is yuge!
I always wanted to do something like this. Cool video with real world tests
Ótimo material. Me ajudou na tomada de decisão. Obrigado!
Lightweight wheels do help in several ways and when combined with a lightweight flywheel it becomes a whole new world in performance for sportscars.
It would be very interesting to see what the braking results would be. From personal experience, when my Aprilia was fitted with 10 lbs of combined weight LESS, the difference was huge. The change of direction was amazing, the suspension needed to be adjusted for rebound and the bike seemed to stop faster and with less effort. What really made the difference was the change of direction and smoothness over uneven pavement. Therefore, putting on light weight wheels on a motorcycle makes a noticeable difference but.....the same cannot be said for a car
Nobody needs a mic that's so good you can hear the spit in their mouth.
First time I’m disappointed that this isn’t a math vid 😂
But thank you very much for doing this
There’s not a lot of content on it
I’m shopping wheels and became obsessed with weight. I drive a 2016 Mazda CX-3 AWD. From my research, I haven’t yet weighed them but I will, the wheel/tire combo, 215/50 on 18x7s and weigh 50.5lbs per corner, I’m looking at switching to summer performance 245/45 on 17x8s that weigh 39.9lbs per corner. Smaller diameter by 1.9% or 8/10ths of an inch (12mm) means a shade more torque applied over a larger contact patch by better, softer tires that all told weigh 42.4lbs less per corner than stock, over 21% weight savings on the wheels. Safe to say I’m excited, moreso after this video.
Did you use the same tires?
The intelligent driver will always prefer smaller and lighter wheels for numerous reasons. And low profile tires are stupid!
Thank you for your effort! Support
Glad you enjoyed it! Thank you for the support! 🙌
Well, it probably affects steering and ride more than acceleration. Lighter wheels would likely make the ride harsher and increase steering response and could cause ABS to kick in more. But what would I know
Great testing.
Very informative. Appreciate the real world application of lighter wheels.
Thanks! Tried my best to bring some real world results. Gonna keep doing this as I go through the different tuning phases as well. Should be a nice little comparison from stock to hopefully bigger turbo down the line :)
una variable q cambiaste es la aerodinamica en 2 puntos al bajar 4 cm la altura del auto . eso no lo tuviste en cuenta
Excellent video. Thank you sir.
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you for taking the time to prove the benefits, it’s a shame it’s going to cost me,
I need forged wheels 😂
good video
Hi, thx for the analysis. I wish you did also 100-200 kph :)
Good work bro
I'm surprised you only talked about "unsprung" weight, then proceeded to test the improved rotational mass weight savings instead. Your vehicle (being 2 propelling wheels) would mean your saving 6 lbs per wheel (12 lbs total) of weight off the rotational mass from the engine trying to spin the wheels.
I believe its about 2 to 1 for rotational mass to hp. (ie ~ every 2 lbs you save on rotational mass will net you ~1hp, so your 12lbs of rotational mass would equate out to about 6hp gain)
I have to imagine an AWD/4WD vehicle shaving a full 24lbs, would actually see even greater benefits, as you can apply it to all 4 wheels.
Great job though for trying to take everything into consideration, great to see real world footage on this! Nice wheels too! I'm looking at wheels and a carbon fiber driveshaft, and plan to do a dyno with before/after on the same day to limit as many variables as possible. Hoping to gain at least 10hp by simply shaving off rotational mass!
The weight influences the 4 wheels as they all offer resistance even if they are those of the axle that does not pull, all are interconnected except when they lose traction, It's easy to see by taking it to the extreme, imagine some ultra-heavy wheels on the axle that have no traction, now imagine they are ultra-light, does it matter?
What if I shave off 28pds per wheel?
I was hoping for full tank in this experiment...
Interesting despite of some variables.
I appreciate your experiment, for reference here is another one using a chassis dyno back to back so less variables and more quantifiable result. It is titled: "20 HP Loss On Dyno From Heavy Wheels WHAT? Stock 5.0 Mustang" Here's the link:
ruclips.net/video/5MUnG5hrEEI/видео.html
The weight difference was greater but he only tested the effect on two wheels not all four like you did, so the net weight difference effect is about the same. So he measured a 20 HP difference, which sounds about right for 2-3 tenths difference in acceleration.
A lot of folks don't seem to understand, when it comes to drivetrain loss, some of it is friction but most of the losses are due to inertia, and in any drivetrain there is no rotating mass bigger and heavier (creating more friction/inertia), than all four wheels and tires. Another mistake they make is in thinking that because the car is FWD or RWD, that only the driven wheels/tires has an effect, and that is actually not true. Sure on a chassis dyno you see a big difference between 2WD and 4WD because you are only spinning two wheels. However, on the road when your car is accelerating it has to overcome the inertia and friction of all four wheels and tires. It doesn't matter which wheels are being driven, most of the loss is the inertia of the spinning wheels and the friction from the tire to road surface. On the road the actual wheels being driven is irrelevant, lighter wheel/tires help regardless if they are driven or not. There is good reason why dragsters run those skinny tires up front.
A lot of people believe 2WD cars have a 10% to 15% drivetrain loss, and AWD cars have a 20% to 30% drivetrain loss, but that is only true on a chassis dyno. On the road, all other things being equal, from a roll the AWD will be a bit slower, but not 10% to 15% power difference slower. That is because the AWD car is a bit heavier, and it does have a bit more drivetrain loss from the AWD components, but on the road that is more like 1% or less. And that is because both cars experience the same drivetrain loss of all four wheels/tires, and those are by far the biggest contributors to drivetrain loss.
Lighter wheels and tires also help significantly with handling, braking, and fuel economy. If you care about performance, there are a lot of good reasons to go with the lightest wheels you can get. On street cars it is always a compromise, even tire pressure can have a significant effect, most people lower tire pressure to get better grip off the line, but on a 30-75 pull (where grip is not an issue), higher tire pressure will also reduce tire contact/friction and improve acceleration and fuel economy. Of course ride and handling will suffer a bit, it's all a matter of what cost/compromises you are willing to accept.
Everyone was surprised when the FK8 Type R pulled on the new slightly more powerful FL5 Type R from a roll race. What they did not understand is that the FK8 runs a 245 width tire and the FL5 runs massive 265 width tires. Yes it is slightly smaller diameter wheel but it is the tire that weighs the most and is on the outer edge (more inertia), also there is more friction and air drag with wider tires. When you consider these facts it is not surprising at all that the FL5 is actually a bit slower in straight line acceleration from a roll with those tires/wheels. But they also significantly improve grip off the line, and for braking, and of course for corner grip so... In that application it is worth giving up a little straight line speed and fuel economy.
"What they did not understand is that the FK8 runs a 245 width tire and the FL5 runs massive 265 width tires." The FL5 has a longer final drive ratio, it uses the FK2 ratio of 3.84 (6.6% less wheel torque), where the FK8 is 4.11. I don't think the wheels & tyres are primarily responsible for why it accelerates slower, FK8 is a 20" wheel too versus FL5 19".
@@TassieLorenzo That might be a factor however, the FL5 has a smaller diameter wheel/tire so the actual difference is more like 4.6% and the FL5 has 5% more torque which in theory should nullify the slight difference in final drive ratio. Also the dyno tests I have seen seem to indicate the FL5 actually has considerably more torque and HP than what Honda's specs would suggest.
This is why I still think it is primarily the tire width difference. There are multiple factors at play when you increase tire width. If you want increased grip for cornering, braking, and traction off the line, wider tires is a great way to achieve that goal. However, not only do you increase unsprung weight, but you do it at the furthest point of the wheel axis, which gives you the greatest amount of inertia loss. But that is not the only thing, those wider stickier tires also create more frictional drag. Keep in mind there is always some toe front & rear even when you are going straight, the tires drag a bit even in a straight line. So, when you increase the contact patch and use a tire with more grip, you significantly increase friction loss.
Then there is the increased wind resistance, wheels/tire make up around around 25% of the drag coefficient, and wider tires have a significant effect on this as well. I have seen top speed testing where only increasing tire width by only two centimeters can cause a 5-7 mph loss in top speed. Wider tires do help with many performance aspects, but they also have a very definite down side when it comes to straight line acceleration. There is a very good reason why drag cars run skinny front tires. I have no doubt that an FL5 with a set of 245 width tires would smoke an FK8 from a roll. Of course it will have even more difficulty trying to get off the line from a dig, and you will lose all the other launching, cornering, and braking benefits so...
I'm confused. you're saying 15 times you're trying to eliminate all variations, and yet you have applied two changes (wheels + suspension) at the same time? Let me put it like this, the effect of different suspension might not be huge, but probably still 10 times more relevant than relative humidity..
Also you didn't talk about the tyres, did you re-use the exact same ones? Same tire pressure?
Keyword “try”. Also you do realize the point of the video is the impact of lighter weight wheels…so of course the wheels will change 😂 Most people might compare with 1/4 mile or 0-60 but launch and shift are variables that are WAY more impactful than suspension, tire pressure, or tires (remember this is a rolling test, all those will have more of an effect on launch/shifts/traction).
Same tires, don’t recall tire pressure. Don’t recall if I put the springs in before or after. I might have said it in the video, but I’m answering from my phone and I made this video a long time ago so don’t know 100%. Again, those are minimal compared to the variables that I eliminated like launching and shifting which would skew the data much more.
In the future I would love to do this test again with more data but I’m still a small guy on RUclips and don’t have access to do the tests as precise as I would like. This was just me trying my own testing.
@@DrivenDistrict I think this is a really interesting test, it's almost impossible to find any good comparisons anywhere. guess most people shy away from keeping all the variables under control. Lowering the car sure has measurable impact, same as fuel levels and fuel type, driver weight, tires, road conditions, air temperature, even the cleanliness of the car - a dirty car can have 10% more drag.
Also I guess the biggest effect would be on launch and lower speeds? A automatic transmission would allow comparable launch tests I reckon. Otherwise a 15-50mph run in 2nd gear might also be interesting.
Did the springs change your height?
Hi is OZ 16pounds per wheel without tyre?
Yes, they are 16lbs without tire for the size I had which was 17x7 +37.
Hi :) Got a question...I'm looking at leggera's for my suv...should I consider them? Or would it affect the stability of the vechile?
Look at the data on the wheel you're considering for load carrying capability.
👍
A perfect video!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it :)
i want to change the wheels but one things gets confusing is the ride quality. lots of people say that lighter wheels gonna make the car way bumpier and rattle specially on small bumps and unsmooth asphalt
False
@@jaygarcia6388 wym what is false ? like lighter wheels dont make the car bumpier ? like i heard heavier wheels will absorb small bumps easier but on bigger ones they hit hard cause they are heavier well usually less tire cause they are bigger. im thinking to go with a wider rim and i guess wider rims automatically make it heavier than factory ones ?
Ofc suspension is a factor.
Probably helps the MPG too
What car is this?
Fiat 124 Spider Abarth (basically an Italian Miata)
Nicee😅
Very thorough job , thankyou
Great video!!
Thanks for watching 🙏 Glad you enjoyed it!
Amazing! Thank you!
Good video!
Thanks!
would a rim that is 5 lbs lighter than stock have better acceleration and would it be noticeable ?
I would say yea...but I guess it depends what "noticeable" means. From the driver seat you might not "feel" the actual difference in just acceleration, but as you can tell from my testing which (which was 6lbs per wheel drop), there was a noticeable difference in time. On track, side by side with another car, etc. you should 100% notice a difference in acceleration as well as the handling/steering difference.
@@DrivenDistrict okay thanks for replying !!
where'd that golf r dash come from lol
😂That was mine...my car before this one was a MK7.5 Golf R 💪Had bolt-ons and a Unitronic Stage 2 tune. The full 40-145mph pull video with sound is here: ruclips.net/video/X7lSuiZDD3k/видео.html and I have a playlist here with a few other videos of that car before I sold it: ruclips.net/p/PLbSWhpMlJIRuVd7agtCEoRbljrfXtj7VW
Loved the car! Problem was I drove stick for over 10 years and the DSG sold me when I test drove it. If you want to go fast, you can't beat it! But after a few years I just REALY missed driving stick and I've always loved the Fiat 124 Spider Abarth so I decided to get back into a little manual. Sacrificed a lot of power with that switch lol but it's a super fun car and now i'm building that car up which is fun 😎
I asume the wheels and tyres are exactly the same size?
Yes tires are the exact same tire, and wheels are the same size just lighter.
Did you see any appreciable gains in MPG?
Sorry that’s one thing I honestly never pay attention to.