Thanks Mazzy for the measured review of this. I was getting confused, and not being a super fan haven’t the opportunity to compare. Appreciate you jumping in.
Mazzy. , very interesting topic I find it very interesting about that Black Sabbath album, the different sounds on each of those albums , everybody’s systems are different and will sound different to each person‘s ears
A thorough and valid assessment of this great album Mazzy. It's easy for us CD listeners to sit back on the sidelines and enjoy the fun when it comes to discussions like this. I have a two CD 'deluxe' edition from 2009 on the Sanctuary label that includes 'Wicked World' plus some totally worthwhile outakes and instrumentals. It sounds pretty good on a decent system. As I noted elsewhere this Sabbath debut album was recorded in two days. One day for recording and one day for mixing - amazing the album sounds as good as it does. It was supposed to ooze grungy heaviness. That was the whole point. It isn't 'Dark Side of the Moon' so it's difficult to take too seriously high fidelity wordage on this stoner rock masterpiece! As a side comment anyone who criticises anyone else for receiving free records is either absurdly envious or seemingly has no conception of individual opinion.
This is exactly the kind of video I've been searching RUclips for. Thank you so much for this comparison. I do have The UK Vertigo swirl 2nd edition with the large swirl (Vertigo) under spindle hole. And have two Canadian green originals which i find sound absolutely great. I've always struggled to try to figure which I prefer most. I think it really depends on mu mood for the day. Some days I prefer WB greeny over Vertigo other days vice versa. The main difference i find with the Vertigo is the Soundstage really comes through more. I also have an original Italian vertigo pressing which I might add sounds just as equal to the UK swirl.
Talking about how old fart hearing might change over time, I’m 72 and was weaned on the Bay Area and British stuff and while my ears are fine, it’s like whole new channels in my mind have opened up and I hear things with much greater subtlety and depth than I did as a mere worshipping wippersnapper for whom these kinds of bands were the soundtrack of my life and that was the only way I heard them. Now going back and listening with fresh ears I’m blown away. I love your show and have learned so much, I feel like I’m working a a degree from the University of Mazzy.
IMO it’s more important to know someone’s “likes” than their system or room. It seems InGroove Mike prefers clarity & separation, so loves the Rhino HiFi pressing. I find that clarity comes at the cost of bright with lighter bass. It seems a quality of the whole Rhino HiFi series to me. I prefer the UK 73 Vertigo spaceship I have, as my preference is for most lifelike. The rain intro sounds like it’s outside my open window on the UK, not like a good recording of rain as it does on the Rhino HiFi. And the UK is better balanced and alive IMO. To each their own.
I own many UK pressings by UK band. They all sound better, especially in the low end, than their US counterparts. I do not have a Verdigo copy of this lp. I do have an exceptional green label copy I paid a dollar for in 1978. In the 70s and 80s albums that were mastered for the US market were mastered to sound good in cars. I played in bands in the Bay Area and visited and used studios in the area (the Record Plant in Sousalito). I was surprized to find this out as I was very much into quality playback in my own system. Maybe after the Robert Ludwig Led Zepplin 2 thing the American companies pussied out. I have the Rhino copy and happy to say the 50 dollars was well spent. Its the most I have ever paid for a new lp.
I agree with you on the green Warner bros pressing, that’s been the one I always liked. I bought that record back in 1971. That was all the rage in high school plus Alice Cooper, Grand Funk, Humble Pie, all those bands were of my time. I’m 66. It’s wired that this record is getting so much attention, this was the beginnings of stoner rock. Never in a million years I would have thought there would be so much discussion on this album.
Nice video, Mazzy. I enjoyed our discussion on Rachel's. I totally agree with you on the US 1st sounding phenomenal. I too love it. But as you said, it's a very subjective experience, depending on many things human and machinery. 😂 I prefer the UK Swirl 1st pressing, but I think that the Rhino sounds fantastic and if you don't want to have a UK 1st or can't have one, the Rhino is a great way to enjoy this wonderful album. I personally would go for a decent US 1st if I wouldn't want to spend the big bucks.
Thanks, Mazzy. I remember hearing this (at University of Minnesota ca 1970) when it first came out. Black Sabbath wasn't quite my cup of tea then. But it grew on me. Over the years I've bought a couple albums by BS, and by Ozzy. The stuff doesn't sound dated, so much as it was/is limited in scope. But, that's just me...luv your vids; keep 'em coming.
'I enjoy music where I live' is the most significant sentence for me. I share this attitude 100 per cent. My main HiFi system is in our living room, consisting of Linn stuff. That's where I listen to music mostly. Still I have a separate music room with a kind of retro set-up with Sony turntable, pre- and main amplifiers, CD-Player with a Revox B77 and Klipsch Heresy speakers. This is where I play mostly 7" records and sometimes older stuff such as the Black Sabbath album. My copy is just an Italien pressing from Earmark/Castle and has also Evil Woman on it. Until I saw this video I did not bother about the different mixes on the different labels mentioned. The only fact which makes me curious now, is the different track list, i.e. Wicked World instead of Evil Woman. Next thing I've got to do is listening to Wicked World via streaming. In so far thanks for your info.
Thank you for watching. At course lives great sound stereo, however listening to music in a spot or room I love make be enjoy the music more than a better sounding room tucked away somewhere ✌🏼
Enjoyed your overall position. I firmly believe as you pointed out that your sound environment is extremely important. If i listen to that record on my vintage system and you listen to it on a crosley, our experiences will be different.
Nice video! I’m just really surprised at all the hoopla over this release All the comparisons and disagreements over this! It’s a Sabbath record recorded in 2 days and was never released as a AUDIOPHILE release Seems much to do about nothing!!!
It’s sound really about being audiophile or not to me, just being a good sounding record based on how it was recorded. It’s doesn’t sound as great and slick as a Toto recording. But I personally can’t stand Toto
It’s about a classic record that was the start of heavy metal and an important record to a lot of people. It has nothing to do with the fact that it was recorded in two days or that it’s not an audiophile level recording. It’s about finding the best sounding version of an important, classic record.
I've never heard this record, I'm waiting for the next version, then I'll decide if I ever wanna hear it. Nevertheless, as usual, Mazzy, thanks for the enjoyable take on the various versions of Black Sabbath.
There are 2 Warner green labels. The earlier one is a square box with just a blue W7 with red surrounding it inside the box with a lighter shade of green label. This was most likely an Indianapolis record club pressing using up old labels. The second one is the common shield shape logo with WB inside it, with the same color schemes but the green is darker. The record seems thinner almost like Dynaflex.
Mazzy having watched you for the past 3 years or so and find you extremely objective for all your reviews, except The Beatles, ha, ha. My first listen was in early 1970 art class on a HS flip top heavy duty record player and we were all taken back by the music and sound, gritty, haunting almost frightening us with the Satan indications nothing like Are You Experienced or Green River. I will always remember that album and proceeding releases changing the music genre forever and 3 people will have 3 differing opinions no matter what, where, or how they listen. Thankfully Rhino is giving us a 2024 great analog record (not that it matters always) mastered by someone who cares as much a we do! As you've stated we never knew jack s_it about mastering just wanting new music to enjoy, my OG is beat to s_it from loaning around to our group of fans and hopefully getting it back without roach burns! Your truthfulness shows through and not letting meaningless barbs dissuade you is commended.
I'm on the Hoffman forums and I know that very long Rhino High Fidelity thread. It has devolved into a relentlessly pissing match on many occasions I'm surprised it was not closed by the Gorts. And your antagonist on the thread has done the same in many other threads. The biggest surprise here is knowing Mike at the In Groove is not as old as I had thought or old as myself.
Mike from the ingroove had a German Vertigo. He didn’t have the UK. He went to Kevin Grey’s studio in the past and knows him. I would of thought he could of got a UK for the video. Anyways, I have a clean olive green pressing. I haven’t heard the other mentioned pressings. I just know I like the original US pressing. Also, I’m a fan of the Grateful Dead olive green labels. There’s something special about them. I do like my vertigo pressings, but haven’t heard the Sabbath one.
My Canadian copy sounds just fine to me Mazz. It's what I first heard them on and I'm always looking for the sound that I initially heard when first hearing a tune. Other mixes might sound interesting to me but would seem out of whack according to my memory... I'm afraid I'm an old stick in the mud that likes things the way they used to be when I first experienced them. Living in the past some might say but I much prefer it to what we have today... I tell folks "Old School" is my school and if you don't like it get out of the building.... LOL
Nice video Mazzy. I have the Warner/Rhino 2016 reissue of 2012 remaster, 180g version, which has a green label on the vinyl and also has Wicked World on side 2. It is mint condition on both the jacket and vinyl. It is not the version which is sold out on the Rhino website. Have not played it yet, but I will. Also looking to buy an original American 1970 pressing for my collection for comparison. Curious, wouldn't a great pair of audiophile headphones work better as a reference than a stereo system for comparing different pressings?
Balanced overview, Mazzy. I have a UK Vertigo original, NEMS and the dreadful 2016 repress. So I can’t challenge or even comment on whether a US greenie or the Rhino Hifi pressings are better or worse. One point worth clarifying though; I don’t think artist’s intent is the relevant point. The real point of an original pressing is one of fact. The facts are that the UK Vertigo and US greenie were the two original pressings. The versions that ensnared listeners and which were played to death in 1970. So any departure from that original sound is not the artefact that made history. That’s the problem I have with it. It’s like re- creating a Van Gogh on higher quality paper. It might indeed be a better Van Gogh but it isn’t the original work of art. I’m not saying there is no place for represses. I have loads (and kiss the sky that we can get our hands on amazing Blue Note all analog pressings for a fraction of the cost of an original). But I’m unconvinced about the constant search for better updated pressings. Also let’s not forget by no measure was Sabbath’s debut audiophile! It was recorded on a tiny budget using even then basic recording equipment and the entire session took 12 hours before even redacting for pub visits.
The UK version of the Beach Boys Sunflower LP opened with the single Cottonfields which was a big hit over here. It's always strange to me to hear it start with Slip On Through as the band intended, with Cottonfields nowhere to be seen.
All very well said! Enjoyed it! Also like you were saying it’s all subjective to what you as the listener like anyway so really when it’s all said and done does it matter what you or Mike or anyone else says.
Spot on. But after you listen to any of us for awhile , you get to know our tastes and where we are each coming from. The best judge is each listener. ✌🏼
The best Sabbath pressing I listened to is a German one, but not the debut record.. Seriously though, I’m very happy with an early Green WB US presssing I have of the debut.. Hmm, I wonder what Richard Lloyd thinks of the the new mastering of Marquee Moon..
Mikes review (to me) was right on. I had to be exact same opinion. Keep in mind. Rhino Hi Fidelity is direct to consumer Mike has no skin in the game making it totally honest. Unlike say the other "Mike" won't say his name but many of the records he "reviews" are 45 RPM ....... 45 does not get out of bed unless there is a FREE record on his porch. After the review of The Doors ERC 45 lost all credibility with me. A very expensive record he got for FREE.
This was one of those cases of "do I need this"? Being extremely happy with the OG Warner Greenie I've had for 30 years, I passed on the Rhino. If I didn't have a clean one, I'd have definitely gotten it. I had it in my cart but then I heard a prominent RUclipsrs opinion (ok, it was yours) and decided to pass. Although I'f I knew it would be selling for $150 a week later, I would have. So you owe me the $75 I would have cleared after flipping it. I'll take Venmo, PP, check, however you wanna do it.
I'm a Deep Purple guy over Sabbath, but I always chuckle when people get too invested in what is the best. I have multiple versions of Machine Head and prefer the original UK pressing over the others. With that said, the differences are often minor, and if you only have one pressing, getting another is not worth it. Thanks again you rebel!
Dear Amazing Mazzy, I have the Artisan Olive, and the very first Vertigo, and I agree with your feelings about both. I also prefer the Olive because it omits the gatefold, having the overly grim poem inside, which the band didn’t like, but were overruled by Vertigo. I have an observation, about the cover art, which I’m hoping will stir up the Vinylistas🙃 The tree, that intersects the title, on the UK and Rhino, goes through the right of the “A”, but goes right between the A and T, on the Olive. And more disturbing, the tree on the Japanese cover, goes right through the “T”. With your photographic background, perhaps you can explain how the cover printing process works.
Probably a crossed processed color photograph : Cross Processing is intentionally processing film in the wrong chemicals, creating interesting and unpredictable color shifts and increased contrast.
@@mazzysmusic interesting, sounds like giving the negative some LSD. Could it be like, judging by the differences between the UK and US Rubber Soul album covers, that Capital received the photograph of the Beatles and overlayed their own gold colored version title? Standing in the weeds here, I can see that the “Rubber Soul” titles are not exactly in the same spot.
'Wicked World' was a B Side in the UK. Most of us Brits had to wait until the cash grab compilation 'We Sold Our Souls For Rock N Roll' before we heard it. I agree that it would have been a better choice than Evil Woman
Good stuff mazzy. I agree side 2 on all my records sonically sounds better. Side 1 seems to be not quite as powerful. But in general I agree with everything you say in the posting.
Ordered mine on 5/18 and I'm still waiting for it. Best part is I told my boss about it and he ordered it on 5/20 or 5/21 and he already received his on Monday (6/10). How the hell does that work? I have several other RHF pressings and they're great but the PAY and PRAY ordering process is completely unacceptable in 2024.
Very cool maz. You didn’t take the easy route of adopting the seemingly hot take that is actually the trendy one to have which in this case would be to say the UK vertigo all day
Lol 427 on the Hoffman forums. Anytime I see his post i just scroll down to the next comment without reading. He writes essays that say absolutely nothing.
Listening to vinyl records seems to have got so complicated. Luckily we didn't know all this stuff when I was first getting into records. If I was a kid of thirteen or fourteen now and watched some of those audiophile shootout vidéos (this isn't one of them I should add) I would think record collecting was much too difficult and do something else.
No, I wasn't having ago at your vidéo (but a lot of vidéos by thé more hardcore audiophile specialists) - as you say, just love the music worry about thé other stuff later.
Ha. I am not butt hurt at all. I don't regret spending 500€ on my autographed UK 1st and why would I be? I never want a reissue to sound worse...I am glad that the Rhino sounds excellent and I am happy to own one and I understand those who prefer it over other pressings.. but it seems that many have a problem when someone (like me) prefers the UK 1st...and the US 1st...I respect all opinions. 🙏
Yes I have. But I never actually heard it until after I did this comparison. I friend loaned me a vertigo OG plus the NEMS. Didn’t love the later but the Vertigo was very good. Just not as good as the Warners Green Artisan to me.
You weren't supposed to listen to this record you were supposed to freak out and wave your long hair and dandruff around because it is intended for boys from 12 to 18.
In fact, in Britain it would have been the preserve of chemistry students as young men who had to go out work were listening to soul and motown and if they were skinheads, reggae.
In fact one hour and fifteen minutes of serious headbanging. When I was a student in Birmingham a few years later I shared a flat with a guy wbo worked for John Birch. People from Birmingham aren't pretentious twats unlike some I could mention. ..
I gave up on the Hoffman group several years ago. Too many selfish, immature snobs on there. I should revisit though as it would be a great place for finding content for my channel😎
Didn't know you were in SH jail. Hope it doesn't last. I've been a contributor there for almost 20 years now, even had some nice exchanges with you. But SH has a sh**show side to it too and I can take it or leave it. Having many copies of this LP for decades, the Vertigo obviously has the best resolution, it had the best tape generation to cut it. But it can be a hair bright too. The mastering is more important though. The US album is great and worthy all by itself because it has a different track listing and starts off side 2 with the killer Wicked World. Dang... is Bill Wards drumming tight or what?
I have two. The others of this record were loaned to me as I stated here. But other records I enjoy for different modes and finer art. Or track changes
Surprised Kevin Gray didn’t mix up the Black Sabbath with Blue Note records. I heard Kevin Gray and Bernie Grundman may go on strike and then there will be no more remastering of any album ever since they are the only two engineers left in the world
Well done. Well said.
So many variables to consider but ultimately will come down to the room / system that the music is enjoyed in.
Always 🎸🥁
Evil Woman was Sabbath's 1st single, on 45, which is a cover of California group, The Crow.
Maz, I look at it this way: You know your shit... I have taken your recommendations, you have been spot on, and you have not let me down....
I'm just one opinion. Obviously, people have different tastes and hear it differently on their gear.
Thanks Mazzy for the measured review of this. I was getting confused, and not being a super fan haven’t the opportunity to compare. Appreciate you jumping in.
Mazzy. , very interesting topic I find it very interesting about that Black Sabbath album, the different sounds on each of those albums , everybody’s systems are different and will sound different to each person‘s ears
A thorough and valid assessment of this great album Mazzy. It's easy for us CD listeners to sit back on the sidelines and enjoy the fun when it comes to discussions like this. I have a two CD 'deluxe' edition from 2009 on the Sanctuary label that includes 'Wicked World' plus some totally worthwhile outakes and instrumentals. It sounds pretty good on a decent system. As I noted elsewhere this Sabbath debut album was recorded in two days. One day for recording and one day for mixing - amazing the album sounds as good as it does. It was supposed to ooze grungy heaviness. That was the whole point. It isn't 'Dark Side of the Moon' so it's difficult to take too seriously high fidelity wordage on this stoner rock masterpiece! As a side comment anyone who criticises anyone else for receiving free records is either absurdly envious or seemingly has no conception of individual opinion.
Thank you. I’m good with CDs too. Don’t have this one in the format though ✌🏼
This is exactly the kind of video I've been searching RUclips for. Thank you so much for this comparison. I do have The UK Vertigo swirl 2nd edition with the large swirl (Vertigo) under spindle hole. And have two Canadian green originals which i find sound absolutely great. I've always struggled to try to figure which I prefer most. I think it really depends on mu mood for the day. Some days I prefer WB greeny over Vertigo other days vice versa. The main difference i find with the Vertigo is the Soundstage really comes through more. I also have an original Italian vertigo pressing which I might add sounds just as equal to the UK swirl.
Thank you for watching. They all sound good, just different. ✌🏼
Talking about how old fart hearing might change over time, I’m 72 and was weaned on the Bay Area and British stuff and while my ears are fine, it’s like whole new channels in my mind have opened up and I hear things with much greater subtlety and depth than I did as a mere worshipping wippersnapper for whom these kinds of bands were the soundtrack of my life and that was the only way I heard them. Now going back and listening with fresh ears I’m blown away. I love your show and have learned so much, I feel like I’m working a a degree from the University of Mazzy.
IMO it’s more important to know someone’s “likes” than their system or room. It seems InGroove Mike prefers clarity & separation, so loves the Rhino HiFi pressing. I find that clarity comes at the cost of bright with lighter bass. It seems a quality of the whole Rhino HiFi series to me. I prefer the UK 73 Vertigo spaceship I have, as my preference is for most lifelike. The rain intro sounds like it’s outside my open window on the UK, not like a good recording of rain as it does on the Rhino HiFi. And the UK is better balanced and alive IMO. To each their own.
I own many UK pressings by UK band. They all sound better, especially in the low end, than their US counterparts. I do not have a Verdigo copy of this lp. I do have an exceptional green label copy I paid a dollar for in 1978. In the 70s and 80s albums that were mastered for the US market were mastered to sound good in cars. I played in bands in the Bay Area and visited and used studios in the area (the Record Plant in Sousalito). I was surprized to find this out as I was very much into quality playback in my own system. Maybe after the Robert Ludwig Led Zepplin 2 thing the American companies pussied out. I have the Rhino copy and happy to say the 50 dollars was well spent. Its the most I have ever paid for a new lp.
If you were lucky enough to get the Rhino for $40, it is a no brainer. Best sounding copy I have of three copies.
Bowers & Wilkins and Hegel are a perfect match, congratulations 😎🤘
I agree with you on the green Warner bros pressing, that’s been the one I always liked. I bought that record back in 1971. That was all the rage in high school plus Alice Cooper, Grand Funk, Humble Pie, all those bands were of my time. I’m 66.
It’s wired that this record is getting so much attention, this was the beginnings of stoner rock. Never in a million years I would have thought there would be so much discussion on this album.
Nice video, Mazzy. I enjoyed our discussion on Rachel's. I totally agree with you on the US 1st sounding phenomenal. I too love it. But as you said, it's a very subjective experience, depending on many things human and machinery. 😂
I prefer the UK Swirl 1st pressing, but I think that the Rhino sounds fantastic and if you don't want to have a UK 1st or can't have one, the Rhino is a great way to enjoy this wonderful album. I personally would go for a decent US 1st if I wouldn't want to spend the big bucks.
Probably the "crunchiest" album ever made. Warning is a phenomenal cover. Good to see you, Maz.
Thanks, Mazzy. I remember hearing this (at University of Minnesota ca 1970) when it first came out. Black Sabbath wasn't quite my cup of tea then. But it grew on me. Over the years I've bought a couple albums by BS, and by Ozzy. The stuff doesn't sound dated, so much as it was/is limited in scope. But, that's just me...luv your vids; keep 'em coming.
'I enjoy music where I live' is the most significant sentence for me. I share this attitude 100 per cent. My main HiFi system is in our living room, consisting of Linn stuff. That's where I listen to music mostly. Still I have a separate music room with a kind of retro set-up with Sony turntable, pre- and main amplifiers, CD-Player with a Revox B77 and Klipsch Heresy speakers. This is where I play mostly 7" records and sometimes older stuff such as the Black Sabbath album. My copy is just an Italien pressing from Earmark/Castle and has also Evil Woman on it. Until I saw this video I did not bother about the different mixes on the different labels mentioned. The only fact which makes me curious now, is the different track list, i.e. Wicked World instead of Evil Woman. Next thing I've got to do is listening to Wicked World via streaming. In so far thanks for your info.
Thank you for watching. At course lives great sound stereo, however listening to music in a spot or room I love make be enjoy the music more than a better sounding room tucked away somewhere ✌🏼
Enjoyed your overall position. I firmly believe as you pointed out that your sound environment is extremely important. If i listen to that record on my vintage system and you listen to it on a crosley, our experiences will be different.
I don’t own any version and it sounds like I won’t for awhile. Not paying ridiculous money. Why didn’t Rhino press more of these? 🤯
I have a first press UK and US. I'm listening to them now. The UK vertigo has more bass maybe?. Both sound fantastic!
Nice video! I’m just really surprised at all the hoopla over this release All the comparisons and disagreements over this! It’s a Sabbath record recorded in 2 days and was never released as a AUDIOPHILE release Seems much to do about nothing!!!
It’s sound really about being audiophile or not to me, just being a good sounding record based on how it was recorded. It’s doesn’t sound as great and slick as a Toto recording. But I personally can’t stand Toto
It’s about a classic record that was the start of heavy metal and an important record to a lot of people. It has nothing to do with the fact that it was recorded in two days or that it’s not an audiophile level recording. It’s about finding the best sounding version of an important, classic record.
I've never heard this record, I'm waiting for the next version, then I'll decide if I ever wanna hear it. Nevertheless, as usual, Mazzy, thanks for the enjoyable take on the various versions of Black Sabbath.
There are 2 Warner green labels. The earlier one is a square box with just a blue W7 with red surrounding it inside the box with a lighter shade of green label. This was most likely an Indianapolis record club pressing using up old labels. The second one is the common shield shape logo with WB inside it, with the same color schemes but the green is darker. The record seems thinner almost like Dynaflex.
Quit Right 😊
Mazzy having watched you for the past 3 years or so and find you extremely objective for all your reviews, except The Beatles, ha, ha. My first listen was in early 1970 art class on a HS flip top heavy duty record player and we were all taken back by the music and sound, gritty, haunting almost frightening us with the Satan indications nothing like Are You Experienced or Green River. I will always remember that album and proceeding releases changing the music genre forever and 3 people will have 3 differing opinions no matter what, where, or how they listen. Thankfully Rhino is giving us a 2024 great analog record (not that it matters always) mastered by someone who cares as much a we do! As you've stated we never knew jack s_it about mastering just wanting new music to enjoy, my OG is beat to s_it from loaning around to our group of fans and hopefully getting it back without roach burns! Your truthfulness shows through and not letting meaningless barbs dissuade you is commended.
i have 2nd pressing 1970 vertigo copy, and green warner bros copy they both sound good!
I'm on the Hoffman forums and I know that very long Rhino High Fidelity thread. It has devolved into a relentlessly pissing match on many occasions I'm surprised it was not closed by the Gorts. And your antagonist on the thread has done the same in many other threads. The biggest surprise here is knowing Mike at the In Groove is not as old as I had thought or old as myself.
😝😵💫😂🤠
I’m with Mike from the In Groove on this one. Rhino slightly beats out the WB Artisan green label.
Mike from the ingroove had a German Vertigo. He didn’t have the UK. He went to Kevin Grey’s studio in the past and knows him. I would of thought he could of got a UK for the video. Anyways, I have a clean olive green pressing. I haven’t heard the other mentioned pressings. I just know I like the original US pressing. Also, I’m a fan of the Grateful Dead olive green labels. There’s something special about them. I do like my vertigo pressings, but haven’t heard the Sabbath one.
He does have a UK too.
My Canadian copy sounds just fine to me Mazz. It's what I first heard them on and I'm always looking for the sound that I initially heard when first hearing a tune. Other mixes might sound interesting to me but would seem out of whack according to my memory... I'm afraid I'm an old stick in the mud that likes things the way they used to be when I first experienced them. Living in the past some might say but I much prefer it to what we have today... I tell folks "Old School" is my school and if you don't like it get out of the building.... LOL
Nice video Mazzy. I have the Warner/Rhino 2016 reissue of 2012 remaster, 180g version, which has a green label on the vinyl and also has Wicked World on side 2. It is mint condition on both the jacket and vinyl. It is not the version which is sold out on the Rhino website. Have not played it yet, but I will. Also looking to buy an original American 1970 pressing for my collection for comparison. Curious, wouldn't a great pair of audiophile headphones work better as a reference than a stereo system for comparing different pressings?
Balanced overview, Mazzy. I have a UK Vertigo original, NEMS and the dreadful 2016 repress.
So I can’t challenge or even comment on whether a US greenie or the Rhino Hifi pressings are better or worse.
One point worth clarifying though; I don’t think artist’s intent is the relevant point. The real point of an original pressing is one of fact.
The facts are that the UK Vertigo and US greenie were the two original pressings. The versions that ensnared listeners and which were played to death in 1970.
So any departure from that original sound is not the artefact that made history.
That’s the problem I have with it. It’s like re- creating a Van Gogh on higher quality paper. It might indeed be a better Van Gogh but it isn’t the original work of art.
I’m not saying there is no place for represses. I have loads (and kiss the sky that we can get our hands on amazing Blue Note all analog pressings for a fraction of the cost of an original). But I’m unconvinced about the constant search for better updated pressings.
Also let’s not forget by no measure was Sabbath’s debut audiophile! It was recorded on a tiny budget using even then basic recording equipment and the entire session took 12 hours before even redacting for pub visits.
The UK version of the Beach Boys Sunflower LP opened with the single Cottonfields which was a big hit over here. It's always strange to me to hear it start with Slip On Through as the band intended, with Cottonfields nowhere to be seen.
the first UK vertigo and 1st green US warner are the best imho .
Many thanks Norman✌️🤘
Thank you ✌🏼
All very well said! Enjoyed it! Also like you were saying it’s all subjective to what you as the listener like anyway so really when it’s all said and done does it matter what you or Mike or anyone else says.
Spot on. But after you listen to any of us for awhile , you get to know our tastes and where we are each coming from. The best judge is each listener. ✌🏼
I approve this video, especially since I have the WB green label. Reinforces my idea that I don't need Rhino hi-fi or a Vertigo
These videos really don’t matter but they are occasionally fun for me. Kimbo loaned me all the other copies.
Tom Port's Hot Stampers seem to bee Warner Green Labels too, if i'm not mistaken ?
Well, that settles it...
Trust but verify. Mine's the Burbank Warner label. Not too shabby.
The best Sabbath pressing I listened to is a German one, but not the debut record.. Seriously though, I’m very happy with an early Green WB US presssing I have of the debut.. Hmm, I wonder what Richard Lloyd thinks of the the new mastering of Marquee Moon..
So appropriate to wear the right t-shirt! Great subliminal messaging!
Of course. My Fire Island T was in the laundry 🤠🥰😇
OMG, Overkill with The Black Sabbath already. Mazzy Rules!!! Welcome to The Gravy Train!
Mikes review (to me) was right on. I had to be exact same opinion. Keep in mind. Rhino Hi Fidelity is direct to consumer Mike has no skin in the game making it totally honest.
Unlike say the other "Mike" won't say his name but many of the records he "reviews" are 45 RPM .......
45 does not get out of bed unless there is a FREE record on his porch. After the review of The Doors ERC
45 lost all credibility with me. A very expensive record he got for FREE.
This was one of those cases of "do I need this"? Being extremely happy with the OG Warner Greenie I've had for 30 years, I passed on the Rhino. If I didn't have a clean one, I'd have definitely gotten it. I had it in my cart but then I heard a prominent RUclipsrs opinion (ok, it was yours) and decided to pass. Although I'f I knew it would be selling for $150 a week later, I would have. So you owe me the $75 I would have cleared after flipping it. I'll take Venmo, PP, check, however you wanna do it.
I'm a Deep Purple guy over Sabbath, but I always chuckle when people get too invested in what is the best. I have multiple versions of Machine Head and prefer the original UK pressing over the others. With that said, the differences are often minor, and if you only have one pressing, getting another is not worth it. Thanks again you rebel!
Dear Amazing Mazzy,
I have the Artisan Olive, and the very first Vertigo, and I agree with your feelings about both.
I also prefer the Olive because it omits the gatefold, having the overly grim poem inside, which the band didn’t like, but were overruled by Vertigo.
I have an observation, about the cover art, which I’m hoping will stir up the Vinylistas🙃
The tree, that intersects the title, on the UK and Rhino, goes through the right of the “A”, but goes right between the A and T, on the Olive.
And more disturbing, the tree on the Japanese cover, goes right through the “T”.
With your photographic background, perhaps you can explain how the cover printing process works.
Probably a crossed processed color photograph : Cross Processing is intentionally processing film in the wrong chemicals, creating interesting and unpredictable color shifts and increased contrast.
@@mazzysmusic interesting, sounds like giving the negative some LSD.
Could it be like, judging by the differences between the UK and US Rubber Soul album covers, that Capital received the photograph of the Beatles and overlayed their own gold colored version title?
Standing in the weeds here, I can see that the “Rubber Soul” titles are not exactly in the same spot.
'Wicked World' was a B Side in the UK. Most of us Brits had to wait until the cash grab compilation 'We Sold Our Souls For Rock N Roll' before we heard it. I agree that it would have been a better choice than Evil Woman
Good stuff mazzy. I agree side 2 on all my records sonically sounds better. Side 1 seems to be not quite as powerful. But in general I agree with everything you say in the posting.
Ordered mine on 5/18 and I'm still waiting for it. Best part is I told my boss about it and he ordered it on 5/20 or 5/21 and he already received his on Monday (6/10). How the hell does that work? I have several other RHF pressings and they're great but the PAY and PRAY ordering process is completely unacceptable in 2024.
Very cool maz. You didn’t take the easy route of adopting the seemingly hot take that is actually the trendy one to have which in this case would be to say the UK vertigo all day
I say what I hear 🤠
@@mazzysmusic calls em how I hears em!
There are 2 types of record/pressing. One you like and one you don't like and everyone is different.
Great video but I would be so pissed if someone got their fingers all over my Vertigo swirlie the way you did!
Lol 427 on the Hoffman forums. Anytime I see his post i just scroll down to the next comment without reading. He writes essays that say absolutely nothing.
Is what who I was referring to 🤷🏻♂️😇😎🤠
Listening to vinyl records seems to have got so complicated. Luckily we didn't know all this stuff when I was first getting into records. If I was a kid of thirteen or fourteen now and watched some of those audiophile shootout vidéos (this isn't one of them I should add) I would think record collecting was much too difficult and do something else.
It’s not complicated at all. I do very fees comparisons like this. It’s occasionally a fun exercise. ✌🏼
No, I wasn't having ago at your vidéo (but a lot of vidéos by thé more hardcore audiophile specialists) - as you say, just love the music worry about thé other stuff later.
Because the butt-hurt by people who paid too much for NM UK Vertigo's and those trying to sell them for big big Abraxas bucks.
Ha. I am not butt hurt at all. I don't regret spending 500€ on my autographed UK 1st and why would I be? I never want a reissue to sound worse...I am glad that the Rhino sounds excellent and I am happy to own one and I understand those who prefer it over other pressings.. but it seems that many have a problem when someone (like me) prefers the UK 1st...and the US 1st...I respect all opinions. 🙏
You've never heard of the Vertigo ?
Yes I have. But I never actually heard it until after I did this comparison. I friend loaned me a vertigo OG plus the NEMS. Didn’t love the later but the Vertigo was very good. Just not as good as the Warners Green Artisan to me.
You can buy a copy of this album for five bucks. It is fantastic.
You weren't supposed to listen to this record you were supposed to freak out and wave your long hair and dandruff around because it is intended for boys from 12 to 18.
@@iconicon5642 well I first saw Black Sabbath in 1972 when I was 18. And again a few years later. What the fuck are you talking about 🤷🏻♂️
In fact, in Britain it would have been the preserve of chemistry students as young men who had to go out work were listening to soul and motown and if they were skinheads, reggae.
Grow up Mazzy when I went to see them in Manchester in 1971 I was 13 and so was everybody else. Maybe 15 ot 16 tops.
In fact one hour and fifteen minutes of serious headbanging. When I was a student in Birmingham a few years later I shared a flat with a guy wbo worked for John Birch. People from Birmingham aren't pretentious twats unlike some I could mention. ..
I gave up on the Hoffman group several years ago. Too many selfish, immature snobs on there. I should revisit though as it would be a great place for finding content for my channel😎
Like RUclips. Pick and choose your thread
Didn't know you were in SH jail. Hope it doesn't last. I've been a contributor there for almost 20 years now, even had some nice exchanges with you. But SH has a sh**show side to it too and I can take it or leave it. Having many copies of this LP for decades, the Vertigo obviously has the best resolution, it had the best tape generation to cut it. But it can be a hair bright too. The mastering is more important though. The US album is great and worthy all by itself because it has a different track listing and starts off side 2 with the killer Wicked World. Dang... is Bill Wards drumming tight or what?
Only banned from that one thread. 🤠😎😇
You keep saying it's the music, you don't need 20 copies of any album
I have two. The others of this record were loaned to me as I stated here. But other records I enjoy for different modes and finer art. Or track changes
Surprised Kevin Gray didn’t mix up the Black Sabbath with Blue Note records. I heard Kevin Gray and Bernie Grundman may go on strike and then there will be no more remastering of any album ever since they are the only two engineers left in the world
Not sure why this was even considered to be released as an audiophile offering. All Black Sabbath records sound like crap.
Actually they don’t. The is a clean recording with very few overdubs
Your a music fan,Black Sabbath it just shit you know they didn't invet anything new
I like their first four records, but I agree they weren’t first at the hard rock metal thing.
I am so angry over this!!!!! HATE!!!! HATE!!!!!! HATE!!!!! 😋
🤷🏻♂️
@@mazzysmusic It's my duty as an audiophile to take a side and attack the opposition. I have gates to keep! Lives depend on it!!😇
Not a Fan in anyway, format, or pressing.
reading the Hoffman Forums right now!
🤠😵💫😂🥸🙄😝😇