One thing I like to point out is that "maximum" range is objective, but "effective" range is a bit more subjective. It depends to an extent on just how effective is considered "effective" by the army defining the effective range.
To add: rockets are even more inaccurate at long range, because they keep accelerating after they leave the muzzle. There is also the fact that opening fire too far away, will give your position away without inflicting decisive casualties. And, of course, that means that the enemy has something to yeet mortar bombs at.
encountering short range RPG ambushes from enemies hidden in buildings are a huge killer of my forces in SF2. i've learned to keep at maximum range (300-400m) and bait out enemy positions with area fire on buildings in order to find those dang RPG teams
The vast majority of rocket weapons burn completly in the fraction of a second they remain in the launch tube. This is necessary to prevent the gunner getting a facefull of rocket exhaust, and is why the Panzershreck has a shield. A small handful of rockets- RPG-7 rounds (but not the frag one) and Carl Gustav's FFV 551 round come to mind- do have sustainer motors to provide additional thrust and longer effective range. These are on a slight delay to allow the weapon to gain enough distance to not injure the gunner. Actual ATGMs and MANPADS all have boost-sustain motors as well
its surprised me that in SF2 the US army rifle squad is mostly unmagnified optics. i understand that 300-400m is a good rule of thumb for their effective range i wonder if the USMC with their long barrel m16 and ACOGs, or other NATO squads who seem to have magnified optics have a higher effective range with the 5.56
Even with magnified optics, it's still very difficult to hit targets at 3-400m under stress. That said, the Marines do it better. Watch this space on that front...
9 Hole reviews practical accuracy is a really good demonstration of this. An excellent shooter can hit targets at 500 yards but the arc makes this much harder for lower velocity rounds and that's with a spotter and prone rest. A normal person trying to hit fleeting targets from a standing position and stress is much much harder.
Effective range? The soviet PPSH squads go BRRRT for a solid minute and then just chill at the back line for the rest of the battle. Did I mention the friendly fire due to ricochets?
Most bolt-actions of the late 19th/early 20th century had sights that went all the way out to 2,000 yards/meters, sometimes further. Given the difficulties in actually seeing anything at such a range let alone getting a round even close to the aim point, this sort of extreme-range fire was generally limited to colonial shenanigans as a binocular-equipped officer called range settings to his company lined up like they're at Waterloo as they engage whatever tribal warriors objected to colonization this week. This is the same school of though that gave us the magazine cut-off.
Can’t wait to get home to watch this, I’d like to say thank you for the all great videos you put out. The past 2 months I’ve been in hospital I went and looked for videos of yours. Always was excited to watch them when I wasn’t writing or trying to keep myself occupied. Cheers, wish you the best on this RUclips channel of yours ❤.
A point worth considering is 'effect at range'. Projectiles being in all manner of forms and purposes, the effects they have once they have travelled down range are similarly variable and that can have a big influence on the actual effective range. For example, a grenadier might be expected to be reasonably accurate with an under-barrel grenade launcher out to 200 meters or so, but given the explosive nature of the ammunition, the grenadier in question doesn't necessarily have to be that accurate. You might then consider the effective range of the weapon more like 300+ meters, where even if the grenade itself is a ways off target, the resulting shrapnel compensates. Another example is heavier caliber ammunition fired at a low angle of attack, especially on hard terrain. Something like a .50 caliber HMG, firing at a very low angle, is likely to 'skip' rounds off of the terrain. So while the gunner may only be able to effectively hit targets 500-600 meters away, the resulting spray of wayward ricochets gives the gunner a good chance at hitting targets behind (further away and in-line with) the aim point.
I am curious, where are you getting these maximum effective range figures from? You say 250m for 9mm which is silly short (it's more like 1000) but then say 4700 for 8mm mauser which is about right AFAIK. Are those the stated ranges in CM or something?
Are the pictures of your local area? Lovely stone walls. I'm going to be building some of those over the summer. Old school and the best. Still have those where I'm from in Co. Antrim.
@@usuallyhapless9481 I know not Combat Mission related but didn't think England had stone walls. So interesting they do. I think they're works of art and been asked help build one. Looking forward to learning that. Not a huge wall but I do want to learn those skills. Local farmer has asked would I do it. Answer was yes. Good money in it!
Well, yes and no. The weapon wouldn't get more accrate, the shooter would have some advantages that might make them more accurate. And some disadvantages, like extra weight.
Dude, how did you gain the tactical knowledge to play this game at a high level?? I've learned the basic controls but I'm lost when it comes tonactually developing a plan to achieve the objective during the campaign
@@usuallyhapless9481 I for one am glad you are almost exclusively covering CM. You are the still the best at it, and there is not too many others covering it.
Also at "maximum range" the round isn't traveling very fast and the kinetic energy to actually hurt someone is markedly reduced. Hence comments about 9mm rounds being unable to penetrate a wet greatcoat at 100m.
When's coming out the M2 Eye ball?
DLC. Or a patch...the eye patch.
The eye ball is designated Mk1, not M1. They originated with the seamen and so got the Navy designation.
@@dmitriyogarkov1140 Well played.
You didn't get the birthday update? Lemme get the patch notes for you
They got nerfed. I'm so sorry
@@dmitriyogarkov1140 Mine are from the marine corps sir
One thing I like to point out is that "maximum" range is objective, but "effective" range is a bit more subjective. It depends to an extent on just how effective is considered "effective" by the army defining the effective range.
Exactly. That did sort of get lost in the video.
To add: rockets are even more inaccurate at long range, because they keep accelerating after they leave the muzzle.
There is also the fact that opening fire too far away, will give your position away without inflicting decisive casualties.
And, of course, that means that the enemy has something to yeet mortar bombs at.
Yep, yep, yep
encountering short range RPG ambushes from enemies hidden in buildings are a huge killer of my forces in SF2. i've learned to keep at maximum range (300-400m) and bait out enemy positions with area fire on buildings in order to find those dang RPG teams
The vast majority of rocket weapons burn completly in the fraction of a second they remain in the launch tube. This is necessary to prevent the gunner getting a facefull of rocket exhaust, and is why the Panzershreck has a shield.
A small handful of rockets- RPG-7 rounds (but not the frag one) and Carl Gustav's FFV 551 round come to mind- do have sustainer motors to provide additional thrust and longer effective range. These are on a slight delay to allow the weapon to gain enough distance to not injure the gunner.
Actual ATGMs and MANPADS all have boost-sustain motors as well
its surprised me that in SF2 the US army rifle squad is mostly unmagnified optics. i understand that 300-400m is a good rule of thumb for their effective range
i wonder if the USMC with their long barrel m16 and ACOGs, or other NATO squads who seem to have magnified optics have a higher effective range with the 5.56
The USMC squad in SF2 definitely has a longer effective range! It's an infantry beast.
Even with magnified optics, it's still very difficult to hit targets at 3-400m under stress.
That said, the Marines do it better. Watch this space on that front...
9 Hole reviews practical accuracy is a really good demonstration of this. An excellent shooter can hit targets at 500 yards but the arc makes this much harder for lower velocity rounds and that's with a spotter and prone rest. A normal person trying to hit fleeting targets from a standing position and stress is much much harder.
Can't beat a bit of Henry and Josh
Anyone else looking at Hapless' picture of the English countryside and pining to go on a vacation there?
To be fair, it is usually a lot more grey and miserable
Effective range? The soviet PPSH squads go BRRRT for a solid minute and then just chill at the back line for the rest of the battle. Did I mention the friendly fire due to ricochets?
Most bolt-actions of the late 19th/early 20th century had sights that went all the way out to 2,000 yards/meters, sometimes further.
Given the difficulties in actually seeing anything at such a range let alone getting a round even close to the aim point, this sort of extreme-range fire was generally limited to colonial shenanigans as a binocular-equipped officer called range settings to his company lined up like they're at Waterloo as they engage whatever tribal warriors objected to colonization this week.
This is the same school of though that gave us the magazine cut-off.
It's not bad when you're firing at a massed battalion column. But people gave those up pretty quickly.
Can’t wait to get home to watch this, I’d like to say thank you for the all great videos you put out. The past 2 months I’ve been in hospital I went and looked for videos of yours. Always was excited to watch them when I wasn’t writing or trying to keep myself occupied. Cheers, wish you the best on this RUclips channel of yours ❤.
Wow, hope you're ok man! Glad I was some help.
A point worth considering is 'effect at range'. Projectiles being in all manner of forms and purposes, the effects they have once they have travelled down range are similarly variable and that can have a big influence on the actual effective range.
For example, a grenadier might be expected to be reasonably accurate with an under-barrel grenade launcher out to 200 meters or so, but given the explosive nature of the ammunition, the grenadier in question doesn't necessarily have to be that accurate. You might then consider the effective range of the weapon more like 300+ meters, where even if the grenade itself is a ways off target, the resulting shrapnel compensates.
Another example is heavier caliber ammunition fired at a low angle of attack, especially on hard terrain. Something like a .50 caliber HMG, firing at a very low angle, is likely to 'skip' rounds off of the terrain. So while the gunner may only be able to effectively hit targets 500-600 meters away, the resulting spray of wayward ricochets gives the gunner a good chance at hitting targets behind (further away and in-line with) the aim point.
I am curious, where are you getting these maximum effective range figures from? You say 250m for 9mm which is silly short (it's more like 1000) but then say 4700 for 8mm mauser which is about right AFAIK. Are those the stated ranges in CM or something?
Yeah, those are from the manuals IIRC
Are the pictures of your local area? Lovely stone walls. I'm going to be building some of those over the summer. Old school and the best. Still have those where I'm from in Co. Antrim.
They are! Bit of an art to getting them to stay up.
@@usuallyhapless9481 I know not Combat Mission related but didn't think England had stone walls. So interesting they do. I think they're works of art and been asked help build one. Looking forward to learning that. Not a huge wall but I do want to learn those skills. Local farmer has asked would I do it. Answer was yes. Good money in it!
Excellent work, sir! Please dig deeper into the topic, if you can! Thanks.
Do you plan on doing another campaign like the Scottish corridor? Would love to see you play the CMBN Kampfgruppe Engel campaign
Yes!
4:20 if you add an optic to an SMG the effective range wouldn't change it, but the accuracy within that effective range would be increased
Well, yes and no. The weapon wouldn't get more accrate, the shooter would have some advantages that might make them more accurate. And some disadvantages, like extra weight.
Good video.
Dude, how did you gain the tactical knowledge to play this game at a high level?? I've learned the basic controls but I'm lost when it comes tonactually developing a plan to achieve the objective during the campaign
Lots of getting my arse kicked!
I'm wondering hapless
Would you release videos about other games ?
For example the close combat games ?
Potentially. Finding the time is a bit of an issue.
@@usuallyhapless9481 I for one am glad you are almost exclusively covering CM. You are the still the best at it, and there is not too many others covering it.
Also at "maximum range" the round isn't traveling very fast and the kinetic energy to actually hurt someone is markedly reduced. Hence comments about 9mm rounds being unable to penetrate a wet greatcoat at 100m.
Still not something I'd like to try.
Nice 🙂