Great video. I use the same system and have two suggestions you may like. To avoid dust when pouring the grain into the mash tun, use a piece of plywood with a hole in it the size of the underside of you grain mill. Place on top of the tun and then grind directly into the mash tun. Second, when hooking your hoses up to chill, go through the counterflow chiller before the pump. This way you get more wort out before the pump runs dry.
Thanks John! Those are some great suggestions! I will give them both some seriously consideration! I do worry about the dust created when pouring the grains into the mill. With the counter-flow chiller and pump, I don't see this as a huge concern as I just lift the chiller up when the boil kettle run off is done, and everything in it flows out into the fermenter. If I ever fix it to the frame, I can see that as helping out though! Thanks a lot! Cheers!
Wow Tony!... a 12 hours brew day... now that's true commitment to the craft my friend. Amazing in depth brew day footage as always mate. Thanks for doing what you do and Sharing it. "I f*n love science"! thats pure gold Tony!. Cheers
this is freaking awesome....there was a point in time where i had contemplated a sahti, just never got around to making it.....can't wait to see how this turns out! Well done my man, cheers, and happy new year!!!!
Thanks, man! That makes two of us. Haha. So if you looked into sahti, then you know these beers are not normally carbed up... So that's going to be a little odd, but hey it's the style. More to come on that front. Cheers and Happy New Year to you too!
Woo! A brew day! This is the first one you've posted in real time since I discovered your channel and went through your *entire* video history over the holiday break. I'm embarrassed by how excited I was to see you'd uploaded another brew day. :D Also, I noticed your serious footwear when preparing the grains. I'm still wearing my flip-flops. Would it be mean to tell you what the weather report is here in San Diego??? Thanks for the video; happy new year!
Mr. Tony. There's some crazy guy putting tree clippings in your brewing system. He looks allot like you but, this dude must be off his rocker. This can't be the brewing wizard I know as TONY YATES. That little bug would have been a nice addition the the mix. Ok... At this point I'm thinking two things... You don't drink when you brew and..... You could make a damn good beer from antifreeze. Cheers to my favorite nerd. =)
Your setup is amazing man, a very in-depth video! How long were you brewing for before you got this equipment? Just a word of caution, I noticed a small leak on your mash tun hose connection at around 24:28. Could have just been temporary though.
Hi Brian! Only about 18 months before I got this system. I knew I didn't want to have a garage full of kettles from which I upgraded and just went with what I thought I would want 5 years down the road. It took about a year to get all the parts and assemble it all, but in the end I'm very happy with it. Complete instructions at: www.theelectricbrewery.com. That's just a temp hose I rarely use from time to time to strike with. It's the only time I use it. Good eye though! Cheers!
Thanks Daz! I understand that DWB is a mixture of Calcium Sulfate, Calcium Chloride, and possible Epsom Salt. I believe that's what I saw at Harrys (Idle Valley Brewing) when I was visiting him last summer. The guys who did his water analysis also provided a sheet with recommended amounts for both these salts and another solution for pH (acidity). I think this is a good solution when granular control is not a big concern, or knowledge of water chemistry isn't high. I like having more granular control and being able to tweak each salt accordingly when I want to try something new, but that's just personal preference. I don't see anything wrong with DWB. Those are my thoughts. :-) Cheers!
Thanks for the reply Tony, I am a newly opening brewery in the UK also ive had the same report done cant remember the ratio it provides using DWB this is neutral ratio i think thanks for your thoughts on the matter! Cheers
Thanks Tony, this is an amazing experiment. 12 hours though 😩. Looking forward to watching the results of this. I use a 5.2pH stabiliser in my mash. Do you know if this contains Calcium, Sodium, Epsom Salts etc. to provide the correct water profile and pH or basically only simulates a pH of 5.2 for the conversion of starches to sugar? Cheers.
+Scott Maley Hi Scott, thanks! That product is know to best help water profiles that are higher in residual alkalinity and not so much for lower residual alkalinity (soft/low-mineral water) water profiles. It contains high amounts of sodium and therefore isn't recommended in water that is already high in sodium (which sometimes comes from water softener filtration systems). Some interesting notes about it here: sites.google.com/site/brunwater/water-knowledge Cheers!
Tony Yates Cheers Tony, appreciate the feedback. I use spring water when i brew which i constantly measure the pH as 5.9 to 6.0. So i take this as a high residual alkalinity. Reading the great information from the Bru n' Water link you provided my water needs to be more acidic with an ideal pH of 5.4. The 5.2 stabiliser can benefit the mash with my water being high in residual alkalinity. Mind you i'm not a fan of the sodium increase affecting the beer flavour. Would you add Calcium or Magnesium to this water to make it harder rather than adding an acid such as Phosphoric acid?
Eureka moment! I will add some Gladfields Sour Grapes Malt to the mash which contains lactic acid to balance or reduce pH. 5% addition to the grain bill will drop the pH by .5 from 5.9 to 5.4. Hopefully this does not produce any distinct sourness to the finished beer. 👍🏻
+Scott Maley pH alone is not a good indicator of residual alkalinity. Residual Alkalinity (RA) is only a prediction of what your mash pH will be based on a water profile. It really takes knowing what the hardness (calcium/magnesium) and Alkalinity concentration is in a solution to determine what the RA is. I don't know what the current Ca or Mg concentrations are, so it's impossible to say what I would do. If the question stems from simply wanting to reduce mash pH, the first thing I would want to ensure is that there was at least 50ppm of calcium in the water for yeast health and clarity. Then I would use Phosphoric acid to reduce mash pH if necessary. Cheers!
Cool! I added a link to your playlist for kveik yeast and Norwegian farmhouse ale on the MTF wiki here: www.milkthefunk.com/wiki/Kveik#External_Resources
Tony, I noticed you are measuring pH at room temperature and trying to reach 5.2. I haven't done any experiments to test the taste profile, but I've been taking classes at Siebel and they teach you want around 5.6 pH at room temperature and at mash temperature you want 5.2. My question is have you done comparisons with the different pH levels and, if so, what's the taste profile difference?
+jonathan liles What is the name of the person that teaches that? While the pH range between 5.2 and 5.6 is the desirable range, dependent on beer style/color, all references to those values are always referred to at room temperature unless otherwise stated. My source references are Water: a comprehensive guide for brewers by John Palmer and Colin Kaminski, Bru'N Water by Martin Brungard, A.J. Delange and Greg Noonan - just to name a few. Check out my water videos if you want to learn more. Cheers!
Yes, they mentioned all pH levels are at room temperature unless stated otherwise. They did point out that at room temperature it should be 5.6 and 5.2 is at mash temp. I can't remember the professor's name but it's Siebel Institute in Chicago. I've also read those books you are referring to and I thought it was 5.2 at room temp until I took that class. I'm just getting in to brewing and haven't done any experiments to taste the differences between 5.2 at room temp and 5.6 at room temp.
Right, OK. Well you (or we) are not way off. I guess my main point is that there is not one correct figure - it's a range. I respect John Palmers experience and advise most in this area, and I've heard him express that point on several occations. Here is one time, for example: ruclips.net/video/zJj__jEkFUE/видео.htmlm22s . I will concede that what I said earlier is not exactly what he states in this video, but is very very close. This video is before his book actual, and it's in the book where he changes the range to 5.2 to 5.6. Most pH probes do not last long when stuck directly in the mash, and therefore should only be used at room temperature. pH strips, which have their own quirks, are designed to only be used at room temperature. This is why all texts say pH values are always referred to at room temperature unless otherwise stated. I believe the lectures you heard are repeating what Wolfgang Kunze wrote in Technology Brewing and Malting. These values are likely highly dependent whether the target is alpha amylases or beta amylases, but I wasn't there and don't have the context of the lecture. With an understanding of the relationship between pH and Residual Alkalinity, this is the only experiment that I know of demonstrates the comparisons of your original question. I plan on doing something similar in the near future. Maybe not exactly what they did, but similar: ruclips.net/video/zJj__jEkFUE/видео.htmlm22s . Best regards! Cheers!
I've seen that john palmer video before and must have missed the part about the room temp/mash temp ranges. That's the second place I've seen it. I'm not confused anymore! Thanks, Tony!
Great video. I use the same system and have two suggestions you may like. To avoid dust when pouring the grain into the mash tun, use a piece of plywood with a hole in it the size of the underside of you grain mill. Place on top of the tun and then grind directly into the mash tun. Second, when hooking your hoses up to chill, go through the counterflow chiller before the pump. This way you get more wort out before the pump runs dry.
Thanks John! Those are some great suggestions! I will give them both some seriously consideration! I do worry about the dust created when pouring the grains into the mill. With the counter-flow chiller and pump, I don't see this as a huge concern as I just lift the chiller up when the boil kettle run off is done, and everything in it flows out into the fermenter. If I ever fix it to the frame, I can see that as helping out though! Thanks a lot! Cheers!
Wow Tony!... a 12 hours brew day... now that's true commitment to the craft my friend. Amazing in depth brew day footage as always mate. Thanks for doing what you do and Sharing it. "I f*n love science"! thats pure gold Tony!. Cheers
Thanks, man! I appreciate the kind feedback, Cheers!
Nice to see you Brewing. Tak for the inspiration
+Brewmacker ! Thanks, man. Cheers!
Another complete and outstanding video. Can't wait to see the results :D
Thanks, Mike! I appreciate it. Cheers!
Absolutely fascinating video Tony! Thanks for posting this
Thanks for sticking around :-) It's a long one.. Haha. Cheers!
Great video Tony, really looking forward to the results 👍🍺
Thanks Dan! Me too! Haha. I appreciate it. Cheers!
this is freaking awesome....there was a point in time where i had contemplated a sahti, just never got around to making it.....can't wait to see how this turns out! Well done my man, cheers, and happy new year!!!!
Thanks, man! That makes two of us. Haha. So if you looked into sahti, then you know these beers are not normally carbed up... So that's going to be a little odd, but hey it's the style. More to come on that front. Cheers and Happy New Year to you too!
Great video! Im about to brew one of these myself! Thank you!
+David Heath very cool! Cheers!
I've got at farmhouse going right now. I have some neat adds to help not along. What a interesting brewing style.
Cheers brother
Thanks SJ! Its really pushing my boundaries out a little, so it's all good! Cheers!
talking of hot breaks... remember when we thought we'd got past the hot break at idlevalley? lol nearly poached you before heading home! :)
Great vid Tony, interesting to see the results of different yeasts.
Thanks, Mark! It's going to be interesting for sure. I'm looking forward to try them out soon! Cheers!
Good brewing video.
Thanks, I appreciate that. Cheers!
nice video! just had some lutefisk the other day, yummmy!!!!
Woo! A brew day! This is the first one you've posted in real time since I discovered your channel and went through your *entire* video history over the holiday break. I'm embarrassed by how excited I was to see you'd uploaded another brew day. :D
Also, I noticed your serious footwear when preparing the grains. I'm still wearing my flip-flops. Would it be mean to tell you what the weather report is here in San Diego???
Thanks for the video; happy new year!
Haha, cool! No, that's OK. Not many people know I used to live in Scripps Ranch. Haha. Cheers!
Mr. Tony. There's some crazy guy putting tree clippings in your brewing system. He looks allot like you but, this dude must be off his rocker. This can't be the brewing wizard I know as TONY YATES. That little bug would have been a nice addition the the mix. Ok... At this point I'm thinking two things... You don't drink when you brew and..... You could make a damn good beer from antifreeze. Cheers to my favorite nerd. =)
+Drunkinone Haha! That's funny right there, love it! Nope, I reserve the beer for after the yeast has been pitched and the equipment is clean! Cheers!
Your setup is amazing man, a very in-depth video! How long were you brewing for before you got this equipment? Just a word of caution, I noticed a small leak on your mash tun hose connection at around 24:28. Could have just been temporary though.
Hi Brian! Only about 18 months before I got this system. I knew I didn't want to have a garage full of kettles from which I upgraded and just went with what I thought I would want 5 years down the road. It took about a year to get all the parts and assemble it all, but in the end I'm very happy with it. Complete instructions at: www.theelectricbrewery.com. That's just a temp hose I rarely use from time to time to strike with. It's the only time I use it. Good eye though! Cheers!
very interesting Tony!! I'm glad you love to science the shit out of it! :-) You learn way more that way too! keep up the awesome work!
+Stass Brewing Thanks Stass! It sure is, cheers!
Always interesting to hear you talk about water chemistry what are your thoughts on adding DWB vs Each salt on its own?
Cheers
Thanks Daz! I understand that DWB is a mixture of Calcium Sulfate, Calcium Chloride, and possible Epsom Salt. I believe that's what I saw at Harrys (Idle Valley Brewing) when I was visiting him last summer. The guys who did his water analysis also provided a sheet with recommended amounts for both these salts and another solution for pH (acidity). I think this is a good solution when granular control is not a big concern, or knowledge of water chemistry isn't high. I like having more granular control and being able to tweak each salt accordingly when I want to try something new, but that's just personal preference. I don't see anything wrong with DWB. Those are my thoughts. :-) Cheers!
Thanks for the reply Tony, I am a newly opening brewery in the UK also ive had the same report done cant remember the ratio it provides using DWB this is neutral ratio i think thanks for your thoughts on the matter!
Cheers
Espetacular! Manda umas leveduras dessas para o Brasil!
Thanks Tony, this is an amazing experiment. 12 hours though 😩. Looking forward to watching the results of this. I use a 5.2pH stabiliser in my mash. Do you know if this contains Calcium, Sodium, Epsom Salts etc. to provide the correct water profile and pH or basically only simulates a pH of 5.2 for the conversion of starches to sugar? Cheers.
+Scott Maley Hi Scott, thanks! That product is know to best help water profiles that are higher in residual alkalinity and not so much for lower residual alkalinity (soft/low-mineral water) water profiles. It contains high amounts of sodium and therefore isn't recommended in water that is already high in sodium (which sometimes comes from water softener filtration systems). Some interesting notes about it here: sites.google.com/site/brunwater/water-knowledge Cheers!
Tony Yates Cheers Tony, appreciate the feedback. I use spring water when i brew which i constantly measure the pH as 5.9 to 6.0. So i take this as a high residual alkalinity. Reading the great information from the Bru n' Water link you provided my water needs to be more acidic with an ideal pH of 5.4. The 5.2 stabiliser can benefit the mash with my water being high in residual alkalinity. Mind you i'm not a fan of the sodium increase affecting the beer flavour. Would you add Calcium or Magnesium to this water to make it harder rather than adding an acid such as Phosphoric acid?
Eureka moment! I will add some Gladfields Sour Grapes Malt to the mash which contains lactic acid to balance or reduce pH. 5% addition to the grain bill will drop the pH by .5 from 5.9 to 5.4. Hopefully this does not produce any distinct sourness to the finished beer. 👍🏻
+Scott Maley yes, this is the traditional way to do it. Another alternative is just to use lactic acid, or phosphoric acid. Cheers!
+Scott Maley pH alone is not a good indicator of residual alkalinity. Residual Alkalinity (RA) is only a prediction of what your mash pH will be based on a water profile. It really takes knowing what the hardness (calcium/magnesium) and Alkalinity concentration is in a solution to determine what the RA is. I don't know what the current Ca or Mg concentrations are, so it's impossible to say what I would do. If the question stems from simply wanting to reduce mash pH, the first thing I would want to ensure is that there was at least 50ppm of calcium in the water for yeast health and clarity. Then I would use Phosphoric acid to reduce mash pH if necessary. Cheers!
Cool! I added a link to your playlist for kveik yeast and Norwegian farmhouse ale on the MTF wiki here: www.milkthefunk.com/wiki/Kveik#External_Resources
What? Get out! I made it into the wiki? Mind blown! Cheers, Dan!
Tony, what size gap do you use on your mill?
Did anyone see a spider? :P looking great.
Tony, I noticed you are measuring pH at room temperature and trying to reach 5.2. I haven't done any experiments to test the taste profile, but I've been taking classes at Siebel and they teach you want around 5.6 pH at room temperature and at mash temperature you want 5.2. My question is have you done comparisons with the different pH levels and, if so, what's the taste profile difference?
+jonathan liles What is the name of the person that teaches that? While the pH range between 5.2 and 5.6 is the desirable range, dependent on beer style/color, all references to those values are always referred to at room temperature unless otherwise stated. My source references are Water: a comprehensive guide for brewers by John Palmer and Colin Kaminski, Bru'N Water by Martin Brungard, A.J. Delange and Greg Noonan - just to name a few. Check out my water videos if you want to learn more. Cheers!
Yes, they mentioned all pH levels are at room temperature unless stated otherwise. They did point out that at room temperature it should be 5.6 and 5.2 is at mash temp. I can't remember the professor's name but it's Siebel Institute in Chicago. I've also read those books you are referring to and I thought it was 5.2 at room temp until I took that class. I'm just getting in to brewing and haven't done any experiments to taste the differences between 5.2 at room temp and 5.6 at room temp.
Right, OK. Well you (or we) are not way off. I guess my main point is that there is not one correct figure - it's a range. I respect John Palmers experience and advise most in this area, and I've heard him express that point on several occations. Here is one time, for example: ruclips.net/video/zJj__jEkFUE/видео.htmlm22s . I will concede that what I said earlier is not exactly what he states in this video, but is very very close. This video is before his book actual, and it's in the book where he changes the range to 5.2 to 5.6. Most pH probes do not last long when stuck directly in the mash, and therefore should only be used at room temperature. pH strips, which have their own quirks, are designed to only be used at room temperature. This is why all texts say pH values are always referred to at room temperature unless otherwise stated.
I believe the lectures you heard are repeating what Wolfgang Kunze wrote in Technology Brewing and Malting. These values are likely highly dependent whether the target is alpha amylases or beta amylases, but I wasn't there and don't have the context of the lecture.
With an understanding of the relationship between pH and Residual Alkalinity, this is the only experiment that I know of demonstrates the comparisons of your original question. I plan on doing something similar in the near future. Maybe not exactly what they did, but similar: ruclips.net/video/zJj__jEkFUE/видео.htmlm22s . Best regards! Cheers!
I've seen that john palmer video before and must have missed the part about the room temp/mash temp ranges. That's the second place I've seen it. I'm not confused anymore! Thanks, Tony!