On the 2-piece seal (in the interest of preventing rear main leaks), I highly recommend "clocking" the mating surface of the two main seal halves- i.e. 8 and 2 o'clock instead of inline with the same mating surface of the oil pan. An old school racer taught me that some 30+ years ago, and it has never let me down.
The center bolt valve cover one piece engines are just as buildable. You are 100% correct! The only thing I seen you forgot to mention is some of the newer blocks are sealed-off where you would normally bolt on a manual fuel pump.
I'm a boater and have built a 383 from a 350. The main differences are that the boat engine is always under load so the ring clearances and piston side clearances are like a truck engine. And boat cams need to be designed to prohibit reversion. Quick explaination of why reversion is bad in boats... When the exhaust valve is still open as the intake stroke begins, there is a bit of overlap when both valves are open. During idle some exhaust can get pulled back into the combustion chamber. This is no big deal with non boat engines. They can use a big cam and get more power with cool noises. But boat engines use water cooled exhaust. The water is added to the exhaust after it exits the heads and goes up through a casting, then turns downward and to the rear. During lower rpm this reversion pulse in the exhaust can pull water into the engine if the cam isn't right.
Dan M mine has a single screw volvo penta set up. Just has a single prop. But I get what your saying about dipstick. Thats how I change the oil is by pumping it out from the dipstick tube. Thanks for your input though I appreciate it!
@@savageshooter2248 Like he said, you don’t have to drop or lift the crankshaft. Once the cap is removed, you can tap the seal halve around and pull it out. The other halve on the cap of course is easily swapped. I personally prefer a 2pc. I’ve recently built two SBCs and sourced 0010 blocks with 2pc seals. It’s my preference for my personal trucks. The seal shouldn’t leak. But if it ever does, it’s relatively easy to replace it. No need to pull a transmission (and transfer case if 4wd) out!
I was working at a GM dealer shop in the early to mid 1980s and 2 piece Chevy rear main seals were never a big problem. I remember replacing a few, I guess, but not very often. One piece seals are a little more tolerant of a worn rear main bearing before leaking maybe. Worn main bearings and rear main seal leaks go hand in hand. Bad PCV valves, too.
I think that's because most folks in the early 80's more or less expected their cars to leak oil. Oil seepage on the driveway and in the garage was commonplace back then. The mentality of the consumer was not to return the car to the dealer for slow oil drips.
The quality of American cars in general was abysmal during those years, but we made a lot of money back then adjusted for inflation because the cars sucked so badly and needed repairs so often. Air conditioner / HVAC repairs on GM vehicles alone put a lot of dollars in our pockets back then on the old R12 systems.
I have an 84 k10 Chevy just bought..leaks everywhere ..pan ,valve covers, probably rear seal,. A little blow by..pcv valve was not even sticking in the valve cover.. I'm looking at replacing all the gaskets , plus doing a catch can..what do you think?
for alittle tid bit of info. port is left, both 4 letters, also port wine is red so the port running light is red. the right side is starboard, green light. in the very old days the steering board or rudder was mounted on the starboard side. the right side was originally called the steer board side and sometime it was changed to starboard. so when you were entering "port" you brought the port side to the dock. if you docked on the starboard side you haD A GOOD chance of hitting the rudder.
I don’t know if you read comments. But your video helped me out a lot!!! I blindly bought a Chevy 350 and 400th tranny from a project car guy. It was missing the torque converter and flex plate. I was lost alon trying to figure out which engine I had
One thing you halto understand is it takes allot more torque and power to move a boat than it does something on 4 wheels also this boat is on the larger side the amount of power it takes to increase the speed of a boat on the water is staggering compared to a car so this boat can pull it;s own weight and two skiers at around 20 MPH it can pull 1 skier at 28 MPG with no skier it can do around 35 to 40 MPH with 100 extra HP we can add 10 to 12 MPH to all of those speeds that's all 100 HP gets you on the water water has a huge amount of resistance and it takes a ton of power to overcome it keep in mind this is a large boat that does not normally get used for skiers the engines themselves are very different from car engines clearances and internal parts wise they also rotate in opposite directions from one another this is done with reverse rotation camshaft,distributor and starter motor. There is allot of things that are kind of tricky with this marine stuff fortunately for me I have a buddy who builds crazy high HP marine engines and he has educated me about all of this over the years
I was thinking the same . I have a 5.0 Volvo Penta and it pulls three people on a large tube and will go fast enough to administer free lake water enimas for all.
Yea I was thinking same thing. These motors are either super weak or these people are very big. Our Nautiques in ski shows would pull up 4 or 5 people on skies. Of course it takes a tad longer but it’s done all the time. Not a big deal
I have changed the rear main seal, and inserts without taking the crank out on the older engine. Not a big deal but when you are doing this shade tree without engine/trans hoists etc.
I've never had a two piece that didn't outlast the engine. I have had one piece ones fail... Just like the new unit wheel bearings. Never had an old spindje hearing or old axle bearing fail and the new unit bearings go out all the time. Progress sucks sometimes
Dont forget in marine applications one motor spins clockwise the other spins counterclockwise my brother worked on boat engines for awhile..I thought he was full of it..
Good video. I am in the middle of a build using a 1993 350 in a 1983 Chevy 4X4. There were two notable differences other than the rear main. The 4 center intake bolts are at a different angle so you can't use an older intake I bought an edelbrock 3706 performer to switch back to 83 emissions using a carb instead of the injection. Also there is no ports drilled through the engine block to receive a fuel pump but if you need they sell jigs for doing it. I like the bolts in the intake better because they come out easier and I don't mind using an electric pump as those mechanicals were a bit of a pain to get to. No more greasing the rod! ;^D
Thanks for the information, cant wait for the 305 v6 run video. you encourage me to rebuild my 350 sbc. I hear your really busy with other builds, hope your shop has AC its going to be hot here in Phoenix soon. :D
What is the difference between a "marine" engine and an automotive engine...I am a boat owner and my boat has a a chevy 350 265 hp single engine or "single screw"...but I wondered is there a difference in the block or is it that they are just set up differently as far as the cooling and manifolds...I know your a hot rod guy and not a boater and thats cool...but I wonder why when you go to buy a 350 chevy motor they specify "marine" engine for a boat (by the way they charge for that moniker) or is it that they just say that to beat you up at the marine mechanics shops...just wondered.
Thanks for your time to explain these main seal differences. Was kinda confused because the motor i'm putting in my S-10 is from a 1985 monte carlo SS. I know it won't be a race truck but better than a 2.8 V6. P.S. I subscribed.
not sure if anyones mentioned it, but you need to be REALLY careful with cams in marine motors... If you don't have the right LSA you can get reversion where the motor actually sucks water back in the engine because the exhausts manifolds have water in them.
Yes this is very true this is just one aspect to consider when building a marine engine where people get in trouble is they put a passenger car engine into a boat this is a really bad idea marine engines are built very different than a car engine everything from balancing to clearances and yes the cam profile like you said, great point
So I'm working on a 383 stroker for a friend. The dipstick is on the passenger side. I pulled the oil pan and need to replace it and Summit said I have the later model small block. Well it's a old style 2 piece seal rear main cap with a old style crank shaft. So I assume you can run a older crank in the newer blocks and use a two piece rear main?
Currently rebuilding my vortec block but i was wondering i have a one piece main seal but at 4:05 , is their supposed to be a gasket or something that goes where the main bearing journal is where the one piece main seal bolts up to ? Was only wondering because i was told the slots were made to run a 2 piece and one main seal Thanks.
Also didnt see anyone mention that in 91 or 92 they went to a roller cam and on the vortec block there is not the extra bolt hole on the water pump that is all tue way thru to thr water jacket on the non vortec
Some of those 350 vortec (880) blocks are not drilled right for a early stamped timing covers and some of them don't have the water bypass hole under the left water pump mounting holes.
Hey great channel pal” I’m building me an 880 block now and am using a lot the knowledge I’m learning every step of the way. That being said, it would be nice to know exactly what is the differences in timing covers from older to newer sbc. Thanks a bunch keep up the good work 👌👌👌
The vortec uses a plastic timing cover that has a built in seal and a crank sensor you can use the early steel cover on it if you install the dowl pins into it the bolt pattern is the same
'86 is also the year they introduced stock hydraulic roller lifters to their SBC lineup, saving loads of trouble of having to add ZDDP formula to every oil change. What's really nice is a lot of parts from the Vortec era can be carried over to the '86-'95 engine lineup, thus modernizing any engine you've been running for 30 years or more.
Yeah Ford did the same thing, they ran flat tappets for years way after the SBC blocks got rollers on some of their engines. Jeg's direct replacement truck motors still come with flat tappets, their Vortec models came with rollers, though now it seems they're phasing Vortec motors out in favor for crate performance engines. Rebuilt motors are gonna be the cheapest way to go in order to get a stock engine with hydraulic rollers.
Skyline Fever, the raised boss tower is cast in the galley and can be drilled and tapped for the spider hold down. Very easy to make those motors into a roller cam motor.
Yeah you don't even have to go that far, just get roller lifters that are paired together with a control arm, that arm keeps the lifters from spinning in their bores so the rollers are always in line with the cam.
id much rather have the old 2 piece seals. you can remove the oilpan and rear cap, and use a wood screw to pull the old seal and put a new seal in by rotating the crank by hand. the 1 piece type you have to separate the engine from transmission to replace
This was perfect thank you . I have a early 1970s cam and lifters heads and intake I was unsure weather they would work on a 87 4 bolt main . Can you please do a video on installing cam bearings everyone iv talked to has a different way I need to see your way please
Ah-Ha! Likely you didn't mean to say a 1998 can have 1970 cylinder heads. Starting in 1996 all of the engines had some major changes like the Vortec heads, roller camshafts, multi-port fuel injection vs. TBI from 1986-1995. One example is that you could do a camshaft and lifter job on the 1995 and earlier engines by just pulling the intake manifold and valve covers off. Newer models you have to remove the cylinder heads to do a cam and lifter job. As far as the actual head bolt pattern, not sure. TBI's are center bolt heads with center bolt valve covers. So many unnecessary changes making things more difficult and less interchangeable makes most people think they have been trying to make the old shade tree mechanic give up and take it to the dealership for service. Like why would the engineers mess with the location and reliability of an oil pump? Well, they did it on the 1996 and later models.
I am in the same ‘boat’. :) I have an 88 Sea Ray with 2 x 5.7s (1 piece rear-main seal) and they need overhaul. Could you please tell me what heads & camshafts combo you used to increase his HP? If you have a recommended brand or a link please include. Thank you for the very informative video!
I just built my first stroker .did the oil pan rail clearancing myself out the pan on and installed the motor .guess what.i didn't clearance the oil pan...nothing is hurt.. just sounded bad till I figured outwhat it was..I won't say what my first thoughts and words were
What about the intake manifold mounting bolts on the newer block with TBI? I thought that some of the bolts are angled which prevents you from running a carburetor manifold.
I’ve seen a lot of people run cooler lines to the centre of the head because of the valves burning out Also cooler lines from back to the front and middle of the manifold Is there a water jacket in the centre between the bolts on the manifold into the head ?
when you install the timing gear do you put lock tite on the 3 bolts? also the specs for timing chain slack say around 22 mm. that seems like alot.. what is acceptable. thanks
Great share, I,m asking, without a scope how can I determine if my 1985 305 ci.is a one piece or two piece rear seal ? The engine number tells me its a 1985 installed in Malibu. The chassis was an unknown build date donor car. Thanks
Question on a harmonic balancer. Did about 2 hrs of research with no luck. Dirt circle track sbc 6500 rpm msd chipped with rotating assembly internally balanced, h beam rods hyperpneutectic pistons and 1 piece cast crank. Will any balancer work or would you have a suggested opinion?
not sure what kind of boat but it is on the big side he said one of these engines runs clockwise and the other runs counter clock wise I guess to avoid torque steer
MrColdwatercanyon just a note check the seals for the way the groves are going. I've hear on the counter rotators the groves on the seal are flipped to help keep oil in the motor and to help with leaking....
1 what i need to change from 2 piece seal to 1 piece ? 2 i have 1981suburban 350 SB, to change more horse power 350 , do i need more cooling , my area extreme hot regards, and thanks for the information Mak
I pulled out an internally balanced 350 from by '78 GMC P35. I ordered a rebuilt motor and when I received it I noticed that it is externally balanced. Can I just put a different flywheel (manual transmission) on the new motor?
I just got my motor rebuilt and the end of the crankshaft that you called a flex plate the new motor does not have the studs in it. And I’m having a hard time getting them out of the old block. What do I google to find these new studs? And what are they called?
The one piece blocks aren’t better, they’re a lighter casting by 15lbs and that weight was removed from the coolant passage walls and main web which makes them significantly more noteworthy for cracking along said walls . As to the rear main, clock the seal and you will WILL eliminate the leaking, it’s that easy.
The older blocks were more common with 4 bolt mains, which are stronger for big power. Most of the newer blocks with a 1 piece rear main seal come with a 2 bolt main. There are 1 piece rear mains with 4 bolt mains but they aren’t very common.... hopefully that makes sense.
Can you put a late-model crank one-piece rear main in the early block which was two piece cuz I seen online where they make it us to go for the one piece to a two piece or two piece two ones each other say aluminum flange art I really need to know if I should very much
I'm in need of some advice I have 1989 Chevy k1500 and I need to replace or rebuild my 350 tbi that's in it. The question I have is it worth the extra money to put in a roller cam setup or leave it factory cam I would like to get about 325 hp out of it is that possible without doing a 383 stroker build
Port and Starboard FYI :--))))))))))))))))))))) Oh, I just noticed those engines, being black, I'm thinking these are Merc-Cruiser engines? They are Chev 350 & big blocks, not sure sure about Fords, tho. We used these engines at Tollycraft Yachts when I worked there way back.
I think the only drawback is they did not make a 400 crank with a one piece seal so you can't make a 383 stroker on the newer blocks. I believe the last 400 SBC was 1980. please correct me if I'm wrong
I have a 350 with the starter boats are straight across ,is that away to tell if it's a one or two piece seal , with the starter bolt hole pattern that's straight across what tooth flywheel will I need 168 or 154
You didn't show the back of the block!!! If you happen to have a very expensive one piece rms crank, you can machine the back of the block and cap to fit the one piece main seal. Nobody ever talks about it or mentions it. The one piece rear main block and cap actually have less material. Using a mill you can remove the material and fit the one piece. You don't want to buy a new or used one piece rear main cap. If you do, you will have to align hone the mains. You simply machine the seal lip off of the back of the cap and the back of the block with it torqued in place. Once the back is machined, drilled and tapped for the one piece seal adapter plate, you're good to go. You can even drill and tap the top of the oil gallery above the cam to mount the spider to hold gm OEM lifter rings and machine the top of the lifter bores so the rings fit loosely on the OEM roller lifters. Use studs and loctite them in to avoid leaks using two nuts to set the height of the retainer. And your done! GM hot cam here we come lol.
your talking about a ton of machine work at an average of $100.00 per hour it is far more cost effective to buy a roller block for a couple hundred bucks and your done I would charge $500+ for all that work it doesen't make sence to me to try and sell this to a customer when the 880 blocks are a dime a dozen
@@Myvintageiron7512 I agree with that if you're talking about a factory block. Unless you have your own mill... With a CNC mill it's a single fixture mount. With the rear main bolted in place, the only way I would do it, it's cleaning out a circle and tapping a few holes. If you're talking about aftermarket blocks and 4000 dollar cranks, even $500 is worth it. Blueprinting a block will run you that.
I have a 79 350 block 2 piece on the rear 4 bolt main the only issue i have is the fkexplate vibrates a little n ive replaced it twice ha snew harmonic balancer but still vibrates a little any advice on what could cause the vibration dowmes not burn oil runs very good had it on truck since 85 and has no blowby
i see you mention interchangeable on all parts would that include distributor from like 85 going into a lets say 86 to 89 vehicle i should know this but i do most of the bull work installing and removing had a friend who did timing ect ?
Dude those crank shafts has lots of differences you should inform the public of..i understand maybe why you didn't mention a few things ..because it really doesn't have much to do with the rear mainseal...but obviously one crank was forged...which can handle much more horse power.....while the one piece seal crank is clearly a cast crankshaft...and it would also appear the forged crank was one of the few that was internally and externally balanced...probably out of an old school 350 out of a suburban or truck..with what they used to call 400hp heads...which if i am correct you cannot bolt any old,flywheel to it will vibrate it's self to pieces in no time..im aware people will most likely argue that 350 never made an inrernal/external balanced engine..but indeed they did a few..for bigger applicatipns...same reason you cannot use 400 to 350 fly wheels to interchange....just saying ..i like your videos...you do have a lot of knowledge...but I find in some of your videos you fail to mention certain things that in my opinion is vital ...
This difference sucks when your working on a budget, pulled the 350 out of my 87 IROC, put a 70 350 in it an the damm flywheel want work,now I have to hunt down a flywheel for a early 350
Hello I have a early block the problem I'm having is that the 2 pc rear seal it seam to be to long. Can I cut the end to make them fit. I think they sent me the wrong seal because they go above the block like if they to long. Thank Robert
How the heck do you get the old seal out of the housing to replace it with a new one wirh out damaging the housing? Is there a video that addresses that?
@@Myvintageiron7512 I have it out. The seasons a bugger to remove was just wondering if a trick to popping it out so I can install the new one. I've seen a couple guys beat it out with a hammer and punch.
Is there by any chance a way to convert the 2pc type of engine to a 1pc? Like can i put a 1pc crank in a 2pc block and just bolt on a 1pc crankcap and that aluminium sealplate on the 2pc block? Or are the blocks also different so im bound to get a 1pc block? Great video btw! :-)
Ill have to look but what's all the differences between a vortex and the earlier blocks. The new LS stuff confuses me. I know some have the aluminum block and most are iron on the LS. Thanks for your info
On the 2-piece seal (in the interest of preventing rear main leaks), I highly recommend "clocking" the mating surface of the two main seal halves- i.e. 8 and 2 o'clock instead of inline with the same mating surface of the oil pan. An old school racer taught me that some 30+ years ago, and it has never let me down.
Yes definitely be a good trick to know
8 and 4 😉
What do you mean by clocking?
My dad taught me this about clocking the seal
The center bolt valve cover one piece engines are just as buildable. You are 100% correct! The only thing I seen you forgot to mention is some of the newer blocks are sealed-off where you would normally bolt on a manual fuel pump.
I'm a boater and have built a 383 from a 350. The main differences are that the boat engine is always under load so the ring clearances and piston side clearances are like a truck engine. And boat cams need to be designed to prohibit reversion.
Quick explaination of why reversion is bad in boats...
When the exhaust valve is still open as the intake stroke begins, there is a bit of overlap when both valves are open. During idle some exhaust can get pulled back into the combustion chamber. This is no big deal with non boat engines. They can use a big cam and get more power with cool noises.
But boat engines use water cooled exhaust. The water is added to the exhaust after it exits the heads and goes up through a casting, then turns downward and to the rear. During lower rpm this reversion pulse in the exhaust can pull water into the engine if the cam isn't right.
That really makes sense. I learned something.
Smart!
only plus to the 2pc rear main is you can change it w/o pulling trans out
Dan M mine has a single screw volvo penta set up. Just has a single prop. But I get what your saying about dipstick. Thats how I change the oil is by pumping it out from the dipstick tube. Thanks for your input though I appreciate it!
How you have to drop the crankshaft
@@Ohiocountryboy-se2cn no you dont
Would a two piece rear mail seal oil pan from a 1966 Chevelle work on a 1998 oil piece rear mail seal block? Great video as always.
@@savageshooter2248 Like he said, you don’t have to drop or lift the crankshaft. Once the cap is removed, you can tap the seal halve around and pull it out. The other halve on the cap of course is easily swapped. I personally prefer a 2pc. I’ve recently built two SBCs and sourced 0010 blocks with 2pc seals. It’s my preference for my personal trucks. The seal shouldn’t leak. But if it ever does, it’s relatively easy to replace it. No need to pull a transmission (and transfer case if 4wd) out!
Been watching you for a few years, awesome stuff, I can watch it all day!
I was working at a GM dealer shop in the early to mid 1980s and 2 piece Chevy rear main seals were never a big problem. I remember replacing a few, I guess, but not very often. One piece seals are a little more tolerant of a worn rear main bearing before leaking maybe. Worn main bearings and rear main seal leaks go hand in hand. Bad PCV valves, too.
I think that's because most folks in the early 80's more or less expected their cars to leak oil. Oil seepage on the driveway and in the garage was commonplace back then. The mentality of the consumer was not to return the car to the dealer for slow oil drips.
The quality of American cars in general was abysmal during those years, but we made a lot of money back then adjusted for inflation because the cars sucked so badly and needed repairs so often. Air conditioner / HVAC repairs on GM vehicles alone put a lot of dollars in our pockets back then on the old R12 systems.
I have an 84 k10 Chevy just bought..leaks everywhere ..pan ,valve covers, probably rear seal,. A little blow by..pcv valve was not even sticking in the valve cover.. I'm looking at replacing all the gaskets , plus doing a catch can..what do you think?
@@davidjessee7701 God, Don't do it man. That would be common sense...
I find all your videos are very interesting, im watching all of them as they come out, be nice to see the 350s being assembled and running
keep watching em you will see that's already been done
THX
for alittle tid bit of info. port is left, both 4 letters, also port wine is red so the port running light is red. the right side is starboard, green light. in the very old days the steering board or rudder was mounted on the starboard side. the right side was originally called the steer board side and sometime it was changed to starboard. so when you were entering "port" you brought the port side to the dock. if you docked on the starboard side you haD A GOOD chance of hitting the rudder.
You should sell merchandise like shirts or caps I would definitely buy one to support your channel your my favorite automotive channel on RUclips 👍
Very informative video, I appreciate your time in helping all of us make fewer mistakes and spend a lot less money. Keep up the great work!
Could you do a video of the best way to replace a 2 piece while still in a vehicle?
There's only one way, and it ain't good.
The worst part is dropping the pan if that's possible
I don’t know if you read comments. But your video helped me out a lot!!! I blindly bought a Chevy 350 and 400th tranny from a project car guy. It was missing the torque converter and flex plate. I was lost alon trying to figure out which engine I had
glad it helped
Great video. I was struggling to figure out how the 2 piece rear main seal goes back in. Now I know. THANKS
Ya. Whew, Lucky I watched. I did learn Those crank bolt patterns are different...
Crikey mate..2x 350's and he needs more to pull 2 people out of the water.?..How big are these people.?
One thing you halto understand is it takes allot more torque and power to move a boat than it does something on 4 wheels also this boat is on the larger side the amount of power it takes to increase the speed of a boat on the water is staggering compared to a car so this boat can pull it;s own weight and two skiers at around 20 MPH it can pull 1 skier at 28 MPG with no skier it can do around 35 to 40 MPH with 100 extra HP we can add 10 to 12 MPH to all of those speeds that's all 100 HP gets you on the water water has a huge amount of resistance and it takes a ton of power to overcome it keep in mind this is a large boat that does not normally get used for skiers the engines themselves are very different from car engines clearances and internal parts wise they also rotate in opposite directions from one another this is done with reverse rotation camshaft,distributor and starter motor. There is allot of things that are kind of tricky with this marine stuff fortunately for me I have a buddy who builds crazy high HP marine engines and he has educated me about all of this over the years
I was thinking the same . I have a 5.0 Volvo Penta and it pulls three people on a large tube and will go fast enough to administer free lake water enimas for all.
i agree we only used one engine just it was a 396 rat
Yea I was thinking same thing. These motors are either super weak or these people are very big. Our Nautiques in ski shows would pull up 4 or 5 people on skies. Of course it takes a tad longer but it’s done all the time. Not a big deal
It's running twins, it's probably a pretty big 80s boat. Probably a Cuddy if it has trouble with speed.
EXACTLY what I've been needing to know.
I have changed the rear main seal, and inserts without taking the crank out on the older engine. Not a big deal but when you are doing this shade tree without engine/trans hoists etc.
I've never had a two piece that didn't outlast the engine. I have had one piece ones fail...
Just like the new unit wheel bearings. Never had an old spindje hearing or old axle bearing fail and the new unit bearings go out all the time.
Progress sucks sometimes
could you do a mid 90's lt1 build? not much info available on those engines.
Dont forget in marine applications one motor spins clockwise the other spins counterclockwise my brother worked on boat engines for awhile..I thought he was full of it..
Good video. I am in the middle of a build using a 1993 350 in a 1983 Chevy 4X4. There were two notable differences other than the rear main. The 4 center intake bolts are at a different angle so you can't use an older intake I bought an edelbrock 3706 performer to switch back to 83 emissions using a carb instead of the injection. Also there is no ports drilled through the engine block to receive a fuel pump but if you need they sell jigs for doing it. I like the bolts in the intake better because they come out easier and I don't mind using an electric pump as those mechanicals were a bit of a pain to get to. No more greasing the rod! ;^D
Oil pans are different for the 2 piece and 1 piece and some companies dont make 1 piece oil pans for 85 and under chassis's
You really help me out ... thanks a lot brother!
you are doing a great job, I am enjoying your videos. Keep up the good work!
Thanks for the information, cant wait for the 305 v6 run video. you encourage me to rebuild my 350 sbc. I hear your really busy with other builds, hope your shop has AC its going to be hot here in Phoenix soon. :D
What is the difference between a "marine" engine and an automotive engine...I am a boat owner and my boat has a a chevy 350 265 hp single engine or "single screw"...but I wondered is there a difference in the block or is it that they are just set up differently as far as the cooling and manifolds...I know your a hot rod guy and not a boater and thats cool...but I wonder why when you go to buy a 350 chevy motor they specify "marine" engine for a boat (by the way they charge for that moniker) or is it that they just say that to beat you up at the marine mechanics shops...just wondered.
Thanks for your time to explain these main seal differences. Was kinda confused because the motor i'm putting in my S-10 is from a 1985 monte carlo SS. I know it won't be a race truck but better than a 2.8 V6. P.S. I subscribed.
not sure if anyones mentioned it, but you need to be REALLY careful with cams in marine motors... If you don't have the right LSA you can get reversion where the motor actually sucks water back in the engine because the exhausts manifolds have water in them.
Yes this is very true this is just one aspect to consider when building a marine engine where people get in trouble is they put a passenger car engine into a boat this is a really bad idea marine engines are built very different than a car engine everything from balancing to clearances and yes the cam profile like you said, great point
Yeah it happened to my brother's boat engine then the engine builder told me about it never heard of it till then makes sense though
I've built a lot of boat engines and I've never seen this happen ever except in one engine that flattened the cam on the intake side.
Make sure if one of those are ccw rotation you need the correct direction main seal or you will be dropping the pan as soon as you get it installed
And this is 1 of the main reasons Chevy was loved. They basically stayed the same until LS
So I'm working on a 383 stroker for a friend. The dipstick is on the passenger side. I pulled the oil pan and need to replace it and Summit said I have the later model small block. Well it's a old style 2 piece seal rear main cap with a old style crank shaft. So I assume you can run a older crank in the newer blocks and use a two piece rear main?
So correct me if I'm wrong. 2 piece rear main seal is internally balanced and 1 piece rear main seal is externally balanced
Thank you for your videos learning a lot I want to do a engine build on my Camaro
Currently rebuilding my vortec block but i was wondering i have a one piece main seal but at 4:05 , is their supposed to be a gasket or something that goes where the main bearing journal is where the one piece main seal bolts up to ? Was only wondering because i was told the slots were made to run a 2 piece and one main seal Thanks.
The starter is different. The one piece rear seal flexplate is closer to the block by about a 1/4 inch
Also didnt see anyone mention that in 91 or 92 they went to a roller cam and on the vortec block there is not the extra bolt hole on the water pump that is all tue way thru to thr water jacket on the non vortec
Some of those 350 vortec (880) blocks are not drilled right for a early stamped timing covers and some of them don't have the water bypass hole under the left water pump mounting holes.
yes that is correct
Hey great channel pal”
I’m building me an 880 block now and am using a lot the knowledge I’m learning every step of the way.
That being said, it would be nice to know exactly what is the differences in timing covers from older to newer sbc. Thanks a bunch keep up the good work 👌👌👌
The vortec uses a plastic timing cover that has a built in seal and a crank sensor you can use the early steel cover on it if you install the dowl pins into it the bolt pattern is the same
If I’m not mistaken the oil pans are different as well.
This helps to understand a lot! Thank you!
I wanted to hear about oil pan differences between one and two piece rear main seal oil pans
There is really not much to say about that except that they are different and not interchangeable they are both about the same size wise
So I cannot use a 2 piece oil pan on a 1 piece motor?
John Lafrance I was wondering the same. Did you ever find out?
@@Myvintageiron7512 just say it you , you goofed
yes 86 was the chang over year
'86 is also the year they introduced stock hydraulic roller lifters to their SBC lineup, saving loads of trouble of having to add ZDDP formula to every oil change. What's really nice is a lot of parts from the Vortec era can be carried over to the '86-'95 engine lineup, thus modernizing any engine you've been running for 30 years or more.
+Midnight Mechanic
The SBC TBI engine found in trucks did not get roller lifters.
Yeah Ford did the same thing, they ran flat tappets for years way after the SBC blocks got rollers on some of their engines. Jeg's direct replacement truck motors still come with flat tappets, their Vortec models came with rollers, though now it seems they're phasing Vortec motors out in favor for crate performance engines. Rebuilt motors are gonna be the cheapest way to go in order to get a stock engine with hydraulic rollers.
Skyline Fever, the raised boss tower is cast in the galley and can be drilled and tapped for the spider hold down. Very easy to make those motors into a roller cam motor.
Yeah you don't even have to go that far, just get roller lifters that are paired together with a control arm, that arm keeps the lifters from spinning in their bores so the rollers are always in line with the cam.
At one point "Scat & Eagle "were both making stroker cranks for 5.7 w/ one piece seals. I have no idea if that's good for boats.
I use a little permatex oncap from the bolt back or you will have a seep ,the main reason why you have a leak.. and no one says nothing about it.
Great info! Thank you... do you have any tricks for squeezing more efficiency out of these?
id much rather have the old 2 piece seals.
you can remove the oilpan and rear cap, and use a wood screw to pull the old seal and put a new seal in by rotating the crank by hand.
the 1 piece type you have to separate the engine from transmission to replace
True but you will rarely have to change 1 pc because they don't leak
This was perfect thank you . I have a early 1970s cam and lifters heads and intake I was unsure weather they would work on a 87 4 bolt main . Can you please do a video on installing cam bearings everyone iv talked to has a different way I need to see your way please
Man you're awesome great channel!
Another great video! Thanks.
Ah-Ha! Likely you didn't mean to say a 1998 can have 1970 cylinder heads. Starting in 1996 all of the engines had some major changes like the Vortec heads, roller camshafts, multi-port fuel injection vs. TBI from 1986-1995. One example is that you could do a camshaft and lifter job on the 1995 and earlier engines by just pulling the intake manifold and valve covers off. Newer models you have to remove the cylinder heads to do a cam and lifter job. As far as the actual head bolt pattern, not sure. TBI's are center bolt heads with center bolt valve covers. So many unnecessary changes making things more difficult and less interchangeable makes most people think they have been trying to make the old shade tree mechanic give up and take it to the dealership for service. Like why would the engineers mess with the location and reliability of an oil pump? Well, they did it on the 1996 and later models.
I am in the same ‘boat’. :) I have an 88 Sea Ray with 2 x 5.7s (1 piece rear-main seal) and they need overhaul. Could you please tell me what heads & camshafts combo you used to increase his HP? If you have a recommended brand or a link please include. Thank you for the very informative video!
Im SO glad u answered this question
I just built my first stroker .did the oil pan rail clearancing myself out the pan on and installed the motor .guess what.i didn't clearance the oil pan...nothing is hurt.. just sounded bad till I figured outwhat it was..I won't say what my first thoughts and words were
I know this is a dumb question but what does it cost approx. To put a new rear main seal on a 1984 Riviera 307 engine? Thank you for responding.
Ive always been leery of the 2pc. But I've taken my time and not really any problems
What about the intake manifold mounting bolts on the newer block with TBI? I thought that some of the bolts are angled which prevents you from running a carburetor manifold.
I’ve seen a lot of people run cooler lines to the centre of the head because of the valves burning out
Also cooler lines from back to the front and middle of the manifold
Is there a water jacket in the centre between the bolts on the manifold into the head ?
1986 up went to 1 piece. my 85 vette still has the2 piece
TheeAmateur my early 86 does as well.
so crank and block go together....cranks are not interchangeable! but rods heads etc are! correct?
when you install the timing gear do you put lock tite on the 3 bolts? also the specs for timing chain slack say around 22 mm. that seems like alot.. what is acceptable. thanks
Estos si son mecanicos. No cambiapartes Lipia fierros este ombre si es un mecanico cninjo no cninjaderas👍👍
Great share, I,m asking, without a scope how can I determine if my 1985 305 ci.is a one piece or two piece rear seal ? The engine number tells me its a 1985 installed in Malibu. The chassis was an unknown build date donor car. Thanks
Great job, keep up the great work that you do. Would I need a crankshaft adapter. to put a 1 pc. seal engine in an older truck with a turbo 350 trans.
Question on a harmonic balancer. Did about 2 hrs of research with no luck. Dirt circle track sbc 6500 rpm msd chipped with rotating assembly internally balanced, h beam rods hyperpneutectic pistons and 1 piece cast crank. Will any balancer work or would you have a suggested opinion?
Thanks for the knowledge.
😁👍
Twin screws 350's sounds like a cabin cruiser . Needs to get planing some SS props will help too
not sure what kind of boat but it is on the big side he said one of these engines runs clockwise and the other runs counter clock wise I guess to avoid torque steer
MrColdwatercanyon just a note check the seals for the way the groves are going. I've hear on the counter rotators
the groves on the seal are flipped to help keep oil in the motor and to help with leaking....
1 what i need to change from 2 piece seal to 1 piece ?
2 i have 1981suburban 350 SB, to change more horse power 350 , do i need more cooling , my area extreme hot
regards, and thanks for the information
Mak
I read that the flywheel for the newer engine is slightly larger, and won't fit inside the older rear structures. Is this true?
the 350 motor on the later model the flex plate is a big different. the one peace seal the flex plate has to be balance
I pulled out an internally balanced 350 from by '78 GMC P35. I ordered a rebuilt motor and when I received it I noticed that it is externally balanced. Can I just put a different flywheel (manual transmission) on the new motor?
I just got my motor rebuilt and the end of the crankshaft that you called a flex plate the new motor does not have the studs in it. And I’m having a hard time getting them out of the old block. What do I google to find these new studs? And what are they called?
I wish the 1 price crank could be modified to fit in my 2 piece block... 4 bolt main with nodular caps vs a 2 bolt 880 block
The one piece blocks aren’t better, they’re a lighter casting by 15lbs and that weight was removed from the coolant passage walls and main web which makes them significantly more noteworthy for cracking along said walls .
As to the rear main, clock the seal and you will WILL eliminate the leaking, it’s that easy.
Could you please do more general Q & A, with the most popular good questions?
yep got one coming up
Awesome.... thanks.
Do you recommend offsetting the 2 piece seal like on the Ford big blocks?
thanks for explaining the difference
Are they identical other that the rear main seal? I going to swap a 89 350 into my 76 Pickup. I haven't had any luck finding swap info.
Quick question is there any difference between block strength I've always been told the older blocks are stronger? Thanks for your vids
The older blocks were more common with 4 bolt mains, which are stronger for big power. Most of the newer blocks with a 1 piece rear main seal come with a 2 bolt main. There are 1 piece rear mains with 4 bolt mains but they aren’t very common.... hopefully that makes sense.
Can you put a late-model crank one-piece rear main in the early block which was two piece cuz I seen online where they make it us to go for the one piece to a two piece or two piece two ones each other say aluminum flange art I really need to know if I should very much
I'm in need of some advice I have 1989 Chevy k1500 and I need to replace or rebuild my 350 tbi that's in it. The question I have is it worth the extra money to put in a roller cam setup or leave it factory cam I would like to get about 325 hp out of it is that possible without doing a 383 stroker build
Yes roller cam and FI/computor upgrades will help allot use flat top pistons also
Port and Starboard FYI :--))))))))))))))))))))) Oh, I just noticed those engines, being black, I'm thinking these are Merc-Cruiser engines? They are Chev 350 & big blocks, not sure sure about Fords, tho. We used these engines at Tollycraft Yachts when I worked there way back.
Yep merc-marine
thanks , this was quit helpful for a mopar guy :-)
and more importantly most of the 1 piece blocks are setup for roller cams already.
I think the only drawback is they did not make a 400 crank with a one piece seal so you can't make a 383 stroker on the newer blocks. I believe the last 400 SBC was 1980. please correct me if I'm wrong
1bcasso Blueprint offers a one piece 383. I just bought one last month. it was $100 less than the 2pc RMS
ok sweet so it's possible but with an after market crank! good to know thanks
I have a stroker one piece seal. Also with the stock hydrolic roller cam Just built it.
you can buy a 383 crank from scat they make em
sweet I haven't built a stroker scene 2001 so slot has changed good stuff
I like the video. I see you went to UTI? Me too, graduated in Phoenix 1994.
One question. What is the size of the 1 piece rear main seal. I may have to change mine and I'm willing to now it's dimensions. Thanks
I have a 350 with the starter boats are straight across ,is that away to tell if it's a one or two piece seal , with the starter bolt hole pattern that's straight across what tooth flywheel will I need 168 or 154
You didn't show the back of the block!!! If you happen to have a very expensive one piece rms crank, you can machine the back of the block and cap to fit the one piece main seal.
Nobody ever talks about it or mentions it. The one piece rear main block and cap actually have less material. Using a mill you can remove the material and fit the one piece. You don't want to buy a new or used one piece rear main cap. If you do, you will have to align hone the mains. You simply machine the seal lip off of the back of the cap and the back of the block with it torqued in place. Once the back is machined, drilled and tapped for the one piece seal adapter plate, you're good to go. You can even drill and tap the top of the oil gallery above the cam to mount the spider to hold gm OEM lifter rings and machine the top of the lifter bores so the rings fit loosely on the OEM roller lifters. Use studs and loctite them in to avoid leaks using two nuts to set the height of the retainer. And your done! GM hot cam here we come lol.
your talking about a ton of machine work at an average of $100.00 per hour it is far more cost effective to buy a roller block for a couple hundred bucks and your done I would charge $500+ for all that work it doesen't make sence to me to try and sell this to a customer when the 880 blocks are a dime a dozen
@@Myvintageiron7512 I agree with that if you're talking about a factory block. Unless you have your own mill... With a CNC mill it's a single fixture mount. With the rear main bolted in place, the only way I would do it, it's cleaning out a circle and tapping a few holes.
If you're talking about aftermarket blocks and 4000 dollar cranks, even $500 is worth it. Blueprinting a block will run you that.
@@curvs4me Well I'm gona go out on a lim here ad guess thar 99.999 % of my viewers do not have a CNC Mill nor the skill to set up/ Run one
I have a 79 350 block 2 piece on the rear 4 bolt main the only issue i have is the fkexplate vibrates a little n ive replaced it twice ha snew harmonic balancer but still vibrates a little any advice on what could cause the vibration dowmes not burn oil runs very good had it on truck since 85 and has no blowby
i see you mention interchangeable on all parts would that include distributor from like 85 going into a lets say 86 to 89 vehicle i should know this but i do most of the bull work installing and removing had a friend who did timing ect ?
Dude those crank shafts has lots of differences you should inform the public of..i understand maybe why you didn't mention a few things ..because it really doesn't have much to do with the rear mainseal...but obviously one crank was forged...which can handle much more horse power.....while the one piece seal crank is clearly a cast crankshaft...and it would also appear the forged crank was one of the few that was internally and externally balanced...probably out of an old school 350 out of a suburban or truck..with what they used to call 400hp heads...which if i am correct you cannot bolt any old,flywheel to it will vibrate it's self to pieces in no time..im aware people will most likely argue that 350 never made an inrernal/external balanced engine..but indeed they did a few..for bigger applicatipns...same reason you cannot use 400 to 350 fly wheels to interchange....just saying ..i like your videos...you do have a lot of knowledge...but I find in some of your videos you fail to mention certain things that in my opinion is vital ...
This difference sucks when your working on a budget, pulled the 350 out of my 87 IROC, put a 70 350 in it an the damm flywheel want work,now I have to hunt down a flywheel for a early 350
Hello I have a early block the problem I'm having is that the 2 pc rear seal it seam to be to long. Can I cut the end to make them fit.
I think they sent me the wrong seal because they go above the block like if they to long. Thank Robert
Another difference is the 2 piece is internally balanced except for the 400
"port" is the word you're looking for there at the beginning. haha. port means left
I threw an older block in my 02 , slapped everything from vortec on it but the plastic style timing cover wouldn’t seal for me
How the heck do you get the old seal out of the housing to replace it with a new one wirh out damaging the housing? Is there a video that addresses that?
you need to remove the housing from the engine
@@Myvintageiron7512 I have it out. The seasons a bugger to remove was just wondering if a trick to popping it out so I can install the new one. I've seen a couple guys beat it out with a hammer and punch.
@@Myvintageiron7512 sorry meant seal not seasons.
What are the bolts size that mount the one piece rear main seal to the block?
Is there by any chance a way to convert the 2pc type of engine to a 1pc? Like can i put a 1pc crank in a 2pc block and just bolt on a 1pc crankcap and that aluminium sealplate on the 2pc block? Or are the blocks also different so im bound to get a 1pc block? Great video btw! :-)
no
@@Myvintageiron7512 no with the meaning that i cant convert a 2pc block to 1pc?
What about camshafts I have a cam for a 86 but the block is a 93 will it work
Is there one gasket brand that works better and less likely to leak for a 2 piece rear main seals?
Fel Pro
Ill have to look but what's all the differences between a vortex and the earlier blocks. The new LS stuff confuses me. I know some have the aluminum block and most are iron on the LS. Thanks for your info
The LS Is a newer design and has little interchangeability with the older stuff
i believe only the trucks, with the exception of one year 5.3 (special HO), are iron, and all car motors are aluminum