I'd argue flight is severely underrated here. Flight on it's own is astonishingly good. You get through rooms faster since you avoid floor hazards and cross pits. You take less damage since you can hide behind rocks and needn't worry about floor hazards. You can get many consumables (and occasionally even items) for free, which in turn gives you more health, and more tools to get more items. That's why I'd put Spun at 5th, yes it's fantastic, but flight is better. Plus the points you make in favour of Spun, apply even more to Leviathan. Guppy > Leviathan > Beelzebub > Seraphim > Spun least that's how I see it
Nano Tenko flight is extremely good for me,due To the fact i love azazel,i can fly,making monstro and monstro II Look LIKE idiots and here is why:i can fly Over rocks(if there are)and i bait him NexT To the rocks and he is stuck while i am firing My Tiny brimstone,it’s really Funny To do this
I would say I agree for the most part by why isn't fun guy #1??? A whole heart container plus a great colours boost to Isaac and he's got a sick ass mushroom top!
+ 2 damage is great but guppy's flies deal duble of isaac damage and i think guppy is easier to get you can get spun just by luck but you can get guppy in the curse room random chest and deals with the devil and everybody is going for guppy more then for spun i think guppy is better
Syringe items can be gotten from bosses and demon beggars. I'd say that's about as easy to access as devil rooms and curse rooms. Also, Guppy has a very low percentage chance of being in a red chest on opening it. And for devil deals, that's very much up to rng as the devil pool is massive now.
If You Beat Lust You Get The Virus. And Also Most Guppy Items Alone Are Bad. AND YOU PAY RED HP FOR GUPPY. There Are 8 Syringes, Only 6 Gupp Items. Also There Are Many Boss Items You Want To Reroll, Possibly Making A Syringe. Most Devil Rooms Are Good, Not Wanting A Reroll. Devil Rooms Can Be Outshined By Angel Rooms If Going For Ultra Satan. And The Syringes Can Be Found In The Treasure Room.
NoDisBiz Switzerland ok, stop typing the first letter of every word in caps. I refuse to read a long message that has the first letter of every word as a capital letter.
Well, I can see Spun being better than Guppy in terms of accesibility (syringes being more common) but... I think Guppy is better overall. Dead Cat and Guppy's Tail can help you transform, and even The Left Hand can help sometimes. Even if Spun items are better and more common, I think what Guppy itself gives heavily outweights the stat increases of Spun. Also, Guppy is cute
I feel like the big problem with this list is that you've failed to explain your method of rating and what exactly you mean by best. Guppy is unarguably the best transformation in terms of power, Spun is only better in extremely damage starved runs, which is why so many people disagree with you. I don't think the definition of best in this case is right since you put a lot of emphasis on rarity, which doesn't really matter when directly comparing them. It's KINDA like saying a mid-tier damage up item is better than Sacred Heart just because it's easier to get. I understand why you take the transformation items into account, but again, too much emphasis. Guppy's attack modifier makes up for it with it's massive damage increase. Like I said, proper definition and value is too vague on this list. If it were something like "most preferable" list, then I'd agree with it, because Spun is the safer bet while still giving a solid upgrade.
Noël someone’s triggered. It’s his opinion ok, you don’t have to fucking change his opinion because you don’t like it. Everyone has opinions. Except for Donald trump, he just does what he wants cuz he likes to. Also your not taking into account the buffs from the items you need to get them. Guppy can be worse than spun taking certain items like guppys tail, body and head because sure you have nine lives but only one heart, and you get zero keys making it impossible to win due to lack of item rooms, and just a couple of flies from a room that just get depleted anyway. The spun items give you speed, range, more speed and range, damage and range, shot speed and other things. Plus the fact that you get +2 damage and 0.15 more speed. This makes spun better than guppy. So guppy isn’t ‘non-arguably better’. Next time, think about the facts and buffs before you think of how many times you use it. Thank you. Also pls no hate. Even though I kinda raged...
Ultimate orange Gamer wtf do you mean triggered? Are you 10?? The dude just typed a well thought out explanation as to why the dude should’ve explained his thoughts more in depth as to why he chose spun instead of guppy. Dude is hardly fuckng triggered. But i guess someone is talking a little negatively about your favorite RUclipsr so you gotta defend him.
JehzT actually I literally just found this youtube, or I did back when I made the comment. He said that the guppy transformation was non-arguably better without taking the buffs of the items and usefulness into account
JehzT also why do people associate stupid with ten year olds? That just shows that you have no respect to people learning that are younger than you. Some ten year olds are way smarter than adults too
Another problem with this guy that I've noticed is that he gets very toxic whenever someone comments something like you know, facts that a certain item on the list isn't really good, it's still an opinion, backed up with a fact.
PentaHybrid How is a potential damage/tears downgrade not bad? oh, yeah. but it was totally worth it for the shot speed and range. The problem with treatment is that you never know what you'll get. And once you know what it did, there's no reversing it. At least when i pick up guppies collar or hairball i know what i'm in for. Any decent player would try to get rid of his red health most of the time anyways, so it's price isn't an issue either. The only time spun would actually increase the dps more than guppy would be if your tear damage is below 1. so basically never, except you're running soy milk. Late game, with a damage stat of 20, spun would only contribute 10 more percent, bringing it to 22. WIth guppy on the other hand, you're already at 60. And that's without hive mind.
You know it's bad for one simple reason: If you see 9 Lives as your first guppy item in a run, you will do mental gymnastics in your head to try and make it work. If you see Experimental Treatment as your first spun item in a run(or at any point in it), you probably won't grab it. It's as much as trap item as something like Curse of the Tower or Cursed Eye. Fact is, Guppy makes a run doable if you've been unlucky with getting no damage upgrades(and gives flying on the side as a bonus). Spun doesn't do much more than a free damage upgrade, which is nice, but not really comparable here. The other downside is most of the syringes give you speed buffs, which is the most common buff in the game anyway(few runs go without having max speed since the cap is only 2).
Meia195 except guppy gets better the more damage you have. It ca turn a run you could already win with skill into a steamroll but it rarely makes runs that are truly terrible ( aka terrible eden start never getting damage or tears items just stuff like charm tears) into passable runs, but spun could give a run like this a chance.
PentaHybrid experimental treatment is at least one stat increase AND one stat decrease, with a chance to have up to two more decreases and more increases. At best you get multiple stat increases and one stat decrease, at worst you get three stat decreases and one stat increase. Not worth taking, ever.
adam I often play the treament unless I'm in a really underpowered run. -1 attack in an overpowered one is fine if you gain 1 luck. I find all stats overall even if some are most precious than others (damage, health, hp) it gets pretty hard to really luck out and loose all 3 in favor of height. But I'll agree that it is a gamble and I'm the kind of guy that plays pills without a phd.
setting aside opinions on quality, I think that guppy is more important to have. eg. the game would be worse without it. Without guppy, you'd have no reason to bother, except for with dead cat in some circumstances, the paw if you hate red health, and guppy's head, though there are better space bar items. Syringes didn't need spun to be a must have.
the spider one would've been great if it let you auto-charm or convert red spiders. Or if it let you get Double Spiders instead of normal Spiders. Edit: I totally forgot, I know how to mod the game! :D Ill let you know how it worked out
The biggest thing about Guppy is that it's a transformation you actively seek to get. Nobody actively seeks out Spun. You just get it, and think "Hm, that's pretty neat."
The only srynge item I don't like is Experimental Treatment. Maybe it's just me, but it seems to always screw me over when I decide to give it a chance. "Oh hey, you got your damage reduced to a joke, but you got one red heart and maximum range!"
8:21 whats wrong with tech X? that item is really good at taking out groups of enemies, and it also shoots through enemies and obstacles. it also has a decent fire rate too.
Honestly, I would've put spun and guppy together. They're both insane. I believe guppy (the transformation itself) is a little better than spun, but the items are a little bit worse. I'd call it dead even. I agreed with most of the list though. Nice vid.
I can see where you’re coming from, ranking not only that transformation but also the items required. I think that’s why it was close and spun won out. But items required aside, I think that the effect of guppy is better. Still, it is a close call!
You can make anything sound better by calling it "raw." With Guppy you get RAW flies that do double your RAW tear damage every time you hit an enemy with a RAW tear. This RAW extra damage from the flies results in the best transformation in the game. Also, you get RAW flight. RAW, dude!
TBOI update logs: -added tech 0,a item wich is a tech beam that connects a tear with another... time for synergies, conjoined/the wiz(cause conjoined is actually an wiz),tech 0 and lost lent,if you want even soymilk+libra and 20/20 tell me if good idea
Dude, I totally agree with you putting spun 1st, Spun! is so, so, soooooo good. Not only is Spun! damage scale with dmg multipliers, it is a nice speed boost too.
Imma just say it, comparing spun to guppy is like comparing crayola to prismacolor. Sure spun is cheaper and isn't too bad, but one is way more popular (and higher quality) than the other
Wholeheartedly agree on the Super Bum thing. I haven't played a lot of Isaac, but I watch a lot of Isaac, and I think I've seen Key Bum ONCE in all the time, and Super Bum one other time. Granted there was probably a time or two that the finding of Key Bum was cut out of the video, but still.
PentaHybrid You are totally right, it's just that i personally enjoy it a bit more, but I think you make a better argument in your video than any defense I can think of. MY complaint with conjoined is that it's very difficult to remember which familiars contribute to conjoined.
Ideas for transformations. 1st Acceptance. gives you the happy Isaac face from his fight and the ability to be revived as any character with a 25% chance, and a plus 3 damage buff, but if you get hit in a room it goes away. you need blue baby's only freind, the blue baby head that follows you (forgot it's name) the ankh, either play as the lost, blue baby or Issac. (you only need 3 of these attributes) 2nd Greedy. gives you the greed smile and a noose around your neck. (you can guess what the noose is for, hint hint flight.) You gain 99 coins and 12, YES, 12 extra heart containers. the catch? ALL YOUR HEALTH BECOMES KEEPER COIN HEALTH! That means all hearts drops turn into coins. You need... (GASP) greedy gullet, head of the keeper, stock refresh, steam sale, the noose, a dollar/Gain 99 coins somehow, and finally, collect at least 5 lucky coins in a run. ( same deal, only need 3 of em) 3rd Time fcuker. gives you random cosmetic change and black particles around you. with the whole "time" thing, you get either Binky or the razor depending on if you have the other, an extra Gemini like little steven that when hit by enough tears gets free and chases enemies. You need either steven, lil steven, the hourglass or glowing hourglass. (ERROR 404 ONLY 3 ITEMS REQUIRED) 4th Over dosed. Grey's Isaacs skin and gives him a depressed look. when Issac Deals damage to something (or takes contact damage) It has a 10% chance to inflict a status effect and a 2% chance to inflict EVERY DEBUF IN THE GAME. requires Baggy of pills, placebo, mom's bottle of pills, or Ingest 15 pills. (3 only. you get the deal) That's all I have for now but be tuned for more in the future. comment if you have a idea.
Rnd_ Understandable you feel that way. tbh I feel that (looking back on it) it wasn't such a great idea. maybe substitute Issac, B baby and lost with anything that "kills Issac" as in his sprite is dead but you can still play. also added new transformations =)
My list is really the same but with spun and guppy tied. Spun is easy to get with nice boosts. Guppy is a little more difficult to get but with potential run saving bonuses. Not to mention guppys tail helps in the chest as long as you have the keys to keep up with the gold chests
Why doesnt Leviathan is higher? If you are counting on the items DEFINITELY Leviathan is way better than all others for ej. in a run you get Brimstone, Abbadon and The Nail, ¡BUM! You are Leviathan Who can fly heal himself with the nail and shoots a high damaged death ray of blood.
OR maybe you can have a very high fire rate/high damage and spawn lots of flies to hit the enemies or spawn very strong flies and attack the enemys with them
Thanks to your video, I had to made my own list of Isaac's Transformations, just out of curiosity, of how it would look like. LOL I tried to take everything in account like: - How frequent they appear. - How many different items are there, that allows you to transform into said transformation. (For example: Beelzebub 18 items out of 3 you need) - Is the transformation easy to access?! - What the said transformation gives you and how it's useful. - In what item pools the items can be found?! - Their drawbacks. - And whether they synergize or not. So, here it is, my list of Isaac's Transformations from best to worst. (In my opinion) 1 - Guppy 2 - Beelzebub 3 - Leviathan 4 - Spun 5 - Bookworm 6 - Conjoined 7 - Yes Mother! 8 - Seraphim 9 - Fun Guy 10 - Super Bum 11 - Spider Baby 12 - Adult (Pill T.) 13 - Bob 14 - Oh Crap! 15 - Stompy (Pill T.) If anyone has any questions perhaps to why I think this way, you can always ask. ;) LOL XD
I'm of a similar thought just because in most runs I have, I already have flight by the time I get either transformation. Seraphim by itself has several items that give flight before the transformation, so really when I do get it, it's more like "oh, free soul hearts."
Out of the nine seraphim items, 3 give flight (the bible is temporary however) and 2 give soul hearts (the mitre doesn't actually GIVE soul hearts but it turns red hearts into soul hearts so close enough). This means that 5/9 of the items you need for seraphim give you the effects of seraphim by themselves.
My argument is this. Spun is rare because there are very few syringes, especially considering experimental treatment is detrimental most of the time. Also if you get spun it’s not really useful anymore as it gives you the same bonuses as it’s constituent parts. The only one that is good to get twice is damage and fair enough damage is VERY important but I don’t think you can say damage makes it better than guppy. Guppy gives you guaranteed flies on every hit which do two times your damage. That means guppy is a three times multiplier to damage plus flight. Further still mulligan flies don’t just expend themselves they circle you and make you untouchable by melee enemies. Turning any excess damage into defence. Finally guppy is tied to the meta of Issac, you go for deals with the devil. That’s just what you do and guppy comes from devil item pool therefore you will effectively be searching for guppy every run.
Guppy is a run saver but also makes a good run dull, if you find yourself getting a good synergy or 2 but have the guppy transformation, you don't really get to enjoy using said synergy due to the flies bodying most enemies in a matter of seconds
Personal favourite's probably Bob. As a casual defender of Bob's Brain I think it's pretty sweet to see it add towards a transformation and Curse/Rotten Head aren't too rare. I get why you picked Spun! but I'll contend that most Guppy items are good - the only one I'd never pick up if not for Guppy would be collar and maybe tail. Nine Lives + Guppy's Paw is also an excellent combination that's saved me several times. I'm not sure how most people feel about Guppy's Hairball but I really like it. None of the proponents of Guppy directly stack but Guppy itself is so broken that sacrificing a heart for Guppy's Head is well-worth it. Based on your other lists I think you might've secretly went "Oh, Guppy makes the game too easy." but whatever - I like raw damage and I like Spun! too.
I was watching this video and after you started talking about the 3 best guppy items: dead cat, guppy's collar and guppy's head I got all of them in a curse room lol.
Well spun 2 flat dmg and 0.15 speed (Which is the speed a single speed Up pill gives and the dmg curved horn give). Also guppys tail is awesome, totally underrated, makes you gain bunches of pickups easily, and combine with mom's key, left hand (this one gives u a easy guppy) or contract from below is usually a GG, thing that the whole spun trans. doesnt give. Also im going to give you some stats so you can think: Spun: 3 Syringes- Lets think Synthoil, Growth Hormones and Exp. Treatment: This is a effective +1 dmg and +5 range, +1 dmg and +0.4 speed and a +-1 to every stat, upto 3 stats reduced and at least 1 reduced. This +Spun gives: +3-5, +0.4-0.7 speed and +0-10.5 range. Now lets go to guppy:Lets suppose we get G.Head, G.Tail and G. Hairball: +2-4 flies per room (flies deal ×2 isaac dmg), a great increase of chance to find chests at the end of the room instead of pickups (this one doesnt especify any percentage, but it really feels that you have it) and an familiar which can be swung for 3dmg/tick and increasing dmgand growth per kill. Guppy's transformation effectively gives you flight and ×3 dmg multiplier stackable to other multiplier. And you will say, why a ×3 dmg multiplier? Well every tear will do its base dmg and will generate a fly which deals ×2 tear dmg, so it truly is a ×3 dmg multiplier. Also flying may be common, but it is op too, gives you access to many pickups, some items, and half dmg to enter cursed rooms. So with Isaac's 3.5 dmg we will have an effective +7 to dmg and flight, a familiar, an extra +7-14 dmg per room and way more chests, while with spun you will have a +5 dmg + 0.7 speed and +10 range. Spun is good too, but guppy is just GG in most cases, and combo very well with many items like brimstone or any tears up. It also makes soy milk a decent item to pick up while with spun is still shitty. Well i have explained you with arguments and numbers why guppy is better than spun, now if you want explain me your opinion why you think spun is better. It is the thing you asked for no? PS: Sorry for the enormous text
i love the conjoined transformation, since it is like triple shot but doesn't give the MASSIVE tears down, on its own its not too powerful but it has awesome synergy, like have you ever had conjoined, brimstone and bounding tears? its so funny to just fill a room with 6 brimstone's, however i hate getting familiers (other that dark bum, icubus and daddy long legs) because i feel they just don't really do much, and there are so many other items that i could have gotten that are infinity better
*Sees that number one is spun* *Hasn't played either of the DLC's yet* I've gotta say. Spun is quite good from what I've seen. And the items you get it with are also excellent as well. (Even you experimental treatment.) While Guppy is excellent and all. Well the items for that are well. Guppys hairball and that damn tail. So. Spun kinda wins out for me as well. Must've been difficult to choose there huh, Penta?
PentaHybrid Well at least we don't have riots about this decision yet. Besides that one guy who seems to moan about all your choices. (You know who you are.) And thanks again for the response!
i get your point about spun but with guppy the flies do 2x your DMG. soymilk=RAPID low DMG homing flies. polyphemus=slow but super high DMG flies. I think they share my first spot.
As I explained in the video, it was just below average. On 80% of the runs you get it, it's not synergistic and can ruin your damage and tear rate. Also, as I point out in the video, it's not bad. Just not superior.
My second ever greed mode run:Played as lilithThe one holy crown thingcontinuumtons of damagecar batteryConjoinedIt was amazing. One of the few times I can say conjoined is a good transformationAlso, great video as always, penta!
not that it matters, spoiler. Everyone that is freaking out saying guppy is better was clearly not listing to the video. All of the items leading up to spun is useful, not guppy. Honestly all the guppy items are mostly trash while most of the syringes are useful (and more common). Only 9 lives is really good and that's in certain situations.
Ghostly Pickaxe extra lives are not normally that useful, guppy's tail is borderline ok but not worth the health it takes. guppy's hairball is pretty bad unless you have like no damage at all, and guppy's head is fine, just not stellar and is beaten by alot of other spacebar items. Don't take this as rude just as an explanation 😊
DIrgeGaming The big benefit with many Guppy items is that you lose red health to get them, allowing you more soul/black hearts and more Polaroid procs, as well as having a devil deal item that you can easily pick up, use once and reroll - overall allowing you a much more powerful run than just taking the transformation items in question Tail is almost always worth it as long as you already have 3+ keys and open up item rooms first 9 Lives is handy for getting 1 red health and still being able to take another devil deal Head is a great spacebar item if you don't have one yet, but you can still reroll it afterwards without feeling bad Paw is the second best way of getting rid of extra red hearts(I'd say the melon baller is now for a meatboy army) Hairball can be used (I think?) to block shots Collar is kinda meh
Spun is probably a bit easier to get statistically, but I find myself leaving behind some syringe items, especially ExpTreatment, on purpose. Guppy items are always a grab, with the exception of Dead Cat, unless they're devil deals I can't afford.
Just beat a purist challenge with guppy, and I was reminded of the fact that guppy needs set-up to be good on regular rooms. If you can't still most enemies with tears, then you can't build up a fly zone to make chasing enemies die as well as deal massive amounts of damage against bosses by using flies generated in previous rooms. Still good to get, but the guppy items themselves were eh (hairball is only sometimes a tear blocker, guppy's paw let me trade a heart container for easier devil deals, and guppy's tail is ... Hard to gage the value of.) Flight was really good, as it let me trade my pony for the magic fingers item, which made double gurdy Jr and Mr Fred trival in the womb, as well as making the start of the mom's heart fight easy. (I think pentagram and champ belt were my only damage ups, besides maybe a random Jesus juice.)
guppy is thechnically a times 3 damage cause it spawns a fly that deals 2 times your tear damage everytime your tear hits and have a lot of good synergies like with bstone or hive mind and it gives flight .I think that can make up for the bad synergies (ex:mom's knife)
Spun is a greater DPS boost only if you have 1 or less damage, and you haven't broken the tear rate cap. Otherwise, Guppy's 3x damage multiplier is far better. The speed up is also negligible because the syringe items usually max your speed anyway. Oh, and the only legitimately bad Guppy item is the hairball.
I would prefer guppy because flies are more powerful than normal tears, and guppy items are also common from all of the pools they are in, so basically 20/20 but better. Spun gives a damage up, but the fly damage would be more powerful than the damage up. Also, flight can be useful, and speed is not always wanted.
Very tough call to make. I love my Guppy, and still like him more. But I will never argue with raw positive stats. Guppy is far more rare, the items aren't that great, and Mulligan (while weaker) is still an item on the side.
If I was Edmund, I wouldn't have steaked so much stuff to the ground. In fact, I would've buffed the weaker transformations. For example, Fun Guy would also be, when you get hit, you "fart" out a spore cloud that deal Tammy's Head damage to nearby enemies. I'd also make Spiderbaby's spider familiar be replaced with the Spider Mod item. Also, lower the downsides of Conjoined.
Guppy sucks cuz the flies kill everything putting all of your items to shame, thus ruining the perfectness of being able to kill enemies by yourself. Also spun has better runner-up items and stat boost, whereas guppy makes you pick up items such as nine lives (BLEHH), guppys head (DJANJMEINAH), guppys hairball (UHDEFBUVHBURHFNVIHRFNCEIWHBDIJCBJ), guppys tail (I mean well, good if you have the lockpick thingy lace or loads of keys. Otherwise it’s EEUHFBBDNCIOGSNEWDIOGCNGSNDIOJFIJRFMOKMASIGBCWMFIGNWEIGDBQOISKFGBIM7SUNJ), and teh other tings. But runner up for spun gives you range and speed, more range and speed, shot speed and speed, damage and range, and other super useful things. Also the transformation gives you even MOAR damage and speed, making you twice as OP. Also most of the syringes are amazing. So overall, spun is better. Except for you experimental treatment *sit in the corner and **_cry_*
I mainly think guppy is better just because the flies can give a huge amount of damage, which can easily beat out spun.also I think conjoined can be amazing if u have a powerful run, like when combined with inner eye.
I fully understand your opinion for spun but statistically guppys x2 multiplier of flies per hit generally does more In my opinion But yeah great video keep doing great work!
My one issue is where seraphim is because a lot of the items needed to get seraphim already grant you flight. Whenever I get seraphim it just feels like 3 soul hearts to me so I definitely would have it lower on the list.
I would place Spun as 5th, because I really love the ability to fly. If I didn't take this in consideration, I would place it 2nd, as I find Guppy amazing. Apart from that, I agree with your list.
I'd put FunGuy above Adult, honestly. The method by which it's obtained is a good start. Getting just 2 puberties in a run is hard enough and when going for the first, puts you at risk of something really nasty like Health or Tears down. Meanwhile, picking up Mushrooms is usually a good thing. The only mushroom that has a negative potential to me is the Thin Odd Mushroom, which if you already had a good tear-stat, will result in just a bad damage-cut, but early on can be pretty impressive to get 5 Tear delay really quickly. Other than that, they're always good for both survival-ability and decent stat-increases. Getting a High Priestess stomp once every blue moon isn't gonna fix the fact that getting it gains you nothing along the way and might even dick you over when trying to uncover the right pill.
to be fair, guppy's flies do x2 of your current damage, the flight is pretty useful too and the flies spawn on every single hit which means they simply add to your already existing damage, by the time you become guppy your stats are usually already pretty decent and in total you're having a damage of 3 times your own 2 from the flies and 1 from your own tears and you're becoming unstopable with items like brimstone due to the amount of hits you do. while spun only gives you a decent stat up of course that is neat but it doesn't beat the gup for me :P wish there was an isaac PVP mod so it would become testable xD
Spun, a 2+ damage up vs Guppy which is a 3× damage boost plus flight. Only when you have damage lower than 1 this choice is justified, but all characters start with even more than that. Im literally shaking rn
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I'd vote for Guppy for sure.
WrecklessEating It's a good vote, Guppy is great.
Better than spun
Guppy can fly, not Spun. And Guppy has a stronger damage boost thanks to its flies. I don't understand why Spun is #1 here.
@@OzoneGrif Basically a case of trying to make his opinion not obvious/mainstream or some shit. Guppy is miles better, no one can argue a fact.
Guppy is way better than spun
I'd argue flight is severely underrated here.
Flight on it's own is astonishingly good.
You get through rooms faster since you avoid floor hazards and cross pits.
You take less damage since you can hide behind rocks and needn't worry about floor hazards.
You can get many consumables (and occasionally even items) for free, which in turn gives you more health, and more tools to get more items.
That's why I'd put Spun at 5th, yes it's fantastic, but flight is better. Plus the points you make in favour of Spun, apply even more to Leviathan.
Guppy > Leviathan > Beelzebub > Seraphim > Spun
least that's how I see it
Leviathan is almost the same as Seraphin. I would switch Leviathan and beelzebub.
Nano Tenko flight is extremely good for me,due To the fact i love azazel,i can fly,making monstro and monstro II Look LIKE idiots and here is why:i can fly Over rocks(if there are)and i bait him NexT To the rocks and he is stuck while i am firing My Tiny brimstone,it’s really Funny To do this
100% agree
@@stefansolciansky7302 Hello my dads account which i used to use for youtube, nice to meet you.
Straight up, Guppy has saved more runs than Spun has.
Thats why I dont agree.
Brimblam I'm the opposite. Especially considering the additional difficulty of getting Guppy since Afterbirth.
Brimblam I'm the opposite. Especially considering the additional difficulty of getting Guppy since Afterbirth.
since when do comments repeat?
since when do comments repeat?
since forever
>no bad syringe items
>in the same game as experimental treatment
nice meme
you spin me right round baby right round like a record baby right round right round
0_o
In my expeirence I am really lucky with experimental treatment.
Uh Hello? Virus would like to have a word.
speed ball is mediocre at best
I would say I agree for the most part by why isn't fun guy #1??? A whole heart container plus a great colours boost to Isaac and he's got a sick ass mushroom top!
Mushroom hat was too OP.
It had to be majorly nerfed. That is why it is 13
yeah i miss the old fun guy
Dillon Bundy lol
geez bruh you forgot the stat up you get from transformations. like bob it gives +40.00 ATTACK.
+ 2 damage is great but guppy's flies deal duble of isaac damage and i think guppy is easier to get you can get spun just by luck but you can get guppy in the curse room random chest and deals with the devil and everybody is going for guppy more then for spun i think guppy is better
Syringe items can be gotten from bosses and demon beggars. I'd say that's about as easy to access as devil rooms and curse rooms. Also, Guppy has a very low percentage chance of being in a red chest on opening it. And for devil deals, that's very much up to rng as the devil pool is massive now.
in nearly every run i find 1 or 2 guppy parts in the devil room and if you beat super pride you can get dead cat
Rade Despotovic well boss pull is way more massive than demons, and devil beggars are not so common so i think he doesnt have any point there
If You Beat Lust You Get The Virus.
And Also Most Guppy Items Alone Are Bad.
AND YOU PAY RED HP FOR GUPPY.
There Are 8 Syringes, Only 6 Gupp Items.
Also There Are Many Boss Items You Want To Reroll, Possibly Making A Syringe.
Most Devil Rooms Are Good, Not Wanting A Reroll.
Devil Rooms Can Be Outshined By Angel Rooms If Going For Ultra Satan.
And The Syringes Can Be Found In The Treasure Room.
NoDisBiz Switzerland ok, stop typing the first letter of every word in caps. I refuse to read a long message that has the first letter of every word as a capital letter.
great stat boosts from experimental treatment
-1 hp
+0.15 speed
-3.24 damage
-3 shot speed
#Drugsaretheanswertoallmyproblems
Roll of the dice. Can't argue with RNJesus
Seek help, friend. It's an item in a video game.
aT LeAst YoU gOt ThE SpEEd
Dahdumbguy iTz sOMtHInG.
huh nice math
I like guppy, because cat
Fair reasoning.
Me too
Pail Horse Gaming agreed
Furry
S ame
Well, I can see Spun being better than Guppy in terms of accesibility (syringes being more common) but... I think Guppy is better overall.
Dead Cat and Guppy's Tail can help you transform, and even The Left Hand can help sometimes.
Even if Spun items are better and more common, I think what Guppy itself gives heavily outweights the stat increases of Spun.
Also, Guppy is cute
That ending was super unsatisfying lol. Hust had like a pixel of health left and the video ended :D
I didnt even know "oh crap" existed
Me too
Same
I feel like the big problem with this list is that you've failed to explain your method of rating and what exactly you mean by best. Guppy is unarguably the best transformation in terms of power, Spun is only better in extremely damage starved runs, which is why so many people disagree with you. I don't think the definition of best in this case is right since you put a lot of emphasis on rarity, which doesn't really matter when directly comparing them. It's KINDA like saying a mid-tier damage up item is better than Sacred Heart just because it's easier to get. I understand why you take the transformation items into account, but again, too much emphasis. Guppy's attack modifier makes up for it with it's massive damage increase.
Like I said, proper definition and value is too vague on this list. If it were something like "most preferable" list, then I'd agree with it, because Spun is the safer bet while still giving a solid upgrade.
Noël someone’s triggered. It’s his opinion ok, you don’t have to fucking change his opinion because you don’t like it. Everyone has opinions. Except for Donald trump, he just does what he wants cuz he likes to. Also your not taking into account the buffs from the items you need to get them. Guppy can be worse than spun taking certain items like guppys tail, body and head because sure you have nine lives but only one heart, and you get zero keys making it impossible to win due to lack of item rooms, and just a couple of flies from a room that just get depleted anyway. The spun items give you speed, range, more speed and range, damage and range, shot speed and other things. Plus the fact that you get +2 damage and 0.15 more speed. This makes spun better than guppy. So guppy isn’t ‘non-arguably better’. Next time, think about the facts and buffs before you think of how many times you use it. Thank you. Also pls no hate. Even though I kinda raged...
Ultimate orange Gamer wtf do you mean triggered? Are you 10?? The dude just typed a well thought out explanation as to why the dude should’ve explained his thoughts more in depth as to why he chose spun instead of guppy. Dude is hardly fuckng triggered. But i guess someone is talking a little negatively about your favorite RUclipsr so you gotta defend him.
JehzT actually I literally just found this youtube, or I did back when I made the comment. He said that the guppy transformation was non-arguably better without taking the buffs of the items and usefulness into account
JehzT also why do people associate stupid with ten year olds? That just shows that you have no respect to people learning that are younger than you. Some ten year olds are way smarter than adults too
Another problem with this guy that I've noticed is that he gets very toxic whenever someone comments something like you know, facts that a certain item on the list isn't really good, it's still an opinion, backed up with a fact.
"There is no bad syringe item"
Well you know except for experimental treatment
Tired comment, honestly. It's not bad. You're just cynical.
PentaHybrid How is a potential damage/tears downgrade not bad? oh, yeah. but it was totally worth it for the shot speed and range. The problem with treatment is that you never know what you'll get. And once you know what it did, there's no reversing it. At least when i pick up guppies collar or hairball i know what i'm in for. Any decent player would try to get rid of his red health most of the time anyways, so it's price isn't an issue either. The only time spun would actually increase the dps more than guppy would be if your tear damage is below 1. so basically never, except you're running soy milk. Late game, with a damage stat of 20, spun would only contribute 10 more percent, bringing it to 22. WIth guppy on the other hand, you're already at 60. And that's without hive mind.
Also terrible stat Eden starts with flight are better for spun too.
You know it's bad for one simple reason: If you see 9 Lives as your first guppy item in a run, you will do mental gymnastics in your head to try and make it work. If you see Experimental Treatment as your first spun item in a run(or at any point in it), you probably won't grab it. It's as much as trap item as something like Curse of the Tower or Cursed Eye.
Fact is, Guppy makes a run doable if you've been unlucky with getting no damage upgrades(and gives flying on the side as a bonus). Spun doesn't do much more than a free damage upgrade, which is nice, but not really comparable here. The other downside is most of the syringes give you speed buffs, which is the most common buff in the game anyway(few runs go without having max speed since the cap is only 2).
Meia195 except guppy gets better the more damage you have. It ca turn a run you could already win with skill into a steamroll but it rarely makes runs that are truly terrible ( aka terrible eden start never getting damage or tears items just stuff like charm tears) into passable runs, but spun could give a run like this a chance.
Insert comment arguing about opinions and spun being higher than guppy
lol
"All of the syringes are stat increases" (ehmexperimentaltreatmentehm)
Experimental Treatment is a stat increase. It's just randomized.
PentaHybrid experimental treatment is at least one stat increase AND one stat decrease, with a chance to have up to two more decreases and more increases. At best you get multiple stat increases and one stat decrease, at worst you get three stat decreases and one stat increase. Not worth taking, ever.
adam I often play the treament unless I'm in a really underpowered run. -1 attack in an overpowered one is fine if you gain 1 luck. I find all stats overall even if some are most precious than others (damage, health, hp) it gets pretty hard to really luck out and loose all 3 in favor of height.
But I'll agree that it is a gamble and I'm the kind of guy that plays pills without a phd.
they could have added a transformation for picking up "The Soul", "The Mind" and "The Body", in my opinion.
Yea if you pick those 3 they give you godhead kappa
Good luck getting all three in one run
You do get a transformation form it. You get the "won run" transformation
Guppy is close to my heart as it was the first thing that ripped open Mom’s
LOL!
guppy is a cute kitten
spun is Isaac with 2 syringes inhaled into his flesh
guppy>spun
Cmon, you can't argue with that logic!
ElectronicWaffles Plus Cats are SACRED animals according to egyptian mythology!
Guppy is the reincarnation of Bastet
Goddess of health and war!
@@OhrCompendium yeah.... I am pretty sure dogs we're more sacred than cats
@@originalcomment4818 ???
Guppy is also a corpse.
Spun is at least alive?
@@OhrCompendium I mean, so were dung beetles...
Guppy has a cuter look than spun
SCP_XxxMLGxxX Yeah...not a factor. Lol
I personally find spun really cute
SCP_XxxMLGxxX that's debatable
Bro, this is the proof! Guppy is CUTER. I bet you can't argue against that (penta... i mean... it was obviously a joke... chill)
When it's 2019 and I thought it was gonna be a tier list again
setting aside opinions on quality, I think that guppy is more important to have. eg. the game would be worse without it. Without guppy, you'd have no reason to bother, except for with dead cat in some circumstances, the paw if you hate red health, and guppy's head, though there are better space bar items. Syringes didn't need spun to be a must have.
I never get beelzebub
Tem mie That's because your from Undertale, silly.
PentaHybrid You're
Mobile. I don't even bother if I'm on my phone anymore.
I’ve gotten it once didnt even know or care about it
I got him because the dice room 😄😄
For the bob transformation you forgot to add bobs bladder to the items, even though it is a trinket, it does contribute
Andrew Brown No way...I thought they patched that out. I'll have to double check.
Have you checked already ? :v
FelipongoRules!!! It doesn't.
the spider one would've been great if it let you auto-charm or convert red spiders. Or if it let you get Double Spiders instead of normal Spiders.
Edit: I totally forgot, I know how to mod the game! :D Ill let you know how it worked out
spun is way worse then guppy:(
and btw i have never gotten spun and you say its easier to get then guppy :P
spun has 8 items, and in more common pools, ang guppy has 6 garbage items in rare pools
marco schneider sai that to my 120 hours on boi
marco schneider and half of the spun items are really bad too
marco schneider "guppy has 6 garbage items" so your saing nine lives is "garbage"
Comment section in the nutshell:
Guppy is better.
Štefan Solčianský They do gotta point tho
Always
The biggest thing about Guppy is that it's a transformation you actively seek to get.
Nobody actively seeks out Spun. You just get it, and think "Hm, that's pretty neat."
The only srynge item I don't like is Experimental Treatment.
Maybe it's just me, but it seems to always screw me over when I decide to give it a chance. "Oh hey, you got your damage reduced to a joke, but you got one red heart and maximum range!"
8:21 whats wrong with tech X? that item is really good at taking out groups of enemies, and it also shoots through enemies and obstacles. it also has a decent fire rate too.
Honestly, I would've put spun and guppy together. They're both insane. I believe guppy (the transformation itself) is a little better than spun, but the items are a little bit worse. I'd call it dead even. I agreed with most of the list though. Nice vid.
I can see where you’re coming from, ranking not only that transformation but also the items required. I think that’s why it was close and spun won out. But items required aside, I think that the effect of guppy is better. Still, it is a close call!
You can make anything sound better by calling it "raw."
With Guppy you get RAW flies that do double your RAW tear damage every time you hit an enemy with a RAW tear. This RAW extra damage from the flies results in the best transformation in the game. Also, you get RAW flight. RAW, dude!
Totally RAW comment dude!
I have never lost a run with Guppy, I have, however lost a few with spun.
You're nuts if you think Spun is better than Guppy
PentaHybrid: *puts guppy second*
Everyone: so you have chosen death
for me spun isn't even in top 5
Then play this game
TBOI update logs:
-added tech 0,a item wich is a tech beam that connects a tear with another...
time for synergies,
conjoined/the wiz(cause conjoined is actually an wiz),tech 0 and lost lent,if you want even soymilk+libra and 20/20
tell me if good idea
Dude, I totally agree with you putting spun 1st, Spun! is so, so, soooooo good. Not only is Spun! damage scale with dmg multipliers, it is a nice speed boost too.
Imma just say it, comparing spun to guppy is like comparing crayola to prismacolor. Sure spun is cheaper and isn't too bad, but one is way more popular (and higher quality) than the other
Why even watch this when you know Guppy will be #1. Wait, what?!
You cant believe its not butter bean?
@@depressedkermit3752 nice joke.
@@stefansolciansky7302 thanks.
Wholeheartedly agree on the Super Bum thing. I haven't played a lot of Isaac, but I watch a lot of Isaac, and I think I've seen Key Bum ONCE in all the time, and Super Bum one other time. Granted there was probably a time or two that the finding of Key Bum was cut out of the video, but still.
I personally would have nicer things to say about conjoined, and adult! sounds good enough on paper. But I can agree with almost every other entry.
I felt I was pretty fair with Conjoined. It's not a top tier transformation, but can be awesome.
PentaHybrid You are totally right, it's just that i personally enjoy it a bit more, but I think you make a better argument in your video than any defense I can think of. MY complaint with conjoined is that it's very difficult to remember which familiars contribute to conjoined.
Some Guy I can never remember which ones! LOL
Awesome vid Penta! One of my most favourite videos
I think guppy os The best, but i respect your opinion
>no bad syringe
experimental treatment?
Ideas for transformations.
1st
Acceptance. gives you the happy Isaac face from his fight and the ability to be revived as any character with a 25% chance, and a plus 3 damage buff, but if you get hit in a room it goes away. you need blue baby's only freind, the blue baby head that follows you (forgot it's name) the ankh, either play as the lost, blue baby or Issac. (you only need 3 of these attributes)
2nd
Greedy. gives you the greed smile and a noose around your neck. (you can guess what the noose is for, hint hint flight.) You gain 99 coins and 12, YES, 12 extra heart containers. the catch? ALL YOUR HEALTH BECOMES KEEPER COIN HEALTH! That means all hearts drops turn into coins. You need... (GASP) greedy gullet, head of the keeper, stock refresh, steam sale, the noose, a dollar/Gain 99 coins somehow, and finally, collect at least 5 lucky coins in a run. ( same deal, only need 3 of em)
3rd
Time fcuker. gives you random cosmetic change and black particles around you. with the whole "time" thing, you get either Binky or the razor depending on if you have the other, an extra Gemini like little steven that when hit by enough tears gets free and chases enemies. You need either steven, lil steven, the hourglass or glowing hourglass. (ERROR 404 ONLY 3 ITEMS REQUIRED)
4th
Over dosed. Grey's Isaacs skin and gives him a depressed look. when Issac Deals damage to something (or takes contact damage) It has a 10% chance to inflict a status effect and a 2% chance to inflict EVERY DEBUF IN THE GAME. requires Baggy of pills, placebo, mom's bottle of pills, or Ingest 15 pills. (3 only. you get the deal)
That's all I have for now but be tuned for more in the future. comment if you have a idea.
Rnd_ Understandable you feel that way.
tbh I feel that (looking back on it) it wasn't such a great idea. maybe substitute Issac, B baby and lost with anything that "kills Issac" as in his sprite is dead but you can still play.
also added new transformations =)
My list is really the same but with spun and guppy tied. Spun is easy to get with nice boosts. Guppy is a little more difficult to get but with potential run saving bonuses. Not to mention guppys tail helps in the chest as long as you have the keys to keep up with the gold chests
Why doesnt Leviathan is higher? If you are counting on the items DEFINITELY Leviathan is way better than all others for ej. in a run you get Brimstone, Abbadon and The Nail, ¡BUM! You are Leviathan Who can fly heal himself with the nail and shoots a high damaged death ray of blood.
OR maybe you can have a very high fire rate/high damage and spawn lots of flies to hit the enemies or spawn very strong flies and attack the enemys with them
"Why doesnt leviathan is higher?"
Proper English, please
@@someone-er1on of course. Obviously english is the only language
@@lazykirby57 i forgot this existed lmao, my bag
Thanks to your video, I had to made my own list of Isaac's Transformations, just out of curiosity, of how it would look like. LOL
I tried to take everything in account like:
- How frequent they appear.
- How many different items are there, that allows you to transform into said transformation. (For example: Beelzebub 18 items out of 3 you need)
- Is the transformation easy to access?!
- What the said transformation gives you and how it's useful.
- In what item pools the items can be found?!
- Their drawbacks.
- And whether they synergize or not.
So, here it is, my list of Isaac's Transformations from best to worst. (In my opinion)
1 - Guppy
2 - Beelzebub
3 - Leviathan
4 - Spun
5 - Bookworm
6 - Conjoined
7 - Yes Mother!
8 - Seraphim
9 - Fun Guy
10 - Super Bum
11 - Spider Baby
12 - Adult (Pill T.)
13 - Bob
14 - Oh Crap!
15 - Stompy (Pill T.)
If anyone has any questions perhaps to why I think this way, you can always ask. ;)
LOL XD
Lol everyone is mad about spun being higher than guppy, but nobody is mad about seraphim and leviathan higher than book worm?
Green Shaman Because people realize that book worm sucks.
book worm is half 20/20 , flight isnt (but i think half 20/20 actually is better to)
I'm of a similar thought just because in most runs I have, I already have flight by the time I get either transformation. Seraphim by itself has several items that give flight before the transformation, so really when I do get it, it's more like "oh, free soul hearts."
What do you prefer? Half 20/20 or flight and health?
Out of the nine seraphim items, 3 give flight (the bible is temporary however) and 2 give soul hearts (the mitre doesn't actually GIVE soul hearts but it turns red hearts into soul hearts so close enough). This means that 5/9 of the items you need for seraphim give you the effects of seraphim by themselves.
Guppy is way better than spun, a little damage up of two cant be compared to the 150% extra damage of each fly!
My argument is this. Spun is rare because there are very few syringes, especially considering experimental treatment is detrimental most of the time. Also if you get spun it’s not really useful anymore as it gives you the same bonuses as it’s constituent parts. The only one that is good to get twice is damage and fair enough damage is VERY important but I don’t think you can say damage makes it better than guppy. Guppy gives you guaranteed flies on every hit which do two times your damage. That means guppy is a three times multiplier to damage plus flight. Further still mulligan flies don’t just expend themselves they circle you and make you untouchable by melee enemies. Turning any excess damage into defence. Finally guppy is tied to the meta of Issac, you go for deals with the devil. That’s just what you do and guppy comes from devil item pool therefore you will effectively be searching for guppy every run.
You just started a war between the comments cuz you think that guppy isn't number one on the list. congrats
hollevi I started that war like two months ago. Lol
Guppy is a run saver but also makes a good run dull, if you find yourself getting a good synergy or 2 but have the guppy transformation, you don't really get to enjoy using said synergy due to the flies bodying most enemies in a matter of seconds
At what spot would you place the stompy transformation?
Personal favourite's probably Bob. As a casual defender of Bob's Brain I think it's pretty sweet to see it add towards a transformation and Curse/Rotten Head aren't too rare. I get why you picked Spun! but I'll contend that most Guppy items are good - the only one I'd never pick up if not for Guppy would be collar and maybe tail. Nine Lives + Guppy's Paw is also an excellent combination that's saved me several times. I'm not sure how most people feel about Guppy's Hairball but I really like it. None of the proponents of Guppy directly stack but Guppy itself is so broken that sacrificing a heart for Guppy's Head is well-worth it. Based on your other lists I think you might've secretly went "Oh, Guppy makes the game too easy." but whatever - I like raw damage and I like Spun! too.
I left a random Star Trek Easter egg in this video as well. Astute Trek fans might spot it.
don't make me look for it don't make me god dammit now I gotta find it
all I can link it to is in the conjoined review
FIRE EVERYTHING
Thomas Toledo Nope
Damnit I can't find it.
I was watching this video and after you started talking about the 3 best guppy items: dead cat, guppy's collar and guppy's head I got all of them in a curse room lol.
Guppy is best. It's a cute cat.
Well spun 2 flat dmg and 0.15 speed (Which is the speed a single speed Up pill gives and the dmg curved horn give). Also guppys tail is awesome, totally underrated, makes you gain bunches of pickups easily, and combine with mom's key, left hand (this one gives u a easy guppy) or contract from below is usually a GG, thing that the whole spun trans. doesnt give. Also im going to give you some stats so you can think:
Spun: 3 Syringes- Lets think Synthoil, Growth Hormones and Exp. Treatment: This is a effective +1 dmg and +5 range, +1 dmg and +0.4 speed and a +-1 to every stat, upto 3 stats reduced and at least 1 reduced. This +Spun gives: +3-5, +0.4-0.7 speed and +0-10.5 range.
Now lets go to guppy:Lets suppose we get G.Head, G.Tail and G. Hairball: +2-4 flies per room (flies deal ×2 isaac dmg), a great increase of chance to find chests at the end of the room instead of pickups (this one doesnt especify any percentage, but it really feels that you have it) and an familiar which can be swung for 3dmg/tick and increasing dmgand growth per kill. Guppy's transformation effectively gives you flight and ×3 dmg multiplier stackable to other multiplier. And you will say, why a ×3 dmg multiplier? Well every tear will do its base dmg and will generate a fly which deals ×2 tear dmg, so it truly is a ×3 dmg multiplier. Also flying may be common, but it is op too, gives you access to many pickups, some items, and half dmg to enter cursed rooms. So with Isaac's 3.5 dmg we will have an effective +7 to dmg and flight, a familiar, an extra +7-14 dmg per room and way more chests, while with spun you will have a +5 dmg + 0.7 speed and +10 range.
Spun is good too, but guppy is just GG in most cases, and combo very well with many items like brimstone or any tears up. It also makes soy milk a decent item to pick up while with spun is still shitty. Well i have explained you with arguments and numbers why guppy is better than spun, now if you want explain me your opinion why you think spun is better. It is the thing you asked for no?
PS: Sorry for the enormous text
guppy is better by 1000000 times then spun or any other transformation in the game
If you have a good damage or you'r flyes are good then yes but if not then spun is better smetimes for me
Good Vid and the most impotent thing: You played the best Stage Theme (Fundamentum/Burning Basement) in the back ground.
Legends say, if you're early Penta will reply
No
Yes
You have been proven wrong, filthy clown.
You're mean
I’m only 9 months late. I’m definitely early enough!
the thing about spun is that unlike the iconicness and obvious effects of guppy, spun is kinda like, "well, what did that do?"
#NotNotificationSquad
#ButtBombsforPresident
i love the conjoined transformation, since it is like triple shot but doesn't give the MASSIVE tears down, on its own its not too powerful but it has awesome synergy, like have you ever had conjoined, brimstone and bounding tears? its so funny to just fill a room with 6 brimstone's, however i hate getting familiers (other that dark bum, icubus and daddy long legs) because i feel they just don't really do much, and there are so many other items that i could have gotten that are infinity better
>8:21
>Shit item
>implying Tech X is shit
Yup
Tech X can be bad. Try fighting mega stan with tech x and 2 damage.
Here's a tip: You don't need to fully charge the Tech X laser for full damage, it does full damage on any charge.
PentaHybrid: * Chooses spun over Guppy *
Also PH: *The hardest of decisions require the strongest of pills*
*Sees that number one is spun*
*Hasn't played either of the DLC's yet*
I've gotta say. Spun is quite good from what I've seen.
And the items you get it with are also excellent as well.
(Even you experimental treatment.)
While Guppy is excellent and all.
Well the items for that are well.
Guppys hairball and that damn tail.
So. Spun kinda wins out for me as well.
Must've been difficult to choose there huh, Penta?
Very tough choice to make. I still like Guppy more personally.
PentaHybrid
Well at least we don't have riots about this decision yet.
Besides that one guy who seems to moan about all your choices.
(You know who you are.)
And thanks again for the response!
+Daniel Cathcart flys just pay out more in the end
The beginning is gonna keep me up for the rest of the morning...
I give up on you penta (jk I love you no homo)
Mom's Knife Well to be fair I have up on Mom's Knife three years ago. OHHHHH! *Mic Drop* lol
PentaHybrid nice typo in you roast penta lmao
i get your point about spun but with guppy the flies do 2x your DMG. soymilk=RAPID low DMG homing flies. polyphemus=slow but super high DMG flies. I think they share my first spot.
Why conjoined in 8th man
As I explained in the video, it was just below average. On 80% of the runs you get it, it's not synergistic and can ruin your damage and tear rate. Also, as I point out in the video, it's not bad. Just not superior.
PentaHybrid
I got an insane conjoined synergy. Conjoined, triple shot, wiz shot, shielded tears, guppy, hive mind and a bunch of damage :p
- "amazing conjoied synergy"
- "had guppy+hive mind"
...ok?
Jbdragonfire yeah, that was just the icing on the cake lol
Vepokk add soy milk and libra too and try to get damage by teard
My second ever greed mode run:Played as lilithThe one holy crown thingcontinuumtons of damagecar batteryConjoinedIt was amazing. One of the few times I can say conjoined is a good transformationAlso, great video as always, penta!
not that it matters, spoiler.
Everyone that is freaking out saying guppy is better was clearly not listing to the video. All of the items leading up to spun is useful, not guppy. Honestly all the guppy items are mostly trash while most of the syringes are useful (and more common). Only 9 lives is really good and that's in certain situations.
DIrgeGaming How r the guppy items shit?
Ghostly Pickaxe extra lives are not normally that useful, guppy's tail is borderline ok but not worth the health it takes. guppy's hairball is pretty bad unless you have like no damage at all, and guppy's head is fine, just not stellar and is beaten by alot of other spacebar items. Don't take this as rude just as an explanation 😊
DIrgeGaming The big benefit with many Guppy items is that you lose red health to get them, allowing you more soul/black hearts and more Polaroid procs, as well as having a devil deal item that you can easily pick up, use once and reroll - overall allowing you a much more powerful run than just taking the transformation items in question
Tail is almost always worth it as long as you already have 3+ keys and open up item rooms first
9 Lives is handy for getting 1 red health and still being able to take another devil deal
Head is a great spacebar item if you don't have one yet, but you can still reroll it afterwards without feeling bad
Paw is the second best way of getting rid of extra red hearts(I'd say the melon baller is now for a meatboy army)
Hairball can be used (I think?) to block shots
Collar is kinda meh
DIrgeGaming experimental treatment is bad
adamjack7891 neither bad or good, it's random
Spun is probably a bit easier to get statistically, but I find myself leaving behind some syringe items, especially ExpTreatment, on purpose. Guppy items are always a grab, with the exception of Dead Cat, unless they're devil deals I can't afford.
Penta you don't seem to handle criticism very well. You made a list, people disagree. Now handle it like an adult
J-Walker, you don't seem to understand what "in character" means. You made a comment, I responded. Now carry on with your day.
@@PentaHybrid what a dick
Just beat a purist challenge with guppy, and I was reminded of the fact that guppy needs set-up to be good on regular rooms. If you can't still most enemies with tears, then you can't build up a fly zone to make chasing enemies die as well as deal massive amounts of damage against bosses by using flies generated in previous rooms. Still good to get, but the guppy items themselves were eh (hairball is only sometimes a tear blocker, guppy's paw let me trade a heart container for easier devil deals, and guppy's tail is ... Hard to gage the value of.) Flight was really good, as it let me trade my pony for the magic fingers item, which made double gurdy Jr and Mr Fred trival in the womb, as well as making the start of the mom's heart fight easy. (I think pentagram and champ belt were my only damage ups, besides maybe a random Jesus juice.)
guppy is thechnically a times 3 damage cause it spawns a fly that deals 2 times your tear damage everytime your tear hits and have a lot of good synergies like with bstone or hive mind and it gives flight .I think that can make up for the bad synergies (ex:mom's knife)
Spun is a greater DPS boost only if you have 1 or less damage, and you haven't broken the tear rate cap. Otherwise, Guppy's 3x damage multiplier is far better. The speed up is also negligible because the syringe items usually max your speed anyway.
Oh, and the only legitimately bad Guppy item is the hairball.
Spun's face is the face you make where ur in the curse of the blind and you get experimental treatment
2+ damage is great but only if you have 1 dmg it is equal to the triple damage guppy grants you (1 from the tear and 1 fly=2 tears)
Guppy and spun depends on what kinda run you're having if you're using epic fetus he can't spawn flies which is why it's at number 2.
I would prefer guppy because flies are more powerful than normal tears, and guppy items are also common from all of the pools they are in, so basically 20/20 but better. Spun gives a damage up, but the fly damage would be more powerful than the damage up. Also, flight can be useful, and speed is not always wanted.
Nice Penta, i love your vids (you know that) and i agree with Spun and Guppy. Have a good one :)
Very tough call to make. I love my Guppy, and still like him more. But I will never argue with raw positive stats. Guppy is far more rare, the items aren't that great, and Mulligan (while weaker) is still an item on the side.
Ofc only raw stats. We all love guppy.
Shinui Zabusa Guppy Dream!!!
Am I the only one that every run get guppy
If I was Edmund, I wouldn't have steaked so much stuff to the ground. In fact, I would've buffed the weaker transformations. For example, Fun Guy would also be, when you get hit, you "fart" out a spore cloud that deal Tammy's Head damage to nearby enemies. I'd also make Spiderbaby's spider familiar be replaced with the Spider Mod item. Also, lower the downsides of Conjoined.
Guppy sucks cuz the flies kill everything putting all of your items to shame, thus ruining the perfectness of being able to kill enemies by yourself. Also spun has better runner-up items and stat boost, whereas guppy makes you pick up items such as nine lives (BLEHH), guppys head (DJANJMEINAH), guppys hairball (UHDEFBUVHBURHFNVIHRFNCEIWHBDIJCBJ), guppys tail (I mean well, good if you have the lockpick thingy lace or loads of keys. Otherwise it’s EEUHFBBDNCIOGSNEWDIOGCNGSNDIOJFIJRFMOKMASIGBCWMFIGNWEIGDBQOISKFGBIM7SUNJ), and teh other tings. But runner up for spun gives you range and speed, more range and speed, shot speed and speed, damage and range, and other super useful things. Also the transformation gives you even MOAR damage and speed, making you twice as OP. Also most of the syringes are amazing. So overall, spun is better.
Except for you experimental treatment
*sit in the corner and **_cry_*
I mainly think guppy is better just because the flies can give a huge amount of damage, which can easily beat out spun.also I think conjoined can be amazing if u have a powerful run, like when combined with inner eye.
I fully understand your opinion for spun but statistically guppys x2 multiplier of flies per hit generally does more In my opinion
But yeah great video keep doing great work!
My one issue is where seraphim is because a lot of the items needed to get seraphim already grant you flight. Whenever I get seraphim it just feels like 3 soul hearts to me so I definitely would have it lower on the list.
I would place Spun as 5th, because I really love the ability to fly. If I didn't take this in consideration, I would place it 2nd, as I find Guppy amazing. Apart from that, I agree with your list.
I think that Lord of the flies is best transformation. Bit i respect your opinion 8)
i remember once i got spun, mom, and guppy in one run
Man i just started to get into this game. I love how many items there are and the story as well hopefully ill be able to get it on my switch soon
I'd put FunGuy above Adult, honestly. The method by which it's obtained is a good start. Getting just 2 puberties in a run is hard enough and when going for the first, puts you at risk of something really nasty like Health or Tears down. Meanwhile, picking up Mushrooms is usually a good thing. The only mushroom that has a negative potential to me is the Thin Odd Mushroom, which if you already had a good tear-stat, will result in just a bad damage-cut, but early on can be pretty impressive to get 5 Tear delay really quickly. Other than that, they're always good for both survival-ability and decent stat-increases. Getting a High Priestess stomp once every blue moon isn't gonna fix the fact that getting it gains you nothing along the way and might even dick you over when trying to uncover the right pill.
to be fair, guppy's flies do x2 of your current damage, the flight is pretty useful too and the flies spawn on every single hit which means they simply add to your already existing damage, by the time you become guppy your stats are usually already pretty decent
and in total you're having a damage of 3 times your own
2 from the flies and 1 from your own tears and you're becoming unstopable with items like brimstone due to the amount of hits you do.
while spun only gives you a decent stat up of course that is neat but it doesn't beat the gup for me :P wish there was an isaac PVP mod so it would become testable xD
The only reason I would put spun in number one is because it's easier to get
And it's very damn good
Spun, a 2+ damage up vs Guppy which is a 3× damage boost plus flight.
Only when you have damage lower than 1 this choice is justified, but all characters start with even more than that.
Im literally shaking rn
Im only here because i wanna learn what the transformations do.