I'm glad this video acknowledged that Nate's role in the movie was one traditionally played by women; that of the long suffering significant other due to the negative changes (subjectively self-perceived or otherwise) of their partner's success (aka "The Nag"; something you guys have also previously covered). Not to say he was without fault - as has been exhaustively covered - but I wonder if people would have been so critical towards him if the sexes had been reversed.
Spoiler, when Nate finds out that she cheated on him during the Paris trip, they would have broke up again. Just saying. Nate has morals and people that see Nate as the person in the wrong can't and will never see that.
So the "villain" of the story isn't any of the characters, but the systems and the expectations that they have been made to build upon? I believe that.
That's how I read it too like even Miranda the so called Devil of the movie's title came across as a product of the system, even recognising that the journalism career path suits Andie more and helping her get that job.
I wish you'd talked about the scene where Nate and Friends take Andy's work phone. It always makes my blood boil - they can see how stressed she is but they carry on. And this is AFTER Andy gives them all expensive designer presents that she could have kept for herself, but she wanted to treat her friends.
Yeah, and the fact that you totally left out that awfully immature scene kind of shows… Yes, if this were different person, then I’ll be like yeah they’re concerned but Because this is Nate know this doesn’t work And I will not be subscribing to your channel. Thank you.
I'd say both Miranda and Nate are terrible. It's easy to say it's a choice, but it's a choice that might leave her unemployed and without the job Miranda got her in the end. The job was hurting her, but he could've been understanding. It's very optimistic to say he was concerned, when he only complained about not getting enough attention.
@Cio Lake my family is used to doing birthday celebrations on weekends, cause everyone is busy otherwise. it was a matter of communication, and he didn't even bother to hear her
@Cio Lake But she couldn't make it because of her demanding job. She still brought a small gift for him but couldn't make it to the party, which he should understand, but he kind of dismissed her regardless. I felt like he was being irrational. Yes it's his birthday but he never really took her job seriously or respected it. She has to make money somehow because it's not like he was making much himself.
@@IsisAlv she cancelled last minute and didn't think about him. Being "busy" doesn't mean you just drop important plans without so much as a word. It's why she admitted eventually HE was right. He wasn't this saint, but he also wasn't terrible
@Cio Lake I'm not dumping blame on him for not making as much money as her. You completely misunderstood, but yeah, they're not married but they ARE living together. Don't know if you watched the same movie but how did you miss that they were literally living under the same roof?? Because they live together, they have to pay rent. They have to put food on the table, so yes, money is very important here. They are both making money in their jobs but they have to make ENOUGH to pay bills and support each other. In this way, they do depend on each other, which is why Nate annoys me because even if Andy is doing her best for her job and earning the money that she is, instead of being supportive, he shames and judges her on her job when all she's doing is trying to adapt with her super demanding job. He acts like a sulky, pissy baby just because she doesn't show up for his birthday even if she turned down a huge opportunity just to make it in time because, again, she has a demanding ass job! And no, I will never understand because if my boyfriend had a super stressful job, it is my duty to support and cheer him on through it, which Nate NEVER does.
It’s the “as long as you did it with some integrity” line that makes him such an ass. She got promoted over someone else because she was better at the job. She didn’t push someone down the stairs like Showgirls. And, yeah, being a chef pontificating about work/life balance is pretty rich.
YES she did lmfao, Emily was sick and injured and Andy swooped in on the Paris trip. She had become a completely different person, someone Andy from the first scene would have ridiculed.
@@aparna2701 I disagree. One of the first things that Emily told Andy when she started working at the Runway was that you don't question Miranda. If Miranda tells you to do something, you just do it, no questions asked, which is exactly what she did. What people seem to forget is that Andy and Emily aren't friends and Andy honestly doesn't owe Emily anything. Emily has been very catty and bitchy to her the entire time that they've worked together. I actually found Andy to be too nice for even considering Emily's feelings after everything that's happened. Had the roles been reversed, Emily won't have given it a second thought. She'd have rubbed it right in Andy's face with zero remorse. I don't understand why people make Andy out to be a terrible person for doing her job. She might have changed, but it's not as if she took a 180 degree turn. She's still the same person, but she actually began to care about fashion and take her job seriously, god forbid, which conflicted with schedules with her friends who were trash in all honesty. Everyone has gaslit Andy, making her feel bad about her growth, but all I saw was that she was going to high places, they were stagnating, and they didn't like that. Andy honestly matures when she realizes that making fun of fashion doesn't make her superior.
I understood what his character was supposed to be for. It was to ground our protagonist, and call her attention at how unhealthy her work was. But it was badly executed. I still don't understand why a chef (one of the most intense careers a person can have. Some people work more than 12 hours a day!) has all that free time and never expects to make any sort of compromise. I mean, he's going to move by the end and the movie wants me to think that, if it was the other way around, that he wouldn't whine about it? C'mon. When things were just starting, he complained about her missing his birthday. Not like, when things started accumulating. At the start of her adapting to the flow of her work. God knows I had that happend to me twice because of others' university work or career related things. You just shrug and reschedule, like adults. I don't think he's the true villain but he's no hero or good romantic interest, either
@@alondraperez-ramirez8363 That does make a whole lot more sense! I can't expect a freaking chef to tell me how unhealthy my career path is, but I could expect that from a teacher. It's still a very demanding job, but in a different way. I wonder why they changed that bit about his profession for the movie?
@@m.n.2971 no idea since as a teacher it actually makes sense due to them having to be on the outlook for kids in a bad place so it's not illogical he's seeing Andy's workplace in the same way he would a bad home environment on his students.
I think they purposely gave him a non traditional schedule work so you can realize how many hours Andy is actually working. So again he's right, he's allowed to voice his concerns, but some people still have the misguided idea that men must settle for what they get and just be grateful.
The Devil Wears Prada is one of my favorite movies, but unfortunately because of Andy's boyfriend (and friends) I always get angry when I watch the movie. I'm fine with Andy choosing herself in the end (even though I would've loved to see her ditch her bf and old friends), but I just hate it when she's like "You were right all along" etc. edit: Also, Andy was only supposed to work under Miranda for one year so that she could get her dream job as a reporter or writer somewhere else. If you're with someone, I think you both would agree to accept that during that one (1) year things are gonna be tough but it will be worth it (*should* be worth it) so that the other person can get their dream job. Plus, Nate decided to celebrate his birthday on a work/weekday. As an adult if you and/or your partner has a demanding job (like a chef or working under Miranda), I'd assume you'd agree to celebrate it on the weekend where you're sure all of your friends can join and have a good time. I do understand that they wanted Nate to be this grounding character, a reminder for work-life balance, but they executed is badly.
I agree with literally everything you said. Nate and his friends piss me off every time I watch it because of how condescending they sound about Andy's job. They believe that just because it pertains to fashion, magazines, runways, and so on that it shouldn't be taken seriously so they make jabs at her at times, meanwhile she's making more money than them. Someone had to bring in the money since Nate's job didn't look to be paying that well, and he had way too much free time for a chef, but all he did was complain that she wasn't spending as much time with him as he wanted like an irrational child. Like dude, she has a demanding ass job and you're whining that she "changed". I get that he was supposedly used to identify that Andy's job was toxic, but it wasn't executed in an intelligent way. They made him sound like a child if anything. Andy had some faults too, but she was ten times more bearable and level-headed than the other characters in the movie. I hated that she went "you were right all along" at the end. He wasn't! Her decisions at the time made sense. She was busting her ass because it was the price to pay to become the journalist she wanted to be, but he seemed to not even care about that.
Complete agree. I work in elections and my boyfriend is a first year medical resident. Thankfully we are on opposite years (my hard years land on some of his easier years and vice versa). We have conversations about how sometimes one of us has to step up a little more often in those years to support the other one in their careers. They had an immature relationship if they couldn’t respect that about each other. Also, I ALWAYS thought being angry about missing an unremarkable birthday during a work week was the most childish thing. Hustle, burnout culture is terrible, but lets be realistic man...
It's not just about the work and long hours... it was about her internal trasnformation. She became a different person, made choices and changed plans without even a call to let him know. She just said "I'm sorry" after the fact. That's the real issue. I'm not saying Nate hadled it well, but the point is, neither did she.
Runway is not to be admired given it's overall terrible conditions but that doesn't give Nate or Andy the right to make a mockery of the people that choose to work there
Exactly! I don't even care about fashion that much but the way Nate kept criticizing Andy for dressing up was what repulsed me the most about his character
Do people like Andy's friends even exist? It's like those people can't go a day in their life without mocking anything fashion. Who the hell does that? Why are all those people friends again? Making fun of fashion ain't exactly a reason to be friends with someone.
LOL what terrible conditions? Lawyers work till 11 pm and midnight. Runway was not abusing its workers. Personal assistants make sure that the needs of the person are taken care of, in order to ensure that the person gives his/her best performance.
Nate didn't care about Andy being overworked or taken for granted as one of the lowest employee's at her job ("I had no choice"). If he did, he would have cared for her mental health/well-being rather than the impact it had on him and their relationship. Jobs change you. For better and for worse. He was mainly concerned with the negatives of the job (of which there were many!) and the only time he showed interest in how the job benefits her (and him) is when she wears different clothes, particularly lingerie. Wanting be a journalist and working in a fashion magazine, where she could learn about production, editing etc., made so much sense. The fact that she ended up apologizing to him in the end always irks me cause she was midst transition; finding herself and the professional she wanted to be. While the points being made are valid, these being highlighted as his "concerns" are a reach. His only concern with her work-life balance was how he and their old life fit into it. It's hard to watch your partner change/grow and Nate was projecting his fears onto Andy.
YEP - A good juxtaposition to Nate's reaction to her job is her dad's reaction when he comes to visit. Unlike Nate, her dad is genuinely worried about Andy's well-being and happiness, and whether Andy will actually benefit from this job.
What a Female community! Without nothing, They talk back and chew up like it is not a big thing. 😮 like the first secretary did. It is just a difference of lifestyle. Not a Right or Wrong! Female insists not to discriminate, Justice, But it is just arrogant and self-righteous
@@sawanna508the point was everyone except Meryl Streep owned up to selling their souls. Anne Hathaway acted like she didn’t want the job but she really liked there life
I have always said that neither Nate and Friends or Miranda are villains. All of the characters have negative traits and failed in some aspects because they’re human. I never saw this hustle lifestyle and Runway job as admirable as other people I could only see it taking more and more from Andy. People always say Nate and friends are only criticizing her for caring too much about her job and they fail to remember that scene with her father’s visit she didn’t even have quality time for her dad! That’s not healthy at all. Christian is trash and the only victims here are Nigel and Emily.
Yeah, I agree being dedicated to your job shouldn't mean having to ignore your own father when he makes a trip to see you to deal with situation that literally an act of nature and beyond your control and it certainly doesn't mean you start getting flirty and cozy with a sleazy guy when you're supposedly in a committed relationship (relationship problems is not an excuse to behave that way with another person).
@@phoenixrising7777 it is sad when people need to stay in horrible jobs to support themselves. I’m not criticizing those people I admire their strength. I’m criticizing the system, there’s a difference. A place where you work shouldn’t represent a threat to your mental and emotional health and make you neglect others aspects of your life, but it’s not a perfect world I guess. Also, speaking of the movie, at a certain point, Andy was free to leave that place if she wanted to.
I get that he wasn't the villain but some of the things he says about fashion and the people involved in it were degrading. I just think there were better ways to communicate with Andy.
I agree with you that Nate needed better ways to communicate because who really gets the message when it comes out whiney, but to be fair, that's exactly the same way Andy used to talk about the fashion industry. I don't agree with putting anyone's work down, but they were both in on that behavior and way of thinking till she changed for Miranda.
To be fair, we are "eavesdropping" on these characters' lives. We all have unpopular or uncouth opinions that would seem uncharismatic if taken as a proof of our character. His "degrading" comments make him human, not evil.
@@pendra_txt a lot of abusers hide behind the ‘right thing’ to ostracize them from family, friends and their career goals to keep them dependent on them for stability.
That wasn't the carreer she wanted She was leaving her family and friends behind because of her work. Her boyfriend was immature but he wasn't abusive, he wanted her happiness.
@@mdragon12 he never ostracize her from her relationships, actually his complains were that she was ostracizing them. He was inmature, but also was she, it's pretty much like a very young couple that needs growth from both ends.
@@mdragon12 he never tried any of those things you are saying. He wanted her to be professionally successful, but also didn't want to lose herself in a career that she never really wanted to begin with. Nate's flaw is that he didn't elaborate properly on those feelings and was not able to express himself that way that he could have.
Nick is the same age as Andy as far as we know. It’s an age where many relationships fail because young people are not yet sure about what they want, and they go through so many life changes. Nate may feel deep down that he doesn’t want a partner who is too emotionally invested in their job, constantly exhausted, traveling, unavailable or back-and-forth about quitting every other day. However, the challenge in sympathizing with Nick for me is that Andy’s job is TEMPORARY - that she is just going to check the box of being there for 1 year… Nick was on board with that at first, so he seems entitled for changing his mind before the year expires. It’d be one thing if 3, 4 years passed and Andy was always checked out and he felt they had too little in common anymore - but idk as a 30 year old, 1 tough year of a relationship is a piece of cake that he should’ve been able to handle.
Yeah, Nate as a personification of anti-hustle culture is fine, but as a person? It just seemed like he wanted his naturally gorgeous but "not like the other girls" girlfriend to not change - especially in a way that could make her more attractive to the opposite sex, and give her exposure to the wider world. I always saw jealousy in Nate's actions. The video said it: she was learning by doing, and trying something new. Exploration isn't some giant betrayal of your relationships. And nobody's talking about the misogyny of "becoming one of those runway girls"? Isn't the whole point that Andy came to appreciate what she once perceived as vapid? And yet, she *apologizes* for ALL of it in the end - while Nate apologizes for *nothing*. I hate that ending.
The movie seems to portray that Andy is loving her new life and self, but she is actually lost in it. When Nate call her out, we don't have enough evidence that she dislikes being fashion and lost her identity to assimilate the bad habits and culture from her work, but being proud of wear a clothe size is one tip of many that she was not necessarily growing, but changing into something not good, not herself.
That’s actually a very interesting point. Could someone like Nate, subconsciously, be afraid for his “not like other girls” girlfriend to turn into someone he feels he’s beneath…? Hmm. Never thought of that. That’s the beauty of think pieces. So many different views. Love it! You’re also correct about Nate’s job as a chef. The movie portrays Nate as having all this down time, like being a chef (in freaking New York City!) is a simple clock in and out job. Ha! That’s also a cutthroat, competing, grueling career.
I can't consider Nate as anti hustler. The guy was working towards sous chef position in NYC restaurant. That gig doesn't have stability of an accountant. It's as, if not more, intense as Andy's. I still believe that he wasnt THE villain but he was a jerk. And sometimes you need to go beyond "he's just flawed and human" and breakup with that person.
That was Aline Brosh McKenna's angle with this movie originally. She wanted to say something about work-life balance without taking potshots at the fashion industry like the book did, but felt Nate was right. I still feel that he's childish, and her friends were unsupportive, but I see this viewpoint.
I wholeheartedly agree on importance of work life balance but a partner should not weaponize it by sulking, whining and emotionally blackmailing with it
The book highlights an unhealthy work-life balance as well, and Andie's boyfriend in the book is completely different. I do love, though, how different adaptations/versions highlight different things in society that were key issues at the time, and each revisitation shifts what those key issues are.
Agreed, Nate and Andy's friends would work better as the good guys if they showed more understanding and concern, how the intense burnout and cut-throat hustle is badly affecting her well-being, maybe asking "are you okay?" and making her think about that, instead of childish mockery while happily taking benefits or whining about themselves in this temporary but crucial stepping stone in her life's aspirations. It's like she was expected to be support human for everyone else, being on their beck and call, not unlike Miranda's treatment of her, but with less benefit. No wonder she became charmed with her work, finally she got something in return of her time and efforts, because her support system was not very supportive!
I could never get past that fact that it was only supposed to be a year, 1 year in hell and then she has an amazing foundation to build her journalism career on. If she had stayed that 1 year, she could have ended up writing a piece on her experience in runway and working under the creative director of Runway, which most likely would have been something good considering how popular Runway was and how infamous Miranda is. No one seemed to remember this was job was supposed to be rocket launcher for her career, if she stayed just a year. They said she could work anywhere she dreamed if she just worked under Miranda for a year, and yet everyone treated it like this was throwing away her dreams by working under Miranda.
Are we forgetting that she turned down new york times networking opprtunity for nate birthday? had she spoke to them she could have left runway way sooner or stayed and immediately networked to New York times and began journalism and publishing there. People who get ahead in that industry is NETWORKING. It's allll about who you know, who pulls what strings for you and who has good reference for you to show your stuff to the right people. it's not like manual labor work like Nate's where you 99% judged on yeaars of experience and regular requirements. You have to be your own resume and she failed at that when she turned down the chance.
Exactly this. What did they expect? That she'd just have a lovely time and not be really challenged by the work? If a year had come and gone and Andy had fundamentally changed and was considering staying with Runway, *then* the friends can step in and say, "Whoa, take a step back and ask if this is really what you want to do. What happened to becoming a writer?" and then Andy could still have said, "You know, I thought I'd hate fashion, but I love it. I think there is a realistic possibility of becoming a collumnist for Runway, and that would be more fun and prestigious than what I thought I wanted before," and then they should have said, "If you're sure, go for it. You seem stressed and different but more fulfilled than you used to be." That would have been supportive and not held the friendship hostage to a version of Andy she no longer was.
One year in hell is bad enough! Working like that can lead into a burn out and that will keep you out of business for a while. Andy's father is conscerned too and says that and he can't be blamed to be immature. And just look how Andy treats her father turing his visit because she is so stressed out. She hits him with a car door after all and all because her Bos demands her to solve an impssoble task!
Not "the villain" but really a jerk, if he and Andi broke up in friendly terms since they wanted diferent things/were not compatible after all that would have been FINE , the problem was that Andi got back together with him.Being frustrated was understandable and "be supportive" doesn't mean not figthing for your relationship, BUT Nate 1)was a chef, he must have know how hard was the situation for Andi in a demanding job, 2) he knew Miranda was giving Andi a hard time at her job and the least she needed was her boyfriend giving her a hard time at home, he made the situation more stressing that it should have been, his (and Andi´s friends) lack of empathy really shine
Indeed, I second this argument! Chefs work unpredictable, long, gruelling hours, so Nate should have understood how hard it was for Andy to schedule time off work.
I don’t know… I get the feeling if Andy had gotten a journalist job (that has just as hard and crazy hours as the runway magazine) from the get go he’d be more understanding. Andy changed personality and values wise at runway and that’s why Nate broke up with her. She wasn’t who he fell in love with anymore so they broke up and that’s valid. I think if she had stayed at Runway he would’ve stayed broken up but because she eventually had the growth and maturity to see how the job at Runway was changing her into a bad person who was willing to be ruthless and horrible to get ahead (remember Emily?) Nick and Andy gave it another shot.
@@silentsaturn7604 You're right, no one should ever stifles another person's growth but I didn't read that as what he's doing. He sees her making unhealthy choices and and tries to voice his objections. That's a valid reaction for someone to do when they see someone they love in an objectively abusive relationship (like Andy's relationship with Miranda). Remember, at no point is Andy actually happy at this job, just desperate and stressed out, and later ambitious (which is not the same as happy). And what's worse, Andy starts to act badly too (to Emily). What would you do if the person you love is growing into what you believe is a bad person? What if you wake up one day and your partner is now so different, they in no way resemble the person you fell in love with. Nick says in the movie he doesn't recognize Andy anymore and that's the reason he gives for breaking up. Before marriage I think anyone can break up for any reason, but if your partner no longer has any of the characteristics you fell in love with in the first place, that's probably one of the most valid reasons I can think of for ending a relationship. Andy goes from being a good person to a ruthless person who would screw over a colleague to get ahead. That has nothing to do with growth or evolution. Andy's growth happens when she shows the maturity and self awareness to realize how far she's strayed from the core values she once had and walks away from the unhealthy job/relationship with Miranda. After that, Nick seems really into her again, growth and all
It's almost like Nate is an actual human being with flaws and nuance, and not a one-dimensional trope. Seems to be a pattern in this masterpiece of a movie 🤔
Too bad he's an awful person and could have been written better. Nobody cares about Andy's friends or Nate. Andy and the _Runway_ employees are what people watch the movie for.
@@0deadx21 I always liked Nate somehow because the fashon world is something I still don't get and he is cute. I watch the movie because of the actresses/actors, because I admire their skills. I don't like the plot. The movie is like a "Make over-movie" to me and I always hated them.
Nope, sorry, not buying it. You're saying that a chef in the early years of his career in the NYC restaurant scene is fundamentally against hustle culture? Line cooks (especially those low on the totem pole) work into the late hours of the night almost every night. They have horrific schedules, do physically draining work, and often have extremely demanding bosses/work environments. (The fact that we don't see much of this in the movie I think is more of an unrealistic oversight in the writing vs a writing choice to prove that he heroically managed to avoid this killer work schedule on principle) They kill themselves for their work because they love it and that's the career path they've chosen. Andy's chosen career path is journalism and it's mentioned countless times that this (ONE YEAR LONG) position is the key stepping stone to propel her career forward. The fact that he can't support that even temporarily, the fact that at the end scene in the café he reduces all of her work decisions to be based on a superficial desire for clothes, the fact that he's hurt by her missing his birthday instead of empathetic when as a chef he's no doubt missed events he wished he could go to, the fact that he says they don't "have anything in common anymore" because she's dressing the part for her job in fashion and putting her all into the work...It's all just STEEPED in misogyny and he is being a horrible partner. Him accidently (and mostly likely hypocritically) stumbling onto some valid criticism of hustle culture doesn't excuse his lack of support for her. And even if (and that's a big if) he truly was anti hustle culture and really did maintain the perfect work/life balance as a chef (suuure), then his criticism should have been targeted exclusively toward her work environment itself and offering empathy/concern for how hard it's been for her, not shaming her for doing what she had to do to survive in that culture. And to be clear, the things she's "had" to do were grunt work, hard tasks, long hours. She's never done anything objectively immoral at work. His reactions through the movie are 100% of the time judgement of her vs concern for her. It's easy to look into someone's situation and point out all the flaws and how they should be behaving in a perfect world. But it's completely unfair to put it on that person to single handedly change the culture from the bottom or leave on principle. People need to eat, need to advance their careers, and sometimes that means they have to do shit work for a shit boss at a shit company. Not everyone has the luxury to pass over work because they don't like the job. Miranda even threatened to essentially blackball her from the publishing industry if she didn't take Emily's spot on the Paris trip. And even if she hadn't threatened her, while it's sad that Emily missed out on something she was looking forward to, at that point Andy was just the better assistant and business doesn't care about your feelings. She SHOULD have taken that opportunity without hesitation. I'll say it again, she never does anything at her job that is morally questionable and Nate's stance that she does her job without any 'integrity" is completely baseless. Nate was just insecure about his girlfriend excelling at work, working in a traditionally feminine industry that took away his view of her as being "not like other girls", and their relationship not being the end all be all of her 20-something life. 100% fuck Nate.
The best, all my thoughts exactly. I don't know why is Take trying to deconstruct Nate just for the heck of it all. He was a cry baby and sure as hell wasn't condemning hustle culture.
Its not really about what is the job, its is about HOW the people react and behave bc of said job, infact, the fact that nate works in a job that is exactly as demanding or even more shows the difference between characters. While Nate stills can calls her, wait for her, still supports and pushes her up to works, Andy's cant, she cant call her or her friends or family, she cant arrived at time to plans with nate, or other friends, OR family. Fuckin miranda even says to her "Oh you had a choise, and you choose" while they are in france. If you really think that a person being mad and sad bc the soul-less work hours of a toxic industry is """the bad guy""" that shows that you might not understand how round and human characters works
I think the issue is calling anyone the “villain”. I notice this same issue when a relationships end in the real world: nothing is one sided. Nate could have been more supportive and Andy could have had better boundaries at work. That’s life, it’s messy.
The world evolves, the many route of life sprout. So there are many lifestyle, philosophy, and interest. But many people who even speak about justice and love to others Don't understand the situation and just insult others like it's nothing. 😮💨😮💨
Even Adrian Grenier didn't understand why the fans disliked Nate so much, but now states that Nate hadn't grown up, while Andy had, and simply wanted more out of life. He was unable to support her emotionally because he was still a fragile, wounded boy.
@@tyrant-den884 Nate was watching his relationship fall apart mach speed. The dismissiveness of it's only a birthday, aka his feelings seems to be appropriate if It's a man's feelings being dismissed. Other way around he would be an uncaring boyfriend.
As a grown man, the only thing I think he was wrong about was getting mad about her missing his birthday. He was REALLY supportive of her, and he was worried about what was happening to her. Andy is NOT who she is at the climax of the movie...she's becoming a dark perversion of herself, and he saw it (and so did ALL of her friends). Miranda is a fun character, but you shouldn't turn yourself into someone like that to get ahead, unless what you do is really what you want your life to be. Full disclosure: last year, my wife was stuck in a toxic work environment that was literally making her work 80-90 hour weeks most weeks. They had laid off a large portion of her peers, her boss had left, and she was basically running the entire branch of the company without having been compensated while also doing nearly all of the work. The kicker was that by doing all of this she was probably saving her firm close to 800k or more in salary...yet when they gave her a pay raise for her "new title", which still wasn't the same title her boss had had, the pay bump was about 2/3rds of her old boss's STARTING salary in his position, and then they immediately cut her pay back to it's initial base, and only hers. The entire time I was supportive and was the primary parent for everything (still am, this week nonwithstanding due to a client being an absolute POS and demanding immediate documents for what would be 4 weeks of work), but I was telling her she needed to look for another job because she was losing herself, and time with our child. Thankfully at the end of the year she finally listened to me (and several of her friends who told her that she was missing everything that made work worth doing), and found a better job. Shoot, she had to do the same to ME this year earlier because this job has become more and more of what I said above. So in a month, I'm swapping employment for a far better job with better work-life balance. To be fair, it's not my immediate boss at fault, I rather like him; it's the way our clients have been taking advantage of the current environment to shaft us at every turn---I've had enough.
Yeah I saw that interview. He said he now understand why viewers get frustrated. He was also praising Anne Hathaway for changing a scene's blocking because she felt the two characters weren't in the same for it (I can't remember what exactly but it's in the reunion interview.)
Was with you until the last sentence. He was in the right and already realized what is truly important in life. If only more people were happy with simple lives. The world would be a better place.
Yes yes! And every character brings some positive and negative characteristics, every character is right sometimes and wrong sometimes. I call that good character writing and performance.
Yeah though where is the good side of Nate? He just nags all the way through the film and is only nice, when Andy is the doting girlfriend. To me he is very one note.
It's not that he doesn't have a point, but it's the way he goes about pointing it. He isn't willing to grow with her, he is not willing to accept her new passions, yet he is willing to enjoy to fruits of her labor. He is also very petty, and is making it about him being right instead of what's best for Andy. Basically, he is not a villain, just an unsupportive, petty, and demeaning partner
Exactly. I appreciate this video for giving an updated perspective of an issue that is not black and white, but some parts rely on the premise that nate knows what's best for Andy better than Andy herself, and that's how he behaves. He has the right to feel emotionally neglected in their relationship, but he is also condescending towards her job, the entire industry and incredibly unsuspportive, acting as if good journalism jobs are super easy to get, and like Andy can afford to just get fired over his birthday and waste a lot of work by getting a bad reference from miranda. Sure, she has a choice, technically, all of us theoretically have a choice to quit every time our jobs are shit, but at the end of the day, forging a career requires some hard compromises that are much easier with a partner who values you. And anyways, What if she changed her mind and doesn't want to work in journalism anymore or maybe she is now okay wirh working for an outlet like runaway/vogue? He was only willing to give her the minimum space for growth, within the idea that he had for her and his plan for them. People change their minds and then change it back, and neither nate nor the movie gave Andy that agency. In the end he was vindicated, although he was wrong to underestimate her job and treat her career like disposable trash. He is not evil or a villain, but they should have not gotten back together. She definitely should not have moved for him, further nailing the point that his job is more important. Plus, she wouldn't actually have offers from multiple places if it weren't for her hard work for miranda.
Not to mention he treated his own job like it didn't matter, and in the end, Andy was ready to move to boston because of his job, even though he wasn't willing to give her any support in the time she required it most for her career. The movie tells us very clearly that being committed to your job and asking your partner for the same, is only okay if you are nate or have a job he approves of.
@@tamarat9735 You put it best, she *technically* had a choice, but not really. He wasn't willing to bend towards her career the same we she does towards his. I would even say you can have the capitalism conversation here. Andy has to bend towards her career goals, do things she wouldn't actually necessarily like, but manages to find joy in it. Nate, acts like a child who sees the world in black and white terms. As if her "giving in to the system" is really a choice in that world. Sure, she could also not choose to work in any job that isn't the idealistic view of how "real" journalism should be, but she will never develop an actual career that way. Some sacrifices have to be made to get there
Okay so you've said it yourself: Andy's biggest flaw was not striking the balance (while experiencing growth, pressure and hostility from EVERYONE). While Nate's was not being able to communicate his emotions... in a serious relationship... WHEN time and again he still chose to express those emotions immaturely, irately or passive aggressively???? And he never apologises. You can have all the good points in the world but if you talk at someone/raise your voice, assume the worst, or shut someone down when they're trying to make things up to you... That's not acceptable in any circumstance. You also talk about food being an act of care for Nate that Andy rejects (again, due to verbal digs about her appearance) but Andy offers food in the form of a lit up cupcake and a heartfelt gesture and he rejects it. After he clearly stayed up to wait for her to get home
This is why I love this channel. Looking at both sides of the argument; and accepting the pros and cons of each character archetype without being (too) judgmental.
@@owenmccord5078 They basically made Harry sound like a whiny no good ungrateful character and in the end mentioned that Hermione should be the protagonist of the series named 'HARRY POTTER' , only showing his bad moments from the movies without books cannon and ignoring the childhood abuse he suffered from Dursleys.
Hot Take: The kinds of women who idolize Miranda and ignore/excuse her abusive/toxic behavior are no different than the dudebros who worship Tyler Durden from Fight Club.
As someone who likes Miranda, I don't like her as a person, but I like Meryl as Miranda Priestley. I love her execution of the character, I love how she looks in this movie, the way she speaks, etc. At the same time, despite being extremely demanding, I don't think Miranda's desires were unrealistic at all. The biggest thing was asking Andy for for the Harry Potter book, but again, Runway knows EVERYONE in publishing. She literally could have called JK Rowling's publisher and gotten that book immediately. At the same time, almost all of her tasks are things that a secutary in a big high end company does everyday in the real world. I don't see anyone screaming that a secutary's job is demanding though
I can understand Andi making those choices. Just starting her career in a city where there is a LOT of competition for journalism jobs. The fact she settled for the Runway job after all the others fell through shows that situation. We're they the right choices? Not necessarily. But understandable.
i still think andy was right when she said "i didn't have a choice", i also think miranda didn't have another choice but betray Nigel, at least if she wanted to keep her job. This job (in andys case also limited to just 1 year!!!) requires complete commitment, which everyone who works there knew. Besides, It would have been childish and unprofessional to tell a person like miranda "oh i cant go to paris, because its emilys biggest dream and would mean the world to her", like? Do they really think miranda would care? And the night Andy got late to Nates birthday, i think simon baker saying "stupid boyfriend" is more an insult with a wink so i understand that andy didn't jump to defend her boyfriend. Besides simon bakers character being douchy and annoying. Simon Baker even offered her to meet new york times people and andy turned it down because of her (in fact) stupid boyfriends birthday. I wouldnt have blamed andy if she stayed to meet these people, it actually could be a one time chance. And still, she comes home, nate is pissed af, and andy didnt even tell him what she just turned down to come home as early as possible. In the end, when andy says she turned her back on her family and friends and asks herself for what she even did that. Nate says "haha you did it for clothes and makeup", as if we (the audience) didnt hear mirandas speech in the beginning about the significance of fashion. So in the end, it seems that andy blames herself for falling for a shallow superficial inflated world, but in reality, she actually learned how to really put an effort in a job and discovered the art and fun of fashion. Its sad she didnt realize that. I dont think that andy is perfect or anything. But for nate, it's just a year, get your shit together.
Why don't people understand that it was one (bad) year for a potentially huge career advancement? Many people sacrifice multiple years (along with tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt) to potentially advance in their careers (or to establish one).
Exactly! it's also andys choice what she's willing to sacrifice to get her dreamjob, so if she sacrifices her "integrity", it should be accepted. I would lick a damn train station toilet for my dream job. Dont need a nate to tell me that this is undignified
Also I wanna say that this is why being selfish as a person can pay off big time professionally. For instance: Carrie Bradshaw from sex & the cityy would have NEVER turned the chance down to meet with publishers if it was aiden or big's birthday. She was (arrogantly and snotty albeit) secure and had a self esteem. She would have went to the new york times people then gave nate a "take it or leave it" later on.
What a Female community! Without nothing, They talk back and chew up like it is not a big thing. 😮 like the first secretary did. It is just a difference of lifestyle. Not a Right or Wrong! Female insists not to discriminate, Justice, But it is just arrogant and self-righteous
I used to love this movie. I bought it for the 10th anniversary and it gave me so much anxiety. I've never understood how everyone defends Miranda. She treats everyone so horribly.
His behavior really was inappropriate. Despite the culture, he was still *throwing shade at his girlfriend's accomplishments* because it was making him insecure
What a Female community! Without nothing, They talk back and chew up like it is not a big thing. 😮 like the first secretary did. It is just a difference of lifestyle. Not a Right or Wrong! Female insists not to discriminate, Justice, But it is just arrogant and self-righteous
Yeaaaah idk, I still can’t stand Nate. I hate hustle culture as much as the next guy, but at the end of the day, Andy was exploring an exciting new opportunity, and he should have been happy for his partner. He should get hustle culture as a chef, because if anything that workplace is just as hectic and has weird hours, too. I think it’s important in a relationship to allow space for your partner to explore themselves and grow, even if it means they aren’t a carbon copy of the person you met. It’s totally okay to voice concerns if you think they’re doing harm to themselves, but I think Nate started hating Andy’s job prematurely. It took nothing for him to start pouting, and his complaints are almost always self-centered. So from the outside, it seems like the second Andy was no longer exactly the way she was when he met her, he starts complaining. And to me, that cheapens whatever moral guidance he is supposed to be proffering to her. If he’s supposed to be her conscience, he should have been written to reflect on how her current path is detrimental to her mental health and her friendships, relationships other than him, etc. I’m not saying that Andy should have stayed in the fashion world, but I’m not convinced by the ticking clock the writers tried to have going throughout the movie. I don’t see a time limit to Andy figuring herself out, but Nate makes it feel like it’s some witch’s curse where if she doesn’t get her soul back by the next full moon, she’ll be trapped in the fashion world with Meryl Streep forever. But that’s just not the case, and it’s not generally how life works. Anyway, rant over. I didn’t realize I had so many feelings about this movie lmao
Exactly. What's also aggravating is that in almost every conversation it's always about her flaws and his wants. At no point did he ever stop to think "Maybe I shouldn't judge" or"Hey maybe this is her new dream". Career paths change. Sometimes you go into something thinking it's just a job,but then it becomes your career. There no shame in exploring. There is however shame in throwing a hissy fit everytime your SO grows into their own.
@@chrissyr8387 I know right. It's a weird Hollywood thing, where every film/TV show makes it out, that whenever a character doesn't follow the path they chose when they were literally a kid, they're a sell out.
Sorry this isn’t meant to be argumentative, just a different take: I always read it as his concerns manifesting very quickly because her change from loathing the fashion industry to passion for it is so sudden from an outsider’s perspective. It would be very frustrating and disarming to hear a loved one entering a profession they’ve openly decried beforehand, start by hating it and complaining about it and then suddenly start to switch. It’s not holding someone back or stopping their personal growth to call out sudden changes in behaviour, especially if they seem unhealthy. It seems like a point of view issue where their respective viewpoints don’t overlap at all: Andi only sees Runway and Nate only sees her outside of it, so neither can see how the other perceives them. Nate is disarmed and guarded about her sudden willingness to work way too hard on a job she’s openly stated to dislike until now and she only sees him as the one dissenting voice trying to tempt her not to work hard whereas everyone else she sees in a day is equally subservient to Runway and browbeaten that they actively encourage her to continue in her passion for it. Imagine watching the film but only the scenes outside of Runway: Andi would seem to change very quickly and without warning. It’s no wonder they clash. Nate should adapt his reactions based on what he is saying to her, but I can see why he might not: it’s almost like seeing someone you love join a cult. She wasn’t excited for runway and initially it was not exciting for her, and not in a pay-your-dues-at-the-start way, she hated the whole atmosphere, the people, the job… Then the cult seduces the victim. The victim might profess newfound love for it but if it’s ‘not them’ and they’re behaving oddly wouldn’t you call them out on it? Then she doubles down and he remains stubborn and they clash. It’s totally Andi’s story of course, but I personally think Nate comes off okay: she sees him as being unsupportive so so does the audience, but from his perspective, she is running herself ragged for a job she does not like or want (until she very suddenly claims the opposite despite visibly still being stressed, overworked and under ridiculous pressure) and letting it take over her life and destroy her relationships with friends. It m if he seem selfish to word it as ‘why are you choosing runway over me?’ But what he is really I guess trying to ask is ‘how can a job you never wanted be more important than your relationship’? Which is a perfectly reasonable question I think, he should feel valued by his partner and vice versa. He also seems to feel responsible for maintaining her friendships with others, which she does not seem too concerned with worrying about. He doesn’t want her to lose other personal relationships over her job. Who wouldn’t act like him? He could’ve tried to be more understanding but realistically I think most people would act like him and double down on his negative feedback towards her to, as he sees it, make her see sense.
For me a problem in most movies is the timeline: Imagine the film depicting a whole year. The picture would be really different. But there are a lot of movies, especially book adaptations, that have a problem with setting up realistic timelines.
Nate was the villain to the extent that, as someone who was supposed to be one of the most supportive relationships in Andy's life, he was one of the least supportive. He never really offered constructive criticism/support, he just complained all the time and tried to make her feel bad for taking her job seriously. If he truly cared about her he would have found better ways to talk to her about the personal compromises she may have been making for the sake of her job, instead of being a whiny teenager most of the time.
Fair, but he's still right in that one shouldn't be consumed by their job. I think he also has the right to be upset when Andy missed his birthday in order to attend a work function. Could he have been more mature about it? Absolutely. But I think his position is valid.
maybe Nate didn't have the vocabulary to voice his opinions in a constructive way, maybe he needed a youtube video that tells him how he should've handled the situation.
@@jeremyboyd6136 Nate should’ve had a seat with Andy and talked to her like an adult. He never liked her job and was always trashing it. He lacked maturity and communication skills. Yea, her job was challenging and yes, missing his birthday was bad but all of that could’ve been handled with effective communication instead of him blurting out his frustrations in the middle of the street and breaking up with her in the moment. He was childish
Ok but taking a job miles away within a week or two after the breakup (Emily is still in the hospital so it can’t have been that long) after having an interview. Interviews usually don’t just happen and he was likely planning or entertaining ideas of leaving the city without talking to Andy. It comes across that he expects to be supported in all his career choices and for her to make sacrifices but couldn’t bother to offer the same to Andy. As a chef I’m sure he’s had to miss some important dates (hello holidays). Also he did like the lingerie and the general makeover, so he likes the transformation parts that please him which is selfish. He isn’t The villain but is he A villain to Andy’s story.
The problem is that employers don’t promote people who place work life balance bc they see it as not going above and beyond, my HR boss said this flat out for a state government company of 1300. She wasn’t the only one, so in this way you are forced given you need a job and this is so common.
Because this isn't real work life balance. She is young and single. Its totally different to say you have a 10 year old or elderly parent to care for vs you have a perfectly healthy self sufficient boyfriend.
Respectfully disagree. Currently the cultural pendulum has swung, and employers actually admire workers with good life balance. It shows skill and maturity. My star employee is a mother of three young children who is very confident about drawing boundaries and taking time off for kids' appointments when she needs to. But she is so stellar and superior that I don't mind. I would never push her to work extra hours that she isn't comfortable with because she can do amazing things with the 8 hours she does work. Yes, once in a while I think it would be nice if I could ask her to stay late for a particular meeting or project, but in the big picture she's more valuable to me than an even slightly less superior employee with more flexible hours.
@@FayeIL You didn't make any actual reference to a "cultural pendulum" swinging, you just pointed out your own workplace. That's not a cultural shift, that's just one single workplace.
@@FayeIL the key being she's getting the job done well. Work balance is appropriate when you are getting the job done and doing more is going beyond expectations. It's meant to actually be a balance not just saying you have a kid so you get to leave early and it certainly isn't meant to be used as a reason a millenial or Gen Z can think getting drunk and high or going to a long ski/lake house vacation several times a year is "balance" Part of growing up is putting your career and long term financial stability as a priority. It's not balance if you think you can have it all. If you are steller performer and your employer is being unreasonable asking you to work every weekend then you vote with your feet. The problem is with our hr happy culture it's virtually impossible for your boss to honestly tell you the white male with no kids is outperforming you by staying late and working weekends if you aren't doing the same. It is only relevant to keep your current position that you just do the job so telling you that opens the door to complaints. What people forget is getting promoted or getting a raise may require competition or showing you can handle the responsibility of a more demanding job. If you by comparison can't get the job done as well as the person doing more hours then you decide for yourself what balance is worth. This is why single parents have it so hard. But As a single woman w no kids I hate it when women with kids get away with murder bc hr is too worried if asking them if they could arrange a sitter should have been planned vs dumping thier work when it's not done as "balance". It's not fair people with kids dump thier work on singles who are putting their work first to get promotions. I'll gladly take on more work for me to earn a bonus or OT if offered but doing someone else's work bc they won't do it iwithout any recognitions of my work life balance isnt fair. Most bosses will recognize a good performer the ones who don't you vote with your feet.
Just bc Nate was right about hustle culture doesn’t mean he’s a good guy now. He was still super misogynistic and unsupportive and I dont get why he was surprised at people in their early 20s changing and developing new interests
@@Sims4Tto clarify. I’m not saying he hates women. But a lot of the views he expressed were rooted in misogynistic stereotypes, and none of the characters are free from that, because our society is inherently misogynistic. Just because he loved Andy doesn’t mean he can’t say misogynistic things and be extremely condescending to her. It doesn’t make him an awful human being, but unfortunately, we don’t see him be anything but immature.
This "Nate is the villain" discussion never made sense to me. Andy should have the ability to change her persona, goals, and priorities as she grows as a person. That said, Nate should also be able to challenge her choices if they leave him feeling alone, and he should have the ability to leave if his partner grows into a new person that he doesn't feel compatible with. Trying to pin one of them as a "villain" is because the relationship fell through is reductive and regressive. Not every breakup needs a "villain".
The real problem is that Andy chose a job she didn't want and chose to work in an environment that changed her identity to one that she didn't like, and she acted like she had no choice. At least her "toxic" boyfriend tells her the truth and wants what's best for her. Isn't that what a good boyfriend is about? yes, he wasn't perfect, but he was immature, not toxic. People love throwing around the word toxic too easily these days 😒
@ What do you call staying up all all night, just so you can make a dramatic exit the minute your partner comes home, cause she had to work on your birthday? That's so petty.
Spoken like someone who has no clue what it’s like to work a toxic job just to pay the bills. So glad I didn’t have Andi’s friends, it would’ve made things even more of a nightmare.
Finally someone said it, lol. When I watched the movie, if felt he is a bit annoying. But, I can understand his frustration. He expected a decent work life balance which Andy's new job was unable to provide. I don't think its wrong to want to spend some quality time with your partner everyday, especially on your birthday. Unfortunately, Andy was too preoccupied with Miranda and had little to no time to spend for her boyfriend. Once Andy updated her fashion sense and became a 'better' person, their interests became incompatible and the relationship inevitably ended in a break-up. It doesn't make either person bad. Edit: However, i was definitely irked by Andy's unprofessional attitude. She always looked down upon the people in her office for being into fashion. And when she quit her job in Paris, it was an impulsive decision. Without a care of thought about her commitments to Miranda in Paris, she quit on the spot without a notice!. That's very unprofessional. She should have finished her job at Paris and then quit after they came to the US.
It does make him bad when he actively makes her feel guilty for outgrowing him. He attacks her integrity (WTF), pouts about her new clothes, and sulks like a toddler. I hate this Nate revisionism.
I agree with you Sibi. Andy is the one who gave up her integrity, sold her soul to the devil and turned into what she once made fun of. Nate simply called her out on that. Andy put a job, that was supposed to be temporary, above all of her relationships thus ending them. Andy is the true villain of the film.
@@rafaelcastillo3834 When exactly did she "give up her integrity"? Seriously. Name it. She sold her soul to the devil?? WTF. Did I miss the scenes of Andy slaughtering babies somewhere? The movie simply doesn't show her doing anything remotely close to what she's been accused of.
@@saltycrunch Losing weight for a job, when you aren't overweight at all, isn't compromising your integrity? Particularly when you do it by adopting normalized disordered eating and body shaming from your co-workers? Did going from a size 6 to a 4 make Andi a better assistant? No! She's not a model. Looking a certain way isn't a part of her job description. It's just a part of the toxic culture, which Andi laughed at in the beginning of the film. People are apparently so brainwashed by hustle culture that they can't even see this. I'm not saying Nate was a great catch, but I do not get why people defend Miranda and Runway!
@@sawanna508 I think it comes down to the idea that we shouldn't sell ourselves - that's part of Andy's journey. She makes her decision by the end that she is not a Miranda. But she has learned a couple of things without losing her core: the way she presents herself at her interview at the end is more assured, more clear. Her clothing style is much more relaxed than it was at Runway, neater than it was at the start, and she feels comfortable in it. It's still Andy, just polished. And there are other gains: she has kept Miranda's respect despite, or perhaps because of, her decision; and Emily has learned to appreciate the friend who will never be close but who has learned from her and who has given Emily the gift of tolerance for Emily's stress-filled abruptness.
A lot of people forget that this was an entire year (or almost) because of how nate reacted to her not coming to his birthday party. She probably has promised many times either to spend time or have plans together, but it always falls through. The sad part is we're not seeing his side. Of course, communication. He might have talked to her and she might have brushed him off or not listened
@@arkeshn729 They risked getting her fired, when they stole her phone and wanted to answer it. That's a bit worse than friendly banter. Not to mention that they have serious goes at her as well, not just some snide remarks.
No one is saying her job and Miranda weren't toxic, but all parties involved knew that going in. That doesn't absolve him for his crappy behaviour. All he had to do was support her for one year while she gained the necessary experience. It was literally just resume filler. Really good filler but filler nonetheless. All he had to do was no be a d*ck for a year and he couldn't manage that.
@@silentsaturn7604 It was a major plot point of the movie that you survive a year with Miranda and you can get hired at any newspaper in the country. Tolerate a year was all they needed to do.
@@silentsaturn7604 Yeah, super convenient to leave the most crucial detail out of the conversation, so that it makes it seem the video poster has a valid point.
@@silentsaturn7604 didn’t they have a guy who was always passed up at every turn? That was what made Andy wake-up and truly commit to the 1 year instead of more years (or else he is useless as a character)
I always felt uncomfortable with people labeling Nate as a villain. Sure, he was an ass during a few of his scenes, but his reactions for the most part always seemed understandable, even if they weren't the best ways of handling the situation. Nate and Andy were jerks to each other, and neither were emotionally mature about their relationship.
Nah, he’s the villain. You’re an adult and you’re treating your girlfriend like shit because she couldn’t make it on time to your birthday because of work even when she showed genuine remorse? That’s shitty.
@@Bloooo95 No, shitty is missing your boyfriends birthday party and expecting a sorry with zero changed belabor to fix anything. She was late constantly
I never understood all of The Nate Hate. Andie did neglect him and her friends. I think that the birthday scene showed that Nate knew that they were growing apart.
I am starting the video, and i hope this doesn't turn a victim-blaming fest towards Andi, sometimes people can't afford to say "no" to their boss (unless in an imoral thing)
It was a victim blaming fest. 🤷🏻♀️ This and the Harry Potter video they made where they said Hermione should have been the star of the franchise based solely on the movies that are absolute trash and don't reflect at all the depth of the characters have been the only videos I've really disliked of them. PS: I also dislike a lot how they completely forgot neurodivergence is more than just Asperger's.
Yes. Most unhealthy bosses are like "do the job or you're fired". Finding a job which matches your needs is very difficult. It's wrong to say Andi had a choice (especially when she was in the early stages of her career).
@@alejandraolvera5029 So, it is okay for a girlfriend or a wife to nag to their husbands about being home more but it is not okay for a boyfriend to do the same thing? Women are hypocrites.
@@lisah8438 I don't like both actions as the women who nag their husbands need to STFU cause all that they do they do for them and put the money on the table for them to afford all they have, but you missed the big point in what you said: both people complaining on both ends ARE NOBODIES. ost wives that complain like this are housewives with no career, no part or full time or anything to aspire to that keeps their anger, interests, and emotions in tact.
@@lisah8438 neither of them were home!! He is a chef in NYC for christ sake, meaning he has 100% done skipped out on her for a shift. I've worked as a kitchen porter and even I have cancelled plans, so imagine how silly I would be to drag someone for cancelling plans on me. Nate was silly
Someone can be the villain of someone else’s story and still not be an actual bad person. If a person is unhappy with their own career progression, jealous, and believes a person can only change how they want and they take that out on someone else, that’s toxic. Nate rarely is shown listening to Andy. His response to her venting is ‘just quit’ with no empathy that she cannot just quit. His lack of respect towards her job is selfish and belittling, and as people have pointed out considering his job, leans heavily to the whole misogynistic undertones. It screams I’m good when we’re on the same level, but don’t jump ahead. I’m not emotionally mature enough to be supportive to someone else and their success’ vibes.
Andy didn't have respect towards the job either. for her it was just a job that pay the bills and she laughs at the situation when they select a belt and calling it 'stuff'.
That's what i love about this movie, the characters are not 8 or 80, they can be bad at times, good at others, like humans, we have to stop to look at movies and series in Disney eyes, not everybody is a mastermind villain or a super kind person... we're fucked up as hell!
@Cio Lake why would i say that lol, i'm laughing so much right now. i'm sorry too, i didn't know any english expression to this, that's why i put one that is often used on Brazil. english is not my first language
No. In the end Nate blames Andy for everything and she accepts total guilt. And that’s it. He didn’t grow at all and the film wants us to accept he didn’t do anything wrong. Just. No. I’m sorry but he was an immature jerk most of the time.
THANK YOU! I never thought Nate acted the best way, and he could have been more supportive and less accusatory, but people saying he was wrong to even be upset never sat right with me. Miranda's actions were way worse and downright abusive, but people just gloss over that and brand Nate as the villain. Anybody would be upset if they were in his place.
I disagree with the general ethos of this analysis. This was Andy’s first real professional job and she went from not caring at all about it to giving it her all. She was able to learn about an entirely new industry that she started to like and get excited about and her job allowed her to utilize her intelligence and creativity. Nate was unsupportive, close minded, and dismissive not seeing the growth and change in Andy that’s obvious to anyone watching the movie. Yes, Miranda crossed boundaries that weren’t appropriate but I also completely understand Andy’s perspective of wanting to stick it out for a year and not tarnish her resume. This is a Great Recession millennial coming of age story and Andy had a better career trajectory than most. I think even if Andy hadn’t quit the magazine she would have established firmer boundaries in time. That said I do understand how dating Andy during a period of transition like this could have been frustrating. But it’s how dismissive and unsupportive her friends are that really hits today. Also I don’t think Miranda stepped on anyone, she found out she was about to be stepped on and defended herself. Her instinct isn’t to get ahead by stepping over people, it’s to utilize her talent, connections, and reputation which she acquired through passion and hard work. The Take has been oddly harsh on her character given it’s otherwise progressive lean.
If you want to view this movie in the lens of a toxic workplace/abusive employers, the way Andy's friends and boyfriend treat her can be viewed as victim blaming. Instead of asking why she can never seem to find any free time or why she seems so terrified of displeasing her boss, they attack her for not acting like the girl they knew 16 years ago - their words, not mine. Also, it's very telling that when Lily confronts Andy, she starts off by saying, "the Andy i know is madly in love with Nate." She's essentially tying her identity to her relationship which is never healthy, especially when that identity is being imposed on you by others. Ultimately, Andy's quest to escape Runway and get back to her "true self" seems to be the movie's way of discouraging personal growth. Also the only person who is not a possible villain in this is Doug. Doug is a treasure of which we're not worthy.
Every ambitious graduate is nervous and wants to do his/her best at his/her job. Every professional and person who strives for excellence, wants to avoid mistakes. That’s how the best inventions were invented, by avoiding mistakes. That’s how products, services and inventions are perfected.
I think I said this in another comment, but Andy's dad is a good example of a character who shows genuine concern for Andy's job in a way that actually looks out for her well-being rather than blaming her for the fact her job is toxic.
Looks like this is the first video I disagree with. I feel both Andy’s boyfriend and friends were awful to her. Now I don’t think they are worst than Miranda but they weren’t very supportive of her.
@@tyrant-den884 it's pretty easy when it's said from the jump that the job is only temporary. She just had to do her best for 1 year and she could get a job anywhere else where she could write. It would be one thing if this was her career of choice forever, but it's not. I feel like they could have been more supportive and understanding with it being only going for 1 year and she was quitting. Now if they were at the year mark and she was not making any plans to leave then have the conversation, but all this stuff happened over the course of the 1 year. She's paying her dues and networking with other people in the publishing community not to mention getting great work experience which was not on her resume before Miranda.
@@letrailhall-nance9189 but that's not what she was saying anymore. She was defending Miranda and Runway, not the "I just need to stick it out" "to the jobs that pay the bills" mentality her friends had just a few weeks before.
@@letrailhall-nance9189 Thank god at least someone has a sane take. I swear everyone commenting about how "consuming" Andy's temporary 1-year job was has probably never worked in a desirable, competitive industry.
@@saltycrunch maybe people are commenting bc that is not a good thing. If everything you care can come in second, third place, you are not a worker, you are a paid slave.
Bc its not guaranteed that at the end of the year she'd be able to land a journalism job. The job was tangential but probably paid more than an entry level journalism job and given the trajectory of journalism is layoffs and crap like buzzfeed and huffpost no original writing she may like many people just stay in a job she gets good at and seems to be progressing in. Afterall after a year she is above Emily.
This is a bad take. The "villain" label is a simplistic one to begin with, but Nate IS a selfish asshole and a bad boyfriend. All Andy had to do was put in one year as Miranda's assistant before she would have any entry job in publishing open to her. Nate was a pouty 4-year-old (while having a busy stressful job himself), totally unsupportive. Her awful friends were similar. All of them act like Andy is out there committing war crimes. She doesn't do anything unethical (the movie does not sell her "betrayal" of Emily i.e. agreeing to go to Paris). She's a good assistant and maturing, something Nate desperately wants to stop. She's 22 for god's sake. Those are not the years to prioritize a worthless boyfriend over finding one's career, expanding one's horizons, and gaining new skills and experiences.
THIS! Why didn't the take mention for all this shit Nate should have asked Andy to marry him. They were chewing Andy out as if they are 45 and this is it. unless Nate had a ring and was ready to lock it down, she owes him nothing.
@@saltycrunch but she wasn’t just a demanding boss she was also a narcissist. She only cared about herself. In real life your relationships wouldn’t survive if your boss still has access to you in your personal life than your partner.
@@Lola-qy9yt Yet again... It was for one year. 12 months. After that Andy could quit and based on her experience with Miranda get a job at any other publication, as we are explicitly told in the film.
Yet at the end he announces a move to Boston to be a sous chef. It would be interesting to see if he can maintain that work/life balance in his new role and new city.
The problem I STILL have with Nate (sorry) is that he only supports Andy when she is acting the way he wants her to act. He doesn't respect fashion nor the people interested in it, so when Andy starts caring about fashion and her job, he stars to disrespect her and her decisions. He never really learns that Andy has changed her mind and now cares for her job, but it is not because she doesn't say it, but because he doesn't want to hear it, he makes fun of her for her new interests. I he had listened, maybe he could've give moral advices that weren't "quit your job". Conclusion: Nate is a jerk, and I don't think their relationship would work at the end, because Andy changed, grew and learned a lot and Nate clearly didn't change or grew up a bit.
I am not his fan but I don't think he's the villain. I just felt he wasent very understanding, she had a demanding job that she needed as a stepping stone it's not easy to just quit when you need to pay bills and what not. However he gets over hated. You can sympathize that he didn't like Miranda being demanding of andi and andi spending all her time pleasing her. There are two sides of his character
Yeah, that’s where Nate lovers lose me. If you had to do a shit job for a year, but after every door for what you want you really is opened, is it not worth it? It was stepping stone that would project her career in ways that just aren’t possible for most.
Nate is as much of a villan as Janis was a villan in mean girls. Both Nate and Miranda try to make Andy something she's not. While Miranda ofcourse is more extreme in her approach to bring out the Miranda she sees in Andy. Nate trys to stunt Andy's growth and wants her to be " old Andy" who is passive and willing to take the rude jabs he makes at her. Let's not forget before and after her transformation Nate is kind of a passive aggressive bully to Andy. What I think makes Nate look like a worse villan than Miranda is that he never grows.He doesn't apologize for the mean way he treats Andy nor does he compromise anything in the relationship. Andy, now changed, has to deal with a relationship with a guy who is happy with her more serious journalist job and has no intention on addressing his obvious flaws
Unpopular opinion: I always liked Nate, and he was a pretty solid partner. "I don't care if you're pole-dancing, just pole-dance with integrity," is a solid point. Ambition is something that I believe should be used in moderation: what good are the perks of a solid career if I haven't got a pet, or a person to share it with? We need someone/something to spend our money on besides keeping ourselves alive.
@@silentsaturn7604 That's a solid point. I hope my mentioning pets too was ok? Yes, our careers are important and I think not wanting a romantic relationship is perfectly valid. But, there is more to our lives than careers or relationships: what about hobbies, travel, academic pursuits/research, friendships? We all do things outside of work that make our jobs a means to fund our lives, not the purpose of our actual lives...If that makes sense?
I never understood the vitriol Nate would get like he wasn’t great, still have my qualms, but I thought he made some good points at times and honestly I can sympathise with his position on occasion. I always thought it was a bit more complicated than him being the villainous boyfriend. Maybe it’s a case of good intentions, poor execution
For me the worst moment was when Nate and the others stole Andy's phone making fun of her just because she was worried she could lose an important call from work. Helloooo she's telling you her boss is demanding, if you can't be supportive at least don't be a jerk
Anyone who saw Nate as the villain either 1. Has never worked in a toxic work environment or 2. IS the toxic person in our work environments. Nate actually loves and cares about Andy. Miranda would replace Andy instantly if anything happened to her. Nate would be an easy choice for anyone if this were real life.
Thanks to the lovely The Take Team for differentiated, balanced analyses of characters, stories and topics in general, especially when in the general discourse 'choosing your camp', being right/wrong and absolute 'truths' seems more important than looking at things with the nuance and patience for flawed characters great stories invite us to. More than one thing can be true, and I'm always relieved when The Take invites us to pause, take a step back and look at the whole picture. ❤
Well ... Basically, Andy has a hard time dealing with the egos of the people around her and Nigel is her only Fairy Godmother~ Poor girl, she is surrounded by people who think in their own way is the best and they feel like Andy must listen to them or people will say that she becomes a very bad person.
I remember when I watched that movie with my Mom when I was Young I Just couldnt See why they Just didnt Take a break for a year and Then have a good Life where she also Had her Dreams career
Some people don't have the privilege to quit their toxic jobs and start looking for a new one while they are unemployed... sometimes putting food on the table doesn't allow you to prioritize your wellbeing because you may a person under your responsibility
Okay hear me out but Nate was shit. We're not stupid, we understand the intentions behind the idea of his character but there are flaws in the development. You simply can't be self-righteous about someone else's decisions while simultaneously behaving the way Nate did and not expect to get called out on your hypocrisy. Andy's friends loved the gifts but continuously undermined her work. When Andy started realising there was more to Miranda and Runway, her bf and friends were not allowed to go on that discovery with her. This made them look like A**holes. Despite knowing the temporary nature of this job and the role it would play in her career, they almost sabotaged it with childish stunts. Even though Andy chose to walk away as originally intentioned, the way her circle handled that was not helpful. If you have decided that you need Miranda's recommendation then you stick it out for the year, make your little jokes and cut it out when she's legit struggling at an impossible job, not double down and add to her misery.
I don't understand why her friends are even considered villains. The only moment they were childish and kinda rude to her was when they were passing her phone around while Miranda was calling her. After that, her friends were always supportive throughout the movie. When Andy's friend called her out, it was because she was letting herself be kissed by Christian, and smiling about it, WHILE SHE WAS STILL WITH NATE. I thought her friend's reaction was perfectly appropriate.
Nah, still a villain in my book. Even the movie's mantra was that this gig is only for a year and that it wasn't permanent. He could support her and stick it up. And yeah, later it becomes obvious that Andy changed her attitude and started enjoying her job, redirecting her career, and what's so wrong about that? I redirected my career a few times, growing and changing and figuring out what I like. Andy deserved better than him.
Nah he's a jerk. Yes, he has a few good points. But he ultimately only supported her as long as she didn't like the job. Once she had been there a while and was starting to get good at it, make some work friends, find some interest in the industry, and dress in the way that was expected at her workplace, then he was out. He refused to respect her as long as she actually enjoyed the job. He wouldn't allow for her to grow and try new things.
@@drummstickydd93 Working at Runway for a year would have led to other opportunities in Andy's dream industry. They reiterate this many times throughout the film. If Nate ACTUALLY cared about Andy's dreams, he would have toughed it out for a year instead of whining every step of the way about how preoccupied she was with her career, and also making fun of her choices.
I always felt Nate was truly concerned about Andie's surrendering to the fashion culture she previous loathed. He knew she was not being true to herself.
Why does being true to herself have to mean never expanding her interests and career goals? So Andy became interested in fashion and the fashion publishing world and worked in a busy job. He wasn't truly concerned about her newfound interests, he was (rightly) concerned about her outgrowing him.
@@saltycrunch She wasn't interested in fashion in the slightest. She was groomed and molded. Miranda took her on as a project. Nate saw right through it.
@@MustardSeedish You mean when he wasn't distracted by Andy's new found interest in langerie? How do you know Andy wasn't interested in fashion? She had a very predjudice and juvenile opinion on the fashion industry without actually knowing anything about it and eventually learned that she was wrong. It's called growing and learning, that's never a bad thing, ever. Nate trying to stop Andy from doing that is what makes him toxic. He wants her to stay the moon to his sun and nothing else.
@@silentsaturn7604 One clue was the way she dressed in the beginning of the film and her words saying she never read Runway and didn't know who Miranda Priestly was. It was the actual thesis of the story.
I feel like we as millennials were enamoured by the glamour of the magazine. We would probably be able to see more clearly the toxicity of this work environment if it were something less pretty than fashion. But as Miranda says at the end: "Everyone wants to be us". Yeah, we as a generation totally drank the kool aid and now we grew up and just want peace of mind.
@@curlychapina Same. I knew Miranda was evil the moment she belittles and degrade her employees. Because let's face it, Miranda isn't called the devil because she is just mean, but she tempts people to go against their morals and principles in order to please her own selfish wishes.
I am an old man now and have seen stories much like this played out many times over. They will not be getting back together. They were once the same, but things change, seasons change, people change. She is a career girl with ambition, and he is just a simple man with simple ambitions. They were not meant to be. It is better they part ways. He will end up happier without her. As for her, she will never be happy.
Thanks for this piece! I understand the point of the “Nate-villain” thesis, I do. But I always saw this movie as not so much a commentary on all working women, but specific to the cut-throat fashion/entertainment industry that will inevitable put strains on these workers personal lives. I never saw Nate’s criticisms as something that would occur in Andy were a working woman in general. He makes valid points that her specific job in that moment is a shit-show and that she should re-evaluate her options.
Whatever shit-show that job may be, it was due to be over after one goddamn year, and then Andy would quickly land the dream job she truly wanted. Is it too much to ask for Nate to be supportive of Andy for this pitifully small amount of time?
I saw the movie dozens of times, can't think of one good quality he had. In the whole book the only good thing he did was that he ONCE brought food for Andy. Arguing is great and all, but this one's really not for me as a die hard fan.
There is a difference between the college boyfriend growing in a different direction and "the true villain holding her back from a demeaning job in an industry she had no interest in."
@@tyrant-den884 Well, yes. But he should've spoken up instead of being passive aggressive about it (like on his birthday). I do understand where his feelings came from, but he acted very immature, like a child left in the supermarket.
It seems like Nate and the gang were trying to define Andy as their "friend" who lost herself and the people she loves in trade for success in the fashion industry. However, Andy got both the awareness and conscience intact. She cared and had valid reasons, but they couldn't support her at all. I'm glad she was alone in the end, Nate is not for her.
I've never agreed with all this "Nate bad boyfriend" hate because I'd always put myself in his place. If my boyfriend misses my birthday and changes into a totally different person I'd be really upset. I think most women and girls who hate Nate is because they wish they have Andy's opportunities and dream about that glamorous life she lived for a while (designers clothes, Paris and all that). I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice the time I spend with my partner for that
When I first saw the movie with my friends, they all hated him but I didn’t. It felt like the “what are you booing, I’m right” meme. He was worried that she was changing in a negative way. She eventually realized that he was right.
That doesn't seem important to the Nate haters. In sixty days Andy went from a job that pays the bills to I'll see you when I see you. That would be jarring in any relationship.
I think that’s a movie problem in general: time. Nate does not consider that it’s just one year, the transition in just a few weeks is really hard. I think they put a storyline that would have worked in a whole year just into a few month. There are a lot of movies doing it because it is difficult to show time on a screen without lessening the tension.
To say that Andy had a choice when Miranda told her to basically do as she was told or she would become unemployable is pretty nearsighted. If a robber came to you and pointed a gun at you and said your money or your life, would you say you had a choice? In theory, yes, in both cases they're is a choice to be made, but it's not one you're actually making, you're *forced* into making and that's the difference. You can't judge people that make choices under duress as if they were acting out of their own free will. Andy actually didn't have much of a choice if the only other option was potentially risking her entire career and future (which meant putting food on the table and having a roof to live under). In the end she chose to do it and face the possible consequences, which in her mind (and in reality) were very real as seen by the job interview scene where Miranda actually wrote them personally. Andy was mentally prepared for the worse and thanks to her determination through her stay at Runway, she managed to touch Miranda.
Miranda Priestly and Andera herself, are the true villains. Because at several points in the movie, Andera and Emily could turn her into the B.B.B, for not following workplace laws, taking advantage of her staff, etc., even the stylist/photo developer could turn Miranda in for falsely promising a career in defrauding contracts to steal his money, family jewels, & gems, etc.
I usually agree with your take,but not this time. In a supporting relationship you think long term. Andy wanted to do this for a year. If you serious about your partner, you acknowledge that she/he has other responsibilities, interest and plans. Andy thought it's a good decision to take this job before she goes back to her original plan. Nate should have sacrifice 1 year, not more. He was very selfish and treated Andy poorly and it was a bad choice from her side to go back to him. He clearly holds her back and thinks Andy top priority should be him and nothing else.
I never saw Nate as a villain, rather a someone who says the right stuff but in the wrong, quite harsh way. Actually I see Nigel as more of a villain because of his comments about Andy’s weight throughout the film....because when she comes to him as he said to “whine” he basically tells her to get on with toxic work place and plants the seed in her head that she needs to get a makeover to fit in and be accepted. I never felt sorry for him when Miranda “screwed” him over because in all honesty he was only ever accepted by her for pleasing her and get the job done as she wanted to, but I doubt she ever really respected him because he had no real character, he never stood up to her. Remember how he whines to Andy that he will finally be able to come to Paris and see it or take control of his life? It shows he was just a loyal follower to Miranda, who secretly wished for more and wanted more, but never had the balls to actually do what he wants. That is why when he thinks a time will come and Miranda will pay him back, Andy is highly doubtful. Nigel and Emily are so similar in every aspect which is why Miranda could do what she did to them, because she knows they are loyal no matter what. They have no opinion or self-respect, unlike Andy.
I do agree with most of what you said, however I do think nigel's speech about Andy whining was right. Andy was disrespectful to the people working there and did not work hard enough to earn her respect from miranda. He was right about that and put her in her place. If she wanted to do well, she had to change to fit in- and it was her choice, since he told her that she could quit and leave it for someone who actually wants it. Yes, him and Emily were schmoozes to miranda, however, unlike Andy, they were passionate about fashion. This was the career that they wanted and they dedicated their lives to it. The real problem was that Andy chose a job that she did not want to do and felt like she had no choice, but she did have a choice, she always did.
@@joycezale5433 I completely get your point, when I was younger and just starting out in the workplace, I would totally get along with Nigel and follow his advice. Now I see that he could have used different words to stimulate and support her because first of all, I can not agree that Andy disrespected anyone, she was getting the downright bad treatment although her only major fault was that she did not look glamourous. Yes, Nigel understood better the effect and the passion he and several others shared unlike Andy for fashion. Andy wasn't dumb and wanted to do things better, but she also received very little support from her workplace.
@@jessicavictoriacarrillo7254 oh trust, I know. Thanks to COVID and taking a year of work made me realize what a slave I was to the my workplace without even trully realizing how I was ruining my self-esteem and eating habits.
Yeah, Nate had his issues to, but honestly, all the people who justify how toxic Miranda was as a boss and the sick enviroment on Runaway just for the pretty clothes and the travel to Paris... that's NOT goot either.
Educate yourself the Milgram’s obedience study and Stanford prison study, or go to move to mainland China to be the “moral” one and get you all your family prisoned and tortured by CCP before making accusations about other people’s moral failing.
@@rww5416 when you start with 'educate yourself' you've already lost the plot. What makes you think I haven't? Nothing I said remotely points to the fact that that which you mention is foreign to me.
@@dvdv8197 If you educated yourself like you said you would never say it’s a good old defense. It’s funny how when others are calling people out for their own ignorance, it’s always “you lost the plot”.
Very happy that at least someone is willing to look deep enough. Nate was right all along. Andrea lost her friends and her boyfriend, for an abusive job that she never wanted. Andrea hated her job, she was a very nice and smart type of girl, not a toxic backstabber. That why Christian Thompson told her from the start "You won't survive Miranda. You're nice, smart'." Through the whole movie Andrea says "I didn't have a choice" to convince herself that she did nothing wrong. However when Miranda herself objects Andrea's pathetic excuse, then Andrea comprehends that Nate was right all along and she is going to become the new Miranda if she doesn't quit. Nate did absolutely nothing wrong. As a matter of fact, breaking up with her was the 2nd most masculine thing he has done. Offering them to get back together was the 1st.
I already disagree lol but imma watch it anyways. Edit: At this point, Emily was probably the only non toxic person in this film lol! She was upfront about the workplace, Miranda, the industry, and let Andy know that they weren’t friends without actually saying it lol! As for Nathan: Now that I’ve watched the video, I can see where he was concerned that she was losing her self respect and core values. However, he was very immature and went about trying to talk to her about it all wrong.
@@danielasilva8765 Absolutely! Emily was a good coworker and did help Andy with learning the ropes. It was definitely a great professional relationship and hopefully Andy took some of Emily’s “this is how it’s done” attitude with her when she has a coworker that may not know the ropes quite yet. Of course not as neurotic as Emily but yeah lol!
I think Emily had plenty of toxicity? She was just as devoted to the overwhelming hustle culture at runway as anyone. Plus It's rude to laugh at someone's lack of fashion sense like a high school mean girl?
@@lydiafayre9806 Oh please it was a high fashion publication in a high fashion industry Andy was working at and she didn’t take it seriously when she first started and knew NOTHING about the job she was applying for. Do you not remember when she laughed at the two belts that looked the same to her which resulted in Miranda reading her for filth eloquently? Andy was laughing at everyone’s fashion forward mentality so I guess that makes her a mean girl too? She thought she was better than everyone at the start of the film.
@@87alsjth I do think there's a lot to critique about Andy's dismissiveness of fashion and people who are invested in it (Which fortunately the film drew attention to). I do think there's a smugness to it that could be labelled mean, or at least inconsiderate. I don't think that this recognition does anything to mitigate the rudeness I'm accusing Emily of, though.
@@lydiafayre9806 In my opinion Emily wasn’t rude. She was real by questioning Andy on why she was there in the first place with how she dressed and not knowing about the industry. You just cannot waltz into an industry like that not looking sharp; that’s just facts. The fashion industry is cut throat and cold at times so you better at least look like you belong there if you don’t know much about it yet. Again, facts of that industry; it is what it is. Along with looking sharp you better sharpen your ability to take criticism, orders, having open availability and all that. EVERYONE was like 🙄👀🤨 with Andy at first so…
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Please the take, can u do a vidéo about couple Toxicity representation in movie and shows.
I'm glad this video acknowledged that Nate's role in the movie was one traditionally played by women; that of the long suffering significant other due to the negative changes (subjectively self-perceived or otherwise) of their partner's success (aka "The Nag"; something you guys have also previously covered). Not to say he was without fault - as has been exhaustively covered - but I wonder if people would have been so critical towards him if the sexes had been reversed.
Spoiler, when Nate finds out that she cheated on him during the Paris trip, they would have broke up again. Just saying. Nate has morals and people that see Nate as the person in the wrong can't and will never see that.
@@thedreamer6930 Uh, in case you forgot, when Andy was in Paris, they were on a break. Did you expect her to go on celibacy or what?
So the "villain" of the story isn't any of the characters, but the systems and the expectations that they have been made to build upon? I believe that.
Yes.
Exactly
So... capitalism? I agree.
So what you're saying is The Devil Wears Prada has the same message as The Wire? I can see that.
That's how I read it too like even Miranda the so called Devil of the movie's title came across as a product of the system, even recognising that the journalism career path suits Andie more and helping her get that job.
I wish you'd talked about the scene where Nate and Friends take Andy's work phone. It always makes my blood boil - they can see how stressed she is but they carry on. And this is AFTER Andy gives them all expensive designer presents that she could have kept for herself, but she wanted to treat her friends.
That scene always makes me mad too
It's a comedic timing moment in a comedy movie, the work abuse were treated as hilarious situations in this movie, relax
@@trile6243 you must be fun at parties
Yeah, and the fact that you totally left out that awfully immature scene kind of shows… Yes, if this were different person, then I’ll be like yeah they’re concerned but
Because this is Nate know this doesn’t work
And I will not be subscribing to your channel. Thank you.
They were such jerks about it.
I'd say both Miranda and Nate are terrible. It's easy to say it's a choice, but it's a choice that might leave her unemployed and without the job Miranda got her in the end. The job was hurting her, but he could've been understanding. It's very optimistic to say he was concerned, when he only complained about not getting enough attention.
@Cio Lake my family is used to doing birthday celebrations on weekends, cause everyone is busy otherwise. it was a matter of communication, and he didn't even bother to hear her
@Cio Lake But she couldn't make it because of her demanding job. She still brought a small gift for him but couldn't make it to the party, which he should understand, but he kind of dismissed her regardless. I felt like he was being irrational. Yes it's his birthday but he never really took her job seriously or respected it. She has to make money somehow because it's not like he was making much himself.
@@IsisAlv she cancelled last minute and didn't think about him. Being "busy" doesn't mean you just drop important plans without so much as a word. It's why she admitted eventually HE was right. He wasn't this saint, but he also wasn't terrible
Work/life balance
@Cio Lake I'm not dumping blame on him for not making as much money as her. You completely misunderstood, but yeah, they're not married but they ARE living together. Don't know if you watched the same movie but how did you miss that they were literally living under the same roof?? Because they live together, they have to pay rent. They have to put food on the table, so yes, money is very important here. They are both making money in their jobs but they have to make ENOUGH to pay bills and support each other. In this way, they do depend on each other, which is why Nate annoys me because even if Andy is doing her best for her job and earning the money that she is, instead of being supportive, he shames and judges her on her job when all she's doing is trying to adapt with her super demanding job. He acts like a sulky, pissy baby just because she doesn't show up for his birthday even if she turned down a huge opportunity just to make it in time because, again, she has a demanding ass job! And no, I will never understand because if my boyfriend had a super stressful job, it is my duty to support and cheer him on through it, which Nate NEVER does.
It’s the “as long as you did it with some integrity” line that makes him such an ass. She got promoted over someone else because she was better at the job. She didn’t push someone down the stairs like Showgirls. And, yeah, being a chef pontificating about work/life balance is pretty rich.
I like the Showgirls reference
Emily was not worse at the job, she fell sick from work!
YES she did lmfao, Emily was sick and injured and Andy swooped in on the Paris trip. She had become a completely different person, someone Andy from the first scene would have ridiculed.
@@sawanna508I agree
@@aparna2701 I disagree. One of the first things that Emily told Andy when she started working at the Runway was that you don't question Miranda. If Miranda tells you to do something, you just do it, no questions asked, which is exactly what she did. What people seem to forget is that Andy and Emily aren't friends and Andy honestly doesn't owe Emily anything. Emily has been very catty and bitchy to her the entire time that they've worked together. I actually found Andy to be too nice for even considering Emily's feelings after everything that's happened. Had the roles been reversed, Emily won't have given it a second thought. She'd have rubbed it right in Andy's face with zero remorse. I don't understand why people make Andy out to be a terrible person for doing her job. She might have changed, but it's not as if she took a 180 degree turn. She's still the same person, but she actually began to care about fashion and take her job seriously, god forbid, which conflicted with schedules with her friends who were trash in all honesty. Everyone has gaslit Andy, making her feel bad about her growth, but all I saw was that she was going to high places, they were stagnating, and they didn't like that. Andy honestly matures when she realizes that making fun of fashion doesn't make her superior.
I understood what his character was supposed to be for. It was to ground our protagonist, and call her attention at how unhealthy her work was. But it was badly executed.
I still don't understand why a chef (one of the most intense careers a person can have. Some people work more than 12 hours a day!) has all that free time and never expects to make any sort of compromise. I mean, he's going to move by the end and the movie wants me to think that, if it was the other way around, that he wouldn't whine about it? C'mon. When things were just starting, he complained about her missing his birthday. Not like, when things started accumulating. At the start of her adapting to the flow of her work. God knows I had that happend to me twice because of others' university work or career related things. You just shrug and reschedule, like adults.
I don't think he's the true villain but he's no hero or good romantic interest, either
Nail on the head
In the book he's a teacher which made more sense in my opinion.
@@alondraperez-ramirez8363 That does make a whole lot more sense! I can't expect a freaking chef to tell me how unhealthy my career path is, but I could expect that from a teacher. It's still a very demanding job, but in a different way. I wonder why they changed that bit about his profession for the movie?
@@m.n.2971 no idea since as a teacher it actually makes sense due to them having to be on the outlook for kids in a bad place so it's not illogical he's seeing Andy's workplace in the same way he would a bad home environment on his students.
I think they purposely gave him a non traditional schedule work so you can realize how many hours Andy is actually working. So again he's right, he's allowed to voice his concerns, but some people still have the misguided idea that men must settle for what they get and just be grateful.
The Devil Wears Prada is one of my favorite movies, but unfortunately because of Andy's boyfriend (and friends) I always get angry when I watch the movie. I'm fine with Andy choosing herself in the end (even though I would've loved to see her ditch her bf and old friends), but I just hate it when she's like "You were right all along" etc.
edit: Also, Andy was only supposed to work under Miranda for one year so that she could get her dream job as a reporter or writer somewhere else. If you're with someone, I think you both would agree to accept that during that one (1) year things are gonna be tough but it will be worth it (*should* be worth it) so that the other person can get their dream job. Plus, Nate decided to celebrate his birthday on a work/weekday. As an adult if you and/or your partner has a demanding job (like a chef or working under Miranda), I'd assume you'd agree to celebrate it on the weekend where you're sure all of your friends can join and have a good time.
I do understand that they wanted Nate to be this grounding character, a reminder for work-life balance, but they executed is badly.
I agree with literally everything you said. Nate and his friends piss me off every time I watch it because of how condescending they sound about Andy's job. They believe that just because it pertains to fashion, magazines, runways, and so on that it shouldn't be taken seriously so they make jabs at her at times, meanwhile she's making more money than them. Someone had to bring in the money since Nate's job didn't look to be paying that well, and he had way too much free time for a chef, but all he did was complain that she wasn't spending as much time with him as he wanted like an irrational child. Like dude, she has a demanding ass job and you're whining that she "changed". I get that he was supposedly used to identify that Andy's job was toxic, but it wasn't executed in an intelligent way. They made him sound like a child if anything. Andy had some faults too, but she was ten times more bearable and level-headed than the other characters in the movie. I hated that she went "you were right all along" at the end. He wasn't! Her decisions at the time made sense. She was busting her ass because it was the price to pay to become the journalist she wanted to be, but he seemed to not even care about that.
Hard agree. Nate is a jerk to Andy unless she does what he wants.
It baffles me how people get angry at Nate and co and not at Miranda. Like, are we watching the same movie? She is a bitch.
Complete agree. I work in elections and my boyfriend is a first year medical resident. Thankfully we are on opposite years (my hard years land on some of his easier years and vice versa). We have conversations about how sometimes one of us has to step up a little more often in those years to support the other one in their careers. They had an immature relationship if they couldn’t respect that about each other. Also, I ALWAYS thought being angry about missing an unremarkable birthday during a work week was the most childish thing. Hustle, burnout culture is terrible, but lets be realistic man...
It's not just about the work and long hours... it was about her internal trasnformation. She became a different person, made choices and changed plans without even a call to let him know. She just said "I'm sorry" after the fact.
That's the real issue.
I'm not saying Nate hadled it well, but the point is, neither did she.
Runway is not to be admired given it's overall terrible conditions but that doesn't give Nate or Andy the right to make a mockery of the people that choose to work there
Exactly! I don't even care about fashion that much but the way Nate kept criticizing Andy for dressing up was what repulsed me the most about his character
Exactly.
@@JadeCaro She was also criticized by Emily for the way she dressed before she got the fashionable clothes.
Do people like Andy's friends even exist? It's like those people can't go a day in their life without mocking anything fashion. Who the hell does that? Why are all those people friends again? Making fun of fashion ain't exactly a reason to be friends with someone.
LOL what terrible conditions? Lawyers work till 11 pm and midnight.
Runway was not abusing its workers. Personal assistants make sure that the needs of the person are taken care of, in order to ensure that the person gives his/her best performance.
Here's my take: Andy needed to walk away from both Nate and Runway.
Preach, Sister! 🙌🏾 It would have been a far more rewarding ending if she'd simply chosen herself.
Both were toxic. At least Runway gave her experience to advance her career.
Word!
@@nix2747 Yes. And Nate living in her apartment supported partly by her Daddy's money.
@@jessicavictoriacarrillo7254 Shading her about Miranda while b*tching about his own job which he hated, acting high and mighty in the same position.
Nate didn't care about Andy being overworked or taken for granted as one of the lowest employee's at her job ("I had no choice"). If he did, he would have cared for her mental health/well-being rather than the impact it had on him and their relationship. Jobs change you. For better and for worse. He was mainly concerned with the negatives of the job (of which there were many!) and the only time he showed interest in how the job benefits her (and him) is when she wears different clothes, particularly lingerie. Wanting be a journalist and working in a fashion magazine, where she could learn about production, editing etc., made so much sense. The fact that she ended up apologizing to him in the end always irks me cause she was midst transition; finding herself and the professional she wanted to be. While the points being made are valid, these being highlighted as his "concerns" are a reach. His only concern with her work-life balance was how he and their old life fit into it. It's hard to watch your partner change/grow and Nate was projecting his fears onto Andy.
He’s immature. Every first time full job will be stressful for a graduate. That’s life.
YEP - A good juxtaposition to Nate's reaction to her job is her dad's reaction when he comes to visit. Unlike Nate, her dad is genuinely worried about Andy's well-being and happiness, and whether Andy will actually benefit from this job.
It always seemed to me Andy was loosing her self not finding herself.
What a Female community! Without nothing, They talk back and chew up like it is not a big thing. 😮 like the first secretary did. It is just a difference of lifestyle. Not a Right or Wrong! Female insists not to discriminate, Justice, But it is just arrogant and self-righteous
@@sawanna508the point was everyone except Meryl Streep owned up to selling their souls. Anne Hathaway acted like she didn’t want the job but she really liked there life
I have always said that neither Nate and Friends or Miranda are villains. All of the characters have negative traits and failed in some aspects because they’re human. I never saw this hustle lifestyle and Runway job as admirable as other people I could only see it taking more and more from Andy. People always say Nate and friends are only criticizing her for caring too much about her job and they fail to remember that scene with her father’s visit she didn’t even have quality time for her dad! That’s not healthy at all. Christian is trash and the only victims here are Nigel and Emily.
Agreed!
Yes.
Yeah, I agree being dedicated to your job shouldn't mean having to ignore your own father when he makes a trip to see you to deal with situation that literally an act of nature and beyond your control and it certainly doesn't mean you start getting flirty and cozy with a sleazy guy when you're supposedly in a committed relationship (relationship problems is not an excuse to behave that way with another person).
Spoken like someone who hasn’t had to work a toxic job just to pay the bills.
@@phoenixrising7777 it is sad when people need to stay in horrible jobs to support themselves. I’m not criticizing those people I admire their strength. I’m criticizing the system, there’s a difference. A place where you work shouldn’t represent a threat to your mental and emotional health and make you neglect others aspects of your life, but it’s not a perfect world I guess. Also, speaking of the movie, at a certain point, Andy was free to leave that place if she wanted to.
I get that he wasn't the villain but some of the things he says about fashion and the people involved in it were degrading. I just think there were better ways to communicate with Andy.
I agree with you that Nate needed better ways to communicate because who really gets the message when it comes out whiney, but to be fair, that's exactly the same way Andy used to talk about the fashion industry. I don't agree with putting anyone's work down, but they were both in on that behavior and way of thinking till she changed for Miranda.
everyone has their opinion, it's up to those people on they deal with it, in Nate's situation it's layered
To be fair, we are "eavesdropping" on these characters' lives. We all have unpopular or uncouth opinions that would seem uncharismatic if taken as a proof of our character. His "degrading" comments make him human, not evil.
@@renemoreno7907 We were all INVITED to eavesdrop on their lives, as it is being televised to us through a mainstream movie.
Of course. But human is not perfect and even he was young. Mistakes and problems are destiny of human, the animal
Nate can tell her she’s unhealthy without being a jerk
but it doesn't make a villain per se
@@pendra_txt a lot of abusers hide behind the ‘right thing’ to ostracize them from family, friends and their career goals to keep them dependent on them for stability.
That wasn't the carreer she wanted She was leaving her family and friends behind because of her work. Her boyfriend was immature but he wasn't abusive, he wanted her happiness.
@@mdragon12 he never ostracize her from her relationships, actually his complains were that she was ostracizing them. He was inmature, but also was she, it's pretty much like a very young couple that needs growth from both ends.
@@mdragon12 he never tried any of those things you are saying. He wanted her to be professionally successful, but also didn't want to lose herself in a career that she never really wanted to begin with. Nate's flaw is that he didn't elaborate properly on those feelings and was not able to express himself that way that he could have.
Nick is the same age as Andy as far as we know. It’s an age where many relationships fail because young people are not yet sure about what they want, and they go through so many life changes.
Nate may feel deep down that he doesn’t want a partner who is too emotionally invested in their job, constantly exhausted, traveling, unavailable or back-and-forth about quitting every other day.
However, the challenge in sympathizing with Nick for me is that Andy’s job is TEMPORARY - that she is just going to check the box of being there for 1 year…
Nick was on board with that at first, so he seems entitled for changing his mind before the year expires.
It’d be one thing if 3, 4 years passed and Andy was always checked out and he felt they had too little in common anymore - but idk as a 30 year old, 1 tough year of a relationship is a piece of cake that he should’ve been able to handle.
Nate, not Nick. But I wholeheartedly agree with you.
Yeah, Nate as a personification of anti-hustle culture is fine, but as a person? It just seemed like he wanted his naturally gorgeous but "not like the other girls" girlfriend to not change - especially in a way that could make her more attractive to the opposite sex, and give her exposure to the wider world. I always saw jealousy in Nate's actions. The video said it: she was learning by doing, and trying something new. Exploration isn't some giant betrayal of your relationships. And nobody's talking about the misogyny of "becoming one of those runway girls"? Isn't the whole point that Andy came to appreciate what she once perceived as vapid? And yet, she *apologizes* for ALL of it in the end - while Nate apologizes for *nothing*. I hate that ending.
The movie seems to portray that Andy is loving her new life and self, but she is actually lost in it. When Nate call her out, we don't have enough evidence that she dislikes being fashion and lost her identity to assimilate the bad habits and culture from her work, but being proud of wear a clothe size is one tip of many that she was not necessarily growing, but changing into something not good, not herself.
Yesss
That’s actually a very interesting point. Could someone like Nate, subconsciously, be afraid for his “not like other girls” girlfriend to turn into someone he feels he’s beneath…?
Hmm. Never thought of that. That’s the beauty of think pieces. So many different views. Love it!
You’re also correct about Nate’s job as a chef. The movie portrays Nate as having all this down time, like being a chef (in freaking New York City!) is a simple clock in and out job. Ha! That’s also a cutthroat, competing, grueling career.
Better take than most of this video at the moment currently :(
I can't consider Nate as anti hustler. The guy was working towards sous chef position in NYC restaurant. That gig doesn't have stability of an accountant. It's as, if not more, intense as Andy's. I still believe that he wasnt THE villain but he was a jerk. And sometimes you need to go beyond "he's just flawed and human" and breakup with that person.
Can we please have a Cruel Intentions video of Kathryn Merteuil and The Last two videos of the elements from Avatar the last airbender.
I second that!
Colorblind
cruel intentions yes!!!
More buffy
I’d like to pick Kathryn’s brain a bit.
That was Aline Brosh McKenna's angle with this movie originally. She wanted to say something about work-life balance without taking potshots at the fashion industry like the book did, but felt Nate was right. I still feel that he's childish, and her friends were unsupportive, but I see this viewpoint.
I wholeheartedly agree on importance of work life balance but a partner should not weaponize it by sulking, whining and emotionally blackmailing with it
@@mediokritet Oh, we're definitely agreed on that one, too.
The book highlights an unhealthy work-life balance as well, and Andie's boyfriend in the book is completely different. I do love, though, how different adaptations/versions highlight different things in society that were key issues at the time, and each revisitation shifts what those key issues are.
Agreed, Nate and Andy's friends would work better as the good guys if they showed more understanding and concern, how the intense burnout and cut-throat hustle is badly affecting her well-being, maybe asking "are you okay?" and making her think about that, instead of childish mockery while happily taking benefits or whining about themselves in this temporary but crucial stepping stone in her life's aspirations. It's like she was expected to be support human for everyone else, being on their beck and call, not unlike Miranda's treatment of her, but with less benefit. No wonder she became charmed with her work, finally she got something in return of her time and efforts, because her support system was not very supportive!
I'm afraid her work-life balance message wasn't super well communicated
I could never get past that fact that it was only supposed to be a year, 1 year in hell and then she has an amazing foundation to build her journalism career on. If she had stayed that 1 year, she could have ended up writing a piece on her experience in runway and working under the creative director of Runway, which most likely would have been something good considering how popular Runway was and how infamous Miranda is. No one seemed to remember this was job was supposed to be rocket launcher for her career, if she stayed just a year. They said she could work anywhere she dreamed if she just worked under Miranda for a year, and yet everyone treated it like this was throwing away her dreams by working under Miranda.
Are we forgetting that she turned down new york times networking opprtunity for nate birthday? had she spoke to them she could have left runway way sooner or stayed and immediately networked to New York times and began journalism and publishing there. People who get ahead in that industry is NETWORKING. It's allll about who you know, who pulls what strings for you and who has good reference for you to show your stuff to the right people. it's not like manual labor work like Nate's where you 99% judged on yeaars of experience and regular requirements. You have to be your own resume and she failed at that when she turned down the chance.
@@60wwediva yeah but Nate got in the way of that. She would’ve never even had that networking opportunity if she hadn’t worked for Runway.
Exactly this. What did they expect? That she'd just have a lovely time and not be really challenged by the work? If a year had come and gone and Andy had fundamentally changed and was considering staying with Runway, *then* the friends can step in and say, "Whoa, take a step back and ask if this is really what you want to do. What happened to becoming a writer?" and then Andy could still have said, "You know, I thought I'd hate fashion, but I love it. I think there is a realistic possibility of becoming a collumnist for Runway, and that would be more fun and prestigious than what I thought I wanted before," and then they should have said, "If you're sure, go for it. You seem stressed and different but more fulfilled than you used to be." That would have been supportive and not held the friendship hostage to a version of Andy she no longer was.
@@QuesoCookies I would have loved that, her staying at Runway but not forgetting about her dream of becoming a writer.
One year in hell is bad enough! Working like that can lead into a burn out and that will keep you out of business for a while. Andy's father is conscerned too and says that and he can't be blamed to be immature. And just look how Andy treats her father turing his visit because she is so stressed out. She hits him with a car door after all and all because her Bos demands her to solve an impssoble task!
Not "the villain" but really a jerk, if he and Andi broke up in friendly terms since they wanted diferent things/were not compatible after all that would have been FINE , the problem was that Andi got back together with him.Being frustrated was understandable and "be supportive" doesn't mean not figthing for your relationship, BUT Nate 1)was a chef, he must have know how hard was the situation for Andi in a demanding job, 2) he knew Miranda was giving Andi a hard time at her job and the least she needed was her boyfriend giving her a hard time at home, he made the situation more stressing that it should have been, his (and Andi´s friends) lack of empathy really shine
Indeed, I second this argument! Chefs work unpredictable, long, gruelling hours, so Nate should have understood how hard it was for Andy to schedule time off work.
Also he sure was happy to enjoy the fruits of her work when it fit him, while demeaning her for changing into something he deemed unworthy
I don’t know… I get the feeling if Andy had gotten a journalist job (that has just as hard and crazy hours as the runway magazine) from the get go he’d be more understanding. Andy changed personality and values wise at runway and that’s why Nate broke up with her. She wasn’t who he fell in love with anymore so they broke up and that’s valid. I think if she had stayed at Runway he would’ve stayed broken up but because she eventually had the growth and maturity to see how the job at Runway was changing her into a bad person who was willing to be ruthless and horrible to get ahead (remember Emily?) Nick and Andy gave it another shot.
@@ayameisastar If he doesn't want his partner to grow and evolve, that's his problem. No one stays the same all their life nor should they.
@@silentsaturn7604 You're right, no one should ever stifles another person's growth but I didn't read that as what he's doing. He sees her making unhealthy choices and and tries to voice his objections. That's a valid reaction for someone to do when they see someone they love in an objectively abusive relationship (like Andy's relationship with Miranda). Remember, at no point is Andy actually happy at this job, just desperate and stressed out, and later ambitious (which is not the same as happy).
And what's worse, Andy starts to act badly too (to Emily). What would you do if the person you love is growing into what you believe is a bad person? What if you wake up one day and your partner is now so different, they in no way resemble the person you fell in love with. Nick says in the movie he doesn't recognize Andy anymore and that's the reason he gives for breaking up. Before marriage I think anyone can break up for any reason, but if your partner no longer has any of the characteristics you fell in love with in the first place, that's probably one of the most valid reasons I can think of for ending a relationship.
Andy goes from being a good person to a ruthless person who would screw over a colleague to get ahead. That has nothing to do with growth or evolution. Andy's growth happens when she shows the maturity and self awareness to realize how far she's strayed from the core values she once had and walks away from the unhealthy job/relationship with Miranda. After that, Nick seems really into her again, growth and all
It's almost like Nate is an actual human being with flaws and nuance, and not a one-dimensional trope. Seems to be a pattern in this masterpiece of a movie 🤔
Precisely 👌
Too bad he's an awful person and could have been written better. Nobody cares about Andy's friends or Nate. Andy and the _Runway_ employees are what people watch the movie for.
@@0deadx21 I feel this as well. The character's time on screen made him completely one-dimensional and that's how we have to critique it.
@@0deadx21 Exactly. If the movie were to rely entirely on Andy's personal acquaintances, it would probably be a Razzie champ.
@@0deadx21 I always liked Nate somehow because the fashon world is something I still don't get and he is cute. I watch the movie because of the actresses/actors, because I admire their skills. I don't like the plot. The movie is like a "Make over-movie" to me and I always hated them.
Nope, sorry, not buying it. You're saying that a chef in the early years of his career in the NYC restaurant scene is fundamentally against hustle culture? Line cooks (especially those low on the totem pole) work into the late hours of the night almost every night. They have horrific schedules, do physically draining work, and often have extremely demanding bosses/work environments. (The fact that we don't see much of this in the movie I think is more of an unrealistic oversight in the writing vs a writing choice to prove that he heroically managed to avoid this killer work schedule on principle) They kill themselves for their work because they love it and that's the career path they've chosen. Andy's chosen career path is journalism and it's mentioned countless times that this (ONE YEAR LONG) position is the key stepping stone to propel her career forward. The fact that he can't support that even temporarily, the fact that at the end scene in the café he reduces all of her work decisions to be based on a superficial desire for clothes, the fact that he's hurt by her missing his birthday instead of empathetic when as a chef he's no doubt missed events he wished he could go to, the fact that he says they don't "have anything in common anymore" because she's dressing the part for her job in fashion and putting her all into the work...It's all just STEEPED in misogyny and he is being a horrible partner. Him accidently (and mostly likely hypocritically) stumbling onto some valid criticism of hustle culture doesn't excuse his lack of support for her. And even if (and that's a big if) he truly was anti hustle culture and really did maintain the perfect work/life balance as a chef (suuure), then his criticism should have been targeted exclusively toward her work environment itself and offering empathy/concern for how hard it's been for her, not shaming her for doing what she had to do to survive in that culture. And to be clear, the things she's "had" to do were grunt work, hard tasks, long hours. She's never done anything objectively immoral at work. His reactions through the movie are 100% of the time judgement of her vs concern for her. It's easy to look into someone's situation and point out all the flaws and how they should be behaving in a perfect world. But it's completely unfair to put it on that person to single handedly change the culture from the bottom or leave on principle. People need to eat, need to advance their careers, and sometimes that means they have to do shit work for a shit boss at a shit company. Not everyone has the luxury to pass over work because they don't like the job. Miranda even threatened to essentially blackball her from the publishing industry if she didn't take Emily's spot on the Paris trip. And even if she hadn't threatened her, while it's sad that Emily missed out on something she was looking forward to, at that point Andy was just the better assistant and business doesn't care about your feelings. She SHOULD have taken that opportunity without hesitation. I'll say it again, she never does anything at her job that is morally questionable and Nate's stance that she does her job without any 'integrity" is completely baseless. Nate was just insecure about his girlfriend excelling at work, working in a traditionally feminine industry that took away his view of her as being "not like other girls", and their relationship not being the end all be all of her 20-something life. 100% fuck Nate.
You put it all into words. Best comment on here
YES
& I couldn’t agree more !!!
The best, all my thoughts exactly. I don't know why is Take trying to deconstruct Nate just for the heck of it all. He was a cry baby and sure as hell wasn't condemning hustle culture.
Its not really about what is the job, its is about HOW the people react and behave bc of said job, infact, the fact that nate works in a job that is exactly as demanding or even more shows the difference between characters.
While Nate stills can calls her, wait for her, still supports and pushes her up to works, Andy's cant, she cant call her or her friends or family, she cant arrived at time to plans with nate, or other friends, OR family.
Fuckin miranda even says to her "Oh you had a choise, and you choose" while they are in france.
If you really think that a person being mad and sad bc the soul-less work hours of a toxic industry is """the bad guy""" that shows that you might not understand how round and human characters works
I think the issue is calling anyone the “villain”. I notice this same issue when a relationships end in the real world: nothing is one sided. Nate could have been more supportive and Andy could have had better boundaries at work. That’s life, it’s messy.
The world evolves, the many route of life sprout. So there are many lifestyle, philosophy, and interest. But many people who even speak about justice and love to others Don't understand the situation and just insult others like it's nothing. 😮💨😮💨
Even Adrian Grenier didn't understand why the fans disliked Nate so much, but now states that Nate hadn't grown up, while Andy had, and simply wanted more out of life. He was unable to support her emotionally because he was still a fragile, wounded boy.
Honestly, it was two months: how much was he supposed to grow up?
@@tyrant-den884 Nate was watching his relationship fall apart mach speed. The dismissiveness of it's only a birthday, aka his feelings seems to be appropriate if It's a man's feelings being dismissed. Other way around he would be an uncaring boyfriend.
As a grown man, the only thing I think he was wrong about was getting mad about her missing his birthday. He was REALLY supportive of her, and he was worried about what was happening to her. Andy is NOT who she is at the climax of the movie...she's becoming a dark perversion of herself, and he saw it (and so did ALL of her friends). Miranda is a fun character, but you shouldn't turn yourself into someone like that to get ahead, unless what you do is really what you want your life to be.
Full disclosure: last year, my wife was stuck in a toxic work environment that was literally making her work 80-90 hour weeks most weeks. They had laid off a large portion of her peers, her boss had left, and she was basically running the entire branch of the company without having been compensated while also doing nearly all of the work. The kicker was that by doing all of this she was probably saving her firm close to 800k or more in salary...yet when they gave her a pay raise for her "new title", which still wasn't the same title her boss had had, the pay bump was about 2/3rds of her old boss's STARTING salary in his position, and then they immediately cut her pay back to it's initial base, and only hers. The entire time I was supportive and was the primary parent for everything (still am, this week nonwithstanding due to a client being an absolute POS and demanding immediate documents for what would be 4 weeks of work), but I was telling her she needed to look for another job because she was losing herself, and time with our child. Thankfully at the end of the year she finally listened to me (and several of her friends who told her that she was missing everything that made work worth doing), and found a better job.
Shoot, she had to do the same to ME this year earlier because this job has become more and more of what I said above. So in a month, I'm swapping employment for a far better job with better work-life balance. To be fair, it's not my immediate boss at fault, I rather like him; it's the way our clients have been taking advantage of the current environment to shaft us at every turn---I've had enough.
Yeah I saw that interview. He said he now understand why viewers get frustrated.
He was also praising Anne Hathaway for changing a scene's blocking because she felt the two characters weren't in the same for it (I can't remember what exactly but it's in the reunion interview.)
Was with you until the last sentence. He was in the right and already realized what is truly important in life. If only more people were happy with simple lives. The world would be a better place.
So basically everybody is a Bit a villan and people arent Just black or white
exactly!
Precisely, we're all varying shades of grey, and not straight up heroic or evil.
Yes yes! And every character brings some positive and negative characteristics, every character is right sometimes and wrong sometimes. I call that good character writing and performance.
Yeah though where is the good side of Nate? He just nags all the way through the film and is only nice, when Andy is the doting girlfriend. To me he is very one note.
It's not that he doesn't have a point, but it's the way he goes about pointing it. He isn't willing to grow with her, he is not willing to accept her new passions, yet he is willing to enjoy to fruits of her labor. He is also very petty, and is making it about him being right instead of what's best for Andy.
Basically, he is not a villain, just an unsupportive, petty, and demeaning partner
Exactly. I appreciate this video for giving an updated perspective of an issue that is not black and white, but some parts rely on the premise that nate knows what's best for Andy better than Andy herself, and that's how he behaves. He has the right to feel emotionally neglected in their relationship, but he is also condescending towards her job, the entire industry and incredibly unsuspportive, acting as if good journalism jobs are super easy to get, and like Andy can afford to just get fired over his birthday and waste a lot of work by getting a bad reference from miranda. Sure, she has a choice, technically, all of us theoretically have a choice to quit every time our jobs are shit, but at the end of the day, forging a career requires some hard compromises that are much easier with a partner who values you. And anyways, What if she changed her mind and doesn't want to work in journalism anymore or maybe she is now okay wirh working for an outlet like runaway/vogue? He was only willing to give her the minimum space for growth, within the idea that he had for her and his plan for them. People change their minds and then change it back, and neither nate nor the movie gave Andy that agency. In the end he was vindicated, although he was wrong to underestimate her job and treat her career like disposable trash. He is not evil or a villain, but they should have not gotten back together. She definitely should not have moved for him, further nailing the point that his job is more important. Plus, she wouldn't actually have offers from multiple places if it weren't for her hard work for miranda.
Not to mention he treated his own job like it didn't matter, and in the end, Andy was ready to move to boston because of his job, even though he wasn't willing to give her any support in the time she required it most for her career. The movie tells us very clearly that being committed to your job and asking your partner for the same, is only okay if you are nate or have a job he approves of.
@@tamarat9735
You put it best, she *technically* had a choice, but not really. He wasn't willing to bend towards her career the same we she does towards his.
I would even say you can have the capitalism conversation here. Andy has to bend towards her career goals, do things she wouldn't actually necessarily like, but manages to find joy in it. Nate, acts like a child who sees the world in black and white terms. As if her "giving in to the system" is really a choice in that world. Sure, she could also not choose to work in any job that isn't the idealistic view of how "real" journalism should be, but she will never develop an actual career that way. Some sacrifices have to be made to get there
Yes! What if she realized that was the job she wanted? Then he's just another unsupportive, judgemental POS
Exactly. She is an adult who made mistakes but grew,and he stayed childish throughout the whole film and got rewarded for it.
Okay so you've said it yourself: Andy's biggest flaw was not striking the balance (while experiencing growth, pressure and hostility from EVERYONE). While Nate's was not being able to communicate his emotions... in a serious relationship... WHEN time and again he still chose to express those emotions immaturely, irately or passive aggressively???? And he never apologises.
You can have all the good points in the world but if you talk at someone/raise your voice, assume the worst, or shut someone down when they're trying to make things up to you... That's not acceptable in any circumstance.
You also talk about food being an act of care for Nate that Andy rejects (again, due to verbal digs about her appearance) but Andy offers food in the form of a lit up cupcake and a heartfelt gesture and he rejects it. After he clearly stayed up to wait for her to get home
lol. damn, you really cant admit Andy isnt any better then him, can you?
@@claynorth964 Well, she experiences character growth throughout the movie, which he clearly does not. And you clearly failed to see that.
This is why I love this channel.
Looking at both sides of the argument; and accepting the pros and cons of each character archetype without being (too) judgmental.
Ya HARRY POTTER Cough.
@@theunitedcommonwealth715 Indeed. That one was _bad._ Like, almost jumping the shark bad.
@@theunitedcommonwealth715
Ok,if you didn’t mind be more specific, please.
I don’t really remember them too well.
@@owenmccord5078 They basically made Harry sound like a whiny no good ungrateful character and in the end mentioned that Hermione should be the protagonist of the series named 'HARRY POTTER' , only showing his bad moments from the movies without books cannon and ignoring the childhood abuse he suffered from Dursleys.
@@shreyadhoot7164 Fair enough
Hot Take: The kinds of women who idolize Miranda and ignore/excuse her abusive/toxic behavior are no different than the dudebros who worship Tyler Durden from Fight Club.
As someone who likes Miranda, I don't like her as a person, but I like Meryl as Miranda Priestley. I love her execution of the character, I love how she looks in this movie, the way she speaks, etc.
At the same time, despite being extremely demanding, I don't think Miranda's desires were unrealistic at all. The biggest thing was asking Andy for for the Harry Potter book, but again, Runway knows EVERYONE in publishing. She literally could have called JK Rowling's publisher and gotten that book immediately.
At the same time, almost all of her tasks are things that a secutary in a big high end company does everyday in the real world. I don't see anyone screaming that a secutary's job is demanding though
I can understand Andi making those choices. Just starting her career in a city where there is a LOT of competition for journalism jobs. The fact she settled for the Runway job after all the others fell through shows that situation. We're they the right choices? Not necessarily. But understandable.
It's normal to take less than ideal jobs on your way to the ideal one. People rarely land their dream role out of college.
i still think andy was right when she said "i didn't have a choice", i also think miranda didn't have another choice but betray Nigel, at least if she wanted to keep her job. This job (in andys case also limited to just 1 year!!!) requires complete commitment, which everyone who works there knew. Besides, It would have been childish and unprofessional to tell a person like miranda "oh i cant go to paris, because its emilys biggest dream and would mean the world to her", like? Do they really think miranda would care?
And the night Andy got late to Nates birthday, i think simon baker saying "stupid boyfriend" is more an insult with a wink so i understand that andy didn't jump to defend her boyfriend. Besides simon bakers character being douchy and annoying. Simon Baker even offered her to meet new york times people and andy turned it down because of her (in fact) stupid boyfriends birthday. I wouldnt have blamed andy if she stayed to meet these people, it actually could be a one time chance. And still, she comes home, nate is pissed af, and andy didnt even tell him what she just turned down to come home as early as possible.
In the end, when andy says she turned her back on her family and friends and asks herself for what she even did that. Nate says "haha you did it for clothes and makeup", as if we (the audience) didnt hear mirandas speech in the beginning about the significance of fashion. So in the end, it seems that andy blames herself for falling for a shallow superficial inflated world, but in reality, she actually learned how to really put an effort in a job and discovered the art and fun of fashion. Its sad she didnt realize that.
I dont think that andy is perfect or anything. But for nate, it's just a year, get your shit together.
Why don't people understand that it was one (bad) year for a potentially huge career advancement? Many people sacrifice multiple years (along with tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt) to potentially advance in their careers (or to establish one).
Exactly! it's also andys choice what she's willing to sacrifice to get her dreamjob, so if she sacrifices her "integrity", it should be accepted. I would lick a damn train station toilet for my dream job. Dont need a nate to tell me that this is undignified
Also I wanna say that this is why being selfish as a person can pay off big time professionally. For instance: Carrie Bradshaw from sex & the cityy would have NEVER turned the chance down to meet with publishers if it was aiden or big's birthday. She was (arrogantly and snotty albeit) secure and had a self esteem. She would have went to the new york times people then gave nate a "take it or leave it" later on.
@@60wwediva yes for sure! It‘s also pretty normal for us that male bosses are narcissists, but god forbid a woman takes herself and her career first.
What a Female community! Without nothing, They talk back and chew up like it is not a big thing. 😮 like the first secretary did. It is just a difference of lifestyle. Not a Right or Wrong! Female insists not to discriminate, Justice, But it is just arrogant and self-righteous
I used to love this movie. I bought it for the 10th anniversary and it gave me so much anxiety. I've never understood how everyone defends Miranda. She treats everyone so horribly.
Capitalism and hussle-worship can rot the brains of even the most liberal people.
@@mysteriiis I think the difference is actually having jobs between when it came out and the 10th anniversary.
@@mysteriiis it's pretty embarrassing how ppl were lauding miranda as an example of a strong independent woman or a feminist icon
Yes!!!! It is Miranda that makes it hard for me to watch! Finally someone that understand me.
@@curlychapina The amount of people that make excuses for her treating her employees like garbage drives me crazy.
His behavior really was inappropriate. Despite the culture, he was still *throwing shade at his girlfriend's accomplishments* because it was making him insecure
I disagree, he has his own thing going on, she told him to told warn her in the future
What a Female community! Without nothing, They talk back and chew up like it is not a big thing. 😮 like the first secretary did. It is just a difference of lifestyle. Not a Right or Wrong! Female insists not to discriminate, Justice, But it is just arrogant and self-righteous
The insecure is just what you thought you female..😮💨
Yeaaaah idk, I still can’t stand Nate. I hate hustle culture as much as the next guy, but at the end of the day, Andy was exploring an exciting new opportunity, and he should have been happy for his partner. He should get hustle culture as a chef, because if anything that workplace is just as hectic and has weird hours, too. I think it’s important in a relationship to allow space for your partner to explore themselves and grow, even if it means they aren’t a carbon copy of the person you met. It’s totally okay to voice concerns if you think they’re doing harm to themselves, but I think Nate started hating Andy’s job prematurely. It took nothing for him to start pouting, and his complaints are almost always self-centered. So from the outside, it seems like the second Andy was no longer exactly the way she was when he met her, he starts complaining. And to me, that cheapens whatever moral guidance he is supposed to be proffering to her. If he’s supposed to be her conscience, he should have been written to reflect on how her current path is detrimental to her mental health and her friendships, relationships other than him, etc. I’m not saying that Andy should have stayed in the fashion world, but I’m not convinced by the ticking clock the writers tried to have going throughout the movie. I don’t see a time limit to Andy figuring herself out, but Nate makes it feel like it’s some witch’s curse where if she doesn’t get her soul back by the next full moon, she’ll be trapped in the fashion world with Meryl Streep forever. But that’s just not the case, and it’s not generally how life works. Anyway, rant over. I didn’t realize I had so many feelings about this movie lmao
Exactly. What's also aggravating is that in almost every conversation it's always about her flaws and his wants. At no point did he ever stop to think "Maybe I shouldn't judge" or"Hey maybe this is her new dream". Career paths change. Sometimes you go into something thinking it's just a job,but then it becomes your career. There no shame in exploring.
There is however shame in throwing a hissy fit everytime your SO grows into their own.
Amen, well said.
@@chrissyr8387 I know right. It's a weird Hollywood thing, where every film/TV show makes it out, that whenever a character doesn't follow the path they chose when they were literally a kid, they're a sell out.
Sorry this isn’t meant to be argumentative, just a different take: I always read it as his concerns manifesting very quickly because her change from loathing the fashion industry to passion for it is so sudden from an outsider’s perspective. It would be very frustrating and disarming to hear a loved one entering a profession they’ve openly decried beforehand, start by hating it and complaining about it and then suddenly start to switch. It’s not holding someone back or stopping their personal growth to call out sudden changes in behaviour, especially if they seem unhealthy. It seems like a point of view issue where their respective viewpoints don’t overlap at all: Andi only sees Runway and Nate only sees her outside of it, so neither can see how the other perceives them. Nate is disarmed and guarded about her sudden willingness to work way too hard on a job she’s openly stated to dislike until now and she only sees him as the one dissenting voice trying to tempt her not to work hard whereas everyone else she sees in a day is equally subservient to Runway and browbeaten that they actively encourage her to continue in her passion for it. Imagine watching the film but only the scenes outside of Runway: Andi would seem to change very quickly and without warning. It’s no wonder they clash. Nate should adapt his reactions based on what he is saying to her, but I can see why he might not: it’s almost like seeing someone you love join a cult. She wasn’t excited for runway and initially it was not exciting for her, and not in a pay-your-dues-at-the-start way, she hated the whole atmosphere, the people, the job… Then the cult seduces the victim. The victim might profess newfound love for it but if it’s ‘not them’ and they’re behaving oddly wouldn’t you call them out on it? Then she doubles down and he remains stubborn and they clash. It’s totally Andi’s story of course, but I personally think Nate comes off okay: she sees him as being unsupportive so so does the audience, but from his perspective, she is running herself ragged for a job she does not like or want (until she very suddenly claims the opposite despite visibly still being stressed, overworked and under ridiculous pressure) and letting it take over her life and destroy her relationships with friends. It m if he seem selfish to word it as ‘why are you choosing runway over me?’ But what he is really I guess trying to ask is ‘how can a job you never wanted be more important than your relationship’? Which is a perfectly reasonable question I think, he should feel valued by his partner and vice versa. He also seems to feel responsible for maintaining her friendships with others, which she does not seem too concerned with worrying about. He doesn’t want her to lose other personal relationships over her job. Who wouldn’t act like him? He could’ve tried to be more understanding but realistically I think most people would act like him and double down on his negative feedback towards her to, as he sees it, make her see sense.
For me a problem in most movies is the timeline: Imagine the film depicting a whole year. The picture would be really different. But there are a lot of movies, especially book adaptations, that have a problem with setting up realistic timelines.
Nate was the villain to the extent that, as someone who was supposed to be one of the most supportive relationships in Andy's life, he was one of the least supportive. He never really offered constructive criticism/support, he just complained all the time and tried to make her feel bad for taking her job seriously.
If he truly cared about her he would have found better ways to talk to her about the personal compromises she may have been making for the sake of her job, instead of being a whiny teenager most of the time.
Exactly!
Yes!!!
Fair, but he's still right in that one shouldn't be consumed by their job. I think he also has the right to be upset when Andy missed his birthday in order to attend a work function. Could he have been more mature about it? Absolutely. But I think his position is valid.
maybe Nate didn't have the vocabulary to voice his opinions in a constructive way, maybe he needed a youtube video that tells him how he should've handled the situation.
@@jeremyboyd6136 Nate should’ve had a seat with Andy and talked to her like an adult. He never liked her job and was always trashing it. He lacked maturity and communication skills. Yea, her job was challenging and yes, missing his birthday was bad but all of that could’ve been handled with effective communication instead of him blurting out his frustrations in the middle of the street and breaking up with her in the moment. He was childish
Ok but taking a job miles away within a week or two after the breakup (Emily is still in the hospital so it can’t have been that long) after having an interview. Interviews usually don’t just happen and he was likely planning or entertaining ideas of leaving the city without talking to Andy. It comes across that he expects to be supported in all his career choices and for her to make sacrifices but couldn’t bother to offer the same to Andy. As a chef I’m sure he’s had to miss some important dates (hello holidays). Also he did like the lingerie and the general makeover, so he likes the transformation parts that please him which is selfish. He isn’t The villain but is he A villain to Andy’s story.
I think everyone treated Andy like sh*t. She probably should have dumped them all, except for her dad.
The problem is that employers don’t promote people who place work life balance bc they see it as not going above and beyond, my HR boss said this flat out for a state government company of 1300. She wasn’t the only one, so in this way you are forced given you need a job and this is so common.
Because this isn't real work life balance. She is young and single. Its totally different to say you have a 10 year old or elderly parent to care for vs you have a perfectly healthy self sufficient boyfriend.
Respectfully disagree. Currently the cultural pendulum has swung, and employers actually admire workers with good life balance. It shows skill and maturity. My star employee is a mother of three young children who is very confident about drawing boundaries and taking time off for kids' appointments when she needs to. But she is so stellar and superior that I don't mind. I would never push her to work extra hours that she isn't comfortable with because she can do amazing things with the 8 hours she does work. Yes, once in a while I think it would be nice if I could ask her to stay late for a particular meeting or project, but in the big picture she's more valuable to me than an even slightly less superior employee with more flexible hours.
@@FayeIL You didn't make any actual reference to a "cultural pendulum" swinging, you just pointed out your own workplace. That's not a cultural shift, that's just one single workplace.
@@FayeIL the key being she's getting the job done well. Work balance is appropriate when you are getting the job done and doing more is going beyond expectations. It's meant to actually be a balance not just saying you have a kid so you get to leave early and it certainly isn't meant to be used as a reason a millenial or Gen Z can think getting drunk and high or going to a long ski/lake house vacation several times a year is "balance" Part of growing up is putting your career and long term financial stability as a priority. It's not balance if you think you can have it all. If you are steller performer and your employer is being unreasonable asking you to work every weekend then you vote with your feet. The problem is with our hr happy culture it's virtually impossible for your boss to honestly tell you the white male with no kids is outperforming you by staying late and working weekends if you aren't doing the same. It is only relevant to keep your current position that you just do the job so telling you that opens the door to complaints. What people forget is getting promoted or getting a raise may require competition or showing you can handle the responsibility of a more demanding job. If you by comparison can't get the job done as well as the person doing more hours then you decide for yourself what balance is worth. This is why single parents have it so hard. But As a single woman w no kids I hate it when women with kids get away with murder bc hr is too worried if asking them if they could arrange a sitter should have been planned vs dumping thier work when it's not done as "balance". It's not fair people with kids dump thier work on singles who are putting their work first to get promotions. I'll gladly take on more work for me to earn a bonus or OT if offered but doing someone else's work bc they won't do it iwithout any recognitions of my work life balance isnt fair. Most bosses will recognize a good performer the ones who don't you vote with your feet.
Just bc Nate was right about hustle culture doesn’t mean he’s a good guy now. He was still super misogynistic and unsupportive and I dont get why he was surprised at people in their early 20s changing and developing new interests
This!
How was he misogynistic??
@@Sims4Thow was he not?
@@Sims4Tto clarify. I’m not saying he hates women. But a lot of the views he expressed were rooted in misogynistic stereotypes, and none of the characters are free from that, because our society is inherently misogynistic. Just because he loved Andy doesn’t mean he can’t say misogynistic things and be extremely condescending to her. It doesn’t make him an awful human being, but unfortunately, we don’t see him be anything but immature.
@@singundertherose Okay nothing you just said is an example of misogyny.
I will accept Nate as not being an antagonist if we can say that capitalism was the real villain.
Hustle culture is the true villain
Yes and professional narcissism (as shown by Miranda Priestly saying that Runway "would suffer for it" if she was forced out).
Yes
No
I think that's why this movie is such a interesting tragedy. The villain is the environment rather than any character being a villain.
This "Nate is the villain" discussion never made sense to me. Andy should have the ability to change her persona, goals, and priorities as she grows as a person. That said, Nate should also be able to challenge her choices if they leave him feeling alone, and he should have the ability to leave if his partner grows into a new person that he doesn't feel compatible with. Trying to pin one of them as a "villain" is because the relationship fell through is reductive and regressive. Not every breakup needs a "villain".
The real problem is that Andy chose a job she didn't want and chose to work in an environment that changed her identity to one that she didn't like, and she acted like she had no choice. At least her "toxic" boyfriend tells her the truth and wants what's best for her. Isn't that what a good boyfriend is about? yes, he wasn't perfect, but he was immature, not toxic. People love throwing around the word toxic too easily these days 😒
True.
I don't think he was immature at all.
He wanted what's best for him not her.
@ What do you call staying up all all night, just so you can make a dramatic exit the minute your partner comes home, cause she had to work on your birthday? That's so petty.
Spoken like someone who has no clue what it’s like to work a toxic job just to pay the bills. So glad I didn’t have Andi’s friends, it would’ve made things even more of a nightmare.
Finally someone said it, lol. When I watched the movie, if felt he is a bit annoying. But, I can understand his frustration. He expected a decent work life balance which Andy's new job was unable to provide. I don't think its wrong to want to spend some quality time with your partner everyday, especially on your birthday. Unfortunately, Andy was too preoccupied with Miranda and had little to no time to spend for her boyfriend. Once Andy updated her fashion sense and became a 'better' person, their interests became incompatible and the relationship inevitably ended in a break-up. It doesn't make either person bad.
Edit: However, i was definitely irked by Andy's unprofessional attitude. She always looked down upon the people in her office for being into fashion. And when she quit her job in Paris, it was an impulsive decision. Without a care of thought about her commitments to Miranda in Paris, she quit on the spot without a notice!. That's very unprofessional. She should have finished her job at Paris and then quit after they came to the US.
It does make him bad when he actively makes her feel guilty for outgrowing him. He attacks her integrity (WTF), pouts about her new clothes, and sulks like a toddler. I hate this Nate revisionism.
I agree with you Sibi. Andy is the one who gave up her integrity, sold her soul to the devil and turned into what she once made fun of. Nate simply called her out on that. Andy put a job, that was supposed to be temporary, above all of her relationships thus ending them. Andy is the true villain of the film.
@@rafaelcastillo3834 When exactly did she "give up her integrity"? Seriously. Name it. She sold her soul to the devil?? WTF. Did I miss the scenes of Andy slaughtering babies somewhere? The movie simply doesn't show her doing anything remotely close to what she's been accused of.
@@saltycrunch Losing weight for a job, when you aren't overweight at all, isn't compromising your integrity? Particularly when you do it by adopting normalized disordered eating and body shaming from your co-workers?
Did going from a size 6 to a 4 make Andi a better assistant?
No!
She's not a model. Looking a certain way isn't a part of her job description.
It's just a part of the toxic culture, which Andi laughed at in the beginning of the film.
People are apparently so brainwashed by hustle culture that they can't even see this.
I'm not saying Nate was a great catch, but I do not get why people defend Miranda and Runway!
@@rafaelcastillo3834 Andy grew up, Nate didn't.
I hate that the underlining theme of the film is that we have to sell ourselves, even if it’s only temporary, to make it.
That's why I don't like it.
@@sawanna508 I think it comes down to the idea that we shouldn't sell ourselves - that's part of Andy's journey. She makes her decision by the end that she is not a Miranda. But she has learned a couple of things without losing her core: the way she presents herself at her interview at the end is more assured, more clear. Her clothing style is much more relaxed than it was at Runway, neater than it was at the start, and she feels comfortable in it. It's still Andy, just polished. And there are other gains: she has kept Miranda's respect despite, or perhaps because of, her decision; and Emily has learned to appreciate the friend who will never be close but who has learned from her and who has given Emily the gift of tolerance for Emily's stress-filled abruptness.
A lot of people forget that this was an entire year (or almost) because of how nate reacted to her not coming to his birthday party. She probably has promised many times either to spend time or have plans together, but it always falls through. The sad part is we're not seeing his side.
Of course, communication. He might have talked to her and she might have brushed him off or not listened
I thought her friends were so mean to her.
I grew up around sarcasm, quick-wit, and dry humor. Andy's friend were normal people to me.
@@arkeshn729 Same
@@arkeshn729 They risked getting her fired, when they stole her phone and wanted to answer it. That's a bit worse than friendly banter. Not to mention that they have serious goes at her as well, not just some snide remarks.
No one is saying her job and Miranda weren't toxic, but all parties involved knew that going in. That doesn't absolve him for his crappy behaviour. All he had to do was support her for one year while she gained the necessary experience. It was literally just resume filler. Really good filler but filler nonetheless. All he had to do was no be a d*ck for a year and he couldn't manage that.
Exactly, it was only ever going to be temporary. They didn't even mention that in the video.
@@silentsaturn7604 It was a major plot point of the movie that you survive a year with Miranda and you can get hired at any newspaper in the country. Tolerate a year was all they needed to do.
@@silentsaturn7604 Yeah, super convenient to leave the most crucial detail out of the conversation, so that it makes it seem the video poster has a valid point.
@@silentsaturn7604 didn’t they have a guy who was always passed up at every turn? That was what made Andy wake-up and truly commit to the 1 year instead of more years (or else he is useless as a character)
Well it's not easy to watch someone you love losing herself and leading an unhealthy live.
I always felt uncomfortable with people labeling Nate as a villain. Sure, he was an ass during a few of his scenes, but his reactions for the most part always seemed understandable, even if they weren't the best ways of handling the situation. Nate and Andy were jerks to each other, and neither were emotionally mature about their relationship.
Yes!!!!! 100% with you
Nah, he’s the villain. You’re an adult and you’re treating your girlfriend like shit because she couldn’t make it on time to your birthday because of work even when she showed genuine remorse? That’s shitty.
@@Bloooo95 No, shitty is missing your boyfriends birthday party and expecting a sorry with zero changed belabor to fix anything. She was late constantly
I never understood all of The Nate Hate. Andie did neglect him and her friends. I think that the birthday scene showed that Nate knew that they were growing apart.
@@pleasedroses3811 The birthday scene is a pathetic childish tantrum, no more, no less.
I am starting the video, and i hope this doesn't turn a victim-blaming fest towards Andi, sometimes people can't afford to say "no" to their boss (unless in an imoral thing)
It was a victim blaming fest. 🤷🏻♀️ This and the Harry Potter video they made where they said Hermione should have been the star of the franchise based solely on the movies that are absolute trash and don't reflect at all the depth of the characters have been the only videos I've really disliked of them.
PS: I also dislike a lot how they completely forgot neurodivergence is more than just Asperger's.
Yes. Most unhealthy bosses are like "do the job or you're fired". Finding a job which matches your needs is very difficult. It's wrong to say Andi had a choice (especially when she was in the early stages of her career).
@@alejandraolvera5029 So, it is okay for a girlfriend or a wife to nag to their husbands about being home more but it is not okay for a boyfriend to do the same thing? Women are hypocrites.
@@lisah8438 I don't like both actions as the women who nag their husbands need to STFU cause all that they do they do for them and put the money on the table for them to afford all they have, but you missed the big point in what you said: both people complaining on both ends ARE NOBODIES. ost wives that complain like this are housewives with no career, no part or full time or anything to aspire to that keeps their anger, interests, and emotions in tact.
@@lisah8438 neither of them were home!! He is a chef in NYC for christ sake, meaning he has 100% done skipped out on her for a shift. I've worked as a kitchen porter and even I have cancelled plans, so imagine how silly I would be to drag someone for cancelling plans on me. Nate was silly
Someone can be the villain of someone else’s story and still not be an actual bad person. If a person is unhappy with their own career progression, jealous, and believes a person can only change how they want and they take that out on someone else, that’s toxic.
Nate rarely is shown listening to Andy. His response to her venting is ‘just quit’ with no empathy that she cannot just quit. His lack of respect towards her job is selfish and belittling, and as people have pointed out considering his job, leans heavily to the whole misogynistic undertones. It screams I’m good when we’re on the same level, but don’t jump ahead. I’m not emotionally mature enough to be supportive to someone else and their success’ vibes.
Andy didn't have respect towards the job either. for her it was just a job that pay the bills and she laughs at the situation when they select a belt and calling it 'stuff'.
@@raziel7148 did you miss the point of the belt scene and all her development after it?
That's what i love about this movie, the characters are not 8 or 80, they can be bad at times, good at others, like humans, we have to stop to look at movies and series in Disney eyes, not everybody is a mastermind villain or a super kind person... we're fucked up as hell!
@Cio Lake is a brazilian expression, i'm not talking about age. wtf??
@Cio Lake why would i say that lol, i'm laughing so much right now. i'm sorry too, i didn't know any english expression to this, that's why i put one that is often used on Brazil. english is not my first language
No. In the end Nate blames Andy for everything and she accepts total guilt. And that’s it. He didn’t grow at all and the film wants us to accept he didn’t do anything wrong. Just. No. I’m sorry but he was an immature jerk most of the time.
THANK YOU! I never thought Nate acted the best way, and he could have been more supportive and less accusatory, but people saying he was wrong to even be upset never sat right with me. Miranda's actions were way worse and downright abusive, but people just gloss over that and brand Nate as the villain. Anybody would be upset if they were in his place.
he's not a villain, but he does suck
I disagree with the general ethos of this analysis. This was Andy’s first real professional job and she went from not caring at all about it to giving it her all. She was able to learn about an entirely new industry that she started to like and get excited about and her job allowed her to utilize her intelligence and creativity. Nate was unsupportive, close minded, and dismissive not seeing the growth and change in Andy that’s obvious to anyone watching the movie. Yes, Miranda crossed boundaries that weren’t appropriate but I also completely understand Andy’s perspective of wanting to stick it out for a year and not tarnish her resume. This is a Great Recession millennial coming of age story and Andy had a better career trajectory than most. I think even if Andy hadn’t quit the magazine she would have established firmer boundaries in time. That said I do understand how dating Andy during a period of transition like this could have been frustrating. But it’s how dismissive and unsupportive her friends are that really hits today. Also I don’t think Miranda stepped on anyone, she found out she was about to be stepped on and defended herself. Her instinct isn’t to get ahead by stepping over people, it’s to utilize her talent, connections, and reputation which she acquired through passion and hard work. The Take has been oddly harsh on her character given it’s otherwise progressive lean.
If you want to view this movie in the lens of a toxic workplace/abusive employers, the way Andy's friends and boyfriend treat her can be viewed as victim blaming. Instead of asking why she can never seem to find any free time or why she seems so terrified of displeasing her boss, they attack her for not acting like the girl they knew 16 years ago - their words, not mine.
Also, it's very telling that when Lily confronts Andy, she starts off by saying,
"the Andy i know is madly in love with Nate." She's essentially tying her identity to her relationship which is never healthy, especially when that identity is being imposed on you by others. Ultimately, Andy's quest to escape Runway and get back to her "true self" seems to be the movie's way of discouraging personal growth.
Also the only person who is not a possible villain in this is Doug. Doug is a treasure of which we're not worthy.
I love this take
Every ambitious graduate is nervous and wants to do his/her best at his/her job.
Every professional and person who strives for excellence, wants to avoid mistakes.
That’s how the best inventions were invented, by avoiding mistakes. That’s how products, services and inventions are perfected.
I think I said this in another comment, but Andy's dad is a good example of a character who shows genuine concern for Andy's job in a way that actually looks out for her well-being rather than blaming her for the fact her job is toxic.
Looks like this is the first video I disagree with. I feel both Andy’s boyfriend and friends were awful to her. Now I don’t think they are worst than Miranda but they weren’t very supportive of her.
How do you support a friend to work at a job she always says she hates?
@@tyrant-den884 it's pretty easy when it's said from the jump that the job is only temporary. She just had to do her best for 1 year and she could get a job anywhere else where she could write. It would be one thing if this was her career of choice forever, but it's not. I feel like they could have been more supportive and understanding with it being only going for 1 year and she was quitting. Now if they were at the year mark and she was not making any plans to leave then have the conversation, but all this stuff happened over the course of the 1 year. She's paying her dues and networking with other people in the publishing community not to mention getting great work experience which was not on her resume before Miranda.
@@letrailhall-nance9189 but that's not what she was saying anymore. She was defending Miranda and Runway, not the "I just need to stick it out" "to the jobs that pay the bills" mentality her friends had just a few weeks before.
@@letrailhall-nance9189 Thank god at least someone has a sane take. I swear everyone commenting about how "consuming" Andy's temporary 1-year job was has probably never worked in a desirable, competitive industry.
@@saltycrunch maybe people are commenting bc that is not a good thing. If everything you care can come in second, third place, you are not a worker, you are a paid slave.
Why do people think Andy would stay at that Job longer that a year as multiple Times said
Because they forgot she was a journalism major.
Bc its not guaranteed that at the end of the year she'd be able to land a journalism job. The job was tangential but probably paid more than an entry level journalism job and given the trajectory of journalism is layoffs and crap like buzzfeed and huffpost no original writing she may like many people just stay in a job she gets good at and seems to be progressing in. Afterall after a year she is above Emily.
This is a bad take. The "villain" label is a simplistic one to begin with, but Nate IS a selfish asshole and a bad boyfriend. All Andy had to do was put in one year as Miranda's assistant before she would have any entry job in publishing open to her. Nate was a pouty 4-year-old (while having a busy stressful job himself), totally unsupportive. Her awful friends were similar. All of them act like Andy is out there committing war crimes. She doesn't do anything unethical (the movie does not sell her "betrayal" of Emily i.e. agreeing to go to Paris). She's a good assistant and maturing, something Nate desperately wants to stop. She's 22 for god's sake. Those are not the years to prioritize a worthless boyfriend over finding one's career, expanding one's horizons, and gaining new skills and experiences.
THIS! Why didn't the take mention for all this shit Nate should have asked Andy to marry him. They were chewing Andy out as if they are 45 and this is it. unless Nate had a ring and was ready to lock it down, she owes him nothing.
Don't be silly every time they were together Miranda would call even when Andy was with her dad.
@@Lola-qy9yt- So what? Demanding bosses exist. It was only for a year.
@@saltycrunch but she wasn’t just a demanding boss she was also a narcissist. She only cared about herself. In real life your relationships wouldn’t survive if your boss still has access to you in your personal life than your partner.
@@Lola-qy9yt Yet again... It was for one year. 12 months. After that Andy could quit and based on her experience with Miranda get a job at any other publication, as we are explicitly told in the film.
I don't always get why people seem to think a boyfriend character owes unconditional love.
Yet at the end he announces a move to Boston to be a sous chef. It would be interesting to see if he can maintain that work/life balance in his new role and new city.
The problem I STILL have with Nate (sorry) is that he only supports Andy when she is acting the way he wants her to act. He doesn't respect fashion nor the people interested in it, so when Andy starts caring about fashion and her job, he stars to disrespect her and her decisions.
He never really learns that Andy has changed her mind and now cares for her job, but it is not because she doesn't say it, but because he doesn't want to hear it, he makes fun of her for her new interests. I he had listened, maybe he could've give moral advices that weren't "quit your job".
Conclusion: Nate is a jerk, and I don't think their relationship would work at the end, because Andy changed, grew and learned a lot and Nate clearly didn't change or grew up a bit.
I am not his fan but I don't think he's the villain. I just felt he wasent very understanding, she had a demanding job that she needed as a stepping stone it's not easy to just quit when you need to pay bills and what not.
However he gets over hated. You can sympathize that he didn't like Miranda being demanding of andi and andi spending all her time pleasing her. There are two sides of his character
Yeah, that’s where Nate lovers lose me. If you had to do a shit job for a year, but after every door for what you want you really is opened, is it not worth it? It was stepping stone that would project her career in ways that just aren’t possible for most.
Nate is as much of a villan as Janis was a villan in mean girls. Both Nate and Miranda try to make Andy something she's not. While Miranda ofcourse is more extreme in her approach to bring out the Miranda she sees in Andy. Nate trys to stunt Andy's growth and wants her to be " old Andy" who is passive and willing to take the rude jabs he makes at her. Let's not forget before and after her transformation Nate is kind of a passive aggressive bully to Andy.
What I think makes Nate look like a worse villan than Miranda is that he never grows.He doesn't apologize for the mean way he treats Andy nor does he compromise anything in the relationship. Andy, now changed, has to deal with a relationship with a guy who is happy with her more serious journalist job and has no intention on addressing his obvious flaws
Unpopular opinion: I always liked Nate, and he was a pretty solid partner. "I don't care if you're pole-dancing, just pole-dance with integrity," is a solid point. Ambition is something that I believe should be used in moderation: what good are the perks of a solid career if I haven't got a pet, or a person to share it with? We need someone/something to spend our money on besides keeping ourselves alive.
I don't care if u were pole dancing. Coming fr om a man. Yeaaaah suuuure
Some people prefer a career over a relationship, that's their choice.
@@silentsaturn7604 That's a solid point. I hope my mentioning pets too was ok? Yes, our careers are important and I think not wanting a romantic relationship is perfectly valid. But, there is more to our lives than careers or relationships: what about hobbies, travel, academic pursuits/research, friendships? We all do things outside of work that make our jobs a means to fund our lives, not the purpose of our actual lives...If that makes sense?
Same with me.
I never understood the vitriol Nate would get like he wasn’t great, still have my qualms, but I thought he made some good points at times and honestly I can sympathise with his position on occasion. I always thought it was a bit more complicated than him being the villainous boyfriend. Maybe it’s a case of good intentions, poor execution
People who think Nate is the villain give me the ick
For me the worst moment was when Nate and the others stole Andy's phone making fun of her just because she was worried she could lose an important call from work. Helloooo she's telling you her boss is demanding, if you can't be supportive at least don't be a jerk
Anyone who saw Nate as the villain either 1. Has never worked in a toxic work environment or 2. IS the toxic person in our work environments. Nate actually loves and cares about Andy. Miranda would replace Andy instantly if anything happened to her. Nate would be an easy choice for anyone if this were real life.
Thanks to the lovely The Take Team for differentiated, balanced analyses of characters, stories and topics in general, especially when in the general discourse 'choosing your camp', being right/wrong and absolute 'truths' seems more important than looking at things with the nuance and patience for flawed characters great stories invite us to. More than one thing can be true, and I'm always relieved when The Take invites us to pause, take a step back and look at the whole picture. ❤
Well ... Basically, Andy has a hard time dealing with the egos of the people around her and Nigel is her only Fairy Godmother~
Poor girl, she is surrounded by people who think in their own way is the best and they feel like Andy must listen to them or people will say that she becomes a very bad person.
Except Nigel is toxic to her too!
If he's her Fairy Godmother, he's a dysfunctional one.
I remember when I watched that movie with my Mom when I was Young I Just couldnt See why they Just didnt Take a break for a year and Then have a good Life where she also Had her Dreams career
Some people don't have the privilege to quit their toxic jobs and start looking for a new one while they are unemployed... sometimes putting food on the table doesn't allow you to prioritize your wellbeing because you may a person under your responsibility
It’s taken people 15 years to realise this? I thought it was the literal point of the film…
FINALLY, SOMEONE SAID IT
What genuine boundary with Miranda? I don't think Miranda lets her employees have boundaries. She's famous for that.
Yeah, do we know of any employee there that had established boundaries with Miranda?
Okay hear me out but Nate was shit. We're not stupid, we understand the intentions behind the idea of his character but there are flaws in the development. You simply can't be self-righteous about someone else's decisions while simultaneously behaving the way Nate did and not expect to get called out on your hypocrisy. Andy's friends loved the gifts but continuously undermined her work. When Andy started realising there was more to Miranda and Runway, her bf and friends were not allowed to go on that discovery with her. This made them look like A**holes. Despite knowing the temporary nature of this job and the role it would play in her career, they almost sabotaged it with childish stunts. Even though Andy chose to walk away as originally intentioned, the way her circle handled that was not helpful. If you have decided that you need Miranda's recommendation then you stick it out for the year, make your little jokes and cut it out when she's legit struggling at an impossible job, not double down and add to her misery.
I don't understand why her friends are even considered villains. The only moment they were childish and kinda rude to her was when they were passing her phone around while Miranda was calling her. After that, her friends were always supportive throughout the movie. When Andy's friend called her out, it was because she was letting herself be kissed by Christian, and smiling about it, WHILE SHE WAS STILL WITH NATE. I thought her friend's reaction was perfectly appropriate.
Nah, still a villain in my book. Even the movie's mantra was that this gig is only for a year and that it wasn't permanent. He could support her and stick it up. And yeah, later it becomes obvious that Andy changed her attitude and started enjoying her job, redirecting her career, and what's so wrong about that? I redirected my career a few times, growing and changing and figuring out what I like. Andy deserved better than him.
Im glad you had a completely supportive partner throughout those years and still going strong, I hope.
Nah he's a jerk. Yes, he has a few good points. But he ultimately only supported her as long as she didn't like the job. Once she had been there a while and was starting to get good at it, make some work friends, find some interest in the industry, and dress in the way that was expected at her workplace, then he was out. He refused to respect her as long as she actually enjoyed the job. He wouldn't allow for her to grow and try new things.
i don't care what anyone says. NATE IS THE VILLIAN FOR NOT SUPPORTING HIS GIRLFRIEND'S DREAMS!
Yes! And criticizing and mocking her decisions and actions every step of the way!
When did her dream change from being a writer to working at runway?
Its also Just a year and Then she has her dream
@@drummstickydd93 It wasn't her dream at all, but she started to like it and she worked hard so she could get her actual desired job.
@@drummstickydd93 Working at Runway for a year would have led to other opportunities in Andy's dream industry. They reiterate this many times throughout the film. If Nate ACTUALLY cared about Andy's dreams, he would have toughed it out for a year instead of whining every step of the way about how preoccupied she was with her career, and also making fun of her choices.
I always felt Nate was truly concerned about Andie's surrendering to the fashion culture she previous loathed. He knew she was not being true to herself.
Why does being true to herself have to mean never expanding her interests and career goals? So Andy became interested in fashion and the fashion publishing world and worked in a busy job. He wasn't truly concerned about her newfound interests, he was (rightly) concerned about her outgrowing him.
@@saltycrunch She wasn't interested in fashion in the slightest. She was groomed and molded. Miranda took her on as a project. Nate saw right through it.
Bingo!
@@MustardSeedish You mean when he wasn't distracted by Andy's new found interest in langerie?
How do you know Andy wasn't interested in fashion? She had a very predjudice and juvenile opinion on the fashion industry without actually knowing anything about it and eventually learned that she was wrong. It's called growing and learning, that's never a bad thing, ever. Nate trying to stop Andy from doing that is what makes him toxic. He wants her to stay the moon to his sun and nothing else.
@@silentsaturn7604 One clue was the way she dressed in the beginning of the film and her words saying she never read Runway and didn't know who Miranda Priestly was. It was the actual thesis of the story.
I feel like we as millennials were enamoured by the glamour of the magazine. We would probably be able to see more clearly the toxicity of this work environment if it were something less pretty than fashion. But as Miranda says at the end: "Everyone wants to be us". Yeah, we as a generation totally drank the kool aid and now we grew up and just want peace of mind.
Millennial here, and I hated both Runway and Miranda.
@@curlychapina Same. I knew Miranda was evil the moment she belittles and degrade her employees. Because let's face it, Miranda isn't called the devil because she is just mean, but she tempts people to go against their morals and principles in order to please her own selfish wishes.
I am an old man now and have seen stories much like this played out many times over. They will not be getting back together. They were once the same, but things change, seasons change, people change. She is a career girl with ambition, and he is just a simple man with simple ambitions. They were not meant to be. It is better they part ways. He will end up happier without her. As for her, she will never be happy.
Thanks for this piece! I understand the point of the “Nate-villain” thesis, I do. But I always saw this movie as not so much a commentary on all working women, but specific to the cut-throat fashion/entertainment industry that will inevitable put strains on these workers personal lives. I never saw Nate’s criticisms as something that would occur in Andy were a working woman in general. He makes valid points that her specific job in that moment is a shit-show and that she should re-evaluate her options.
Whatever shit-show that job may be, it was due to be over after one goddamn year, and then Andy would quickly land the dream job she truly wanted. Is it too much to ask for Nate to be supportive of Andy for this pitifully small amount of time?
The worst thing about The Devil Wears Prada to me is still the fact that Anne Hathaway's character was called "fat".
@Skarbie Well oh god, that sounds awful
I saw the movie dozens of times, can't think of one good quality he had.
In the whole book the only good thing he did was that he ONCE brought food for Andy.
Arguing is great and all, but this one's really not for me as a die hard fan.
There is a difference between the college boyfriend growing in a different direction and "the true villain holding her back from a demeaning job in an industry she had no interest in."
@@tyrant-den884 I don't think Andy felt held back. She felt left.
@@yesboyjay so did he.
@@tyrant-den884 Well, yes. But he should've spoken up instead of being passive aggressive about it (like on his birthday).
I do understand where his feelings came from, but he acted very immature, like a child left in the supermarket.
@@yesboyjay truly the true villain.
It seems like Nate and the gang were trying to define Andy as their "friend" who lost herself and the people she loves in trade for success in the fashion industry. However, Andy got both the awareness and conscience intact. She cared and had valid reasons, but they couldn't support her at all. I'm glad she was alone in the end, Nate is not for her.
I've never agreed with all this "Nate bad boyfriend" hate because I'd always put myself in his place. If my boyfriend misses my birthday and changes into a totally different person I'd be really upset. I think most women and girls who hate Nate is because they wish they have Andy's opportunities and dream about that glamorous life she lived for a while (designers clothes, Paris and all that). I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice the time I spend with my partner for that
When I first saw the movie with my friends, they all hated him but I didn’t. It felt like the “what are you booing, I’m right” meme. He was worried that she was changing in a negative way. She eventually realized that he was right.
I want to point out that all these changes in Andy occured in two months.
That doesn't seem important to the Nate haters. In sixty days Andy went from a job that pays the bills to I'll see you when I see you. That would be jarring in any relationship.
I think that’s a movie problem in general: time. Nate does not consider that it’s just one year, the transition in just a few weeks is really hard. I think they put a storyline that would have worked in a whole year just into a few month. There are a lot of movies doing it because it is difficult to show time on a screen without lessening the tension.
To say that Andy had a choice when Miranda told her to basically do as she was told or she would become unemployable is pretty nearsighted. If a robber came to you and pointed a gun at you and said your money or your life, would you say you had a choice? In theory, yes, in both cases they're is a choice to be made, but it's not one you're actually making, you're *forced* into making and that's the difference. You can't judge people that make choices under duress as if they were acting out of their own free will.
Andy actually didn't have much of a choice if the only other option was potentially risking her entire career and future (which meant putting food on the table and having a roof to live under). In the end she chose to do it and face the possible consequences, which in her mind (and in reality) were very real as seen by the job interview scene where Miranda actually wrote them personally. Andy was mentally prepared for the worse and thanks to her determination through her stay at Runway, she managed to touch Miranda.
Miranda Priestly and Andera herself, are the true villains. Because at several points in the movie, Andera and Emily could turn her into the B.B.B, for not following workplace laws, taking advantage of her staff, etc., even the stylist/photo developer could turn Miranda in for falsely promising a career in defrauding contracts to steal his money, family jewels, & gems, etc.
I usually agree with your take,but not this time. In a supporting relationship you think long term. Andy wanted to do this for a year. If you serious about your partner, you acknowledge that she/he has other responsibilities, interest and plans. Andy thought it's a good decision to take this job before she goes back to her original plan. Nate should have sacrifice 1 year, not more. He was very selfish and treated Andy poorly and it was a bad choice from her side to go back to him. He clearly holds her back and thinks Andy top priority should be him and nothing else.
I never saw Nate as a villain, rather a someone who says the right stuff but in the wrong, quite harsh way.
Actually I see Nigel as more of a villain because of his comments about Andy’s weight throughout the film....because when she comes to him as he said to “whine” he basically tells her to get on with toxic work place and plants the seed in her head that she needs to get a makeover to fit in and be accepted. I never felt sorry for him when Miranda “screwed” him over because in all honesty he was only ever accepted by her for pleasing her and get the job done as she wanted to, but I doubt she ever really respected him because he had no real character, he never stood up to her. Remember how he whines to Andy that he will finally be able to come to Paris and see it or take control of his life? It shows he was just a loyal follower to Miranda, who secretly wished for more and wanted more, but never had the balls to actually do what he wants. That is why when he thinks a time will come and Miranda will pay him back, Andy is highly doubtful. Nigel and Emily are so similar in every aspect which is why Miranda could do what she did to them, because she knows they are loyal no matter what. They have no opinion or self-respect, unlike Andy.
I do agree with most of what you said, however I do think nigel's speech about Andy whining was right. Andy was disrespectful to the people working there and did not work hard enough to earn her respect from miranda. He was right about that and put her in her place. If she wanted to do well, she had to change to fit in- and it was her choice, since he told her that she could quit and leave it for someone who actually wants it. Yes, him and Emily were schmoozes to miranda, however, unlike Andy, they were passionate about fashion. This was the career that they wanted and they dedicated their lives to it. The real problem was that Andy chose a job that she did not want to do and felt like she had no choice, but she did have a choice, she always did.
Trust me there are a lot of people who internalized the toxicity of the workplace, even their own lunchtimes all because "they need you"
@@joycezale5433 I completely get your point, when I was younger and just starting out in the workplace, I would totally get along with Nigel and follow his advice. Now I see that he could have used different words to stimulate and support her because first of all, I can not agree that Andy disrespected anyone, she was getting the downright bad treatment although her only major fault was that she did not look glamourous. Yes, Nigel understood better the effect and the passion he and several others shared unlike Andy for fashion. Andy wasn't dumb and wanted to do things better, but she also received very little support from her workplace.
@@jessicavictoriacarrillo7254 oh trust, I know. Thanks to COVID and taking a year of work made me realize what a slave I was to the my workplace without even trully realizing how I was ruining my self-esteem and eating habits.
@@joycezale5433 Andy was already working her ass of at that point! Trying to solve impossible tasks while neglecting her father.
Yeah, Nate had his issues to, but honestly, all the people who justify how toxic Miranda was as a boss and the sick enviroment on Runaway just for the pretty clothes and the travel to Paris... that's NOT goot either.
I see the point, however, how many women behave like Nate in the screen and we don't even consider "oh, she might have a point"
This
Men consumed with work tend to end up raising the pool boy or neighbors kid
The Take recently did a video of the women that behave like Nate
@@melodyclark1944 Oh thanks, I'll make sure to check it out
@@arkeshn729 So do the women
I just saw this movie for the first time in full detail. I gotta say the "we have nothing on common" scene made me so infuriated.
y'all taking the "the villain" way too literal, we say he's the villain bc he sucks
He gets a job as a sous-chef at the end of the movie, so he’s going to have a demanding boss,crazy schedule, and work long hours just like Andy
"I didn't have a choice."
- good ol' defense of every soldier on the 'wrong side' of a conflict who is just 'following orders'. 🤷♀️
Educate yourself the Milgram’s obedience study and Stanford prison study, or go to move to mainland China to be the “moral” one and get you all your family prisoned and tortured by CCP before making accusations about other people’s moral failing.
@@rww5416 when you start with 'educate yourself' you've already lost the plot. What makes you think I haven't? Nothing I said remotely points to the fact that that which you mention is foreign to me.
@@dvdv8197 If you educated yourself like you said you would never say it’s a good old defense. It’s funny how when others are calling people out for their own ignorance, it’s always “you lost the plot”.
@@dvdv8197 nothing you said is remotely difficult or confusing, stop calling people lost the plot when it’s clear that they didn’t
@@rww5416 it's funny how you couldn't resist the urge to respond not once, but twice. Seems like you lost the plot there. 🤷♀️
Very happy that at least someone is willing to look deep enough. Nate was right all along. Andrea lost her friends and her boyfriend, for an abusive job that she never wanted. Andrea hated her job, she was a very nice and smart type of girl, not a toxic backstabber. That why Christian Thompson told her from the start "You won't survive Miranda. You're nice, smart'."
Through the whole movie Andrea says "I didn't have a choice" to convince herself that she did nothing wrong. However when Miranda herself objects Andrea's pathetic excuse, then Andrea comprehends that Nate was right all along and she is going to become the new Miranda if she doesn't quit.
Nate did absolutely nothing wrong. As a matter of fact, breaking up with her was the 2nd most masculine thing he has done. Offering them to get back together was the 1st.
I already disagree lol but imma watch it anyways.
Edit: At this point, Emily was probably the only non toxic person in this film lol! She was upfront about the workplace, Miranda, the industry, and let Andy know that they weren’t friends without actually saying it lol!
As for Nathan: Now that I’ve watched the video, I can see where he was concerned that she was losing her self respect and core values. However, he was very immature and went about trying to talk to her about it all wrong.
@@danielasilva8765 Absolutely! Emily was a good coworker and did help Andy with learning the ropes. It was definitely a great professional relationship and hopefully Andy took some of Emily’s “this is how it’s done” attitude with her when she has a coworker that may not know the ropes quite yet. Of course not as neurotic as Emily but yeah lol!
I think Emily had plenty of toxicity?
She was just as devoted to the overwhelming hustle culture at runway as anyone.
Plus It's rude to laugh at someone's lack of fashion sense like a high school mean girl?
@@lydiafayre9806 Oh please it was a high fashion publication in a high fashion industry Andy was working at and she didn’t take it seriously when she first started and knew NOTHING about the job she was applying for. Do you not remember when she laughed at the two belts that looked the same to her which resulted in Miranda reading her for filth eloquently? Andy was laughing at everyone’s fashion forward mentality so I guess that makes her a mean girl too? She thought she was better than everyone at the start of the film.
@@87alsjth I do think there's a lot to critique about Andy's dismissiveness of fashion and people who are invested in it (Which fortunately the film drew attention to). I do think there's a smugness to it that could be labelled mean, or at least inconsiderate.
I don't think that this recognition does anything to mitigate the rudeness I'm accusing Emily of, though.
@@lydiafayre9806 In my opinion Emily wasn’t rude. She was real by questioning Andy on why she was there in the first place with how she dressed and not knowing about the industry. You just cannot waltz into an industry like that not looking sharp; that’s just facts. The fashion industry is cut throat and cold at times so you better at least look like you belong there if you don’t know much about it yet. Again, facts of that industry; it is what it is. Along with looking sharp you better sharpen your ability to take criticism, orders, having open availability and all that. EVERYONE was like 🙄👀🤨 with Andy at first so…