Why was the Georgia shooter’s dad charged?
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- Опубликовано: 17 сен 2024
- A 14-year-old boy shot and killed two students and two teachers at Apalachee High School in Winder, Georgia. The next day, the Georgia Bureau of Investigation announced that Colin Gray, the boy's father, had been charged with two counts of second-degree murder and several other felonies. #criminaljustice #law #legal #crime #crimestory
How can you charge someone with harming a child while ALSO saying that the child is legally an adult? Pick one
They are not saying he is legally an adult, they are charging him as an adult. That is different.
I think they want people to be afraid of owning a gun in case someone they know end up using it.
Or... maybe they expect people to be responsible when giving their children deadly weapons? Especially when their children are emotionally disturbed?
in a country where there are more guns than people… 😂
What is the problem here
The dad has to take responsibility for giving a child he was aware was mentally unstable access to that weapon
@@fuxkag3908the father should be charged with something. But not murder. The dude literally didn’t kill anyone. Regardless of how we feel about this, or the guy… this is a major perversion of the law.
Or… you know, buy a safe.
If you can charge a father with the crimes of his son, you can charge descendants with the crimes of their ancestors.
Not the same. That father procured a weapon and gave it to his son knowing said sons proclivity to harm people.
@@Whoishere2333
This sucks people cant realize that
If hes guilty of anything its endangerment
@@Whoishere2333false .. your comment showed you did not watch the video
Maybe watch before commenting
@fuxkag3908 FBI found sone never did the threat .. so the comment you replied to is false
@@darunealbane I am not incorrect considering the father himself said in an interview he gave his son the weapon so the son can cope with his issues
Sounds like the FBI should be charged since they investigated.
@@Quinu12 the ignorance of that statement makes me weep for the American education system. Think of it like this. If you see one person give another person a gun. Then the person with the gun goes and kills someone. They are both guilty. Are you guilty because you didn’t stop it?? Of course not.
Charged for what
The dad apparently said in a interview he gave his son the weapon so his son could cope with his mental health issues
The father is very much responsible
The FBI didint put the weapon in the kids hands
For what
The father gave his son who he was aware was mentally unstable the weapon
The father is most definetly responsible
if the logic is the dad should get charged because he didn’t do anything about the murder so should the FBI who have had the kid in their radar and did nothing about it when the kid showed signs of committing a shooting
The FBI didn’t give him the rifle
@@jjd-lx5vr the fbi saw what he wanted to do with the rifle though 😭😭
@@sebastian_the_fool3726 but they didn’t provide it, that’s the key. Also the idea that law enforcement is criminally liable for crimes they fail to prevent is preposterous.
@sebastian_the_fool3726 the fbi found the kid made no such threats
@@darunealbaneokay to be clear to be clear according to the CBS source that they cited along with the CNN source what they directly said was there is not enough evidence to make an arrest not that they're was no evidence and as such the father has a certain level of culpability because the FBI had already investigated told him about this and he still bought his son a ar 15 style rifle
Earlier this year the mom of one of these $hooters was convicted for manslaughter because of what her son did.
Which is fascist
No, the mother was accused of negligence and manslaughter, it was shown that she knew that her son suffered from psychosis and suicidal thoughts, the school had warned her, and she gave him the gun with which she caused the shooting.
If we're talking about the case in Michigan, the mom there absolutely deserved the charges.
@zigzag321go I agree. Both parents were at the school the day of the shooting and refused to take him to get help.
@@Ignapur
This
Time to hold prosecutors accountable then. Life in prison for misuse of their authority sets a good example in think.
Well who prosecutes the prosecutor?
@@adamcahoon6362The people
@@simeon2bheard I like that answer
Responsible for what upholding the law
He is guilty of depraved indifference murder for giving a child he was aware was mentally unstable the weapon
seems this is there way of attacking gun owners shameful and seems illegal !
So if the FBI investigated him last year shouldn't they be charged for not stopping this shooting since they should be held to the same standard as the shooters father?
No, the guilty act on the part of the father was providing him the rifle. The FBI didn’t do that. The dad is guilty of depraved indifference murder because he “engaged in conduct that created a grave risk of death and was aware of and consciously disregarded that risk.” That is the legal definition right there.
@@jjd-lx5vrthis
@@jjd-lx5vrthe fbi found the kid made no such threat
Maybe watch the video
@@jjd-lx5vrthe fbi warned the father of what he had been planning beforehand. It’s def his fault for not heeding that warning and buying his son a gun anyways
The father should be charged with something. But not murder. The fact that we charge people with crimes they didn’t commit is insane.
Unless he was intentionally giving his son a weapon and saying "go shoot up a school son" I don't see an issue. I was born in 1994 and had access to guns all my life. If I take the gun and do bad things that doesn't make my parents liable
@@billybuchanan385 His son made threats about killing people and was investigated by the FBI, and even after that, his father BOUGHT HIM a gun. Thats irresponsible. He deserves to be punished. Had his father not bought him a gun after having a credible risk identified, those people would still be alive. Shame on you.
@@djbreal87the FBI told him his son didn't do that did U not watch the video 😂😂😂😂
@@djbreal87He made them in a discord chat. Did the father have access to that discord shop? Also who has their parents on discord?
Unless the kid was either told by the parents to go shoot up a school or the kid made it clear or had hinted that they would like to commit violence using a gun then how are the parents responsible? The parents can't predict the future. While it is true that they should be on the safe side if the kid legally was allowed to own the gun and the parents had no reasonable way of knowing that the kid would or might shoot up a school then how are they guilty of anything?
If he’s charged as an adult, how is the father at all responsible? The kid is apparently an adult and responsible for his own actions.
You literally don’t understand how the court system works do you?
@@f-86zoomer37lol. I do, but if you don’t see the complete lack of logic in a situation where a child is charged as an adult, but the father is also charged for providing a child access to firearms, then you’re incompetent.
@@donaldham308 it doesn’t matter though. Charging as adult/minor doesn’t mean what you think it means outside the legal world. We want the shooter going to prison for a long time. He has to be charged as an adult for that. That’s just how our courts work, so you literally just proved you don’t understand anything.
@@f-86zoomer37 probably dumb question but why does the definition in the legal world not line up with the outside the legal world? are laws just not being updated so the definitions match or something?
This country is doomed.
So if the dad is charged with these crimes simply because he gave the rifle to his child, does this set precedent for the dad to sue the gun shop for selling him the rifle? Should the gun shop owner be in court too? Maybe we’ll charge the manufacturer next?
(Sarcasm, for those who don’t realize. It’s ridiculous charging one person for the crimes another person committed)
But sadly, i think people will let this injustice stand. Nobody is ever going to stand up and take action against these tyrants. We will complain online ineffectually until all rights are eroded.
To be proper the 14 years old that still a child should be prosecuted as a child .. and the father should be prosecuted for his negligence as a parent
This is literally the definition of the phrase you didn't shoot but you gave him a loaded gun
Federal law still says a straw purchase is a crime. Whether or not Georgia thinks it’s illegal to gift your child a gun or not the federal courts say it’s a felony.
No, that is not what the law says, it is only a straw purchase if you are KNOWINGLY trying to buy a firearm for a felon, buying a gun with the express purpose of gifting it to someone who is not a felon is 100% legal, do literally two seconds of research
@@cjbrags1344 oh dear. Accusing others of not doing the research you haven’t done yourself. Let me know when you get your law degree. ATF Form 4473 section B 21a: “Are you the actual transferee/buyer of all of the firearm(s) listed on this form and any continuation sheet(s) (ATF Form 5300.9A)?
**Warning: You are not the actual transferee/buyer if you are acquiring any of the firearm(s) on behalf of another person. If you are not the actual transferee/buyer, the licensee cannot transfer any of the firearm(s) to you.** Exception: If you are only picking up a repaired firearm(s) for another person, you are not required to answer 21.a. and may proceed to question 21.b.”
This is double jeopardy. If the shooter is being charged as an adult, they are the responsible party. It's not the dad who failed, it's society as a whole.
That’s not what double jeopardy is.
DJ is being tried twice for the same crime. It is being charged again after being acquitted. One can be charged for the same crime in both state and federal which is not double jeopardy.
@@Spacemans2023 I would call it a variation of double jeopardy. Afaic, there isn't a better phrase for it. Since the kid is already being charged as an adult, an adult is already present to face the consequences. It's not illegal for children to own long guns or shotguns, just pistols.
Oh please. If you give a child a gun, you have enabled him to kill. People like you allow bad things to happen by doing nothing about it
@dieselphiend
Not illegal (even though it should) but many would argue he is guilty of endangerment or depraved indifference
the kid cant buy a gun its on the parents to make it safe and not put guns in the hands of mentally ill people the kids doesnt even know if hes a boy or a girl. both should be charged.
Or maybe the kid was deranged, the parents were told the kid needs help, and then the dad got the kid a gun to open fire on everyone else.
Not guilty. He has a second amendment right to have firearms,and how could he have known? Cops get their cop car stolen occasionally,should we charge the police officers with allowing the crime to happen? I’m not so sure we should! Just like I’m not so sure this guy should be charged.
His dad signed an affidavit saying that his son had no access to any firearms which was not true
You should mention how the mother tried warning the school and authorities about her son hours beforehand and they failed to respond.
Another FBI fail
I love how they can just randomly decide a 14 year old is an adult. Never seems to work when a 14 year old tells a store clerk they identify as an adult when trying to buy tobacco or alcohol.
The father gave his unstable son a gun. So yes he is responsible even if his son tried as an adult. This is basically the same as the negligence of the Crumbley parents led to charges and conviction against them.
The lesson here is stop being irresponsible asshole parents.
If the kid had access to a weapon he couldn't obtain himself, the father failed to follow basic gun safety protocol. Shooting aside, all parents are responsible for the children's actions. If a 12 year old breaks into a house or car and is caught, does that kid have assests? Can that child be sued? No. The parents bear the expense and cost. In this case, the father provided access to a weapon that cost the lives of 4 people. The father gave it to his son as a method of helping him cope with his issues (the father said that when interviewed), so there lies the fault. If he flipped his son the keys to his truck and the kid ran 4 people over, dad would be charged too.
Additional edit: The case worker from the FBI who oversaw this should bear some degree of responsibility as well.
Ok, fascist 😂 in a free country you don't charge people for crimes they don't commit.
In Georgia there is no age restriction on rifle possession. Do some research before you open your mouth bro
@markleeben In Georgia the legal age to purchase a long gun is 18 and 21 for a handgun. Do your own research "bro". Peak irony.
@@JannyPwns Learn to read, smoothbrain.
@@markleeben nice edit. ^----- (your acknowledgment of failure) smooth brain. You're a clown. Get rekt.
The son shouldn’t suffer the sins of the father. It hardly seems, fair, moral, or ethical to hold the father responsible for the son’s sins. Should there be accountability? Absolutely, but throwing the book at this man is hardly appropriate either
He is sure as hell responsible for giving his son access to the weapon (so endangerment?) especially if he was aware of this possibility
Think about it the kid is charged with felony murder. That’s when during the commission of a crime someone dies. So in some cases people have been charged with felony murder for what cops have done. Like a cop kills your accomplice and you end up charged with felony murder.
I guess in this case the kid was charged because he was illegally bringing a gun to school and his father murdered 4 people???
This is absolutely insane and a tragedy for basic accountability!!!
Oakland County, Michigan did similar after the Oxford school shooting. The county argued that both parents neglected his mental health. If Georgia can say the dad knew about the mental health issues of his son when he gave him the gun, prosecutors can charge the dad
Scary time in our lives when a parent can be charged for the things their kid does.
Whats next in the sequence? What if dad didnt have guns, and the shooter stole the weapon. Can we charge the store owner with murder for not keeping the shop secure enough?
Does dad go to prison for murder because he didnt do enough to keep the kid from sneaking out to steal a gun? Where does it end?
He can be held accountable for giving his son access to it in the first place preety much endangerment or depraved indifference especially if he was aware this was most likley a possibility
And 2. If the weapon was stolen the owner won't take responsibilit although they should sure as hell should store it properly to prevent that
Pretty sure a teenager cannot buy an assault rifle. If the father gave his son a rifle he wasn't allowed to have, then he contributed to the massacre and should be charged. Same with 6 year olds shooting their sibling playing around with daddy's gun that he left laying around.
They can't buy it but I don't think there's a law that they can't have one. Regardless it probably depends on the state I know fed law is no pistols period for
Okay, I agree he is considered an associate of said crime to some extent, but there 3 take away things to note.
1 - Based on this video, I haven’t looked farther into this, if the father had a gun in a open area ie a closet or living room, but he never gave it into the kids possession, then he not at fault.
2 - Unless there’s more evidence that’s constantly there and not this one off idea, there is no history of mental illness.
3 - He, the father, never pulled the trigger.
At the prosecutors logic everyone is guilty of murder because, we all are mind readers and fell to warn people again even though there’s no history of the kid struggling.
There’s a difference when your kid Ethan Crumbley had a gun that you gave into his possession and was trying to reaching out for mental help CONSTANTLY, and surprise he commit a school shooting.
@@10Wk3y84R Must be 21 to purchase a pistol but only 18 to possess/transport a pistol in many states.
You are aware that the laws regarding ownership and purchasing of a fire-arm are completely different, right? Ah who am I kidding.. Of course you don't.
First, it was not an assault rifle. Second, in Georgia there is no age restriction on rifle purchases. Know your facts before you talk shit
Why is anyone defending these monsters
The dad is very much reaponsible for giving his son who he was aware was mentally unstable access to the weapon
We’ll see what the courts decide. I hope father and son go away for life.
And theres the 5,697, 395th reason not to have kids today. If a parent can be held responsible for everything there kids do dear god why would anyone have kids.
Wonder if they'll apply it to other laws/crimes.
confiscate all weapons of war
Why is the public school which made the boy crazy, not guilty? Seriously, you don't see a lot of shootings at Montessori schools. It's just government schools, kind of like government "going postal" offices. Maybe something else is going on.
Well that's fucked, the father did shoot up any one. I can see a negligence charge because of a failure to prevent his son from acting out but that still shouldn't be a jail sentence.
Even then you shouldn't charge the father for the crimes of the son.
He should be charges for depraved indifference for giving a kid he was aware was mentally unstable a gun
Legislating by judges hate it
Guilty until proving innocent..
Getting nitpicky, but your last sentiment about charging based on laws that exist is a bad take.
Common law is the general idea that a law doesn’t have to exist in order for justice to be served.
I understand the sentiment about putting guardrails on government but courts evaluating non statutory law is pivotal in ensuring liberty in a free society.
I cant get on board with charging someone as an adult and ain the same breathe not holding them accountable specifically for their own concious actions
Parents are certainly not responsible for the acts of their adult children. And for minir children, unless the parents are given carte blanche on how to raise and discipline their children and unless the children are legally deemed as property, then the parents are also not culpable. One simply cannot separate responsibility and authority.
Cant see the murder charge sticking. It would set legal precedent that would be used in nefarious ways. Do you really think the dad was rooting for his kid to murder ppl on the first day of high school? is he culpable? Yes of course, whatever neglect of care or something? Sure the dad should face consequences. But trying him for second degree murder is more of a statement than something they’re actually gonna achieve. Though he definitely should be charged with lesser crimes
They are changing with the maximum they can. It is more likely that they are hoping he will take a plea deal for reduced charges.
I believe that he was negligent. He was in denial about how much of a threat his son actually was. His son had a history of making threats, and he knew it. I feel no pity for him.
lawyers are sickening. my ex was a escort and she told me alot of her "clients" were lawyers smoking meth and saying wild power tripping shit
What is the problem here
The father gave his son a weapon (and if I recall was aware this could happen)
He should take some responsibility
Maybe teach your children and teach them accountability or you and them will learn it from the tyrannical government 😂😂😂
Is the kid doesnt get life or death sentence then this systems completely colapsed
It is impossible to follow the exact letter of the law for every case, which is why jury's exist and why judges don't always give the same sentence to two people accused of the same crime. Edge cases happen where unique circumstances unfortold by the law that if you follow the law exactly would be completely legal even if it is clearly wrong. In this case, if the father knew his son wasn't in the right mental state, by giving him a gun he knew he had the potential to do crime with, he just aided and abetted those murders, regardless of the kid being tried as an adult. That's not to mention that someone being tried as an adult doesn't mean the parent weren't responsible, it just means the court will ignore usual preceding in similar cases where minors were tried, and will still use precedents set from adult cases. All in all this videos kinda misleading
Great video, but you were holding that mic way too far away. Try holding it a few millimeters away from your lips next time.
that’s why we have lawyers for both parties, the alleged perpetrator, and then the alleged victim. both the lawyers determine what precisely is happening with the laws and the particular case in front of them. If you guys actually read some of the laws in our judicial system, you’ll be surprised to learn how unbelievably vague they are their crazy vague or they’re so hyper specific that you’re actual crime doesn’t even fit into it, and therefore you can have the case dismissed or reduced or something of that nature. You can be charged for something, but it can be dropped or dismissed because the law doesn’t comfortably fit into what you did. the judicial system is unbelievably complex. That’s why we have professionals that help people navigate it. I also think that the judicial system desperately wants to pin parents or caregivers for minors conducting mass shootings because they want to reduce shootings and I think this is the best way they can do it because the whole gun control thing is not gonna go down in the way people want we’ve been discussing gun control for over a decade and it’s simply not gonna happen so now they’re trying to get to the entire family line to the actions of a youth. dad is supposed to be the example to the entire nation
Yes there is a law against what the father did. It does not specifically say that you can’t give a gun to a minor. But depraved indifference murder does say that if you “engage in conduct that creates a grave risk of death and are aware of and consciously disregard that risk.” that you are guilty …. Ya know like giving an AR-15 to a mentally unstable 14yr old.
Nobody in public school should have access to a firearm that can be brought outside the home
Are NY prosecutors now working in GA?
It is the parent that has control of the weapons and not the child . It could have not happen if he had the weapons out of reach from the 14 year old.
It is called accountability .
People are only worried they are going to take away gun rights.
His son was troubled and had made previous threats, and he gave the kid a rifle as a Christmas present. It was an absolutely dumb thing to do and not responsible gun ownership.
This
Georgia getting creative with their laws?
That never happens.
Getting creative
He should take responsibility for giving a 14yo boy access to the weapon in the first place and if I recall was aware of his sons violent tendencys
Well stated young man. I do think the father has some responsibility in the matter, but only as an accessory to the crimes.
Where did they get there law degree
when you buy a gun. It is registered in your name. You are responsible for any damage done by that gun regardless of who uses it. Thats why you have to notify the ATF when you transfer ownership of the gun. Don't ever let anyone "borrow" or use YOUR gun.
It sounds messed up, for sure! Rule of Law is meaningless if they don't apply the actual laws.
Tell me what is messed up from what I heard
He gave a child access to the weapon and if I recall was aware of his sons tendency to violence
@@fuxkag3908 You watched the video, didn't you? The most obvious problem is that they're trying the kid as an adult, which means that he should have the full responsibility for the crime, but they're ALSO charging the father with various, multiple crimes. Unless the father was a co-conspirator in the crime, then it needs to be one or the other, not both.
@macsnafu
Theres this thing called depraved-heart murder which is in some states constitutes second degree or manslaughter
The father was aware his son was mentally unstable and bought the 14yo boy the weapon so his son can cope with his issues he admitted that in the interview if I recall.
Since the father's recklessness, carlessness and negligence got 4 people killed he should also bear some responsibility
@@fuxkag3908 "Depraved-heart murder"? Sounds like another law trying to punish people for what they think instead of what they actually do. Either the boy is considered an adult with full responsibility for his crime, or he's not. The father only bears responsibility if the boy isn't fully responsible for his crime and isn't tried as an adult.
@@fuxkag3908 "Depraved-heart" murder? Sounds like another attempt to punish someone for what they think, not what they actually do.
The father only bears some responsibility for the crime if the boy is not tried as a adult. If he's tried as an adult, then he bears full responsibility for his crime. The authorities in this case are trying to have it both ways, bu they are mutually incompatible.
Why is this guy trying to talk like Thurstan Howell III from Gilligan's Island?
The shooter is 14. He didn't go to the store and acquired the pew pew, the father did. The father was responsible for keeping this deadly weapon locked. I think it's about time we set precedent for these type of parents, it's their responsibility to help their CHILDREN address their mental health and wellbeing. Not the teacher, neighbor, or society.
The crime is that microphone
100%
o well
Prosecutors are as bad as if not worse than the actual cops. They have the benefit of tome to make decisions and still so often chose to ruin innocent lives and do the wrong thing. Not saying this father is completely innocent but ot shows how much they want to charge others based on their feelings instead of the actual criminals.