E Mountain Bike Motors Explained | EMBN's E-Bike Fundamentals Part 1
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- Опубликовано: 7 авг 2024
- Here's everything you need to know about each and every e mountain bike motor out there on the market right now.
Which one do you ride? 👇
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In this video, Steve explains the characteristics, key details, the all important ride feel and what it does on the trail, and, finally the tech specs and a few maintenance tips. Whether you need to choose the best e bike motor for you, if you're looking to upgrade or find something suited to your riding, or if you're just interested to find out more, it's all here.
We cover the following systems:
- Specialized
- Shimano Steps
- Brose
- Bosch
- Yamaha
- Rocky Mountain
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Which do you use?
Electric Mountain Bike Network none of these they take away the whole point of the sport
Bolt on currently, looking to get Specialized
Yamaha syncdrive sport. Three power modes ECO NORMAL POWER
Well, that's your opinion. Obviously it's not ours! E-bikes add a whole new dimension to the sport but they're not for everyone just yet. Happy riding!
Nice!
This video is exactly what I was hoping for so thank you guys! When comparing the system as a whole (weight, power output, app, de-coupling, etc) it appears the Specialized system is the one to buy (which obviously means a Specialized eMTB). Personally I have been leaning towards Specialized and Haibike when I finally purchase an eMTB. I'm really excited to see the PowerTube from Haibike later this year. The integrated removable battery is without a doubt the best way to go, as opposed to the batteries that are externally attached to the downtube. The Jam2 with internal battery and additional external battery is very enticing, also. It is very exciting to watch this segment of mountain biking evolve and grow.
Cube Stereo 140 with a Bosch drive, amazing bike and motor, so much fun going uphill, great film by the way, very informative.
I have the Bosch Active Line and unlike the CX I haven't noticed any drag when assist cuts out. There is a little drag at lower speeds with assist OFF but that disappears with the correct use of years and increased speed. As an example, I'm 70 years of age, suffer spinal disabilities and I am also in heart failure but I ride my ebike 80% of the time with the motor OFF. It's a Raleigh Motus Hybrid tourer not a EMTB but all the same, the Bosch Active Line is very impressive. Also, it's silent as far as I can tell. Range is outstanding. My local terrain is pretty flat and I can get up to 100 miles on a single charge the WAY I RIDE IT. Others who want an easier time will get less. I went out today and as a test I used the motor over 25 miles on undulating roads and had a projected 27 miles remaining range plus the 5% reserve so even then 55/60 is easily attainable. It is definitely not a power hungry motor which for me was a big selling point.
Brilliant presentation, thank you. Kind regards James
What an excellent overview. What not to get hung up on, and what to pay attention to. Thumbs up, subscribed.
Excellent video series! Thanks so much learned tons.
Most informative and absolutely minimal background sounds. Great!!!!. Many thanks.
A great review thank you ,you have made choosing a power unit so much easier .
Excellent Steve, really enjoyed the programme. love my bosch Gen 4😁👌❤️lots of love from me😂😂👌
Great info! Thanks Steve!!
Great new series!
Awesome video very informative not to technical or overly long, appreciate that!
I have a Focus Jam2 plus with shimano motor. happy with it.
Excellent, informative and entertaining. Keep up the good work.Rgds De Slash, Australia.
Thank you! You really helped me with understanding my Bulls/Brose system! Cheers!
Very good explanation about e-bikes. Thanks for sharing !!
Thanks, very good review, essential viewing if you are buying.
I have a hub motor design, but thinking of my next upgrade, so very useful info.
loving these videos so informative , it's making the imminent purchase decision easier , thanks guys
+Chris Edwards thanks Chris, really pleased you like the video!
Dont wait too long Chris!
Thanks, Steve, this is an excellent overview. And I like your line about motors and water not being 'good mates.' And for myself, my first toes in the water with ebikes will most likely be an add-on motor for two reasons--cost and I want to get my hands on this tech.
Great video, very informative.
Very useful! Thanks...
Very useful overview, thanks.
Very good fundamentals discussed here they are crisp and very clear! Thank you these gave me a serious consideration to upgrading to eMTB as my age advances. Would be nice also if there is some price tag matrix comparison too.
Great video, very informative 👍
pw-x is the best motor out right now hands down. tried them all, the pw-x is thin/light smooth and powerful. easily keeps you at max speed (20mph). 1k miles on mine so far 3 months, only complaints it is on loud side and no walk mode other than that love it.
Enjoyed this matey.
Loved this product!
Bosch performance line CX....love the assist for the steep hills
Love the Bosch it also has shift detect that helps with gear changing ;)
Bosch cx on my cube. All good and no complaints. Tried the yamaha motor and that's good as well.
Fantastic video. Thx
Hub and Torque sensor FTW. Even for center of gravity, the rearward motor and the forward battery. Also a Hub drive doesn't destroy your chain. You can have dual drive with a Hub.
Great review. I am looking forward the battery mike range.
good info of all motors, its the way the power tapes off or cuts off on hitting the 25k limit that makes a big different
Very cool show once again, very informative and great to learn more about all the options, you didn't show the Giant cockpit and display it has a very simple power control switch similar to the Evo and a great central disply that the back light can be dimmed or swiched off for night riding.
The Giant has the walk assist function, know the specialised now has walk assist, do all the brand's now have that feature ?
Thank again for a great program
Tich Mitchell
Cape Town South Africa
Hi Denise, yes most have walk assist, although id avoid going to places that require you to push your ebike! Haha
Steve,,, (two years later) you said your lines with out a Hick Up... Well Presented...Cheers
Very informative and well presented.
Thanks 👍
Wonderful presentation. Thank you!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Brilliant!!! thanks 🙏
Gent great job on your presentation, and appreciate your hard work in presenting the specs, that frankly dealers won’t give you. I must say the facts about the Rocky motor are not quite accurate. The torque is more like 127 Nm. Also has the highest production of max watts. This motor is by far the strongest on the market. I understand you have sponsors and they make/use great motors, I own a specialized and love it, but if your are presenting EMTB as unbiased reviewers, I expect accurate reporting. I really depend on this network for info that I will base my buying decision in conjunction to my seat of the pants ride. Thank you. And keep up the good work. E bikes will be the future of bicycling....
Useful, thumbs up
Would love to see you guys do a comparison test vid on the more simplistic and affordable hub motors versus mid drive.
Thanks for the video Steve, very informative. Sorry Steve off topic question, Can the rear shock of your Kenevo Specialized fit the Levo Specialized?
Thanks again.
Great channel and very informative video. Good to get a comparison of different motors. Is the Specialised motor not a Brose the same way Giant is a Yamaha.
The video implies it's a different motor to Brose.
Keep videos coming.
Great insight Steve.
Thanks Mark! Really appreciate that.
Thanks Mark!
Keep the tech coming
Hi thanks for an informative video , but can I throw in a couple of points- you tend to lean towards mid mount motors but may I just add with my mid mount I found it very easy to break chains on rocky hill climbs under full combined power & as I live in a sandy dry area maintenance of the chain & sprockets was a continual pain however with the hub mount I have increased my power considerably & virtually no maintenance. The enclosed mid mount gearbox does run a chain but it’s much larger & no derailer , nothing hanging down to get wiped off in rocky terrain. Just a thought.
Good vid! Any up to date info on these motors, any advancement? Cheers
Very good!
I don't own a e-mtb and don't see myself buying one any time soon but these videos are really interesting and a good way to learn about the ever evolving technology in the bikes! :)
If buying one isn't for you, try and borrow or rent one for a day. It's a different experience on the trails for sure.
I agree, with both of you, so much fun but I don’t I’ll ever own one
Electric Mountain Bike Network I’ve been planning to actually! We have some awesome winter trails here in Finnish Lapland!
That sounds awesome 👍
HEIPPI stop being a wuss and buy one, money well spent ona eMTB than a regular MTB at the same price
Great vid Steve. I though Specialized used a Brose motor that utilized their own power and management technology?
Great overview reviews Steve ;0) One thing that wasn't mentioned was the IP rating on each motor and battery system?! It's a bit like the elephant in the room on ebike tech stats! How waterproof is each system? What are your views on this at EMBN? The only published IP rating I have found after extensive research is Bosch at IP 54, which means its only splash proof! And Brose a IP 56 for the motor and IP 67 for the battery, which makes that system virtually waterproof. I feel like its a hot topic, especially when we are riding our beloved ebikes in wet and muddy conditions! Many thanks for considering this a video topic ;0)
Terry Brightwater totally agree with you mate, I work in the power electronics industry and supply power semiconductors to companies who design and manufacture inverters for motors and was looking for one for my wife and was shocked to find non of them are IP67, the Spesh one using the Brose System is the best out there. It is certainly something they need to address for mountain biking. I guess the issue the companies have is if you totally seal the unit then in hot countries the thermal trip will kick in when the motor gets too hot, so perhaps some more work needs to be done on managing the thermals. I do wonder how much the manufacturer’s are going to behave to units under warranty with water ingress, totally understand that bike parts can fail due to wear and tear but these units are not cheap to replace.
jumbleross thanks for a great reply :0) Not being in the power electronics industry, I didn't know about the thermal trip when the motor gets too hot, especially if it's fully sealed! Maybe they need to make motors for hot countries and motors for cold wet countries? Certainly riders in hot climates have not had the problems with there ebike motors, as the riders have in cold wet climates :( I live in Wales UK, so my next system will be a Brose ;0)
HI Terry, yes i agree, thanks for pointing out, it was something i missed
I like the Bosch best, smooth transition between the modes and tails off nicely when you hit the max. Shimano is my second choice a little more abrupt than Bosch, batteries are a little to bulky for my liking. Never tried Yamaha or Rocky Mountain so no idea. To many people I know have had countless issues with Brose/Specialized motors so that wouldn't be an option for me.
Would you have any idea why would rear motor make noise when with load and speed would drop to 13km vs 39 km without load? I checked inside and did not see any physical damage . Do you have any video on how to fix it?
Segway mtb's and urbans use the bosch performance line too. If you chip it they easily support 45km/h and can go up to 65km/h but beyond 45 you get gearing issues.
I have moderately severe scoliosis so I had to give up trail riding years ago. I would love to get back into it by means of a trail capable full suspension recumbent etrike. The price tags area little high for these so I would love a episode compering the etrikes so I know what one provide the best value and where I could be overpaying for the product.
Would be nice to get Valentino’s take on emtb as he is the G.O.A.T on two wheels :-)
I started ebiking in early days as had epilepsy so needed transport, trouble i found using befang they had a poor metal drive stem on motor in side fitted to coil and non changeable, i broke mine 3 times just on normal road use and trying hard not to use power until i have pedaled up first. Mine has throttle and pedal so i disconnected pedal assist and so far its ok. What i am waiting for is a better bike and more reliable motors but from what i have seen there isn't one yet. Lots of new motors 2018 so need some test results
Nice one.... again
Thanks!
More information on the Vee go E bikes and green bikes. Thanks
I got a ebike today mid drive its awesome
I own 2 Ebike Mid Drive System. Bafang Ultra M620 1,000 watts. 2nd Bofeili system with 250 watts. Bafang motor should be a common sight in US and Europe and you might want to look into it and review the system.
Bafang is eBay stuff..No dealers no support.
Cannondale2019 maybe in USA. Almost every ebike dealer in Scandinavia sells bikes with bafang and other systems. Especially since bafang max drive was released.
Dealear is USA are afraid of progress. The also only look to sell products on which they cand make ridiculously high profit markups. Like the 7000$ 250W Bosch... Why would they ever want to sell you a cheap 1000$ overpowered 1500W Bafang BBSHD ?👌😁 When they can make 4000$ profit selling you the bosch unit that no one except bosch technician know how to service and repair
Good vid, I have a Giant Ebike Trance, is ther a UK app they seen to be either chineese or spanish.
Yamaha pw-x love it. Almost 1500km on it.
how's the range of the bike with this motor?
@@sterpumihai I own the giant version of it, and what I get is roughly:
Road eco- 100km
Road basic- 80km
Over that... Depends on the power you use
Trails eco 80km
Trails basic/active with a bit of sport/power 50-60km
I weigh 85kg. This is with 500w battery.
More technical info in that one video than most of all the ebike videos I've seen, keep up the good work, I did want a shimano steps but maybe a rocky now, bit undecided need more input :).
It's a tough decision! We're not going to do reviews on this channel, but hopefully there's a trail centre nearby where you can trial each of the options. Thanks for the comment!
Electric Mountain Bike Network
I get you fella totally my own choice and you can't step on manufacturers toes.
Cost will he the biggest factor
Either of them will be really nice, let us know how you get on!
Electric Mountain Bike Network
Will do, I'll keep liking and commenting top team.
Thanks Ian, appreciate it. Happy riding!
Loving this whole EMBN channel! Quick question - have a Merida eOne sixty 800 (great bike with a great geometry running the STEPS motor) - however, I also have a saloon (hybrid) which cant take a tow bar and wont accomodate the bike in the (rather small) boot. Other than changing my car (which I have actually thought about!!!), any suggestions on using alternative bike carriers such as roof carriers??
Hey Ian, what car you got? We'll make it fit!!
Hello, is it possible to change my 250W motor on a Zipper Z4?
Outstanding.... Love from India..... Can you do comparison on cost and feature compare with china
Thanks - any idea if there are any countries in Europe that allow a throttle option?
Do these motors include the Bianchi motor on the rebal ebike do u know, and as a comparison how do they differ as they have 1 more gear than the bosh or Shimano systems.
Hey, dare the new TQ motors resistance free?
like all your vids.... :)
May I ask about Panasonic GX0? It's 90NM , it has an "auto" mode which is similar to to Bosch EMTB mode.
How about the Bafang BBSHD, BBS02, BBS01 and Bafang Ultra and Ultra Max, all these mid-drive are at least twice the power and one sixth of the price of a Bosch
Thanks for the info mate, you're really knowledgeable.
Hi guys I know you are all about mtb but could you do something re the new hub motors in gravel bike's versus mid mount motors, I am 69 with a total knee replacement and want to continue riding two wheel tracks and fire roads thank you Bruce, in Australia.
Are there any standards for how motors fit to the frame or does each manufacturer have their own?
Are the cranks standard or again do you have to get oem replacements?
I don't have one but for me would have to be specialized. Imagine doing one of those MB trips and after a few hours the battery dies, I would want to pedal with the minimum drag possible.
Any chance of an update with new TQ and Bosch units?
What happens with drag when run out of battery, does the system disengage in these three brands only?
Sería posible subtítulos en Español? Vuestro canal es muy interesante y divertido, y este vídeo es fascinante, que de información. Muy bien.
I think you'll find that the Specialized is just a rebranded Brose motor. Brose unlike Bosch and Yamaha allow for bike companies to choose their own batteries and control systems. I believe Focus are the only company that Shimano allow use non Shimano batteries.
yes you are right same as Yamaha have there own motor for there bikes like giant so they can have there own display and batts and software that they can use with a brand motor.
Yamaha has been configured by Giant to make the PWX motor even more stronger & powerful
Exactly, there was little point in analyzing brose and specialized separately.
Specialized uses the Brose motor in case anyone wasn't sure.
@NYCeWheels are you saying Specialized re-brands the Brose motor as their own? The Specialized Levo website clearly states that the motor is branded as Specialized, not Brose. Please clarify.
We don't sell Specialized so I don't know what they advertise, but it's certainly a Brose motor between those cranks. It's tuned to Specialized's liking but is made by Brose and uses the same belt drive technology. They might brand it as their own since they are the only ones with an app that syncs with the system the way theirs does, that's the only thing I could think of. Sounds very Specialized to brand things as their own that aren't truly theirs ;)
Specialized use Brose witch they tuned with theyer own Software
It s true and no Secret.
Its the Same thing with theyr Dh Tires wich are Copys of Maxxis Tires
@@DerekLHays Specialized has the worst motors in E bikes
Nice Video guys
Thanks! Appreciate it 👍
Thanks Bushcraft!
Are resistance band weights accurate?
Bbshd and bosch. The bosch has developed a creek. Buy a brose s and make sure it's 1.3 or it will drag and keep it cool or they cut out.
friend i have a bike with shimano steps e6000, my battery has gone black, i can put a non original shimano battery
Wow! Wow!! Wow!!! Now we have that officially stated: "a 1.2kg weight difference isn't so important"!
I've knew it! ThnX! ;)
Definitely, with e bikes, it's more about motor placement, and, of course, also how you use the power you have!
On an eBike it’s a small difference, power to weight ratio. That would be significant on a regular mtn bike
Not if Haibike/Bosch is a sponsor of the channel... when the aging Performance CX will be updated with a lighter version then it will be an advantage you can be sure. :) I think 1,2kg (and the smaller size) is significant even on ebikes hence the Shimano E8000 became very popular just in a year.
You know, some of the fastest riders in my areas are looking at my e-bike and deciding on a brand. They like their work out but they also see that the race for competition has taken something they loved away. On the e-mtb it is returned - no more strava worry or weight worry, it's back to explore, sessions and flow.
I have both ebike and regular bikes. At the moment I wouldn't want my ebike to be my only bike. Regarding the weight I don't care too much about it my enduro and trail bikes are close to 14kg. Ebikes are generally heavy with their 22-24kg and if I can be closer to 22 by going with a lighter, smaller, more current system and closer geometry to a regular bike then why not?
Can I use a 36v battery with a 48v motor? TIA
Do you think there is chance a mfg'r will come out with a re-gen feature that quickly switches off for gravity downhill work that changes to a climb or power need? Could that maybe give 10-15% back on some rides.....or more? The Prius of mountain bikes.....haha.
Specialized motors are made by Brose, they just get repackaged (software, apps, etc.), and Specialized tend to steer the focus away from the motor's origins.
I know you're never going to review Bafang motors on here because they've not been adopted by mainstream manufacturers, but there's a lot of e-bike only brands that are working with Bafang. The biggest benefit there is the power settings and software can be tailored for each country (your shirt does say "Global", so these things need to be factored in), and each manufacturer can choose their own batteries, displays, software, etc. as they wish, as long as they match up. This makes the differences between each bike considerably greater than just a few minor variations in geometry and components.
It's also cheaper, which will help to open up e-bikes for everyone, not just the wealthy or fortunate.
I love the BBSHD with a 58v battery. More power and torque then any of these restricted motors!
How are the Brose motors at high cadence?
I need advise please - I bought a older E bike . It says 36 volt 250w ,
Max 500w . Brushed motor ( I want to buy a controller ) The bike does 20
Kmh - Do I buy a 500w controller ? I would like more speed too if
possible . Thanks
I would buy the 500 watt then. But 36v is kinda low I use 48v and want to upgrade to 60v myself. I also have a geared front hub.
The Powerplay control is good, you're showing the very old type, the new type is so much better, even more smaller and streamlined than the Specialized, It's so easy to change the power modes and the colour of the lights tell you what level with just a glance if not sure and the Battery level as well. Also I've altered the levels via the app, ecco 60% Trail 75% ludicrous left at 100% and ride in ecco most of the time, no need to conserve power here and as the Motor when off reverts to my setting of ecco I don't even have to change it up when restarting the Bike for a ride. One of the biggest plusses is the instant torque if misjudged and your stalling on a tricky Rock and have to Pedal and would strike your Pedal for sure, with the Rocky you can just jiggle the Pedals an inch or two and power over. No I don't work for Rocky :))) I'm an OAP.
A couple of points on the Bosch system. I tend to ride quite economically and frequently select the "Off" position when riding on flat or gently undulating trails. When I do this, I backpedal for about half a revolution and there is an audible click as the motor decouples. I have one bike with the Nyon system. It's unreliable. The first one stopped working and was replaced by the dealer. The second one lasted about 6 months then failed and was sent off to Bosch for repair. It came back several weeks later and now seems to be behaving itself . The GPS mapping system is inadequate in capacity. I can have the whole of Europe on my Garmin but only part of France. Seems to be a bit of poor design specification there.
Peter Kinsella are you serious about Bosch decoupling? Half a back stroke and no resistance pedaling without motor on? That would be amazing!
It seems to work quite effectively. After the click, it seems to pedal more freely.
If I run a 52v battery through a 48-80v controller to a 1500w rear hub motor, will I get a poorer performance?
Whats the point in 360% assistance? Is it for people who can only put out 75W?
LEVO De-restriction question: Aside from increased heat, does it hurt the motor to run at higher RPM's if the LEVO has been de-restricted ? especially if it was only used on occasion & not like a road bike. I am tempted to de-restrict the LEVO, but I don't want to break it.