1:54 Dragonbane 3:22 ShadowDark 6:02 Knave 2e 7:50 Old School Essentials 9:43 Pathfinder for Savage Worlds 11:45 Worlds Without Number 13:36 Crown and Skull 15:17 Dungeon Crawl Classics 17:38 Hyperborea 19:43 Mörk Bõrg
@@SteveDahlskog I have heard it pronounced as MURK BURG and MORK BORG, but I don’t know for sure that I am even capable of saying it properly.😀. I just know the Swedes put out some great games and Dark Fort (Mork Borg) is one!
"I have numerous better options" for fantasy TTRPG. Yep, I echo that thought and approve of several of your suggestions for "better games". We have wonderful choices today...oh and everything that came before can still be played today. I ❤ this hobby!
Fred! Love seeing you in the comments again sir. We are really in a golden age, and as you said, our games don’t exactly carry a “best used by” date! I’m running Savage Pathfinder, sure, but I’m running it in the 2nd edition Toril world. All my maps, history and magic items are from 2e Forgotten Realms boxes. My two boys and I have a separate game that they are playing in Krynn with AD&D 2e rules. Even with the inflated “collector” prices, I think the 2e boxed sets are an EXCELLENT value for your gaming bucks, if you plan to play long term.
No mention of Castles and Crusades? You should be playing that system if your still playing 2nd edition. Great system and they're kickstarter is on now
I’ve actually had C&C since 2008, I do like it (did a video on it a few months ago actually), just doesn’t make this list for me. Still a very good game.
@@booksbricksandboards783better than half of this list for me but everyone has their favorites. As long as we keep the games going and having fun playing in them it's all good 👍
Absolutely, I had some pretty positive words for C&C in my video, just not as high for me as these. Nothing wrong with C&C. If it makes up for it at all, Talanian that made Hyperborea got his start on C&C products.
Advanced OSE is my main. Amazing experience at the table. It captures the glory days of DnD in all their glory, and somehow manages to have its own vibe. This is the way
Heck yeah! Though I recommend checking out Dolmenwood as soon as it becomes available! To me it takes the whole thing to the next plane of existence. My only gripe is that now I have to do some adjusting to fit in the advanced OSE races and classes. Not that I need to, but I want to 😁
Excellent choices presented here. It really is hard to overstate how brilliant the Dragonbane boxed set is. Easily the best value I've ever seen. Also, I am a sucker for a d20 or d100 roll-under system. Savage Pathfinder is another super fun one. Golarion is such an interesting and living world, it's really a shame to keep it locked up under too much crunch. I want to run something in Qadira, I think there's a lot to be found in that setting. Mork Borg is a bridge too far for me with some of its imagery. Top notch art, but also get off my porch with that. There is a Star Borg out there, and also, I recently learned of a Smork Borg. Seems like the Smurfs got Morked. Or like that thing when they'd get bit by the fly. I saw art that said "Go Smork Yourself," no joke. I was immediately intrigued.
I did 30-40 sessions of Shadowdark, last year. This year I've been running mostly DCC because I wanted some more gonzo and crunchyness. Next year I'll probably run a long term Dolmanwood which I'm looking forward to
At first I was iffy on Dragonbane during the kickstarter… after it’s release I saw some videos and now it is my one of my all time favorites it is deceptively deadly. No raise in HP and weapons do huge damage. Every combat is exciting. And the monster attack matrix is the best. Possibly best solo game also. Shadowdark, DCC and Mörk Borg I also love. Crown and Skull I have but have not run it yet. Still hasn’t got me yet, but I will imagine it will given time.
Theres these spiters on YT that mock Dragonbanes magic system, when they havent played ANY other ttrpg besides their pompous Pathfinder and D&D. They truly dont " get " such a nice take on magic system Imo. Forbidden Lands is great aswell. Also Symboraum and Væsen. You can solo/ co-op all. Get the solo rules for Væsen on drivethrough RPG
@@odinulveson9101 preaching to the choir. you don’t need to tell me I hate D&D modern and pathefinder so boring. Role playing good. Roll playing bad. At least for me
Been playing worlds without number with my group, moved from dnd and my players are already commenting that it is more fun/ punchy. Would recommend it for sure
For sure. Kevin basically kept all of the bits that he liked of BX, took lessons of 50 years of game design innovation lessons and then added them to the mix to create something new, but familiar. He really has a nice playground for us.
Ironsworn, Ironsworn: Starforged, and Ironsworn:Starforged - Sundered Isles are worthy of this list. They are built for solo play, but play amazingly well in co-op and guided (GM) modes. The most immersive role-playing experiences I have had in my 44+ years have been found in Ironsworn and Starforged.
You won’t get any pushback against Ironsworn or Starforged. Love both, and Shawn actually allowed me to upload my custom Ironsworn narrative journal sheet on RPGGeek. This list was meant to be a little more mainstream, but if you are wanting solo and co op, great choice!
Yups same for me, The ironsworn stuff is by far what I enjoy the most in any RPG. Absolutely TOP NOTCH. But they are mostly solo games so I wouldn''t have put them here either.
I'm going to plug my favorite game: Basic Fantasy RPG. In my opinion, it's what another edition of Basic D&D should have been, had WotC continued the break between Basic and Advanced.
Good to see Worlds Without Number getting some love. I ran the sci-fi version, Stars Without Number, as a break for my 5e group and the group loved it.
0:50 let's go with the most ridiculous option here : a pixie Rogue can be as strong AND faster than a Goliath Barbarian, a half orc paladin can be as dexterous as a Tabaxi ranger , an halfling sorcerer and be as hardy(con) as a a Dwarf fighter & a human ranger can be as smart or wise as an elf wizard....
Dear Mr. Books, Bricks and Boards...I enjoyed your video. I too started playing BX and AD&D in the early 1980s and have tried 5e and found it unsatisfactory because the feel is not the same. (I will leave it at that.) I am in complete agreement that there are plenty of alternatives, and there is really no need for all the redundant critiques when there are so many better products out there that one can just move on from 5e. I own quite a few of these books already, and I am on the kickstarter for Gavin Norman's Dolmenwood, which I think is even better than OSE both as a model and a game. I did, however, take your advice regarding Knave 2e and ordered a copy!!! Although I am not a fan of watching him DM on RUclips and disagree with much of his understanding and critique of the Gygax DM Guide of 1979 , I do think his reviews are great and I have learned a lot about what is out there from them...Thanks for doing your video!
Currently playing Dragonbane with my secondary group and I am trying SO HARD to get my main group to switch over but they are adamant about just playing D&D xD
Hyperborea is a personal favorite. Jeff is an excellent human being and also Gygax’s last collaborator. The game feels like what 3rd edition D&D could have been.
Next to Castles & Crusades, which is refreshingly rules light without feeling too rules light offers a scratch to my AD&D 2nd itch, which I played to death back in the days till 3e. Another great contender is actually Mini Six. Very easy to learn, quick and fun.
I do like Castles & Crusades. I picked it up in 2008 originally, on a whim at Gen Con. Is Mini Six related to the old West End Games D6 systems or something different?
Indeed it is, actually based on WEGs Open D6 books as a light version with static defenses. Very quick and easy to learn and the whole rulebook is less than 30 pages.
That sounds cool. I have heard a lot about Mini Six, but never the mechanics. I played a lot of WEG Star Wars as a kid, so pretty familiar with the system. Is it all POD or are there regular retail copies in the wild as well?
At least half of these games are on my list of next game I want to run. Unfortunately, I'm having trouble making the math on that add up. I'm not sure how to pick just one of these to start with. Excellent list!
You’re a gamer dammit!! Write a numbered list and then roll a die. Optional addenda: If you are disappointed with the result rolled, scratch it off the list and roll again.
Adv.OSE is my new love. You said it here... there are LOTS of material from the golden age! And when i get the chance, I'll get Knave, Shadowdark and you made me add Dragonbane to my wishlist. Great video, thanks for the illumination.
Dragonbane was my biggest surprise of the bunch… I figured I’d like it, because Free League, but when I dug in and played it, I sold my Forbidden Lands books.. and I really enjoyed Forbidden Lands… DB is just so clean and smooth. Also, Knave and Shadowdark, both incredible!
Just pulled up you channel to go sub, and it seems like we are on the same gaming page, as you released a very similar video just 5 days ago! Thanks for commenting!
Personally, I'm a huge fan of Savage Worlds (I'm currently building a version of Fading Suns with it) and Blades in the Dark. But I think Imma hafta give Dragonbane a try. 😈 Because I'm not buying another D&D product while Hasblow owns the game.
@@steelmongoose4956 I like it a lot. It is mechanically very slick, and deceptively powerful. Little things like the way Trappings effect spells to the way that Setting Rules can wildly change the feel of a world, add together to make a SWEET toolkit for a GM.
@@booksbricksandboards783 The reason I call it "Hasblow" is because *SOMEBODY* in the Executive Suite is obviously snorting a lot of coke. There is no other rational excuse for some of the idiot stunts they've pulled since January '23.
While it is nice to find 'new' TTRPGs, as in things that have been created in the last few years, internet have had something interesting happening, and that is that it is so much easier to find books and supplements of older RPGs from the 80s and 90s, heck, even 70s RPGs can be found and it can be fun to just do a one shot with them. Many of those games were unnoticed due to how hard it could be to market them or very few knew them.
No argument here, but a large portion of potential players won’t consider playing the older systems. I have a number of videos specifically about how to start playing older games today, focusing on AD&D 2e and BX D&D primarily, but there is a much larger group interested in modern alternatives. There are a lot of great older games, as I mentioned in this video, I’m playing 2e with my boys now, but there are also a number of fantastic modern alternatives as well. If you look at my shelf at the end of this video you will notice I’m not a stranger to the older stuff 😉. Thanks for watching!
@@booksbricksandboards783 Oh yeah, completely agree with you on that, also, two of my favorites lately when it comes to fantasy have been Cairn and Dungeon World, me and a friend of mine always DMed together since the days of DnD3.5, mostly we worked together in world building and dungeons while he did the DM portion. Also, Liminal is a very interesting modern fantasy RPG that not many talk about.
@@TheRatedOniChannel I have enjoyed DW quite a bit. I have Cairn but not read it yet. Liminal is one I will have to research. Thanks for watching and sharing!
@@booksbricksandboards783 Cairn is the perfect 'oh, you've never played rpgs but are curious about DnD? Say no more fam' and Liminal is a bit like the BBC series of Neverwhere... which also has its own RPG, I swear, this hobby is just a giant rabbit hole.
Great video as always. Happy 4th too. Any thoughts about the new DC20 system that the dungeon coach just launched on Kickstarter. It look really interesting.
Great video. And fantastic list. I’ll still take Castles & Crusades over all of them. But that’s just me as AD&D 1st Edition is still my favorite of all of the D&D editions and I started with OD&D in 1974/75 and played all editions. ❤
Nothing wrong with that take… I lime C&C quite a bit. I’d person take AD&D 2e over several on the list, but I wanted to keep options more modern and accessible. Thanks for watching
Another OSR RPG that deserves mention is Dark Places & Demogorgons for both the "Survive This" system and OSE. “Dark Places & Demogorgons” is an OSR (Old School Revival) horror tabletop RPG set in the 1980s. In this game, players take on the roles of teenagers in a small town where strange and supernatural occurrences are happening all around them. The adults are too busy or disbelieving to help, leaving it up to the players to uncover and confront the mysteries1. The game uses the SURVIVE THIS!! system, which is a d20-based mechanic familiar to those who have played classic fantasy RPGs. It features a variety of character classes like the Geek, Jock, and Goth, each with unique abilities and traits1. The gameplay is designed to be fast-paced and engaging, capturing the nostalgic feel of '80s horror and adventure films. Whether you’re dealing with creepy clowns, alien life forms, or other eerie entities, “Dark Places & Demogorgons” promises a thrilling and immersive experience
The Dragonbane boxed set is not a "starter set"; it's the entire game in a box. Much like D&D 0e came in a boxed set or the newly released Mothership 1e comes in a boxed set, so too does Dragonbane come in a complete boxed set
If those, not familiar with Seven Seas. Heard of it but not read or played. How would you describe it? Not many great pirate games out there, so might be one I’d look at. Pirate Borg was one I really enjoyed.
I had a long reply and lost it to an editing error. Maybe a second try will be better organized. 7th Sea is based on the world of the 7th Sea CCG from AEG. It's generally Hollywood swashbuckling (Three Musketeers, Captain Blood, Ivanhoe) plus cultural magic. Each culture is obviously based on a specific European nation from an important time in that nation's history. So "Germany" is set during or immediately after the 30-Years War, France, Spain, and Russia are in the middle of the Napoleonic Wars, England is in the reign of Elizabeth I, and so on. This sort of works if you don't look too hard. Each culture has its own style of magic that doesn't really match that of any other culture, so France has weird teleportation, Italy has soothsaying, Russia has shapeshifting, England has mythology, and so on. The combat rules are designed to facilitate cinematic play by PCs, so PCs can often tear through huge numbers of what are essentially extras until they reach the villain, when the combat becomes much slower and more detailed. There are solid social rules, including rules for reputation. It's an interesting system with the right group, and worth taking a look at.
@@dougsundseth6904 that sounds VERY cool. Thank you for the long response (twice 😉). The game sounds like exactly the type of pirate game I’d want to play in as a player.
OSE and Basic Fantasy are the 2 best ADND re-done versions so far that ive seen. I lean towards OSE for the organization of the material and ease of reading.
I had the Basic Fantasy core book and some expansions… it made a couple of small changes but largely pretty accurate to the original. If I remember they gave clerics spells at first level, which for some reason was the change I remember after a few years 😀. That said, still a very good option, but hard to compete in the BX sphere when OSE is around… just so good.
@@swordsnstones pretty much everything you would need… before OSE, I was a BIG proponent that the Rules Cyclopedia was the definitive Basic resource. OSE changed that. Allston did something very special for the time with the RC, but OSE just perfected it.
“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.” -Antoine de Saint-Exupéry We still play 5e but with the rules provided in the Essentials box set :D
That sounds fair… as much as I give the game a hard time, there is a lot I like about the original 3 5e books… everything after got further from my preferences. Olde Swords Reign might be something your group would dig, and it is SUPER affordable too.
Yes. From the art to the “innovation”, WOTC feels to me like they are heating up the same TV dinner with each new release. The more hungry small pubs are giving us 7 course masterpieces.
@@booksbricksandboards783 The biggest innovations to the modern D20 style seem to be coming from DC20 (which I backed). Or I should say, at least, that Dungeon Coach’s innovations are confined to gameplay and mechanics, rather than social theory and historical revision.
@@steelmongoose4956 very well put! It seems like the effort applied to mechanical improvements is very much secondary to the effort WOTC spends on sanitizing and “modernizing” the works that came before. They stand on the shoulders of giants (literally as Gygax means giant) and call themselves tall, while scolding those of us that appreciate the older products that gave them their platform.
@@booksbricksandboards783 It’s really great. It’s not only an amazing and phenomenally detailed setting, it practically functions as B/X 2.0. He has a lot of tweaks which polish and enhance B/X.
@@hillerm I had heard that they were thinking about jumping off of the OGL with the Dolmenwood release, but I forgot about it… so this is a complete new system it sounds like? Very interesting.
@@booksbricksandboards783 No it’s still B/X but has has a lot of the options from Carrion Crawler built into the core system. He also redesigned all the spells and most of the classes to be setting specific. The entire game is really tight and bursting with flavor.
@@hillerm well, guess that is another one on the list… lol. Glad this video is doing well, because I am going to need more cash for some of these games in the comments! 😉
I actually would have done that before Dragonbane. For myself, Dragonbane scratched the same itch as Forbidden Lands, but with a little less overhead. FL is a great system though.
'looking to eke out another day or two in the miserable existence of a dying world and deal with the other desperate souls trying to do the same. So basically similar to Chicago, if you've ever been there.' lol I wrote a #1 hit song with a guy from Chicago. The description above is pretty accurate for the world of professional songwriting too.
lol, no career highs as good as a #1 hit song for me, but that is a pretty awesome tidbit. If you need help writing lyrics about a cleric in Golarion getting eaten by a tentacle beast, I’m your guy!
@@booksbricksandboards783 It sounds a lot cooler than it is, believe me. On the lyrics offer, I would but the demand for songs about clerics in Golarion getting eaten by tentacled beasts has really ebbed over the last couple of years.
Awesome indie games all! Knave 2e is unfortunately missing from my library for now but will be added eventually. Happy indie game month! Oh and as skill systems go WWN is the best! How it works with the character creation, the foci and leveling up is fantastic!
Currently running Hyperborea, 15 sessions in and we are having a blast. Using a modified simple Dark & Dangerous spell casting rule that fits the tone of the game perfectly. About to run some modified DCC afventures, and it looks to be an easy conversion. I played Savage Worlds and love it- but playing online and its dice system was a huge pain. Hope to try it in person.
You have a good breadth of gaming experience, would you say that from what you see of my list, this would be a good list for gamers looking to find a change of pace from Dungeons & Dragons?
@@booksbricksandboards783 Yes, excellent list for a change of pace from 5e - of course Crown & Skull and Savage Worlds would be the biggest leap rules wise from 5e. I own all of the books you mentioned (except the Pathfinder SW - I have the Fantasy Companion) and cannabalize from all of them . One that I would add is Tales of Argosa (new version of Low Fantasy Gaming), it has tightened up LFG and the layout and rules are concise. I backed the Kickstarter and hope to get the print copy soon, but I printed out the 95% finished PDF and will play it soon. I think you would dig it - ithas a simple skills and Background system , and this combined with Unique Features that can be anything you want as long as the GM agrees to it allows you to make up unique characters without getting too complicated. Also has "Exploits", that are simpler version of Mighty Deeds from DCC and basically the possibility of Wild Magic and Corruption every time magic is used.
@@Finniganmydog Finn, I had never heard of Tales of Argosa, but definitely have eyed Low Fantasy Gaming several times. That sounds like my kind of game for sure! You named several different beats that I like in my games! Thanks for the suggestion, it is on my list (list is long and money short, but it is on there!).
Another great video, another masterful list with none I'd argue to remove. I'd add for public consumption: _The One Ring 2E_ (the Moria supplement shipping now!), _When the Wolf Comes_ (Ian Sharpe's _Vikingverse_ utilizing Rob Schwalb's _Shadow of the Demon Lord_ system), _Adventurer Conqueror King System_ (ACKS II), and of course _Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay_ (WFRP) 4E. We are truly in a golden age of TTRPGs.
The DCC funnel is the main reason I can't get my head into it. it seems a complete anathema to RPGs, which is more hilarious because Goodman focuses so much on Appendix N but nothing in any of those novels/media is "start as 0th level nobodies and earn your way to being an adventurer". it comes off way more like someone's crazy idea of how 1974-era D&D was, rather than based in any fact.
I know that when I was playing BX we played large parties, with each of us running 2-3 characters, 12-15 total. We had deaths pretty regularly, but not like a funnel. You actually don’t have to play a funnel to play DCC, it has the option to create first level characters (and great modules for them as well). Like I said, hard to understand until you try it… it’s frantic, it’s hilarious and because characters keep dying, players get clever about creative play, and they occasionally try some WILD things because they aren’t too attached to that zero level… YET. After one survives, that IS there backstory. They have an immediate attachment to the Baker that killed the demon with his rolling pin, even though he has a 4 wisdom score!
Here is a better list: Adventurer Conqueror King System II, Low Fantasy Gaming, OSE, Castles & Crusades, Worlds Without Number, Hyperborea, Scarlet Heroes, LotFP, Wightbox (spelled correctly), Horde Wars. Horde Wars Basic and Wightbox are relatively inexpensive options that you have not heard of, and can be found on DTRPG.
I'm only missing 3 of those: Pathfinder for SW, WWN and Knave 2e Very great systems and getting Hyperborea for my birthday I hope I can get some players to test Crown and Skull one day Hopefully, I can try the Japan-flavored 'Ronin' Mörk Borg-like I'm looking forward most to Dolmenwood, Tales of Argosa and Mythic Bastionland
Well regarding the 2 rules you mentioned, potion as free action, and everyone and their friends have the same stats... Blame BG3. well obviously some certain companies wouldn't have fired all the talented people those probably would have explained why Larian made those choices, but heyyyy! I am more leaning on the sci-fi than fantasy tropes (space travel... man MY STUFF) so some of those games I don't know. But still Kevin Crawford declines his world without in Cyberpunk and space opera, and I LUV those (both). Mork Borg... I have Pirate Borg, totally Kicking some ass. DCC I love the supplements I have a lots of them. they are built on 'how to make a barebone story. the core of the game is dungeon exploration so by itself each NPC presented is like gold mine. Savage world always loved that stuff. And I am always sad we don't have a Savage World Starfinder. the universe is really great, well written. But the rules helluva of NO! shadowdark which I don't own, and Dragonbane , which I DO own and read the rules, are the 2 for me that appeal the most. So great stuff as always. Thank for that.
Not anything about your output. I wouldn't know about ADND and Worlds Without Number. Just seems odd with the RUclips sphere that Torchbearer Second Edition is kinda left aside.
@@TweaksDIRT I like Crane’s work quite a bit. I have Torchbearer on the shelf, and read it twice. I thought it and Mouse Guard were pretty similar and preferred the latter because I like the graphic novel. I agree, Crane has not gotten as much attention on the whole as deserved.
Palladium Fantasy is a great game that has been around for a long time and has a huge amount of background material, I am surprised that no one ever mentions it, in fact it has 2 editions the 1st more like D&D and the 2nd more like other Palladium Books games.
Yeah, I actually did some videos on Palladium books last year… I had all of their games except the Vietnam Conflict game. If you enjoy Palladium, you may also enjoy the Survive This series. It draws a lot from BX and Palladium(mainly skill theory). I did decide to sell my Palladium collection recently, because while I love the creative stories and art, I don’t really enjoy the game system… there are several official rulings for some of the combat mechanics, and generally it is just a little too clunky to get anyone else to play it with me. That said, I have the entire Savage Rifts line because I love the idea of Rifts. Thanks for watching.
@@steelmongoose4956 I think Sembieda has a tremendous talent for painting a picture with his words that extends to his artists. It always feels like a world I want to play in.
@@benitopulatso6637 Can I ask you what about the system you honestly don't like? I mean combat is D20 and the skills are percentile based, these seem to be pretty popular systems over all. I would really like to know if you would be willing to elaborate.
Midnight, herein lies the problem with having these awesome interactions with the viewers, now I read up on Neon Lords and I want to buy it too! Lol. Thanks for watching, and sharing… even if it might cost me $50 😉
DCC/MCC, Dragonbane, Savage Worlds, Knave, Shadowdark, and WWN/SWN are some of my favorite TTRPGs. Your top 10 is insanely close to mine, but I wasn't surprised. Great video; please keep evangelizing brilliant games that aren't the hobby's big bois.
@@booksbricksandboards783 Justin: I recently picked up Free League's Forbidden Lands box set thanks to some store credit at my FLGS. Reading it, it looks really fun -- traveling is it's own mini-game!
www.hyperborea.tv for the hardcovers, which are BEAUTIFUL, or DriveThruRpg.com for the PDF’s. Great books! I have a couple of other Hyperborea videos on the channel as well.
@@swordsnstones no worries, good luck with the channel Swords. I really think that our content works a little bit like car dealerships, the more of around each other, the more it generates traffic for everyone.
@@booksbricksandboards783 CHEERS SIR i appreciate it i am sending others to watch your vids all the time as i dont really do much for content, so hopefully you get some subscriptions from it.
Here's my top five: 1) Cypher System Revised (i I know, it's like calling Unreal Engine your favorite game, but that's kinda part of the charm) 2) Sword World (an accessible Japanese take of quasimedieval fantasy roleplay) 3) The Black Hack (imagine if OD&D got one more editing pass by a punk rock band) 4) Savage Worlds (flexible and to the point) 5) Sword Bastards (a game that actually pulled off combat that doesn't need its own subsession). Part of the reason I to post this was because too many lists of "D&D alternatives" are 31 flavors of D&D.
Solid list. I have several of them on my shelf and have actually played many of them, including Dragonbane, Knave, Shadowdark and Mork Borg. All great systems.
Well for me, my alternatives are and in no particular order. 1. Castles and Crusades. 2. Mythras. 3. Runequest 4 Dragonbane 5 Against the Darkmaster 6 King Arthur Pendragon. 7. The BRP book 2nd ed.
lol you really enjoy Chaosium apparently, with Mythras being a take on Runequest, Dragonbane originating from Runequest/Basic, Pendragon being originally based on Basic, and then of course Runequest itself… lol. I don’t know anything about Against the Darkmaster but based upon the list I would think it might be related to the Chaosium system 😀😉. Nothing wrong with those games. C&C would be the closest to make my top 10. Thanks for sharing. (If I had a group that would get into the generational play aspect, Pendragon could make the list)
As an old school OD&D player, who also played AD&D, 2nd, 3rd, 3.5, Pathfinder, 5e, and Pathfinder 2e - I have settled on Savage Worlds / Savage Pathfinder as my main game over the last year or so. All the fun without any of the god mode PC nonsense that current day D&D injects.
Monogamy isn't for TTRPG's! My favorite TTRPG's and systems: 1-Cypher(generic), 2-Teenagers From Outer Space(anime), 3-Gamma World 4E(not based on D&D 4E)(post apocalyptic), 4-All Flesh Must be Eaten(zombie), 5-Battlelords of the 23rd Century(sci-fi), 6-Pathfinder 1E(fantasy), 7-5E(fantasy), 8-Palladium system(generic), 9-AD&D(fantasy), 10-Shadow of the Demon Lord(sci-fantasy/horror) and 11-Star Frontiers(sci-fi)
I like these suggestions for dungeoneering games (though I would add Torchbearer for a crunchy and brutal experience). I would add my top 10 non-dungeoneering rpgs: 10. Against the Darkmaster 9. Pendragon 8. Masks: A New Generation 7. Blades in the Dark 6. Into the Odd 5. M-Space 4. Magonomia 3. Basic Roleplaying 2. The One Ring 1. Ars Magica
I've been running PF2 and it's a really well put together system, but I 100% get the exhaustion from making sure you're running it "correctly." It really shines as a tactical combat game though and my players mostly love the crunch.
@@SeanFranchise I don’t disagree at all, that is actually what attracted me to it… as players gain levels and monsters gain abilities to track, it becomes cumbersome. Throw in that a couple of my players, after two campaigns and more than 3 years mind you, are still needing to ask how action economy works, how spells work and generally where they can find numbers on their sheets… it’s the adults that are slower to pick up on it, not the kids, in my experience! 😉 that said, I’ve enjoyed the system, just feel like I have done everything I want to with it. Thanks for watching!
@@booksbricksandboards783 Haha yeah that all tracks and we're just at level 1! I love the action economy but as a GM that is more comfortable on the ICRPG/ShadowDark/Knave end of the spectrum I end up wishing I didn't have to reference rules every couple of minutes. Savage PF sounds like a great alternative though since Golarion is such a dope setting.
@@SeanFranchise the Abomination Vaults AP is great too. Just ends up taking way too long for a single combat… also, player died in the campaign and then spent half of a 5 hour session to build a new character. Just a very decision heavy system across the board after about level 5.
Yawn. Shadow Dark, just like Flame Princess just sound like another over hyped semi clone. I already have a ton of clones. Why get this? Is it because a female made it? If I want simple I can play ICRPG.
I thought that was the case myself until I read it. The way she handled classes and races was very unique, offering versatility but simplicity. The torch system is also pretty unique and changes the way that dungeon crawls play. Also, content generation tools are second only to Knave for newer dungeon crawlers. Throw in the Zines she released with the Hexcrawls and additional classes and there is a lot of great gameplay in Shadowdark. None of that has to do with the author. Though having accidentally blocked her way for a few minutes while discussing the game she wrote, while she waited patiently for me to finish standing behind me, I can say she is a pretty kind and patient person as well.
No mention of Runequest? I mean it’s not exactly a dnd replacement [because it is very different], but it CERTAINLY IS a great fantasy game, and an amazing alternative!
1:54 Dragonbane
3:22 ShadowDark
6:02 Knave 2e
7:50 Old School Essentials
9:43 Pathfinder for Savage Worlds
11:45 Worlds Without Number
13:36 Crown and Skull
15:17 Dungeon Crawl Classics
17:38 Hyperborea
19:43 Mörk Bõrg
Thank you
What is the õ doing in Mörk Borg?
excellent list 💯
@@SteveDahlskog I have heard it pronounced as MURK BURG and MORK BORG, but I don’t know for sure that I am even capable of saying it properly.😀. I just know the Swedes put out some great games and Dark Fort (Mork Borg) is one!
@@alvarogarcia5514 thanks Alvaro!
"I have numerous better options" for fantasy TTRPG.
Yep, I echo that thought and approve of several of your suggestions for "better games". We have wonderful choices today...oh and everything that came before can still be played today. I ❤ this hobby!
Fred! Love seeing you in the comments again sir. We are really in a golden age, and as you said, our games don’t exactly carry a “best used by” date! I’m running Savage Pathfinder, sure, but I’m running it in the 2nd edition Toril world. All my maps, history and magic items are from 2e Forgotten Realms boxes. My two boys and I have a separate game that they are playing in Krynn with AD&D 2e rules. Even with the inflated “collector” prices, I think the 2e boxed sets are an EXCELLENT value for your gaming bucks, if you plan to play long term.
No mention of Castles and Crusades? You should be playing that system if your still playing 2nd edition. Great system and they're kickstarter is on now
I’ve actually had C&C since 2008, I do like it (did a video on it a few months ago actually), just doesn’t make this list for me. Still a very good game.
@@booksbricksandboards783better than half of this list for me but everyone has their favorites. As long as we keep the games going and having fun playing in them it's all good 👍
Absolutely, I had some pretty positive words for C&C in my video, just not as high for me as these. Nothing wrong with C&C. If it makes up for it at all, Talanian that made Hyperborea got his start on C&C products.
Advanced OSE is my main. Amazing experience at the table. It captures the glory days of DnD in all their glory, and somehow manages to have its own vibe.
This is the way
OSE is great. Love that entire line.
Heck yeah! Though I recommend checking out Dolmenwood as soon as it becomes available! To me it takes the whole thing to the next plane of existence. My only gripe is that now I have to do some adjusting to fit in the advanced OSE races and classes. Not that I need to, but I want to 😁
Excellent choices presented here. It really is hard to overstate how brilliant the Dragonbane boxed set is. Easily the best value I've ever seen. Also, I am a sucker for a d20 or d100 roll-under system.
Savage Pathfinder is another super fun one. Golarion is such an interesting and living world, it's really a shame to keep it locked up under too much crunch. I want to run something in Qadira, I think there's a lot to be found in that setting.
Mork Borg is a bridge too far for me with some of its imagery. Top notch art, but also get off my porch with that. There is a Star Borg out there, and also, I recently learned of a Smork Borg. Seems like the Smurfs got Morked. Or like that thing when they'd get bit by the fly. I saw art that said "Go Smork Yourself," no joke. I was immediately intrigued.
All good additions to the conversation!
I did 30-40 sessions of Shadowdark, last year. This year I've been running mostly DCC because I wanted some more gonzo and crunchyness. Next year I'll probably run a long term Dolmanwood which I'm looking forward to
Sounds like you have some pretty great gaming groups to get that much table time! Good on you!
@@booksbricksandboards783 unfortunately I build it all out in Foundry.. I never get much face to face gaming
At first I was iffy on Dragonbane during the kickstarter… after it’s release I saw some videos and now it is my one of my all time favorites it is deceptively deadly. No raise in HP and weapons do huge damage. Every combat is exciting. And the monster attack matrix is the best. Possibly best solo game also. Shadowdark, DCC and Mörk Borg I also love. Crown and Skull I have but have not run it yet. Still hasn’t got me yet, but I will imagine it will given time.
You sir seem to have a very discerning taste. Thanks for watching!
Forbidden Lands as well is in the same vein of Dragonbane
@@TweaksDIRT it is, I have a Forbidden Lands video from last year that goes over solo play. Good game. For me, Dragonbane replace it.
Theres these spiters on YT that mock Dragonbanes magic system, when they havent played ANY other ttrpg besides their pompous Pathfinder and D&D. They truly dont " get " such a nice take on magic system Imo.
Forbidden Lands is great aswell. Also Symboraum and Væsen. You can solo/ co-op all. Get the solo rules for Væsen on drivethrough RPG
@@odinulveson9101 preaching to the choir. you don’t need to tell me I hate D&D modern and pathefinder so boring. Role playing good. Roll playing bad. At least for me
Been playing worlds without number with my group, moved from dnd and my players are already commenting that it is more fun/ punchy. Would recommend it for sure
For sure. Kevin basically kept all of the bits that he liked of BX, took lessons of 50 years of game design innovation lessons and then added them to the mix to create something new, but familiar. He really has a nice playground for us.
Ironsworn, Ironsworn: Starforged, and Ironsworn:Starforged - Sundered Isles are worthy of this list. They are built for solo play, but play amazingly well in co-op and guided (GM) modes.
The most immersive role-playing experiences I have had in my 44+ years have been found in Ironsworn and Starforged.
You won’t get any pushback against Ironsworn or Starforged. Love both, and Shawn actually allowed me to upload my custom Ironsworn narrative journal sheet on RPGGeek. This list was meant to be a little more mainstream, but if you are wanting solo and co op, great choice!
Yups same for me, The ironsworn stuff is by far what I enjoy the most in any RPG. Absolutely TOP NOTCH. But they are mostly solo games so I wouldn''t have put them here either.
I'm going to plug my favorite game: Basic Fantasy RPG. In my opinion, it's what another edition of Basic D&D should have been, had WotC continued the break between Basic and Advanced.
Killing the Basic D&D line was a mistake in my opinion. There is a very solid system there.
Found your channel via a discord group that I have joined up with. I just subscribed today.
Keep up the good work.
Thanks! I have a buddy that has offered to create and moderate a Discord channel for me, so that will be coming soon.
Subscribed aswell. Good work!
@@odinulveson9101 appreciate it Odin, thank you!
Good to see Worlds Without Number getting some love. I ran the sci-fi version, Stars Without Number, as a break for my 5e group and the group loved it.
Kevin is one of my favorite authors. Great rule set.
0:50 let's go with the most ridiculous option here : a pixie Rogue can be as strong AND faster than a Goliath Barbarian, a half orc paladin can be as dexterous as a Tabaxi ranger , an halfling sorcerer and be as hardy(con) as a a Dwarf fighter & a human ranger can be as smart or wise as an elf wizard....
Yes, all true statements in the “new” D&D .
Dear Mr. Books, Bricks and Boards...I enjoyed your video. I too started playing BX and AD&D in the early 1980s and have tried 5e and found it unsatisfactory because the feel is not the same. (I will leave it at that.) I am in complete agreement that there are plenty of alternatives, and there is really no need for all the redundant critiques when there are so many better products out there that one can just move on from 5e. I own quite a few of these books already, and I am on the kickstarter for Gavin Norman's Dolmenwood, which I think is even better than OSE both as a model and a game. I did, however, take your advice regarding Knave 2e and ordered a copy!!! Although I am not a fan of watching him DM on RUclips and disagree with much of his understanding and critique of the Gygax DM Guide of 1979 , I do think his reviews are great and I have learned a lot about what is out there from them...Thanks for doing your video!
Violet, much appreciated and glad you are enjoying Knave. Sounds like we have similar tastes.
@@booksbricksandboards783 Don't know yet as far as Knave, I haven't looked at the pdf yet! :D
Currently playing Dragonbane with my secondary group and I am trying SO HARD to get my main group to switch over but they are adamant about just playing D&D xD
Very common. I did a video on introducing a group to new games a while back.
Beautiful list! I haven't had a look at Hyperborea, the others stand proudly on my game (or pdf) shelf 😉
Hyperborea is a personal favorite. Jeff is an excellent human being and also Gygax’s last collaborator. The game feels like what 3rd edition D&D could have been.
Next to Castles & Crusades, which is refreshingly rules light without feeling too rules light offers a scratch to my AD&D 2nd itch, which I played to death back in the days till 3e.
Another great contender is actually Mini Six. Very easy to learn, quick and fun.
I do like Castles & Crusades. I picked it up in 2008 originally, on a whim at Gen Con. Is Mini Six related to the old West End Games D6 systems or something different?
Indeed it is, actually based on WEGs Open D6 books as a light version with static defenses. Very quick and easy to learn and the whole rulebook is less than 30 pages.
That sounds cool. I have heard a lot about Mini Six, but never the mechanics. I played a lot of WEG Star Wars as a kid, so pretty familiar with the system. Is it all POD or are there regular retail copies in the wild as well?
At least half of these games are on my list of next game I want to run. Unfortunately, I'm having trouble making the math on that add up. I'm not sure how to pick just one of these to start with. Excellent list!
lol, and that is the conundrum! God bless you!
You’re a gamer dammit!! Write a numbered list and then roll a die.
Optional addenda: If you are disappointed with the result rolled, scratch it off the list and roll again.
@@sturat5166 or if you rolled behind a screen and a different result better moves the party where you need them to go… it is what it is 😉
@@sturat5166 Brilliant!
Adv.OSE is my new love. You said it here... there are LOTS of material from the golden age! And when i get the chance, I'll get Knave, Shadowdark and you made me add Dragonbane to my wishlist. Great video, thanks for the illumination.
Dragonbane was my biggest surprise of the bunch… I figured I’d like it, because Free League, but when I dug in and played it, I sold my Forbidden Lands books.. and I really enjoyed Forbidden Lands… DB is just so clean and smooth. Also, Knave and Shadowdark, both incredible!
I need to point my comments section of my Top 13 to your video. You named all the games they told me I left out 😂
lol, I guess I should be watching your channel then… deal, subbed!
Just pulled up you channel to go sub, and it seems like we are on the same gaming page, as you released a very similar video just 5 days ago! Thanks for commenting!
I couldn't find a place to comment on your post (My age is showing) but just wanted to say thanks for sharing that post. Appreciate the highlight!
@@ElderGoblinGames no problem.
Personally, I'm a huge fan of Savage Worlds (I'm currently building a version of Fading Suns with it) and Blades in the Dark. But I think Imma hafta give Dragonbane a try. 😈 Because I'm not buying another D&D product while Hasblow owns the game.
Sounds like we have similar tastes and thoughts on WOTC!
I need to check out Savage Worlds. I’ve managed somehow to miss it.
@@steelmongoose4956 I like it a lot. It is mechanically very slick, and deceptively powerful. Little things like the way Trappings effect spells to the way that Setting Rules can wildly change the feel of a world, add together to make a SWEET toolkit for a GM.
@@booksbricksandboards783 The reason I call it "Hasblow" is because *SOMEBODY* in the Executive Suite is obviously snorting a lot of coke. There is no other rational excuse for some of the idiot stunts they've pulled since January '23.
While it is nice to find 'new' TTRPGs, as in things that have been created in the last few years, internet have had something interesting happening, and that is that it is so much easier to find books and supplements of older RPGs from the 80s and 90s, heck, even 70s RPGs can be found and it can be fun to just do a one shot with them. Many of those games were unnoticed due to how hard it could be to market them or very few knew them.
No argument here, but a large portion of potential players won’t consider playing the older systems. I have a number of videos specifically about how to start playing older games today, focusing on AD&D 2e and BX D&D primarily, but there is a much larger group interested in modern alternatives. There are a lot of great older games, as I mentioned in this video, I’m playing 2e with my boys now, but there are also a number of fantastic modern alternatives as well. If you look at my shelf at the end of this video you will notice I’m not a stranger to the older stuff 😉. Thanks for watching!
@@booksbricksandboards783 Oh yeah, completely agree with you on that, also, two of my favorites lately when it comes to fantasy have been Cairn and Dungeon World, me and a friend of mine always DMed together since the days of DnD3.5, mostly we worked together in world building and dungeons while he did the DM portion.
Also, Liminal is a very interesting modern fantasy RPG that not many talk about.
@@TheRatedOniChannel I have enjoyed DW quite a bit. I have Cairn but not read it yet. Liminal is one I will have to research. Thanks for watching and sharing!
@@booksbricksandboards783 Cairn is the perfect 'oh, you've never played rpgs but are curious about DnD? Say no more fam' and Liminal is a bit like the BBC series of Neverwhere... which also has its own RPG, I swear, this hobby is just a giant rabbit hole.
Very good time to be a gamer.
Great video as always. Happy 4th too. Any thoughts about the new DC20 system that the dungeon coach just launched on Kickstarter. It look really interesting.
Jay, I have been eyeing it from a distance but not dove in just yet… if I pick it up, you can bet I will share my thoughts.
Great video. And fantastic list. I’ll still take Castles & Crusades over all of them. But that’s just me as AD&D 1st Edition is still my favorite of all of the D&D editions and I started with OD&D in 1974/75 and played all editions. ❤
Nothing wrong with that take… I lime C&C quite a bit. I’d person take AD&D 2e over several on the list, but I wanted to keep options more modern and accessible. Thanks for watching
Another OSR RPG that deserves mention is Dark Places & Demogorgons for both the "Survive This" system and OSE. “Dark Places & Demogorgons” is an OSR (Old School Revival) horror tabletop RPG set in the 1980s. In this game, players take on the roles of teenagers in a small town where strange and supernatural occurrences are happening all around them. The adults are too busy or disbelieving to help, leaving it up to the players to uncover and confront the mysteries1.
The game uses the SURVIVE THIS!! system, which is a d20-based mechanic familiar to those who have played classic fantasy RPGs. It features a variety of character classes like the Geek, Jock, and Goth, each with unique abilities and traits1. The gameplay is designed to be fast-paced and engaging, capturing the nostalgic feel of '80s horror and adventure films. Whether you’re dealing with creepy clowns, alien life forms, or other eerie entities, “Dark Places & Demogorgons” promises a thrilling and immersive experience
Also available in an Old School Essentials variation. Since it is Sci Fantasy it didn’t really meet my list criteria, but it is a good game!
The Dragonbane boxed set is not a "starter set"; it's the entire game in a box. Much like D&D 0e came in a boxed set or the newly released Mothership 1e comes in a boxed set, so too does Dragonbane come in a complete boxed set
Yeah, I actually mention that in the video, when I call out that it comes with a full set of the rules. Thanks for watching.
My short list:
Fantasy Hero (Hero System)
Mythras/RuneQuest RP in Glorantha
Seventh Sea
GURPS Fantasy
Band of Blades/Blades in the Dark
If those, not familiar with Seven Seas. Heard of it but not read or played. How would you describe it? Not many great pirate games out there, so might be one I’d look at. Pirate Borg was one I really enjoyed.
I had a long reply and lost it to an editing error. Maybe a second try will be better organized.
7th Sea is based on the world of the 7th Sea CCG from AEG. It's generally Hollywood swashbuckling (Three Musketeers, Captain Blood, Ivanhoe) plus cultural magic.
Each culture is obviously based on a specific European nation from an important time in that nation's history. So "Germany" is set during or immediately after the 30-Years War, France, Spain, and Russia are in the middle of the Napoleonic Wars, England is in the reign of Elizabeth I, and so on. This sort of works if you don't look too hard.
Each culture has its own style of magic that doesn't really match that of any other culture, so France has weird teleportation, Italy has soothsaying, Russia has shapeshifting, England has mythology, and so on.
The combat rules are designed to facilitate cinematic play by PCs, so PCs can often tear through huge numbers of what are essentially extras until they reach the villain, when the combat becomes much slower and more detailed.
There are solid social rules, including rules for reputation.
It's an interesting system with the right group, and worth taking a look at.
@@dougsundseth6904 that sounds VERY cool. Thank you for the long response (twice 😉). The game sounds like exactly the type of pirate game I’d want to play in as a player.
OSE and Basic Fantasy are the 2 best ADND re-done versions so far that ive seen. I lean towards OSE for the organization of the material and ease of reading.
I had the Basic Fantasy core book and some expansions… it made a couple of small changes but largely pretty accurate to the original. If I remember they gave clerics spells at first level, which for some reason was the change I remember after a few years 😀. That said, still a very good option, but hard to compete in the BX sphere when OSE is around… just so good.
@@booksbricksandboards783 true datt OSE is by far the most comprehensive version ive read i have the two advanced phb and dmg very cool
@@swordsnstones pretty much everything you would need… before OSE, I was a BIG proponent that the Rules Cyclopedia was the definitive Basic resource. OSE changed that. Allston did something very special for the time with the RC, but OSE just perfected it.
@@booksbricksandboards783I do thing RC has the best take on the reaction table though.
Here for the Crown & Skull!
lol. It’s a sweet game!
“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.”
-Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
We still play 5e but with the rules provided in the Essentials box set :D
That sounds fair… as much as I give the game a hard time, there is a lot I like about the original 3 5e books… everything after got further from my preferences. Olde Swords Reign might be something your group would dig, and it is SUPER affordable too.
@@booksbricksandboards783 I'll have to check that out. Thanks!
@@artistpoet5253 very welcome. I think I picked it up on Amazon for like $7?
Nice reviews. There’s some real genius in the indie market these days, and the stagnation at WotC is a stark contrast.
Yes. From the art to the “innovation”, WOTC feels to me like they are heating up the same TV dinner with each new release. The more hungry small pubs are giving us 7 course masterpieces.
@@booksbricksandboards783 The biggest innovations to the modern D20 style seem to be coming from DC20 (which I backed). Or I should say, at least, that Dungeon Coach’s innovations are confined to gameplay and mechanics, rather than social theory and historical revision.
@@steelmongoose4956 very well put! It seems like the effort applied to mechanical improvements is very much secondary to the effort WOTC spends on sanitizing and “modernizing” the works that came before. They stand on the shoulders of giants (literally as Gygax means giant) and call themselves tall, while scolding those of us that appreciate the older products that gave them their platform.
Best review of these ten I've seen on u tube!!!
thanks Eric!
Dolmenwood is coming!
I haven’t got to check it out yet, but Gavin and crew are legends so sure it will be good.
@@booksbricksandboards783 It’s really great. It’s not only an amazing and phenomenally detailed setting, it practically functions as B/X 2.0. He has a lot of tweaks which polish and enhance B/X.
@@hillerm I had heard that they were thinking about jumping off of the OGL with the Dolmenwood release, but I forgot about it… so this is a complete new system it sounds like? Very interesting.
@@booksbricksandboards783 No it’s still B/X but has has a lot of the options from Carrion Crawler built into the core system. He also redesigned all the spells and most of the classes to be setting specific. The entire game is really tight and bursting with flavor.
@@hillerm well, guess that is another one on the list… lol. Glad this video is doing well, because I am going to need more cash for some of these games in the comments! 😉
Oh, most are OSR. I like it. I would add Forbidden Lands
I actually would have done that before Dragonbane. For myself, Dragonbane scratched the same itch as Forbidden Lands, but with a little less overhead. FL is a great system though.
'looking to eke out another day or two in the miserable existence of a dying world and deal with the other desperate souls trying to do the same. So basically similar to Chicago, if you've ever been there.'
lol I wrote a #1 hit song with a guy from Chicago. The description above is pretty accurate for the world of professional songwriting too.
lol, no career highs as good as a #1 hit song for me, but that is a pretty awesome tidbit. If you need help writing lyrics about a cleric in Golarion getting eaten by a tentacle beast, I’m your guy!
@@booksbricksandboards783 It sounds a lot cooler than it is, believe me. On the lyrics offer, I would but the demand for songs about clerics in Golarion getting eaten by tentacled beasts has really ebbed over the last couple of years.
Awesome indie games all! Knave 2e is unfortunately missing from my library for now but will be added eventually. Happy indie game month!
Oh and as skill systems go WWN is the best! How it works with the character creation, the foci and leveling up is fantastic!
Paavo welcome back, I didn’t realize there was an Indie gaming month.
@@booksbricksandboards783thanks! It was debuted last year by Prof DM for July.
He’s a pretty good dude, like yourself.
@@booksbricksandboards783 Back at ya! 😀
Thank you for your work.
Really excellent games. I admit to being in love with the DCC RPG System.
Between the Magic and the funky dice it had me from the jump! 😉. You are welcome!
Good post and good channel. Subscribed.
Thanks! Appreciate the support.
I'm familiar with about half the games on your list and agree that they are better than modern D&D. I could easily list a dozen more.
Yeah, the problem wasn’t so much coming up with 10, but which 10 😉. Thanks for watching!
Currently running Hyperborea, 15 sessions in and we are having a blast. Using a modified simple Dark & Dangerous spell casting rule that fits the tone of the game perfectly.
About to run some modified DCC afventures, and it looks to be an easy conversion.
I played Savage Worlds and love it- but playing online and its dice system was a huge pain. Hope to try it in person.
You have a good breadth of gaming experience, would you say that from what you see of my list, this would be a good list for gamers looking to find a change of pace from Dungeons & Dragons?
@@booksbricksandboards783 Yes, excellent list for a change of pace from 5e - of course Crown & Skull and Savage Worlds would be the biggest leap rules wise from 5e. I own all of the books you mentioned (except the Pathfinder SW - I have the Fantasy Companion) and cannabalize from all of them .
One that I would add is Tales of Argosa (new version of Low Fantasy Gaming), it has tightened up LFG and the layout and rules are concise. I backed the Kickstarter and hope to get the print copy soon, but I printed out the 95% finished PDF and will play it soon. I think you would dig it - ithas a simple skills and Background system , and this combined with Unique Features that can be anything you want as long as the GM agrees to it allows you to make up unique characters without getting too complicated. Also has "Exploits", that are simpler version of Mighty Deeds from DCC and basically the possibility of Wild Magic and Corruption every time magic is used.
@@Finniganmydog Finn, I had never heard of Tales of Argosa, but definitely have eyed Low Fantasy Gaming several times. That sounds like my kind of game for sure! You named several different beats that I like in my games! Thanks for the suggestion, it is on my list (list is long and money short, but it is on there!).
Another great video, another masterful list with none I'd argue to remove. I'd add for public consumption: _The One Ring 2E_ (the Moria supplement shipping now!), _When the Wolf Comes_ (Ian Sharpe's _Vikingverse_ utilizing Rob Schwalb's _Shadow of the Demon Lord_ system), _Adventurer Conqueror King System_ (ACKS II), and of course _Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay_ (WFRP) 4E. We are truly in a golden age of TTRPGs.
Paul definitely good additions, and I never heard of when the wolf comes, but sounds pretty sweet from the description! Golden Age for sure!
Thanks for making this list of rpgs.
Very welcome!
The DCC funnel is the main reason I can't get my head into it. it seems a complete anathema to RPGs, which is more hilarious because Goodman focuses so much on Appendix N but nothing in any of those novels/media is "start as 0th level nobodies and earn your way to being an adventurer". it comes off way more like someone's crazy idea of how 1974-era D&D was, rather than based in any fact.
I know that when I was playing BX we played large parties, with each of us running 2-3 characters, 12-15 total. We had deaths pretty regularly, but not like a funnel. You actually don’t have to play a funnel to play DCC, it has the option to create first level characters (and great modules for them as well). Like I said, hard to understand until you try it… it’s frantic, it’s hilarious and because characters keep dying, players get clever about creative play, and they occasionally try some WILD things because they aren’t too attached to that zero level… YET. After one survives, that IS there backstory. They have an immediate attachment to the Baker that killed the demon with his rolling pin, even though he has a 4 wisdom score!
Here is a better list: Adventurer Conqueror King System II, Low Fantasy Gaming, OSE, Castles & Crusades, Worlds Without Number, Hyperborea, Scarlet Heroes, LotFP, Wightbox (spelled correctly), Horde Wars. Horde Wars Basic and Wightbox are relatively inexpensive options that you have not heard of, and can be found on DTRPG.
Thanks for sharing.
P.S. I love and respect your channel.
Monk, thank you very much! I enjoy getting to talk games with people I otherwise would not meet, you are now in that group.
I'm only missing 3 of those: Pathfinder for SW, WWN and Knave 2e
Very great systems and getting Hyperborea for my birthday
I hope I can get some players to test Crown and Skull one day
Hopefully, I can try the Japan-flavored 'Ronin' Mörk Borg-like
I'm looking forward most to Dolmenwood, Tales of Argosa and Mythic Bastionland
Welcome back! You’re going to have a good birthday!
Just opened our new OSE box sets this afternoon. Ah, the delicious scent of THAC0. 🥰
Nothing like the smell of descending AC in the morning!
Good stuff again. 😊
Sir Dean of the Acene, welcome back and thank you good man.
Well regarding the 2 rules you mentioned, potion as free action, and everyone and their friends have the same stats... Blame BG3. well obviously some certain companies wouldn't have fired all the talented people those probably would have explained why Larian made those choices, but heyyyy!
I am more leaning on the sci-fi than fantasy tropes (space travel... man MY STUFF) so some of those games I don't know. But still Kevin Crawford declines his world without in Cyberpunk and space opera, and I LUV those (both). Mork Borg... I have Pirate Borg, totally Kicking some ass.
DCC I love the supplements I have a lots of them. they are built on 'how to make a barebone story. the core of the game is dungeon exploration so by itself each NPC presented is like gold mine.
Savage world always loved that stuff. And I am always sad we don't have a Savage World Starfinder. the universe is really great, well written. But the rules helluva of NO!
shadowdark which I don't own, and Dragonbane , which I DO own and read the rules, are the 2 for me that appeal the most.
So great stuff as always. Thank for that.
Thanks Pral! For sure I appreciate your additions to the cause my good man.
Why isn't Torchbearer Second Edition getting love? Just curious as it is in tbr same vein as the ones presented.
I own it, just didn’t make my top list… I’d go Mouse Guard myself, but pretty close cousins they are. Thanks for watching!
Like the lack of Videos aside from Luke Crane is criminal or anyone saying anything about it.
Not anything about your output. I wouldn't know about ADND and Worlds Without Number. Just seems odd with the RUclips sphere that Torchbearer Second Edition is kinda left aside.
@@TweaksDIRT I like Crane’s work quite a bit. I have Torchbearer on the shelf, and read it twice. I thought it and Mouse Guard were pretty similar and preferred the latter because I like the graphic novel. I agree, Crane has not gotten as much attention on the whole as deserved.
Palladium Fantasy is a great game that has been around for a long time and has a huge amount of background material, I am surprised that no one ever mentions it, in fact it has 2 editions the 1st more like D&D and the 2nd more like other Palladium Books games.
Yeah, I actually did some videos on Palladium books last year… I had all of their games except the Vietnam Conflict game. If you enjoy Palladium, you may also enjoy the Survive This series. It draws a lot from BX and Palladium(mainly skill theory). I did decide to sell my Palladium collection recently, because while I love the creative stories and art, I don’t really enjoy the game system… there are several official rulings for some of the combat mechanics, and generally it is just a little too clunky to get anyone else to play it with me. That said, I have the entire Savage Rifts line because I love the idea of Rifts. Thanks for watching.
Palladium lured me away from AD&D back in the 84, and I never went back.
@@steelmongoose4956 I think Sembieda has a tremendous talent for painting a picture with his words that extends to his artists. It always feels like a world I want to play in.
I frequently use Palladium source material, the ideas and worlds created are really fun. But the system, oh the system.
@@benitopulatso6637 Can I ask you what about the system you honestly don't like? I mean combat is D20 and the skills are percentile based, these seem to be pretty popular systems over all. I would really like to know if you would be willing to elaborate.
The Dragonbane Core Box is the whole game, not a starter set
Yep, I actually said that it had the full rules in the video.
I run DCC, Neon Lords of the Toxic Wasteland, and OSE. All are fantastic
Midnight, herein lies the problem with having these awesome interactions with the viewers, now I read up on Neon Lords and I want to buy it too! Lol. Thanks for watching, and sharing… even if it might cost me $50 😉
@@booksbricksandboards783 Man it's an absolute blast!
Looks like it! Man, I dig everything 80’s/90’s, love BX and the whole style just seems very cool.
DCC/MCC, Dragonbane, Savage Worlds, Knave, Shadowdark, and WWN/SWN are some of my favorite TTRPGs. Your top 10 is insanely close to mine, but I wasn't surprised.
Great video; please keep evangelizing brilliant games that aren't the hobby's big bois.
Not Tim, my RPG spirit animal! Absolutely my brother! Thanks!
@@booksbricksandboards783 Justin: I recently picked up Free League's Forbidden Lands box set thanks to some store credit at my FLGS. Reading it, it looks really fun -- traveling is it's own mini-game!
Love hyperborea.
Yeah, I bought it for the rules set and was totally blown away by the setting.
No Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay?
I did a video on WHFRP a couple months ago. Good game, just not my top 10.
knave is a HUUGE influence on my own game, luv it
I really think that Ben did something incredibly special with Knave 2e. Gladly bought that book twice lol.
@@booksbricksandboards783 lol nice
Where can I get Hyberborea from
www.hyperborea.tv for the hardcovers, which are BEAUTIFUL, or DriveThruRpg.com
for the PDF’s. Great books! I have a couple of other Hyperborea videos on the channel as well.
@booksbricksandboards783 Thank you great video
@@salperez50 very welcome, thanks for the comment Sal!
If anyone is interested i an alternative al be it amateur give us a look see, swords n stones is on itch and dtrpg
Cheers
Keep em rollin😎🙃
Thanks for the suggestion.
@booksbricksandboards783 ty, lil bit of self promotion sorry just offerin a choice
Keep em rollin
@@swordsnstones no worries, good luck with the channel Swords. I really think that our content works a little bit like car dealerships, the more of around each other, the more it generates traffic for everyone.
@@booksbricksandboards783 CHEERS SIR i appreciate it i am sending others to watch your vids all the time as i dont really do much for content, so hopefully you get some subscriptions from it.
Very much appreciated buddy! If you see me at a con be sure to say hi.
I have no interest in D&D One. I am currently running a campaign using Five Torches Deep by Sigil Stone, but I really want to try out Dragonbane.
Dragonbane is awesome! I’ve heard a lot about 5TD, but never did the dive. Thanks for watching.
Here's my top five:
1) Cypher System Revised (i
I know, it's like calling Unreal Engine your favorite game, but that's kinda part of the charm)
2) Sword World (an accessible Japanese take of quasimedieval fantasy roleplay)
3) The Black Hack (imagine if OD&D got one more editing pass by a punk rock band)
4) Savage Worlds (flexible and to the point)
5) Sword Bastards (a game that actually pulled off combat that doesn't need its own subsession).
Part of the reason I to post this was because too many lists of "D&D alternatives" are 31 flavors of D&D.
Fair list. Thanks for watching.
DC20?!?!
I don’t know a lot about Coleville’s project, other than if I recall, no to hit rolls?
Solid list. I have several of them on my shelf and have actually played many of them, including Dragonbane, Knave, Shadowdark and Mork Borg. All great systems.
The thanks for sharing Ed!
Well for me, my alternatives are and in no particular order.
1. Castles and Crusades.
2. Mythras.
3. Runequest
4 Dragonbane
5 Against the Darkmaster
6 King Arthur Pendragon.
7. The BRP book 2nd ed.
lol you really enjoy Chaosium apparently, with Mythras being a take on Runequest, Dragonbane originating from Runequest/Basic, Pendragon being originally based on Basic, and then of course Runequest itself… lol. I don’t know anything about Against the Darkmaster but based upon the list I would think it might be related to the Chaosium system 😀😉. Nothing wrong with those games. C&C would be the closest to make my top 10. Thanks for sharing. (If I had a group that would get into the generational play aspect, Pendragon could make the list)
I cannot take this video seriously because it did not mention ACKS imperial imprint.
I actually have ACKS. Good system.
As an old school OD&D player, who also played AD&D, 2nd, 3rd, 3.5, Pathfinder, 5e, and Pathfinder 2e - I have settled on Savage Worlds / Savage Pathfinder as my main game over the last year or so. All the fun without any of the god mode PC nonsense that current day D&D injects.
Dan, that is EXACTLY what prompted my switch to Savage Pathfinder! Seem to be on the same page!
Monogamy isn't for TTRPG's!
My favorite TTRPG's and systems: 1-Cypher(generic), 2-Teenagers From Outer Space(anime), 3-Gamma World 4E(not based on D&D 4E)(post apocalyptic), 4-All Flesh Must be Eaten(zombie), 5-Battlelords of the 23rd Century(sci-fi), 6-Pathfinder 1E(fantasy), 7-5E(fantasy), 8-Palladium system(generic), 9-AD&D(fantasy), 10-Shadow of the Demon Lord(sci-fantasy/horror) and 11-Star Frontiers(sci-fi)
Good choices. I kept my options to readily available and in print.
I like these suggestions for dungeoneering games (though I would add Torchbearer for a crunchy and brutal experience). I would add my top 10 non-dungeoneering rpgs:
10. Against the Darkmaster
9. Pendragon
8. Masks: A New Generation
7. Blades in the Dark
6. Into the Odd
5. M-Space
4. Magonomia
3. Basic Roleplaying
2. The One Ring
1. Ars Magica
Fair! Don’t know 10, 5 and 4 on your list, but the rest I am familiar with. Thanks for watching!
HackMaster 5E from Kenzer is the true successor to TSR AD&D. Great game and setting, Kalamar.
I had everything up to the second monster book for it… too fiddly for this guy. But the books look great.
I switched to PF2e after tot OGL, and absolutely love it.
Played two campaigns in PF2e. Just finished up 2.5 years in the Abomination Vaults. Definitely ready for something quicker for my group.
I've been running PF2 and it's a really well put together system, but I 100% get the exhaustion from making sure you're running it "correctly." It really shines as a tactical combat game though and my players mostly love the crunch.
@@SeanFranchise I don’t disagree at all, that is actually what attracted me to it… as players gain levels and monsters gain abilities to track, it becomes cumbersome. Throw in that a couple of my players, after two campaigns and more than 3 years mind you, are still needing to ask how action economy works, how spells work and generally where they can find numbers on their sheets… it’s the adults that are slower to pick up on it, not the kids, in my experience! 😉 that said, I’ve enjoyed the system, just feel like I have done everything I want to with it. Thanks for watching!
@@booksbricksandboards783 Haha yeah that all tracks and we're just at level 1! I love the action economy but as a GM that is more comfortable on the ICRPG/ShadowDark/Knave end of the spectrum I end up wishing I didn't have to reference rules every couple of minutes. Savage PF sounds like a great alternative though since Golarion is such a dope setting.
@@SeanFranchise the Abomination Vaults AP is great too. Just ends up taking way too long for a single combat… also, player died in the campaign and then spent half of a 5 hour session to build a new character. Just a very decision heavy system across the board after about level 5.
Yawn. Shadow Dark, just like Flame Princess just sound like another over hyped semi clone. I already have a ton of clones. Why get this? Is it because a female made it? If I want simple I can play ICRPG.
I thought that was the case myself until I read it. The way she handled classes and races was very unique, offering versatility but simplicity. The torch system is also pretty unique and changes the way that dungeon crawls play. Also, content generation tools are second only to Knave for newer dungeon crawlers. Throw in the Zines she released with the Hexcrawls and additional classes and there is a lot of great gameplay in Shadowdark. None of that has to do with the author. Though having accidentally blocked her way for a few minutes while discussing the game she wrote, while she waited patiently for me to finish standing behind me, I can say she is a pretty kind and patient person as well.
No mention of Runequest? I mean it’s not exactly a dnd replacement [because it is very different], but it CERTAINLY IS a great fantasy game, and an amazing alternative!
Thing about a top ten list is there are only 10 places😉. Nothing wrong with RQ. I did some videos on the subject last year. Fine game.