another fascinating aspect is our sensitivity to truly tiny amounts of acoustic energy.. i might be wrong but as i recall even dangerously loud sounds are just a few watts of energy per sq meter and yet we can hear a leaf hitting the ground as they say. it also says something about the lack of efficiency of speakers w/ the most of the energy being wasted, like less than 1% of electrical energy gets transformed into acoustic energy in general. happy new year everyone
I absolutely hate I have to turn to the internet to be a fly on the wall of wholesome interactions with others like this. I'm thankful I have ears to comprehend all this.
Love meandering around the frequencies beyond the most readily perceptible senses of sight and hearing! THanks for the discussion it was very interesting and helped to illuminate a demarcation between brainwaves and bone-vibration I had not considered!
The first time I heard a REAL Victrola I had the most amazing experience. It was just one sound source, so not exactly realistic BUT I had this distinct VISION of me being a small child in a building in New York City and hearing sounds from the ballroom several floors below (where the adults were dancing) coming thru the air duct into my room. Crazy ... great to hear from Sammy too!! Happy New Year! 🥳
Another real good one from Dave. I'm blessed, and spend ample time actually sitting in SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA or in Big Band, or other ensembles. It's the best (most Hi Fi? LOL) you can get. Given the economics of today, it's actually not all that expensive. For what some audiophiles spend on gear, one could easily hire an actual orchestra and get ultimate sound. By the way look into schedule at The Grape (jazz club in Ventura) which is an example of good live sound such as jazz club sound and specifically the Phoenyx Big Band (spelling is correct - an unusual "outside the box" type big band - imagine big band jazz group doing tunes like "Tiny Dancer"). Good club, with very good sound person, and yet small venue.
Great conversation, add in the awesomeness that some of our body organs and bones are tuned to 100hz so at the appropriate energy level you can affect the body with 100hz, other frequencies are tuned to other body parts but a ton of ancient caves and temples have been found to purposely resonate at 100hz for what they thought was spiritual healing. Would love more of these thought promoting type workshop videos.
Your daughter is right about the cats. Although, it's not so that we _can_ hear them but rather to play on our evolutionary heart strings or annoy the sh*t out of us-one of the two. According to a 2009 study published in the journal Current Biology, when domesticated cats are purring and rubbing up on your leg in solicitation for food or attention, they embed some 2.5k in there because they know how much we love 2.5k (sarcasm). I wonder if this is a direct result of coevolution with humans since that is the fundamental of a baby's cry or if the cats acquired this some other way like trial and error or simply observing which sounds demanded our attention the most. The study doesn't say. Either way, weaponizing their purrs is exactly the type of diabolical sh*t we've always suspected them of doing. This just confirms it 😂
I believe there was some interesting research by Bell labs in sound reproduction when mono was still the primary if only listening format. While some believed that 3 channel was a better reproduction format stereo was chosen for financial reasons of easier mass adoption. Some of the early non-mono music recordings were done with 3 microphones instead of 2 by Mercury, RCA and Philips.Some of theses rival modern recordings in my opinion. The first documented use of surround sound was in 1940 for the Disney film Fantasia. The whole process must be considered from sound capture to reproduction. Most modern sound is a bunch of separate recordings being mixed together with psychoacoustics tricks being used to simulate them as happening together in the same space and time. Hearing is probably the most complex sensory input for our brain to process. Makes seeing look simple.
seeing the ground through my feet, using my eyes to keep the horizon level, my ears locate the freight train 7 miles away telling me which way is North . . . another moonless night in the high desert
Dave your videos always inspire! I have and Idea for an auditory manipulator device to fool the listener into thinking that they are in the "sweetspot" when the room cannot be setup that way. I have no way to create such a device but would like to share it with you. How do I go about doing this? When the two of you bounce ideas off of each other its AMAZING... the Student becomes the instructor and vice versa .. Thanks for the update and have a Happy and Healthy New Year to you and yours!🎉
Years ago I ran 4 tracks of a recorded band thought 4 high quality speakers, like a mini greatfull dead wall of sound. It was a positive step. I think Dave ran double PA stack speakers for the RHCP a few years ago. I would love to try this again using Omni directional speakers that are full range. 😊 my experience is that when one speaker is producing only one instrument clarity and realism takes a jump forward.
Bone conduction is just energizing the cochlea in a way that doesn't involve the ear drum because that was the original driver. Also, this is why I'm excited about dolby atmos in music so many more possibilities to include a larger and more realistic room in music.
We are not able to locate sounds vertically as well as horizontally because our ears oppose each other horizontally. Some owls have one ear in a different vertical position for localizing prey better.
Bose 901 was an attempt to simulate both the directed and reflected sound reproduction. The problem was for a full Symphony orchestra it was "ok" but for a single guitar the sound got spread too far. Perhaps a way to control the amount of rejected vs direct would have been a good addition.
I opine that the body as our vehicle for perception and understanding is ever vibrating in a verity of frequencies relative to the energy surrounding it. It seems to me that listening to music in a dark room affects the body in a vastly different way than in a lit room or outside in the open. Add to the experience of sound, music or environmental sounds, the element of other humans, lights or animals and the energy can transform the perception the body experiences as global, an all body and mind experience which could be a concert or ball game, being in a group of domesticated animals or a group of hungry wild animals. In any case the human body is amazingly vibratory; expressive, receptive, reflective, and always adjusting to its immediate environment energetically.
My daughters are way ahead of me too ;) As she said, the ear is tuned to what sounds we want to communicate. So the real question isn't can you hear 40hz, but can you hear a communication using 40hz. So in a future experiment you might find a conga player and see if that music needs 40hz and if it is important in that communication. In light, we can see the difference between black velvet and black paper in real life, but not on any monitor. I bet the same is true in music but you'd know some examples better than I. What instruments do you think are the hardest to replicate electronically. For your next conversation maybe you can blindfold test each other.
Love the velvet/paper analogy. If the light-or the perspective-doesn't move in relation to the velvet itself then we fail to see the shine of the velvet fibers so they might as well not be shiny at all, at which point you don't have velvet anymore but rather black paper. Funny because that is actually the concept behind that photo blackout paper used in cinematography-a fibrous paper where each fiber is non-reflective (matte). Incidentally, that paper is velvety to the touch haha.
I like the talk about the human ear's evolution. My question then becomes, Why do we trust these computers to tell us what is correct so often? I can closely time align, tune and voice a 3 way full range cabinet with my ear, and it sounds great and its very comfortable to listen to.... Then I can run a transfer function and time align with smaart, and I often loose that comfortable sound I had created by ear. I understand that the computer can help me in a lot of ways. But I still end up trusting my ear over the computer when it comes to running a comfortable soundscape. The larger a system becomes the more I have to just trust the computer measurements.
A microphone and an ear are not the same. An ear is attached to a head which shape affects the sound entering the ear. The ear is also attached to a brain which does the actual hearing by processing the complexity of all the sounds detected by the ear. This processing is studied in the field of Psychoacoustics. The brain decides what's important and what to ignore down to the nanosecond. It's an amazing thing we still are learning. I wonder how our brain automatically develops such capability?
do you know what happens to sound when it fades away or is absorbed? ... it turns into heat another fun fact about vibrations(heat) is that if you see something like a glowing hot piece of metal/flame/stove top, the color it glows is the temperature....so something that glows a "cherry red" is the same temp as anything else glowing that same color - so there is a range of colors below visual that we can sense as temperature - *infrared* radiation fills the gap between sound and light in the frequency range
The acoustic space/environment can often be as important as the sound source. In this case you still have not recreated that component and is not practical for larger musical ensembles. This is why a lot of engineering goes into such places as symphony concert halls. This is the ultimate goal of surround sound to recreate the acoustic environment in a different place. When watching a movie being transported to another place is the immersion.
@@HazeAnderson its not is it? is there air in space? but you see light from stars and sun right? is there light in a vacuum? of course there is. no air isnt the medium for light something else is.
How about when we 'hear' through vibration/conduction? E.g tuning fork on the 'ear bone'. Are we 'airheads' with the skull chamber resonating? Is it that conduction is the means of transmission, whether in air or other matter?
another fascinating aspect is our sensitivity to truly tiny amounts of acoustic energy.. i might be wrong but as i recall even dangerously loud sounds are just a few watts of energy per sq meter and yet we can hear a leaf hitting the ground as they say.
it also says something about the lack of efficiency of speakers w/ the most of the energy being wasted, like less than 1% of electrical energy gets transformed into acoustic energy in general.
happy new year everyone
Great chemistry, A huge blessing you have through your daughter. Keep the symphony alive.
I absolutely hate I have to turn to the internet to be a fly on the wall of wholesome interactions with others like this. I'm thankful I have ears to comprehend all this.
Love meandering around the frequencies beyond the most readily perceptible senses of sight and hearing! THanks for the discussion it was very interesting and helped to illuminate a demarcation between brainwaves and bone-vibration I had not considered!
Thank you Charles!!!
i love this. happy holidays & happy new year dave!
The first time I heard a REAL Victrola I had the most amazing experience. It was just one sound source, so not exactly realistic BUT I had this distinct VISION of me being a small child in a building in New York City and hearing sounds from the ballroom several floors below (where the adults were dancing) coming thru the air duct into my room. Crazy ... great to hear from Sammy too!! Happy New Year! 🥳
Thank you Haze and Happy New Year!
Another real good one from Dave. I'm blessed, and spend ample time actually sitting in SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA or in Big Band, or other ensembles. It's the best (most Hi Fi? LOL) you can get. Given the economics of today, it's actually not all that expensive. For what some audiophiles spend on gear, one could easily hire an actual orchestra and get ultimate sound. By the way look into schedule at The Grape (jazz club in Ventura) which is an example of good live sound such as jazz club sound and specifically the Phoenyx Big Band (spelling is correct - an unusual "outside the box" type big band - imagine big band jazz group doing tunes like "Tiny Dancer"). Good club, with very good sound person, and yet small venue.
Happy new year Dave. Great conversation!
Great conversation, add in the awesomeness that some of our body organs and bones are tuned to 100hz so at the appropriate energy level you can affect the body with 100hz, other frequencies are tuned to other body parts but a ton of ancient caves and temples have been found to purposely resonate at 100hz for what they thought was spiritual healing. Would love more of these thought promoting type workshop videos.
Your daughter is right about the cats. Although, it's not so that we _can_ hear them but rather to play on our evolutionary heart strings or annoy the sh*t out of us-one of the two. According to a 2009 study published in the journal Current Biology, when domesticated cats are purring and rubbing up on your leg in solicitation for food or attention, they embed some 2.5k in there because they know how much we love 2.5k (sarcasm). I wonder if this is a direct result of coevolution with humans since that is the fundamental of a baby's cry or if the cats acquired this some other way like trial and error or simply observing which sounds demanded our attention the most. The study doesn't say. Either way, weaponizing their purrs is exactly the type of diabolical sh*t we've always suspected them of doing. This just confirms it 😂
Dave. Good job man!
👍🤙👍
Everyone at a gig gets there own unique sound depending on their position ...mix position will always be the most golden seat
I believe there was some interesting research by Bell labs in sound reproduction when mono was still the primary if only listening format. While some believed that 3 channel was a better reproduction format stereo was chosen for financial reasons of easier mass adoption. Some of the early non-mono music recordings were done with 3 microphones instead of 2 by Mercury, RCA and Philips.Some of theses rival modern recordings in my opinion. The first documented use of surround sound was in 1940 for the Disney film Fantasia. The whole process must be considered from sound capture to reproduction. Most modern sound is a bunch of separate recordings being mixed together with psychoacoustics tricks being used to simulate them as happening together in the same space and time. Hearing is probably the most complex sensory input for our brain to process. Makes seeing look simple.
seeing the ground through my feet, using my eyes to keep the horizon level, my ears locate the freight train 7 miles away telling me which way is North . . . another moonless night in the high desert
Dave your videos always inspire!
I have and Idea for an auditory manipulator device to fool the listener into thinking that they are in the "sweetspot" when the room cannot be setup that way.
I have no way to create such a device but would like to share it with you. How do I go about doing this? When the two of you bounce ideas off of each other its AMAZING... the Student becomes the instructor and vice versa .. Thanks for the update and have a Happy and Healthy New Year to you and yours!🎉
Think about a flashlight bouncing of mirrors
Years ago I ran 4 tracks of a recorded band thought 4 high quality speakers, like a mini greatfull dead wall of sound. It was a positive step. I think Dave ran double PA stack speakers for the RHCP a few years ago. I would love to try this again using Omni directional speakers that are full range. 😊 my experience is that when one speaker is producing only one instrument clarity and realism takes a jump forward.
AND HAPPY NEW YEAR!!
Happy New Years,, 🍻🥰👍
You think we could have DJs use serato stems (each stem to a different output) then route that to different speakers in a venue?
Happy New Year
Bone conduction is just energizing the cochlea in a way that doesn't involve the ear drum because that was the original driver.
Also, this is why I'm excited about dolby atmos in music so many more possibilities to include a larger and more realistic room in music.
We are not able to locate sounds vertically as well as horizontally because our ears oppose each other horizontally. Some owls have one ear in a different vertical position for localizing prey better.
Here, for the knowledge, the algorithm, and of course Dave's analogies! Happy New Year, everyone. Make 2025 your year. God bless.
Bose 901 was an attempt to simulate both the directed and reflected sound reproduction. The problem was for a full Symphony orchestra it was "ok" but for a single guitar the sound got spread too far. Perhaps a way to control the amount of rejected vs direct would have been a good addition.
I opine that the body as our vehicle for perception and understanding is ever vibrating in a verity of frequencies relative to the energy surrounding it. It seems to me that listening to music in a dark room affects the body in a vastly different way than in a lit room or outside in the open. Add to the experience of sound, music or environmental sounds, the element of other humans, lights or animals and the energy can transform the perception the body experiences as global, an all body and mind experience which could be a concert or ball game, being in a group of domesticated animals or a group of hungry wild animals. In any case the human body is amazingly vibratory; expressive, receptive, reflective, and always adjusting to its immediate environment energetically.
My daughters are way ahead of me too ;) As she said, the ear is tuned to what sounds we want to communicate. So the real question isn't can you hear 40hz, but can you hear a communication using 40hz. So in a future experiment you might find a conga player and see if that music needs 40hz and if it is important in that communication. In light, we can see the difference between black velvet and black paper in real life, but not on any monitor. I bet the same is true in music but you'd know some examples better than I. What instruments do you think are the hardest to replicate electronically. For your next conversation maybe you can blindfold test each other.
Love the velvet/paper analogy. If the light-or the perspective-doesn't move in relation to the velvet itself then we fail to see the shine of the velvet fibers so they might as well not be shiny at all, at which point you don't have velvet anymore but rather black paper. Funny because that is actually the concept behind that photo blackout paper used in cinematography-a fibrous paper where each fiber is non-reflective (matte). Incidentally, that paper is velvety to the touch haha.
@@deviantmultimedia9497 YES, we have a strong biological sensitivity to movement! Both visually and auditory, movement gives a lot information.
I like the talk about the human ear's evolution. My question then becomes, Why do we trust these computers to tell us what is correct so often? I can closely time align, tune and voice a 3 way full range cabinet with my ear, and it sounds great and its very comfortable to listen to.... Then I can run a transfer function and time align with smaart, and I often loose that comfortable sound I had created by ear. I understand that the computer can help me in a lot of ways. But I still end up trusting my ear over the computer when it comes to running a comfortable soundscape. The larger a system becomes the more I have to just trust the computer measurements.
A microphone and an ear are not the same. An ear is attached to a head which shape affects the sound entering the ear. The ear is also attached to a brain which does the actual hearing by processing the complexity of all the sounds detected by the ear. This processing is studied in the field of Psychoacoustics. The brain decides what's important and what to ignore down to the nanosecond. It's an amazing thing we still are learning. I wonder how our brain automatically develops such capability?
do you know what happens to sound when it fades away or is absorbed?
... it turns into heat
another fun fact about vibrations(heat) is that if you see something like a glowing hot piece of metal/flame/stove top, the color it glows is the temperature....so something that glows a "cherry red" is the same temp as anything else glowing that same color - so there is a range of colors below visual that we can sense as temperature - *infrared* radiation fills the gap between sound and light in the frequency range
You got a smart kid there, Dave. Acorns.
dude so cool
"you can't recreate a sprinkler field with shower heads"
for sure
so each sound source microphone channel gets its own omnidirectional speaker
The acoustic space/environment can often be as important as the sound source. In this case you still have not recreated that component and is not practical for larger musical ensembles. This is why a lot of engineering goes into such places as symphony concert halls. This is the ultimate goal of surround sound to recreate the acoustic environment in a different place. When watching a movie being transported to another place is the immersion.
This just popped up in my feed ..... ruclips.net/video/uPKLUNQaJ7A/видео.html
Lol… unless you’re a bat 🦇 #echolocation
Also, delay, reverb, chorus, flange and various other effects mimic reflected sounds.
we know the medium for sound is air, until we come to what the medium for light is all is lost for understanding it.
Some would say it’s like the Aether. A universal medium, also the medium of fields that create light…….maybe lol
How is air not a medium for light too?
@@HazeAnderson its not is it? is there air in space? but you see light from stars and sun right? is there light in a vacuum? of course there is. no air isnt the medium for light something else is.
@@jondelaire its something. the people that created the modern electrical system knew. why dont we?
How about when we 'hear' through vibration/conduction? E.g tuning fork on the 'ear bone'. Are we 'airheads' with the skull chamber resonating?
Is it that conduction is the means of transmission, whether in air or other matter?