You may not like the design, but this is not a flaw. Neither the original 84 / 85 nor the 80x are designed to be carried cocked & locked. My 92FS has no cocked & locked option either. There is no half-safe position. Load the magazine, chamber a round, push the "trigger deactivator/de-cocker" all the way up to safely drop the hammer. You can carry with the chamber loaded and hammer down (double-action), with the trigger deactivator either on or off. The 80x manual clearly states ( multiple times ) " A safety is fully engaged only when the safety can move no further into the safe position. A safety which is not fully engaged will not prevent weapon discharge." The 80x manual makes no mention of it having the cocked & locked function.
You misunderstood the video. He's describing how he initially *speculated* whether that position might be a C&L position, but then after testing it out, he realized that it's not. And I have to assume you simply stopped watching at that point, because what he showed clearly IS a flaw in the design. He was able to put that safety level into an unintended "half-safety" state, which disconnected the trigger, but then by pressing the trigger a certain way, it functioned and dropped the hammer. That is objectively dangerous.
@@hux2000 Looks like someone would have to ignore some basic common sense to make this ever happen. You'd pretty much have to be going out of your way to try to make it fail. I very much doubt he thought it was some position for the gun to go in to, because as he states, he read the manual and it says there are only two positions and there is no C&L position... so he literally went out of his way to do something that nobody else would do. It's like the people that pull their Taurus G2C triggers 70% and then flip their safety on... and then act like the gun is dangerous, because you can do that. When would anyone ever naturally put a gun in that condition? They may as well just say something ridiculous like "This gun is dangerous, because if you point it at yourself and pull the trigger it just goes off by itself and can kill you". People have the responsibility to understand their firearms and how they work, so they don't do stupid things like this. It is not the fault of the company or the firearms design in the slightest.
"Neither the original 84 / 85 nor the 80x are designed to be carried cocked & locked. " I believe the original Cheetah series WAS designed for cocked and locked carry, because they didn't have a decocker until about 10 years after the initial release :)
@@deucedeuce1572 I used to work in customer service for a gun company and people would call in all the time describing a scenario they had to try really hard to make happen, and that nobody would ever intentionally do, and try to make it sound like a flaw. Some people just lack common sense and have way too much spare time.
@@allanstipe2829 lol. That don't surprise me in the slightest. I think they did a recall on the Taurus PT-111/140 models at one point, because if you pull the trigger 75% and then switch the safety on it will lock the trigger behind the safety, making it so the safety is disabled (or "defeating" the safety). It's just not a thing that a company should ever have to be worried about, because like, Who would be so stupid that they would pull the trigger on a loaded gun to turn the safety on? Nonetheless though, stupid people made a big deal of it, so they had to modify the safety itself, to add a shelf that would stop the safety from engaging if the trigger wasn't 100% "unpulled". (...and it wouldn't have surprised me in the slightest if some idiot shot himself, because of that he would have blamed and sued Taurus... so I get why they recalled and upgraded them all).
I see lots of comments about “it’s not a design flaw, been like that forever.” Just because something has been a way forever doesn’t excuse a major flaw. If it’s 2 position, there should be no detent for a ghost position, plain and simple. If your design confuses the operator or allows an unintended operation, you failed.
How is it a flaw? The gun was not safety on when he pulled the trigger as he pulled it sideways which is not normal. The safety has a very positive click. While he did not have in in safe he had the lever at the very edge of the detent and then pulled up on the trigger and back which is intentionally trying to cause and malfunction. The weapon has a safety he was not in safety even though the trigger was dead meaning he was riding the detent which means he was in between safe and fire. How stupid is this guy?
I'm an engineer. When you design something you have to consider "If it can happen, it will happen" so I agree this is not ideal. Not terrible, but not ideal.
@@snake109I'm an engineer also. You're being way too nice. As you say, if it can happen, it will eventually happen. Defense lawyers everywhere are waiting for someone to get shot because of this flaw, and Beretta has a 0% chance of winning the resulting lawsuit. This video could very well be used as evidence by the plaintiff, assuming he or she is still alive.
It has been mentioned in most, but not all, reviews of this new gun that Beretta intended for it NOT to be carried in a "cocked-and-locked" position. After a round is chambered, the hammer should be lowered with the decock/safety lever, and the first pull should always be double action-only. You may or may not decide to use the safety, but the gun should always be carried with the hammer down, for a double-action first shot.
Wonder they even bothered to give it a safety than? Should just be a decocker only version. Seems like they are asking for someone to make a mistake. It basically doesn’t have a safety when cocked. Very interesting.
Did you just stop watching the video after he uttered the words "cocked and locked", or something? That isn't the point here at all. The point is that it's possible to put the safety lever in an unintended, midway position, with the hammer back, which disconnects the trigger, but then you can defeat that disconnect by pushing the trigger with sideways pressure, which drops the hammer and fires a round (and also scrapes some coating off of the slide for good measure). That's objectively dangerous.
It’s a huge deal, and Beretta is ignoring it. Unbelievable they are not recalling them. Just because the intermediate position is not called out in the manual does not mean users may make a logical assumption about what that position means.
@@evajordan450 I had a hard time believing it could be cocked and locked as I figured that if it could be done for a duty grade gun SIG would have already done it, given their fondness for gimmicks. As it stands, I love this little Cheetah.
@gutblaster187 my EDC doesn't have a safety at all, and I probably would never use the safety anyway, I'm just concerned about the the remote possibility of accidental discharge. I've had a glock discharge when setting it down on a table with nothing touching the trigger. That being said, I wonder how secure the hammer is, in that under shock would the weapon fire? I'm probably going to wait a little while longer before picking one of these up
Beretta 80X is not designed to have a safety lever, but a de-cocker. Check CZ 75 B Omega - the default is de-cocker, but you can switch it for a safety lever. The same mechanism can't do both. IT IS NOT AN ISSUE - just know your gun well and learn how to use it safely.
This gun needs to be recalled, this is awful and im so glad you posted this, i was about to buy this for EDC but that should not happen whith a brand new gun, i imagine it will get worse after 5k rounds
This is something that definitely needs to be clarified. James on his TFB RUclips channel claims that the "in-between" position is a cock & locked feature. ruclips.net/video/Qpsdooq_5vQ/видео.html However this has been added in the comments: **NOTE**: According to an email I received from Beretta, cocked-and-locked carry (hammer cocked with safety engaged) is not an intermediate position but, rather, is a transitional step where the safety lever stiffens against the decocking lever. While, at that point, the trigger bar should be disconnected - it’s not guaranteed. Thus, if you carry cocked-and-locked, you do so at your own risk.
James Reeves later corrected his earlier statement to say NO, this gun was not really designed to be carried cocked-and-locked. If Beretta says you do it "at your own risk," I'd take that caution seriously.
@@RedHuntsman The whole point in this video is that the in-between position DOES disconnect the trigger, but that that disconnect can be defeated by adding sideways pressure to the trigger when pulling it, which is objectively dangerous. Did you just stop watching after 30 seconds or something?
@@hux2000 I heard it depends on the specific firearm - some 80Xs will not engage the disconnect at all in the phantom "middle position" while some behave as in the video here. You may also meet varying amounts of resistance when attempting to defeat the disconnect if it _does_ engage in the false safety position. This isn't to discredit your point, actually it strengthens it; the safety issue is _even worse_ if it's inconsistent from one gun to the next!
This isn’t something I would be concerned with. The only thing I would care about is getting the safety off reliably if I even used the safety at all. Putting a safety on and holstering are nearly never a thing that should be rushed as opposed to getting a gun out of a holster and disengaging a safety. The safety is a decocker. It isn’t a 1911. Every time you engage the safety all the way the hammer drops. As long as you follow the 4 basic firearm safety rules and look/listen for the hammer to fall, you are good to go. The firearm is good to go.
Yeah I agree . Not sure why people are so concerned with " cocked and locked " with this.. DA is literally 6lbs. If you need SA just get a God damn 92xi which is SAO.
You're not concerned that it's possible to click that lever into what the user might think is "safe", but actually isn't safe? That's insane. If a safety lever is intended to have two positions, it should have two positions, not three. And it *definitely* shouldn't have an unintended third position that disconnects the trigger...sometimes...unless you pull it in a certain way. That's going to hurt someone.
@@hux2000 Agree, and I can't understand all the people insisting "this is fine, read the manual, user error". _Yes_ the user should read the manual, but that doesn't excuse confusing and potentially dangerous design. Let's say I design an automatic gearbox. It's got the positions you expect - P, R, N, D - but there's a "ghost" position between N and D that lets you drive forwards if you turn the steering wheel slightly while you push the accelerator. That is clearly unsafe and nobody would accept "read the owner's manual" as a justification. Any car fitted with the gearbox would be recalled. Why is this different?
You see red you could be dead. Mainly because 1. You didn't read the manual. 2. You pushed it and made it stop halfway between safe and ready too fire with RED still showing which means it is not in safe mode. Why anyone would do that is beyond me. Either all the way up or all the way down. Don't manipulate the safety. I personally in 80 years have never seen a 3 position safety.
Just picked mine up today and tried the same thing. Cocked the hammer back and put the safety up into the "false detent" position halfway up. The trigger on mine DOES NOT go dead. It behaves exactly as if it the safety is OFF. Pulling the trigger causes the gun to fire normally. Pushing leftward against the trigger (while pulling the trigger) doesn't do anything different either. Nor did it take a chunk off my slide. Repeated over and over with the same result. So I'm not really sure what's going on with yours.
@@FranciscoHernandez-lt1mo That just seems so massively defective and unsafe. Like, who takes absolute care in flipping their safety up every single time? You flip it up, it's safe, you flip it to fire it's on fire. Not one person I've ever known in my life would flip a safety up and then be like "oops, it's only 99.999% into place, so I better flip it back up that 0.001% that's not even visible to the human eye". It's a major design flaw and is likely only just barely ever being engaged (like an extremely small engagement surface), I don't know the beretta 92 models and variations like I know other guns, so I'm kinda speaking from the side of ignorance, but I'm failing to see how they couldn't be a safety/design flaw.
I tested my new Cheetah today, and you don't have to push (mine) over for the hammer to drop on half safe position. I was on a range, I did load ONLY ONE round when testing, and YES it did fire on all three tests. And the click is overly obvious. Even after shooting with earplugs you could still hear CLICK and feel the firearm shuttle vibration from the snapping into position.
Hey brother I have never heard anyone saying or talking about this type of issues you are having with this beautiful piece. Thanks 🙏 for sharing because i just literally purchased this exact gun and I hope I don’t encounter these issues at all. You got yourself a new supporter here. I would appreciate support if possible!
@@mattyingling9020 He just demonstrated in the video that this one has a problem. It's right there in front of your eyes. Did you stop watching after 30 seconds or something?
The Beretta is not designed for cocked and Locked. The procedure is Decock and leave in safety position or decock and take off safety and carry in Double action. ALL of the hand guns information on operations is clearly written and explained in the owners manual. No need to visit the website.
@@hux2000 Watch the point where he intentionally positions the decocker /safety lever right to the point of actually engaging it stopping short of the safety clicking in then says he has to turn the weapon sideways as he draws the trigger back and the weapon discharges. That is manipulating a malfunction. He didn't have it all the way engaged. There is no in between. Safety is either engaged fully or not.
Agreed. Just bought an 80X today, was completely aware of this. No reason to carry cocked and locked anyways with a ridiculously smooth 6 lb double action pull.
I tried with mine. When the safety is in the halfway position, it doesn’t disengage the trigger, it fires whichever way you lean on the trigger. Only one thing I noticed with mine the first day I shot it, there were a couple of instances where the trigger didn’t reset. I made sure the slide is back all the way
Thats why you read the Manuel before use..It states make sure the Safety is ALL THE WAY UP IN FULL LOCKED position until you cant push up no more and red notifier is FULLY COVERED. OR chance of firearm will discharge ..Thats not the guns fault nor its a error in design...Your just not fully activating the Manuel safety.
I’m reading the comments here. I think it’s a reasonably big deal. It’s not incorrect to point to the manual and the “intent” and say it is operating within the design parameters - however, a new shooter, lacking the wealth of experience many of us have (I have 43 years shooting, training, & collecting) might not understand, might not notice, might be distracted trying to assimilate all the sight/grip/trigger/stance/press inputs, etc. “Design vs Flaw” - I won’t comment on it or make a stand (LOL) but I would not be surprised if Beretta executes a safety recall, even if an optional recall, to remove the mid-position of the safety making it either ON or OFF with no middle ground. I confess I was wondering about that position when I first got my 80X - and I have more than a few handguns of various types and actions. Just sayin. Hope we can all stop bickering and support the 2A here.
A few very experienced gun people looked at this an assumed it could be carried safely cocked and locked before they corrected themselves. Assuming everyone reads the manual or has an intimate knowledge of similar Beretta models is irresponsible on Beretta’s part. A non-functional, detent position on a safety lever should not exist. To your point, with all of the attacks on 2A, introducing a gun with a clear safety issue is not helpful.
@@scooter5940 There is no nonfunctional detent. That's like saying the shifter of a vehicle equipped with an automatic transmission has got a design flaw because you can rest the lever somewhere between engagement points. On the Beretta, you click the safety to cover the red dot. The gun decocks. It's very obvious.
@@Incomudro1963don’t believe your lyin’ eyes buddy. If you say it doesn’t click into the middle position, everyone who has shot the gun must be wrong. Don’t hurt yourself.
@Incomudro1963 Well, you seem pretty knowledgeable about firearms, but not about what happens in a court of law. There is a 0% chance that Beretta's defense attorneys will be able to convince a jury of that.
I think you basically didn’t push the safety “all the way”. I tried it and found that if you don’t push it all the way it can sorta stop halfway thru the motion. Basically push it completely.
@@hux2000 Yes I see now, people that think they know everything, sould not buy this gun, only people that know how to read and use a manual. Incorrectly actuating the safety can result in Negligent Discharge.
Thanks for posting this. Unfortunately, reading through the comments, I am appalled at how many people think this is not an issue, and criticize your video. (Push it all the way. You can still see a little of the red dot. Read the manual. Are they f****g kidding!?) This is clearly a massive issue! The fact that there is any kind of intermediate position that a user might inadvertently place the safety in is completely unacceptable. If a person pushes the safety with his thumb and feels a click, he is going to quite reasonably believe the gun is in safe. I just watched a video by a very respected and experienced gun reviewer who literally fired a round inadvertently believing the gun was in safe. Someone WILL get hurt because of this. It's mind-boggling that the manufacturer has not taken immediate action. There's no jury on the planet that will rule in Beretta's favor after being shown what's in this video.
This is NOT a new issue and this is NOT a new gun. The selector has been like this since the F and FS models added the decocker in the early 1990's. The Cheetah came out in 1976. 47 years ago. This is just latest version. Thanks for letting people know.
So wait, you're saying that, for half a century, owners of ALL Cheetah series pistols have been able to put them into an untended, pseudo-safety state, with the hammer back - contrary to both the weapon's design and Beretta's manual of arms - and then defeat that "safety" by manipulation of the trigger, causing the gun to fire...and everyone's just been fine with that? At no point has Beretta thought, 'You know, maybe we should fix this'? For nearly 50 YEARS? If so, that's really, really bad and 100% contrary to what I would expect from a company with such a strong reputation for excellence.
It's malfunctioning because it's not meant to be carried in the 'cocked and locked' position. I have 3 berretta's they fantastic guns. Cocked and locked is an unsafe practice with no particular benefits.
Thanks for the input everyone! This seems to be a dividing issue. I might make a follow up video and 10 month review of the pistol. I have been carrying this as my primary EDC.
It is indeed a dividing issue. One group believes that a safety that can be "sort of on but not really on" is perfectly fine, while the other group believes that it isn't. I know which side I'm on.
Safety lever can be engaged part way, which can lead an insufficiently attentive user to believe they've made the gun safe when they haven't. Problem not at all fixed.
@@hux2000 You'd have to be deaf, blind, as well as lack feeling in your hands to not hear and see the gun decock, as well as feel the action of the decock and click of the safety.
Lord help!! Look at all the keyboard Rambos criticizing this video. RUclips is starting to get more like Reddit everyday. SMH Thank for the heads up on this quirk. I stumbled across your video because I'm considering a 80x, and it's a good thing to be aware of if I'm going to be training my family to use it.
I see a lot of people defending this issue. It's a flaw, It shouldn't fire like that. Just because states "at your own risk" doesn't mean they shouldn't fix that. They need a 2.0 version soon.
Jesus Christ, it's not a flaw. I've got an 80x, you just put the safety into position like you're supposed to. Forget any idea that it's got a cocked and locked feature, because it doesn't.
@@Incomudro1963 It is a flaw. There absolutely should not be a "ghost" position between safe and fire accessible only when the hammer is back. It's confusing and potentially dangerous. _Yes_ you should know better but it's still far from ideal from a design perspective. You know how Old West single-action revolvers were carried with 5 in the cylinder, not 6 so the hammer would rest over the empty chamber? Just because "you should know" to only load 5 doesn't mean the lack of a transfer bar was totally fine.
If you don’t mind my saying, what you are essentially stating is that if you don’t fully engage the safety, the gun isn’t safe. You didn’t check for a full red dot and you don’t seem to have checked the manual to see if there was a mid-point function. But you fired the gun without checking to see if that was a valid position. Didn’t it occur to you that with the switch touching the slide, it would cause damage? You did this on purpose? Presumably with people around you who could be hit by the result of your actions?
@@snake109 You could have conducted your test with snap caps or by dry firing. Instead, you tested with live rounds in a public place. You are a firearm owner and everything having to do with that gun is 100% your responsibility. If you aren’t willing to accept that, you don’t understand gun ownership.
@@snake109 It didn’t. Any responsible gun owner you ask would say the same thing. One day, you will take off a part of your hand or maybe your face or worse still the person next to you at the range. Then you will realize what you have done through your irresponsible firearm handling, but by then it will be too late.
I was between this and the Ruger security 380 and I bought the Ruger , for a couple reasons, 1 the Ruger has an unexposed hammer so no snagging, 2 no safety decocker nonsense, for me it's one or the other safety or decocker not both, 3 Ruger is America made for $299 Beretta is Italian for $800 now where a gun comes from is not a issue until they stop importing them or parts, and lastly price and capacity Beretta 13+1 ,Ruger 15+1 or 10+1 depending on your state. If the Beretta was 15+1, and just one a safety or decocker only not both I would have but hey maybe version 2 in the future.
Many people don’t. There should not be an intermediate position. It’s irresponsible. I’m not saying the user is not responsible, but this is a lawsuit waiting to happen and a ridiculous design.
@@scooter5940 except read the fucking manual. There isn't a middle position. Most lawsuits shouldn't happen but there is an endless supply of stupid people
Damn if I push that lever from P to R the dam thing goes backwards it must have a flaw oh what a minute if I push it all the way to D it works like I want. Damn people should stop hammering on the gun. Just because they think you should not have to know what the hell your doing!!Learn how to use what ever your trying to operate and stop blaming the item for your lack of knowledge.
Funny you mention this. There is a reason all modern car's automatic shifters are organized P-R-N-D (hint: it's for safety). Look up human factors engineering.
Wake up people! This IS an intentional safety position! There is no flaw, engineering problem or whatever. Examine how the safety (de-cocker) works in single action. You push the lever all the way up (two clicks) and the gun de-cocks with the trigger free. Now go to double action mode. Push the lever up (one click). The hammer was already de-cocked and now the trigger is free. To quote the 80x's owner's manual; "WARNING: Always ensure that the safety is fully engaged until ready to fire. A safety is fully engaged only when the safety can move no further into the safe position. A safety which is not fully en-gaged will not prevent weapon discharge."
Thanks. I have one but haven't been able to go shoot it yet... I'm looking forward to it, though. Now, if they could just get some holsters out for it...
This is the same thing with the 84f. Thats why its important to actually read the user manual. Doesnt help that they dont even include a copy of itnwith the gun though.
If you spend as much time as I have with an 80X that behaves like this you might change your mind. I don't think it's a major issue, but an issue for sure.
I have the Beretta 85 single-stack model, and the safety has the same issue--except you don't even have to push the trigger to the side to fire the weapon. When the hammer is cocked and the safety is in the "halfway" position, pulling the trigger releases the hammer. Frankly, I consider it a design flaw, and a consumer safety issue at that! I wish they'd used the slide-mounted hammer drop safety like the model 94, basically making it into a baby 94. Also, as a blowback design, the 85 has the recoil-spring from hell. I showed it to some police officers at the range one day and even they were surprised at how difficult it was to rack the slide. I don't know whether the 80X has the same issue.
I also have a model 85 for 25 years, and it is ridiculously difficult to rack the slide. Beautiful gun though. I wonder if Langdon Tactical can work their magic on the Cheetah series (as per my px4 Storm Carry LTT, which is butter smooth)
@@LarrySealeArcheryCoach I actually sent my 85 into Beretta and they replaced the spring, but it was no less difficult to rack than before. Thank you for the Langdon Tactical suggestion, but at this point I probably won't put anymore money or effort into it.
I don't really understand people saying that this is "not" a problem or that it's not designed to be carried that way or that it showed up on the older cheetahs. When you get two different results (fire and not fire) based on how you pull the trigger (a little left or straight) when the safety setting is the same for both of them, you got a problem. Thanks for this video man. I guess I'll skip the 80x until Beretta figures it out and comes out with a new version.
@@williamryan9195 totally man. I don't even have the gun, but I saw another video where the dude says the manual very clearly talks about its operation. I remember before the gun came out when it was only shown in gun shows, even the Beretta reps talked about you can carry it "cocked and locked" What a load of BS.
@@wampastompastomp It's common for people to buy weapons and fuck with them right of the box. I'm still not sure what he was trying to do to be honest. It is Decock to drop the hammer and safety on. Safety off to activate dead trigger and fire. Couldn't be more simple. I personally like Decock only configuration with no safety. Don't trust what anyone says on RUclips no matter if they work for Beretta or not. Owners manual is the Bible.
@@williamryan9195 Totally missing the point. Let me quote the important part and this time try to read it: "When you get two different results...based on how you pull the trigger...when the safety setting is the same for both of them, you got a problem."
Think the best thing to do at this point is not even use that middle position at all, Ive handled one and for me the trigger would just be dead, the hammer doesnt fall! but it does for others??? weird :/
There isn't one He did not engage the safety and it was in hot position. He manipulated the trigger by pushing it sideways and pulled the Trigger even though he was in hot position.
@@williamryan9195 He clearly demonstrated that the safety lever has a third position, which is not there by design, and affects the operation of the trigger and hammer. That's a serious manufacturing flaw.
@@hux2000 He manipulated the handgun to the point of inducing malfunction which is not present in the weapons character when operated in accordance with manufacturers design. He created it.
I'd check with Beretta, don't believe the gun is made to be carried with the hammer back. It's not a two stage safety, it's either all the way on or not safe. Good video, thanks for sharing. Definitely why people have firearm accidents. 👌🙏👌
Took a chunk of the slide? Ummm no sir send it back there should be no metal falling off your slide after 1 week. Actually not sad now the FFL didn't get in the Bronze one in now....just more flaws. Honest Outlaw said he had "play through the pain" meaning the Beaver tail would bite his wrist in a way it actually made him bleed. But he's also got giant hands....hope you get it figured out buddy I was really excited for this one.
Seems to me there's all these people talking shit about a problem that doesn't exist. You can make anything mess-up if you FUC_ with it long enough! Beretta has been in business since 1526 You think they have just been getting lucky for 497yr's!!
It is only an issue if someone just picked up for the first time thought the in between position does something. When I bought mine, after a few dry fires I quickly realized it doesn't make the gun safe, but is just where the lever rests against the wall of activating the decocker.
I;m an 80x owner and I actually burst out laughing at your. There's a rule of shooting that says; "know your target and what's beyond". There's also a saying about any new gun you buy; "Read the owner's manual". If you just go out and shoot a new gun (or someone else's), the first order of being a responsible shooter is read the manual, familiarize yourself with a gun before shooting the first time (that means know EVERYTHING about it). It's pretty obvious Beretta deliberately set this "middle" position on the de-cocker. Anyone who suggests this deliberate engineering design is a "flaw" has to be some sort of a moron. They design a gun, make protypes, test, adjust, test etc. until the manufacturer has what they intend, then they produce it. Now get a grip because the setting is intentional. So, knock off the "WARNING, WARNING". You'd think you were Chicken Little or that ronot from Lost in Space. I can't believe you're not passing out warnings about Glocks not having any "safety", as in, did they really intend that little bar in-between the trigger to be a safety?!
My last two Berettas (80X and 92GTS) did not come with a paper manual. They're on the web of course but most people won't search that out right away. Also, I'm an engineer so I know a thing or two about designing things, and it absolutely is a bad design. Anyone who thinks the design is ok is a moron. Every company makes bad design choices at times, it's ok to be a Beretta fanboy and not think the company just produces gold all the time.
@@snake109 To quote the 80x's owner's manual; "WARNING: Always ensure that the safety is fully engaged until ready to fire. A safety is fully engaged only when the safety can move no further into the safe position. A safety which is not fully en-gaged will not prevent weapon discharge." Now how much clearer can the manual be? Now why would that statement be made (move no further) if they were not aware of the middle "click"? No, not bad engineering, rather people who won't or can't read a manual. Now try this on the gun; rack the slide and release itas if you were loading a round. Now push the lever until it goes no further. The hammer de-cocks and the trigger is free. Now move the de-cocker down to the firing position. It's ready to fire. Now click to that "mysterious" click and what happens? It's in safe mode. There is a very VALID reason for the "mysterious" click! In double action mode, it's really the safety! The hammer is down and the trigger is free.
One for the love of God please tag or a pin a link to their response and make a Beretta response video Two what is the name of the song playing in the beginning half of the video I completely tuned out it's an amazing song and I would love to know the name
That's a bummer, I was looking at getting this gun too. The plan was to carry cocked and locked but now that I see that design flaw I don't think I will be getting it. Maybe they should have made two versions, one decock and one safety. Oh well back to my p365xl. Thanks for the video.
Or this Beretta. Me and many others love the brand. DA/SA was how I learned how to shoot, as I'm sure many others would say the same. Beretta is a wonderful company.
1911s are antiquated garbage, and CZs are always eating firing pin retaining pins. Ill stick to my P226, and 92FS. CZ fanboys are honestly worse then Glock fanboys.
I’m unconcerned about this possible design problem because I have no interest or intention of buying this gun. I have a Sig P365 and Springfield Hellcat and to me at least, they preclude the need for this pistol in .380 ACP. Perhaps others may feel differently.
@@alexporter560 I am only speaking for myself and no one else including trolls such as you. I personally have no need of this gun and any problems associated with it will be addressed by the company and remedied.
If you don't care about it because you don't own this gun and aren't planning to own it, why the fuck are you posting? Your opinion is quite literally irrelevant. Do you just like the sound of your own "voice" or something?
There is no flaw, only inexperienced ppl. There is no halfway, there is no C & L, this is not a 1911. It functions exactly like a Bersa. Very very safe guns both...for ppl who know their operation and have common sense.
The user is able to put the safety lever in an intermediate position that seems to be safe, but is not. If you think that's "safe", you're crazy. If you think that during the lawsuit that WILL happen that Beretta's lawyers will be able to convince the jury that it's safe, you're even crazier!
@@jwchenard1 hard to sue if you cant read, which anyone who cant operate it safely evidently cant bc ITS IN PLAIN ENGLISH IN MANUAL. Its a DA/SA gun, if you dont know what that is dont buy one. Lawsuits?! Jesus last resort of low brows who cant take responsibility for their own actions. Is McDonalds coffee too hot for you as well?
You may not like the design, but this is not a flaw. Neither the original 84 / 85 nor the 80x are designed to be carried cocked & locked. My 92FS has no cocked & locked option either. There is no half-safe position. Load the magazine, chamber a round, push the "trigger deactivator/de-cocker" all the way up to safely drop the hammer. You can carry with the chamber loaded and hammer down (double-action), with the trigger deactivator either on or off. The 80x manual clearly states ( multiple times ) " A safety is fully engaged only when the safety can move no further into the safe position. A safety which is not fully engaged will not prevent weapon discharge." The 80x manual makes no mention of it having the cocked & locked function.
You misunderstood the video. He's describing how he initially *speculated* whether that position might be a C&L position, but then after testing it out, he realized that it's not. And I have to assume you simply stopped watching at that point, because what he showed clearly IS a flaw in the design. He was able to put that safety level into an unintended "half-safety" state, which disconnected the trigger, but then by pressing the trigger a certain way, it functioned and dropped the hammer. That is objectively dangerous.
@@hux2000 Looks like someone would have to ignore some basic common sense to make this ever happen. You'd pretty much have to be going out of your way to try to make it fail. I very much doubt he thought it was some position for the gun to go in to, because as he states, he read the manual and it says there are only two positions and there is no C&L position... so he literally went out of his way to do something that nobody else would do.
It's like the people that pull their Taurus G2C triggers 70% and then flip their safety on... and then act like the gun is dangerous, because you can do that. When would anyone ever naturally put a gun in that condition? They may as well just say something ridiculous like "This gun is dangerous, because if you point it at yourself and pull the trigger it just goes off by itself and can kill you". People have the responsibility to understand their firearms and how they work, so they don't do stupid things like this. It is not the fault of the company or the firearms design in the slightest.
"Neither the original 84 / 85 nor the 80x are designed to be carried cocked & locked. " I believe the original Cheetah series WAS designed for cocked and locked carry, because they didn't have a decocker until about 10 years after the initial release :)
@@deucedeuce1572 I used to work in customer service for a gun company and people would call in all the time describing a scenario they had to try really hard to make happen, and that nobody would ever intentionally do, and try to make it sound like a flaw. Some people just lack common sense and have way too much spare time.
@@allanstipe2829 lol. That don't surprise me in the slightest. I think they did a recall on the Taurus PT-111/140 models at one point, because if you pull the trigger 75% and then switch the safety on it will lock the trigger behind the safety, making it so the safety is disabled (or "defeating" the safety). It's just not a thing that a company should ever have to be worried about, because like, Who would be so stupid that they would pull the trigger on a loaded gun to turn the safety on? Nonetheless though, stupid people made a big deal of it, so they had to modify the safety itself, to add a shelf that would stop the safety from engaging if the trigger wasn't 100% "unpulled". (...and it wouldn't have surprised me in the slightest if some idiot shot himself, because of that he would have blamed and sued Taurus... so I get why they recalled and upgraded them all).
I see lots of comments about “it’s not a design flaw, been like that forever.” Just because something has been a way forever doesn’t excuse a major flaw. If it’s 2 position, there should be no detent for a ghost position, plain and simple. If your design confuses the operator or allows an unintended operation, you failed.
Design Flaw is what guy's say when they don't read the owners manual. It's not like Daddy's Glock and reading is hard.
How is it a flaw? The gun was not safety on when he pulled the trigger as he pulled it sideways which is not normal. The safety has a very positive click. While he did not have in in safe he had the lever at the very edge of the detent and then pulled up on the trigger and back which is intentionally trying to cause and malfunction. The weapon has a safety he was not in safety even though the trigger was dead meaning he was riding the detent which means he was in between safe and fire. How stupid is this guy?
@@williamryan9195 "How stupid is this guy?" Not at all stupid. You, on the other hand, are dense AF.
I'm an engineer. When you design something you have to consider "If it can happen, it will happen" so I agree this is not ideal. Not terrible, but not ideal.
@@snake109I'm an engineer also. You're being way too nice. As you say, if it can happen, it will eventually happen. Defense lawyers everywhere are waiting for someone to get shot because of this flaw, and Beretta has a 0% chance of winning the resulting lawsuit. This video could very well be used as evidence by the plaintiff, assuming he or she is still alive.
It has been mentioned in most, but not all, reviews of this new gun that Beretta intended for it NOT to be carried in a "cocked-and-locked" position. After a round is chambered, the hammer should be lowered with the decock/safety lever, and the first pull should always be double action-only. You may or may not decide to use the safety, but the gun should always be carried with the hammer down, for a double-action first shot.
Wonder they even bothered to give it a safety than? Should just be a decocker only version. Seems like they are asking for someone to make a mistake. It basically doesn’t have a safety when cocked.
Very interesting.
EXACTLY. That is not a position- the red "fire" indicator still shows...one must push all the way up to engage the safety, while it decocks.
Yes, but that intermediate position then serves no purpose and should not exist. Beretta is looking at a huge potential liability here.
Did you just stop watching the video after he uttered the words "cocked and locked", or something? That isn't the point here at all. The point is that it's possible to put the safety lever in an unintended, midway position, with the hammer back, which disconnects the trigger, but then you can defeat that disconnect by pushing the trigger with sideways pressure, which drops the hammer and fires a round (and also scrapes some coating off of the slide for good measure). That's objectively dangerous.
@@scooter5940 There IS no intermediate position.
That's really good to know and is actually kind of a big deal.
Agree. Something to be aware of for sure.
It’s a huge deal, and Beretta is ignoring it. Unbelievable they are not recalling them. Just because the intermediate position is not called out in the manual does not mean users may make a logical assumption about what that position means.
This should be recalled
@@evajordan450 I had a hard time believing it could be cocked and locked as I figured that if it could be done for a duty grade gun SIG would have already done it, given their fondness for gimmicks.
As it stands, I love this little Cheetah.
@gutblaster187 my EDC doesn't have a safety at all, and I probably would never use the safety anyway, I'm just concerned about the the remote possibility of accidental discharge. I've had a glock discharge when setting it down on a table with nothing touching the trigger. That being said, I wonder how secure the hammer is, in that under shock would the weapon fire? I'm probably going to wait a little while longer before picking one of these up
It’s de-cocker only!! Beretta makes the best firearms period! 500 years!! Get with this program!!🇮🇹🇺🇸❤️💪🏼👍🏼
bruh
And I’m glad you said your education. 🤣. Have a nice day!! -Bon Jovi
Read the owners manual.
Beretta 80X is not designed to have a safety lever, but a de-cocker. Check CZ 75 B Omega - the default is de-cocker, but you can switch it for a safety lever. The same mechanism can't do both. IT IS NOT AN ISSUE - just know your gun well and learn how to use it safely.
Jesus fucking Christ, just watch the whole video, will you? It's only 2 mins. long. You're missing the whole point of it.
Push it all the way up so the dots covered completely when the hammers back
This gun needs to be recalled, this is awful and im so glad you posted this, i was about to buy this for EDC but that should not happen whith a brand new gun, i imagine it will get worse after 5k rounds
This is something that definitely needs to be clarified. James on his TFB RUclips channel claims that the "in-between" position is a cock & locked feature. ruclips.net/video/Qpsdooq_5vQ/видео.html However this has been added in the comments: **NOTE**: According to an email I received from Beretta, cocked-and-locked carry (hammer cocked with safety engaged) is not an intermediate position but, rather, is a transitional step where the safety lever stiffens against the decocking lever. While, at that point, the trigger bar should be disconnected - it’s not guaranteed. Thus, if you carry cocked-and-locked, you do so at your own risk.
Awesome thanks for sharing!
James Reeves later corrected his earlier statement to say NO, this gun was not really designed to be carried cocked-and-locked. If Beretta says you do it "at your own risk," I'd take that caution seriously.
The in between position does not disable the trigger. If you carry it cocked-n-locked you do so without a safety engaged (pull trigger --> go bang).
@@RedHuntsman The whole point in this video is that the in-between position DOES disconnect the trigger, but that that disconnect can be defeated by adding sideways pressure to the trigger when pulling it, which is objectively dangerous.
Did you just stop watching after 30 seconds or something?
@@hux2000 I heard it depends on the specific firearm - some 80Xs will not engage the disconnect at all in the phantom "middle position" while some behave as in the video here. You may also meet varying amounts of resistance when attempting to defeat the disconnect if it _does_ engage in the false safety position.
This isn't to discredit your point, actually it strengthens it; the safety issue is _even worse_ if it's inconsistent from one gun to the next!
This isn’t something I would be concerned with. The only thing I would care about is getting the safety off reliably if I even used the safety at all. Putting a safety on and holstering are nearly never a thing that should be rushed as opposed to getting a gun out of a holster and disengaging a safety.
The safety is a decocker. It isn’t a 1911. Every time you engage the safety all the way the hammer drops. As long as you follow the 4 basic firearm safety rules and look/listen for the hammer to fall, you are good to go. The firearm is good to go.
Agree. I plan on carrying it safety off with hammer fully de-cocked.
Yeah I agree . Not sure why people are so concerned with " cocked and locked " with this.. DA is literally 6lbs. If you need SA just get a God damn 92xi which is SAO.
The double action is really nice on the 80X. I found zero impact in accuracy between double action and single action shots.
You're not concerned that it's possible to click that lever into what the user might think is "safe", but actually isn't safe? That's insane. If a safety lever is intended to have two positions, it should have two positions, not three. And it *definitely* shouldn't have an unintended third position that disconnects the trigger...sometimes...unless you pull it in a certain way. That's going to hurt someone.
@@hux2000 Agree, and I can't understand all the people insisting "this is fine, read the manual, user error".
_Yes_ the user should read the manual, but that doesn't excuse confusing and potentially dangerous design. Let's say I design an automatic gearbox. It's got the positions you expect - P, R, N, D - but there's a "ghost" position between N and D that lets you drive forwards if you turn the steering wheel slightly while you push the accelerator. That is clearly unsafe and nobody would accept "read the owner's manual" as a justification. Any car fitted with the gearbox would be recalled. Why is this different?
You see red you could be dead. Mainly because 1. You didn't read the manual. 2. You pushed it and made it stop halfway between safe and ready too fire with RED still showing which means it is not in safe mode. Why anyone would do that is beyond me. Either all the way up or all the way down. Don't manipulate the safety. I personally in 80 years have never seen a 3 position safety.
Winchester model 70 rifles
Just picked mine up today and tried the same thing. Cocked the hammer back and put the safety up into the "false detent" position halfway up. The trigger on mine DOES NOT go dead. It behaves exactly as if it the safety is OFF. Pulling the trigger causes the gun to fire normally. Pushing leftward against the trigger (while pulling the trigger) doesn't do anything different either. Nor did it take a chunk off my slide. Repeated over and over with the same result. So I'm not really sure what's going on with yours.
Mine behaves just like your, it will shoot unless fully up no matter how a fidget with the trigger, left, right no matter
@@FranciscoHernandez-lt1mo That just seems so massively defective and unsafe. Like, who takes absolute care in flipping their safety up every single time? You flip it up, it's safe, you flip it to fire it's on fire. Not one person I've ever known in my life would flip a safety up and then be like "oops, it's only 99.999% into place, so I better flip it back up that 0.001% that's not even visible to the human eye". It's a major design flaw and is likely only just barely ever being engaged (like an extremely small engagement surface), I don't know the beretta 92 models and variations like I know other guns, so I'm kinda speaking from the side of ignorance, but I'm failing to see how they couldn't be a safety/design flaw.
I tested my new Cheetah today, and you don't have to push (mine) over for the hammer to drop on half safe position.
I was on a range, I did load ONLY ONE round when testing, and YES it did fire on all three tests.
And the click is overly obvious.
Even after shooting with earplugs you could still hear CLICK and feel the firearm shuttle vibration from the snapping into position.
Hey brother I have never heard anyone saying or talking about this type of issues you are having with this beautiful piece. Thanks 🙏 for sharing because i just literally purchased this exact gun and I hope I don’t encounter these issues at all. You got yourself a new supporter here. I would appreciate support if possible!
Thanks! There are a few other videos on this issue floating around. And it's a controversial topic for sure haha.
@@snake109 You are welcome 🙏 brother. I haven’t seen any other videos like this one, but I will be on the lookout 👀 for it! Have a great weekend!!
no cock and lock for this pistols, you need to push it to the end and cover red mark
THE SAFETY WAS NOT IN FULL WAY POSITION
The original 84F had this same problem! Incredible that they didn't test it enough.
I checked the Beretta 84 (no letters after the 84) and 81. This does not happen with them.
There wasn't a problem with those or this one.
@@mattyingling9020 He just demonstrated in the video that this one has a problem. It's right there in front of your eyes. Did you stop watching after 30 seconds or something?
@hux2000 How is not engaging your safety all the way an issue with the firearm?
The Beretta is not designed for cocked and Locked. The procedure is Decock and leave in safety position or decock and take off safety and carry in Double action. ALL of the hand guns information on operations is clearly written and explained in the owners manual. No need to visit the website.
Now watch the video beyond the first 30 seconds. You've missed the whole point.
@@hux2000 Watch the point where he intentionally positions the decocker /safety lever right to the point of actually engaging it stopping short of the safety clicking in then says he has to turn the weapon sideways as he draws the trigger back and the weapon discharges. That is manipulating a malfunction. He didn't have it all the way engaged. There is no in between. Safety is either engaged fully or not.
Only an issue if you make it one by not understanding the operation of the decocker/safety
Agreed. Just bought an 80X today, was completely aware of this. No reason to carry cocked and locked anyways with a ridiculously smooth 6 lb double action pull.
On and off are the safety positions. Halfway in between is not a position. Use the firearm correctly, as designed. Apparently, it's not idiot proof 😂
I tried with mine. When the safety is in the halfway position, it doesn’t disengage the trigger, it fires whichever way you lean on the trigger. Only one thing I noticed with mine the first day I shot it, there were a couple of instances where the trigger didn’t reset. I made sure the slide is back all the way
Why would you think the gun is locked when you can clearly see the red dot (firing position)
Because it's not clearly visible silly goose. Did you watch the whole video? It's half covered up and has a very noticeable detent.
Thats why you read the Manuel before use..It states make sure the Safety is ALL THE WAY UP IN FULL LOCKED position until you cant push up no more and red notifier is FULLY COVERED. OR chance of firearm will discharge ..Thats not the guns fault nor its a error in design...Your just not fully activating the Manuel safety.
I’m reading the comments here. I think it’s a reasonably big deal. It’s not incorrect to point to the manual and the “intent” and say it is operating within the design parameters - however, a new shooter, lacking the wealth of experience many of us have (I have 43 years shooting, training, & collecting) might not understand, might not notice, might be distracted trying to assimilate all the sight/grip/trigger/stance/press inputs, etc. “Design vs Flaw” - I won’t comment on it or make a stand (LOL) but I would not be surprised if Beretta executes a safety recall, even if an optional recall, to remove the mid-position of the safety making it either ON or OFF with no middle ground. I confess I was wondering about that position when I first got my 80X - and I have more than a few handguns of various types and actions. Just sayin. Hope we can all stop bickering and support the 2A here.
A few very experienced gun people looked at this an assumed it could be carried safely cocked and locked before they corrected themselves. Assuming everyone reads the manual or has an intimate knowledge of similar Beretta models is irresponsible on Beretta’s part. A non-functional, detent position on a safety lever should not exist. To your point, with all of the attacks on 2A, introducing a gun with a clear safety issue is not helpful.
@@scooter5940 There is no nonfunctional detent.
That's like saying the shifter of a vehicle equipped with an automatic transmission has got a design flaw because you can rest the lever somewhere between engagement points.
On the Beretta, you click the safety to cover the red dot.
The gun decocks.
It's very obvious.
@@Incomudro1963don’t believe your lyin’ eyes buddy. If you say it doesn’t click into the middle position, everyone who has shot the gun must be wrong. Don’t hurt yourself.
@Incomudro1963 Well, you seem pretty knowledgeable about firearms, but not about what happens in a court of law. There is a 0% chance that Beretta's defense attorneys will be able to convince a jury of that.
I think you basically didn’t push the safety “all the way”. I tried it and found that if you don’t push it all the way it can sorta stop halfway thru the motion. Basically push it completely.
..but when he does push the safety all the way it decocks the gun and the safety is no longer engeged. It puts into DA mode.
Thank you. I've been wanting a Cheeta.
1. Confirm with Beretta. Otherwise, fully activate the safety, that will probably go away with use. 2. It should be in the manual if it's a "feature".
word. That is not a position- the red "fire" indicator still shows...one must push all the way up to engage the safety, while it decocks.
He's trying to do shit he isn't suppose .
You're missing the whole point of the video.
@@hux2000 Yes I see now, people that think they know everything, sould not buy this gun, only people that know how to read and use a manual. Incorrectly actuating the safety can result in Negligent Discharge.
Thanks for posting this. Unfortunately, reading through the comments, I am appalled at how many people think this is not an issue, and criticize your video. (Push it all the way. You can still see a little of the red dot. Read the manual. Are they f****g kidding!?) This is clearly a massive issue! The fact that there is any kind of intermediate position that a user might inadvertently place the safety in is completely unacceptable. If a person pushes the safety with his thumb and feels a click, he is going to quite reasonably believe the gun is in safe. I just watched a video by a very respected and experienced gun reviewer who literally fired a round inadvertently believing the gun was in safe. Someone WILL get hurt because of this. It's mind-boggling that the manufacturer has not taken immediate action. There's no jury on the planet that will rule in Beretta's favor after being shown what's in this video.
This is NOT a new issue and this is NOT a new gun. The selector has been like this since the F and FS models added the decocker in the early 1990's.
The Cheetah came out in 1976. 47 years ago. This is just latest version.
Thanks for letting people know.
So wait, you're saying that, for half a century, owners of ALL Cheetah series pistols have been able to put them into an untended, pseudo-safety state, with the hammer back - contrary to both the weapon's design and Beretta's manual of arms - and then defeat that "safety" by manipulation of the trigger, causing the gun to fire...and everyone's just been fine with that? At no point has Beretta thought, 'You know, maybe we should fix this'? For nearly 50 YEARS?
If so, that's really, really bad and 100% contrary to what I would expect from a company with such a strong reputation for excellence.
It's malfunctioning because it's not meant to be carried in the 'cocked and locked' position. I have 3 berretta's they fantastic guns. Cocked and locked is an unsafe practice with no particular benefits.
Thanks for the input everyone! This seems to be a dividing issue. I might make a follow up video and 10 month review of the pistol. I have been carrying this as my primary EDC.
It is indeed a dividing issue. One group believes that a safety that can be "sort of on but not really on" is perfectly fine, while the other group believes that it isn't. I know which side I'm on.
Safety is either off or on. Problem fixed.
Safety lever can be engaged part way, which can lead an insufficiently attentive user to believe they've made the gun safe when they haven't. Problem not at all fixed.
@@hux2000 You'd have to be deaf, blind, as well as lack feeling in your hands to not hear and see the gun decock, as well as feel the action of the decock and click of the safety.
Lord help!! Look at all the keyboard Rambos criticizing this video. RUclips is starting to get more like Reddit everyday. SMH
Thank for the heads up on this quirk.
I stumbled across your video because I'm considering a 80x, and it's a good thing to be aware of if I'm going to be training my family to use it.
I see a lot of people defending this issue. It's a flaw, It shouldn't fire like that. Just because states "at your own risk" doesn't mean they shouldn't fix that. They need a 2.0 version soon.
Jesus Christ, it's not a flaw.
I've got an 80x, you just put the safety into position like you're supposed to.
Forget any idea that it's got a cocked and locked feature, because it doesn't.
@@Incomudro1963 It is a flaw. There absolutely should not be a "ghost" position between safe and fire accessible only when the hammer is back. It's confusing and potentially dangerous.
_Yes_ you should know better but it's still far from ideal from a design perspective. You know how Old West single-action revolvers were carried with 5 in the cylinder, not 6 so the hammer would rest over the empty chamber? Just because "you should know" to only load 5 doesn't mean the lack of a transfer bar was totally fine.
Guys watch out the gun fires when the red circle is visible
Red you’re dead.
If you don’t mind my saying, what you are essentially stating is that if you don’t fully engage the safety, the gun isn’t safe. You didn’t check for a full red dot and you don’t seem to have checked the manual to see if there was a mid-point function. But you fired the gun without checking to see if that was a valid position. Didn’t it occur to you that with the switch touching the slide, it would cause damage? You did this on purpose? Presumably with people around you who could be hit by the result of your actions?
It's ok judge I do my firearm testing on the surface of the moon. Very safe.
@@snake109 You could have conducted your test with snap caps or by dry firing. Instead, you tested with live rounds in a public place. You are a firearm owner and everything having to do with that gun is 100% your responsibility. If you aren’t willing to accept that, you don’t understand gun ownership.
@@kb1flr Did saying that scratch your ego? Good glad I could help ya.
@@snake109 It didn’t. Any responsible gun owner you ask would say the same thing. One day, you will take off a part of your hand or maybe your face or worse still the person next to you at the range. Then you will realize what you have done through your irresponsible firearm handling, but by then it will be too late.
@@kb1flr Thanks dad I'll keep that in mind. There is that better?
I was between this and the Ruger security 380 and I bought the Ruger , for a couple reasons, 1 the Ruger has an unexposed hammer so no snagging, 2 no safety decocker nonsense, for me it's one or the other safety or decocker not both, 3 Ruger is America made for $299 Beretta is Italian for $800 now where a gun comes from is not a issue until they stop importing them or parts, and lastly price and capacity Beretta 13+1 ,Ruger 15+1 or 10+1 depending on your state. If the Beretta was 15+1, and just one a safety or decocker only not both I would have but hey maybe version 2 in the future.
For sure, I'm a Ruger fan as well. I want to try the Security 380
Read the manual
Many people don’t. There should not be an intermediate position. It’s irresponsible. I’m not saying the user is not responsible, but this is a lawsuit waiting to happen and a ridiculous design.
@@scooter5940 except read the fucking manual. There isn't a middle position. Most lawsuits shouldn't happen but there is an endless supply of stupid people
Watch the whole video instead of quitting after 30 seconds. You've missed the whole point.
My 80X did not come with a manual. Others I've talked to said the same thing.
@@snake109 if you read the paperwork that came with your 80x then you would know that the manuals are online and that you can request a paper manual.
Damn if I push that lever from P to R the dam thing goes backwards it must have a flaw oh what a minute if I push it all the way to D it works like I want. Damn people should stop hammering on the gun. Just because they think you should not have to know what the hell your doing!!Learn how to use what ever your trying to operate and stop blaming the item for your lack of knowledge.
Funny you mention this. There is a reason all modern car's automatic shifters are organized P-R-N-D (hint: it's for safety). Look up human factors engineering.
It's just not in the Safe position. The Old Cheetahs (models F and FS) were in the same manner.
Wake up people! This IS an intentional safety position! There is no flaw, engineering problem or whatever. Examine how the safety (de-cocker) works in single action. You push the lever all the way up (two clicks) and the gun de-cocks with the trigger free. Now go to double action mode. Push the lever up (one click). The hammer was already de-cocked and now the trigger is free. To quote the 80x's owner's manual; "WARNING: Always ensure that the safety is fully engaged until ready to fire. A safety is fully engaged only when the safety can move no further into the safe position. A safety which is not fully en-gaged will not prevent weapon discharge."
Luv the Beretta 80x Cheetah 💯 💥💥💥💥💥💥💥 , wish we could own pistols here in the UK
Thanks. I have one but haven't been able to go shoot it yet... I'm looking forward to it, though. Now, if they could just get some holsters out for it...
This is the same thing with the 84f. Thats why its important to actually read the user manual. Doesnt help that they dont even include a copy of itnwith the gun though.
Yea found that interesting. Had to grab the manual pdf from Beretta's site.
No safety issue at all. Not sure what your on about.
If you spend as much time as I have with an 80X that behaves like this you might change your mind. I don't think it's a major issue, but an issue for sure.
I have the Beretta 85 single-stack model, and the safety has the same issue--except you don't even have to push the trigger to the side to fire the weapon. When the hammer is cocked and the safety is in the "halfway" position, pulling the trigger releases the hammer. Frankly, I consider it a design flaw, and a consumer safety issue at that! I wish they'd used the slide-mounted hammer drop safety like the model 94, basically making it into a baby 94. Also, as a blowback design, the 85 has the recoil-spring from hell. I showed it to some police officers at the range one day and even they were surprised at how difficult it was to rack the slide. I don't know whether the 80X has the same issue.
I also have a model 85 for 25 years, and it is ridiculously difficult to rack the slide. Beautiful gun though. I wonder if Langdon Tactical can work their magic on the Cheetah series (as per my px4 Storm Carry LTT, which is butter smooth)
@@LarrySealeArcheryCoach I actually sent my 85 into Beretta and they replaced the spring, but it was no less difficult to rack than before. Thank you for the Langdon Tactical suggestion, but at this point I probably won't put anymore money or effort into it.
Ahh man… I was gonna get one next summer when I arrive back to the USA. I think I’ll wait for a second version of it instead 👍
It's a great shooting handgun, would still consider it. Just something to be aware of
Mine will fire in that position, and you don’t even have to push trigger to the side… just a regular pull will do it.
Thanks for sharing. Another data point.
I don't really understand people saying that this is "not" a problem or that it's not designed to be carried that way or that it showed up on the older cheetahs. When you get two different results (fire and not fire) based on how you pull the trigger (a little left or straight) when the safety setting is the same for both of them, you got a problem. Thanks for this video man. I guess I'll skip the 80x until Beretta figures it out and comes out with a new version.
Read the owners manual.Directions in clear english. Don't be Bubba. Stay safe.
@@williamryan9195 totally man. I don't even have the gun, but I saw another video where the dude says the manual very clearly talks about its operation. I remember before the gun came out when it was only shown in gun shows, even the Beretta reps talked about you can carry it "cocked and locked" What a load of BS.
this mofo: ruclips.net/video/AkCHAVU4lyQ/видео.html
@@wampastompastomp It's common for people to buy weapons and fuck with them right of the box. I'm still not sure what he was trying to do to be honest. It is Decock to drop the hammer and safety on. Safety off to activate dead trigger and fire. Couldn't be more simple. I personally like Decock only configuration with no safety. Don't trust what anyone says on RUclips no matter if they work for Beretta or not. Owners manual is the Bible.
@@williamryan9195 Totally missing the point. Let me quote the important part and this time try to read it: "When you get two different results...based on how you pull the trigger...when the safety setting is the same for both of them, you got a problem."
Think the best thing to do at this point is not even use that middle position at all, Ive handled one and for me the trigger would just be dead, the hammer doesnt fall! but it does for others??? weird :/
There is no middle position.
With mine, you don’t even have to push it over… just pull the trigger, and it WILL fire. No such thing as cocked & locked with this weapon.
I've got an 80X.
There is no middle position for the safety.
Engage it, the gun decocks and the trigger goes dead.
I’d love to know what beretta says about the ghost detent.
There isn't one He did not engage the safety and it was in hot position. He manipulated the trigger by pushing it sideways and pulled the Trigger even though he was in hot position.
@@williamryan9195 He clearly demonstrated that the safety lever has a third position, which is not there by design, and affects the operation of the trigger and hammer. That's a serious manufacturing flaw.
@@hux2000 He manipulated the handgun to the point of inducing malfunction which is not present in the weapons character when operated in accordance with manufacturers design. He created it.
thats not a issue that same thing is on my beretta 84F from 35 years ago
That does not mean that it is not an issue...
That doesn't make it not an issue. That makes it an issue that Beretta should've fixed 35 years ago but still has not.
The safety is between your ears use that one correctly and you wont have any problems.
Can't argue with that.
I'd check with Beretta, don't believe the gun is made to be carried with the hammer back. It's not a two stage safety, it's either all the way on or not safe.
Good video, thanks for sharing. Definitely why people have firearm accidents. 👌🙏👌
Owners manual inside with every purchase.
Seen that on a couple guns.. but the manual is gonna say that a partially engaged safety is not safe.. or something to that effect
...which simply isn't good enough. People are going to click that lever halfway and think they've made it safe when they haven't. That's a problem.
@@hux2000 agreed.. but as long as they warn u.. their covered
Took a chunk of the slide? Ummm no sir send it back there should be no metal falling off your slide after 1 week. Actually not sad now the FFL didn't get in the Bronze one in now....just more flaws. Honest Outlaw said he had "play through the pain" meaning the Beaver tail would bite his wrist in a way it actually made him bleed. But he's also got giant hands....hope you get it figured out buddy I was really excited for this one.
Name of song playing from 0 to 1:50
Great, now when we get these pre owned theyll have these "idiot marks" on the edge of the slide. Lol
I bet at least 1/10 will lol
Seems to me there's all these people talking shit about a problem that doesn't exist. You can make anything mess-up if you FUC_ with it long enough! Beretta has been in business since 1526 You think they have just been getting lucky for 497yr's!!
Honest Outlaw was saying this gun pinches his hand and it took skin off. Have you experianced this?
I have not. I really like the ergonomics of it. I grip the pistol high and ride the safety with my thumb, no issues with slide bite.
His injury is from the beaver tail not slide bite
Could also be the fact the guy is literally a giant.
YIKES wow glad I passed on that one so far.
It's a nice handgun. Just something to be aware of.
it's not a "position". you just need to keep pushing up past it.
You're missing the whole point of the video.
@@hux2000 whats the point?
шикарный пистолет, один и лучших
It's a thing from the platform, the old 80 series does it as well.
Been thinking about this handgun/probably will wait for a while. Was already on the fence. Appreciate it!
It is only an issue if someone just picked up for the first time thought the in between position does something. When I bought mine, after a few dry fires I quickly realized it doesn't make the gun safe, but is just where the lever rests against the wall of activating the decocker.
Looks like detent hang up. There's only two positions. But that fact that I did gouge the slide, is shitty.
It’s not cocked and locked capability. It’s decock only.
I recommend you watch the whole 2 mins. rather than quitting at 30 secs. You missed the whole point of the video.
Sounds like the internals need to be checked out
Slide lock safety with decocker is not supposed to do that
Yours might be defective. Mine doesn't do that. Its a hard click on, and a hard click off. No in between.
Good video ❤. Please can you say the name of the song playing during a video ❤❤❤
Its a hammer drop bro.
Working as designed
I;m an 80x owner and I actually burst out laughing at your. There's a rule of shooting that says; "know your target and what's beyond". There's also a saying about any new gun you buy; "Read the owner's manual". If you just go out and shoot a new gun (or someone else's), the first order of being a responsible shooter is read the manual, familiarize yourself with a gun before shooting the first time (that means know EVERYTHING about it). It's pretty obvious Beretta deliberately set this "middle" position on the de-cocker. Anyone who suggests this deliberate engineering design is a "flaw" has to be some sort of a moron. They design a gun, make protypes, test, adjust, test etc. until the manufacturer has what they intend, then they produce it. Now get a grip because the setting is intentional. So, knock off the "WARNING, WARNING". You'd think you were Chicken Little or that ronot from Lost in Space. I can't believe you're not passing out warnings about Glocks not having any "safety", as in, did they really intend that little bar in-between the trigger to be a safety?!
My last two Berettas (80X and 92GTS) did not come with a paper manual. They're on the web of course but most people won't search that out right away.
Also, I'm an engineer so I know a thing or two about designing things, and it absolutely is a bad design. Anyone who thinks the design is ok is a moron. Every company makes bad design choices at times, it's ok to be a Beretta fanboy and not think the company just produces gold all the time.
@@snake109 To quote the 80x's owner's manual; "WARNING: Always ensure that the safety is fully engaged until ready to fire. A safety is fully engaged only when the safety can move no further into the safe position. A safety which is not fully en-gaged will not prevent weapon discharge." Now how much clearer can the manual be? Now why would that statement be made (move no further) if they were not aware of the middle "click"? No, not bad engineering, rather people who won't or can't read a manual. Now try this on the gun; rack the slide and release itas if you were loading a round. Now push the lever until it goes no further. The hammer de-cocks and the trigger is free. Now move the de-cocker down to the firing position. It's ready to fire. Now click to that "mysterious" click and what happens? It's in safe mode. There is a very VALID reason for the "mysterious" click! In double action mode, it's really the safety! The hammer is down and the trigger is free.
@@ol_gunner13b40 lol thanks gramps
@@snake109 Anytime sonny. Kids! LOL!
One for the love of God please tag or a pin a link to their response and make a Beretta response video
Two what is the name of the song playing in the beginning half of the video I completely tuned out it's an amazing song and I would love to know the name
Interesting comparison of older cheetah's safety/detent...showing 3 positions? starting at 5:27, ruclips.net/video/ocijb16ACc4/видео.html
I would Send it back asap
Thats no issue rather just a issue with your using a gun the wrong way
You're so wrong that there's nowhere to even start correcting you. Staggering.
Exactly the same thing on the one I bought today. Have to say, was very disappointed in the workmanship on what is a $800 gun. Mine is going back.
If you knew how this gun worked or is to be carried you would know that this is not a flaw. This gun is not meant to be carried cocked and locked.
That's a bummer, I was looking at getting this gun too. The plan was to carry cocked and locked but now that I see that design flaw I don't think I will be getting it. Maybe they should have made two versions, one decock and one safety. Oh well back to my p365xl. Thanks for the video.
Why wouldn't you carry it decocked?
Why would you wanna mess with a safety if you didn't have to ? Is that DA pull of 6lb too much for you ? P365 suits you..
lol what?
If you must have a hammer fired handgun, stay with a reputable 1911 or a CZ. Otherwise, get a Glock...no manual safely or decocker to fumble with.
Or this Beretta. Me and many others love the brand. DA/SA was how I learned how to shoot, as I'm sure many others would say the same. Beretta is a wonderful company.
Huh Beretta is a 500 yr old company I would think they are Reputable! 😂
It’s a da/sa not a single action so use the safety/ decoker as intended !😂
@@22Phanatic
Amen
1911s are antiquated garbage, and CZs are always eating firing pin retaining pins. Ill stick to my P226, and 92FS. CZ fanboys are honestly worse then Glock fanboys.
No thanks, I'll stick with my M9A4
Çok guzel
I’m unconcerned about this possible design problem because I have no interest or intention of buying this gun. I have a Sig P365 and Springfield Hellcat and to me at least, they preclude the need for this pistol in .380 ACP. Perhaps others may feel differently.
dumb thing to say when the entire manual of arms is different, obviosly this is for people who want a DA/SA with a safety/decocker
@@alexporter560 I am only speaking for myself and no one else including trolls such as you. I personally have no need of this gun and any problems associated with it will be addressed by the company and remedied.
If you don't care about it because you don't own this gun and aren't planning to own it, why the fuck are you posting? Your opinion is quite literally irrelevant. Do you just like the sound of your own "voice" or something?
Hmm
There is no flaw, only inexperienced ppl. There is no halfway, there is no C & L, this is not a 1911. It functions exactly like a Bersa. Very very safe guns both...for ppl who know their operation and have common sense.
The user is able to put the safety lever in an intermediate position that seems to be safe, but is not. If you think that's "safe", you're crazy. If you think that during the lawsuit that WILL happen that Beretta's lawyers will be able to convince the jury that it's safe, you're even crazier!
@@jwchenard1 hard to sue if you cant read, which anyone who cant operate it safely evidently cant bc ITS IN PLAIN ENGLISH IN MANUAL. Its a DA/SA gun, if you dont know what that is dont buy one. Lawsuits?! Jesus last resort of low brows who cant take responsibility for their own actions. Is McDonalds coffee too hot for you as well?
Beretta is so past its prime, this is sad.