'What if Finland's Great Teachers Taught in Your Schools?' Pasi Sahlberg - WISE 2013 Focus
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- Опубликовано: 27 апр 2024
- Many governments are under political and economic pressure to turn their school systems around for higher rankings in the international league tables. Canada, South Korea, Singapore and Finland are commonly used models for the nations that hope to improve teaching and learning in their schools. In search of a silver bullet, reformers now turn their attention to teachers, believing that if only they could attract "the best and the brightest" into the teaching profession the quality of education would improve. This presentation argued that just having better teachers in schools will not automatically improve students' learning outcomes. Lessons from Finland and other high-performing school systems suggest that we should also protect schools from prescribed teaching, toxic accountability, and unhealthy competition, so that all teachers can use their professional knowledge and skills in the best interests of their pupils.
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They would leave, because they would be paid far less, work longer hours, receive no support from school administrators, boards, parents.
You failed to mention the mindless curricula and leaders in the ministries of education. No support ? ? ? How about interference by not allowing teachers with some moral conscience and character to actually teach something of value?
Thank you for stating the facts!
Praise GOD👑 Teacher Veera is a primary school teacher now in her country Finland👏👏👏❤️
actually teachers in finland are paid less than teachers in the usa
@@silverkitty2503 Teacher salaries in the US are among the highest in the world but the real problem is kids.
Let's be honest guys Finland is kind of school's we all wish for our kids to have or for us to have but ..
We aren't that lucky
We can make it happen when we raise our voices and not neglect the consequences we are facing
imagine living in south america, for us the finnish school system is like a dream, we are not even close to become it real in like the next 100 years
@@jorgequeipul True, I live in South America, I changed to an American School here in my country which is way better than my previous education, but looking at Finland, it's like an Utopia for South American
Grew up in inner city public schools. I only graduated because of my parents pushing me. The system didn’t care for us.
@@genyalej8286 Lucky enough to be in public school . Government school was even worse
When I worked in Finland for a summer and people found out I was a teacher I was given the highest respect. In the US I had developed a program that became the top program in CA in what I taught. In my third year of teaching some people came from the state and some universities to spend some time observing and speaking with some of my students. As a student I had gone to one of the top schools in the world. As a result of what I learned I wanted my students to enjoy the same experience I had. Upon graduation from college I was able to get a job at a highs school that had a record of 2/3 of the students dropping out of school. While I taught the state told me that I had not had one student drop out of school. Most of my students worked in a vocation after they graduated from high school. while I was in Finland people told me that if I would learn the language I could get a job teaching and be paid more than a university professor because or my education and qualifications. The Finn culture prizes education while the US does not nearly as much. Many years later I taught at a few universities in the Midwest and was paid quite well. If I had taught in WA or CA I would have received a 25-33% in pay simply because of collective bargaining. In the Midwest I negotiated my wages.
Lies again? UDK Module
@@NazriB what personal experience do you have in education?
What subject do you teach?
High school, junior college, and university.
@@dev_04791 I taught ROP, Industrial Arts, and construction management.
When I have kids I’m moving to Finland for their education.
A bowl of salad sameee
@Dat Trump300 low levels of immigration? what?
Same
@Walter Clements walter
Funny enough, I thought of the same thing too.
I do not think anything significant would change. Overall ambiance, culture and mind sets must change too. For example, in Finnish schools there is flexibility, assessments are personalized and teachers plan according to the needs of students.
evening mam ,
I am Daksh Kapila from Chandigarh,India. I do study in Government College of Commerce and Business Administration, Chandigarh.My college comes under Punjab university.So my question to you is that is there no way left to improve Indian education system. Please do reply mam because this is my first ever reply on youtube .
Listen to Professor Anil Sadgopal.
thank you mam
Daksh kapila I think lots of things need to change
the needs of students
Seems like Finland has an excellent system. I've noticed the school systems that produce the most accomplished students are those in which teachers are the most highly respected - Northern Europe and East Asia in particular. If a child or his/her parents look at a teacher and thinks "you're just a teacher" and it's considered a job for those who couldn't make it in the adult world, then there is no hope. But I remember, even within my high school (which was known as an excellent private school), there were some teachers who gained more respect than others. And I think just one teacher can actually make a difference.
My favourite teacher of all time (Mrs Weatherall/History) was my toughest - and many students just wouldn't take her classes because she was so tough - she actually scared students. The first paper our class had to write, everyone failed except one girl who got a "D". Mrs Weatherall was so disappointed as she was tossing the papers back at us she said "It looks like I'm not only going to have to teach you history, but how to write as well". From then on, we had to provide very clear, detailed outlines for our papers and test essays. With that she taught me/us how to structure our minds and present in a clear orderly fashion, thinking through a paper/essay clearly before starting to write, backing up our statements with facts and evidence in a logical manner, etc. I use what she taught me frequently to this day - I think differently. There were all sort of rumours about her - like she was the only female who drove a tank in WW2 - or that she attended the Potsdam Accord with a briefcase chained to her wrist and a button that would detonate the briefcase if someone tried to take it. As she would teach, there were a couple times that she did comment that the history book was close, but actually blah, blah, blah... The history books may have known what was agreed, but she knew what the different leaders argued before agreeing and she knew because she was in the room when it happened (even though these things were not reported). Students avoided her classes and those who took her classes struggled to live up to her expectations, but she got us there - we were all better for her - and eventually I earned my "A". So much respect and admiration for that incredible woman!
I taught in an outstanding Chinese public school for 5+ years (2003-08) and you're point is spot on. While in China, the teachers in my school (including me) earned more than any other members of that society. Indeed, teaching and teachers were at the top of China's society in terms of respect. One of my parents was a brain surgeon - and way smarter than me - but I could teach and he could only save your life. Needless to say, he envied my earnings. And I'm sad to say that in China today, many entrepreneurs and entertainers earn more than teachers.
If Finland's greatest teachers taught in the U.S., they would soon be devalued, demoralized, and have all of their passion micromanaged out of them, be forced to teach to the test, and soon feel like failures😢
You can say that’s again. Lol. How are you doing?
You forgot to mantion they would be forced to teach children that changing your sex is the jest way to express your inner pathology.
It is so important to consider the value, insight, and future of each individual student. Educators who are focused on learning and growth rather than test scores are bound to be more influential and beneficial to their students.
Results of student's tests like PISA are product of intelligence (which is not same in average for every country), culture and quality of education. Therefore, these tests do not show what the quality of education in some country is, because tests are not measuring quality of education alone, there is no control group. Two ways these tests can show quality of education in some country is: 1) to move some kids to different country for some years and see if they improved, 2) change constantly education system in one country and see which system is getting better results.
This is amazing. We need to keep teachers at the school instead of leaving the profession or going to different schools every few years. It's about the whole culture, cultural value and philosophy about developing people, not test scores. There is no shortcut.
Calvin Chu tried that.. I lost my job because the superintendent embezzled the money paying my salary (art teacher). I left teaching and she is STILL the superintendent of that SAME school system.
There is a MAJOR culture issue in our schools
it is about money, I left my work as a teacher to become a web developer purely because I realised I was never going to have a child or wife if I continued with this work.
I was excited as a new teacher, then I got my first job and couldn't believe the utter disrespect and behavior of students. I left and went to another country after three years of hell.
In Finland it is very different than here. Teachers are given a high level of respect there. The teachers in Finland do not have to tolerate nonsense from the students or parents. If an elementary teacher find a student difficult and has the student removed the parents much find another school for their child. They do not have school buses. At the end of the day a student gets a ticket to ride the city bus home and to ride it to school. If the student is not at school then that person does not get a ticket. The high schools are more like college. Not every class is held every day. The students typically take nine classes. At the elementary school level most teachers teach the same students for three grades but that is also up to the teacher.
No DEI/CRT.
Great analysis! I think other countries falter in FULLY adopting Finland’s education model BECAUSE of Finland’s equality of resource distribution. Fair, free, safe, healthy systems, buildings, facilities.
>Fair
Commie fair, fascist fair or capitalist fair?
@@TeaParty1776 Finland is capitalist and socialist, TP1776 You could have looked it up.
@@kayallen7603 I discussed your out-of-context, "fair," not Finland. I agree about Finland.
@@kayallen7603 Ive known that for a long time. Europe was rarely serious about serious socialism. In fact, some European nations have less govt econ controls than the US. The US is not the economcally freeest economy! I believe that is or was Hong Kong. The vast productive superiority of capitalism is well-known but often evaded by its enemies.
@@TeaParty1776 Fair for all.
The Finish teachers would quit within a week because of the abysnal curriculums, resources and lack of funding and respect for teachers in the U.K schools
You must correct Your way of spelling Finnish ! In english there is a difference between Finish Line to Finnish Line ! In Finland We use suomi - so We know Your pain !
Well finnish education has been slowing down too, funding is cutting down from the government because they have to make cuts to be able afford other things.
@@holoholopainen1627 WHATS SUMOI PERKELE
@@Lilliz91 SO THIS CHANNEL IS BOOTLEG TEDX
I read that New York has 13 languages in which they teach. I doubt Finland has this problem, illegal immigrants to this country do not speak english and are refusing to learn. The older immigrants and the legal ones now wanted to learn the language and melt in. The illegals want you to speak to them in their native tongue.. when you give people like that an inch, they take a mile. California let's illegals vote in local elections. That's the inch. Some have been found to vote in national elections too. That's the mile. Go back to if you come here, come prepared.
It has always been hard to get a teacher diploma here in Finland. When I started my studies in 1985 in TAIK (nowadays Aalto university), there was 430 students applying for the first test to become Art-teachers. Finally it was only 36 students that got accepted. Then followed 5,5 years of studying art. About 80-90% of the time was pure practical learning (painting, life model drawing, clay, glass making, how to make paper, lithography, dry needle, photography, video and more). Rest of the time was all about education, different theories and acting in real schools as teachers. I loved that big chunk of practical learning. When I loved it, I just wanted to share it with my students.
I feel the same today. Teaching over 30 years in the same school, has just made it feel like a second home. I try to make my lessons as nice for the students as possible. Background music and really good quality of brushes and other materials. Good paper quality is also important. As a teacher here in Finland we can make the decisions what material to use our selves. I have a rule for myself that I won't put any material in front of my students, that I wouldn't use myself in my art. They do appreciate it. If you have a bad working brush, that doesn't work, you will hate Art. If the material works with you, you love it. I love Art, I love teaching and my students notice it. They will like it too. That's how it works in Finland (for me anyway).😅
.
Immigration or no immigration , education in a country can only be good if teachers are held in high esteem within the society. And are trained and paid well. Their place in the social hierarchy matters the most. If you treat them as trash, you will only get that!
There are good and bad teachers in every country! Finland has very good administrators especially in the education domain. That is why they have good teachers and a good education system!
I think if teachers would be allowed to work more closely with administrators in deciding what curriculum should be implemented in the classroom, you would get better results. I think our curriculum in the United States is "one size fits all". There should be a way to individualize the curriculum to fit the student.
Thanks for your input. We need a real world wide discussion on the philosophy of education.
Nah. Our teachers just have brain damage. Increase wages and give actual standards to teachers and shit would get better.
Good point. One could argue that we need one curriculum, but maybe implement it differently for different students. There are multiple ways to learn something, there are some basics that everyone need to know if we want civilized society. But yes, the first thing is we as society need to respect and understood how important education is and have discussion about it.
Fascinating talk - as a British teacher, I’m learning a lot about the Finnish education system. I really appreciate the focus on teacher education, personalised teaching and assessment - something I want to focus on more with my learners. Thank you Finland 🙏🙏
I am lucky to have spent a year in Finnish schools lukio and yliopuisto.
Elitedevil Kiitos!
Megan ,
So how was your experience??
You are really lucky
No Way ! Which language Did You use ?
Not all problems can be solved by money or technology. .Family values are needed to have good students.
Great teachers help especially for slower learning students. But 85% of outcomes are all about the parents - teaching at home and expectations of their children.
In our local high school in a typical suburban setting, there are probably 10 Asian kids. The school is prominently white and 25% black and Hispanic. For two years Asian kids have been the valedictorian and salutatorian. When you understand why that is happening you will understand that the 'problem with our schools' isn't a problem with our schools.
Exactly, and with Biden’s open border policy, the problems in every school district is going to get a lot worse.
It is very much a cultural issue then. Asians are renowned for respecting education.
@@lesleyvass8739 It's not a cultural issue, it's a genetic issue. US white students do just as well as Finnish students. Look up PISA score by race.
Teaching is also a family business for me. And I tell people that still. I'm proud of that and considerate that's a bonus for me to becoming a teacher because since I was born, I have been taught the value of quality education and have joined all the teaching case studies at the dinning table with my parents. I didn't know I love kids until I actually got to teach kids, but I know I have always been cultivated to become an educator.
I’m finnish and I went to school in America as well. and the difference in school system is huge. Well first off single motherhood and culture is different.
How is single motherhood different in Finland? Curious if I'm reading that right?
@@megmellas5871 I would assume that fathers are present in Finland.
@@megmellas5871 80% of American black children are born out of wedlock.
Less than 1% of children in India are born out of wedlock.
@@aolvaar8792 More white babies are out-of-wedlock because there are more white people in the USA and they believe your fake reality.
@@paulcrossgrove5353 look up the definitions of ratio and proportionality.
Thank You sir and congratulations to Veera!
8,500 of the best and brightest apply, and they take 750. Right off the bat, you have a cohort that is exceptional, among the exceptional. Then five to six years of training in a research setting. Here in the USA, schools of education have some of the lowest criteria for acceptance in that field of study. Eye opening.
Oh hell... all you people either idealizing the Finnish educational system/teachers or calling them unfit for any other country because the students are better over here?? Are both still giving Finland way more credit than it's due.
Finland isn't a miraculous place where everything is fantastic, the students are angelic and respectful and the teachers sole reason for living is to teach their students all they need to live their life.
Every school has difficult students, being a Finn doesn't automatically make you a model student entusiastic to learn and absorb absolutely everything in every class. I speak only from my own experience, sure, but in my secondary school we had fire alarms, bullying, somebody stupid enough to flood the toilets just for the heck of it, police called multiple times ect. all of these are normal things that teachers just have to deal with when dealing with teenagers.
Just as there are diffucult students, even in Finland there are people who are unfit for teaching. Teachers who can't stand the ridicule or the uncaringness of their students or simply don't understand their needs, and end up tired and uncaring. However they started out as.
Finland isn't a "holy land" of education, at least when it comes to our additude to it, but we do offer equal oppotunity to all. With everyone OFFERED the best our country has, there's just bound to be more success in all.
Whatever the reality of it might be, it's certainly not our nationality alone that makes us so "great."
Well, on the contrary, I think it is our nationality, that makes us exeptional, cause evolution has worked in populations also above the neck.
Well said mään
culture plays a role m8,
@@noshowerforweeks797 Genes of a population manifest in culture.
I agree with you most of the time but by my own experience I know that Finland is the "holy land" of education.
Families need to be part of the solution not the problem, my mother tutored me in reading and an older brother in math, and I tutored a younger brother in Algebra and Geometry. I also tutored someone in reading and friend of mine's son in math, so can get help for child to learn not just in the school system but other places as well. I also tutored my girlfriend that later became my wife in some of her college work. She taught me some Spanish and Piano. She also tutored a friend in Spanish also, and the daughter of another friend in Piano.
Education begins at home...usually by example. Here the house is lined with books, every flat surface has books on it. We talk about books, ideas, ideas in books, we watch videos about certain books. Everyone reads almost constantly and...if you think about it - so do you...the Internet.
So to improve public education you are proposing to improve the one factor over which there is no control at all. And all the children that have less luck will be left in the dust.
I know many adults who hated school and had a patchy education in ‘bog standard’ English comprehensive schools, but through their innate intelligence have gone on to lead good lives with reasonable jobs and moderate salaries. It may be that I am not accounting for those who had miserable lives after leaving school with no jobs or work open to them, but I am not sure that ‘systems’ can always account for success or failure in life choices. If a citizen is born in a country like Finland, where there appears to be a high level of compliance and agreement about the collection and distribution of high tax, then you have a working system. If you are born in a country with low citizen compliance and governments favouring the lowering or eliminating rates of tax collection and distribution, then that country becomes an educational and metaphoric Wild West. But even so, out of that chaos arise good and remarkable men and women, some are virtually self educated and wise beyond their years, it happens all the time. Now that is the phenomenon of Homosapiens .
Such a great speech and sharing!
This is such an inspiring video to watch. I do believe it is true that we need to make sure we have good/passionate teachers in our school systems, but once we get those good/passionate teachers, we must nurture, support, and inspire them. In the U.S. we are so concerned with test scores that we have allowed millions of children get left behind. The No Child Left Behind act just made it worse. We don't inspire the next generation to want to become teachers because of this mentality we created. Heck, we don't even inspire students to want to come to school. Who wants to attend school when you don't learn, teach to a test, and worry about scores and data than students' well-being? I have been teaching for 15 years, I can tell you whether a student learned a concept just by watching, working, and listening to them. I don't need a test to know whether a student learned the concept of telling time. If the student is unable to perform the task of telling time, they did not learn the concept. As a good teacher, you go back, reteach, inspire, mentor, and tutor until that student masters the concept; this my friends is real teaching. I have finally come to my senses and realized that the U.S. does not want to see our schools improve. Instead, we rather keep shelling out money to companies that think they understand education but are just making a profit off very naive yet educator individuals. We put more money into education and yet more countries out educate us. We are in trouble. My goal is to leave the profession by June 2020. I cannot be a part of system that thinks educating students is data and standardized testing. It will be a sad day for me but a new chapter that I must try to endeavor. Thank you!
We have great teachers, it's the leadership who fail. You can't turn your teachers from teaching the brightest to trying to make students equal. They are required to concentrate on the wrong end of the spectrum. Thanks mr bush.
Finland students are lucky to have such an impressive education system , While i am memorising my 10 th grade books at India
:))))))
In our schools they will have a nervous breakdown before the second period begins.
The minute they tried anything outside the norms, they’d be questioned, told to stick to the state mandated program, and if they didn’t conform, they’d be let go lest they become tenured.
Lmfao our teachers in NA are so braindead. My Careers teacher failed math 12 3 times and never passed, and tried to convince us to go into bartending lmfao.
Our school hires the worst of society and then we wonder why schools being run like a prison
The exact model that works in finland probably won't work here in the states but the biggest take away is that we need to change our system and see what works.
I badly want to live in Finland because of their education system.
Results of student's tests like PISA are product of intelligence (which is not same in average for every country), culture and quality of education. Therefore, these tests do not show what the quality of education in some country is, because tests are not measuring quality of education alone, there is no control group. Two ways these tests can show quality of education in some country is: 1) to move some kids to different country for some years and see if they improved, 2) change constantly education system in one country and see which system is getting better results.
We can do what we can to create that change wherever we're at by speaking up & how we vote. From what I've gathered, Finland values teachers & students as individuals & gives them free choice, not government control of outcome like in the USA. I was a teacher in the US school system, but the Marxist principles that run it made it impossible to thrive & really help students. My hands felt tied & I left to do something where I felt I could actually do good & be treated with dignity.
@@goranmilic442 so? what are u even saying here? that Finnish education isnt actually good? yes pisa doesnt mean anything but the guy didnt even talk about pisa, cos it doesnt even matter. did u even watch the video? it really explains well how finnish education is really good, and u dont need to check the pisa test to see is the education good.
@@serkomaani4346 All I said is PISA doesn't show quality of education. And in your comment you agree with me, so I'm not sure why are you replying to me. I didn't say anything about Finnish education; I didn't even mentioned Finland.
Amazing! Thank you a lot.
He was speaking about the facts in teaching that, after 6 years of this event, still are a mystery for the leaders in most of the countries in the world:)
I was amongst the best and the brightest. I burnt out in the American public school system along with many others. Needless to say, I was never named 'Teacher Of The Year', whatever that means.
What if Finland’s admin and school boards came to US schools.
It will be the same. Parents will complain, laws and policy will still favor those undisciplined students for sure.
They would have a heart attack. Because your system is total shit.
@@formatique_arschloch Results of student's tests like PISA are product of intelligence (which is not same in average for every country), culture and quality of education. Therefore, these tests do not show what the quality of education in some country is, because tests are not measuring quality of education alone, there is no control group. Two ways these tests can show quality of education in some country is: 1) to move some kids to different country for some years and see if they improved, 2) change constantly education system in one country and see which system is getting better results.
In the USA it would never happen
Their head would start spinning
My daughter lives in Finland. This is what she said in her email this week. "We got to do a school presentation on American Christmas traditions. The students were so good!! It was insane how peaceful they were. The teacher said like two words when the kids were starting to whisper and then they were quiet again. But they were way cute 5th graders. At the end of the presentation they performed the nativity for us! It is cool because here there's a religion hour and they all read the bible or other religious texts. They read from the bible while they did the nativity for us.
" Maybe this is what makes a difference.
Sounds like you’re daughter and her colleagues were exposed to a U.S. private school which is not the same experience as a U.S. public school
I've never heard students reading the bible during "religion hour". We do have classes where we discuss religions but it's not from a christian point of view.
@Snappingturtle 267 I plan to open a school when I'm older I can't decide between private or charter.
Finland has certainly a good education system. Now other countries also need to learn and adopt better systems of Finnis or European education system. Together we can change the world!
Here, in NSW, Australia, we have accepted students who have 'failed' their final school exams as trainee teachers. It is not a valued or admired or respected profession.
WOW! That's sad.
I wish I had been a student in one of Finland schools, but I wish that one day my child could be there as students In sha Allaah ❤️
The fact that the lecture hall is 15% full tells us how much Americans care about educating their population.
they are in Qatar........
jo jo Sometimes better to just shut your mouth, especially when you don't know what you are talking about.
@@kennbo1 boo hisssss
booo hisss yourself. Does it make you feel better about yourself to put down on Americans?
@@kennbo1 What number would you give the U.S. on how much they care about the education of the population as a whole? On a scale of 1-10.
Unfortunately, we have the idea that the parents get to determine what their children should learn. Having Finnish teachers would wreak havoc in our school system by demanding independence.
That is freedom.
I'm happy for Veera
This video needs to be seen by all the ministers sitting in Indian Parliament as well as by all the teachers of my country INDIA
What a great similarity in comparing Teaching System with a Football Team :)
And the 2005 LA Lakers. Everyone needs to work together to achieve the same goal.
As a sports fan, I also liked the analogy. But what I noticed is that Pasi said a good team with good coach/system can beat a team of 5-star players. What he did NOT say is that a team of average to below average players can beat a team of extremely talented players, even with a good system. I believe the leaders/system/culture in a community/school matters a great deal but the teachers also have to be GOOD. As a US public school teacher, I know that we have many good teachers, but if I'm being honest, we also have some mediocre to bad teachers too.
We do run a school and would love to work with any quality building team
I am the result of Finnish School system. I am working in the foreign country as a Country General Manager for foreign company from the different country I live in. And definitely either of countries is not Finland. The main difference is that there is no home work after the school in the primary school, we can have different hobbies for the evening and we are supercharged to come back to the school in the morning. The second difference is that like Pasi was mentioning here that the teachers are super wise, super intelligent. You are just full of admiration for the teacher who is Master in Physics, Chemistry and Maths and knows five languages. You know that you don't stand a chance in this world if you don't educate yourself. You go the airport as a student without the money, and look the planes departing and landing, and that's how I build my motivation.
You are smarter than most Americans. You can't imagine the ingrained stupidity that has taken our once great society down so far. We are screwed.
glasslinger Thanks for your kind words! It’s about giving opportunity to education, and the rest is about your character and attitude. From European perspective Trump is a businessman with lot of negotiation skills and experience, he understands the economics and how organisations bigger than life itself like UN, WHO, WTO have been looking just their own interest with a lot of corruption and Washington DC, a swamp which succumbs every politician who goes there. That’s why it’s important that you play with simple rules: right and wrong and keep your own country interest first. We are so tired here for EU, for politicians it’s a lottery win when they get elected, they forget their own country. Similar to Washington, a swamp.
@@glasslinger I agree
@Elijah Prasad We do theory and Q&A about the theme during the class. Class takes 45 mins. But generally u are free after 14.00-15.00 hours. Then you are free for your hobbies, more or less serious. Lots of sports activities guaranteed by the community. Or you just go skiing in wintertime or rollerskate on summertime. Hockey , football. We have shorter summer holiday, from the end of May till 15th of August. But I think this everything balances and the teachers are having Master Degrees and can speak several languages. So you look up to them.
@@jukkao.parviainen8669 i dont agree on Trump but on the point re school, UK schools tend to overdo the homework. Also i think Finnish schooling does even start until age 7..is that right please? UK and US schools would be startting kids earlier and earlier if they could
Wonderful and great teacher .
The differences between Finland and the USA are as dramatic as cold and hot. Finland is a small, homogeneous country. The entire system is set up to trust teacher decisions, and the administration is there to support the teacher decisions. They are very smart, very well trained, and their profession is trusted and admired. And, they make a lot of money in comparison to what we make here in the states. They are prized by parents and treated well by administrators, who also prize their skill and expertise.
Great question and a very good talk
Hi. How are you doing.
I have got a lot of experience in respect to my own profession so thank you
My kids attend(ed) a magnet program in Montgomery Alabama. The High School was 7th in the nation. I am more than happy with their education. The curriculum was one year ahead, and later two in math. My daughter did ballet in middle school, my son does classical guitar. There's two things about schools no one wants to address; the quality of the school is driven more by the students and by the parents than the teachers or the "school."
American schools do much better than people realize. If you disaggregate the data and separate the special needs and ELL students the average student does quite well. However, we lump kids into classes rather than separating them by performance, and that undermines the program.
Moreover , teacher I dont consider is merely a teacher but a scientist at the same time and that what I do myself even teaching any new student right form the middle school to university grad,....its the most satisfying and fullfilling experience for me.
the other amazing thing is that *as confirmed by a reply to a thread below, Finnish school age start is 7 years old. Combine that with the lack of homework and its even more amazing. UK schools by 7 already have for those who join reception at 4, kids who have been going to school full time for 3 years.
The other video on Finland schools said that teachers have a Masters' [ MA] in their subject.
In the UK you can pass the Bachelors and do a one-year teacher training. This obviously makes a difference
to how qualified a teacher is at secondary level, while preparing students for university.
Teachers in Finland have more or less the same status as doctors or lawyers. Let that sink in for a minute. In many western countries the parents have the authority (or at least more power) because if they don't like the grades their children are getting, they can always "threaten" the school by taking their kids to another one. The reason Finland uses "socialism" in the education system is because that's a field where it makes sense. Schools aren't dependent on retarded customers who think they know better, and teachers are educated and respected enough for the society to trust their work.
I believe home/parenting is probably a big difference between the two countries.
Music play integral part.
In most other videos about finish school comments are turned off. Wonder why. However is my comment to why they have success over almost all other schools : MOTIVATION over DOMINATION.
What a motivational speaker
Great suit and the dissonant spots and checks I enjoyed too! The talk was interesting.
Finnish teacher salaries US$37k following 5-6 years study with Masters degree, US salaries US$45k and Finland cost of living is 30% higher. Think about that Murika.
This cost of living comparison is always misleading between USA and Europe where you have free education for your children, you have free healthcare and much, much more.
In finland the education system serves a homogonous advanced population
This makes things very very easy as compared to try levelling up in a multi learning speed multi cultural society
Look at china . No issues with education
Look at switzeeland poland or hungary .. same
Look at Paris suburbs east london . Or most usa cities . Extremely challenging to put it politely
if you have 60 kids in a class, it's a little more difficult.
I want to experience teaching in Finland. It's really different system in my country. Actually we had almost the same system in the past but when time changed things are changed too. so sad.
In the late 1970s, an education study on the Bible Belt excluding urban areas found that scholastic achievement was on par with the world's best. To address the disparity, no further studies were conducted.
Hello
Good video, very interesting.
Just one question ¿How Finnish students behave in the classroom? ¿do Finnish schools have a department to help out with students' behaviour?
Finland کاتعلیمی نظام دیکھ کر بہت خوشی ہوئی دنیا کا سب سے اہم کام نسل نو کو علم کے نور سے آراستہ کرنا ہی ہے تاکہ مستقبل میں درپیش تمام مسائل کے حل دریافت کرنے کی صلاحیت میں اضافہ ہو۔
Sometimes I wonder why teachers go through college to learn about child development, only to be thrown into a classroom to follow a schedule and a textbook series set by people who are oblivious to child development. If this is what the Finnish teachers would have to put up with, then my answer is probably no.
Maybe if we made an experiment, let’s see how different types of school react having a teacher of a different caliber, to see how this model can adapt or be adapted to other countries.
The plan is to send a small group of teachers to different countries for 1-3 months each, to see if their experience and education system adapts or can be adapted to the rest of the world (and introduce a new way of seeing things, inspiring students, teachers, or even other schools to adopt their teachings).
We need to value early and late childhood education as mush as anti violence, health, antipoverty, etc.
Best way to combat poverty and violence is our schools lol. Stop hiring mcdonald workers into schools and maybe the system might change.
THANK GOODNESS a video about schools that RUclips hasn't turned off the comments for, in a misguided and paternal effort to "protect children from potential predators"!!! Seriously though - Finland does a LOT of stuff right: we should send all school board members over there to learn how it's done properly.
Considering the fact that the power school boards have is one of the problems, that would be self defeating
I Agree to Sahlberg.
How big are the classes? How many problem pupils do they have per class?
I'm not sure about university but with elementary school (ages 7-12) there are around 20-25 in a class, in middle school (ages 13-15) there is around 25-30, and in high school (16-18) there is around 30-35. The amount of troublemakers depends on where you live. I had my school in a pretty poor neighborhood so the amount of troublemakers could easily be over half of the class. Most of the time there were only around 5 or so good students while everyone else was a troublemaker. However in high school the amount of troublemakers is very close to 0.
I am curios how the teacher in Finland runs the class. Is there any video that shows the Finland teachers teaching 1 full hour from beginning to the end of the lesson.
I am a primary teacher in Indonesia. Education in my country is the lowest rank of the world. I really want to learn from Finland teachers what do they do in class and out class. I want to improve my skills, my method of teaching. Sometimes I feel my way of teaching is old fashioned and makes students bored. Sometimes I also bored doing same things, teach same things every year. Routines make teachers bored. Is there any forum that I can join with Finland teacher. I really want to learn. Please count me in. Thank you
Please start by googling. For example, Typical Finland Classroom
ruclips.net/video/P4JTW8eI6bk/видео.html
What Makes Finnish Education Effective and Fun
ruclips.net/video/3n0kCqEvcmY/видео.html
They would be horrified at the behavior of kids now a days.
A master’s degree is great but great mentors, experience and the view of education also make a big difference. Parents do not all trust teachers and schools and education is not valued by everyone.
American public education has always been almost entirely about indoctrination to be mass production worker.
And yes, I agree that in Murica the working classes largely do not trust highly educated, knowledgeable people, even if they have a degree themselves.
It doesn't help that the web has allowed confused and ignorant people to encourage each other.
Before the web it was difficult for them to cnotact each other since nearly all publications had some sort of editor.
I'm sure there are great teachers in Finland like anywhere else but I wonder how the severe weather in Finland which may limit outdoor activity affects class/study times? Anyone?
Check out videos and pictures online. Finnish kids will bike to school in the winter months. They enjoy outdoor activities throughout the year.
Cold and harsh weather doesn't affect our school days at all! If the temperature goes under -25 celsius we're allowed to stay inside but otherwise students go out and play as usual during breaks :)
There are really only 2 things that change with the cold weather. Those being that depending in the school, if it gets cold enough you can stay inside during the recess and that sports such as football are not played outside anymore and that there is skiing and skating introduced.
Finland has 5.5 million people. Ethnically and culturally 5 million of them are the same, so a homogeneous country. We have twice as many people in NYC alone. Yes, they have made a commitment to successful education in their country, but this is so much easier when your population is on the same page in so many ways. Envious to see such a well,managed, successful school system.
You get great teachers all around the world, what you don't get is a well funded education system all around the world. You pay teachers a non-menial salary and you will be surprised at how the children will prosper. It all boils down to the matter of funding
Hello
great video
The change comes gradually... So i think if ur teachers r ready to live here for ten years.. They might b able to b successful..
Finnish teachers would be getting beat up like the teachers in the United States . Two totally different types of students
If you abandon a child they act out if you abandon fair education for ALL AMERICAN children and assume all are bad then you hurt those who are good who out way the bad students. And you keep the discrimination towards those in our country who need help the most. Pathetic!
400 million guns under beds in usa for SAFETY.
AS FOR DRUGS..........
The mother does not care about the inner city child. The father is already gone.
The child, who never asked to be born into this disastrous situation is now trapped.
There are no real role models so the pathology repeats itself.
The Fins would get eaten alive in every single big city ghetto. The parents, administration, and community have already given up on the children. The moment that the teacher tried to gain control of the class, they would be fired! They would never even get a chance.
American student: F this lesson
Finnish visiting teacher: Go to the office
American student goes to the office and returns 10 minutes later smiling and high fiving other students as the sit back in their desk.
Finnish teacher: What are you doing back here? I sent you to the office!
American student: They told me to call home for my mom to come get me but she didn't answer. The principal said to stop cussing and go back to class.
This literally happened to me my first year teaching... literally. At some places, it doesn't matter if you have some fancy masters degree, you literally cannot teach with students like this!
Because you can influence young people's life's
Having great teachers is only a part of the equation. Finland also has a culture of agreeableness and conscientiousness, plus a very high enthic homogeneity. These are all factors that make their school system work so well.
I believe people in Finland generally see great value in the 'common good'. It is at the centre of a LOT of their decision making. In the US the 'common good' is scorned and ridiculed. Rugged individualism is the mantra of the US, which involves stepping on others, squishing them if necessary, if it means achieving 'success'.
I'm in 🇨🇦 and feel much closer to the Finnish model.
@@coopwannabee8675 Bro what? Im in CA and its cancer bullshit. Our teacher threw a chair at a student and was fired but rehired. Our other teacher failed math 12 three times in a row and tried to teach us how to do resume.
Our math teacher didnt know about functions despite her being a math teacher.
I live near Vancouver, in a really economically active suburb. How tf is our school this bad.
Where I teach, I have 45 third graders in my class and they must accumulate written activities (as prescribed from officials!) and this is so wrong ! Take me to Finland!
45 in your class per day?? 😲 I remember as s kid when I was in 3rd grade we only had 22 kids in the class. Is packing in the kids normal for elementary schools now?
Old Wes I do 🤣
Results of student's tests like PISA are product of intelligence (which is not same in average for every country), culture and quality of education. Therefore, these tests do not show what the quality of education in some country is, because tests are not measuring quality of education alone, there is no control group. Two ways these tests can show quality of education in some country is: 1) to move some kids to different country for some years and see if they improved, 2) change constantly education system in one country and see which system is getting better results.
Then nothing would change, because all of my teachers already are Finnish
I would love to teach in Finland. To learn from both the teacher and the learner.
The whole Scandinavian people seem to be ultra nice! A lot easier for things to flow in harmony.
@@Jimmy911ism What does Scandinavia have to do with her comment?
Students who are not interested in learning is a big factor in inner city schools in the US. Why the big deal about entrance exams? There are online schools in the US such as WGU.edu
They do
great teachers in Finland. They are giving kids freedom to develop on their own. When they grow up they will have to solve a lot of problems created by lot of children with no proper education, like global warming ,plastic contamination, disappearing forests.
LOL....what a dumb thing to say, they are getting a proper education, doesnt have to be your indian way of cramming everything and memorizing 247 to learn
I watched another video about Finland and it's teachers.
What I noticed REALLY different than what I saw in my 14 years of teaching in American high schools:
The students, not the difference in teachers or teaching.
I guarantee in Finland you will never have a "dumping ground" type of class where troublemakers/disrupters are sent.
I guarantee you won't have multiple language speakers as in America.
I guarantee you won't have up to 25% of your class with Resrouce students.
You won't have administration that folds like a tent to parental pressure
We used to say that we can only control within our four walls.
In a perfect world, education would be easy.
yet multiple language Asian kids (specifically Chinese/Korean and Indian) tend do better than monolingual white or black students
What is wrong with multiple language speakers? Do you mean kids who speak Spanish first, but English second? What are 'resource students'?
The dumping ground thing is good, but how do you know? Can you give us examples of what they do with problem students?
W. Edwards Deming sorted this out decades ago. He stated that quality is 90 to 95% due to management, because employees usually do not have the power to change what they know is wrong. This is absolutely true of education in every state in the union. It starts with the US Department of Education and the shit rolls downhill from there. I remember education before the Department of Education existed. Education has gotten steadily worse since it was created.
Likely not relevant, but many European countries are located at higher latitudes. They spend more time indoors as it gets a bit nippy outside a good portion of the year.
I absolutely loved his comments. It will never happen in the United States. I am retired 35 year public high school teacher. Finland sounds like heaven to me.
None of the Finnish education system would not be possible without the compulsory progressive income taxation system. For example the US would have to change how their whole government is run to implement the same type of education system.
how much are teachers paid in finland??
They the system and type of school which educated and skilled that teacher.
How much time does the teacher in Finland spend on problem students vs here in the U.S. ?
As a Fin i can tell from experience for being one. I was removed from normal school to "special school" ESY which translates roughly that it provides special education for those who dont fit with the norm but uses the normal education formula. Which basically means that the education standard doesnt drop, but im moved to smaller group so i dont bother the others. I was there from fourth to sixth grade. You could call it kinda like rehabilitation in a way. On seventh grade i wasn´t problem anymore for the others and i went back to my normal school, but i still worked in small group class with special education teacher on certain subjects like math and english. So id say not that much time at all. They are very quick at reacting to problem students and very good at identifying what is the cause for problems and solving them together with parents. And for that im gratefull. Sorry for my bad english i was never the sharpest pen of my society haha.
@@TheOkkopokko They are very quick at reacting to problem students and very good at identifying what is the cause for problems and solving them together with parents.
And if like in America 70% of those family's their is no father in the home...violence is taught at an early age was how to solve problems. I doubt if many Finn teachers have ever met with problems such as these and could do no better than American teachers.
@@airportrunway3987 My mother is teacher and believe me, even in Finland there are serious cases of mental unstability, violence and really bad families in every school. Probably not nearly as much as in US, but these cases are still dealt with utmost care to give best opportunity for kids.
She talked about one kid that had all of those problems and was attacked or at least threatened with knife or something. Can't really remember which it was. Still was that kid's teacher afterwards :D
@@airportrunway3987 Where did you get that 70% number from? I see an average of about 28% for the USA.