Thanks for the discussion, I would disagree partly with the assertion that EV bikes aren’t a replacement for ICE bikes. They aren’t yet a replacement for some segments due to technological limitations, but are replacements in other market segments.
Energica was the finest, on the highway at 70mph you had 130 miles of range. What it needed was the NACS port to be compatible for the Tesla Supercharger Network. Fastest recharge times at locations all across the USA. 1 - They couldn't get Tesla to allow access. 2 - current battery tech results in a heavy motorcycle, perhaps Honda with their new solid state battery tech may result in a lower weight future E-Motorcycle, combined with Honda's expertise in large production volumes could be the next winner, here's hoping.
I own an S2 Del Mar and the limited range annoys me to no end. Highway speeds, basically anything above 60 mph, effectively cuts the range in half. I can not rely on the the bike's range estimator unless I'm solely riding in the city. I'm all in with electric vehicles. My daily commuter car is an EV. However, EV battery technology is not yet at the point where an electric motorcycle can truly replace an ICE bike yet.
They dont have the range, expensive, no engine sound, battery is going to degrade and have less range, less range in the cold, heavy battery thats expensive to replace, waiting for a charge is a total drag, lack of parts and support as they age and are disontinued, worse for the evironment from beginning to end of life cycle. No thanks.
It depends on your use case. A long-range EV motorcycle is hard to be cost-competitive with a cheap ICE bike. If you wanna putter around the city, EV motorcycles have all the cons of an E-bicycle with none of the benefits. Just get an e-bicycle and you can go on sidewalks, ride through parks/shortcuts, don't have to pay registration, insurance, less maintenance. Sure it's a lot slower but at least you're not wearing leathers in stop-and-go traffic. I'm considering replacing my Ninja 400 with an e-bicycle, and then a larger used ICE bike for longer-range trips. Having both would be cheaper than a new EV motorcycle.
There is a new tabless cell that charges at 5c (thats 10-15 mins to 100%), its a matter of 1-2 years to have it widely available to market and no longer have charge time issues. Overpricing is another issue.
Removable battery, great idea but do what Gogoro does and have a battery center every 50 miles, you just fast swap the 2 battery packs and you are on your way. I am not interested in carrying 2 battery packs into my office or up to my apartment. Gogoro subscription program/fast swap really works. Build the moto's and build the swap centers with a subscription program and range problem is solved.
You sound like boomers hating on new technology without ever trying it or living with it. I own both ICE motorcycles (three to be specific) and an Energica. Do I want to tour on the Energica? No. Do i want to ride around a racetrack on one? Well if I had deep pockets, so instead I'll continue to track and tour with petroleum based propulsion. The energica sure beats the ICE bikes for my 60 mile a day commute. It doesn't make vroom vroom noice, but that doesn't mean it doesn't make any noise. It also provides plenty of feedback to keep me engaged while riding. On the rare day I take one of my ICE bikes to work, I wish I was on the energica. The biggest complaint I'd have would be the cost of entry for the best highway commuter. That said, I save hundreds a month on gas, so eventually it will be less expensive than an ICE bike to commute with. Solid state have been a few years away for a decade. If they ever figure out how to make them in mass and at a price compared to current battery tech, range and weight won't be the barrier it currently is for some buyers. Then all you have to hide behind is your own narrow mind.
My situation doesn't include a need for a commute, trails or motocross vehicle, so I'll stay with petrol... but if the situation changes I'm perfectly OK with an electric bike. Except for Zero of course.
They need to have manual gear changing. They need to be able to be charged within 5mins. They need to have 400km of range. They need to have a battery life of 10-15yrs. They need to use materials not derived from slavery. They need to have the ability to go through rivers etc without shorting out. Just to name a few things. More interested in hydrogen combustion
Each week I can't wait for your podcast !!! I have to improve my English skills, but wanna train myself with something really interesting to me 😅😉 So... You're kind of English teachers to me 😇😉 you can add it to your resume 😂😂😂 cheers from France ✌️ 🇺🇲🤝🇲🇫
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for the discussion, I would disagree partly with the assertion that EV bikes aren’t a replacement for ICE bikes. They aren’t yet a replacement for some segments due to technological limitations, but are replacements in other market segments.
Energica was the finest, on the highway at 70mph you had 130 miles of range. What it needed was the NACS port to be compatible for the Tesla Supercharger Network. Fastest recharge times at locations all across the USA.
1 - They couldn't get Tesla to allow access.
2 - current battery tech results in a heavy motorcycle, perhaps Honda with their new solid state battery tech may result in a lower weight future E-Motorcycle, combined with Honda's expertise in large production volumes could be the next winner, here's hoping.
I own an S2 Del Mar and the limited range annoys me to no end. Highway speeds, basically anything above 60 mph, effectively cuts the range in half. I can not rely on the the bike's range estimator unless I'm solely riding in the city. I'm all in with electric vehicles. My daily commuter car is an EV. However, EV battery technology is not yet at the point where an electric motorcycle can truly replace an ICE bike yet.
They dont have the range, expensive, no engine sound, battery is going to degrade and have less range, less range in the cold, heavy battery thats expensive to replace, waiting for a charge is a total drag, lack of parts and support as they age and are disontinued, worse for the evironment from beginning to end of life cycle. No thanks.
It depends on your use case. A long-range EV motorcycle is hard to be cost-competitive with a cheap ICE bike. If you wanna putter around the city, EV motorcycles have all the cons of an E-bicycle with none of the benefits. Just get an e-bicycle and you can go on sidewalks, ride through parks/shortcuts, don't have to pay registration, insurance, less maintenance. Sure it's a lot slower but at least you're not wearing leathers in stop-and-go traffic.
I'm considering replacing my Ninja 400 with an e-bicycle, and then a larger used ICE bike for longer-range trips. Having both would be cheaper than a new EV motorcycle.
There is a new tabless cell that charges at 5c (thats 10-15 mins to 100%), its a matter of 1-2 years to have it widely available to market and no longer have charge time issues.
Overpricing is another issue.
Removable battery, great idea but do what Gogoro does and have a battery center every 50 miles, you just fast swap the 2 battery packs and you are on your way. I am not interested in carrying 2 battery packs into my office or up to my apartment. Gogoro subscription program/fast swap really works.
Build the moto's and build the swap centers with a subscription program and range problem is solved.
I tested a Zero SR/S for a day and after getting back on a regular gas-powered bike, I didn't want to get back on an electric.
You sound like boomers hating on new technology without ever trying it or living with it. I own both ICE motorcycles (three to be specific) and an Energica. Do I want to tour on the Energica? No. Do i want to ride around a racetrack on one? Well if I had deep pockets, so instead I'll continue to track and tour with petroleum based propulsion.
The energica sure beats the ICE bikes for my 60 mile a day commute. It doesn't make vroom vroom noice, but that doesn't mean it doesn't make any noise. It also provides plenty of feedback to keep me engaged while riding. On the rare day I take one of my ICE bikes to work, I wish I was on the energica.
The biggest complaint I'd have would be the cost of entry for the best highway commuter. That said, I save hundreds a month on gas, so eventually it will be less expensive than an ICE bike to commute with.
Solid state have been a few years away for a decade. If they ever figure out how to make them in mass and at a price compared to current battery tech, range and weight won't be the barrier it currently is for some buyers. Then all you have to hide behind is your own narrow mind.
We are considering new electric dirt bike for our toy hauler. It seems like a good option-light and small profile.
50% more range plus NACS DC fast charging and I'm sold
My situation doesn't include a need for a commute, trails or motocross vehicle, so I'll stay with petrol... but if the situation changes I'm perfectly OK with an electric bike. Except for Zero of course.
what would it take?
price competitive with current ICE supersports
160-200 range with aggressive riding style
something that pulls like my r1
They need to have manual gear changing.
They need to be able to be charged within 5mins.
They need to have 400km of range.
They need to have a battery life of 10-15yrs.
They need to use materials not derived from slavery.
They need to have the ability to go through rivers etc without shorting out.
Just to name a few things.
More interested in hydrogen combustion
Interesting roundtable. Many good points.
I would buy a Zero DSR/X in a heartbeat if it had DC Fast Charging and 150 miles of usable range.
Each week I can't wait for your podcast !!! I have to improve my English skills, but wanna train myself with something really interesting to me 😅😉 So... You're kind of English teachers to me 😇😉 you can add it to your resume 😂😂😂 cheers from France ✌️ 🇺🇲🤝🇲🇫
if you make a video podcast, why dont you put pictures of the motorbikes when you talk about them? This is justa passive-agressive (sorry) feedback.
Just ride one, then talk about it. 1 test drive on a Zero or a Harley livewire will say as much as a thousand words.