Ken also felt that he owned the concept of Sonic having parents. Instant karma hit him in the form of people that remember Paulie and Brenda from the 1992 manga.
i feel like Ken Penders is an au Chris Chan who crossed the dimensional rift and worked in Sega as successfully as any Chris Chan across the multiverse possibly could
@adenosine 2 electric boogaloo yes It was made in a lab with the Egyptians thousands of years ago and then he went back into hibernation waiting for another good time to sue someone
Days late and wholly unrelated to the actual subject, but fun fact: the art style of Butch Hartman's shows isn't even his, it's Stephen Silver's: an artist (production designer, character designer, etc.) on shows like The Fairly Oddparents and Danny Phantom, hence why Butch's attempts at replicating it don't look exactly right
@@HauntLich I mean, I don't doubt that Butch, as the creative lead/ideas-guy, had some influence on the styles of the shows he headed, but Silver's shines through far more palpably. When Butch did that whole "Danny Phantom 10 years later" thing Silver also, unrelated, drew the same concept and those designs reflect the show's style much more than Butch's. Tbh the only reasons I was ever really prompted into looking into this was 1) I got Silver's character design book as a gift a few years back and 2) a singular comment made in a RUclips video about Butch during the height of the major debacles. It does explain a lot though (apologies for the long response)
@@HauntLich oh it's true, he was also the one who stole the idea, Butch Hartman heard Stephen Silver's idea he was going to pitch AKA Danny Phantom, and he went in for his interview before Stephen, he pitched the idea of Danny Phantom and got credited for it.
@Boa-Noah I always feel bad for Silver because he tries to keep up this very friendly reputation but it must be awful to try and stay friends with somebody who literally stole your idea and pushed it to the production company because he was in line before Silver. Like imagine they're both in the room discussing their ideas they're going to promote and then Butch goes in first and literary sells them somebody else's idea and they go in and can't get it. That's just my nightmare. Truly a scumbag.
If you want a rabbit hole deeper and more haunting than your phylactery then you want to go looking into the business and life story of Ken Penders. Especially his artwork on his stories after Archie. Ken is one of the most fascinating and insanely well-documented comic artists when it comes to *drama*. This video only scratches the absolute surface.
Yeah if this is a topic people are interested in, I'd love to talk about "the chronicles of laura-su" and the related drama surrounding it. It's quite the nuthouse.
@@HauntLich i would 100% be up for that! I watched a 1 hour+ video explaining the plot of the whole archie series the other day, so sonic drama? even post-sonic Ken Penders art? yes please!
@@CheriseChattoway I've never really done a follow-up vid, but I'll look more into it, and if it tickles my fancy enough I'd totally make a vid about it.
@@ufazig dude, you two are infringing my copyright on the concept of court. I’d send a cease and desist, but that might anger who owns that, so I’ll see myself out.
@@pyroonbusinesschannel118 Yeah, in later games that was attributed to his link with the master emerald. It wasn't a feat of Knuckles himself; or at least, not a feat that attributed to his natural strength. In the games, Sonic defeats Knuckles handily in virtually every confrontation they have outside of the comedic. Knuckles is definitely strong, he's just not really a match for Sonic when the two are going at it seriously
@@marksamson4173 That can be attributed to the fall of Knuckles character to be fair. Knuckles went from a badass rival that was as strong as Sonic is fast, to an idiot that can barely balance himself.
I don't think I would talk about his religious beliefs, but his shady business endeavors and crappy opinions about art and animation industry stuff are pretty interesting. I should find time to talk about him.
@@HauntLich Fair enough! but you should know that when it comes to Oxais (Butch's failed streaming service) knowing about his religious beliefs and the actual cult he's apart of is important.
One of those cases where the the lawsuit was a terrible idea. Sure he technically won...but not only was it zero benefit to him but it also killed his career and put all his old work out of print forever.
He didnt even technically win iirc. They settled out of court, and ken didn't realize that accepting the settlement means he forfeited his "legal rights" to the characters he penned. Its believed to also be the reason his terrible "Lara-Su Chronicles" comic has never had a single issue released. He can hype it up all he wants but the second he tries to monetize any of it, he's gonna get slapped around by Sega.
@@deadturret4049 I guess that is true that he technically didn't straight up win in court but since he got his characters and storylines I see that as a win for him. My theory on the legal situation is that even though he owns his storylines and characters most are still derived works from Sega's IP and any Archie work that he still doesn't own. So Sega/Archie can't use or reprint anything by Ken Penders without his permission. No big deal, just don't use it and bury it forever. ie - Legacy killed. As for Ken Penders, he can't use any original character with a "look" that is based on any original Sega design. Knuckles, Sonic, Tails, etc. So he has to redesign his characters to not infringe on Sega copyright/trademark. Hence the shitty looking "Laura Su Chronicles". I think it hasn't come out cause he is just sucks and his work suffers without the backbone of Sega's IP ^_^
these comics were my telenovelas as a kid, because thats how batshit crazy these comics were, and little kid me ate that drama up. so ig i have SOMETHING to thank penders for..
Some Corrections/Clarifications: - There isn't any proof (that I know of) that the document was lost in a fire. Archie claims it was lost due to "warehouse staff incompetence". Archie's legal team was really really bad back then, to the point that after this trial, they were all fired and replaced. - The document (well, the photocopy of it) dated back to 1996, when Penders started working on the Sonic comics in 1993, which was the reason why it was rejected as evidence. It could've also been forged, as Penders claims (though the former reason kinda makes this point moot). - The Dark Brotherhood was most likely based on The Dark Legion, as TDL were locked in the Twilight Zone, and TDB were locked in the Twilight Cage. That and the fact they're both Echidna tribes that are advanced with technology makes it seem like there was at least a little influence. Apart from those mistakes, good video! (the "microwaved a baby because of a bad dream" part was the best summary of those events I've ever heard) I hope I don't look like I'm just blindly defending Penders here. The man blaming the toxicity of the Sonic fanbase on autistic people was more than enough to make me (someone with autism) really not like him. I just felt the need to correct some things because if we're going to dunk on him, we should make sure we're critiquing him for the right reasons, and not for some made up ones. We'd hate to be "toxic", wouldn't we?
I knew I got some things wrong. I really just told the story mostly from memory. Doing research is harrrrrd. lmao. But that's really interesting, I figured there'd probably be more layers to it. I'm glad, in the end, Archie's terrible legal team was fired for being so terrible. Good end.
@@HauntLich The sad thing is that your version of events is way more sensible than what actually happened. One side straight up lost the papers that allowed them to own their characters and couldn't even produce an appropriate photocopy, and the other side is Ken "The Father of Knuckles" Penders, who now wants to make NFTs of "his" characters. It's an absolute mess that I've heard misrepresented too many times, and I can't blame anyone for that. Also, I remember the argument being made that the reason Ken's "art" looking the way it does for his "official continuation of the Sonic comics" (yes he has said this) is because if it looked too similar to actual thing, then those are grounds for Sega to step in if he wanted to have people pay for them (which he does, I believe). Doesn't stop it looking trash, though.
Another similarity is how Shade to Julie-Su. Though really, similar characters owned by different companies are a thing in all media. Shoot, the Dark Legion aren't much different from all the para-military groups with advanced tech giving the good guys a hard time in countless media 😝
@@Jangobadass Is it weird that I don't see it? Julie Su joined Knuckles due to falling in love, Shade joined because she was almost killed by her leader, and didn't know the brotherhood was trying to rule the world. and so changed allegiances to redeem herself. Su fights with guns, Shade uses energy blades. The 2 look quite different, too. The best I can give it is that they probably read "female echidna turns good" and that was the only influence Su had.
@@J.R.Unbound I get what you're saying, but the base similarities--female echindas part of the bad guys who turns good--were enough for Ken. Heck, to hear him tell it Shade even looks like Julie, even though they look *nothing* alike...😵
As an artist the thing that bothers me the most about Ken Penders art is that he can draw , he just can’t draw cartoons. I’ve seen his more classic comic book art and it’s not bad, not amazing but it’s clear he knows what he’s doing. But instead of playing to his strength or trying to learn how he can make this more cartoony style work , he just smashes the two together with no concept of what makes art appealing. It’s almost like the only reason he draws the Lara su story that way with the big heads and eyes is so that it looks more like sonic and it gives him an excuse to use the same characters
@@HauntLich yeh ! It all comes down to his weird unhealthy obsession with the echidna characters and his stubbornness to not change even if it meant better looking art for his passion project
Yeah, from what I've, seen, his extremely short-lived comic "The Lost Ones" looked perfectly fine. Now he doesn't even feel like drawing humans and just traces a photo of some celebrity.
Oh, oh jesus, this is how I find out Julie-Su is a Ken Penders OC? I've heard the name brought up for years in Sonic fan games, usually hooked up with Knuckles, and I'm just like, "Okay, whatever," but I caught her name on a picture there talking about Lara-Su...
Penders is one of the few artists in the Archie comic's old run that can draw really well or decent in other titles, but just SOMEHOW can't get a cartoon hedgehog down right at all. Some of Sonic's design and style is literally inspired by Mickey Mouse, arguably the easiest cartoon character to draw, it can't be hard for a professional to fuck up. If you've seen Penders' works in something like DC's Star Trek, you'll see that he honestly draws very well, captures realistic humans and all that. Yet for Sonic, he's always giving the cartoony characters muscles which looks so out of place. Same with Ron Lim, who's considered infamous for his Sonic comic art, yet if you look at his Marvel works at the time, they're much better! Sonic's windshield eyes should be more than enough to explain. I dunno these artists were picked because of their popularity and they just weren't given enough time to practice Sonic's cartoonier style or they just didn't give a shit, but it clearly shows in the finale product that someone just didn't understand it.
I grew up a Sonic fan. I always thought the Sonic comics were OK, until Ian Flynn came along and brought bits of all the continuities (sans Fleetway) together yet he knew that the focus of the series was action. And now, he's the writer of the Sonic game "Sonic Frontiers".
Fun fact: Ian Flynn (another comic book artist/sonic writer) has blocked him when ken tried to reach out to him to be part of the lDW sonic comics. And for trying to to be buddy buddy with him. It was literally haliours. And that's why he hates him (he also hates ian for other things to btw).
Wait, really? Do you know where you learned this? I'd be surprised if Ian said anything about it, considering how he doesn't even want to bring up Ken's name in his podcast, and Ken probably wouldn't share this either considering how it makes him look desperate, and how often he ragged on IDW and (especially) Ian beforehand.
@@mediamuncher6982 The video by Garage Dwelling Frogs (which is the best username I've ever read), right? Guess I'll give it watch to brush up on the KPCU (Ken Penders Cinematic Universe). Thanks! Edit: Just watched it. Unless you were regarding another video, I don't think Ken ever reached out to Ian to be a part of IDW. Ken DID screw over Ben Hurst by misrepresenting his Sonic movie pitch, and then proceeded to pitch his own Sonic Movie, so maybe you confused that event with another?
Based Ian. Fuck Penders, that man really did a number on the Sonic franchise as a whole. He's the reason why a) the Archie Sonic comics don't exist anymore and b) why the Sonic franchise is now held back by shitty mandates (like Sonic not being allowed to show 'excessive emotion', whatever the fuck that means).
7:09 made me chuckle. I think some fans legitimately want badly drawn Sonic characters from him after that one notorious toothy Sonic he did. Though, I agree with your rant, that if you pay a professional artist, they should draw something original in their own style, not merely copy official works. (Heck, I wish someone would pay me to draw crap. Lol) Also, great video, you did a good job researching the Sonic comics for someone not very familiar with them.
Scourge isn't actually his design, you see that is somebody else's design entirely, but because it was built off of Ken Penders' design Ken says he owns it. It falls into a copyright loophole. But because they don't really want to do this song and dance anymore they just let him have it.
@@HauntLich YES! I didn’t know who he was at the time, so now I own one of his prints for his canceled sonic movie and a compilation comic of stories that he wrote. Both of them are signed
I was practically in pain when you got to Hunnid-P/100P at the end. The fact that what you mentioned him doing is nowhere NEAR the worst of his controversies is harrowing.
Yeah I only included the stuff that's Sonic relevant. The rest of his rap sheet is uhhhhhhhh inappropriate for my family friendly Christian minecraft server
Fun fact: the music sonic show where they save there mom is what first introduced me to sonic so when I saw sonic without the necklace I was confused as hell
I think that was my first Sonic media too! That, or a let's play of Sonic CD. Either way, after these two came a let's play (or let's hate, I guess lol) of Sonic 06. Yeah, the start of my Sonic experience was... strange.
@@HauntLich Good point. You know what really bothers me is that I actually enjoyed the overall story that he tried to craft. Giving Knuckles an actual backstory that also becomes something he seeks out to learn. I would like to say one of his adventures uncovers a long distant ancestor, the very first Echidna he gets to meet since his father vanishes . . . And Enerjak tries to kill him. Granted that's probably the reality of life, most of the people you think are good people turn out to be amoral snot balls.
I see this as a precautionary tale... never give a crazy man too much power over making comics- especially not comics owned by someone else. Give then enough power and leeway and they might very well start to say and believe that they own it. I feel like Ken might be neuro divergent- and grew too attached to these characters and no one put a foot down fast enough to remind him that he was basically being paid to make Sonic fanfiction rather than owning the whole thing. As for the art deterioration- I believe it. Not gotta put out any names but I have seen artist get full of themselves, get lazy, and depend so much on tracing that their art literally decreased in quality... Most of the time when this happens it just boils down to an artist getting lazier and no longer bothering to improve.
Yeah it really seems like a little bit more oversight while the comics were being made would've gone a long way. Someone probably would've noticed what Kenders was like much earlier on, or hell, SEGA could've noticed that the comics weren't anything like they wanted much earlier on.
@@HauntLich Ah hey! And good observation, I feel like this could have all been prevented had they taken the content more seriously. They didn't own sonic, they had the 'honor' (I guess) to basically make some OFFICIAL CONTENT- a bunch of fans of any series would be over the moon at this chance- and also respected the brand image and not go all nuts. But someone like Penders was the worst thing that could have happened here, his stories feel more like some crazy crackfic and no one ever proofread his stuff I guess. I'm also wondering how someone like him even got into the comic business in the first place, his art wasn't god tier... so I'm wondering if he had connections, especially if he was allowed to make an entire series on Knuckles. Reminds me of how the Sonic comic team pitched a Kirby comic to Hal/Nintendo and got canned... makes me wonder if this incident played a part in it. Nintendo saw the mess that happened with the Echidnas and just noped out of that.
@@thywolfshark *_"I'm also wondering how someone like him even got into the comic business in the first place, his art wasn't god tier... so I'm wondering if he had connections."_* Not sure about his entire comic career, but he definitely got into Archie Sonic through connections, at least from what I've heard. Someone at the team (can't remember who and I don't feel like doing research RN) was tasked to find a replacement for a writer that left. They ended up picking Ken Penders because they heard that his son loves Sonic. Not Ken himself, _his son._
Quick Tip: Hunnid-P did NOT write or produce the music for Knuckles' stages. There is a huge controversy over this. All he ever did was add rap lyrics over the Japanese game's instrumental tracks for Knuckles, ordered by SEGA America. Those tracks were made by the same artists who made the rest of the music in SA2, all from Japan. Hunnid-P has been falsely claiming that the music was ALL made by him, when all he did really was overlap some pretty badly mastered and mediocre lyrics onto the Japanese OST. Definitely don't give that guy the credit. Hell, you could make a whole video on that situation, too.
I've learned this from the comments after having made this video and it's made me wonder: the fuck does Butch Hartman actually DO? Do people commission him thinking he's the Fairly Oddparents artist and that's why he traces, because he actually can't draw but wants the money from being a famous artist?
@@HauntLichpretty late, but that's easy! He just had the idea for the shows in like 5 minutes (no joking) and... That's it, he's "the creator of your childhood"!
Yeah I learned this recently too. Apparently he created Danny Phantom in 20 minutes during a drive to the office because the execs at Nick wanted a new action show for boys and he was like uuuuuuuuuuuuh how about this?@@Lissy_YT481
Ngl I went through a little character arc when I found out that this guy existed, and yeah there's things I can improve upon as an artist but to the very minimum atleast I don't draw like fucking Chris Chan
now i think ken said like,something like "a lot of the toxicity of the sonic fandom is due to the autistic fans trying to express themself and not sure how to respond when discussion veer into a disagreeable direction" so yeah make it what you want
This is my first video by you but your voice is ridiculously pleasant to listen to dude. I have heard the Ken stories up and down but will definitely look at this and more of your content more.
The man who made some very cringy fanfics in the comics....That also goes for Ian Flynn too, except edgy and stories from his own comics he's made before working on Archie comics. No I am not kidding with that
Okay I just clicked on the video and I already think you're an awesome guy for using the ghouls n' ghosts C64 soundtrack. That game's OST is INCREDIBLE.
Just found your channel today man and I gotta say, the sheer amount of different sprites you use for your avatar are leagues above some other popular channels with a similar gimmick I see on RUclips. It really helps add to the tone of what you're trying to say and adds a lot of expression. Top notch stuff here, man. Editing, quality, jokes, presentation. EZ subscribe 👍 Butler is a little tricky to understand if you are just listening and not reading the captions, but that voice has it's charm 😂
Yeah when I first introduced Butler he didn't have subtitles, fixed that in a jiffy. I've considered changing his voice, but to get a similar voice that's easier to understand, I'd probably have to get an entirely new TTS program made. That's on my to-do list rofl. I'm really happy you like the content, it seems a lot of people have been discovering HauntLich as of late and been pleased with what they've found, and that kicks ass. Comments like this are what make creating this content really worth it. :D
KEN PENDERS SOLD COMICS WITH SHADOW THE HEDGEHOG ON THE COVER AT DOUBLE PRICE AT HIS BOOTH AT COMIC CON, WHAT THE HELL DOES HE MEAN HE CAN'T DRAW SHADOW WHEN HE FREAKING WROTE HIS NAME ON MY BOOKS I BOUGHT FROM HIM???
I guess "I can't draw Shadow" actually meant "I don't want to draw Shadow for you, specifically, but I still want your money." big yeesh. Also double price? C'mon kenders.
@@HauntLich To be fair, I bought the comics in 2006 when I was just getting into collecting them, so this was well before the main drama, but still. Also, he sold Flynn comics too. I have an issue 175 with his signature that I got without knowing until later that he didn't have anything to do with that arc at all.
@@Dcfan200 Check my community page for a second, I just posted the pictures of the exact issues I have including another one he signed that he didn't work on. You will see that issues 157 and 158 have Shadow on the covers and his signature in gold sharpie marker. 🤨 By the way, I'm an all-around Sonic fan that collects from all continuities, stop trying to start drama
100-P as he's referred to in the credits of SA2 did not produce the knuckles Raps. All he did was write and sing the lyrics. It was Tomoya Ohtani that actually produced all of the instrumentals. Hence why they're actually good.
When you discussed tracing and started the "good thing no one else does this" statement I knew it would be Butch Hartman. I haven't even kept up with any Butch Hartman drama, hell I never actually watched any of his shows but a visceral part of me just knew it was him
@@mitchellhancock7920I think what they mean is that Sega still owns the original freedom fighters, like Sally, Bunnie…anyone from the cartoon only. Ken has no involvement of their creation at all. Some people say he does but I believe those are people who hate Sally and knows that if he does own her, then all hope of her coming back is dead. But now that hope is…very minuscule, but it’s still there.
It gets better. Apparently, Ken Penders originally wanted to a do a comic series about technologically advanced Native Americans. When he couldn't find a comic studio willing to publish a story like that, he started adapting it to have echidnas instead and start forcing it into the Archie comics. At least, that's what I think happened. I'm not a big Sonic fan, but I am a big fan of stories about stupid people acting a fool.
Because Princess Sally, the love of his life, was getting married with Antoine (who was actually Patch, Antoine's evil counterpart) so that the latter could become the king, not out of any romantic connection. Yeah, it's wild and I've never read the comics either. The image comes from the cover art of issue 155 of Archie Sonic Comics.
One thing I didn't like about Ken Penders designs is that if characters were related, he would just take the original design; tweak the height/weight, give them a patch of hair and that's it. also I'm surprised that you didn't bring up the fact that he was the reason for the sega mandates
I wasn't fully aware of the SEGA mandates until after the fact. I tend to learn a lot from people after the videos are out, it's actually pretty neat that way.
For those who don't know after he "won" the case Sega said he can use the characters he "won" if the look and feel were not in any way similar to sonic (I think it was something like that).
If your talent is deteriorating, but you're not lazy, there's things you can do about that. Nothing you can do about the inverse, since the premise is inherently that you're too lazy to do anything. Edit post-heart: Examples being mainly the stuff you do if you lack talent or haven't developed it. Practise, addressing shortcomings, etc.
@@robertlupa8273 Being lazy isn't a fixed trait that can't be addressed. Try to focus on building good habits, like, for example, drawing a little bit daily. Even for a few minutes.
Butch at least puts a bit of effort in his tracing. At least Ranma holds a kettle and Mikasa was drawn in a different style. Still he could put in a bit more effort in a commission.
I will never forgive ken penders. Not for fucking up the echidnas. *But for fucking up chronicles and making the GIZOIDS non canon, actual sin, Gizoids are goated.*
Ngl I enjoyed Sonic Forces- Though even I admit that Infinite was a damn good villian and they flat out WASTED his potential at the last second. Like bro they heavily implied he'd come back and he... Didn't. They just had you fight Eggman in the shadow realm, went on a random spcheal about friendship and ended it there. -_-
I'm curious where you heard the bit about the judge not understanding what the case was about (If true good on them for at least attempting to learn) and having never dealt with a copyright case before. I've heard that lawsuit story told tons of times over the years but this is the first time I've heard these bits. As for the judge deciding a photo-copy of a contact is not admissible, I always heard the judge was worried accepting that would set a precedent that could potentially open the door to worse things down the line and they did not want to do that.
I was quite serious when I said I was giving the "campfire story" version of the Penders tale. Some of the stuff is internet rumor that's circulated for many years.
oh my god i remember hunnid p's new sonic music announcement. always wondered what happened to that. turns out nothing i guess lol. that really brings back memories...
I think Ken was a competent artist at the time at least. He showed passion for the project, necessary skills, i can definitely see how he got hired. I'm sure nobody could've predicted all this.
From what I've heard, he worked a bit on Star Trek comics before working in Archie Comics. How did he get there? Well, someone at Archie was told to find a replacement for a writer that had left at that time. He picked Ken because Ken's son loved Sonic. Yes, seriously.
The problem with Ken is he can’t except that he couldn’t do what he wanted during his Archie run, his personal comic is a work of insanity, most likely he never published is because it has sonic n co in it, and he’s hoping that sega will go out of business so he can publish without the being sued by sega , it maybe also have the remaining archie sonic characters to but who knows He’s also doing nfts of lara sue but her suit is from the sonic chronicles stating he owns it despite biowear being the creators , he also shows hatred toward the IDW Sonic run boasting that comics he’s done had sold more but people pointing out his lie, hes very very VERY salty
The line "Waiting for SEGA to go out of business" is genuinely hilarious to me. Imagine if SEGA went under and their licenses got bought by the likes of Nintendo and they sent the copyright ninjas after him after years of him thinking he was a winner.
@@Dcfan200 I genuinely have no idea what you're talking about. I dunno who Potto is but you seem really pissed off about something or other in this comments section.
![Ice On My Teeth - ATEEZ エイティーズ 에이티즈 [Music Bank] | KBS WORLD TV 241115](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/c-n92OgbbwA/mqdefault.jpg)
Ken also felt that he owned the concept of Sonic having parents. Instant karma hit him in the form of people that remember Paulie and Brenda from the 1992 manga.
Ken Penders invented parents. Facts.
@@HauntLich Mom, Dad… I plagiarized you from Ken Penders.
@@HauntLich Ken Penders is actually god and everything is his property
@@rockhistoria2537 I've infringed on Ken Penders intellectual property by being born. Feelsbadman.
He's just upset that knuckles had a dad because hes really his dad
i feel like Ken Penders is an au Chris Chan who crossed the dimensional rift and worked in Sega as successfully as any Chris Chan across the multiverse possibly could
he's from the zone
Penders is proof that the dimensional merge is real and already happened.
Sol dimension’s Chris Chan equivalent, but the big difference is Penders havin a family
the dimensional merge was real all along
Ken is just Chris but without the autism and replace it with narcissism and stupidity
Ken Penders may not be Chris Chan's biological father, but he is in spirit.
I swear that he donated some of his "milk" some long time ago, which resulted in the birth of Chris Chan
2:19 Damn, these Knuckles NFTs go hard.
Each one costs 6,500 USD and likely will appear in a Seth Green TV series at some point
Lol
Ken Penders is why Knuckles can't have nice things.
According to Ken he invented everything in Sonic. He probably thinks he invented comic books too.
Ken Penders, inventor of the printing press.
ken penders the invertor of sonic the hedgehog and writing, art and paper himself.
@adenosine 2 electric boogaloo yes
It was made in a lab with the Egyptians thousands of years ago and then he went back into hibernation waiting for another good time to sue someone
Also, Ken Pender is the creator of SR-71 or YF-12 which it was ultrasonic speed plane... 😂😂😂
ken penders invented the justice system
Penders is just mad because he cant be Knuckles' dad IRL
Grabs a literal sword to "cut to the chase," instead proceeds to go on multiple tangents of interesting topics. Classic HauntLich.
I think Hauntman has undiagnosed ADHD
Kenny P blocked me from Twitter when he criticized Sonic's original design for the first movie and I showed him a cover of Sonic Live! 😂
Getting blocked by Kenders is a badge of honor
THAT COVER SCARED THE SHIT OUT OF ME 🤣😭🤣
@@KingToshin Dude, the IRL photos of his kid and niece 😱
At least The Manhog redeemed himself and got a new life
@@HauntLich Truer words have never been said.
Days late and wholly unrelated to the actual subject, but fun fact: the art style of Butch Hartman's shows isn't even his, it's Stephen Silver's: an artist (production designer, character designer, etc.) on shows like The Fairly Oddparents and Danny Phantom, hence why Butch's attempts at replicating it don't look exactly right
That's absolutely insane if true, completely bananas and it explains so much.
@@HauntLich I mean, I don't doubt that Butch, as the creative lead/ideas-guy, had some influence on the styles of the shows he headed, but Silver's shines through far more palpably. When Butch did that whole "Danny Phantom 10 years later" thing Silver also, unrelated, drew the same concept and those designs reflect the show's style much more than Butch's. Tbh the only reasons I was ever really prompted into looking into this was 1) I got Silver's character design book as a gift a few years back and 2) a singular comment made in a RUclips video about Butch during the height of the major debacles. It does explain a lot though (apologies for the long response)
@@HauntLich oh it's true, he was also the one who stole the idea, Butch Hartman heard Stephen Silver's idea he was going to pitch AKA Danny Phantom, and he went in for his interview before Stephen, he pitched the idea of Danny Phantom and got credited for it.
@Boa-Noah I always feel bad for Silver because he tries to keep up this very friendly reputation but it must be awful to try and stay friends with somebody who literally stole your idea and pushed it to the production company because he was in line before Silver. Like imagine they're both in the room discussing their ideas they're going to promote and then Butch goes in first and literary sells them somebody else's idea and they go in and can't get it. That's just my nightmare. Truly a scumbag.
If you want a rabbit hole deeper and more haunting than your phylactery then you want to go looking into the business and life story of Ken Penders. Especially his artwork on his stories after Archie. Ken is one of the most fascinating and insanely well-documented comic artists when it comes to *drama*. This video only scratches the absolute surface.
Yeah if this is a topic people are interested in, I'd love to talk about "the chronicles of laura-su" and the related drama surrounding it. It's quite the nuthouse.
@@HauntLich i would 100% be up for that! I watched a 1 hour+ video explaining the plot of the whole archie series the other day, so sonic drama? even post-sonic Ken Penders art? yes please!
@@CheriseChattoway I've never really done a follow-up vid, but I'll look more into it, and if it tickles my fancy enough I'd totally make a vid about it.
Honestly, I think this video is about as much attention as this narcissistic furry deserves.
So you are saying that we are sleeping on Ken Penders Ice Berg?
The man unironically thinks he invented the concept of evil doppelgangers.
Even though he took _that_ concept from DC's Earth-Three.
There's a new villain in the idw sonic comic.
A GREEN HEDGEHOG
NAMED SURGE
Probably a big fuck you to Ken.
Actually, Surge is a Tenric.
I have no idea what a Tenric is, therefor it's a fictional fantasy race that I just made up. See you in court buckaroo.
Yeah, but this Tenric race you mentioned has grandparents, a concept I pioneered. So see you all in court.
@@ufazig Your honor here's my patent document showing my exclusive ownership over the concept of people having sex and raising their children
@@ufazig dude, you two are infringing my copyright on the concept of court. I’d send a cease and desist, but that might anger who owns that, so I’ll see myself out.
Funfact: originally knuckles was pinkish before becoming red, and the shoe coloring was different until changed at the same time they changed him red
That is a fun fact!
@@HauntLich ah thanks, also another funfact: knuckles is strong enough to 1 punch super sonic to turn back to normal
@@pyroonbusinesschannel118 slightly true knuckles really just neutralized the emeralds
@@pyroonbusinesschannel118 Yeah, in later games that was attributed to his link with the master emerald. It wasn't a feat of Knuckles himself; or at least, not a feat that attributed to his natural strength. In the games, Sonic defeats Knuckles handily in virtually every confrontation they have outside of the comedic. Knuckles is definitely strong, he's just not really a match for Sonic when the two are going at it seriously
@@marksamson4173 That can be attributed to the fall of Knuckles character to be fair. Knuckles went from a badass rival that was as strong as Sonic is fast, to an idiot that can barely balance himself.
Ken Penders is just like those seagulls from Finding Nemo
I don't get it
@@TheRebelTitan55 if you’ve never seen the movie the seagulls just kept saying Mine over and over again when they saw something they wanted
@@dayvonlouis5187 Yes, I've seen it I just didn't remembered that
Echidnas: *exist*
Ken Penders: MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE!
Red headed echidnas are also real they are just rare!
Rare shiny enchilada :0
@@HauntLich Where's my Ultra Ball?!
Ugly Sonic in Chip and Dale looks like he came from the Penders art style
holy shit now that you've said that i can never unsee it
Yeah. Looking at Lara Su made me think differently about pre-Sonic
I would watch a full video on Butch Heartman. Not only his art but some of his beliefs are absolutely insane.
I don't think I would talk about his religious beliefs, but his shady business endeavors and crappy opinions about art and animation industry stuff are pretty interesting. I should find time to talk about him.
@@HauntLich Fair enough! but you should know that when it comes to Oxais (Butch's failed streaming service) knowing about his religious beliefs and the actual cult he's apart of is important.
One of those cases where the the lawsuit was a terrible idea. Sure he technically won...but not only was it zero benefit to him but it also killed his career and put all his old work out of print forever.
yeah but he walked away thinking he owned anthro echidnas so that's 100% a win for him
@@HauntLich 110%!!!
He didnt even technically win iirc. They settled out of court, and ken didn't realize that accepting the settlement means he forfeited his "legal rights" to the characters he penned. Its believed to also be the reason his terrible "Lara-Su Chronicles" comic has never had a single issue released. He can hype it up all he wants but the second he tries to monetize any of it, he's gonna get slapped around by Sega.
@@deadturret4049 I guess that is true that he technically didn't straight up win in court but since he got his characters and storylines I see that as a win for him.
My theory on the legal situation is that even though he owns his storylines and characters most are still derived works from Sega's IP and any Archie work that he still doesn't own.
So Sega/Archie can't use or reprint anything by Ken Penders without his permission. No big deal, just don't use it and bury it forever. ie - Legacy killed.
As for Ken Penders, he can't use any original character with a "look" that is based on any original Sega design. Knuckles, Sonic, Tails, etc. So he has to redesign his characters to not infringe on Sega copyright/trademark. Hence the shitty looking "Laura Su Chronicles". I think it hasn't come out cause he is just sucks and his work suffers without the backbone of Sega's IP ^_^
these comics were my telenovelas as a kid, because thats how batshit crazy these comics were, and little kid me ate that drama up. so ig i have SOMETHING to thank penders for..
I unironically like most of Ken's characters and ideas. What I do NOT like about Ken, however, is his planet-sized ego.
Some Corrections/Clarifications:
- There isn't any proof (that I know of) that the document was lost in a fire. Archie claims it was lost due to "warehouse staff incompetence". Archie's legal team was really really bad back then, to the point that after this trial, they were all fired and replaced.
- The document (well, the photocopy of it) dated back to 1996, when Penders started working on the Sonic comics in 1993, which was the reason why it was rejected as evidence. It could've also been forged, as Penders claims (though the former reason kinda makes this point moot).
- The Dark Brotherhood was most likely based on The Dark Legion, as TDL were locked in the Twilight Zone, and TDB were locked in the Twilight Cage. That and the fact they're both Echidna tribes that are advanced with technology makes it seem like there was at least a little influence.
Apart from those mistakes, good video! (the "microwaved a baby because of a bad dream" part was the best summary of those events I've ever heard)
I hope I don't look like I'm just blindly defending Penders here. The man blaming the toxicity of the Sonic fanbase on autistic people was more than enough to make me (someone with autism) really not like him.
I just felt the need to correct some things because if we're going to dunk on him, we should make sure we're critiquing him for the right reasons, and not for some made up ones. We'd hate to be "toxic", wouldn't we?
I knew I got some things wrong. I really just told the story mostly from memory. Doing research is harrrrrd. lmao.
But that's really interesting, I figured there'd probably be more layers to it. I'm glad, in the end, Archie's terrible legal team was fired for being so terrible. Good end.
@@HauntLich The sad thing is that your version of events is way more sensible than what actually happened. One side straight up lost the papers that allowed them to own their characters and couldn't even produce an appropriate photocopy, and the other side is Ken "The Father of Knuckles" Penders, who now wants to make NFTs of "his" characters. It's an absolute mess that I've heard misrepresented too many times, and I can't blame anyone for that.
Also, I remember the argument being made that the reason Ken's "art" looking the way it does for his "official continuation of the Sonic comics" (yes he has said this) is because if it looked too similar to actual thing, then those are grounds for Sega to step in if he wanted to have people pay for them (which he does, I believe). Doesn't stop it looking trash, though.
Another similarity is how Shade to Julie-Su.
Though really, similar characters owned by different companies are a thing in all media. Shoot, the Dark Legion aren't much different from all the para-military groups with advanced tech giving the good guys a hard time in countless media 😝
@@Jangobadass Is it weird that I don't see it? Julie Su joined Knuckles due to falling in love, Shade joined because she was almost killed by her leader, and didn't know the brotherhood was trying to rule the world. and so changed allegiances to redeem herself. Su fights with guns, Shade uses energy blades. The 2 look quite different, too. The best I can give it is that they probably read "female echidna turns good" and that was the only influence Su had.
@@J.R.Unbound I get what you're saying, but the base similarities--female echindas part of the bad guys who turns good--were enough for Ken.
Heck, to hear him tell it Shade even looks like Julie, even though they look *nothing* alike...😵
That girl drawing Shadow would make a good art teacher.
As an artist the thing that bothers me the most about Ken Penders art is that he can draw , he just can’t draw cartoons. I’ve seen his more classic comic book art and it’s not bad, not amazing but it’s clear he knows what he’s doing.
But instead of playing to his strength or trying to learn how he can make this more cartoony style work , he just smashes the two together with no concept of what makes art appealing.
It’s almost like the only reason he draws the Lara su story that way with the big heads and eyes is so that it looks more like sonic and it gives him an excuse to use the same characters
He's just completely obsessed with Knuckles and it's all consuming, why draw what you're good at when you could be drawing fuckin ECHIDNAS DUUUUUDE
@@HauntLich yeh ! It all comes down to his weird unhealthy obsession with the echidna characters and his stubbornness to not change even if it meant better looking art for his passion project
Yeah, from what I've, seen, his extremely short-lived comic "The Lost Ones" looked perfectly fine. Now he doesn't even feel like drawing humans and just traces a photo of some celebrity.
Oh, oh jesus, this is how I find out Julie-Su is a Ken Penders OC? I've heard the name brought up for years in Sonic fan games, usually hooked up with Knuckles, and I'm just like, "Okay, whatever," but I caught her name on a picture there talking about Lara-Su...
Ken Penders is pretty much if Christian Weston Chandler was an actual writer for the sonic franchise let that sink in!
Penders is one of the few artists in the Archie comic's old run that can draw really well or decent in other titles, but just SOMEHOW can't get a cartoon hedgehog down right at all. Some of Sonic's design and style is literally inspired by Mickey Mouse, arguably the easiest cartoon character to draw, it can't be hard for a professional to fuck up.
If you've seen Penders' works in something like DC's Star Trek, you'll see that he honestly draws very well, captures realistic humans and all that. Yet for Sonic, he's always giving the cartoony characters muscles which looks so out of place.
Same with Ron Lim, who's considered infamous for his Sonic comic art, yet if you look at his Marvel works at the time, they're much better! Sonic's windshield eyes should be more than enough to explain.
I dunno these artists were picked because of their popularity and they just weren't given enough time to practice Sonic's cartoonier style or they just didn't give a shit, but it clearly shows in the finale product that someone just didn't understand it.
Probably because at the time all the Sonic fans were still kids. But that’s still no excuse.
I grew up a Sonic fan. I always thought the Sonic comics were OK, until Ian Flynn came along and brought bits of all the continuities (sans Fleetway) together yet he knew that the focus of the series was action. And now, he's the writer of the Sonic game "Sonic Frontiers".
Fun fact: Ian Flynn (another comic book artist/sonic writer) has blocked him when ken tried to reach out to him to be part of the lDW sonic comics. And for trying to to be buddy buddy with him. It was literally haliours. And that's why he hates him (he also hates ian for other things to btw).
Wait, really? Do you know where you learned this? I'd be surprised if Ian said anything about it, considering how he doesn't even want to bring up Ken's name in his podcast, and Ken probably wouldn't share this either considering how it makes him look desperate, and how often he ragged on IDW and (especially) Ian beforehand.
@@J.R.Unboundvideo: the history of ken penders I think.
@@mediamuncher6982 The video by Garage Dwelling Frogs (which is the best username I've ever read), right? Guess I'll give it watch to brush up on the KPCU (Ken Penders Cinematic Universe). Thanks!
Edit: Just watched it. Unless you were regarding another video, I don't think Ken ever reached out to Ian to be a part of IDW. Ken DID screw over Ben Hurst by misrepresenting his Sonic movie pitch, and then proceeded to pitch his own Sonic Movie, so maybe you confused that event with another?
@@J.R.Unbound Yeah. I could of sworn that was the video.
Based Ian. Fuck Penders, that man really did a number on the Sonic franchise as a whole. He's the reason why a) the Archie Sonic comics don't exist anymore and b) why the Sonic franchise is now held back by shitty mandates (like Sonic not being allowed to show 'excessive emotion', whatever the fuck that means).
7:09 made me chuckle. I think some fans legitimately want badly drawn Sonic characters from him after that one notorious toothy Sonic he did. Though, I agree with your rant, that if you pay a professional artist, they should draw something original in their own style, not merely copy official works. (Heck, I wish someone would pay me to draw crap. Lol)
Also, great video, you did a good job researching the Sonic comics for someone not very familiar with them.
Scourge isn't actually his design, you see that is somebody else's design entirely, but because it was built off of Ken Penders' design Ken says he owns it. It falls into a copyright loophole. But because they don't really want to do this song and dance anymore they just let him have it.
I actually met Kenneth at SDCC one year, and he was tracing sonic x artwork.
LMAO like he was just sitting right there tracing it in the open?
@@HauntLich YES! I didn’t know who he was at the time, so now I own one of his prints for his canceled sonic movie and a compilation comic of stories that he wrote. Both of them are signed
I was practically in pain when you got to Hunnid-P/100P at the end.
The fact that what you mentioned him doing is nowhere NEAR the worst of his controversies is harrowing.
Yeah I only included the stuff that's Sonic relevant. The rest of his rap sheet is uhhhhhhhh inappropriate for my family friendly Christian minecraft server
"When would I ever get to talk about Butch Hartman?"
Uh, if you wanted to dig into his Axios service... good lord.
Fun fact: the music sonic show where they save there mom is what first introduced me to sonic so when I saw sonic without the necklace I was confused as hell
I think that was my first Sonic media too! That, or a let's play of Sonic CD. Either way, after these two came a let's play (or let's hate, I guess lol) of Sonic 06.
Yeah, the start of my Sonic experience was... strange.
6:07 My exact thoughts when I look at Penders's art. XD
It warms my heart knowing that my art is more pleasant to look at than his.
How the hell did he ever think Knuckles was his?
He STILL thinks Knuckles is his.
@@HauntLich Good point. You know what really bothers me is that I actually enjoyed the overall story that he tried to craft. Giving Knuckles an actual backstory that also becomes something he seeks out to learn. I would like to say one of his adventures uncovers a long distant ancestor, the very first Echidna he gets to meet since his father vanishes . . . And Enerjak tries to kill him.
Granted that's probably the reality of life, most of the people you think are good people turn out to be amoral snot balls.
Do Penders lawyers just say yes to anything
They say "no" to "Is there anything Ken Penders doesn't own" :^)
I see this as a precautionary tale... never give a crazy man too much power over making comics- especially not comics owned by someone else. Give then enough power and leeway and they might very well start to say and believe that they own it. I feel like Ken might be neuro divergent- and grew too attached to these characters and no one put a foot down fast enough to remind him that he was basically being paid to make Sonic fanfiction rather than owning the whole thing.
As for the art deterioration- I believe it. Not gotta put out any names but I have seen artist get full of themselves, get lazy, and depend so much on tracing that their art literally decreased in quality... Most of the time when this happens it just boils down to an artist getting lazier and no longer bothering to improve.
Yeah it really seems like a little bit more oversight while the comics were being made would've gone a long way. Someone probably would've noticed what Kenders was like much earlier on, or hell, SEGA could've noticed that the comics weren't anything like they wanted much earlier on.
@@HauntLich Ah hey! And good observation, I feel like this could have all been prevented had they taken the content more seriously. They didn't own sonic, they had the 'honor' (I guess) to basically make some OFFICIAL CONTENT- a bunch of fans of any series would be over the moon at this chance- and also respected the brand image and not go all nuts. But someone like Penders was the worst thing that could have happened here, his stories feel more like some crazy crackfic and no one ever proofread his stuff I guess. I'm also wondering how someone like him even got into the comic business in the first place, his art wasn't god tier... so I'm wondering if he had connections, especially if he was allowed to make an entire series on Knuckles.
Reminds me of how the Sonic comic team pitched a Kirby comic to Hal/Nintendo and got canned... makes me wonder if this incident played a part in it. Nintendo saw the mess that happened with the Echidnas and just noped out of that.
Also, always keep your contracts in a fireproof safe, or some equivalent to that effect.
*cough cough* the brazillian megaman comic *cough cough*
@@thywolfshark *_"I'm also wondering how someone like him even got into the comic business in the first place, his art wasn't god tier... so I'm wondering if he had connections."_*
Not sure about his entire comic career, but he definitely got into Archie Sonic through connections, at least from what I've heard. Someone at the team (can't remember who and I don't feel like doing research RN) was tasked to find a replacement for a writer that left. They ended up picking Ken Penders because they heard that his son loves Sonic. Not Ken himself, _his son._
Thanks for covering this topic had no idea that he did all this while writing the Archie sonic comic books
Your voice, your editing style, your obligatory shitting all over Butch Hartman. Subbed.
Happy to have you! :D
0:37 ok but sonic underground is goated
Ken Penders is just Butch Hartman but with an echidna obsession.
Why does Knuckles always make people crazy egomaniacs obsessed with dreadlocked echidnas? First Penders, then Hunnid-P
He's the perfect character. Faced with that perfection, men are driven to madness.
Quick Tip: Hunnid-P did NOT write or produce the music for Knuckles' stages. There is a huge controversy over this. All he ever did was add rap lyrics over the Japanese game's instrumental tracks for Knuckles, ordered by SEGA America. Those tracks were made by the same artists who made the rest of the music in SA2, all from Japan. Hunnid-P has been falsely claiming that the music was ALL made by him, when all he did really was overlap some pretty badly mastered and mediocre lyrics onto the Japanese OST. Definitely don't give that guy the credit. Hell, you could make a whole video on that situation, too.
Holy shit that is absolutely BANANAS if true, damn. I'll look into this.
We've been tricked, we've been backstabbed and we've been quite possibly bamboozled.
Your sprite art characters are incredible and added so much charm to the already great video! Great job!
God, I've seen like three videos on this absolute legend and it never gets old.
7:56 It's funny because Stephen Silver was the one behind Fairy OddParents art style, not Butch Hartman.
I've learned this from the comments after having made this video and it's made me wonder: the fuck does Butch Hartman actually DO? Do people commission him thinking he's the Fairly Oddparents artist and that's why he traces, because he actually can't draw but wants the money from being a famous artist?
@@HauntLichpretty late, but that's easy! He just had the idea for the shows in like 5 minutes (no joking) and...
That's it, he's "the creator of your childhood"!
Yeah I learned this recently too. Apparently he created Danny Phantom in 20 minutes during a drive to the office because the execs at Nick wanted a new action show for boys and he was like uuuuuuuuuuuuh how about this?@@Lissy_YT481
1:04 "Werewolf" can be translated into "Man-wolf"; that means that Sonic's basically a "man-hog."
Oh no
Ken dint invent echidnas! Earth did!
Ken is gonna sue because he invented the earth
Ngl I went through a little character arc when I found out that this guy existed, and yeah there's things I can improve upon as an artist but to the very minimum atleast I don't draw like fucking Chris Chan
This is what a sane and successful Chris-Chan looks like
Well, a successful Chris Chan
now i think ken said like,something like "a lot of the toxicity of the sonic fandom is due to the autistic fans trying to express themself and not sure how to respond when discussion veer into a disagreeable direction" so yeah make it what you want
I genuinely have no idea what he's trying to say there. Is it, "People disagree with me because they have autism"?
@@HauntLich idk but at that point it might be possible tho lol
Doesn't one of his kids have autism.
@@fightingmedialounge519 I am not a doctor. But as a professional internet ghostman, yeah probs.
@@Dcfan200 wouldn't exactly say it's a big problem. Most of the unsavory moments in the sonic franchises history wasn't the result of autism.
This is my first video by you but your voice is ridiculously pleasant to listen to dude. I have heard the Ken stories up and down but will definitely look at this and more of your content more.
Thank you, I'm very happy to hear you enjoy my content so much!
Idris Elba did a lot of research on Knuckles. Can you imagine if came across Ken Penders?
There's no way he didn't, Ken Penders created Knuckles after all.
Idris Elba Sega and paramount gave knuckles the recognition he always deserves. Even thou it is in movie.
The man who made some very cringy fanfics in the comics....That also goes for Ian Flynn too, except edgy and stories from his own comics he's made before working on Archie comics. No I am not kidding with that
Okay I just clicked on the video and I already think you're an awesome guy for using the ghouls n' ghosts C64 soundtrack. That game's OST is INCREDIBLE.
Ken is literally the only reason why Knux is the last of his kin and it kinda sucks i still pretty sore of what happen to sonic chronicles
Just found your channel today man and I gotta say, the sheer amount of different sprites you use for your avatar are leagues above some other popular channels with a similar gimmick I see on RUclips. It really helps add to the tone of what you're trying to say and adds a lot of expression. Top notch stuff here, man. Editing, quality, jokes, presentation. EZ subscribe 👍
Butler is a little tricky to understand if you are just listening and not reading the captions, but that voice has it's charm 😂
Yeah when I first introduced Butler he didn't have subtitles, fixed that in a jiffy. I've considered changing his voice, but to get a similar voice that's easier to understand, I'd probably have to get an entirely new TTS program made. That's on my to-do list rofl.
I'm really happy you like the content, it seems a lot of people have been discovering HauntLich as of late and been pleased with what they've found, and that kicks ass. Comments like this are what make creating this content really worth it. :D
I invented the concept of failure.
God: Who the hell is Ken Penders and why is he suing me?
9:52 why is Anthony Mackie playing as Pluto Nash?
7:35 Greg Land is infamous for tracing the same few stock images, aswell as other artist's works
And this guy's supposed to be an "industry professional" lmao. Lol even. Ridiculous.
7:29
Greg Land: Allow us to introduce ourselves
KEN PENDERS SOLD COMICS WITH SHADOW THE HEDGEHOG ON THE COVER AT DOUBLE PRICE AT HIS BOOTH AT COMIC CON, WHAT THE HELL DOES HE MEAN HE CAN'T DRAW SHADOW WHEN HE FREAKING WROTE HIS NAME ON MY BOOKS I BOUGHT FROM HIM???
I guess "I can't draw Shadow" actually meant "I don't want to draw Shadow for you, specifically, but I still want your money." big yeesh. Also double price? C'mon kenders.
@@HauntLich To be fair, I bought the comics in 2006 when I was just getting into collecting them, so this was well before the main drama, but still.
Also, he sold Flynn comics too. I have an issue 175 with his signature that I got without knowing until later that he didn't have anything to do with that arc at all.
@@raelogan Penders just scammed you
@@Dcfan200 Check my community page for a second, I just posted the pictures of the exact issues I have including another one he signed that he didn't work on. You will see that issues 157 and 158 have Shadow on the covers and his signature in gold sharpie marker. 🤨
By the way, I'm an all-around Sonic fan that collects from all continuities, stop trying to start drama
100-P as he's referred to in the credits of SA2 did not produce the knuckles Raps. All he did was write and sing the lyrics. It was Tomoya Ohtani that actually produced all of the instrumentals. Hence why they're actually good.
Sonic music should be kept to the people that dont sound like they're lyrically bankrupt
When you discussed tracing and started the "good thing no one else does this" statement I knew it would be Butch Hartman. I haven't even kept up with any Butch Hartman drama, hell I never actually watched any of his shows but a visceral part of me just knew it was him
That cracks me up I'm glad your mind went there
Thr man who ruined Archie comics and took uncle Chuck and sally
Oh yeah those characters are permanently shelved thanks to ol Kenders lmao
I heard something about Sally coming back but that could be just a rumor.
Ironic because he wanted to kill off Sally initially anyway because she had served his purpose.
@@mitchellhancock7920I think what they mean is that Sega still owns the original freedom fighters, like Sally, Bunnie…anyone from the cartoon only. Ken has no involvement of their creation at all. Some people say he does but I believe those are people who hate Sally and knows that if he does own her, then all hope of her coming back is dead.
But now that hope is…very minuscule, but it’s still there.
It gets better.
Apparently, Ken Penders originally wanted to a do a comic series about technologically advanced Native Americans. When he couldn't find a comic studio willing to publish a story like that, he started adapting it to have echidnas instead and start forcing it into the Archie comics.
At least, that's what I think happened. I'm not a big Sonic fan, but I am a big fan of stories about stupid people acting a fool.
3:07 oh my god I’ve never read any of the Archie comics, but why does Sonic look so depressed??? 😭
Because Princess Sally, the love of his life, was getting married with Antoine (who was actually Patch, Antoine's evil counterpart) so that the latter could become the king, not out of any romantic connection.
Yeah, it's wild and I've never read the comics either. The image comes from the cover art of issue 155 of Archie Sonic Comics.
@@robertlupa8273 I know the backstory; I was more just asking out of shock haha The Archie comments are actually insane. Shout out to Penders!
@@zigzagintrusion Oh ok 😅
One thing I didn't like about Ken Penders designs is that if characters were related, he would just take the original design; tweak the height/weight, give them a patch of hair and that's it. also I'm surprised that you didn't bring up the fact that he was the reason for the sega mandates
I wasn't fully aware of the SEGA mandates until after the fact. I tend to learn a lot from people after the videos are out, it's actually pretty neat that way.
tbh I'm not creative enough to come up with something better either
(this is not to excuse Penders, by the way)
You know, I actually find tracing to be more difficult and infinitely more boring than just drawing my own shit. I do not know why people do it.
He went back in time, stole the creature creation device and made echidnas
Ken Penders may be the single most powerful character in fiction.
For those who don't know after he "won" the case Sega said he can use the characters he "won" if the look and feel were not in any way similar to sonic (I think it was something like that).
Gotta say first time watching this channel and I gotta love the way you format things in your video. Keep up the good work
I'm thrilled you've decided to check me out and that you liked the vid. Thank you! :D
@@HauntLich absolutely no problem
Same here.
I still can't believe LobotomyBunny isn't, like, also a lich?
naw she's just a cute lady is all
All the Archie comics are great… all the ones written by Ian Flynn of course
6:07 is that A-Train in the back?
3:11 bro sonic just switched writers with spider-man’s for a second there
If your talent is deteriorating, but you're not lazy, there's things you can do about that. Nothing you can do about the inverse, since the premise is inherently that you're too lazy to do anything.
Edit post-heart: Examples being mainly the stuff you do if you lack talent or haven't developed it. Practise, addressing shortcomings, etc.
Welp guess I'm a lost cause then.
@@robertlupa8273 Being lazy isn't a fixed trait that can't be addressed. Try to focus on building good habits, like, for example, drawing a little bit daily. Even for a few minutes.
Thanks youtube algoritm
RUclips algorithm finally doing some work for me dang
Butch at least puts a bit of effort in his tracing. At least Ranma holds a kettle and Mikasa was drawn in a different style. Still he could put in a bit more effort in a commission.
I will never forgive ken penders. Not for fucking up the echidnas.
*But for fucking up chronicles and making the GIZOIDS non canon, actual sin, Gizoids are goated.*
@5:10 hey that bone head has pretty good taste. i like him.
@8:28 what.....?
HEY SAME BRAIN CELL!
Underated channel
Thank you friend, tell your loved ones of HauntLich :0
holy shit I love ur chracter so much, the art is so beautiful
Ngl I enjoyed Sonic Forces-
Though even I admit that Infinite was a damn good villian and they flat out WASTED his potential at the last second. Like bro they heavily implied he'd come back and he... Didn't.
They just had you fight Eggman in the shadow realm, went on a random spcheal about friendship and ended it there. -_-
Didn't you see? He's a little girl now in the new game :^)
Also known as the man who nearly destroyed the franchise as we knew it today
I'm curious where you heard the bit about the judge not understanding what the case was about (If true good on them for at least attempting to learn) and having never dealt with a copyright case before. I've heard that lawsuit story told tons of times over the years but this is the first time I've heard these bits.
As for the judge deciding a photo-copy of a contact is not admissible, I always heard the judge was worried accepting that would set a precedent that could potentially open the door to worse things down the line and they did not want to do that.
I was quite serious when I said I was giving the "campfire story" version of the Penders tale. Some of the stuff is internet rumor that's circulated for many years.
Interesting video, Lich Man
Please, make more!
Ken Penders. The OG Chris-chan.
oh my god i remember hunnid p's new sonic music announcement. always wondered what happened to that. turns out nothing i guess lol. that really brings back memories...
Thought I heard this one but then you mentioned the movie.
... Is it just me or does the echidna sheet look kind of like NFTs? Not a good look.
I love how much the echidna sheet looks like NFTs. It's like poetry, it rhymes.
They didn’t exist before 1994 obviously
I really like your style and the video is really cool I’m gonna give you a sub.
I’m just gonna watch more of your videos ;)
What Text to Speech you used for the flying skull guy?
Butler's TTS is Microsoft SAM, same as is used in the horror game Faith!
1:25 is that RuneScape music? That sounds like RuneScape music
Hell yeah it's runescape music!
I actually wonder how he got the job
I think Ken was a competent artist at the time at least. He showed passion for the project, necessary skills, i can definitely see how he got hired. I'm sure nobody could've predicted all this.
From what I've heard, he worked a bit on Star Trek comics before working in Archie Comics. How did he get there? Well, someone at Archie was told to find a replacement for a writer that had left at that time. He picked Ken because Ken's son loved Sonic. Yes, seriously.
ironic as Ken Pender looks like eggman
Honestly, we need a re-trial for the kenders case.
The problem with Ken is he can’t except that he couldn’t do what he wanted during his Archie run, his personal comic is a work of insanity, most likely he never published is because it has sonic n co in it, and he’s hoping that sega will go out of business so he can publish without the being sued by sega , it maybe also have the remaining archie sonic characters to but who knows
He’s also doing nfts of lara sue but her suit is from the sonic chronicles stating he owns it despite biowear being the creators , he also shows hatred toward the IDW Sonic run boasting that comics he’s done had sold more but people pointing out his lie, hes very very VERY salty
The line "Waiting for SEGA to go out of business" is genuinely hilarious to me. Imagine if SEGA went under and their licenses got bought by the likes of Nintendo and they sent the copyright ninjas after him after years of him thinking he was a winner.
@@Dcfan200 bruh
@@Dcfan200 I genuinely have no idea what you're talking about. I dunno who Potto is but you seem really pissed off about something or other in this comments section.
@@Dcfan200 I legit have 0 idea what you're schizoposting about my guy, but I appreciate the comments. 💀👍
@@HauntLichI feel like Nintendo yoinking sonic if sega dies is something they would very much do
this is why dark brotherhood doesn't have a sequel