Well ... Asked on Quora: *"Why do some British people not like Donald Trump?"* An articulate and witty writer from England, *Nate White,* wrote the following faultless response, *sentiments shared by people around the world in general* … “A few things spring to mind. Trump lacks certain qualities which the British traditionally esteem. For instance, he has no class, no charm, no coolness, no credibility, no compassion, no wit, no warmth, no wisdom, no subtlety, no sensitivity, no self-awareness, no humility, no honour and no grace; all qualities, funnily enough, with which his predecessor Mr. Obama was generously blessed. So for us, the stark contrast does rather throw Trump’s limitations into embarrassingly sharp relief. Plus, we like a laugh. And while Trump may be laughable, he has never once said anything wry, witty or even faintly amusing. Not once, ever. I don’t say that rhetorically, I mean it quite literally: not once, not ever. And that fact is particularly disturbing to the British sensibility. For us, to lack humour is almost inhuman. But with Trump, it’s a fact. He doesn’t even seem to understand what a joke is. His idea of a joke is a crass comment, an illiterate insult, a casual act of cruelty. Trump is a troll. And like all trolls, he is never funny and he never laughs; he only crows or jeers. And scarily, he doesn’t just talk in crude, witless insults, he actually thinks in them. His mind is a simple bot-like algorithm of petty prejudices and knee-jerk nastiness. There is never any under-layer of irony, complexity, nuance or depth. It’s all surface. Some Americans might see this as refreshingly upfront. Well, we don’t. We see it as having no inner world, no soul. And in Britain we traditionally side with David, not Goliath. All our heroes are plucky underdogs: Robin Hood, Dick Whittington, Oliver Twist. Trump is neither plucky, nor an underdog. He is the exact opposite of that. He’s not even a spoiled rich-boy, or a greedy fat-cat. He’s more a fat white slug. A Jabba the Hutt of privilege. And worse, he is that most unforgivable of all things to the British: a bully. That is, except when he is among bullies; then he suddenly transforms into a snivelling sidekick instead. There are unspoken rules to this stuff, the Queensberry rules of basic decency, and he breaks them all. He punches downwards, which a gentleman should, would, could never do, and every blow he aims is below the belt. He particularly likes to kick the vulnerable or voiceless, and he kicks them when they are down. So the fact that a significant minority, perhaps a third, of Americans look at what he does, listen to what he says, and then think ‘Yeah, he seems like my kind of guy’ is a matter of some confusion and no little distress to British people, given that: - Americans are supposed to be nicer than us, and mostly are. - You don’t need a particularly keen eye for detail to spot a few flaws in the man. This last point is what especially confuses and dismays British people, and many other people too; his faults seem pretty bloody hard to miss. After all, it’s impossible to read a single tweet, or hear him speak a sentence or two, without staring deep into the abyss. He turns being artless into an art form; he is a Picasso of pettiness; a Shakespeare of shit. His faults are fractal: even his flaws have flaws, and so on ad infinitum. God knows there have always been stupid people in the world, and plenty of nasty people too. But rarely has stupidity been so nasty, or nastiness so stupid. He makes Nixon look trustworthy and George W look smart. In fact, if Frankenstein decided to make a monster assembled entirely from human flaws, he would make a Trump. And a remorseful Doctor Frankenstein would clutch out big clumps of hair and scream in anguish: ‘My God, what have I created?’ If being a twat was a TV show, Trump would be the boxed set.”
This is beautiful!!!!! Id like to copy/paste to some magas I know! It is everything about trump worded superb!! You are correct as well, soooo obvious!!!
Ive watchedmy parents and brother descend into extreme Christian Nationalism. I'm so exhausted of their gaslighting and bigitry; my own daughter is bisexual, yet they claim that anything aside from saving yourself for heterosexual marriage is "the devil's work." This is inspiring. Thank you for speaking out! This is true bravery. ❤
I’m SO sorry for the division trump has wrought within your family. I’m afraid you will have to adopt the coping mechanism I have had to employ with my own family & husband of 41 years. NEVER TALK politics with your loved ones. Agree to disagree, & shut down any political talk. Otherwise you will have NO relationship with your friends & family. Sad.
Perhaps the word “devil’s work” is a bit extreme, but Biblical teachings don’t support extramarital sex in any form. However, if someone doesn’t believe or know the Bible you can’t hold them to this standard. It sounds like much of your family has gone way beyond disagreeing with the bisexual lifestyle, however, and are actively attacking & attempting to force their faith on others. If that worked (which it doesn’t) that wouldn’t be faith anyway! Jesus won people over to a faith & a walk that he himself admitted is not easy through his love & forgiveness, not through hatred & condemnation. The condemnation he did exhibit was reserved for the religious elite of his own time & people. Those Pharisees he criticized were exactly like the white Christian nationalists today.
@@timothyfWeber - abso-bloody-lutely right! I always think of fundamentalist christianity as NO DIFFERENT at all in form or intent than the vile fundamentalist Taliban.
@@SuiGeneris.LetsGetReal i agree with this statement and feel the same way too, as a christian myself and Jesus loved the little children, he never would’ve put them in cages, the bastard. he’s the diametric opposite of Jesus. he also helped and cured those who had afflictions, not mocked them, like he did the disabled reporter
That is the polar opposite of what a Christian is. Yes? A true Christian would not be driven by hate so therein lies the hypocrisy of these people. May God have mercy on everyone ~💙🇺🇸❤️
That is the polar opposite of what a Christian is. Yes? A true Christian would not be driven by hate so therein lies the hypocrisy of these people. May God have mercy on everyone ~💙🇺🇸❤️
As a Canadian Christian, I'm watching this shit seep into my country and I am so mad. The next time a Trump supporter says "When Trump was in power, the world respected us and now they don't" ask them if they have talked with anyone outside the US, because this Canadian told you that Canada (except for Alberta) is disgusted by Trump. Canada ❤ Biden.
I have been feeling that same level of frustration. I understand sort of what happened to the Conservatives in the US but the disappearance of Conservatives in Canada seems odd. I know that Reform engulfed and overtook thr party but this new bunch of right-wing extremist politicians under Poilievre seems so vile. I'm not a great fan of Trudeau's but atleast under the Liberal NDP coalition I feel like I'm looking at people I share a core set of values with whereas when I hear Poilievre or his ilk I feel like I'm watching Mini-MAGA wannabes. It's s lot of culture war nonsense slathered over with sheer awfulness. Is it just a disease we've caught from our American Cousins? Everytime I see Kevin O'leary on American media, I'm embarrassed. Guess we just have to hope Biden gets in in the States and maybe this garbage will calm down on this side of the border.
Religious conservatives seem to think freedom of religion includes the right to force their beliefs on those who don't share them much like Muslims who want to impose Sharia Law.
As was consplained* to me, "The Constitution says 'Freedom of religion.' That means you are free to choose which religion to believe, not freedom from religion." The Constitutions does not say "Freedom of religion." It actually says, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;..." * Conservatives tell me things.
This is an example of the Red Herring Logical Fallacy. The challenger avoids the topic by switching to an irrelevant topic. Not being forced into church has nothing to do with freedom of/from religion.
They are pro-life but don't have a clue what "life" is. They have no concept of being born from sexual assault, incest, born into poverty, becoming an orphan, single mothers, maternity complications including death, parents who unable to support their kids. And the health care in this country is absolutely terrible.
The very first amendment of our Constitution grants American citizens different freedoms, INCLUDING freedom of/from religious law making, and this anti-abortion nonsense absolutely violates that. Not to mention they want to pass laws tracking pregnancies which violate our HIPAA laws. But bc we have a bunch of corrupt, 'Christian', judges on SCOTUS that no one will hold accountable, American citizens have to lose their rights.
@@michelles.1930Controlling oneself, is a great way to prevent pg in the first place. Choose the action; choose the consequences. (Of course, I'm not including pg that occurs in cases of grape)
While I applaud her bravery in finally speaking out, as a long time progressive, I can't help but pull my hair out in frustration at the fact that there doesn't seem to be a single Republican who has any kind of empathy until the thing that progressives have been warning y'all about actually happens to y'all personally. None of y'all believed what we were saying for decades about abortion and the consequences of Roe falling. None of y'all believed us when we told y'all over and over that right wing Christian nationalists were a way bigger threat than any Muslim anywhere in the world. Now y'all are all shocked that women are dying, people can't start families and we are on track to elect the man who instigated an attempted coup by playing on your knee jerk acceptance of anything couched in religious terms and will bring the rest of the country down when he gets back into power. And most of y'all still don't believe us on that. What will it take for y'all to actually put yourselves in someone else's shoes for once or at least listen to what we have been practically screaming about for decades? When will y'all finally put your lust for power and money aside, get the hell over your racism, disavow your religious and political extremism and do something to make the country better?
Jonah Goldberg published a book called “Liberal Fascism” in 2008. He’s still treated as a serious person. These folks can’t fully think about their culpability yet. They still have to reflexively both sides.
Biden and Clinton were the most well funded politicians of all time. Zuckerberg, Bezos, Gates, Bloomberg ext ect support the democrats....what in the world are you in about??
Yes, that 'well I didn't think the leopard would eat MY face' lack of empathy by Conservatives is frustrating. It's been made worse by the inability of the Left and Right to share a set of facts on any issue, thanks to the right wing media propaganda. The most important thing to focus on in the moment though, is saving US, and potentially, world democracies.
@@seanpatrick1243 yup you’re right about that and vote blue through and through up and down the ballot no matter who and let’s vote these repugnants out of office 👋😁😈👊👊😈😇😇😇🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🦋🦋
@@michaelmeroyers5487 I'm not a Dem, so I'm not voting Blue. I'm voting against Red, because ALL Republicans are complicit at a minimum and should be nowhere near the levers of power.
@@seanpatrick1243 well it’s good that you’re voting anti red and thanks for your reply and have a great day today and stay cool 🆒👋😁😈👊👊👊😈😇😇😇😁🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🦋🦋
For demands of 'prayer back in our schools'---- who's prayer in whose name----otherwise w/ a church/state theocracy we lose or origins and head toward inquisition from the church factions. God is teaching the unteachable.
As a christian watching from Norway, you have no idea how different it is. One example is during WWII. When Quisling tried to take over the Lutheran church and put in nazis as priest and bishops people stopped going to that church all together. My grandparents even used a boat in secret to get to a regular church to get married.
@@kasperthecat44 also thanks for the info about the lutherans, my parents were from Europe during the 2nd WW, so interesting to hear another story about this
Wow!! In the God & Country documentary, they discuss how some Christian’s and Priests gave Hitler a religious acceptance of what he did as doing. It’s crazy!!
@@GrandmaCathy me either, what for? vote blue through and through up and down the ballot no matter who and let’s vote those repugnants out of office 😈👊👊👊🐁🐀🐷🐈⬛🐈⬛🐈⬛🐶🗳️🗳️💙💙💙🦋🦋🦋👋😄
it is monumental the point she makes about the right "cleaning their own house" before they start throwing stones. monumental. I have never heard someone from the right say this in such an explicit and clear way. thank you Elizabeth Neumann! this was so clear. not open to interpretation. she is clear on this, and she knows the data. she knows the deal. thank you both Tim and Elizabeth for this conversation. thank you!
'This Is Not Christianity' screams the headline, and of course I agree with Neumann and others that many supposed Christians seem to misunderstand their own faith. But the real problem is that we can't afford to reply 'So what?' Many of us who are not Christians find it both disturbing and alarming that a debate over the true nature of any religion should have such grave implications for the destiny of a supposedly secular republic, and that this is a privilege accorded only to Christians. I am glad that Christians are having this debate, but its necessity amounts to a tragic failure of pluralism.
The ultimate truth about Christianity is that no one knows anything about Jesus (Yeshu). It can only be inferred that the 1st century itinerant apocalyptic Jew Yeshu was crucified. Anything else is people creating the Jesus in their mind to resemble whatever they want him to be. Paul's gospel was not about Jesus, it was about Paul. The four gospels are more fictional than historical, and each tells a different story and theology. Half of the letters attributed to Paul are considered to be forgeries. The epistles of Peter and James were not written by Peter (Cephas) of James (Jacob). Christianity is a religion based on 1st century mythology, fiction, and wishful imaginings of mostly illiterate, ignorant people who never knew the living Jesus but only believed they did. Christianity is not about the real Jesus. It is about power and control over others. It is about self-righteousness and hypocrisy. It is not about truth. It is about misguided belief.
My dad was a man of great faith; a pastor, seminary professor and Biblical scholar. He would be shocked and saddened at the state of right wing "so called Christianity" today.
I've always laughed at the "guard rails held" rhetoric. If they had held, there would not have been a confederate flag in the capitol building. Tim is right, the rank and file were grown ups and stood in the path of destruction. The first and second level people, the ones in charge, abandoned their duties, and they got away with it.
The guard rails were weak and broken at some places, metaphorically speaking,. But if they hadn't held at all, that confederate flag wouldn't have been in the building. It would have been *on* the building.
Thank you so much Elizabeth. I'm crying through this whole interview. I have lost faith in Christians and their beliefs. I am afraid to join a Church for fear of what they believe and teach. I have lost relationships with family members who follow Trump. I am crying because you are speaking truth to what I believe. My rejoice is in you speaking truth to my Jesus. My Jesus lives strongly in my ❤ and my soul. I keep asking God to let me go home. What is my purpose for still being here. I just want to go HOME 🙏
I couldn't be less interested in Christianity. I quit going to church at 12, not able to take the hypocrisy. I just turned 67. That said, I do admire people who walk their talk and adhere to their faith. Good job, Elizabeth.
I am Christian, but from the perspective that people should practice kindness, patience, honor, etc., not in the dogmatic sense. Like you, the hypocrisy has rankled me. If hard core Christians think it is essential they spread Christ’s message, they should start with not offending people by their hypocrisy, it would be a lot easier for people to respect the message.
@@hectorbelarmino6457 I have met many genuine Christian’s, which is why it is so frustrating to have the Christian message turned into one of hate by so many. I find it sacrilegious and sometimes it is really hard to be around people who twist a story of sacrifice, humility, love and acceptance into self-congratulating superiority. But, I agree there are many good people out there. The intensity and volume of the hate is just a lot, A LOT. It obscures the Christian message for many, many people and turns them off.
Yes, as an American, I support and defend the U.S. Constitution, which allows people to worship their God in their way. As to myself, I don't abide by the hypocrisy either.
As a practicing follower of Jesus (albeit a progressive one), I find this conversation so important... absolutely essential. We have an organized and dangerous threat to our democracy in our country and it is grounded in some factions of Christianity. Christians need to keep speaking up, as the way their faith is being corrupted by Christian Nationalism is profound and frighteningly well- organized. You touched on the "academic"/theological justifications for violence that are a part of this. I would add the plans to "re-educate" our children via a Christian Nationalism based educational curriculum. That's an important one to pay attention to as it is happening in grassroots ways and in ways that are more subtle...polite. There's a lot to keep talking about here! Keep bringing it to a wider audience!
Sorry, but who is humiliating Christians and who is persecuting Christians? Seems to me the humiliation us self- inflicted and the persecution is imaginary.
In this country it is imaginary. That isn't true in other parts of the world. These evangelicals admire Russia so much, but unless they pledge their allegiance to Putin, they would be banned and their worship together worthy of imprisonment. But they see themselves as leopards, not ones who get their faces eaten by the leopards they support.
I say the same. I live in the Bible belt and see none of this happening. The Christian Right has been using this line of bullshite for decades starting with Jerry Farewell.
It is about perspective. Although it doesn’t make a lot of sense, people are threatened by what’s different and what they don’t understand. They fear it will take away the foundation of how they see things and are terrified of the potential loss of direction, world understanding, and purpose that drives their lives. (I’m surrounded by MAGA, so I see the fear and freaking out that drives the attacking.) NOT excusing it. I’m freaking exhausted by it, but I see it.
Ms. Neumann, thank you for your true Christian understanding and for leading people in the direction in which people of faith should go. You are a beacon of hope for many.
'Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows Me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life” (John 8:12). I hope you are not trying to turn Elizabeth Neuman into an idol for people to follow.
@@amandaemerson753 Correct, so do not proclaim Elizabeth Neumann as a 'beacon' when 'Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows Me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life” (John 8:12). Also, 'Jesus said to him, “I AM the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me"' (John 14:6). Jesus was not referring to Neumann. I think Neumann also mischaracterises Christianity because the passage about turning the other cheek (I believe) is about God not sorting out every problem. I do not know how people have come to understand Jesus Christ as a pacifist especially as Jesus intensified rather than abolished the moral order.
@@jonathandnicholson I said exactly what I meant. The words, hope and light are not interchangeable in the statement I made. I will not respond to you again. I will pray for you.
"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them." - Matthew 7:15-20
Roses come from thorned bushes. Are roses 'bad fruit'? Vaccines save lives. Dors the fact that they are produced from the very thing that would kill make them 'bad fruit'?
Isn’t it a bit of a self-own when these people admit they only clued in to how sick and twisted MAGA world is in 2020? The subtext to this whole interview is, “I’m kind of a foolish dupe who can’t see where the wind blows.”
My long reply is basically about ignoring all the warning signs of a growing problem. IDK how she got sucked in, and it's frustrating that it took her so long to get out, but at least she did and is doing something about it. I just wish there were more that could figure their way out. I wouldn't call her a dupe. She WAS duped but at least she figured it out and is doing something about it.
@@starpentavery well said. We need to encourage and welcome every person that fights their way out of this madness. You need to understand just how hard it is to turn your back on your "family" of political crazies and return to normalcy. I can't praise them enough; I'm just in awe at their courage.
Since Eisenhower's embrace, we have seen the encroachment of politics in religious lectures and consequential actions. All without the removal of non-profit status. Now THAT is unforgivable.
Thank you, Elizabeth Neuman! As a Christian, I am appalled by the Christian Nationalists! Their God is so small. Of course, Jesus didn't have to be crucified, and he didn't need an AR-15 or even an M16. If God created the Universe, He is perfectly capable of saving Jesus w/o a gun. And we don't need guns, either. We need to focus on loving God and our neighbors. Even as a lifelong Democrat I'm a better conservative than trump.
i was born on easter sunday and once when i was about 20 i saw a bumper sticker that said, jesus christ is coming back and boy is she pissed and i humbly thought that’s me,lol
As a Brit, a Liberal and an antitheist, I am currently watching what's going on in the States with a mixture of disbelief and deep alarm. But this was a brief ray of sunshine breaking through the gathering storm clouds - there may be hope after all. Thank you.
She voted for trump. trump wanted a favor in exchange for weapons for Ukraine, blue and yellow flag. You remember? She wanted to save unwanted children, now thousands of ukrainian children are dead. Worth it?
I am agnostic but I grew up going to Grace Church in Brooklyn Heights, NY. My late father was a Quaker and my mom an Episcopalian. Our church was all about inclusion and helping the poor. No one and I mean no one was out there trying to convert people. Believe it or not, there were Jews and Muslims who came just because the message was simple. Love thy neighbor and do not judge others. One of our rectors was a gay married man who to oversaw my parents renewing their vows after 50 years. They, I believe that homosexuality is not a sin, that a woman has the right to chose, etc. The rector now is black. He preaches about acceptance and love and inclusion and community, etc.
Go back to that Church. For God sake it speaks of everything Jesus was sent her to tell what God wanted his people to hear. I think you are one of the chosen who would hear and believe. Once I gave my life to Jesus and accepted him as my Lord the scales fell off my eyes and I saw things so clearly. I could read the Bible and understand it. I felt the Holy Spirit come into my life and direct me as an intercededant to Jesus I am not blowing smoke up your ass. This is my true experience.
@@marceechristensen2533i never believed in God, but i found him in a recovery house and he looks just like the God in the bible with the flowing robes and long beard and hair he pats me on the head and says you’ve been bad but you’re doing much better now
@@michaelmeroyers5487 I don't know what this reply was about. But it doesn't matter , Jesus mean't for you to give it to me. I just finished a 1st time DUI offender 48 hour lockdown. Got there after a year and a half. I have been in outpatient and inpatient treatment 5 times. Why doesn't God heal me ?!?!? I believe even I don't think I am worthy. God is real he sent Jesus to us so we may be free. He gave us a choice to be free..... I want to be free but the demons who know I am vulnerable still haunt me
Elizabeth Neumann is a national security treasure! Thank you for heeding to the need for YOUR help and expertise regarding that call that day! Thank you Elizabeth Neumann for YOUR service. God Bless You and Yours! 💙❤️💙🇺🇸💙❤️💙🇺🇸💙❤️💙🇺🇸💙❤️
I don't want to one more thing about "faith." Esp. since I finally had to end my contact with my brother who married a "Christian" and proceeded to become a liar and fake and cut us out of the family. We moved away but I kept the peace...but after he went beserk on me recently...he finally revealed that he's in the cult ...I finally hung up after 44 years of gaslighting.
"He was elected by the people." No, in fact he was put in office by the Electoral College, but NOT by the majority of the electorate. This is an important point.
Thank you, Tim, for bringing a host of right-leaning Christian evangelicals and political conservatives into my awareness that I can imagine meeting and having a serious, respectful conversation with. There is sanity and extremism on both sides, and I believe Joe Biden is in exactly the right place at the right time to navigate these treacherous waters.
When you are way out on a wing tip yourself, you have no idea what is right, left, or mainstream. Out on the wing, you think you're mainstream, but the reality is, you're out on the wing!
“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” He said to him:””You must love your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind”. This is the greatest and first commandment. The second, like it, is this: “You must love your neighbor as yourself “. On these two commandments the whole Law hangs, and the Prophets”. Matthew 22:37-40. Anyone not following the admonition is not a Christian (A follower of Jesus Christ) PERIOD
@@Tracy-mq3tz absolutely agree and well said, also the real christians i’ve met teach with love, patience and tolerance for others, not hateful judgments and controlling and punishing
Trump stepped right into the "Boss" place that evangelicals have been taught all their lives to revere and never, ever question. He uses the Constitution just like they do the Bible, a symbol of Ultimate Authority "written down" they can't read, and rely on the pastor to tell them its meaning.
He is constantly referring to the Constitution for his defense. This concerns me because I have heard that he wants to re-write the constitution. So it's good enough for him now but needs to be changed when he's in power? 😢
@nanad4755 Trump’s use of the constitution is entirely self-serving. He cherry-picks and misrepresents whatever little piece of the constitution is convenient to his goals at the moment. He disregards whatever parts aren’t, and he has no qualms at all about completely changing his reading of the constitution in the next moment to suit his changing needs.
Thanks for this great interview. I need to watch a video with more than Trump's Trials. I'm sick of hearing about Trump. I thank you for your great new ideas. Great interview.
Living in Portland, Oregon during that period was horrifying. The national news reporting was sorely lacking. With Idaho on our border & 15 Oregon counties wanting to secede & join Idaho, the Trumpster threat is still very real today. As a nation we have a lot of work to do. I'm glad you're here. Blessings.
I agree with you guys wholeheartedly. I’m a Christian, but I can’t even speak to my Christian friends, because they believe lies and conspiracy theories. I know they would dump me if I spoke up. I have to tell my Democrat friends I’m not like other Christians, that I believe in love, acceptance, and mercy.
As an atheist, what is happening in this country is appalling. The US was designed to be a secular nation. Very little of the Constitution was based on Christianity or any other religion. Much was based on the politics of the Iroquois Nation and other such agreements. Even the Founders said it was a secular nation. Religion has always been in our government. Originally, atheist were not allowed to run for office. Now they can run for office, but, if their lack of faith is known, they most likely will not win. Maybe with the current marriage of religion and government and the lose of women's right to abortion, people will see that religion is not all its cracked up to be.
I’m sorry - there was NEVER any question about Trump’s lack of character. His campaign should have ended when he made fun of the disabled reporter. Hillary was right about everything.
Thanks so much for this podcast. Now is a great time to note what an incredible amount of respect I have for Ms. Neumann and the folks on the inside of the past administration for speaking out. I want to suggest a follow up on this subject as it relates to the Obama administration’s failure (or perhaps their conscious choice) to ignore the rise of right wing extremism in the first decade of this century. Was it fear of him being a Black man looking at a rise in White Christian Nationalist extremism as a direct result of the ascendancy of a Black man to the presidency? The rise of White Christian nationalism was identified and chronicled during his presidency but generally ignored. His own intelligence folks testified to the issue repeatedly to congress during this period but it appeared at the time and in retrospect that it was generally ignored. Thanks
I imagine it is the number of single women on Welfare. I've tried welfare twice in the past. It's better to have a low paying job that treats people like crap.
Thank you Ms. Neumann! As a lifelong Christian and 50 plus year registered Republican, I have wondered what happened to the Republican Party. It is very heartbreaking to see what worship of a man can do. I pray eyes will be opened. I am also in real fear for my country.
I appreciate Elizabeth coming forward and her ethics. I still have to ask who was responsible for the lack of security on J6. No one has said "the buck stops here." To say "we didn't foresee" the lack of security is beside the point, It was someone's JOB, not to foresee, but to know all the protocols for ramping up security and to communicate the threats appropriately, but it seems no one really did their job. Y'all were asleep at the wheel.
Trump removed the people who could have done that after the election and put his hand picked syncophants into every position that could have made a difference. Those people had the ones who knew what to look for and what to do walking a tightrope in fear for themselves. That's if those people weren't totally pushed out of the administration like Elizabeth was the prior year.
A lot of people knew something was going to happen, but the one person who knew and ordered it, trump, wanted it to happen. The President at the time is the only person that could give the order for more police or National Guard, no one else would be listened to, they listen only to the President in office, and we all know that was trump.
God bless you Elizabeth. Thank you for speaking out and for your patriotism. Keep speaking the truth. It matters now more than ever as we head towards November.
"The mafia culture" was nothing new about Trump! I felt it oozing off the page of a Playboy Interview. I could almost smell it! Why did, and do, so many miss that! I can't fathom the blindness!
I wasn't familiar with Ms Neumann, but her description of her faith is refreshing to hear. It's hard to keep evangelical Christian friends with an 'us against them' view of the world.
Tim, you were a great addition to the Bulwark network. I much enjoy your shows. This was a great guest who did far better on the topic than most. I think made a number of errors, such as a blending of morality and legality, rather than keeping them distinct topics. A number of such things. But overall, excellent. Too many make too many errors, so this was refreshing.
If you want to know what Jesus thought about the blending of morality and legality, read John 8 - not just the first eleven verses, but the whole chapter. It isn't long. Even someone with a sixth-grade education should be able to get through it quickly.
@racookster It isn't relevant. Our form of government was built upon certain philosophic ideas. Freedom is built upon the concept of individual rights. In a free society, things are based upon the protection of individual rights, not the enforcement of anyone's views on morality. Be those views whatever religion or non-religion. To remain a free society, we've got to resist some violating the individual rights of others, for enforcement of their religious views, through force of government. I don't mean that the topic you've mentioned isn't important. It is good to know. My starting point is distinguishing religious discussion from political discussion. Once in agreement that we should remain a free society, and that government should be about protection of individual rights, not enforcement of religious views, then lots of topics are good for discussion, in the proper context. It's definitely worth looking at what Jesus had to say on the topic, for awareness and understanding of that perspective. But theocrats are going to want their religious views to dictate the nation's laws, regardless. And so the starting point has to be the Enlightenment rooted philosophical ideas that led to freedom. Separation of church and state being at the core of it. I think it worthwhile to learn a little about Roger Williams. That wall of separation thing started with him, in the early 1600's. The concept resulted in him having to flee Massachusetts, to remain among the living, and then he founding Rhode Island, with its hedge of separation. Massachusetts then invading Rhode Island in objection to that separation. @racookster It isn't relevant. Our form of government was built upon certain philosophic ideas. Freedom is built upon the concept of individual rights. In a free society, things are based upon the protection of individual rights, not the enforcement of anyone's views on morality. Be those views whatever religion or non-religion. To remain a free society, we've got to resist some violating the individual rights of others, for enforcement of their religious views, through force of government. I don't mean that the topic you've mentioned isn't important. It is good to know. My starting point is distinguishing religious discussion from political discussion. Once in agreement that we should remain a free society, and that government should be about protection of individual rights, not enforcement of religious views, then lots of topics are good for discussion, in the proper context. It's definitely worth looking at what Jesus had to say on the topic, for awareness and understanding of that perspective. But theocrats are going to want their religious views to dictate the nation's laws, regardless. And so the starting point has to be the Enlightenment rooted philosophical ideas that led to freedom. Separation of church and state being at the core of it. I think it worthwhile to learn a little about Roger Williams. That wall of separation thing started with him, in the early 1600's. The concept resulted in him having to flee Massachusetts, to remain among the living, and then he founding Rhode Island, with its hedge of separation. Massachusetts then invading Rhode Island with military force, in objection to that separation. Williams having to get on a ship to England, to petition parliament for their approval for having this separation between church and state, and his writing extensively while in England, and those writings having influence on a young English Philosopher, named John Locke. Whose two treatises on government had enormous influence on the government we eventually formed. Jefferson used the phrase wall of separation because he was writing to Baptists. And Roger Williams has strong connection to the forming of the Baptist religion.
Thank you Elizabeth for taking that job. I was sure that nobody working around him knew what they were doing. I prayed every day that strong, smart people were directing him and then it became clear that no! Anyone who knew what they were doing was sent packing. This is why he had the revolving door. Thank you for your service to the country, you tried.
With theocrats, regardless of the religious tradition they base it in, read into whatever religious text whatever supports their authoritarianism yearnings. Arguing it on a religious basis won't do anything at all. Should our laws be based in protection of individual rights? Or should it be based on enforcement of religious views. At that point religion, and religious texts, become irrelevant. Authoritarians have their starting point at the end, and then work backward from there, relying heavily on rationalizations. It simply isn't a religious discussion. It's a political discussion. In their Authoritarian quests, they'll always claim that God is on their side.
![Megan Thee Stallion - Bigger In Texas [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/QxTkZTLWdo4/mqdefault.jpg)
Well ... Asked on Quora: *"Why do some British people not like Donald Trump?"* An articulate and witty writer from England, *Nate White,* wrote the following faultless response, *sentiments shared by people around the world in general* …
“A few things spring to mind. Trump lacks certain qualities which the British traditionally esteem. For instance, he has no class, no charm, no coolness, no credibility, no compassion, no wit, no warmth, no wisdom, no subtlety, no sensitivity, no self-awareness, no humility, no honour and no grace; all qualities, funnily enough, with which his predecessor Mr. Obama was generously blessed. So for us, the stark contrast does rather throw Trump’s limitations into embarrassingly sharp relief.
Plus, we like a laugh. And while Trump may be laughable, he has never once said anything wry, witty or even faintly amusing. Not once, ever. I don’t say that rhetorically, I mean it quite literally: not once, not ever.
And that fact is particularly disturbing to the British sensibility. For us, to lack humour is almost inhuman. But with Trump, it’s a fact. He doesn’t even seem to understand what a joke is. His idea of a joke is a crass comment, an illiterate insult, a casual act of cruelty.
Trump is a troll. And like all trolls, he is never funny and he never laughs; he only crows or jeers. And scarily, he doesn’t just talk in crude, witless insults, he actually thinks in them. His mind is a simple bot-like algorithm of petty prejudices and knee-jerk nastiness.
There is never any under-layer of irony, complexity, nuance or depth. It’s all surface. Some Americans might see this as refreshingly upfront. Well, we don’t. We see it as having no inner world, no soul.
And in Britain we traditionally side with David, not Goliath. All our heroes are plucky underdogs: Robin Hood, Dick Whittington, Oliver Twist. Trump is neither plucky, nor an underdog. He is the exact opposite of that. He’s not even a spoiled rich-boy, or a greedy fat-cat. He’s more a fat white slug. A Jabba the Hutt of privilege.
And worse, he is that most unforgivable of all things to the British: a bully. That is, except when he is among bullies; then he suddenly transforms into a snivelling sidekick instead. There are unspoken rules to this stuff, the Queensberry rules of basic decency, and he breaks them all. He punches downwards, which a gentleman should, would, could never do, and every blow he aims is below the belt. He particularly likes to kick the vulnerable or voiceless, and he kicks them when they are down.
So the fact that a significant minority, perhaps a third, of Americans look at what he does, listen to what he says, and then think ‘Yeah, he seems like my kind of guy’ is a matter of some confusion and no little distress to British people, given that:
- Americans are supposed to be nicer than us, and mostly are.
- You don’t need a particularly keen eye for detail to spot a few flaws in the man.
This last point is what especially confuses and dismays British people, and many other people too; his faults seem pretty bloody hard to miss. After all, it’s impossible to read a single tweet, or hear him speak a sentence or two, without staring deep into the abyss.
He turns being artless into an art form; he is a Picasso of pettiness; a Shakespeare of shit. His faults are fractal: even his flaws have flaws, and so on ad infinitum. God knows there have always been stupid people in the world, and plenty of nasty people too. But rarely has stupidity been so nasty, or nastiness so stupid. He makes Nixon look trustworthy and George W look smart.
In fact, if Frankenstein decided to make a monster assembled entirely from human flaws, he would make a Trump. And a remorseful Doctor Frankenstein would clutch out big clumps of hair and scream in anguish: ‘My God, what have I created?’
If being a twat was a TV show, Trump would be the boxed set.”
Perfection. Thank you from the "other" side of USA. As Mr T said "I pity the fools"💙
This is beautiful!!!!! Id like to copy/paste to some magas I know! It is everything about trump worded superb!! You are correct as well, soooo obvious!!!
Bravo! *Stadium Cheer!*
Very well stated!
Excellent!
Ive watchedmy parents and brother descend into extreme Christian Nationalism. I'm so exhausted of their gaslighting and bigitry; my own daughter is bisexual, yet they claim that anything aside from saving yourself for heterosexual marriage is "the devil's work." This is inspiring. Thank you for speaking out! This is true bravery. ❤
Sorry.I I know it's weird. Most of my extended family is White. I have a niece with a gay daughter, but she is pro-Trump!
I’m SO sorry for the division trump has wrought within your family. I’m afraid you will have to adopt the coping mechanism I have had to employ with my own family & husband of 41 years. NEVER TALK politics with your loved ones. Agree to disagree, & shut down any political talk.
Otherwise you will have NO relationship with your friends & family. Sad.
All but three of us in my family are Trump supporters, so I get it.
Perhaps the word “devil’s work” is a bit extreme, but Biblical teachings don’t support extramarital sex in any form. However, if someone doesn’t believe or know the Bible you can’t hold them to this standard. It sounds like much of your family has gone way beyond disagreeing with the bisexual lifestyle, however, and are actively attacking & attempting to force their faith on others. If that worked (which it doesn’t) that wouldn’t be faith anyway! Jesus won people over to a faith & a walk that he himself admitted is not easy through his love & forgiveness, not through hatred & condemnation. The condemnation he did exhibit was reserved for the religious elite of his own time & people. Those Pharisees he criticized were exactly like the white Christian nationalists today.
I'm sorry this is happening to you. Mass psychosis is REAL. I know it may be hard to accept, but it's a thing. Check it out.
As a conservative christian, thank you for the work you are doing. It is extremely important to talk about the danger of religious fanaticism.
You’re a conservative Christian? You are not for Trump? Can you please try to convince other conservatives that he is not God?
@@user-wd3po8sd7k I’m Catholic, my friends who are Trumpers generally are blind to what is going on or want to see it all burn down.
@@user-wd3po8sd7k But trump says he is a god, he wouldn't lie would he.
“It is from principally White Christian Nationalism that we have the threat of Fascism in this country. “- Alan Watts 1970
Thank you for this quote-a sobering reminder.
It’s because of all ignorant primitive unjustified belief that we have any of this bullshit.
American Taliban Tactics.
Twist the " good book " in to fascist playbook.
@@timothyfWeber - abso-bloody-lutely right! I always think of fundamentalist christianity as NO DIFFERENT at all in form or intent than the vile fundamentalist Taliban.
@timothyfWeber
There is no "good book " only GOOD PEOPLE 😉
She a person with a conscience, a human with a soul. It’s very brave of her to speak out against corruption and tyranny. Bravo 👏
Agree. She believes all humans have a
‘soul’ and can act accordingly. No violence.
It is so refreshing to see a christian not driven by hate. Thank you
@@SuiGeneris.LetsGetReal i agree with this statement and feel the same way too, as a christian myself and Jesus loved the little children, he never would’ve put them in cages, the bastard. he’s the diametric opposite of Jesus. he also helped and cured those who had afflictions, not mocked them, like he did the disabled reporter
@@michaelmeroyers5487 esus was a communist , so Maga has to hate him .That is in their "rules"
That is the polar opposite of what a Christian is. Yes? A true Christian would not be driven by hate so therein lies the hypocrisy of these people. May God have mercy on everyone ~💙🇺🇸❤️
That is the polar opposite of what a Christian is. Yes? A true Christian would not be driven by hate so therein lies the hypocrisy of these people. May God have mercy on everyone ~💙🇺🇸❤️
As a Canadian Christian, I'm watching this shit seep into my country and I am so mad.
The next time a Trump supporter says "When Trump was in power, the world respected us and now they don't" ask them if they have talked with anyone outside the US, because this Canadian told you that Canada (except for Alberta) is disgusted by Trump.
Canada ❤ Biden.
As another Canadian, I fully second this statement. 👍🏻👍🏻
As a contrarian Albertan I am with you
Yeah, reporting from Edmonton; send reinforcements! Hurry!
I'm in Australia and Trump time was a joke. After a while it just became sad that so many people in the US still love him.
I have been feeling that same level of frustration. I understand sort of what happened to the Conservatives in the US but the disappearance of Conservatives in Canada seems odd. I know that Reform engulfed and overtook thr party but this new bunch of right-wing extremist politicians under Poilievre seems so vile. I'm not a great fan of Trudeau's but atleast under the Liberal NDP coalition I feel like I'm looking at people I share a core set of values with whereas when I hear Poilievre or his ilk I feel like I'm watching Mini-MAGA wannabes. It's s lot of culture war nonsense slathered over with sheer awfulness. Is it just a disease we've caught from our American Cousins? Everytime I see Kevin O'leary on American media, I'm embarrassed. Guess we just have to hope Biden gets in in the States and maybe this garbage will calm down on this side of the border.
You can't have freedom of religion without freedom from religion.
Religious conservatives seem to think freedom of religion includes the right to force their beliefs on those who don't share them much like Muslims who want to impose Sharia Law.
So who dragged you into a church in the name of Donald Trump?
As was consplained* to me, "The Constitution says 'Freedom of religion.' That means you are free to choose which religion to believe, not freedom from religion."
The Constitutions does not say "Freedom of religion." It actually says, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;..."
* Conservatives tell me things.
This is an example of the Red Herring Logical Fallacy. The challenger avoids the topic by switching to an irrelevant topic. Not being forced into church has nothing to do with freedom of/from religion.
All religions are scams, making false claims and promises for your tithings.
Baffles me why religion matters so much over there. Forcing unwanted pregnancies on women is disgusting
It’s a means of control, top to bottom.
They are pro-life but don't have a clue what "life" is. They have no concept of being born from sexual assault, incest, born into poverty, becoming an orphan, single mothers, maternity complications including death, parents who unable to support their kids.
And the health care in this country is absolutely terrible.
The very first amendment of our Constitution grants American citizens different freedoms, INCLUDING freedom of/from religious law making, and this anti-abortion nonsense absolutely violates that. Not to mention they want to pass laws tracking pregnancies which violate our HIPAA laws. But bc we have a bunch of corrupt, 'Christian', judges on SCOTUS that no one will hold accountable, American citizens have to lose their rights.
VAN_TRIPPIN: (In case of "grape" aside, of course) When you choose the action-you choose the consequence.
@@michelles.1930Controlling oneself, is a great way to prevent pg in the first place. Choose the action; choose the consequences. (Of course, I'm not including pg that occurs in cases of grape)
Yes, thank you, Ms. Neumann. And thanks, Tim, for a great guest.
While I applaud her bravery in finally speaking out, as a long time progressive, I can't help but pull my hair out in frustration at the fact that there doesn't seem to be a single Republican who has any kind of empathy until the thing that progressives have been warning y'all about actually happens to y'all personally. None of y'all believed what we were saying for decades about abortion and the consequences of Roe falling. None of y'all believed us when we told y'all over and over that right wing Christian nationalists were a way bigger threat than any Muslim anywhere in the world. Now y'all are all shocked that women are dying, people can't start families and we are on track to elect the man who instigated an attempted coup by playing on your knee jerk acceptance of anything couched in religious terms and will bring the rest of the country down when he gets back into power. And most of y'all still don't believe us on that. What will it take for y'all to actually put yourselves in someone else's shoes for once or at least listen to what we have been practically screaming about for decades? When will y'all finally put your lust for power and money aside, get the hell over your racism, disavow your religious and political extremism and do something to make the country better?
Right! It’s also convenient in many cases. Many of these folks created climate to bring us Drump & Christo fascism.
Jonah Goldberg published a book called “Liberal Fascism” in 2008.
He’s still treated as a serious person.
These folks can’t fully think about their culpability yet. They still have to reflexively both sides.
Biden and Clinton were the most well funded politicians of all time. Zuckerberg, Bezos, Gates, Bloomberg ext ect support the democrats....what in the world are you in about??
Yes, that 'well I didn't think the leopard would eat MY face' lack of empathy by Conservatives is frustrating. It's been made worse by the inability of the Left and Right to share a set of facts on any issue, thanks to the right wing media propaganda. The most important thing to focus on in the moment though, is saving US, and potentially, world democracies.
Right on! Been saying the same since the 1980s
Are you serious?
Even since before Reagan, there has been no way that you can be a republican and a Christian without being an incredible hypocrite.
@@seanpatrick1243 yup you’re right about that and vote blue through and through up and down the ballot no matter who and let’s vote these repugnants out of office 👋😁😈👊👊😈😇😇😇🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🦋🦋
@@michaelmeroyers5487
I'm not a Dem, so I'm not voting Blue. I'm voting against Red, because ALL Republicans are complicit at a minimum and should be nowhere near the levers of power.
@@michaelmeroyers5487
My comment was removed for calling republicans complicit and mentioning that I’m not a dem, so my vote will be anti-red.
@@seanpatrick1243 well it’s good that you’re voting anti red and thanks for your reply and have a great day today and stay cool 🆒👋😁😈👊👊👊😈😇😇😇😁🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🗳️🦋🦋
@@michaelmeroyers5487
I'm not a Dem, but I'm energized by the Harris campaign. Biden pulling out was like a weight lifted from my shoulders.
Church and state should never be mixed.
If you want to see the likely results of church state entanglement check out regimes like Iran.
@@glenjohnson5323 Exactly!
I’m a Christian, and even I understand that! What happens when church and state mix? Anybody heard of The Crusades? The Spanish Inquisition?
For demands of 'prayer back in our schools'---- who's prayer in whose name----otherwise w/ a church/state theocracy we lose or origins and head toward inquisition from the church factions. God is teaching the unteachable.
It's almost like a group of people left Britain for that very reason.
As a christian watching from Norway, you have no idea how different it is. One example is during WWII. When Quisling tried to take over the Lutheran church and put in nazis as priest and bishops people stopped going to that church all together. My grandparents even used a boat in secret to get to a regular church to get married.
@@kasperthecat44 that’s really interesting Norway and thank you for your support and comments 😁😈👊👊😈😇😇🗳️🗳️🗳️
@@kasperthecat44 also thanks for the info about the lutherans, my parents were from Europe during the 2nd WW, so interesting to hear another story about this
Wow!! In the God & Country documentary, they discuss how some Christian’s and Priests gave Hitler a religious acceptance of what he did as doing. It’s crazy!!
Haven’t been to church in years. They’ve gone completely off the rails.
@@GrandmaCathy me either, what for? vote blue through and through up and down the ballot no matter who and let’s vote those repugnants out of office 😈👊👊👊🐁🐀🐷🐈⬛🐈⬛🐈⬛🐶🗳️🗳️💙💙💙🦋🦋🦋👋😄
it is monumental the point she makes about the right "cleaning their own house" before they start throwing stones. monumental. I have never heard someone from the right say this in such an explicit and clear way. thank you Elizabeth Neumann! this was so clear. not open to interpretation. she is clear on this, and she knows the data. she knows the deal. thank you both Tim and Elizabeth for this conversation. thank you!
People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones
When you are done cleaning your own house, you should stay there and continue minding your own business. Choice.
'This Is Not Christianity' screams the headline, and of course I agree with Neumann and others that many supposed Christians seem to misunderstand their own faith. But the real problem is that we can't afford to reply 'So what?' Many of us who are not Christians find it both disturbing and alarming that a debate over the true nature of any religion should have such grave implications for the destiny of a supposedly secular republic, and that this is a privilege accorded only to Christians. I am glad that Christians are having this debate, but its necessity amounts to a tragic failure of pluralism.
YES!!! This!
I was about to post a comment similar to yours but when I read your post, you stated it perfectly. Great job and I fully agree.
Thanks!
The ultimate truth about Christianity is that no one knows anything about Jesus (Yeshu). It can only be inferred that the 1st century itinerant apocalyptic Jew Yeshu was crucified. Anything else is people creating the Jesus in their mind to resemble whatever they want him to be. Paul's gospel was not about Jesus, it was about Paul. The four gospels are more fictional than historical, and each tells a different story and theology. Half of the letters attributed to Paul are considered to be forgeries. The epistles of Peter and James were not written by Peter (Cephas) of James (Jacob). Christianity is a religion based on 1st century mythology, fiction, and wishful imaginings of mostly illiterate, ignorant people who never knew the living Jesus but only believed they did. Christianity is not about the real Jesus. It is about power and control over others. It is about self-righteousness and hypocrisy. It is not about truth. It is about misguided belief.
@@hangonaminute2580Q1 aqq😂😂
My dad was a man of great faith; a pastor, seminary professor and Biblical scholar. He would be shocked and saddened at the state of right wing "so called Christianity" today.
it's just another kind of crazy than your dad believed. he`s was just older.
Or it’s also possible that your Dad could of been the ring man
Bless us maga Mike 🙏 let us pray 🙏 for democracy 🙏 ahmen
And yet we rarely hear any christians speak out.
@@fries-with-lies No, he was not like them.
As a long time Buddhist, I find myself agreeing with Ms. Neumann. I deeply appreciate her version of Christianity.
Is Elizabeth Neumann's 'version of Christianity' orthodox Christianity?
I wouldn't say that's her version. It's in the bible.
@@Poemi10304 And the Bible was a propaganda book, designed to denigrate women and pagans. Where is the Book of Mary, Jesus’ wife?
Does that include forcing women to give birth, regardless of their circumstances?
How many versions are there? What a crock of crap! Sending my thoughts and prayers! 🤣
Thank you for sticking to your real Christian values Elizabeth this was a very good podcast!
I've always laughed at the "guard rails held" rhetoric. If they had held, there would not have been a confederate flag in the capitol building. Tim is right, the rank and file were grown ups and stood in the path of destruction. The first and second level people, the ones in charge, abandoned their duties, and they got away with it.
We can always assume there is much more that we don’t know. Let’s all hope we don’t have to experience T without any guardrails!
The guard rails were weak and broken at some places, metaphorically speaking,. But if they hadn't held at all, that confederate flag wouldn't have been in the building. It would have been *on* the building.
@@phillylifer not all of them got away Scott free. waiting patiently for that
@@cphcph12 good point and well said, 😊 thanks
Thank you, Ms. Neumann. The Lord bless you for speaking the truth❤
Thank-you to both Elizabeth Neumann and Tim Miller for presenting sane, rational commentary on the current political situation in the USA.
Thank you so much Elizabeth. I'm crying through this whole interview. I have lost faith in Christians and their beliefs. I am afraid to join a Church for fear of what they believe and teach. I have lost relationships with family members who follow Trump.
I am crying because you are speaking truth to what I believe. My rejoice is in you speaking truth to my Jesus. My Jesus lives strongly in my ❤ and my soul. I keep asking God to let me go home. What is my purpose for still being here. I just want to go HOME 🙏
I couldn't be less interested in Christianity. I quit going to church at 12, not able to take the hypocrisy. I just turned 67. That said, I do admire people who walk their talk and adhere to their faith. Good job, Elizabeth.
I am Christian, but from the perspective that people should practice kindness, patience, honor, etc., not in the dogmatic sense. Like you, the hypocrisy has rankled me. If hard core Christians think it is essential they spread Christ’s message, they should start with not offending people by their hypocrisy, it would be a lot easier for people to respect the message.
I believe there are enough genuine Christians out there. You probably haven't met them yet. The first step is to ask God for guidance.
@@hectorbelarmino6457 I have met many genuine Christian’s, which is why it is so frustrating to have the Christian message turned into one of hate by so many. I find it sacrilegious and sometimes it is really hard to be around people who twist a story of sacrifice, humility, love and acceptance into self-congratulating superiority. But, I agree there are many good people out there. The intensity and volume of the hate is just a lot, A LOT. It obscures the Christian message for many, many people and turns them off.
@@hectorbelarmino6457 What is step two?
Yes, as an American, I support and defend the U.S. Constitution, which allows people to worship their God in their way. As to myself, I don't abide by the hypocrisy either.
As a practicing follower of Jesus (albeit a progressive one), I find this conversation so important... absolutely essential. We have an organized and dangerous threat to our democracy in our country and it is grounded in some factions of Christianity. Christians need to keep speaking up, as the way their faith is being corrupted by Christian Nationalism is profound and frighteningly well- organized. You touched on the "academic"/theological justifications for violence that are a part of this. I would add the plans to "re-educate" our children via a Christian Nationalism based educational curriculum. That's an important one to pay attention to as it is happening in grassroots ways and in ways that are more subtle...polite. There's a lot to keep talking about here! Keep bringing it to a wider audience!
Sorry, but who is humiliating Christians and who is persecuting Christians? Seems to me the humiliation us self- inflicted and the persecution is imaginary.
As a Christian I agree with you. Western Christians have no idea what real persecution looks like.
In this country it is imaginary. That isn't true in other parts of the world. These evangelicals admire Russia so much, but unless they pledge their allegiance to Putin, they would be banned and their worship together worthy of imprisonment. But they see themselves as leopards, not ones who get their faces eaten by the leopards they support.
I say the same. I live in the Bible belt and see none of this happening. The Christian Right has been using this line of bullshite for decades starting with Jerry Farewell.
As a Catholic I feel that this is right on the money
It is about perspective. Although it doesn’t make a lot of sense, people are threatened by what’s different and what they don’t understand. They fear it will take away the foundation of how they see things and are terrified of the potential loss of direction, world understanding, and purpose that drives their lives. (I’m surrounded by MAGA, so I see the fear and freaking out that drives the attacking.) NOT excusing it. I’m freaking exhausted by it, but I see it.
Ms. Neumann, thank you for your true Christian understanding and for leading people in the direction in which people of faith should go. You are a beacon of hope for many.
'Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows Me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life” (John 8:12). I hope you are not trying to turn Elizabeth Neuman into an idol for people to follow.
@@jonathandnicholson God tells us not to worship idols.
@@amandaemerson753 Correct, so do not proclaim Elizabeth Neumann as a 'beacon' when 'Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows Me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life” (John 8:12). Also, 'Jesus said to him, “I AM the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me"' (John 14:6). Jesus was not referring to Neumann. I think Neumann also mischaracterises Christianity because the passage about turning the other cheek (I believe) is about God not sorting out every problem. I do not know how people have come to understand Jesus Christ as a pacifist especially as Jesus intensified rather than abolished the moral order.
@@jonathandnicholson I said exactly what I meant. The words, hope and light are not interchangeable in the statement I made. I will not respond to you again. I will pray for you.
@@amandaemerson753 Well, maybe I misinterpreted the word 'many,' but in religious terms peace means to be reconciled with God.
It does the heart good to hear a person of such character who values the democracy and is deeply thoughtful about their faith
Missus here: Thank God for the sanity of Elizabeth Neumann!
Really appreciate hearing such clear and balanced discussions
Thank you, Elizabeth and thank you, Tim! We appreciate your service!!
Ms Elizabeth you're right on point!!! I would sit and listen to her all day, we have to keep our guards up.
"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them." - Matthew 7:15-20
That’s as true as it gets
Awesome. I am heartened by your comment. My ❤ is bursting with my love for my Jesus 🙏
Roses come from thorned bushes. Are roses 'bad fruit'? Vaccines save lives. Dors the fact that they are produced from the very thing that would kill make them 'bad fruit'?
You Google searched that which is kind of cute in a way
@@marceechristensen2533Wow, you get mad when people don't pretend your brand of faith.
SUCH an important conversation. Thank you for having and sharing it 🙏
Isn’t it a bit of a self-own when these people admit they only clued in to how sick and twisted MAGA world is in 2020? The subtext to this whole interview is, “I’m kind of a foolish dupe who can’t see where the wind blows.”
Your need to treat a sincere self-assessment as a kind of game is highly suspect.
My long reply is basically about ignoring all the warning signs of a growing problem.
IDK how she got sucked in, and it's frustrating that it took her so long to get out, but at least she did and is doing something about it. I just wish there were more that could figure their way out.
I wouldn't call her a dupe. She WAS duped but at least she figured it out and is doing something about it.
@@starpentavery well said. We need to encourage and welcome every person that fights their way out of this madness. You need to understand just how hard it is to turn your back on your "family" of political crazies and return to normalcy. I can't praise them enough; I'm just in awe at their courage.
Excellent interview. Thank you Tim and Elizabeth. I’m in awe of Elizabeth’s bravery.
Since Eisenhower's embrace, we have seen the encroachment of politics in religious lectures and consequential actions. All without the removal of non-profit status. Now THAT is unforgivable.
Thank you, Elizabeth Neuman! As a Christian, I am appalled by the Christian Nationalists! Their God is so small. Of course, Jesus didn't have to be crucified, and he didn't need an AR-15 or even an M16. If God created the Universe, He is perfectly capable of saving Jesus w/o a gun. And we don't need guns, either. We need to focus on loving God and our neighbors. Even as a lifelong Democrat I'm a better conservative than trump.
i was born on easter sunday and once when i was about 20 i saw a bumper sticker that said, jesus christ is coming back and boy is she pissed and i humbly thought that’s me,lol
Their god is don the con
As a Brit, a Liberal and an antitheist, I am currently watching what's going on in the States with a mixture of disbelief and deep alarm. But this was a brief ray of sunshine breaking through the gathering storm clouds - there may be hope after all. Thank you.
She voted for trump. trump wanted a favor in exchange for weapons for Ukraine, blue and yellow flag. You remember? She wanted to save unwanted children, now thousands of ukrainian children are dead. Worth it?
I am agnostic but I grew up going to Grace Church in Brooklyn Heights, NY.
My late father was a Quaker and my mom an Episcopalian.
Our church was all about inclusion and helping the poor. No one and I mean no one was out there trying to convert people. Believe it or not, there were Jews and Muslims who came just because the message was simple. Love thy neighbor and do not judge others.
One of our rectors was a gay married man who to oversaw my parents renewing their vows after 50 years.
They, I believe that homosexuality is not a sin, that a woman has the right to chose, etc.
The rector now is black. He preaches about acceptance and love and inclusion and community, etc.
Go back to that Church. For God sake it speaks of everything Jesus was sent her to tell what God wanted his people to hear. I think you are one of the chosen who would hear and believe. Once I gave my life to Jesus and accepted him as my Lord the scales fell off my eyes and I saw things so clearly. I could read the Bible and understand it. I felt the Holy Spirit come into my life and direct me as an intercededant to Jesus
I am not blowing smoke up your ass. This is my true experience.
That's the kind of church we all need. People choose to hate
my mantras for myself are, judge not lest you be judged and if you show no mercy , none shall be shown you, those 2 keep me humble and on track
@@marceechristensen2533i never believed in God, but i found him in a recovery house and he looks just like the God in the bible with the flowing robes and long beard and hair he pats me on the head and says you’ve been bad but you’re doing much better now
@@michaelmeroyers5487 I don't know what this reply was about. But it doesn't matter , Jesus mean't for you to give it to me. I just finished a 1st time DUI offender 48 hour lockdown.
Got there after a year and a half. I have been in outpatient and inpatient treatment 5 times. Why doesn't God heal me ?!?!?
I believe even I don't think I am worthy. God is real he sent Jesus to us so we may be free. He gave us a choice to be free.....
I want to be free but the demons who know I am vulnerable still haunt me
Thank you Tim and Elisabeth. This has been a great conversation.
I don't follow any religion. This woman sounds inherently good.☺🇬🇧
Good and intelligent. That's the thing--I often ask, what makes a person good? It's not religion, it's not political affiliation, it's something else.
Her hands are bloody. Ukraine ask for weapons. Thousands died because trump wanted a fAvOr...
Really a great conversation. She has deep insight as an insider. Too bad the people who need to listen to her probably won’t listen to her
She’s a neocon and is part of the problem. The disaster that is US Middle Eastern policy rests with her ilk.
Amen. Brilliant video. Truth and facts!!!!❤❤❤❤ God bless you Elizabeth Newman, Tim and all of you at the Bulwark!
Thanks Tim For Having A True Believer On The Show It's Refreshing!❤
why? the bible say`s just as many crazy things as maga and trump.
I love this interview! It’s so refreshing to hear what was happening from someone who was there and saw the threat! Good for her for getting out!
Thank you Elizabeth
Elizabeth Neumann is a national security treasure! Thank you for heeding to the need for YOUR help and expertise regarding that call that day! Thank you Elizabeth Neumann for YOUR service. God Bless You and Yours! 💙❤️💙🇺🇸💙❤️💙🇺🇸💙❤️💙🇺🇸💙❤️
Elizabeth rocks!
If you have to beat someone into agreeing with you, you are probably wrong
I don't want to one more thing about "faith." Esp. since I finally had to end my contact with my brother who married a "Christian" and proceeded to become a liar and fake and cut us out of the family. We moved away but I kept the peace...but after he went beserk on me recently...he finally revealed that he's in the cult ...I finally hung up after 44 years of gaslighting.
He doesn’t deserve you
i dumped my sister years ago and i’ve never regretted it. every time i was down she’d kick me lower…
Thank you Tim Miller and your guest Elizabeth Neumann. Great topic and really important info.
"He was elected by the people." No, in fact he was put in office by the Electoral College, but NOT by the majority of the electorate. This is an important point.
How good to listen to a person who delves deep into her faith and uses it to promote peace!
This was wonderful. Thank you all!
Elizabeth is a TRUE patriot!
That ad NEEDS TO BE PLAYED TODAY UNTIL THE END OF THE ELECTION
why?
she's just another kind of strange beliefs.
Tim and Elizabeth, thank you so much for this interview. And Elizabeth, bless you for your work, your bravery, and your smartness.
Thank you, Tim, for bringing a host of right-leaning Christian evangelicals and political conservatives into my awareness that I can imagine meeting and having a serious, respectful conversation with. There is sanity and extremism on both sides, and I believe Joe Biden is in exactly the right place at the right time to navigate these treacherous waters.
The "left" you're talking about is fringe, whereas on the right it's mainstream. In numbers, there's no comparison.
When you are way out on a wing tip yourself, you have no idea what is right, left, or mainstream. Out on the wing, you think you're mainstream, but the reality is, you're out on the wing!
correct! it drives me crazy that these two things are still held up as opposite equals. they are not comparable at all. at all!
‘Vast’ river of hypocrisy
the right sucks
“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” He said to him:””You must love your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind”. This is the greatest and first commandment. The second, like it, is this: “You must love your neighbor as yourself “. On these two commandments the whole Law hangs, and the Prophets”. Matthew 22:37-40. Anyone not following the admonition is not a Christian (A follower of Jesus Christ) PERIOD
Yes. And too there's a passage, I believe, that says not only must we love our enemies as well, but also do good to them....
@@Tracy-mq3tz absolutely agree and well said, also the real christians i’ve met teach with love, patience and tolerance for others, not hateful judgments and controlling and punishing
It’s not about honoring America as great, or any nation, but glorifying our great God.
Trump stepped right into the "Boss" place that evangelicals have been taught all their lives to revere and never, ever question. He uses the Constitution just like they do the Bible, a symbol of Ultimate Authority "written down" they can't read, and rely on the pastor to tell them its meaning.
He is constantly referring to the Constitution for his defense. This concerns me because I have heard that he wants to re-write the constitution. So it's good enough for him now but needs to be changed when he's in power? 😢
@nanad4755 Trump’s use of the constitution is entirely self-serving. He cherry-picks and misrepresents whatever little piece of the constitution is convenient to his goals at the moment. He disregards whatever parts aren’t, and he has no qualms at all about completely changing his reading of the constitution in the next moment to suit his changing needs.
@nanad4755 Four legs good, two legs better.
Thanks for this great interview. I need to watch a video with more than Trump's Trials. I'm sick of hearing about Trump. I thank you for your great new ideas. Great interview.
Stormy Daniels testimony was an X rated Movie Script. yet her black mail and extortion are swept under the rug
Yeah sure .
Thank you so much, Tim. This was just what I needed to hear today!❤❤❤
So nice to hear intelligent conversation.
I love conversations about these topics without fighting. Just help me understand. Thank you. ❤
Thank you Elizabeth for your integrity and honesty, ethics, etc. we appreciate you.
Thank you both for your insight.
Steve, thank you for doing what you do. 70 year old American here. Please never stop. America needs you more now than ever.
Who’s Steve?
Loved hearing from Elizabeth!
Wonderful guest! Thank you Elizabeth!
Living in Portland, Oregon during that period was horrifying. The national news reporting was sorely lacking. With Idaho on our border & 15 Oregon counties wanting to secede & join Idaho, the Trumpster threat is still very real today. As a nation we have a lot of work to do. I'm glad you're here. Blessings.
I agree with you guys wholeheartedly. I’m a Christian, but I can’t even speak to my Christian friends, because they believe lies and conspiracy theories. I know they would dump me if I spoke up. I have to tell my Democrat friends I’m not like other Christians, that I believe in love, acceptance, and mercy.
Excellent podcast. Thank you, Tim and Elizabeth.
Fabulous lady. Let's hope she can get through to those worshipping Trump.
thank you Elizabeth for serving, for writing the book and doing the video. I hope your words get into the right ears
As an atheist, what is happening in this country is appalling. The US was designed to be a secular nation. Very little of the Constitution was based on Christianity or any other religion. Much was based on the politics of the Iroquois Nation and other such agreements. Even the Founders said it was a secular nation. Religion has always been in our government. Originally, atheist were not allowed to run for office. Now they can run for office, but, if their lack of faith is known, they most likely will not win. Maybe with the current marriage of religion and government and the lose of women's right to abortion, people will see that religion is not all its cracked up to be.
Fascinating, important details, scarry reality. Thank you Elizabeth.
I’m sorry - there was NEVER any question about Trump’s lack of character. His campaign should have ended when he made fun of the disabled reporter. Hillary was right about everything.
i know that was despicable to me too
I could've listened to these 2 for another few hours! They were so interesting and smart and honest and mellow! Loved it!
Thanks so much for this podcast. Now is a great time to note what an incredible amount of respect I have for Ms. Neumann and the folks on the inside of the past administration for speaking out. I want to suggest a follow up on this subject as it relates to the Obama administration’s failure (or perhaps their conscious choice) to ignore the rise of right wing extremism in the first decade of this century. Was it fear of him being a Black man looking at a rise in White Christian Nationalist extremism as a direct result of the ascendancy of a Black man to the presidency? The rise of White Christian nationalism was identified and chronicled during his presidency but generally ignored. His own intelligence folks testified to the issue repeatedly to congress during this period but it appeared at the time and in retrospect that it was generally ignored. Thanks
Great information. Very Good work Elizabeth and Tim.
Completely ignoring that this nationalism has many of it roots in its violent opposition to abortion. Christian martyrism at it's best.
Terrific, enlightening, and hope inducing. Thanks Tim and Elizabeth for restoring my faith (and, I'm an atheist 😂) in Christians.
Lack of respect? What the hell did Reagan mean by “welfare queen”, what was with his campaign opening in Philadelphia, MS?
I imagine it is the number of single women on Welfare. I've tried welfare twice in the past. It's better to have a low paying job that treats people like crap.
Thank you Ms. Neumann! As a lifelong Christian and 50 plus year registered Republican, I have wondered what happened to the Republican Party. It is very heartbreaking to see what worship of a man can do. I pray eyes will be opened. I am also in real fear for my country.
Wow! She’s tremendous! 🙏🏻🇺🇸⚖️💙
Wish I could give multiple thumbs up. Thank you for your integrity!!!!!! I pray with all my heart your message reaches the heart of many who need it.
I appreciate Elizabeth coming forward and her ethics. I still have to ask who was responsible for the lack of security on J6. No one has said "the buck stops here." To say "we didn't foresee" the lack of security is beside the point, It was someone's JOB, not to foresee, but to know all the protocols for ramping up security and to communicate the threats appropriately, but it seems no one really did their job. Y'all were asleep at the wheel.
trmp wasn't worried about domestic terrorists... they are his voters and donors.
Trump removed the people who could have done that after the election and put his hand picked syncophants into every position that could have made a difference. Those people had the ones who knew what to look for and what to do walking a tightrope in fear for themselves. That's if those people weren't totally pushed out of the administration like Elizabeth was the prior year.
I watched it all play out on Parlor. I sounded like the girl with the tinfoil hat. But I KNEW things were going to get violent. Why didn’t they?
A lot of people knew something was going to happen, but the one person who knew and ordered it, trump, wanted it to happen. The President at the time is the only person that could give the order for more police or National Guard, no one else would be listened to, they listen only to the President in office, and we all know that was trump.
God bless you Elizabeth. Thank you for speaking out and for your patriotism. Keep speaking the truth. It matters now more than ever as we head towards November.
"The mafia culture" was nothing new about Trump! I felt it oozing off the page of a Playboy Interview. I could almost smell it! Why did, and do, so many miss that! I can't fathom the blindness!
@@ssshar2176, you mean South Jersey was close enough to pick up the scent?
This is a great presentation. We need much more of this!
I wasn't familiar with Ms Neumann, but her description of her faith is refreshing to hear. It's hard to keep evangelical Christian friends with an 'us against them' view of the world.
Excellent information. Bravo for honesty 👏👏👏👏😇
Tim, you were a great addition to the Bulwark network. I much enjoy your shows. This was a great guest who did far better on the topic than most. I think made a number of errors, such as a blending of morality and legality, rather than keeping them distinct topics. A number of such things. But overall, excellent. Too many make too many errors, so this was refreshing.
If you want to know what Jesus thought about the blending of morality and legality, read John 8 - not just the first eleven verses, but the whole chapter. It isn't long. Even someone with a sixth-grade education should be able to get through it quickly.
@racookster It isn't relevant. Our form of government was built upon certain philosophic ideas. Freedom is built upon the concept of individual rights. In a free society, things are based upon the protection of individual rights, not the enforcement of anyone's views on morality. Be those views whatever religion or non-religion. To remain a free society, we've got to resist some violating the individual rights of others, for enforcement of their religious views, through force of government.
I don't mean that the topic you've mentioned isn't important. It is good to know. My starting point is distinguishing religious discussion from political discussion. Once in agreement that we should remain a free society, and that government should be about protection of individual rights, not enforcement of religious views, then lots of topics are good for discussion, in the proper context. It's definitely worth looking at what Jesus had to say on the topic, for awareness and understanding of that perspective. But theocrats are going to want their religious views to dictate the nation's laws, regardless. And so the starting point has to be the Enlightenment rooted philosophical ideas that led to freedom. Separation of church and state being at the core of it.
I think it worthwhile to learn a little about Roger Williams. That wall of separation thing started with him, in the early 1600's. The concept resulted in him having to flee Massachusetts, to remain among the living, and then he founding Rhode Island, with its hedge of separation. Massachusetts then invading Rhode Island in objection to that separation. @racookster It isn't relevant. Our form of government was built upon certain philosophic ideas. Freedom is built upon the concept of individual rights. In a free society, things are based upon the protection of individual rights, not the enforcement of anyone's views on morality. Be those views whatever religion or non-religion. To remain a free society, we've got to resist some violating the individual rights of others, for enforcement of their religious views, through force of government.
I don't mean that the topic you've mentioned isn't important. It is good to know. My starting point is distinguishing religious discussion from political discussion. Once in agreement that we should remain a free society, and that government should be about protection of individual rights, not enforcement of religious views, then lots of topics are good for discussion, in the proper context. It's definitely worth looking at what Jesus had to say on the topic, for awareness and understanding of that perspective. But theocrats are going to want their religious views to dictate the nation's laws, regardless. And so the starting point has to be the Enlightenment rooted philosophical ideas that led to freedom. Separation of church and state being at the core of it.
I think it worthwhile to learn a little about Roger Williams. That wall of separation thing started with him, in the early 1600's. The concept resulted in him having to flee Massachusetts, to remain among the living, and then he founding Rhode Island, with its hedge of separation. Massachusetts then invading Rhode Island with military force, in objection to that separation. Williams having to get on a ship to England, to petition parliament for their approval for having this separation between church and state, and his writing extensively while in England, and those writings having influence on a young English Philosopher, named John Locke. Whose two treatises on government had enormous influence on the government we eventually formed. Jefferson used the phrase wall of separation because he was writing to Baptists. And Roger Williams has strong connection to the forming of the Baptist religion.
@@racookster I do thank you. And I did take note of it. I'll have to look at it when I'm able to. My appreciation may not have come through.
Thank you Elizabeth for taking that job. I was sure that nobody working around him knew what they were doing. I prayed every day that strong, smart people were directing him and then it became clear that no! Anyone who knew what they were doing was sent packing. This is why he had the revolving door. Thank you for your service to the country, you tried.
With theocrats, regardless of the religious tradition they base it in, read into whatever religious text whatever supports their authoritarianism yearnings. Arguing it on a religious basis won't do anything at all. Should our laws be based in protection of individual rights? Or should it be based on enforcement of religious views. At that point religion, and religious texts, become irrelevant. Authoritarians have their starting point at the end, and then work backward from there, relying heavily on rationalizations.
It simply isn't a religious discussion. It's a political discussion. In their Authoritarian quests, they'll always claim that God is on their side.
Why doesnt the Mainstream Media talk about this? The American people need and deserve to know all of this!
Trump and team cannot be allowed near classified information again. This is more important than owning the libs and party loyalty.
NEVER
Tim, thanks for what you do.