This isn’t a new baseline. It isn’t a new standard. It’s a return to the old gold standard where devs actually made a game with love. A full and complete game made with the fans and not trying to bleed the pockets of their consumers
We let them lower the standard. Slowly, over time, by getting distracted with new gimmicks. Morality systems allowed them to cut out consequences for decisions and replace them with red "bad boy" points or blue "good boy" points. Voice lines became an excuse to include less dialogue and options (I think everyone remembers "dialogue wheels". Making prettier games let them get away with having less intractability. Fear of Missing out became a reason to make it so that players *couldn't* fail. That you couldn't get locked out of content no matter what you did. (making for nonsensical situations- like becoming archmage without knowing more than 1 spell.) Older and more clever games would use these failure states to make new stories- instead, we get even more consequence stripped from our games. And the whole way, they hold our hands and treat us like we can't figure shit out. (skyrim was the *worst* in this regards. Why even have those "puzzle" doors when the answer is always placed right next to the puzzle.)
well said and too true grew up with neverwinter nights and its good to see that the newer generation will have access to at least one bomb ass game that did everything in its power to make that game stand not only the test of time as a game but also as a memory
To be fair larian studio's previous game, divinity original sin 2, had the same amount of love and care put into it. Im glad they are getting recognition now thanks to Baldurs gate 😊
100% agreed. BG3 first game in a while I love. I tried playing Diablo 4 again and did a nightmare dungeon after the recent update and literally quit halfway through
I say we should answer with mass boycotts for ALL theyr new games if they are not up to the new standard. Till thry go bankrupt if necessary. Send the message loud and clear. We shall not be robbed anymore by theese loot boxes spinning CRIMINALS masked as game devs
In my eyes, it's less "raising standards to new heights" and more like "restoring standards to what they once were". Because if you'll recall, games used to be feature-complete on release.
this is sooo true too, games were always complete. DLC’s still existed but even then, they weren’t as prominent as they are now and when there were DLC’s, they were amazing. for example, elder scrolls oblivion’s “shivering isles” DLC was like a whole other game in itself.
@@sarahandersen5091exactly where my mind went when you mentioned dlc. It was like mappacks and game expansions. Shimmering isles was amazing and the hideouts. Oblivion was amazing!
But it's new for the diversity hires, hired in the last 5 years, for their woke politics and to fulfill quotas, than for being good at what they do, and loving what they do.
It’s funny how little the devs are willing to increase standards… which mind you this “increase” is simply restoring the previous standard that was set 15-20ish years ago.
To be fair, the amount of work and expectations of gamers have risen so high that anything new being released is going to be crap anyway, just because it doesn't reach some uber levels of expectations.
Absolutely. It would be hilarious if it weren't so sad. Wish I could share my memories and feelings of how purchasing and playing games was back then with younger people, maybe then they would fully realize the level of bull goin on in today's market and why exactly we are so mad about it all. So many changes to the status quo of gaming design spoon fed down the throat over the years to them because they more readily accept them due to simply not having experienced any better. It's sickening that they are actively trying to push certain practices as the new "normal" for future generations and of course, if they have no perspective one tends to accept what they are given as long as they get their dose of dopamine. Young children especially, have very little control of their lives, so many seek what little kernels of personal accomplishment they can (things that make them more of an "individual", that makes them feel "successful", not unlike the satisfaction of an adult in being good at their job or when you realize something important about yourself) in school, clubs and games, and these people know and exploit that. As a game designer myself, I hate to the depths of my core seeing the purpose of my profession being distorted and weaponized like that.
Ill never forget when i bought the witcher 3 and the game came with a thank you note and a map like when i was a little kid. blew my mind how great the game was and how much effort was put in.
witcher 3 is an amazing case of we love this story lets make it great, although it did take 3 games to get to the point of witcher glory, but you never got hit with micros and DLC was cheap and very expansive
@@starlyghtdrifter66 there's a reason witcher 3 is the most awarded game in history and witcher 1 and 2 are not even close but hey I'm biased I've only ever played 3 because of word of mouth. This is what is happening with bg3 nobody's saying bg1 and 2 are bad but there just not on the same level.
The moment I played Baldurs Gate 3, it gave me the same feeling when I first played Witcher 3. Every decision has a consequence. In Baldurs Gate 3, I tried role-playing as "The Invoker" (yes, the same elf dude from Dota 2) a wizard/manipulative villain and it is possible. I also discovered that I can even play a much more darker one using Dark Urge.
"i don't know anything about how to build a car but if I buy one and it comes with 3 wheels and a DLC for the fourth; i'm going to be pissed." one of the best quotes ive heard in a while when it comes to the state of video games.
@@TWEAKLET NO, stop, just think it through. OP says the 4th wheel that you have to have in order for the car to work, is being stripped off the car and sold back to you as a fucking extra. See? most cars, actually no cars have base packages that remove basic hardware. In this instance we are comparing games that strip out necessary features and or complete proper endings to the main story.
Most gamers of today weren't around during the golden era of games back when DLC and micro transactions didn't exist. Games were developed and released with ALL content right out of the box, and if it sold well...we'd get an expansion or a sequel. Expansions were that DLC, but there was enough content that it was essentially a whole other game. It was a continuation of the first game, but wasn't something you could just conquer in 20hrs or a single weekend of playing. It was the same thing with sequels. You were looking at 50 hours or more to finish them...and they were actually FUN and didn't feel like a slog to progress through, nor did it feel like having a 2nd job like so many of these live service games. The reason all these AAA developers are whining and crying about how it's "unrealistic" to have that expectation of a game of that size and scope and quality from now on is because they were so brutally made to realize that people will flock to those kind of games more than their own. ESPECIALLY when that game is released in it's entirety with NO DLC, NO micro transactions, and NO mandatory permanent internet connectivity. They're salty because it reminds the older gamers of that golden era when games like that weren't the exception or the anomaly, but the RULE. Let me put it another way. The attitude of these other developers is IDENTICAL to Mr. O'Hare from the Dr. Seuss movie "The Lorax" He's the guy who's become rich charging everyone for clean air after all the trees were chopped down to create Thneeds, and he does EVERYTHING in his power to try to make sure that no trees are ever planted again to keep the status quo. Larion in this example is LITERALLY that breath of fresh air that the rest of the industry doesn't like because it means that everyone else now has to work that much harder to try to meet or exceed that level of quality, which also means spending more money, and therefore making less profit. It's all about the money for the shareholders and the bean counters. THAT is the reason we have shitty to mid tier quality unfinished, unpolished, bug ridden games and are being gouged on DLC and micro transactions to squeeze us for as much as humanly possible.
You’re missing a huge aspect and that is that the game is also an easy 9/10 game made at a triple A level. There are tons of complete games that are just average games or worse or perfectly great indie games but the level of work that went into this game is insane.
I worked as a game translation tester for a AAA game studio and I swear to you, I met over 10 translators/testers in the company and I was the only gamer. Quite a few of them openly said they didn't "get" the fun in video games.
Dude, there is nothing new about that concept. Back in ye olden times, people were even killed for being too good, only to later be called martyrs. Work in a Union and find out how quickly you get shit on for going above and beyond too.
@@Lilmikey-dh8cd when the devs are shitting their pants about bg3 becoming a new standard saying the game is horrible is blatant coping, you're just hella mad your favorite game series is doing dogshit stats compared to one you've never heard of
It's crazy how triggered other companies got by a dev studio simply delivering on what they promised to deliver without nickel-and-diming the consumer for all they're worth
You just don't know game development , no one is only worth 80 dollars charged for the average game and developers were mad because they didn't get 7 years to develop their games only one year .
Sierra Online had a habit of releasing unplayable junk that was fundamentally broken before that became possible, when things were still delivered on floppy disk and CD-ROM. And then never releasing updates because there was no way to get them to customers. They didn't last long when they started doing that, people at the time (mid 1990s...) didn't put up with it and stopped buying their junk. These days people DO put up with it and keep buying from the same junk companies over and over again because they have forgotten that quality at some point mattered.
@@vukkulvar9769, I'm assuming you have no experience with programming, because there's absolutely no way to make a huge, complicated game and not have bugs. Even BG3 erased my wizard's entire spell book because of a bug when you learn too many spells. I remember back on PS2 with Soul Reaver 2, there was a bug that made the game unbeatable about 80% into the game if you disturbed some birds on a walkway leading up to a castle. That game was made with a lot of love and care, but bugs will always slip through, and some can completely fuck up the game.
@@DemothHymside Well, guess you're bad at assuming. I never said it would prevent games from having bugs. But it certainly would have companies check more thoroughly for bugs before launch.
their is no competition, no matter how good bg3 does .... a mobile game like clash of clans... still makes more money... and that is all they care about .... its an investment.... their game is money.... oyu dont need to put that much effort in to make fast buck.... for your shareholders...
This has shot up to one of my all time favorite games ever. Larian is gold, simply for making a game with passion and not trying to rip us off, brilliant.
If you haven't played any of their other games... I highly recommend divinity 1 and 2 as well. It will feel like a bit of a step back after playing bg3 but they were so fuckin good
@Blackviper6 divinity os2 is really quite good too. Divinity 1 is I think when it truly becomes a step back. Divinity os2 focus a lot more on the hazard alchemy system which is super cool
DOS 1 had great atmosphere and a cohesive narrative. It does not stretch things for too long and even the filler content has some meaning to the overarching plot
dos2 is really cool, for my entire first playthrough I didn't know you could craft unique spells you wouldn't ever get otherwise or put nails on boots to make you immune to falling on ice
AAA devs are just confirming what we’ve already long said was already happening. They’ve gotten lazier and greedier. And they can’t stand that other developers outside their circle aren’t lowering themselves to their standard of mediocrity. Of course the studio executives who don’t know sh!t about video games are also very much partly to blame for the problem.
They're lazier, but they're not the greedy ones. It's the higher ups that bag most of the money, leaving little for the devs. The devs thus put in the least effort they can in a game they're not interested in making because they're underpaid.
Gamers' fault that we're in this position. Asmon said it well: "every gaming boycott is one 3 min cinematic from being over. " If we don't vote with our wallets, no one will take us seriously.
I mean the reality is I do vote with my wallet. It's not even because I want to. It's because the state of the industry as a general rule genuinely sucks. I understand why the people who buy every call of duty or fifa does every year. They want X genre and nothing quite fills their niche. It's rare for a brand takeover to happen like Sim City to City Skylines. It requires not only nailing the execution but also requires the opposition to basically flop as well. For me I want progression, choice, and sandbox in my games. That gives me a lot of genres to pick from and if any one genre flops, I can pull up the indie games from many other genres. It comes down to the scope of choices.
Exactly! Thank you for your comment! As long as people keep throwing money at shitty games thats all we are going to get. Just let all our great streamers rummage through the products first like our boy here and THEN proceed to buy. I bought only proven games roughly a year after they came out and was always happy to be a client to that studio. Blizzard or ea haven't seen a penny from me in a decade now hahaha.
The industry itself seems to really be the problem. There's too many executives from other industries running things and putting profit first, too many inept upper managers wanting to put deadlines over quality, too many industry people pushing looking pretty over gameplay, writing and depth, and too many (as you say) shit-eaters willing to accept mediocrity.
Baldurs Gate 3 cured the burnout I got with gaming nowadays. Releases dient excite me anymore but this game really felt good to play and it rejuvenated my passion.
Same. And then you realize it wasn't really burnout, but depression induced by the downward state of the game releases feeling like half-baked unoptimized products. They felt more like they sold you the future promise of a "feature complete product" with the caveat assumption of you opening your wallet over and over again.
I never played DND, never played Baldur's gate, barely ever played turn based games.... this game was fucking amazing. They put these idiots to shame and I am so excited to see the massive change in the standards. Support great games.
You can try playing baldurs gate enhanced edition 1 & 2 and baldurs gate siege of dragonspear on a smartphone/tablet. Perfect time sink when on the toilet or on a long commute.
Really? So how overblown was the controversial stuff then? You know the gross ogre seggs and the character creator. Like, what if i want to make a barbarian who looks similar to thor in GOW:R?
"AAA gaming is for investors not consumers. Sometimes those goals align. But remember there is a one and there is a two." - Never really thought of Asmongold as a "great" analyst but that's one of the most succinct and accurate quotes I've ever heard regarding modern gaming. Spot on.
i won't be surprised if destin from ign will get blacklisted by certain dev studios on future release projects for preview/review due to his take on this. he's currently getting ripped on by some game devs on twitter for that ign video (apex legends dev didn't seem to like his video and called him out on twitter for example)
If he has any sense he'll double down. IGN could do with more consumer appreciation and this is their way of going about it by having a guy like this do videos like this.
As a software dev, I'd agree with Asmon regarding there being a lot of bad devs/designers in AAA studios. AAA studios attract a lot of people who are primarily interested in job security; once you're established, you don't run the risk of your studio closing down and having to go job hunting again. You can't tell me that the people making a new Madden/FIFA or whatever every year are passionate about their jobs. They're paid to do minor data entry updates, recolor some uniforms and scenery and repackage it for the following year's release. The only reason why you "want" to be a developer working on Madden, FIFA, etc, is because you know that year after year you'll have a product and audience that will keep you employed.
It's not only that, I think for many other people they support BG3 because of what it represents, a ray of hope in this dying industry, Asmon here bought the game on this principle not because he was interested, and now even he considers playing it
We should hold Triple A developers (Activision Blizzard, EA Games, Square Enix, etc.) to the standard of Baldur's Gate 3 because that's the bracket they're competing in. I'm not expecting smaller indie games devs like those behind Hollow Knight, Stardew Valley, etc. to compete at that kind of level of complexity and depth.
@@reijishian2593 yes but we dont hold it to that standard. we dont expect that, we praise and celebrate it. butnobody expected the game to be as good as it is.
To be fair, It's got to the point where I'm expecting more/better products from indie game devs than I do the Triple A, because of the fact that Triple A is at this point completely consumed by maximizing profit at the least possible cost, whereas indie devs more times than not still get to take the time and develop passionately. Many of the more recent explosively popular games are indie titles from "unknown" indie studios... Sure, it's unfortunately common that it ends up being one-hit wonders but it's still a very real thing.
Developers have gotten so much pushback from the money people at these companies that of course they don’t think this standard can be met. The evidence that it could be is that it was met by Larian. However, everyone is jaded in game design and they know if they proposed Baldur’s Gate 3 to their shareholders and board that they’d be terminated tomorrow because they wouldn’t make enough money on the game for them.
Just started playing baldurs gate today with a friend and I gotta say the co-op is so unrestrained that you can go off and do separate quests and still jump in to see the cutscenes of the other person if you want to, it’s utterly insane I’ve never seen that before
yes, but it can be messy with quest in multi..and also i like the icon of your team choosing dialogue, even if leader kept the final choice.. but yes you can be a sneaky partner who attack people, robb people, and do dialogue when everyone not looking, iniate a fight without warning, and at the end they need to clean your mess lol
I think the reason why a lot of devs are pushing back against this is because they know they simply can't do what Larian has done. They know that they won't be given the time and resources needed to make their games as good as they possibly can be. They know that they're going to have to add micro transactions, battle passes and the like that so many don't like. They know all of this for the same reason anyone who's been paying attention knows this. The people actually running the show don't give a crap about making the best possible game. They just want to make a game good enough to rake in profits, nothing more.
But also as he said: most people are not great at their job. That's just the reality. Look to the art world - how many book authors are genuinely S-Tier in their genre? How many film directors? Fact is, the majority will always be trash no matter how much resources and time they have. Not everyone can be great....that's what makes someone great.
If the company is an indie studio its understandable but for AAA studios, no, its not, especially if said studio sold themselves to EA or Ubisoft or whatever crap publisher there is. They cant complain that they cant do what larian did because they chose to sell themselves to crap publishers and live under the rule of those crap publishers. If you shit your pants you dont get to complain that your pants are now full of shit. The lack of resources for these AAA companies is their own damn fault and no ammount of whining will change that. They could have chosen differently, they could have chosen to go the larian path but they chose not to, they chose to sell, they chose their own chains, so for them, quit the whining and accept the situation you chose to live in.
Then fine, but don't trash the idea of the game being "lucky" to be feature complete. What happens is these devs now become part of the problem. If these Devs feel that STRONGLY about BG3 from Larian Studio. They should quit their soul crushing programming jobs with these AAA studios, to join Larion, or make their own like at People can fly and dozens of other AA studios. War Horse Studios made their dream game in the RPG Kingdom Come. It's entirely possible, but hard work. Making lame excuses is actually easier then working at raising the standard. The lesson is Don't take a job with a shit studio then throw shade at the other guys at another studio that are doing it better.
Well that and baldurs gate was in early access and developed for YEARS. baldurs gate 3 wasn't like this at all a couple of years ago and most game developers are being rushed by higher ups. Like baldurs gate 3 took six years to make. SIX. GTA 5 took THREE. People within the industry are scared they're going to be held to a standard they simply cannot compete with. This is beyond the pale of rpg development. but too treat "beyond the pale" as the new normal would be silly.
@Broskisnowski they have 450 employees that's 100% not an indie studio. Also blizzard might have a shit ton of employees but it doesn't mean they're all working on *one thing*
I mean this kind of blowout happened when elden ring came out to great success and raised the standard, and it too had so many Devs fuming. It's great to see another game studio defy expectations and making a damn good game.
The thing is it isn't "increasing standards" It's returning the standards to what they used to be many years ago. Back when they actually cared about their product and took pride in their work.
Duud, well said. I mean not all games back in my days were good but atleast complete. Men this game is a shimmering star. No wonder other companies are jealous as hell. Instead of making a game for shareholders they just amde a game for us. Worked
In the words of Asmon himself: Baldur's Gate 3 is a game that makes me WANT to waste my time with it. I'm about halfway through Act 2 and I'm still meeting consequences of my Act 1 actions. It just rewards (or punishes) my decisions, gives the feeling that they really matter. I haven't seen that since the Witcher 3 but BG3 arguably does it even better. And it's not just big decisions. Many small, offhand encounters (1 skillcheck and over) are still coming back to either reward or haunt me. Like most, I used to mock the "17,000 ways to finish the game" and, of course, anyone with high school maths skills will tell you that it's based on combining all variations of all quests which does scale exponentially (AKA goes into multiple digits very fast), but even considering this it's a big number to cite. However, now I'm honestly starting to feel like this number is, if anything, an understatement. Obviously, most players won't bother with all the permutations as it's typically the "good choice", "the evil choice", "the IDGAF choice" or "something weird in between the three". And if you settle for a certain RP-style you will stick to certain choices throughout the game effectively ending with maybe 5-6 significanlty different experiences (which is still a lot for a game that takes 70 hours to breeze through and about 200 for the full exploration). And the companion quests are even a higher tier for me. Contrary to most games, you don't just "tag along" for them. Your words and actions have decisive impact. You choose poorly in a character crucial moment and you're in for a fight to the death. But choose wisely and you may actually pull a 180 on their values and beliefs, which is possible even for the most... zealous ones (not spoiling directly but most of y'all probably get the idea who I'm looking at). If you start this game, you start YOUR story and it will be different to almost every other story other players will experience. The odds someone will make exactly the same decisions in exactly the same moments with exactly the same outcome are... well, if we cite the number again 1:17,000. Which, coincidentally, gives the game streaming longevity for years to come. Not everyone will have time/will to play such a big game again, but with streamers you can see all your "what if"-s answered. As such, I'm not surprised AAA studios feel threatened by Larian now. At this point it's either step up and deliver something of at least comparable (if not better) quality and quite soon at that, or be considered the inferior by comparison forevermore. However, whereas I understand their anxiety, I don't offer my sympathy. All of their choices that changed gaming market from a few rare but precious gems into a pile of medioctre pebbles came from the place of greed and arrogance, not passion and respect. Larian has brought the two latter qualities back to the equation with a huge fanfare at that. It took 20 years the last time for people to forget about those qualities (mainly via being constantly distracted by graphics evolution AAAs had earlier access to due to resources). After BG3 it may take 20 years again until mediocrity becomes acceptable once more. And what makes it worse for AAAs, until they can offer a true Full-Dive experience (a'la Ready: Player One) there's little progress to be made with graphics alone this time around, we're already at the threshold of real-life visuals. So no wonder every AAA dev is wearing brown pants now. Alright, enough of the essay. I could say more but I really want to go back into the game instead!
must say i have to agree with you on everything,and though I don't currently own a PC,let alone know how to use a PC I have made it a goal to own a PC just to play BG3. Furthermore I really hope AAA studios will see BG3 as the new way to make games. I will really not mind waiting 10 years for the new release if the current games can provide thousands of hours of quality gaming,not just a grindfest like Destiny 2.
It really is as many say not a new standard. This is the old standard that we once were used to. Having people who actually care and love their game making a game.
I would have absolutely loved to have heard TotalBiscuit's reaction to this whole Baldur's Gate 3 thing from developers. I am sure it would have also been a great teardown of the industry in its current state.
TotalBiscuit would have SHREDDED the profit driven gaming industry right now. He would have done so in such a great and well thought out way. I miss him, fuck cancer.
Been awhile since I heard him mentioned, I was a bit confused by his constant mention of FOV sliders when I was just a console guy but having moved to PC I am extremely agitated by the lack of HUD centering options for Ultrawide screen users. It should be industry standard at this point, just like how he pushed for FOV customization. I'm sure he would have had a very fun take, thanks for reminding me of him.
AAA used to mean a studio could pour a massive amount of resources and time into a single game to give consumers the full vision and breadth of the director. Now it means "Oh we're a massive company and you should buy our game because we're going to spend a lot of money marketing it, also we have nice graphics"
This is why...why normies ruin everything. Gaming got too big. These companies have dialed it down to minimum effort maximum bonuses. Checklists without any single bit of passion. Shit game every year around the holidays so millions of parents go out and buy their kids the next call of duty.
I have such fond memories of Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance and EverQuest Champions of Norrath. PS2 offline co-op gaming was how I spent many days after school with my friends. Glad to see the title is still going strong and has been developed well.
Need more games like this to reeducate people of how games should be. Released as a complete package, fun to play. People have been trained for a decade that paying 70$ for an incomplete garbage is the norm because "we will keep updating the game because we were utterly incompetent to make 1 single complete, fun to play game for 10+ years.'
Most gamers don't even complete a game let alone play it for 10 years, so I think your standards are alittle off because that's what you do but otherwise i agree. Most people who do play that long are either major fans of the game, or the game is a mmo, rougelike, etc that has the potential to last that long. A story driven game probably won't have that happen with the majority of players, and I think that's completely fine. It's pretty unrealistic for a game to last that long when most games dont, even games from back in the day, but every game should be complete on release for sure. There's just too many kinds of games to say every one should last you 10+ years
@@Kratos-eg7ez I think he meant that they're so incompetent they hadn't made 1 single fun and complete game in the last 10 or more years. Not that they should last 10+ years. Personally, a fun and complete game that doesn't try to milk more money out of you, lasting at least 50 hours, and costing at most 60 euro/dollars, is good enough for me. And if the game doesn't last 50 hours, but is just really good, that works too.
@@SanquinityI've been playing an indie text based online multiplayer game called Akanbar on and off for the last ten years for free and honestly my memories from that game still live on long after I've forgotten what happened in most of the new big console games I've bought in that time period
Feature complete games without onerous DLC sell well, what a novel idea. No one could see the success of Tears of the Kingdom, Elden Ring, Hogwarts Legacy or Baldur's Gate 3 coming. I'm completely blindsided by this!
Elden Ring has DLC coming and Elden Ring, Hogwarts Legacy, and Baldur's Gate 3 have and will need post-launch patches for some issues. None of this is bad tbh, I feel like people really don't understand gaming or the industry these days. People act like gaming has fallen so far, yet we can name 4-5 games off the top of our heads that were knock out of the park homeruns in the last couple years and I can personally say that gaming has only gotten better for me as a general thing. Don't like microtransactions? Stay away from games that do them, don't like DLC's? Don't buy them, personally, as long as a game is fun and I enjoy it, they can do whatever the hell they want, I'm in control of my money.
Gonna be honest, the only games i've played in the last couple years is cross out and diablo four. Cross out isn't the game it was designed to be anymore so I stopped playing
@@michaelm6179 Not all DLC is equal imo. Elden Ring is a complete game on it's own, so having DLC come out that actually expands on the game further isn't a bad thing. Meanwhile, DLC in games like Sims 4 or Destiny 2 feels completely predatory. You're right that we've had some great games in recent times. I think the thing that people are upset about is that a considerable amount of development effort, especially in western AAA companies, is going toward products with the sole purpose of milking people for the most money, with the least effort required. Rather than simply focusing on releasing passion driven, quality products that people will love.
@@michaelm6179 The difference is there is no compulsion to buy the DLC. Many games are not complete games without the DLC. So far, I had no bugs with the above games except Hogwarts and those were minimal graphical bugs. All those games were great fun from day one. Also, the only game I have bought DLC for in years is Vampire Survivors. I don't pay to play TFT and my next most played online games BAR(Beyond All Reason) and Halo Infinite which I never spend money in and are free to play.
Yes, it upsets people to see big money spent just to fleece them. People are even madder recently because starting with Elden Ring we have had a lot of bangers from everyone not named Microsoft. Even some of the lower budget Microsoft games are good to great if you look at Hi-Fi Rush, Pentiment, and AoE4.
Go back a year ago, AAA developers were having issues with Elden Ring too. They didn't understand why it was so loved with its lack of UI refinement and quest design. Maybe players don't want their hands held all of the time with obvious markers and breadcrumb for dummies type quests.
@@dgayle2348 Dunno what counts as AA but the Yakuza games and Monster hunter games are always complete on release, MH gives more content after for free unless it's a full expansion
I'm not a CRPG kind of guy but BG3 blew my mind. I can't believe it has engrossed me this much even though I know nothing about DnD. Larion truly is an amazing studio.
This was needing to be said for so long. This is exactly how I feel about the gaming industry. I loved this video so much! I have been playing video games for decades and I have seen the quality of games spiral downward for too long. I plan to get Balders Gate 3 ASAP just because of the fans raving about its quality. The gaming industry really needs to take a good long look at what it has become as a whole and why it is being viewed by fans the way it is. Stop blaming the fans. It's time for the game industry to wake up and smell the coffee. I don't want excuses on why you can't do something or providing info about your designers instead of the game you are working on. I do not care about how so and so got started in the industry or how everyone suffered so much trying to finish a game. I just want information about the game I am waiting on. (I am looking at you Bioware) I am a Nurse. My customers aren't interested in why and how I got started in my profession or how bad my back hurts. They just want quality Nursing care. Quit making excuses for bad decisions and do your job. There I've said my piece. I feel better now. Rant over.
If you fall for this then it's no wonder you fell for 'the big one' three and a half years ago. IGN is and will be the same before and after any "good takes." They know how important it is to '"cool the mark' before the next gaslighting session.
As an artist with a faculty degree and career in 3D I can confirm that the biggest problem is in hiring good people with CV checkmarks that have never played any games, ever. So, you are right on that whole part.
Me and my mates haven’t been this into a game in years. All of us are standing up for crucial rolls and intensely debating strategy in difficult fights. We hit act 3 and all agreed to play it again with different builds and story paths right after we finish.
It's not just that the game is huge and wonderfully done. That's not the "standard". The "standard" is that it was shipped COMPLETE, FUNCTIONAL, and without any paywall/lootbox/gambling shenanigans. All the extra shine is nice, and it took a lot of development time for sure. But the company earned the trust of investors and customers and bought itself that kind of leeway on development because we all expected that the final product would be worth it, and it was.
Exactly. When we shipped games on the PS1 and PS2 days it was *required* that your game pass a “24 hour soak test”: ZERO crashes after running for 24 straight. Today we get HUGE Day 1 patches and customers are nickeled and dimed for content should have been in the original game. * *2003:* _I used to go into a store to find a game,_ * *2023:* _Now I go into a game to find a store._ Greed corrupted AAA games.
@@MichaelPohoreski Day 1 patches are a good thing. Playstation 1 games were infinitely less complex. Stop mixing the good with the bad, it makes you sound like a robot with only 1 horse in the race. 'being negative'
I like how he used the analogy of comparing AAA games as fast food burgers, to other fast food burgers, and BG3 came out as a high class- no carry out- dress code required to enter- restaurant burger but for the same price as "Fast food"..
It's all about the company's direction. Lahrain is an independent with no corporate executive to stear them to only maximize the profit by adding game pass and MTX. You can check the history of used-to-be great developer falling from grace because of their acquisition by a big corporation (Bioware, Blizzard, Bungie, etc.) The best practice is to vote with your wallet. Support the developers doing their work right. 😅
I really want to know how proud the Developers at Larian are feeling because they absolutely deserve all the praise they get. I hope they're raising the middle finger to all AAA companies.
TBH one of the biggest advantages Larian had is that they're their own publisher. I remember a former AAA dev ranting about how publishers literally push their developers to make faster/easier and simpler games with microtransactions instead of making complex games with depth. So a lot of the features gets scrapped even before the development starts because it'd take more time and lose more money. AAA *publishers* are the real assholes not the devs.
@@silentninja9367 BG3 is nothing similar to card games. Any type of knowledge on the game makes that obvious. if you dont like turn based games than thats w/e, but you cant call this a card game and expect people to take your opinion seriously.
I can work with most games not being as big and in-depth as this going forward. But the systems work and are fun, the stories and just about all the characters are interesting, the environments are great, bugs are minimal, exploration and progression are fun (no checklist tasks for the world map, i.e. "6/50 flags found"), no microtransactions or obvious missing features. THAT's the standard that many modern AAA games have fallen behind on.
What makes me really mad is that these people are trying to excuse themselves by claiming they're defending indie teams, but no one is expecting this standard from indies, we expect AAA studios to meet it, and they have no excuse not to except greed.
Video games is art. When AAA studios just photo copy their masterpiece from the old days with using the cheapest paper and cheapest machines we get "modern gaming". Their goal isn't to move their audience rather, to make money with the least amount of effort. It is truly awesome when a true artist like Larian comes along and shakes the world.
It’s a shame that these companies didn’t learn from Elden Ring last year. We don’t want their micro transactions, we just want quality games. Congrats to Larian, and congrats to the gamers that get to enjoy this masterpiece.
Unfortunantly there are games that a single cosmétic gets more money than the Sales of the game itself. There are a lot of simps and P2P that just want that state of “superiority”
BG3 is an example of what talent, 2 decades of experience and enough development time can achieve. Larian is not a small studio, they have 450 people, which is fairly close to a AAA project size. I think there are 3 major contributing factors: - Larian is privately owned, so they are not incentivized to chase quarterly financial goals - They have done exclusively CRPGs for the last 2 decades, so they have the engine and the pipeline to churn out content efficiently. They are a very specialized studio. - They have spent development time to produce a very substantial scope. 6 years of development time is a lot. This is more or less peerless experts at their best working with little time constraints. So, from some perspective - yes, this is not going to be every CRPG from now on. But it is surely a bar to reach now, and something gamers should look forward for.
Frankly the only bar that all games should reach with respect to BG3 is simply having the game be finished and relatively bug free on launch. I'm not paying 70 bucks for what amounts to a glorified beta build.
They also have the advantage of the CEO and majority owner being a passionate gamer and the direct project manager for the game. This means a single direction on the game and that direction being in the hands of someone who just wants to make games he would love to play. And it turns out, so would a lot of other people.
They have not exclusively done CRPGs for the last two decades. They released Divinity: Dragon Commander just 1 decade ago. It's a (decent - but not great) strategy game.
@@jarrodbright5231 Yep, the CEO said in an interview that Microsoft wanted the buy 'em out a few years ago but declined. He said that he knows that their creative freedom wouldn't really be hampered under MS but not in extreme cases like showing nude lol, also he knows that he has a lot of work to do still. GIGA CEO
You are 100% correct. I was born in 81. Thanks to this, I experienced entertainment at the highest level. I listened to music that you wanted to listen to because it was created with passion. I watched movies that had good scripts and brilliant character actors. I played games that contained a story that you wanted to relive over and over again - so you played the game several times. Today... music is often bland, movies are mostly sequels based on the same idea and starring bland actors, and games are devoid of everything... except the option to play online and buy via microtransactions what should be standard... Hope Baldur's Gate 3 broke this trend.
@@Stew91 movies? no. They are absolute trash now across the board with very few exceptions; but music and games, you can still dig and find diamonds in the rough.
@@coldgoldcan2781 Absolute trash across the board have always existed. Also, considering how 2023 has been one of the best years in gaming, your "diamonds in the rough" argument doesn't really hold water.
@@coldgoldcan2781there have been an insane amount of great movies released in the last 15 years. You may need to open your scope. Or try anti depressants
I work for AAA gaming studios - and am really surprised at some responses. Im a dev not an exec - but most devs i know i impressed by it, and obviously always wish to be part of a success such as BG3. They don't speak for all of us.
I think the fact that developers say "We can't do this, don't expect this from us" in a summed up way is telling to the state of the game industry. When you look at a well-made game that is all-in-all complete, it's just... disturbingly sad that the reaction they come up with is "Don't hold us to ths standard" instead of them saying "This game is amazing, and I hope to make something like it one day!" If you can't look at something, even if it is an outlier for whatever reason, that is just incredibly well put together and shows what the entire industry you're working in is capable of on the high end, your reaction shouldn't be that. It should be something to aspire to. Maybe not match in every way, but to make something you could be just as proud of in the end. That's the core of wanting to get better at your craft--this should be an inspiration to them, not perceived as a threat.
And it's creatives saying it, they are just jealous of those who retained their artistic integrity AND get to put "built a masterpiece, all time great game" on their CV. Can't feel great to churn out predatory shell games for megacorps and have it exposed by the likes of FROM and Larian these past two years. Creatives in these twitter threads, basically summarizing the panicked action points from an executive meeting on BG3 gaslighting response strat. Maybe encouraged, maybe to win favour from money execs, who knows. Either way I'd be ashamed of myself.
I wonder why these people took such stance. I mean it's not hurt to just compliment like "nice game, bud". Or better yet, just shut up. Making a fuss like this just shows that they're lazy and kinda jealous.
I understand it though. Imagine the fucking web of storyboarding they had to juggle. Imagine the fucking "ok but if player did X what happens to this storyline?" then XYZ... It's amazing how free BG3 makes me feel. I can't even understand it.... After 3 choice RPGs for so long I can't wrap my mind around this fucking masterpiece. Hollywood writers wouldn't have gotten close. They have Matt Mercer level DMs on board as writers and it's fucking marvellous. Real writers.
I believe every developer should quit their job if they are complaining about consumers holding there games to a higher standard. If you can’t do it then quit and let someone more competent create the games that we want and deserve.
I'm following one indie RPG developer, what he wrote kind of stuck with me; - ;; "Is Baldur’s Gate 3 going to cause gamers to overlook your game?" No. Baldur’s Gate 3 is going to GROW the RPG fanbase. And a grown RPG fanbase means there's an increased chance of more people potentially looking towards my game. Ultimately, I’m happy Larian made Baldur’s Gate 3 so I DON'T HAVE TO. ;; “Isn’t it arrogant to say that?” No. I cannot live forever. Therefore, I cannot learn, make, nor play ALL the games. I don’t have to make an Ultima-type game now because Larian is doing it for me. I get to play a game I dreamed of playing now because Larian made it for me. Also, watching "the games industry" squirm and panic is just too funny to me.
I mean this isn't a "new" standard. It's an old standard that Larian Studios dug up, re-animated with some good cleric magic, and put on the front line in the battle that is AAA gaming. Keep. It. Up.
I haven’t played BG3, but i want to so badly. I’ve seen somebody talk about a review that said something like “killed a woman, robbed her corpse, brought her back to life, gaslit her into believing me to be her savior. 10/10”
Just walked into a barn where a bugbear was doing the dirty to a giant female ogre. As a bard I told him to go on, so I could write a smut book on it and sell copies in Baldurs Gate. 10/10
Here's another thing i've managed to do. Convinced a boss to kill his minions, then to kill his pet, then to kill himself. My fav moment in the game so far.
I love that people are surprised this game is so damn good. Divinity 2 was INCREDIBLE. Im not surprised that when given the budget they were given, that they made a Game of the Generation.
I didn't really know what to expect before playing BG3 and bought it simply because my wife and I were looking for a fun game to play together. I was SHOCKED that the game didn't bombard us with MTX advertisements, battle pass advertisements, in game currency, and links to other sales for other games. It is a game first presentation whereas, sadly, it seems that other major developers have a sales/mtx first approach with the game being a vehicle to "trick" users into wasting their time in game for the longest amount of time. The fact that I even typed that is pretty sad, that's how low the bar is... BG3, Elden Ring, and the God of War PC port have been a ray of sunshine in an abysmal landscape these past few years.
There are 2 types of devs who think like this: 1) the ones who are jealous because they will never create something even close to BG3 2) devs who have the talent but know the executives in charge will never let them make a game like this because the risk of not having microtransactions or let the game be in development until its actually ready to come out.
If Larian really wants to endear themselves to the gaming community, they should release a DM scenario builder or modding toolset a la Neverwinter Nights.
“Stop looking for someone to pat you on the back for not doing it.” That hits the nail on the head I feel like all companies nowadays have just been trying to GUILT YOU into spending YOUR MONEY. Like cool make whatever you want put whatever you want into it Idc but If I don’t spend MY money that’s on me.
The Act Man had an excellent point that caused many triple A game titles like Diablo 4 fall from grace - that sales and marketing make the decisions not the devs. Pretty much players end up playing second fiddle on this whole ordeal. The biggest difference is that Larian Studios made Baldur's Gate with the players first in mind, not any stock holders nor sales/marketing people.
I'm excited to see how many first time CRPG enjoyers go back and buy DOS2 and realize this isn't Larian's first BANGER. They're finally getting the love they deserve!!
Dos2 was a golden boy of Larian for a long time and I spent over 500 hr playing the shit out of it. Soundtrack great storytelling great overall great RPG. Dos2 alone should have been the standard of rpg but still nobody cares now BG2 booming it might set the standard for real this time... I hope...
It is a great game, it is how i knew BG3 would be an even bigger hit. But it isn't on the same level production wise. BG3 has cinematic scenes with all dialogue and events. DOS2 is fully voice acted which is impressive, but its moments are told through a text box. The triple A production budget is why BG3 is so successful.
the reason this is such a big talking point at this stage is because most people have finally had enough of the devs just coming up with excuses and mental gymnastics as to why certain things arent done when said thing usually is dumed down to "theres no money to be made here so we wont do it"
I remember those golden days. It’s hard to counter the rosy tint of nostalgia, but I think it’s fair to say most games are downhill from there. Nice to hear of a game returning to glory. I might actually buy this one!
That's what i've been saying since Elden Ring came out last year. Golden age of gaming is coming back and it pisses off the triple AAA scums, everything is going perfectly.
I work in construction, idk about you but sitting in ac workin on video games all day sounds way harder than working outside in 105 degrees throughout the whole summer
Asmon is so very correct when he says the reason companies keep making sub-par games, is because people keep buying them. When you buy a product, you are not just buying a product, you are also voting with your wallet on what products should be made in the future.
That hamburger metaphor is so shit because if one chain is able to bring a better burger for the same price then the other chains should be thinking of ways to make their burger better instead of saying things like “yeah they put way to much effort in that burger don’t expect anything like that from us”. If they say things like that they deserve to lose their customers…
God im glad im not the only one, me and the homies were in blighted village on top of a house fighting off the goblins, and my buddies whos a sorc was like "i cant be touched im a god up here" my next turn i jumped up beside him and shoved him off was hilarious
I am so irritated with my friends. They like RPGs and a couple of them even play DnD, but for some reason none of them have even bought this glorious game yet
I started gaming in like 2020 the week of cyberpunks launch. I bought Cyberpunk, hogwarts, etc. I bought Baulders gate and felt like id been cheated out of 60$ for a game in the past. I didnt know that video games got that detailed, i genuinely didnt understand the joy of gaming until recently. Its so weird 😂
Enjoy the game friend, we rarely do find games that makes us go “oh, yeah that’s why I love gaming”, for me it’s once every few years lol but it’s great when it happens.
I'm working on my Game Design Bachelor's of Science degree and we have been taught over and over again to go above and beyond to learn, grow and adapt in this industry and try to create what may seem impossible if we are passionate about it. You can see and feel the passion in BG3. Everything said here is true. Keep it coming. The industry needs to hear this and I hope it learns from Larian. FYI - You don't need to be a game designer to know what makes a good game.
No! We need devs gaslighting on behalf of exec's telling us mid, incomplete, storefront/monetization designed scams, churned out on a schedule by the few companies with the resources and ability to take risks, are also "good games" and we should be grateful to be extracted from.
@@cypherpleb It's hilarious isn't it. Devs do actually hate these exec's telling them to release shit early, trust me. Having worked for them does look really good on your CV though.
@@snook.1 Looks good if you want to be hired by a company of the same ilk? All these ESG run companies are now are a name, people want the name that meant quality 20 years ago instead of the one that means something now. Wonder how many of the 400 at Larian came from one of these firms.
I have a ton of respect for game designers because i understand that it is no simple task to make a quality game. I wish you luck in your career, and if you have any control over it please keep microtransactions out of your videogames 😅
Raising the standard is what the car industry has been doing for ages. All these major players in the industry should try to get ahead of the curve instead of whining anout the competition, or sufffer the consequences.
I played BG1 when it was new and it was groundbreaking. I played BG2 when it was new and it was even more groundbreaking. BG3 is the most amazing game I've experienced.
Gamers have settled. They DEMANDED games to be on short rotations. Many titles and producers were quick to agree. Now that people MAY be understanding a good game takes time, they may want to renegotiate. Demand better games. Im stuck in old games. At least they were compleate.
this is all happening at the right time, now that devs want 70$ plus battle pass $ for their games, we better be getting a higher standard of a game for that price.
Back in the day the people who made games were doing it because it was what they loved. Now that gaming is a massive industry, the people who make them aren’t necessarily passionate about it. That’s where shit gets twisted. Unfortunately, we will never be able to go back. All we can do is enjoy the rare games that have a passionate team behind them.
I’ve said this once on another video, but I’ll say it here too. As a solo dev working on his very first commercial game, I can’t begin to express how damn proud I am to see such a work of art be created! I’m sad to hear people express fear of “over delivery”. What the team have done with BG3 is beyond inspiring! My heart goes out to other developers who feel genuine fear because of greatness like this. Not every game has to be a bg3. Create a great player experience and fall in love with your work, be receptive to criticism and feedback and do the best you can! If there are any other devs possibly reading this comment, I wish you all your own success. Don’t be afraid to put something out of great quality just because it isn’t on a BG3 scale!
I love when they say "the dnd rules system is so hard to put into a game" but many many game titles have done it the the AD&D rules system from the 80s through the early 2000s.
If they’re talking about ACTUAL D&D then yes, it *is* really hard, unless you do what Larian did and limit character progression to a 12th level campaign with “homebrew” streamlined systems. Just because it’s difficult doesn’t mean it can’t be done, it just means they’re lazy.
@abbsnncose6305 I don't think our standards have fallen at all tbh. I think people are just ranting and raving over this game because they Larian said they won't do MTX or battle pass lol.
In any other industry, these developers would be fired and blacklisted on the spot. Defending standards of mediocrity and refusing to adapt to competition would be borderline corporate sabotage. "Boss, this other building contractor might be using this new material that is cheaper, more durable, more eco-friendly, easier to work with and everyone loves it but I'm not gonna." Out. Get out. You're done.
The problem is that's the opposite of what he's saying. He's saying "Boss, the other building contractor is using a lot more expensive materials than us, isn't cutting corners to save up money and it's gonna take them twice as long to finish this project, but everybody loves it and says we should be doing that, too."
@@SlCKNESS_ You say this as genshin impact has over 200 million put into its development. Not including the updates its received after coming out. Despite that its still a profitable game. Yes, its a gatcha game which is a money hungry idea developers do, but it should be made clear by now that you CAN go green on your game with absurd about of investment. This also isn't even mentioning that the biggest investors are us the consumers. Larian just made 60 million US dollars off baulders gate assuming they only sold 1 million copies and of course before tax. I don't know the investment put into the game, but they definitely were able to do it because of early access investors like myself. Nearly everyone who did pick up early access knew we could trust this company because of divinity original sin 2. If you make good game, us REAL investor will not only buy the game, but were probably buying the next one too because we trust you. We consumers are paying out much more then companies investors so if they really cared about profit they should start following the actual profit.
@@demon3203 Consumers are not investors. They're the consumers. Genshin Impact being successful means nothing, considering there are countless of games that failed miserably and quite a few companies that went bankrupt, some of which went bankrupt after releasing multiple good games. The actual investors don't care about building up faith with consumers, they only care about return of investment. It's that simple. Also, you might be under the impression that the "boss quote" I gave in a previous comment represents my views. It does not. I'm just saying how the business people think about all of this. Same thing applies to my current comment. I wish investors would understand how the gaming industry can be better, but they don't. They just care about money, here and now.
@@SlCKNESS_ Not at all. Larian is operating on a fraction of the budgets allocated by your Activisions, your EAs, your Ubisofts etc and goes 6+ years in-between single releases. It also took ~50 developers across three countries headquartered in an abandoned building to create Disco Elysium. There is no excuse.
16:00 great point. Speaking as an engineer, if you get pushback from game devs, which is being used interchangeably and ignorantly with all the business roles involved, it's normally because the low quality is "our fault" according to business leaders. It wasn't that the deadlines were too short, we were given no support, we lost talent because more emphasis is placed on micro-transactions than game design... etc. Useless objectives and timeframes are thrown over the wall, because at the end of the day, CEO's and owners aren't willing to make less. The problem is usually not the developers themselves; it's greed.
The car example you gave is spot on. Which is why car companies, like BMW, is taking cues from these big AAA companies by trying to lock certain core car features behind an additional pay wall.
The real issue is a lot of developers and publishers dont think the games industry is going wrong, they dont want to take a good look because a lot of them agree with the current mess. Its all about money, making a good game is low on many companies priorities. They do just the minimum. Thats why when a game developer has passion it tends to make a game that stands out.
Imagine blizzard double the OW2 dev team in 2020 and lie about the PVE. Saying they couldn't make it, but they could develop the BattlePass. Making games is hard, we don't get it.
He's not old enough to know it, but that's exactly what Little Caesar's Pizza did in the 80's with their "Pizza Pizza" campaign. Charging less for two large pizzas than other places did for a medium. It was bloody mayhem out there.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
This isn’t a new baseline. It isn’t a new standard. It’s a return to the old gold standard where devs actually made a game with love. A full and complete game made with the fans and not trying to bleed the pockets of their consumers
Exactly. Either people forgot, have been brainwashed, or just weren't alive when this was the norm.
Problem is that people are buying trash like diablo 4. thats the real problem
We let them lower the standard. Slowly, over time, by getting distracted with new gimmicks.
Morality systems allowed them to cut out consequences for decisions and replace them with red "bad boy" points or blue "good boy" points.
Voice lines became an excuse to include less dialogue and options (I think everyone remembers "dialogue wheels".
Making prettier games let them get away with having less intractability.
Fear of Missing out became a reason to make it so that players *couldn't* fail. That you couldn't get locked out of content no matter what you did. (making for nonsensical situations- like becoming archmage without knowing more than 1 spell.) Older and more clever games would use these failure states to make new stories- instead, we get even more consequence stripped from our games.
And the whole way, they hold our hands and treat us like we can't figure shit out. (skyrim was the *worst* in this regards. Why even have those "puzzle" doors when the answer is always placed right next to the puzzle.)
well said and too true
grew up with neverwinter nights and its good to see that the newer generation will have access to at least one bomb ass game that did everything in its power to make that game stand not only the test of time as a game but also as a memory
To be fair larian studio's previous game, divinity original sin 2, had the same amount of love and care put into it. Im glad they are getting recognition now thanks to Baldurs gate 😊
The AAA game companies who tried to sabotage BG3 are absolute scum.
Should be illegal
Perhaps make a list of companies playing that scum game? If they want to follow up Bud's Light fate
100% agreed. BG3 first game in a while I love. I tried playing Diablo 4 again and did a nightmare dungeon after the recent update and literally quit halfway through
I say we should answer with mass boycotts for ALL theyr new games if they are not up to the new standard. Till thry go bankrupt if necessary. Send the message loud and clear. We shall not be robbed anymore by theese loot boxes spinning CRIMINALS masked as game devs
Envy. Just like how Cain were jealous of his own brother Abel when God accept his offering then proceed to murder him.
In my eyes, it's less "raising standards to new heights" and more like "restoring standards to what they once were". Because if you'll recall, games used to be feature-complete on release.
memory unlocked
this is sooo true too, games were always complete. DLC’s still existed but even then, they weren’t as prominent as they are now and when there were DLC’s, they were amazing. for example, elder scrolls oblivion’s “shivering isles” DLC was like a whole other game in itself.
exactly.
@@sarahandersen5091exactly where my mind went when you mentioned dlc. It was like mappacks and game expansions. Shimmering isles was amazing and the hideouts. Oblivion was amazing!
But it's new for the diversity hires, hired in the last 5 years, for their woke politics and to fulfill quotas, than for being good at what they do, and loving what they do.
* *2003:* _I used to go into a store to find a game,_
* *2023:* _Now I go into a game to find a store._
It’s funny how little the devs are willing to increase standards… which mind you this “increase” is simply restoring the previous standard that was set 15-20ish years ago.
Actually true lmao
To be fair, the amount of work and expectations of gamers have risen so high that anything new being released is going to be crap anyway, just because it doesn't reach some uber levels of expectations.
It's expensive plus most devs don't have the passion or skills to do better.
Absolutely. It would be hilarious if it weren't so sad. Wish I could share my memories and feelings of how purchasing and playing games was back then with younger people, maybe then they would fully realize the level of bull goin on in today's market and why exactly we are so mad about it all. So many changes to the status quo of gaming design spoon fed down the throat over the years to them because they more readily accept them due to simply not having experienced any better.
It's sickening that they are actively trying to push certain practices as the new "normal" for future generations and of course, if they have no perspective one tends to accept what they are given as long as they get their dose of dopamine. Young children especially, have very little control of their lives, so many seek what little kernels of personal accomplishment they can (things that make them more of an "individual", that makes them feel "successful", not unlike the satisfaction of an adult in being good at their job or when you realize something important about yourself) in school, clubs and games, and these people know and exploit that. As a game designer myself, I hate to the depths of my core seeing the purpose of my profession being distorted and weaponized like that.
they worked so hard to lower our standards this cant come to pass :( they'll hav eto actually make good stories again.
Ill never forget when i bought the witcher 3 and the game came with a thank you note and a map like when i was a little kid. blew my mind how great the game was and how much effort was put in.
witcher 3 is an amazing case of we love this story lets make it great, although it did take 3 games to get to the point of witcher glory, but you never got hit with micros and DLC was cheap and very expansive
@@bigstopowensstfu Witcher 1 and 2 are AMAZING
I like their story way better than the 3rd
@@starlyghtdrifter66 there's a reason witcher 3 is the most awarded game in history and witcher 1 and 2 are not even close but hey I'm biased I've only ever played 3 because of word of mouth.
This is what is happening with bg3 nobody's saying bg1 and 2 are bad but there just not on the same level.
All the free dlc too
The moment I played Baldurs Gate 3, it gave me the same feeling when I first played Witcher 3. Every decision has a consequence.
In Baldurs Gate 3, I tried role-playing as "The Invoker" (yes, the same elf dude from Dota 2) a wizard/manipulative villain and it is possible. I also discovered that I can even play a much more darker one using Dark Urge.
"i don't know anything about how to build a car but if I buy one and it comes with 3 wheels and a DLC for the fourth; i'm going to be pissed." one of the best quotes ive heard in a while when it comes to the state of video games.
The sad thing is, that's actually happening in a way. BMW is selling heated seats as a sub now, lol.
most cars have dlc base package and one with all the dlc is normally like 15-40k diff
@@jbradfordphotoTesla too. Mfs really out here selling physical DLCs.
@@TWEAKLET NO, stop, just think it through. OP says the 4th wheel that you have to have in order for the car to work, is being stripped off the car and sold back to you as a fucking extra. See? most cars, actually no cars have base packages that remove basic hardware. In this instance we are comparing games that strip out necessary features and or complete proper endings to the main story.
I'd buy it if it was a collab with Mr Bean lmao
it's weird how releasing a complete game nowadays becomes a special event that needs to be covered and saluted.
And torn down by the rest of the industry rather than them raising their own standards.
sweat from armpits is the best drink
imagine if i told a customer they cant electricity in their buiding because its "too hard to do". id lose my fucking job in 1 second.
Most gamers of today weren't around during the golden era of games back when DLC and micro transactions didn't exist. Games were developed and released with ALL content right out of the box, and if it sold well...we'd get an expansion or a sequel. Expansions were that DLC, but there was enough content that it was essentially a whole other game. It was a continuation of the first game, but wasn't something you could just conquer in 20hrs or a single weekend of playing. It was the same thing with sequels. You were looking at 50 hours or more to finish them...and they were actually FUN and didn't feel like a slog to progress through, nor did it feel like having a 2nd job like so many of these live service games.
The reason all these AAA developers are whining and crying about how it's "unrealistic" to have that expectation of a game of that size and scope and quality from now on is because they were so brutally made to realize that people will flock to those kind of games more than their own. ESPECIALLY when that game is released in it's entirety with NO DLC, NO micro transactions, and NO mandatory permanent internet connectivity. They're salty because it reminds the older gamers of that golden era when games like that weren't the exception or the anomaly, but the RULE.
Let me put it another way. The attitude of these other developers is IDENTICAL to Mr. O'Hare from the Dr. Seuss movie "The Lorax" He's the guy who's become rich charging everyone for clean air after all the trees were chopped down to create Thneeds, and he does EVERYTHING in his power to try to make sure that no trees are ever planted again to keep the status quo. Larion in this example is LITERALLY that breath of fresh air that the rest of the industry doesn't like because it means that everyone else now has to work that much harder to try to meet or exceed that level of quality, which also means spending more money, and therefore making less profit. It's all about the money for the shareholders and the bean counters. THAT is the reason we have shitty to mid tier quality unfinished, unpolished, bug ridden games and are being gouged on DLC and micro transactions to squeeze us for as much as humanly possible.
You’re missing a huge aspect and that is that the game is also an easy 9/10 game made at a triple A level. There are tons of complete games that are just average games or worse or perfectly great indie games but the level of work that went into this game is insane.
I worked as a game translation tester for a AAA game studio and I swear to you, I met over 10 translators/testers in the company and I was the only gamer. Quite a few of them openly said they didn't "get" the fun in video games.
Because modern games are shit.
People think games like God of War are good.
@@frankvonfrauner2018 wad ragnarok not so much
Well, they're not wrong. Lots of those AAA games aren't fun.
@@frankvonfrauner God of War is bad?
@@frankvonfraunerstop projecting 😂
Imagine a world where you are criticized for being too good. What a dystopian nightmare that would be.
Welcome to north america and modern north americans
Dude, there is nothing new about that concept. Back in ye olden times, people were even killed for being too good, only to later be called martyrs. Work in a Union and find out how quickly you get shit on for going above and beyond too.
Tall Poppy syndrome is unfortunately very widespread.
Except literally no one has criticized them, it’s been universal acclaim
@@Lilmikey-dh8cd when the devs are shitting their pants about bg3 becoming a new standard saying the game is horrible is blatant coping, you're just hella mad your favorite game series is doing dogshit stats compared to one you've never heard of
It's crazy how triggered other companies got by a dev studio simply delivering on what they promised to deliver without nickel-and-diming the consumer for all they're worth
I remember when this happened with elden ring as well. Game was good and other devs got mad about it.
"whaaat, they are not selling 3 extra quests for 20 dollars?!?!"
@@Jensen8918 are you sure they could?
They even rewarded the individuals who purchased the early access with a digital upgrade.
You just don't know game development , no one is only worth 80 dollars charged for the average game and developers were mad because they didn't get 7 years to develop their games only one year .
Giving studios the ability to frequently patch games after launch was one of the best and worse things they ever did.
Sierra Online had a habit of releasing unplayable junk that was fundamentally broken before that became possible, when things were still delivered on floppy disk and CD-ROM.
And then never releasing updates because there was no way to get them to customers.
They didn't last long when they started doing that, people at the time (mid 1990s...) didn't put up with it and stopped buying their junk.
These days people DO put up with it and keep buying from the same junk companies over and over again because they have forgotten that quality at some point mattered.
Patches should be forbidden for 3 months after a release and/or patch.
They would be extra careful before releasing anything.
@@vukkulvar9769, I'm assuming you have no experience with programming, because there's absolutely no way to make a huge, complicated game and not have bugs.
Even BG3 erased my wizard's entire spell book because of a bug when you learn too many spells.
I remember back on PS2 with Soul Reaver 2, there was a bug that made the game unbeatable about 80% into the game if you disturbed some birds on a walkway leading up to a castle.
That game was made with a lot of love and care, but bugs will always slip through, and some can completely fuck up the game.
@@DemothHymside Well, guess you're bad at assuming.
I never said it would prevent games from having bugs. But it certainly would have companies check more thoroughly for bugs before launch.
@@vukkulvar9769 , it's not a bad assumption considering what you said.
Good games sell? Imagine that.
😂
AND the consumers are HAPPY?!!?!
Who knew😂😂😂
Ahh it's some kind of conspiracy
No that can’t be true.. why would people buy something that they think is good or better. 🤥
When competition is seen as something bad, you know we hit a dead point in video game development.
100%
@@gerbo8018Dis is da wae. 😎
Not getting anything from me if your product is crap, game makers. Step up. 🙄
Nobody wants competition bro be realistic.
Everyone wants a monopoly to make max cash possible.
Well competition is the enemy of the totalitarian tyrant.
their is no competition, no matter how good bg3 does .... a mobile game like clash of clans... still makes more money... and that is all they care about ....
its an investment.... their game is money....
oyu dont need to put that much effort in to make fast buck.... for your shareholders...
This has shot up to one of my all time favorite games ever. Larian is gold, simply for making a game with passion and not trying to rip us off, brilliant.
If you haven't played any of their other games... I highly recommend divinity 1 and 2 as well. It will feel like a bit of a step back after playing bg3 but they were so fuckin good
@Blackviper6 divinity os2 is really quite good too. Divinity 1 is I think when it truly becomes a step back. Divinity os2 focus a lot more on the hazard alchemy system which is super cool
DOS 1 had great atmosphere and a cohesive narrative. It does not stretch things for too long and even the filler content has some meaning to the overarching plot
dos2 is really cool, for my entire first playthrough I didn't know you could craft unique spells you wouldn't ever get otherwise or put nails on boots to make you immune to falling on ice
@@lebron73 yep.
AAA devs are just confirming what we’ve already long said was already happening. They’ve gotten lazier and greedier. And they can’t stand that other developers outside their circle aren’t lowering themselves to their standard of mediocrity. Of course the studio executives who don’t know sh!t about video games are also very much partly to blame for the problem.
aren't *
@@sssreggiN *are not
They're lazier, but they're not the greedy ones. It's the higher ups that bag most of the money, leaving little for the devs. The devs thus put in the least effort they can in a game they're not interested in making because they're underpaid.
@@Dayhawk101 dont make me overextend your neck
@@shepardvasnormandy Very good point.
Gamers' fault that we're in this position. Asmon said it well: "every gaming boycott is one 3 min cinematic from being over. "
If we don't vote with our wallets, no one will take us seriously.
I mean the reality is I do vote with my wallet. It's not even because I want to. It's because the state of the industry as a general rule genuinely sucks. I understand why the people who buy every call of duty or fifa does every year. They want X genre and nothing quite fills their niche. It's rare for a brand takeover to happen like Sim City to City Skylines. It requires not only nailing the execution but also requires the opposition to basically flop as well. For me I want progression, choice, and sandbox in my games. That gives me a lot of genres to pick from and if any one genre flops, I can pull up the indie games from many other genres. It comes down to the scope of choices.
Exactly! Thank you for your comment! As long as people keep throwing money at shitty games thats all we are going to get. Just let all our great streamers rummage through the products first like our boy here and THEN proceed to buy. I bought only proven games roughly a year after they came out and was always happy to be a client to that studio. Blizzard or ea haven't seen a penny from me in a decade now hahaha.
It's casual's fault.
@@michaelh878 spoken like a true casual
look what happened to bud light ... ppl voted with their wallets
The industry itself seems to really be the problem. There's too many executives from other industries running things and putting profit first, too many inept upper managers wanting to put deadlines over quality, too many industry people pushing looking pretty over gameplay, writing and depth, and too many (as you say) shit-eaters willing to accept mediocrity.
Gotta get that Holiday money 💰
Greed is god in America con artist rule and are looking to exploit people in any way possible.
It’s higher up the food chain, culture & western globalist filth.
Baldurs Gate 3 cured the burnout I got with gaming nowadays. Releases dient excite me anymore but this game really felt good to play and it rejuvenated my passion.
Yes! I haven't been really excited since Witcher 3.
sames
Same. And then you realize it wasn't really burnout, but depression induced by the downward state of the game releases feeling like half-baked unoptimized products. They felt more like they sold you the future promise of a "feature complete product" with the caveat assumption of you opening your wallet over and over again.
Exactly, and the funny thing is i wasn't even expecting it, zero hype. What a great surprise.
@@meltygear5955 the ubisoft effect
I never played DND, never played Baldur's gate, barely ever played turn based games.... this game was fucking amazing. They put these idiots to shame and I am so excited to see the massive change in the standards. Support great games.
You can try playing baldurs gate enhanced edition 1 & 2 and baldurs gate siege of dragonspear on a smartphone/tablet. Perfect time sink when on the toilet or on a long commute.
your dad has a big garage
most addicted ive been to a game in so long
Really? So how overblown was the controversial stuff then? You know the gross ogre seggs and the character creator.
Like, what if i want to make a barbarian who looks similar to thor in GOW:R?
I have been waiting for this. I started on BG 2
"AAA gaming is for investors not consumers. Sometimes those goals align. But remember there is a one and there is a two." - Never really thought of Asmongold as a "great" analyst but that's one of the most succinct and accurate quotes I've ever heard regarding modern gaming. Spot on.
Criticism of Baldur's Gate 3 from game devs and games "journalists" boils down to: "We're happy being complacent, don't make us work harder."
Imagine writing a good story instead of designing our next game pass.
pretty sure, the journalists are agreeing with the gamers in this case.
Thank you IGN for having a rare but great take, This guy went in on these studio's and it need's to happen more often.
Nice tongue in cheek. That's new.
indeed
i won't be surprised if destin from ign will get blacklisted by certain dev studios on future release projects for preview/review due to his take on this. he's currently getting ripped on by some game devs on twitter for that ign video (apex legends dev didn't seem to like his video and called him out on twitter for example)
If he has any sense he'll double down. IGN could do with more consumer appreciation and this is their way of going about it by having a guy like this do videos like this.
Thank you Destin Legarie for having a good take.
He has his own channel called Destin if anyone is interested.
As a software dev, I'd agree with Asmon regarding there being a lot of bad devs/designers in AAA studios. AAA studios attract a lot of people who are primarily interested in job security; once you're established, you don't run the risk of your studio closing down and having to go job hunting again. You can't tell me that the people making a new Madden/FIFA or whatever every year are passionate about their jobs. They're paid to do minor data entry updates, recolor some uniforms and scenery and repackage it for the following year's release. The only reason why you "want" to be a developer working on Madden, FIFA, etc, is because you know that year after year you'll have a product and audience that will keep you employed.
What’s funny is that was one of the plans I came up with when I was figuring out what to do after high school.
BG3 is so good that even IGN made a good video.
lol true
Destin has always been the best employee they've had. Been watching him since the Screwattack days when he did Hard News for them
😂
It's not only that, I think for many other people they support BG3 because of what it represents, a ray of hope in this dying industry, Asmon here bought the game on this principle not because he was interested, and now even he considers playing it
We should hold Triple A developers (Activision Blizzard, EA Games, Square Enix, etc.) to the standard of Baldur's Gate 3 because that's the bracket they're competing in. I'm not expecting smaller indie games devs like those behind Hollow Knight, Stardew Valley, etc. to compete at that kind of level of complexity and depth.
FF16 releases feature complete with no dlcs: 😢
You say, but Hollow Knight DOES compete at that level within the context of it's own genre.
@@reijishian2593 yes but we dont hold it to that standard. we dont expect that, we praise and celebrate it. butnobody expected the game to be as good as it is.
Stardew Valley was made by one guy . . . he put those AAA studios to shame
To be fair, It's got to the point where I'm expecting more/better products from indie game devs than I do the Triple A, because of the fact that Triple A is at this point completely consumed by maximizing profit at the least possible cost, whereas indie devs more times than not still get to take the time and develop passionately. Many of the more recent explosively popular games are indie titles from "unknown" indie studios... Sure, it's unfortunately common that it ends up being one-hit wonders but it's still a very real thing.
Developers have gotten so much pushback from the money people at these companies that of course they don’t think this standard can be met. The evidence that it could be is that it was met by Larian. However, everyone is jaded in game design and they know if they proposed Baldur’s Gate 3 to their shareholders and board that they’d be terminated tomorrow because they wouldn’t make enough money on the game for them.
Just started playing baldurs gate today with a friend and I gotta say the co-op is so unrestrained that you can go off and do separate quests and still jump in to see the cutscenes of the other person if you want to, it’s utterly insane I’ve never seen that before
Oh, that is cool. that really does feel like table top DnD where your party just goes off on their own sometimes.
Was the same in divinity original sin 2, you could both get your own party together and compete for the end of the game
yes, but it can be messy with quest in multi..and also i like the icon of your team choosing dialogue, even if leader kept the final choice.. but yes you can be a sneaky partner who attack people, robb people, and do dialogue when everyone not looking, iniate a fight without warning, and at the end they need to clean your mess lol
I think the reason why a lot of devs are pushing back against this is because they know they simply can't do what Larian has done. They know that they won't be given the time and resources needed to make their games as good as they possibly can be. They know that they're going to have to add micro transactions, battle passes and the like that so many don't like. They know all of this for the same reason anyone who's been paying attention knows this. The people actually running the show don't give a crap about making the best possible game. They just want to make a game good enough to rake in profits, nothing more.
But also as he said: most people are not great at their job. That's just the reality. Look to the art world - how many book authors are genuinely S-Tier in their genre? How many film directors? Fact is, the majority will always be trash no matter how much resources and time they have. Not everyone can be great....that's what makes someone great.
If the company is an indie studio its understandable but for AAA studios, no, its not, especially if said studio sold themselves to EA or Ubisoft or whatever crap publisher there is. They cant complain that they cant do what larian did because they chose to sell themselves to crap publishers and live under the rule of those crap publishers. If you shit your pants you dont get to complain that your pants are now full of shit. The lack of resources for these AAA companies is their own damn fault and no ammount of whining will change that. They could have chosen differently, they could have chosen to go the larian path but they chose not to, they chose to sell, they chose their own chains, so for them, quit the whining and accept the situation you chose to live in.
Then fine, but don't trash the idea of the game being "lucky" to be feature complete.
What happens is these devs now become part of the problem. If these Devs feel that STRONGLY about BG3 from Larian Studio. They should quit their soul crushing programming jobs with these AAA studios, to join Larion, or make their own like at People can fly and dozens of other AA studios. War Horse Studios made their dream game in the RPG Kingdom Come. It's entirely possible, but hard work. Making lame excuses is actually easier then working at raising the standard.
The lesson is Don't take a job with a shit studio then throw shade at the other guys at another studio that are doing it better.
Well that and baldurs gate was in early access and developed for YEARS. baldurs gate 3 wasn't like this at all a couple of years ago and most game developers are being rushed by higher ups. Like baldurs gate 3 took six years to make. SIX. GTA 5 took THREE.
People within the industry are scared they're going to be held to a standard they simply cannot compete with. This is beyond the pale of rpg development. but too treat "beyond the pale" as the new normal would be silly.
@Broskisnowski they have 450 employees that's 100% not an indie studio. Also blizzard might have a shit ton of employees but it doesn't mean they're all working on *one thing*
I mean this kind of blowout happened when elden ring came out to great success and raised the standard, and it too had so many Devs fuming. It's great to see another game studio defy expectations and making a damn good game.
The thing is it isn't "increasing standards" It's returning the standards to what they used to be many years ago. Back when they actually cared about their product and took pride in their work.
Duud, well said. I mean not all games back in my days were good but atleast complete. Men this game is a shimmering star. No wonder other companies are jealous as hell. Instead of making a game for shareholders they just amde a game for us. Worked
In the words of Asmon himself: Baldur's Gate 3 is a game that makes me WANT to waste my time with it. I'm about halfway through Act 2 and I'm still meeting consequences of my Act 1 actions. It just rewards (or punishes) my decisions, gives the feeling that they really matter. I haven't seen that since the Witcher 3 but BG3 arguably does it even better.
And it's not just big decisions. Many small, offhand encounters (1 skillcheck and over) are still coming back to either reward or haunt me. Like most, I used to mock the "17,000 ways to finish the game" and, of course, anyone with high school maths skills will tell you that it's based on combining all variations of all quests which does scale exponentially (AKA goes into multiple digits very fast), but even considering this it's a big number to cite. However, now I'm honestly starting to feel like this number is, if anything, an understatement.
Obviously, most players won't bother with all the permutations as it's typically the "good choice", "the evil choice", "the IDGAF choice" or "something weird in between the three". And if you settle for a certain RP-style you will stick to certain choices throughout the game effectively ending with maybe 5-6 significanlty different experiences (which is still a lot for a game that takes 70 hours to breeze through and about 200 for the full exploration).
And the companion quests are even a higher tier for me. Contrary to most games, you don't just "tag along" for them. Your words and actions have decisive impact. You choose poorly in a character crucial moment and you're in for a fight to the death. But choose wisely and you may actually pull a 180 on their values and beliefs, which is possible even for the most... zealous ones (not spoiling directly but most of y'all probably get the idea who I'm looking at).
If you start this game, you start YOUR story and it will be different to almost every other story other players will experience. The odds someone will make exactly the same decisions in exactly the same moments with exactly the same outcome are... well, if we cite the number again 1:17,000. Which, coincidentally, gives the game streaming longevity for years to come. Not everyone will have time/will to play such a big game again, but with streamers you can see all your "what if"-s answered.
As such, I'm not surprised AAA studios feel threatened by Larian now. At this point it's either step up and deliver something of at least comparable (if not better) quality and quite soon at that, or be considered the inferior by comparison forevermore. However, whereas I understand their anxiety, I don't offer my sympathy. All of their choices that changed gaming market from a few rare but precious gems into a pile of medioctre pebbles came from the place of greed and arrogance, not passion and respect.
Larian has brought the two latter qualities back to the equation with a huge fanfare at that. It took 20 years the last time for people to forget about those qualities (mainly via being constantly distracted by graphics evolution AAAs had earlier access to due to resources). After BG3 it may take 20 years again until mediocrity becomes acceptable once more. And what makes it worse for AAAs, until they can offer a true Full-Dive experience (a'la Ready: Player One) there's little progress to be made with graphics alone this time around, we're already at the threshold of real-life visuals. So no wonder every AAA dev is wearing brown pants now.
Alright, enough of the essay. I could say more but I really want to go back into the game instead!
Well thought out take friend, here's your +1!
must say i have to agree with you on everything,and though I don't currently own a PC,let alone know how to use a PC I have made it a goal to own a PC just to play BG3. Furthermore I really hope AAA studios will see BG3 as the new way to make games. I will really not mind waiting 10 years for the new release if the current games can provide thousands of hours of quality gaming,not just a grindfest like Destiny 2.
Dude just spit knowledge for 7 paragraphs and went back to adventuring. What an endorsement. Maybe I WILL buy it
It really is as many say not a new standard. This is the old standard that we once were used to. Having people who actually care and love their game making a game.
I would have absolutely loved to have heard TotalBiscuit's reaction to this whole Baldur's Gate 3 thing from developers. I am sure it would have also been a great teardown of the industry in its current state.
Blessed be his name.
TotalBiscuit would have SHREDDED the profit driven gaming industry right now. He would have done so in such a great and well thought out way. I miss him, fuck cancer.
Been awhile since I heard him mentioned, I was a bit confused by his constant mention of FOV sliders when I was just a console guy but having moved to PC I am extremely agitated by the lack of HUD centering options for Ultrawide screen users. It should be industry standard at this point, just like how he pushed for FOV customization.
I'm sure he would have had a very fun take, thanks for reminding me of him.
Man rip totalbiscuit o7
Gods I miss his videos. Cancer is the f*cking worst.
AAA used to mean a studio could pour a massive amount of resources and time into a single game to give consumers the full vision and breadth of the director. Now it means "Oh we're a massive company and you should buy our game because we're going to spend a lot of money marketing it, also we have nice graphics"
This is why...why normies ruin everything. Gaming got too big. These companies have dialed it down to minimum effort maximum bonuses. Checklists without any single bit of passion. Shit game every year around the holidays so millions of parents go out and buy their kids the next call of duty.
They spent a lot of money hiring dozens of artists and having them spend thousands of hours developing assets.
I have such fond memories of Baldur’s Gate Dark Alliance and EverQuest Champions of Norrath.
PS2 offline co-op gaming was how I spent many days after school with my friends.
Glad to see the title is still going strong and has been developed well.
EQ? What Server were you on?
Champions was the jam.
My brother and I would play this all the time. Some of my favorite gaming experiences
I spent countless hours with my brothers playing Champions and just started replaying RTA with them this year. PoE reminds me of those too
Need more games like this to reeducate people of how games should be. Released as a complete package, fun to play. People have been trained for a decade that paying 70$ for an incomplete garbage is the norm because "we will keep updating the game because we were utterly incompetent to make 1 single complete, fun to play game for 10+ years.'
Most gamers don't even complete a game let alone play it for 10 years, so I think your standards are alittle off because that's what you do but otherwise i agree. Most people who do play that long are either major fans of the game, or the game is a mmo, rougelike, etc that has the potential to last that long. A story driven game probably won't have that happen with the majority of players, and I think that's completely fine. It's pretty unrealistic for a game to last that long when most games dont, even games from back in the day, but every game should be complete on release for sure. There's just too many kinds of games to say every one should last you 10+ years
@@Kratos-eg7ez I think he meant that they're so incompetent they hadn't made 1 single fun and complete game in the last 10 or more years. Not that they should last 10+ years.
Personally, a fun and complete game that doesn't try to milk more money out of you, lasting at least 50 hours, and costing at most 60 euro/dollars, is good enough for me. And if the game doesn't last 50 hours, but is just really good, that works too.
and I've seen devs say this is a stupid take.. maybe they're a part of the problem
@@dontatmetillyouvebeenoutside idk man everyone else seems to disagree with you lol
@@SanquinityI've been playing an indie text based online multiplayer game called Akanbar on and off for the last ten years for free and honestly my memories from that game still live on long after I've forgotten what happened in most of the new big console games I've bought in that time period
Feature complete games without onerous DLC sell well, what a novel idea. No one could see the success of Tears of the Kingdom, Elden Ring, Hogwarts Legacy or Baldur's Gate 3 coming. I'm completely blindsided by this!
Elden Ring has DLC coming and Elden Ring, Hogwarts Legacy, and Baldur's Gate 3 have and will need post-launch patches for some issues. None of this is bad tbh, I feel like people really don't understand gaming or the industry these days. People act like gaming has fallen so far, yet we can name 4-5 games off the top of our heads that were knock out of the park homeruns in the last couple years and I can personally say that gaming has only gotten better for me as a general thing. Don't like microtransactions? Stay away from games that do them, don't like DLC's? Don't buy them, personally, as long as a game is fun and I enjoy it, they can do whatever the hell they want, I'm in control of my money.
Gonna be honest, the only games i've played in the last couple years is cross out and diablo four. Cross out isn't the game it was designed to be anymore so I stopped playing
@@michaelm6179 Not all DLC is equal imo. Elden Ring is a complete game on it's own, so having DLC come out that actually expands on the game further isn't a bad thing. Meanwhile, DLC in games like Sims 4 or Destiny 2 feels completely predatory. You're right that we've had some great games in recent times. I think the thing that people are upset about is that a considerable amount of development effort, especially in western AAA companies, is going toward products with the sole purpose of milking people for the most money, with the least effort required. Rather than simply focusing on releasing passion driven, quality products that people will love.
@@michaelm6179 The difference is there is no compulsion to buy the DLC. Many games are not complete games without the DLC. So far, I had no bugs with the above games except Hogwarts and those were minimal graphical bugs. All those games were great fun from day one. Also, the only game I have bought DLC for in years is Vampire Survivors. I don't pay to play TFT and my next most played online games BAR(Beyond All Reason) and Halo Infinite which I never spend money in and are free to play.
Yes, it upsets people to see big money spent just to fleece them. People are even madder recently because starting with Elden Ring we have had a lot of bangers from everyone not named Microsoft. Even some of the lower budget Microsoft games are good to great if you look at Hi-Fi Rush, Pentiment, and AoE4.
Go back a year ago, AAA developers were having issues with Elden Ring too. They didn't understand why it was so loved with its lack of UI refinement and quest design. Maybe players don't want their hands held all of the time with obvious markers and breadcrumb for dummies type quests.
it's incredibly refreshing to play a complete game.
Yeah, which is why I've been playing many AA japanese games which have ALWAYS been very complete unlike western AAA games.
@bloody4558 : throw some titles out there
@@dgayle2348ubisoft😂
@@bloody4558what games?
@@dgayle2348 Dunno what counts as AA but the Yakuza games and Monster hunter games are always complete on release, MH gives more content after for free unless it's a full expansion
I'm not a CRPG kind of guy but BG3 blew my mind. I can't believe it has engrossed me this much even though I know nothing about DnD. Larion truly is an amazing studio.
This was needing to be said for so long. This is exactly how I feel about the gaming industry. I loved this video so much! I have been playing video games for decades and I have seen the quality of games spiral downward for too long. I plan to get Balders Gate 3 ASAP just because of the fans raving about its quality. The gaming industry really needs to take a good long look at what it has become as a whole and why it is being viewed by fans the way it is. Stop blaming the fans. It's time for the game industry to wake up and smell the coffee. I don't want excuses on why you can't do something or providing info about your designers instead of the game you are working on. I do not care about how so and so got started in the industry or how everyone suffered so much trying to finish a game. I just want information about the game I am waiting on. (I am looking at you Bioware) I am a Nurse. My customers aren't interested in why and how I got started in my profession or how bad my back hurts. They just want quality Nursing care. Quit making excuses for bad decisions and do your job. There I've said my piece. I feel better now. Rant over.
"This game is good and has no microtransactions, don't expect our studio to do the same"
I think the most unbelievable thing about this is IGN having an actual good take for the first time in a while.
I had to do a double take, because I couldn't believe this was an IGN video.
they have been making a bit of a comeback the last year or so. Must be new management or something.
I was thinking the same.
If you fall for this then it's no wonder you fell for 'the big one' three and a half years ago. IGN is and will be the same before and after any "good takes." They know how important it is to '"cool the mark' before the next gaslighting session.
@@Joyapp Their review of Hogwarts Legacy was nonsense if I remember correctly so it must be within the last few months
As an artist with a faculty degree and career in 3D I can confirm that the biggest problem is in hiring good people with CV checkmarks that have never played any games, ever.
So, you are right on that whole part.
Me and my mates haven’t been this into a game in years.
All of us are standing up for crucial rolls and intensely debating strategy in difficult fights.
We hit act 3 and all agreed to play it again with different builds and story paths right after we finish.
It's not just that the game is huge and wonderfully done. That's not the "standard". The "standard" is that it was shipped COMPLETE, FUNCTIONAL, and without any paywall/lootbox/gambling shenanigans. All the extra shine is nice, and it took a lot of development time for sure. But the company earned the trust of investors and customers and bought itself that kind of leeway on development because we all expected that the final product would be worth it, and it was.
Exactly. When we shipped games on the PS1 and PS2 days it was *required* that your game pass a “24 hour soak test”: ZERO crashes after running for 24 straight.
Today we get HUGE Day 1 patches and customers are nickeled and dimed for content should have been in the original game.
* *2003:* _I used to go into a store to find a game,_
* *2023:* _Now I go into a game to find a store._
Greed corrupted AAA games.
@@MichaelPohoreski Day 1 patches are a good thing. Playstation 1 games were infinitely less complex. Stop mixing the good with the bad, it makes you sound like a robot with only 1 horse in the race. 'being negative'
@@TravelWithBradley How dare consumers get a stable product they paid for! /s
You’ve shipped how games on which platforms again?
I like how he used the analogy of comparing AAA games as fast food burgers, to other fast food burgers, and BG3 came out as a high class- no carry out- dress code required to enter- restaurant burger but for the same price as "Fast food"..
It's all about the company's direction. Lahrain is an independent with no corporate executive to stear them to only maximize the profit by adding game pass and MTX. You can check the history of used-to-be great developer falling from grace because of their acquisition by a big corporation (Bioware, Blizzard, Bungie, etc.) The best practice is to vote with your wallet. Support the developers doing their work right. 😅
Yup it’s just a matter of some companies prioritizing profits and other companies prioritizing customer satisfaction
I really want to know how proud the Developers at Larian are feeling because they absolutely deserve all the praise they get. I hope they're raising the middle finger to all AAA companies.
no lie, im rizzuku himdoryia
TBH one of the biggest advantages Larian had is that they're their own publisher. I remember a former AAA dev ranting about how publishers literally push their developers to make faster/easier and simpler games with microtransactions instead of making complex games with depth. So a lot of the features gets scrapped even before the development starts because it'd take more time and lose more money. AAA *publishers* are the real assholes not the devs.
they are not because the game is for card game lovers its not some magical game its bland. you like it because you like pokemon cards.....
@@silentninja9367 BG3 is nothing similar to card games. Any type of knowledge on the game makes that obvious. if you dont like turn based games than thats w/e, but you cant call this a card game and expect people to take your opinion seriously.
I can work with most games not being as big and in-depth as this going forward. But the systems work and are fun, the stories and just about all the characters are interesting, the environments are great, bugs are minimal, exploration and progression are fun (no checklist tasks for the world map, i.e. "6/50 flags found"), no microtransactions or obvious missing features. THAT's the standard that many modern AAA games have fallen behind on.
What makes me really mad is that these people are trying to excuse themselves by claiming they're defending indie teams, but no one is expecting this standard from indies, we expect AAA studios to meet it, and they have no excuse not to except greed.
protein shakes taste like apples and cream
Video games is art. When AAA studios just photo copy their masterpiece from the old days with using the cheapest paper and cheapest machines we get "modern gaming". Their goal isn't to move their audience rather, to make money with the least amount of effort. It is truly awesome when a true artist like Larian comes along and shakes the world.
Your second sentence makes me think of young anime fans who would just draw over a screenshot of a scene to make their own ocs...
I'm telling you, Fromsoftware and Larian are the ONLY good game developers nowadays
It’s a shame that these companies didn’t learn from Elden Ring last year. We don’t want their micro transactions, we just want quality games. Congrats to Larian, and congrats to the gamers that get to enjoy this masterpiece.
Unfortunantly there are games that a single cosmétic gets more money than the Sales of the game itself. There are a lot of simps and P2P that just want that state of “superiority”
BG3 is an example of what talent, 2 decades of experience and enough development time can achieve. Larian is not a small studio, they have 450 people, which is fairly close to a AAA project size. I think there are 3 major contributing factors:
- Larian is privately owned, so they are not incentivized to chase quarterly financial goals
- They have done exclusively CRPGs for the last 2 decades, so they have the engine and the pipeline to churn out content efficiently. They are a very specialized studio.
- They have spent development time to produce a very substantial scope. 6 years of development time is a lot.
This is more or less peerless experts at their best working with little time constraints.
So, from some perspective - yes, this is not going to be every CRPG from now on. But it is surely a bar to reach now, and something gamers should look forward for.
Frankly the only bar that all games should reach with respect to BG3 is simply having the game be finished and relatively bug free on launch.
I'm not paying 70 bucks for what amounts to a glorified beta build.
They also have the advantage of the CEO and majority owner being a passionate gamer and the direct project manager for the game. This means a single direction on the game and that direction being in the hands of someone who just wants to make games he would love to play. And it turns out, so would a lot of other people.
They have not exclusively done CRPGs for the last two decades. They released Divinity: Dragon Commander just 1 decade ago. It's a (decent - but not great) strategy game.
@@jarrodbright5231 Yep, the CEO said in an interview that Microsoft wanted the buy 'em out a few years ago but declined. He said that he knows that their creative freedom wouldn't really be hampered under MS but not in extreme cases like showing nude lol, also he knows that he has a lot of work to do still. GIGA CEO
I love how all the devs are like “yo, don’t expect us to make games this good.” 😂
for real though 💀
You are 100% correct. I was born in 81. Thanks to this, I experienced entertainment at the highest level. I listened to music that you wanted to listen to because it was created with passion. I watched movies that had good scripts and brilliant character actors. I played games that contained a story that you wanted to relive over and over again - so you played the game several times. Today... music is often bland, movies are mostly sequels based on the same idea and starring bland actors, and games are devoid of everything... except the option to play online and buy via microtransactions what should be standard... Hope Baldur's Gate 3 broke this trend.
Why do people act like everything sucks nowadays? You really cant find movies with good scripts nowadays?
@@Stew91 movies? no. They are absolute trash now across the board with very few exceptions; but music and games, you can still dig and find diamonds in the rough.
@@coldgoldcan2781 Absolute trash across the board have always existed. Also, considering how 2023 has been one of the best years in gaming, your "diamonds in the rough" argument doesn't really hold water.
@@coldgoldcan2781there have been an insane amount of great movies released in the last 15 years. You may need to open your scope. Or try anti depressants
I work for AAA gaming studios - and am really surprised at some responses. Im a dev not an exec - but most devs i know i impressed by it, and obviously always wish to be part of a success such as BG3. They don't speak for all of us.
I think the fact that developers say "We can't do this, don't expect this from us" in a summed up way is telling to the state of the game industry. When you look at a well-made game that is all-in-all complete, it's just... disturbingly sad that the reaction they come up with is "Don't hold us to ths standard" instead of them saying "This game is amazing, and I hope to make something like it one day!"
If you can't look at something, even if it is an outlier for whatever reason, that is just incredibly well put together and shows what the entire industry you're working in is capable of on the high end, your reaction shouldn't be that. It should be something to aspire to. Maybe not match in every way, but to make something you could be just as proud of in the end. That's the core of wanting to get better at your craft--this should be an inspiration to them, not perceived as a threat.
And it's creatives saying it, they are just jealous of those who retained their artistic integrity AND get to put "built a masterpiece, all time great game" on their CV.
Can't feel great to churn out predatory shell games for megacorps and have it exposed by the likes of FROM and Larian these past two years.
Creatives in these twitter threads, basically summarizing the panicked action points from an executive meeting on BG3 gaslighting response strat. Maybe encouraged, maybe to win favour from money execs, who knows. Either way I'd be ashamed of myself.
I wonder why these people took such stance. I mean it's not hurt to just compliment like "nice game, bud". Or better yet, just shut up. Making a fuss like this just shows that they're lazy and kinda jealous.
I understand it though. Imagine the fucking web of storyboarding they had to juggle. Imagine the fucking "ok but if player did X what happens to this storyline?" then XYZ...
It's amazing how free BG3 makes me feel. I can't even understand it.... After 3 choice RPGs for so long I can't wrap my mind around this fucking masterpiece.
Hollywood writers wouldn't have gotten close. They have Matt Mercer level DMs on board as writers and it's fucking marvellous. Real writers.
I believe every developer should quit their job if they are complaining about consumers holding there games to a higher standard. If you can’t do it then quit and let someone more competent create the games that we want and deserve.
I'm following one indie RPG developer, what he wrote kind of stuck with me;
-
;; "Is Baldur’s Gate 3 going to cause gamers to overlook your game?"
No. Baldur’s Gate 3 is going to GROW the RPG fanbase. And a grown RPG fanbase means there's an increased chance of more people potentially looking towards my game.
Ultimately, I’m happy Larian made Baldur’s Gate 3 so I DON'T HAVE TO.
;; “Isn’t it arrogant to say that?”
No. I cannot live forever. Therefore, I cannot learn, make, nor play ALL the games. I don’t have to make an Ultima-type game now because Larian is doing it for me. I get to play a game I dreamed of playing now because Larian made it for me.
Also, watching "the games industry" squirm and panic is just too funny to me.
I mean this isn't a "new" standard. It's an old standard that Larian Studios dug up, re-animated with some good cleric magic, and put on the front line in the battle that is AAA gaming. Keep. It. Up.
I haven’t played BG3, but i want to so badly. I’ve seen somebody talk about a review that said something like “killed a woman, robbed her corpse, brought her back to life, gaslit her into believing me to be her savior. 10/10”
It's amazing it has so many branches and out comes with amazing cutscenes and badass boss fights
Just walked into a barn where a bugbear was doing the dirty to a giant female ogre. As a bard I told him to go on, so I could write a smut book on it and sell copies in Baldurs Gate. 10/10
@@TheCrimsonSporkhahaha that’s hilarious. When I walked in on them as a Barb my guy started cussing out the bugbear for his terrible ‘form’
Here's another thing i've managed to do. Convinced a boss to kill his minions, then to kill his pet, then to kill himself. My fav moment in the game so far.
This game is so incredibely well writen and gameplay is soo immersive that I honestly think this is the best game in 20 years.
Is the whitcher 3 , 20 years old then bruv ?
true but say 10 years, still, ....don't forget skyrim
If you think the writing in this is good I have a series to recommend for you, it's called "Artemis Fowl". lmao
@fozzbot2896 Witcher 3 sucked. So it doesn't have to be 20 years old.
I love that people are surprised this game is so damn good. Divinity 2 was INCREDIBLE. Im not surprised that when given the budget they were given, that they made a Game of the Generation.
I didn't really know what to expect before playing BG3 and bought it simply because my wife and I were looking for a fun game to play together. I was SHOCKED that the game didn't bombard us with MTX advertisements, battle pass advertisements, in game currency, and links to other sales for other games. It is a game first presentation whereas, sadly, it seems that other major developers have a sales/mtx first approach with the game being a vehicle to "trick" users into wasting their time in game for the longest amount of time. The fact that I even typed that is pretty sad, that's how low the bar is... BG3, Elden Ring, and the God of War PC port have been a ray of sunshine in an abysmal landscape these past few years.
Imagine paying full price for a game and expecting a full game. Just imagine
There are 2 types of devs who think like this:
1) the ones who are jealous because they will never create something even close to BG3
2) devs who have the talent but know the executives in charge will never let them make a game like this because the risk of not having microtransactions or let the game be in development until its actually ready to come out.
Baldur's gate 3 is a labour of love and it's showing. Something completely different from modern standards for the videogame industry
If Larian really wants to endear themselves to the gaming community, they should release a DM scenario builder or modding toolset a la Neverwinter Nights.
This could actually happen, Divinity (Original sin 2 ) had a feature like this and it shouldnt be too hard to move it across to BG3
@@gavin1786 By Div2 did you mean Ego Draconis or Original Sin 2?
@@Portuducks sorry original sin 2
Yes. Waiting for it.
imagine getting this good of a game and saying "if they really want people to like them they need to do even more"
“Stop looking for someone to pat you on the back for not doing it.” That hits the nail on the head I feel like all companies nowadays have just been trying to GUILT YOU into spending YOUR MONEY. Like cool make whatever you want put whatever you want into it Idc but If I don’t spend MY money that’s on me.
The Act Man had an excellent point that caused many triple A game titles like Diablo 4 fall from grace - that sales and marketing make the decisions not the devs. Pretty much players end up playing second fiddle on this whole ordeal. The biggest difference is that Larian Studios made Baldur's Gate with the players first in mind, not any stock holders nor sales/marketing people.
Really appreciated the critique on some of my points and am glad to see more people get where I’m coming from. ❤
I'm excited to see how many first time CRPG enjoyers go back and buy DOS2 and realize this isn't Larian's first BANGER. They're finally getting the love they deserve!!
Dos2 was a golden boy of Larian for a long time and I spent over 500 hr playing the shit out of it. Soundtrack great storytelling great overall great RPG. Dos2 alone should have been the standard of rpg but still nobody cares now BG2 booming it might set the standard for real this time... I hope...
I decided to buy DOS2 after playing bg3...it don't hit the same
@@tjandhuri because Dos2 aren't played by DnD rules it is it's own universe and it has a completely different mechanic. Like... No dice.
It is a great game, it is how i knew BG3 would be an even bigger hit. But it isn't on the same level production wise. BG3 has cinematic scenes with all dialogue and events. DOS2 is fully voice acted which is impressive, but its moments are told through a text box. The triple A production budget is why BG3 is so successful.
@@namesii1880 yes.. I totally agree
9:20 "I dont know how to build a car, but if they give me that b---- with 3 wheels and I have to pay for the 4th one as DLC I'm gonna be pissed" lmao
the reason this is such a big talking point at this stage is because most people have finally had enough of the devs just coming up with excuses and mental gymnastics as to why certain things arent done when said thing usually is dumed down to "theres no money to be made here so we wont do it"
I remember those golden days. It’s hard to counter the rosy tint of nostalgia, but I think it’s fair to say most games are downhill from there.
Nice to hear of a game returning to glory. I might actually buy this one!
That's what i've been saying since Elden Ring came out last year.
Golden age of gaming is coming back and it pisses off the triple AAA scums, everything is going perfectly.
I work in construction, idk about you but sitting in ac workin on video games all day sounds way harder than working outside in 105 degrees throughout the whole summer
Asmon is so very correct when he says the reason companies keep making sub-par games, is because people keep buying them. When you buy a product, you are not just buying a product, you are also voting with your wallet on what products should be made in the future.
there is no such thing as voting with your wallet, only supply and demand
That hamburger metaphor is so shit because if one chain is able to bring a better burger for the same price then the other chains should be thinking of ways to make their burger better instead of saying things like “yeah they put way to much effort in that burger don’t expect anything like that from us”. If they say things like that they deserve to lose their customers…
This game is amazing, especially with friends. The feeling of pushing them into 5 enemies..... Invigorating
God im glad im not the only one, me and the homies were in blighted village on top of a house fighting off the goblins, and my buddies whos a sorc was like "i cant be touched im a god up here" my next turn i jumped up beside him and shoved him off was hilarious
oh god as soon as I get an opportunity to push a friend in a pit killing them instantly I'm taking.
Man i need friends lmao
I am so irritated with my friends. They like RPGs and a couple of them even play DnD, but for some reason none of them have even bought this glorious game yet
@@thorkagemob1297Same lol
I would respect and watch IGN more if this man is given more screen time, finally a great take from IGN
Baldur's Gate 3 and Elden Ring should be standards for quality games, and anyone who fails to make such quality should reconsider their profession
I’ve ordered both physical, as those are two titles definitely worth owning physical editions for 🔥
I started gaming in like 2020 the week of cyberpunks launch. I bought Cyberpunk, hogwarts, etc. I bought Baulders gate and felt like id been cheated out of 60$ for a game in the past. I didnt know that video games got that detailed, i genuinely didnt understand the joy of gaming until recently. Its so weird 😂
Started gamung in 2020 lol what a newb
Enjoy the game friend, we rarely do find games that makes us go “oh, yeah that’s why I love gaming”, for me it’s once every few years lol but it’s great when it happens.
@@sssreggiN sorry mb. I was poor. 😂
@@MoraMorbid thanks
You should try Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous next if you’re enjoying BG3
I'm working on my Game Design Bachelor's of Science degree and we have been taught over and over again to go above and beyond to learn, grow and adapt in this industry and try to create what may seem impossible if we are passionate about it. You can see and feel the passion in BG3. Everything said here is true. Keep it coming. The industry needs to hear this and I hope it learns from Larian. FYI - You don't need to be a game designer to know what makes a good game.
No! We need devs gaslighting on behalf of exec's telling us mid, incomplete, storefront/monetization designed scams, churned out on a schedule by the few companies with the resources and ability to take risks, are also "good games" and we should be grateful to be extracted from.
@@cypherpleb It's hilarious isn't it. Devs do actually hate these exec's telling them to release shit early, trust me. Having worked for them does look really good on your CV though.
@@snook.1 Looks good if you want to be hired by a company of the same ilk? All these ESG run companies are now are a name, people want the name that meant quality 20 years ago instead of the one that means something now. Wonder how many of the 400 at Larian came from one of these firms.
I have a ton of respect for game designers because i understand that it is no simple task to make a quality game. I wish you luck in your career, and if you have any control over it please keep microtransactions out of your videogames 😅
i soloed her
Raising the standard is what the car industry has been doing for ages. All these major players in the industry should try to get ahead of the curve instead of whining anout the competition, or sufffer the consequences.
I played BG1 when it was new and it was groundbreaking. I played BG2 when it was new and it was even more groundbreaking. BG3 is the most amazing game I've experienced.
I grew up with Neverwinter Nights, I feel the exact same way
Is this a joke?
no @@nightfears3005
Actually surprisingly IGN putting out a decent analysis
That dude is freelancing - he’s called Destin and has his own channel, loads of coverage on the Microsoft takeover of Activision-Blizzard.
@@VesiustheBoneCruncher he actually recently became the director of video content strategy at IGN
@@cgiacona didn’t know that - if that is the case, good call by them.
@@cgiacona got to imagine the sponsors of IGN will be getting on the phone soon.
Gamers have settled. They DEMANDED games to be on short rotations. Many titles and producers were quick to agree. Now that people MAY be understanding a good game takes time, they may want to renegotiate. Demand better games. Im stuck in old games. At least they were compleate.
this is all happening at the right time, now that devs want 70$ plus battle pass $ for their games, we better be getting a higher standard of a game for that price.
Play REMNANT 2 ❤🔥
what they want vs what you give them
make better choices
i would never pay that for a game period even if i have to wait 5 years to play it
I remember when you'd buy a game and "feature complete" was a given lol
Back in the day the people who made games were doing it because it was what they loved. Now that gaming is a massive industry, the people who make them aren’t necessarily passionate about it. That’s where shit gets twisted. Unfortunately, we will never be able to go back. All we can do is enjoy the rare games that have a passionate team behind them.
I’ve said this once on another video, but I’ll say it here too. As a solo dev working on his very first commercial game, I can’t begin to express how damn proud I am to see such a work of art be created! I’m sad to hear people express fear of “over delivery”. What the team have done with BG3 is beyond inspiring! My heart goes out to other developers who feel genuine fear because of greatness like this. Not every game has to be a bg3. Create a great player experience and fall in love with your work, be receptive to criticism and feedback and do the best you can! If there are any other devs possibly reading this comment, I wish you all your own success. Don’t be afraid to put something out of great quality just because it isn’t on a BG3 scale!
im korean
I love when they say "the dnd rules system is so hard to put into a game" but many many game titles have done it the the AD&D rules system from the 80s through the early 2000s.
If they’re talking about ACTUAL D&D then yes, it *is* really hard, unless you do what Larian did and limit character progression to a 12th level campaign with “homebrew” streamlined systems. Just because it’s difficult doesn’t mean it can’t be done, it just means they’re lazy.
a better example would be Madden, who charges you $60 for the same recycled game every year.
@abbsnncose6305 I don't think our standards have fallen at all tbh. I think people are just ranting and raving over this game because they Larian said they won't do MTX or battle pass lol.
In any other industry, these developers would be fired and blacklisted on the spot. Defending standards of mediocrity and refusing to adapt to competition would be borderline corporate sabotage.
"Boss, this other building contractor might be using this new material that is cheaper, more durable, more eco-friendly, easier to work with and everyone loves it but I'm not gonna."
Out. Get out. You're done.
The problem is that's the opposite of what he's saying. He's saying "Boss, the other building contractor is using a lot more expensive materials than us, isn't cutting corners to save up money and it's gonna take them twice as long to finish this project, but everybody loves it and says we should be doing that, too."
@@SlCKNESS_ You say this as genshin impact has over 200 million put into its development. Not including the updates its received after coming out. Despite that its still a profitable game. Yes, its a gatcha game which is a money hungry idea developers do, but it should be made clear by now that you CAN go green on your game with absurd about of investment. This also isn't even mentioning that the biggest investors are us the consumers. Larian just made 60 million US dollars off baulders gate assuming they only sold 1 million copies and of course before tax. I don't know the investment put into the game, but they definitely were able to do it because of early access investors like myself. Nearly everyone who did pick up early access knew we could trust this company because of divinity original sin 2. If you make good game, us REAL investor will not only buy the game, but were probably buying the next one too because we trust you. We consumers are paying out much more then companies investors so if they really cared about profit they should start following the actual profit.
@@demon3203 Consumers are not investors. They're the consumers. Genshin Impact being successful means nothing, considering there are countless of games that failed miserably and quite a few companies that went bankrupt, some of which went bankrupt after releasing multiple good games. The actual investors don't care about building up faith with consumers, they only care about return of investment. It's that simple. Also, you might be under the impression that the "boss quote" I gave in a previous comment represents my views. It does not. I'm just saying how the business people think about all of this. Same thing applies to my current comment. I wish investors would understand how the gaming industry can be better, but they don't. They just care about money, here and now.
@@SlCKNESS_ Not at all. Larian is operating on a fraction of the budgets allocated by your Activisions, your EAs, your Ubisofts etc and goes 6+ years in-between single releases.
It also took ~50 developers across three countries headquartered in an abandoned building to create Disco Elysium. There is no excuse.
Baldur's Gate is a triple A game. All others are triple F.
16:00 great point. Speaking as an engineer, if you get pushback from game devs, which is being used interchangeably and ignorantly with all the business roles involved, it's normally because the low quality is "our fault" according to business leaders. It wasn't that the deadlines were too short, we were given no support, we lost talent because more emphasis is placed on micro-transactions than game design... etc. Useless objectives and timeframes are thrown over the wall, because at the end of the day, CEO's and owners aren't willing to make less. The problem is usually not the developers themselves; it's greed.
The car example you gave is spot on. Which is why car companies, like BMW, is taking cues from these big AAA companies by trying to lock certain core car features behind an additional pay wall.
The real issue is a lot of developers and publishers dont think the games industry is going wrong, they dont want to take a good look because a lot of them agree with the current mess.
Its all about money, making a good game is low on many companies priorities. They do just the minimum.
Thats why when a game developer has passion it tends to make a game that stands out.
Imagine blizzard double the OW2 dev team in 2020 and lie about the PVE. Saying they couldn't make it, but they could develop the BattlePass. Making games is hard, we don't get it.
not enough hours in a day to watch all these videos, keep em coming :)
He's not old enough to know it, but that's exactly what Little Caesar's Pizza did in the 80's with their "Pizza Pizza" campaign. Charging less for two large pizzas than other places did for a medium. It was bloody mayhem out there.